BajaNomad - Evictions coming btwn Santispac and Posada?

Evictions coming btwn Santispac and Posada?

ZThomas - 10-12-2008 at 10:04 PM

Rumor is that Ejido Bonfil has gotten a court to issue an eviction order for residents of the hill between Santispac and Posada. Anybody have any reliable information to add? Grounds for the order (assuming it exists)? Timeline? Implications? Recourse? Pertinent history?

toneart - 10-12-2008 at 10:08 PM

Oh oh. Is that the hill with the hot springs and the B & B at the bottom?

gnukid - 10-12-2008 at 11:12 PM

I am sorry for anyone affected negatively. I do not know anything about it yet, but I have friends with the Ejido Bonfil as I find the families to be good, honest friendly people. I can ask what the explanation is from the families though at this point it seems they have a judgment for a claim that the land was sold or leased unfairly by a member of the ejido without the collective agreement and process completed.

We seem to be hearing the echos of this up and down the peninsula...

whalemeat - 10-13-2008 at 05:47 AM

This has happened in Baja Norte and the excuse was the paperwork trail was incomplete. The process is confusing and there are potential timebombs like this ticking all over Baja. Its sad for the people who will feel unsettled because of this. Its why I will never buy land in Mexico.

CaboRon - 10-13-2008 at 08:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by whalemeat
This has happened in Baja Norte and the excuse was the paperwork trail was incomplete. The process is confusing and there are potential timebombs like this ticking all over Baja. Its sad for the people who will feel unsettled because of this. Its why I will never buy land in Mexico.

Only invest in land in mexico if you can afford to lose it .

CaboRon

David K - 10-13-2008 at 08:29 AM

Ron is correct!

Buying on ejido land has always been cause for a red flag, anyway!

Well put this in your pipe and smoke it-

CasaManzana - 10-13-2008 at 03:35 PM

For what it's worth, all the houses on the hill there are holding a "fideicomisso"...a Mexican land ownership title. The Notario in Santa Rosalia and an attorney in Zihuatanejo have both told me there has never been a case where the Ejido has been successful over turning that title of ownership

But scare tactics might work!

Sharksbaja - 10-13-2008 at 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by CasaManzana
For what it's worth, all the houses on the hill there are holding a "fideicomisso"...a Mexican land ownership title. The Notario in Santa Rosalia and an attorney in Zihuatanejo have both told me there has never been a case where the Ejido has been successful over turning that title of ownership

Yep, and they have tried plenty times.

Cajones - 10-13-2008 at 04:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sharksbaja

Quote:

Yep, and they have tried plenty times.

I suppose a greater issue is why is it in Mexico that people keep coming back at you trying to get back the property they sold? Why is land title so fragile and tenuous that it requires an owner constantly defend himself from onslaughts? There are also all those issues of squatters taking adverse possession and then getting clear title to property.

This came from two longtime Mexican Mulege locals........

CasaManzana - 10-13-2008 at 08:04 PM

This came from two local long-time business owners in Mulege who had the newspaper postings of the Ejido evictions to show from the La Paz paper...both on the Posada Hilltop casas and their efforts on the beach below (Posada). They said the Ejido attorneys, in an effort to generate billings, are always just casting efforts out to fish for court "pot-holes". If the Ejido see this as hopeful they pay the attorney bills that are doing this. They said there is a lot of places in Mulege going through the same attacks and it's an on-going effort on the part of the Ejido attorneys.
Two years ago, as the only resident of Posada Beach in August, I met a Santa Rosalia attorney here who said I was going to soon be evicted, as were we all (70 casas). He said in October, when most were back they would be here to tell us our eviction date...or maybe our new lease rates if we wanted to stay. That was two years ago...tick...tick..tick... and now again they are efforting at this- at least the attorneys are anyway. I keep track and this is Mexican Mystery #124557986352325

ZThomas - 10-14-2008 at 08:47 AM

CasaManzana et al,

Thanks for the info. It's somewhat reassuring to hear that the ejido hasn't been able to beat a fideicomiso. My father, who owns a place on the hill, is headed down sometime in the coming weeks to try and figure out firsthand what exactly is going on.

ZT

Lease rates?

Dave - 10-14-2008 at 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CasaManzana
He said in October, when most were back they would be here to tell us our eviction date...or maybe our new lease rates if we wanted to stay.

What kind of Fideicomisso comes with a lease? :rolleyes:

tripledigitken - 10-14-2008 at 10:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CasaManzana
This came from two local long-time business owners in Mulege who had the newspaper postings of the Ejido evictions to show from the La Paz paper...both on the Posada Hilltop casas and their efforts on the beach below (Posada). They said the Ejido attorneys, in an effort to generate billings, are always just casting efforts out to fish for court "pot-holes". If the Ejido see this as hopeful they pay the attorney bills that are doing this. They said there is a lot of places in Mulege going through the same attacks and it's an on-going effort on the part of the Ejido attorneys.
Two years ago, as the only resident of Posada Beach in August, I met a Santa Rosalia attorney here who said I was going to soon be evicted, as were we all (70 casas). He said in October, when most were back they would be here to tell us our eviction date...or maybe our new lease rates if we wanted to stay. That was two years ago...tick...tick..tick... and now again they are efforting at this- at least the attorneys are anyway. I keep track and this is Mexican Mystery #124557986352325

If were talking "lease rates" this is not an issue over a land purchase, correct?

So many of these threads on evictions are taken by some as another example of someone being thrown off Ejido Land that was purchased. When you buy property (house or improvements) on leased land it is a very different animal than a real estate purchase with a fideicomiso.

Can we clarify this situation, is it only an issue with leased land or is it something different? :?:

Ken

Sharksbaja - 10-14-2008 at 11:21 AM

Oh that's the speil they lay on unsuspecting dolts. Just trolling lawyers looking for easy victims. You would not believe how gullable and how easily intimidated so many are. Fido or not.

ZThomas - 10-14-2008 at 11:29 AM

As CasaManzana said, the homes in question all have fideicomisos.

I don't know what the situation is at Posada. Apparently, based on CasaManzana's comments, they land there is leased.

But on the hill north of Posada, which I originally asked about, everything is fideicomiso.

[Edited on 10-14-2008 by ZThomas]

Cypress - 10-14-2008 at 12:38 PM

You need a lawyer to determine whether or not your lease/title is valid? After years and years of payments/taxes etc. Is there something wrong with that picture.

tripledigitken - 10-14-2008 at 01:51 PM

Zthomas,

Manazana needs to clarify the post. The post said "both on the Posada Hilltop casas and their efforts on the beach below (Posada)"

It was clarified regarding ownership on the hill "For what it's worth, all the houses on the hill there are holding a "fideicomisso"...a Mexican land ownership title."

What wasn't clariifed is whether the homes subject to eviction on the beach are Fideo properties. Casamanzana's is obviously a leased property "I met a Santa Rosalia attorney here who said I was going to soon be evicted, as were we all (70 casas). He said in October, when most were back they would be here to tell us our eviction date...or maybe our new lease rates if we wanted to stay."

Just trying to get this story straight.

Does any Nomad know of an eviction involving a Fideo?

Thanks,

Ken

CaboRon - 10-14-2008 at 02:34 PM

If a fidecomiso was a title ..... you would own the land .... you will NEVER hold the actual title in your hands .... it is a joke .... on you ...

CaboRon

tripledigitken - 10-14-2008 at 02:49 PM

Caboron,

Hey amigo enjoy the sunshine and balmy weather down your way and have a c-cktail and some carnitas. You are getting too uptight on this topic. :tumble:

Those of us with Fideo's can walk into the bank and ask to hold the title. Funny though I never have asked to do the same with all the houses I have owned in the States, (never having paid them off).

100 years is more than enough time for me to control some property. Camp, rent, lease, "buy" your dream in Mexico. In the final analysis for me anyway, is about being there.

Ken

Cypress - 10-14-2008 at 03:37 PM

Some folks spend a dollar to enjoy the same things that are free to others.

tripledigitken - 10-14-2008 at 03:42 PM

Cypress,

You are absolutely right. In fact a lot of the time the free version is superior to the one that costs.

Ken

CaboRon - 10-14-2008 at 04:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress
You need a lawyer to determine whether or not your lease/title is valid? After years and years of payments/taxes etc. Is there something wrong with that picture.

There is something VERY wrong with this picture ....

If you can own the property , why do you need a bank trust to hold it for you :lol:

CaboRon

Hook - 10-14-2008 at 06:54 PM

Posada Concepcion is on leased land, as I understand it. That's where Manzana lives. The hill is apparently fidecomiso, not where he/she lives. That explains the misconception.

Looks like we've exported our lawyer mentality to Mexico, too.......... :rolleyes:

Pescador - 10-14-2008 at 08:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ZThomas
Rumor is that Ejido Bonfil has gotten a court to issue an eviction order for residents of the hill between Santispac and Posada. Anybody have any reliable information to add? Grounds for the order (assuming it exists)? Timeline? Implications? Recourse? Pertinent history?

Zack, did the original escritura come from Ejido Alfredo Bonfil. Did they originally own the land before the fideos were issued to the current owners.
There seems to be some real confusion between leaseholders and holders of fideos.

Also posted, but relating to leases:
CasaChristie

Newbie

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Posts: 3
Registered: 8-28-2008
Location: Posada, B.C.S.
Member Is Offline

posted on 10-14-2008 at 05:31 PM

Edictos (Public Notices)

Does anyone know how I might track public notices (edictos) in the La Paz or Mulege Newspapers or other sources? I have been online with Sudcaliforniano and I cannot find a thread that takes me to that information.

I am curious because the Edjido in our area is attempting to illegally take property of those who leave in the summer claiming they have abandon their properties. In order to proceed with legal action they must provide public notice to those they want evicted. They must do this three times. The edicto is a proclamation and must be responded to within a certain timeframe so it is important to be vigilant and monitor these notices. So far they have been using the La Paz and Mulege papers.

Our property in Posada Concepcion is under this attack by the Ejido as are several other beach communities in Bahia de Concepcion. We have identified, through a friend, that at least one edicto was published in Sept. in La Paz. Fortunately it was found and responded to, but they can continue this practice. They tried it last year also. Apparently there is an old Mexican law that allows them to take abandon property.

Any assistance anyone can provide would be greatly appreciated.

Miramontes - 10-15-2008 at 04:02 PM

Does anyone have information on Mexican citizenship? If a Mexican born citizen becomes an American Citizen (20+ years ago) do they lose thier Mexican citizenship? Does anyone know where to go to find out this information.

Hoping to satify the post of tripledigitken -

CasaManzana - 10-15-2008 at 08:35 PM

The casas between Santispac and Posada are all "Fido'ed" and Posada is leased on a yearly basis....no Fido's here

Miramontes

bajaguy - 10-15-2008 at 08:53 PM

Check this link:

http://www.city-data.com/forum/el-paso/349360-have-any-you-u...

Or this one:

http://www.laprensa-sandiego.org/archieve/march28-03/dual2.h...

Sounds pretty easy, but I think your first step would be to contact/visit the nearest Mexican Consulate

[Edited on 10-16-2008 by bajaguy]

capt. mike - 10-16-2008 at 07:47 AM

Bob and i were talking, emailing about a property for sale or rent a few weeks ago and he said it came with a Fido.

i actually thought he meant there was a dog! i figured it was a guard dog. :lol:

and i'd have to take care of it for the owner or something.

tripledigitken - 10-16-2008 at 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CasaManzana
The casas between Santispac and Posada are all "Fido'ed" and Posada is leased on a yearly basis....no Fido's here

CasaManzana,

Thank you for clarifying that. I wish you good luck with your negotiations on your lease. I will be very interested along with alot of others as to what happens regarding those owners on the "hill" with fidecomiso's.

Ken

losfrailes - 10-29-2008 at 03:17 PM

Anything further on the actions on the Ejido Bonfil regarding these properties on or near Santispac and Posada Conception?

Cypress - 10-29-2008 at 04:19 PM

The lawyers will keep on milking 'em, till they're dry, then they'll be evicted. They don't live there year 'round, just seasonal camps.

losfrailes - 10-29-2008 at 04:21 PM

What about the people who 'own' their homes in that area. Surely they are not seasonal campers.

Cypress - 10-29-2008 at 04:54 PM

losfrailes, They only spend 3 or 4 months during the winter. That's seasonal. The lawyers will argue their status. Campers or residents? Guess it's gonna all boil down to legal fees and much the annual lease is adjusted. If the electricity is cut off? :?:

roundtuit - 10-29-2008 at 05:44 PM

They as who ?? Most spend more time then that . I spend 6 to 7 months and have a FM3, pay taxes and love Baja. If you don't know don't surmise what's happening.....

losfrailes - 10-29-2008 at 06:37 PM

And I have friends there who live there year round.

You apparently do not live there, just a guess.

And there are about a dozen homes in the area that are owned, a couple with outright titles, others with fidecomisos held by local banks.

[Edited on 10-30-2008 by losfrailes]

roundtuit - 10-29-2008 at 08:10 PM

I do live here and do know what I talk about..Your friends must be my friends So we must be friends. Buy you a marg at Ana's Halloween nite if you live in the area