BajaNomad - Gabacho vs. Gringo

Gabacho vs. Gringo

tjBill - 12-8-2008 at 03:38 PM

Are there differences in meaning between a "Gabacho" and a "Gringo" :?:

gnukid - 12-8-2008 at 03:49 PM

Gabacho means rancher, Gringo could be either Gabacho or Capitain i.e. rancher or yachtee, but there are only those two choices, officially speaking of course. Other sub-classes include surfer or racer those though fall into Capitain and Gabacho respectively. Know it, live it, love it and play the part.

BajaGringo - 12-8-2008 at 03:52 PM

Locals in Baja use the two terms equally...

estebanis - 12-8-2008 at 08:21 PM

I always understood that the term Gabacho was aimed more at europeans and Gringo for Norte Americanos. Also the way I have seen the word used Gabacho is less derogatory than Gringo which can be used in a negative way...
Esteban

[Edited on 12-9-2008 by estebanis]

BajaGringo - 12-8-2008 at 08:29 PM

If you talk to the locals in Baja they will tell you that they interchange the terms equally. I just asked an entire house full here sharing a BBQ and they all agreed 100% that there is no difference in the terms.

Any slander/disrespect intended is based in the person using the term and not part of the term itself. You need to remember that this is a culture that calls people as they see them; flaco, gordo, chaparro, guero, negro, viejo. None of these terms in themselves are meant to be disrespectful anymore than gavacho or gringo.

We have become too PC north of the border - a condition that has yet to be picked up on this side of the border...

gnukid - 12-8-2008 at 08:39 PM

Last week I renewed my visa and beautiful agent Maria started to give me a hard time, then I decided to simply agree with whatever she said which seemed to work well, she continued with her questions and the standard FM2-3 form for a new book, she asked, Gabacho o Capitain, Christian o Catolica, Black or Brown eyes? I replied, Gabacho, Black eyes, Catolica! as she checked the boxes on the form. Then Stamp, stamp, stamp! Bien Voy a casarme con ella.

[Edited on 12-9-2008 by gnukid]

estebanis - 12-8-2008 at 10:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
You need to remember that this is a culture that calls people as they see them; flaco, gordo, chaparro, guero, negro, viejo.

That is sooo true. Some of the nicknames in the ejido I hang in are Feo(my landlords Lifelong name),Chango(he does look a bit like a primate),La Mala(my pal who has been ill for too long) and Bola(my amigo with a Huge Goiter on his neck).

BajaGringo - 12-8-2008 at 10:31 PM

I keep dreaming some woman will see me and call me guapo...

:spingrin:

Pompano - 12-9-2008 at 06:23 AM

Not exclusive to Baja, it occurs to me that the custom of nicknaming for physical or perceived distinctions is practiced around the globe.

A Mexican guy I know is called ..'Diamante' ... diamond...because of his popularity with women.

A Norsk guy I know is called .. 'Jorun'...sword to love...because of his popularity with women.

Bob and Susan - 12-9-2008 at 06:32 AM

BajaGringo... what about guapedo

shari - 12-9-2008 at 07:15 AM

OUr little poll reveals the same as el guapo, bajagringo...they use them interchangeably and is NOT offensive....just true...it is what it is!
I love the nicknames in baja...it is much easier to remember people...and useful and there are ALOT of Jose's, Juan's etc.
Some local ones here for mexicans...gringo(a guy that looks like one), velero(who is tall like a mast of a sailboat), filipino(who is mexican), surdo (left handed), gato, lobo, juan vaso(who always has a drink in his hand), etc. etc....
But what's funny are the names they give gringos here...usually they name them after someone they look like in town or a famous person...usually becase they cant remember their names so when they refer to them..all their buddies know who they are talking about...cracks me up.

[Edited on 12-9-2008 by shari]

Santiago - 12-9-2008 at 07:24 AM

My uncle had the nick-name of 'Tripod Harry' - as an 8-year-old I caused quite a stir one Thankgsgiving dinner when I asked how he got that nickname. My mom choked and my aunt got real red.

Hey Shari - what to the locals call Zak? el corredor?

[Edited on 12-9-2008 by Santiago]

lingililingili - 12-9-2008 at 07:32 AM

This is all very interesting. Why do you suppose the Mexican people don't get offended by the nick names given them? Down the street we have a man who goes by the name negro. I always have trouble calling his name because I find it offensive but it's the only name we were given! Then there are the names men use for their wives like gorda, flaka, gueda, piernuda, to name a few. When my dad was young he was known as moloton (he had alot of hair) now he is called pelon because he is bald!

Just wondering

lizard lips - 12-9-2008 at 07:38 AM

We have a family friend with a nickname of "Chulo" but he far from handsome.

shari - 12-9-2008 at 08:30 AM

Lingigiggli...it took me many years to overcome my PC values and accept that the mexican way was better...call it like it is and dont be embarrassed. Mexican people really dont "judge" others like we do/did...they just are what they are how they are...we are all different...not better or worse. It doesnt matter what you look like but what is in your heart that matters..the outside is just a package. Also because there are few names and lots of people...it is easier to identify someone by their physical attributes..that way everyone knows who you are talking about.
It does take getting used to...relearning...realizing that words are NOT offensive if they arent meant to be. I can now easily call my amigos negro, gordo, pelon etc....

lingililingili - 12-9-2008 at 08:40 AM

Shari:

I'm working on it!

BajaGringo - 12-9-2008 at 09:24 AM

You hit the nail squarely on the head Shari - Rubia Chula!!!

:yes:

DianaT - 12-9-2008 at 10:02 AM

In the pueblo a few people have asked us about using the word gringo---since we use it all the time -- if we or others find it offensive or not. We tell them that to us, it is how it is used and how it is being said----attitude, not the word.

They were somewhat surprised because they thought that just the word was offensive to many.

We are careful with some nicknames because we have found that some people have been given nicknames they don't like---like filipino. Everyone calls him filipino, but he does not really like that nickname, so we call him by his given name. The same with indio. But if we are referring to them to someone else, they don't know about whom we are speaking unless we use the nickname. Doesn't hurt to ask.

In Honduras, nicknames were common also, and to be called something like gordo or gordita was not offensive.

However, the students all had animal nicknames given to them, like caballo for one with a big nose, vaca for a bigger girl, pollo, etc. They all used the nicknames for each other, but it was NOT ok for someone else to use those names---

so, we are careful. If someone uses their nickname when we are introduced, we are likely to use it, but if they use their given name, we use that until they say otherwise.

Just our experience with gringo and nicknames.

[Edited on 12-9-2008 by jdtrotter]

estebanis - 12-9-2008 at 10:30 AM

Well said, I have asked several of the folks if they are offended so far most just shrug and say "It is what it is". I do know that you don't call Chango, Chango in front of his wife Maria de los angeles! A mexican friend made that mistake at changos house when looking for him and got chewed out by her...
Esteban

BMG - 12-9-2008 at 10:53 AM

I guess I'll just have to go with the nickname I've been tagged with.

El_Guapo.jpg - 34kB

gnukid - 12-9-2008 at 02:55 PM

BMG we always call you Pancencito?

DENNIS - 12-9-2008 at 03:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
Gabacho means rancher, Gringo could be either Gabacho or Capitain i.e. rancher or yachtee, but there are only those two choices, officially speaking of course. Other sub-classes include surfer or racer those though fall into Capitain and Gabacho respectively. Know it, live it, love it and play the part.

HUH?????

Gabacho
From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia
Jump to: navigation, search
Gabacho (feminine, Gabacha) is a rather derogatory word used in Spanish to describe foreigners of different origins:

In the United States it is used mainly by Mexican Americans (and by extension American Hispanics) as a pejorative name for White Americans. It is not widely used or understood by Spanish speakers in the Americas outside the USA and Mexico. The term Güero (disambiguation) or Huero is sometimes used interchangeably to describe someone who is pale skinned.
In Mexico it refers to both the US citizens and their country ("El Gabacho"), especially as an alternative to the milder gringo. It became widely used in Mexico during the French occupation as a term to refer to the invading French.
In Spain, where the word was first used in Spanish, it was used in the first instance to describe people from the skirts of the Pyrenees and then, more generally, when referring to a person from France, which is its main use today. It is also used in Occitan for a rude mountain dweller who speaks the national language badly, this being the origin of the word that, by semantic sliding, was then applied to French people in Spain and to US Anglo-Saxon citizens in Mexico or the United States by Mexican-Americans

BMG - 12-9-2008 at 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
BMG we always call you Pancencito?

Okay, I am now be called one of 2 things. A roll or a big belly. Not sure which, but I still prefer El Guapo.

gnukid - 12-9-2008 at 05:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Dennis,

First off, wikipedia is hardly a source of record as it is edited by anyone and no one is paid to do so though that isn't the point. The definition stated in wikipedia aligns precisely with the one I provided, as in a rancher, meaning someone of non-mexican non-spanish, primarily european such as french or us anglo people in spain or in mexico who may speak spanish poorly (that is not paceno mexican which may include people who speak castilian spanish) though are likely owners of plots of land of mountainous regions, as such the kind definition suggests historically "rancher" not farmer or sea captain.

In terms of connotation or the denotation of gabacho, my suggestion as non-mexican "rancher" and yours; the one provided by wikipedia as rough speaking mountain dweller of anglo descent are hardly different.

Though if you wish to choose an argument, it seems in this case you lose, again.

Now if you wish to pursue it further, we can. In terms of the use of the word gabacho or gringo, remember that indigenous people to Mexico call anyone non-indigenous guero or gringo or mestizo and technically all people of non-indigenous descent are mestizos which includes spanish, anglo and all mixed descent people who are practically speaking 100% of the population though many Mexicans consider mestizos only those of dark skin, that would be incorrect prejudice as well, in practice.

So practically speaking it depends on your perspective. Now, getting back to our point about Gabacho, as in my case where the inmigration hot babe Maria asked me if I was a gabacho with a wink, I took it to mean, am I of other parts, from the mountains as opposed to La Paz and likely of non-indigenous background, possibly european with an accent to my spanish different than Pacenos and likely a land owner.

In my case as I am sure in yours being called gabacho or gringo is hardly a outright insult or derogatory. If I may add, I considered the tone or denotation to be complimentary at worst in a teasing and fun tone.

However, I might add that I would jump to the conclusion that most comments in Mexico are meant in a teasing and fun tone first and foremost and those who take offense may be missing an opportunity to make friends and a connection in response to extended personalized greetings.

DENNIS - 12-9-2008 at 06:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid

Though if you wish to choose an argument, it seems in this case you lose, again.

No...I'm not looking for an arguement about anything. It's just my opinion that both words are derogatory and carry that conotation until they hit the brick wall of thick-skinned Americans who have chosen to adopt the insult and treat them as cute Mexicanisms without any knowledge of the sentiment of the words. They are not terms of endearment nor were they ever meant to be.
So, you can hang out at that office with the winking, blinking assistant and have her insult you 'till you're red, white and blue in the face if that's what makes you feel good but, I'll bet everything I have that she wouldn't be caught dead with you in public.

BajaGringo - 12-9-2008 at 06:29 PM

Dennis, I hear what you are saying but having lived, worked and married into the local community for many years I can say with a lot of confidence that the vast overwhelming majority here use the term with no insult intended.

I think a lot of folks here prefer to use the term of Gringo or Gavacho in lieu of calling us "Americanos" as they also see themselves as "Americanos". It also relieves them of the task of determining if we are from the USA, Canada, etc. We all just become Gringos/Gavachos.

They are aware that some of us may see the term as derogatory and some may hesitate to use it in our presence. At least until they know how we feel about it on a personal basis. Whatever be the case that is not their intent behind its usage any more than they intend to insult when they use terms like negro, gordo, viejo, pelon, etc among each other.

Can they use it in an insulting way? Of course! Just like we could use any innocent term in an insulting way if that is what we mean to do. To not understand that is simply a lack of interaction with the local culture on their level, in their vernacular and knowing their true hearts and motivation. It took me years of living and speaking ONLY Spanish to reach that point. I can understand how some may not get it based on how PC we have become in the USA. I also suspect any dictionary definition saying it is in fact derogatory would be written by an author who also believes that terms like negro, fat, skinny, shorty, baldy, old man, etc are also derogatory.

In the Latin culture it simply is not seen that way.

But I also respect your right to hold a different opinion and I am just happy to see you posting again so I promise never to call you a gav__ho or gr__go.

OK?

norte - 12-9-2008 at 06:30 PM

and tell me Gnu

Which indigenous are you refering to? Some might say there aren't many "indigenous" people left in Baja CaliforniA.

he term 'indigenous people' or 'autochthonous peoples' can be used to describe any ethnic group of people who inhabit a geographic region with which they have the earliest historical connection, alongside migrants which have populated the region and which are greater in number. [1] However, several widely-accepted formulations, which define the term "indigenous peoples" in stricter terms, have been put forward by prominent and internationally-recognized organizations, such as the United Nations, the International Labour Organization and the World Bank. Indigenous peoples in this article is used in such a narrower sense.

Drawing on these, a contemporary working definition of "indigenous people" for certain purposes has criteria which would seek to include cultural groups (and their continuity or association with a given region, or parts of a region, and who formerly or currently inhabit the region either:

* before its subsequent colonization or annexation; or
* alongside other cultural groups during the formation of a nation-state; or
* independently or largely isolated from the influence of the claimed governance by a nation-state,

and who furthermore:

* have maintained at least in part their distinct linguistic, cultural and social/organizational characteristics, and in doing so remain differentiated in some degree from the surrounding populations and dominant culture of the nation-state.

To the above, a criterion is usually added to also include:

* peoples who are self-identified as indigenous, and/or those recognised as such by other groups.

Note that even if all the above criteria are fulfilled, some people may either not consider themselves as indigenous or may not be considered as indigenous by governments, organizations or scholars

ELINVESTIG8R - 12-9-2008 at 08:00 PM

Just call me Gringo culo prieto! Grassyass

BAJACAT - 12-9-2008 at 08:13 PM

David thats exactly what my granmother used to tell me whe I move to the states,thanks for remind me of her..

BajaNuts - 12-9-2008 at 08:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Just call me Gringo culo prieto! Grassyass

online translation-
Foreign blackish bottom

:lol:

movinguy - 12-9-2008 at 08:42 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
Whatever be the case that is not their intent behind its usage any more than they intend to insult when they use terms like negro, gordo, viejo, pelon, etc among each other.

True . . . as another example, anyone who looks oriental is a chino (Chinese), regardless of whether they are Japanese, Korean, Vietnamese or anything else. The details just aren't important . . . :no:

DENNIS - 12-10-2008 at 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
But I also respect your right to hold a different opinion and I am just happy to see you posting again so I promise never to call you a gav__ho or gr__go.

OK?

Thanks, Ron. You can call me anything you want. I'm too old to care. My wonderment is at why our diverse culture will accept some derogatory labels and not others. Pretty soon we'll be joking and laughing when called "Infidel."

shari - 12-10-2008 at 07:41 AM

diane is correct regarding prudent use of nicknames...I have made that mistake more than once...(usually having never even heard the guys's real name) however...In my opinion, the reason mexicans may ask if "gringo" is offensive is because they have heard foreigners tell them it is offensive...which mystifies them...but nowadays they often ask new gringos...kind of take a poll and have learned that many are offended by it...which only stops them from saying it to you...so as not to offend you but it's still widely used amongst themselves.

Dennis Infidel!

The Gull - 12-10-2008 at 07:44 AM

DENNIS - 12-10-2008 at 08:15 AM

Nicest thing you've ever said to me, Gull. Merry Christmas.

ELINVESTIG8R - 12-10-2008 at 10:17 AM

BajaCat you are welcome. If someone tells me I am a Gringo Culo Prieto it is a compliment. Loosely translated it means American who knows the Mexican culture and speaks Spanish.

thebajarunner - 12-10-2008 at 10:43 AM

When I asked my Jalisco native wife about the use of "Gabacho" she said, "Isn't that some kind of soup?"

After further discussion she said she knows the term, but they never used it in Mascota.

tjBill - 12-10-2008 at 11:01 AM

When they want to insult us they say, "P-nche Gringo Puto!' or "P-nche Gringa Puta" :lol:

Oso - 12-10-2008 at 01:32 PM

Se dice "Norteamerigringo", por favor.

In my experience, gabacho is used more often by Chicanos in the U.S. than by Mexicans. When Mexicans want to refer to "white" people in general, in reference to race specifically rather than nationality, they say "Sajon". In Texas the term "Anglo" is used by both white and brown Texans. "Anglo-Sajon" is usually found only in textbooks.

When I taught English in Mexico City, my students would often ask if I found the term "gringo" to be offensive. I would say no, especially if a pretty girl said "Hola, Gringuito." "But", I would add, "please don't call me yanqui." and then I would explain a bit about my Confederate ancestors.

DENNIS - 12-10-2008 at 02:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Oso
"But", I would add, "please don't call me yanqui."

Thank God we don't hear much of the word, "Yanqui" as it rarely stands alone. It's usually joined with, "Go home."
We can thank the same God that Mexicans are as gracious as they are or we might hear what they really think of us.

shari - 12-10-2008 at 02:14 PM

I once made the mistake of using the work Yankee to refer to our american amigos which resulted in an educational tongue lashing. It was just a term that many canadians use for americans and was not meant to be insulting either...we use the term yanks loosely and innocently...even if they were confederates. Example: yanks like weak beer....Remember, us canucks are inferiors and rather ignorant...so try to go easy on us.

LOSARIPES - 12-12-2008 at 05:20 AM

Baja is famous for making up nicknames. A previous governor had a driver who was missing an ear. They called him "Cabeza de tasa" (coffee cup head)

An old policeman in La Paz had a stiff leg and walk with a very pronounced limp. He hit the ground rather hard with one of his legs every step, so he used metal reinforcements on his shoe heel. If you watched him walk at nights you would see and occasional spark. They called him "Encendedor sin gas" (out of fuel lighter)

Of course, there is "El zurdo" (lefty), the guy who is missing his right arm.

Ex-governor Cervantes el Rio, while giving a speech on official visit to Todos Santos, spoke well, using real fancy words nobody understood was named "Pico de Oro" (Golden beak) a nickname for which was known nationally for the rest of his political career.

Here is one that non-Mexicans would not understand without explanation:
There are many street dogs in Mexico. They follow, bark and bug you at times, whether you are walking, jogging, bicycle riding, etc.
No all streets are paved, so there are rocks/stones on the ground here and there. People chase the dogs away by throwing stones at them. The dogs learn the moves and know that every time a person bends down as to pick up a stone, it is time to run. And they run away, spooked and scared as they see the stone coming their way. This is common knowledge, part of the culture.
Well, There was a newspaper peddler in La Paz who walked with a big limp, bending himself down to one side almost to touch the ground with his hand. They called him "Espanta perros".... sort of like "dog chaser"...

No respect and definitely an incredible sense of humor.

Mexican TV news reporters refer to Obama as "El Negro" y "El Negrito".....

Now on the gabacho/gringo issue.... Mexicans use the terms indistinctly. Wouldn't know the difference. Now if they refer to someone from Europe, they would call them "El Aleman"; El Frances"; etc. if from Spain though, they are called gachupin and that is disrespectful. But they call them gachupin anyway.
Merry Xmas to us all...

Iflyfish - 12-29-2008 at 09:19 AM

I have heard young ladies on the mainland refer to a handsome young man as a mango, sweat and succulant fruit.

IgordoweopescadorconfronteraespanoleP-nchegringoamigo

The Gull - 12-29-2008 at 09:49 AM

I have heard the word mango in reference to something female.

Iflyfish - 12-29-2008 at 09:57 AM

Gull

This may well account for all the blushing I see when I use the term around young Mexican ladies? I may be making a very bad joke that I did not intend. So when I say to these young ladies "Isn't he a mango?" I may be communicating that he is a mariposa? Or is it even more convoluted than that and I am communicating that I am a mariposa? The wonder and fun of it all never cease.

Ilfyfishwhenmyfootisnotinmymouth

LOSARIPES - 1-7-2009 at 03:28 PM

A "mango" is the analogy used comparing a delicious, pretty and juicy fruit with a similarly perceived person. Thalia; Marylin Monroe; Chakira and Christina Aguilera are each one of them a perfect MANGO. Us guys, when we were young, I must add, sure were called "what a mango!" when looked at with desire by them chicks out there.... sigh...

mulegemichael - 1-7-2009 at 06:31 PM

i finally had to drop my handle from down south, mil amores, when my beautiful wife asked me what it meant...ooops...nicknames in baja are SO innocent and fun...it's a big part of daily life....my guys here in mulege take time to tell me what a new workers nickname is to make sure i refer to him in that way...really...so...from now on, i, am simply, gordo...no strings attached...

Mexitron - 1-7-2009 at 06:35 PM

My fellow workers in Texas, who are mostly originally from the area of Guanajuato and Hidalgo, use the term gabacho in a slightly friendlier context than gringo...but as stated before--its how they use either word that's important...the "lilt" as it were. I've been called chango, gato, huero, pajaro--its all in fun and I dish it right back to them in the same vein.

EnseNADAslim - 3-3-2009 at 09:57 AM

This is a fun topic, but yea, it can take a bit getting used to when it comes to nicknames. Some that kind of shocked me at first is when parents call their children Gordo/a or Husbands and wives use that one as well.
How about the fair skin daughter/son that is called wheda/o (spelling?)
Or my worked shared this on with me, it used if you are working with someone and they "Get it Right"-like when you try to fix something, your partner will say with excitement "Ándale Whedo!"
I call my wife Rubia, she calls me...EnseLADAslim :lol:

Mango - 4-6-2009 at 10:11 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Iflyfish
I have heard young ladies on the mainland refer to a handsome young man as a mango, sweat and succulant fruit.

IgordoweopescadorconfronteraespanoleP-nchegringoamigo

Quote:

Originally posted by LOSARIPES
A "mango" is the analogy used comparing a delicious, pretty and juicy fruit with a similarly perceived person. Thalia; Marylin Monroe; Chakira and Christina Aguilera are each one of them a perfect MANGO. Us guys, when we were young, I must add, sure were called "what a mango!" when looked at with desire by them chicks out there.... sigh...

I have to interject here! You are correct. :lol:

I was once called a mango by a an older Mixtec woman that was talking with me in the Puebla train station..

It was a crazy day/train ride. Mi novia laughs very much that my name here is "Mango" But, I have such good memories of being surrounded by 50 mixtec women as we communicated in Spanglishmixtec. The train was a few hours late and I literly had 500 people rolling on the ground laughing at my jokes (or me?!) :lol:

Mango - 4-6-2009 at 10:19 PM

BTW - I've been called gringo hundreds of times.. only a few of which were derogatory. It's all about context.

Just the other day I saw white scarecrows(in tyvex suits) hanging from trees with shinny foil attached to scare birds away from a vinyard.

It didn't bother me.. But; I did consider the hypocrisy/duality that is/would be involved if those tyvex suits were black and not white. (Not making a statement here.. just an observation) It's really about context and meaning! - Unfortunately; too many in the USA have knee jerk reactions. (I seriously thought of calling the NAACP just to mess with them- though, I am fully aware of the ugly racial history here and elsewhere!)

BajaDove - 4-7-2009 at 09:02 AM

We found the really guapo guys in Baja are called Caliman. When we asked we were told should go to California to be in the movies.

JaraHurd - 8-26-2011 at 08:22 AM

Good thread. My mother-in-law, who is from Michoacan, regards "gabacho" as slightly derogatory. She prefers the term "Americano" for some reason (maybe she thinks, incorrectly, that I would be offended if she used the term gabacho..) but rarely uses the term gringo. She sees nothing wrong with the term gringo.

Here in LA I work in a community that is comprised largely of people of Central American and Mexican descent. In my occupation use of physical descriptors is very important. I almost never hear the term "gringo" here (gabacho is very common..) but hear it a lot the further south I travel in California. I have always thought this interesting since LA is not that far from the border...where gringo seems to be used a lot.
..

fresa

JaraHurd - 8-26-2011 at 08:30 AM

I see the term "mango" used. What does it mean when a Mexican describes a lady as a fresa? I have been told it means either an educated or high maintenance or stuck-up person..but..in taking an informal poll with my Hispanic friends and colleagues...most are not familiar with the term...

DENNIS - 8-26-2011 at 08:31 AM

Hi Jon.....you must be on vacation to have this much time to spend in the "thread grave yard." This was a fun thread....especially with a box of beer next to the keyboard.
Good to see you.

JaraHurd - 8-26-2011 at 08:35 AM

As usual you are absolutely correct!! De-toxing for a month. Yeah..i am catching up on my 'Nomad reading. This thread is particularly interesting to me. Boring life I guess.

Woooosh - 8-27-2011 at 07:33 AM

If you want to get me going this weekend, lets do "Gringo" or "Yankee"

DENNIS - 8-27-2011 at 08:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
native castillian spanish.

Native to where? You must be refering to Spain.

DENNIS - 8-27-2011 at 08:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
If you want to get me going this weekend, lets do "Gringo" or "Yankee"

Yankees are trailing Boston by one game. Relax. They still have a month to play. :biggrin:

gnukid - 8-27-2011 at 09:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
native castillian spanish.

Native to where? You must be referring to Spain.

yes the roots are in spain, however, in BCS we do have some portion who speak castillian spanish and some have spanish ancestry, in fact that is the historical influence of spanish on mexico, castillian speaking conquistadors. Who is Mexico? Metzitizos of castillian, portuguese, chineses, european, american and indigenous background.

You wouldn't know it from speaking on the border or NOB, there are more than 16 verb tenses and some are different in the negative versus positive conjugation so one can understand that tendency for Gabachos to get it wrong while visiting the shops.

Funny thing, the typical person calling you gabacho couldn't understand correctly conjugated spanish, never has learned nor is interested, since in baja there is no might, could've, should've, maybe, might not have been, there is only present tense, simple future and past (copreterito and preterite).

SFandH - 8-27-2011 at 10:06 AM

My Oxford Spanish Dictionary, which is very comprehensive and shows Spanish usage in different Spanish speaking countries and accounts for the differences in British and American English says that "gabacho" translates to "frog" in Spain and Chile.

Maybe as in someone from France?

In Mexico "gabacho" means a foreigner of North America or Europe. The dictionary has (fam & pey) prior to the translation which I think means the word is used in both the familar and pejorative sense.

It's a great dictionary, as thick as a NYC phone book with tiny print.

[Edited on 8-27-2011 by SFandH]

DENNIS - 8-27-2011 at 10:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
in baja there is no might, could've, should've, maybe, might not have been, there is only present tense, simple future and past (copreterito and preterite).

Yeah....OK....but we don't have a word in our vocabulary that even comes close to the myriad meaning of "Mañana" either. If people want to complicate communication with fifty tenses, that's wonderful...for them, but it doesn't render us all mute if we don't have that range to work with.

How About This Explanation?

Gypsy Jan - 8-27-2011 at 11:07 AM

According to some accounts, during the Mexican-American War, Irish immigrants deserted their involuntary assignment as soldiers in the U.S. army to join the Mexican side because the Mexican government promised them land and citizenship, were highly regarded for their ferocity and fight-to-last-man tenacity, one of the reasons being that if they were caught alive, they would executed by hanging - a British punishment for a common criminal.

The Irish fought for Mexico while waving the flag of Ireland and from that collaboration, it is said that the Mexicans cheered the English-speaking, Irishers on with the phrase, "Green Go!."

DENNIS - 8-27-2011 at 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy Jan
The Irish fought for Mexico while waving the flag of Ireland and from that collaboration, it is said that the Mexicans cheered the English-speaking, Irishers on with the phrase, "Green Go!."

Snopes says FALSE, but they don't know either. No one really knows when or where it started.

http://www.snopes.com/language/stories/gringo.asp

Snopes, SHMOPES

Gypsy Jan - 8-27-2011 at 11:26 AM

Both Snopes and Wikipedia have to be verified - lots of ridiculous stuff on each site.

I like this version - it is a good fit with the character of the Irish and Mexicans.

DENNIS - 8-27-2011 at 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy Jan
I like this version - it is a good fit with the character of the Irish and Mexicans.

Nobody liked the Irish before or after they immigrated. That's why they were treated so badly in the US military then and that's the reason they defected. They were promised land and respect by Mexico.
What most of them got was hung and face-branded.

SiReNiTa - 9-2-2011 at 10:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Santiago
My uncle had the nick-name of 'Tripod Harry' - as an 8-year-old I caused quite a stir one Thankgsgiving dinner when I asked how he got that nickname. My mom choked and my aunt got real red.

[Edited on 12-9-2008 by Santiago]

Ooooh that almost made me pee my pants!!!

wessongroup - 9-3-2011 at 08:01 AM

WOW ... and I only used booze, money... and cigars... had a great time... no communication problems at all..... ever... even with the narco's diving for coke, smack and speed in front of our place we rented right on the beach.. but, then ... we didn't talk all that much... :lol:

pauldavidmena - 8-31-2014 at 11:04 AM

I'm glad I found this thread, and that it gets bumped every so often, because I was going to ask the very same question. Truth be told, while I've always heard the word "gringo" to describe an American in Mexico, I had never heard the word "gabacho" until reading Gustavo Arellano's "Ask A Mexican" column in the OC Weekly. It was featured in his very first column:

Question: "Dear Mexican, Why do Mexicans call white people gringos?"

Answer: "Dear Gabacho, Mexicans do not call gringos gringos. Only gringos call gringos gringos. Mexicans call gringos gabachos."

Cypress - 8-31-2014 at 11:20 AM

You can call me most anything as long as you're smiling and mean no harm.

tecatero - 9-1-2014 at 04:45 AM

Gringo is way more offensive than gabacho........It is the equivalent to using the "N" word to african americans.......But being a gringo myself, I 've just excepted the fact that whitey has no rights to discrimination and that whitey is at fault for everything,,,,,,,,please pass me a beer.lol

DENNIS - 9-1-2014 at 04:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pauldavidmena
Question: "Dear Mexican, Why do Mexicans call white people gringos?"

Answer: "Dear Gabacho, Mexicans do not call gringos gringos. Only gringos call gringos gringos. Mexicans call gringos gabachos."

Wrong, but when you hear it, "Gringo," it ain't nice, and the Mexican saying it isn't just being overly familiar. He's being an "in your face" a-hole.

bajabuddha - 9-1-2014 at 04:55 AM

Must admit, 'Gabacho' is a new one for me, and I've been called just about everything in the book...... :coolup:

BajaBoomerBabe - 9-1-2014 at 07:49 AM

And in Cuba, us gringos/gabachos are called Yumas!

treuboff - 9-1-2014 at 12:01 PM

All Mexicans I come in contact with love it when I refer to white USA citizens as Gobacho's. They really crack a smile and give a chuckle when I tell them all Gobacho's look alike.

bajabuddha - 9-1-2014 at 12:13 PM

Awright, is it GA or GO-bacho? Double spelling here; which is it?

DENNIS - 9-1-2014 at 12:20 PM

Gabacho

Gabacho (Spanish pronunciation: [ɡaˈβatʃo]; feminine, gabacha) is a word used in the Spanish language to describe foreigners of different origins. In Spain it is used as a pejorative reference to someone French, coming from the Catalan word gavatx which translates as foreigner.

Gabacho - Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gabacho

Wikipedia

EnsenadaDr - 9-1-2014 at 07:45 PM

you can also spell it gavacho, or in a case of a woman, gavacha.

dasubergeek - 9-2-2014 at 11:11 AM

I hear both "gabacho" and "gringo", but usually just overly familiar. It's when words get added to it, like "p*nche gringo" or "p*to gabacho" that it becomes fighting words. On Revolución in Tijuana you'll only hear "gringo". Nobody uses "americano", because Mexicans see themselves as Americans just as much as estadounidenses and Soviet Canuckistanis.

The one that's never used pejoratively is güero. My Spanish, once I get going, is accent-free enough that Mexican people, especially in the U.S., will stop and ask me if I'm from Sinaloa. Why Sinaloa? "Porque en Sinaloa hay muchos güeros como tú."

As for nicknames, everyone in Baja calls me "El Grenache" because my face is as red as the wine they grow. Up here I get called "the Mountain" because I'm pretty physically imposing.

dasubergeek - 9-2-2014 at 11:13 AM

Oh, and to the person who asked what it means when a woman is a "fresa", it means she's stuck-up and fancy. There's a whole "fresa" subculture in Mexico City, with their own manner of speaking ("O sea...") and very judgmental about clothes and taste. The opposite of "fresa" is "naco" or "naca", low-class, the Mexican equivalent of powhitetrash.

alacran - 9-2-2014 at 10:30 PM

Well I agree with most of the name (AKA) calling. I became ALACRAN in Mulege, more than 30 yrs. Ago. (another story)
I never killed one, saved them, took them to the chili cook off and said it was made from alacran, I sold out first every time.