BajaNomad - 2 border crossing questions

2 border crossing questions

pacside - 6-10-2009 at 09:27 AM

Driving down to Baja Sur in a few weeks with some 'gear' in the back of a beater Ford150 v8.

1. What border crossing, Tecate or Tijuana, gives you the best chance of being able to just drive on through without having to stop? i.e. green light vs. red light

2. At either border crossing is there a place to park on U.S. side and walk across to get FMT? Reason for wanting to do this is so we could just drive through when crossing border without having to stop and get FMT at the border crossing.

Muchos gracias,
pacside

[Edited on 6-10-2009 by pacside]

bajaguy - 6-10-2009 at 09:34 AM

My suggestion is to stop at TJ and bluff 'em....pull into the declare lane and tell them you are getting FMT's......other suggestion is to get FMT's at Otay and cross S/B at Otay........either way, it's a flip of the coin

Crossed S/B at Otay with a load of "stuff" at 9:15AM last Friday. No cars in line S/B, green light, passed on through.

No problems

[Edited on 6-10-2009 by bajaguy]

David K - 6-10-2009 at 09:37 AM

Tecate is easier to walk across for the cards... but the bank there is only open regular hours... Tijuana has a 24 hour bank teller for card payment.

Tijuana has many lanes flowing into Mexico and Tecate has only one... either way you can get a red light... unless you are smuggling, it's no big deal.

woody with a view - 6-10-2009 at 10:12 AM

they stand in the roadway at tj and if you look loaded they flag you over. if you park for fmt they still look inside and then ask you to push the button.

BajaDove - 6-10-2009 at 10:13 AM

WHOA! When you reach GN they will want to see your papers. You best have at least a tourist card or they could send you back to TJ.
Unless the Migration officer isn't there.

DENNIS - 6-10-2009 at 10:26 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pacside
1. What border crossing, Tecate or Tijuana, gives you the best chance of being able to just drive on through without having to stop? i.e. green light vs. red light

San Ysidro, hands down. [ I don't really know what "hands down" means but, I hear a lot of people say it ]
I've watched them operate at Tecate and, at times, given the low volume of traffic, they seem to get bored and lonely and will red-lite every car that comes through.
Unless you're driving a big covered vehicle or a loaded exposed F-150, your chances of being stopped are slim.
On the other hand, if you want a more scientific opinion, flip a coin. :lol:

David K - 6-10-2009 at 11:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaDove
WHOA! When you reach GN they will want to see your papers. You best have at least a tourist card or they could send you back to TJ.
Unless the Migration officer isn't there.

You do know that is BS... the whole operation there is for some cash, so you can continue. That said, get the card at the border so you are not in violation when you are south of Ensenada.

Also, Hwy. 1 is NOT the only road that goes into Baja Sur from Baja Norte... The locals in Guerrero Negro have a really great way to avoid that tourist trap/ bug spray operation. Use Google Earth and folllow the road past the airport, north of the border.

The Guillermo Prieto/San Francisquito and El Arco/Hwy.1 roads across the border also do not have any inspection or personal.

David K - 6-10-2009 at 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by pacside
1. What border crossing, Tecate or Tijuana, gives you the best chance of being able to just drive on through without having to stop? i.e. green light vs. red light

Exactly, Dennis! I got the red light at Tecate once so they could make sure my one 5 gallon red plastic gas can was empty and then sniff my full BLUE 6 gallon camping water container contents to make sure it wasn't gasoline inside!!! :light:

LB - 6-10-2009 at 12:11 PM

We cross early about 5:30 am on Sundays, shift change and is still kinda dark
and we beat the traffic thru TJ, Ensenada and Rosorita. Plus those greedy cops
are still asleep. Some people like really busy hours and pull all the way over to
the left, out of site and get lost in the crowd, trying to pull over for secondary or
move on thru. Some people like Tecate. We use Tecate on our trip back, as the
TJ lines and the mass of beggars is so overwhelming. My husband gets his FMT, at Loreto and I get my FM3 stamped. Never had a problem. Although legally we
should do it in TJ. Also you can join Baja Bound (I believe that is the name) they
will send you a FMT, and you just need to pay at any bank. Membership was $39.00 I believe, you get discounts at hotels, shops and etc.

When we have gotten a red light they pull us over and have just opened
the doors and moved us on.

Bob and Susan - 6-10-2009 at 12:41 PM

there is a guy that sits in a chair at tj

if you have a truck with controban in it you WILL get a red light even if you cant see red :spingrin:

if you smuggle you will get caught one time or another

just pay the small tax and sleep the night before :light:

tripledigitken - 6-10-2009 at 01:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Tecate is easier to walk across for the cards... but the bank there is only open regular hours... Tijuana has a 24 hour bank teller for card payment.

Tijuana has many lanes flowing into Mexico and Tecate has only one... either way you can get a red light... unless you are smuggling, it's no big deal.

Last time crossing at TJ we had bought our FMT's through Discover Baja. We still had to get them signed. We pulled over and walked around to the Migracion office only to find no one there. It was 7 am on a Saturday. We went on our way and passed the Baja Sur border twice with that office also unmanned.

Didn't really give it a second thought until I recently read a post concerning the problem of Insurance not covering you if you do not have a valid signed visa.

Question to you out there? What would you do in this situation?

Thanks in advance.

Ken

Bajahowodd - 6-10-2009 at 02:54 PM

Show of hands! Who has been asked for papers at GN headed South. me, never. Just bug spray and pay.

tripledigitken - 6-10-2009 at 03:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Show of hands! Who has been asked for papers at GN headed South. me, never. Just bug spray and pay.

You may have missed my point. That would have been an opportunity to get the FMT's signed! :rolleyes:

Ken

dtbushpilot - 6-10-2009 at 03:05 PM

Me, several times. No hay problema, always have something to show them.....dt

Bajahowodd - 6-10-2009 at 04:05 PM

Ken- signed and a fine. Not to mention as I previously posted, South of Maneadero you need a valid FMT. Unsigned, it's not valid. Invalid, your Mexican auto insurance can be voided. Do it at the border, and have peace of mind.

tripledigitken - 6-10-2009 at 04:13 PM

I will try to explain the situation one more time.

We cross the border for a weeks vacation on Sat morning at 7am with FMT's from Discover Baja to get signed.

The office there is closed with no one to sign said doc's.

What can one do at this point?

Ensenada I am told tells you to go back to TJ.

As i have mentioned GN/Baja Sur is unreliable as to being open, particulary on Saturdays when we cross.

I AM aware now of the repercussions of not having a valid signed FMT.

What can be done to get it signed in this situation?

Ken

toneart - 6-10-2009 at 04:31 PM

Legal documentation (FMT or FM3/FM2) is one thing and absolutely necessary. Trying to get "stuff" through the border is another. Many take their chances and try to get the green light. At either border crossing (TJ or Tecate), I have experienced green lights and red lights. Also, sometimes you get a green light and they still jump out in front of you and order an inspection.

If you decide to go for it, you need to make a plan and also a plan B as a backup. Plan A would be to chance it (risky). Plan B would require a decision on your part before you cross: You could informally make a list of your "stuff" and show receipts in case they inspect you. Usually they will just figure a tax and then, after you pay it, you go. They have also told me that they have the right to fine you or confiscate everything if you try to cross without declaring. Perhaps a mordita, if caught, could help smoothen the negotiation.

What I have done is to simply declare it and pay the low tax. As Bob says (Bob and Susan), you will sleep better and also preempt any problems. The worst that could happen is that they could turn you around and send you to Otay Mesa and/or cause you to formally manifest your "stuff". If you have a lot of building materials or appliances or furniture, this could happen.

In the last couple of years of passing through Guerrero Negro, there has been nobody there to inspect either documentation or cargo. Just the bug spray man.

longlegsinlapaz - 6-10-2009 at 08:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

You do know that is BS... the whole operation there is for some cash, so you can continue.

What is BS??? If BajaDove KNEW "it" was BS I sincerely doubt they'd have said it! Cash for what? Were you referring to the agricultural spray fee? Fines for not having a valid FMT? Mordita to obtain an FMT?

Quote:

That said, get the card at the border so you are not in violation when you are south of Ensenada.

Good advice!

Quote:

Also, Hwy. 1 is NOT the only road that goes into Baja Sur from Baja Norte... The locals in Guerrero Negro have a really great way to avoid that tourist trap/ bug spray operation. Use Google Earth and folllow the road past the airport, north of the border.

The Guillermo Prieto/San Francisquito and El Arco/Hwy.1 roads across the border also do not have any inspection or personal.

WHAT????? Now you're talking out of the OTHER SIDE OF YOUR MOUTH??? First you advise how to do it legally; which ensures their Mexican car insurance (IF they chose to get it) will be valid if they have the bad luck to be involved in an accident & they'll stand much less chance of other legal repercussions if they get into any situation requiring proof of being in the country legally! Then out of the other side of your mouth you advocate; oh right, you weren't advocating, you were simply innocently just advising of another route! to avoid the legal immigration checkpoint! :no:

The locals have NO NEED to pass through a legal Immigration Checkpoint...they're in the country legally!

David, your posts are becoming more & more irrational & irresponsible. What gives you the right to suggest anyone do anything illegal here? Oh that's right! It'll be THEM who'll have to live with the consequences, not YOU!
This is NOT hatred of you speaking, this is my honest assessment of your posts. You are getting ruder, whinier & more offensive & and from many others' recent comments, it's obvious that I'm not alone in having reached this conclusion. Go back & read....REALLY READ....some of your posts WORD BY WORD & see if you can honestly deny you resort to snide remarks, innuendos & blatantly obvious attempts to point the blame anywhere else but at yourself. Be a man! Drop the ego & understand that you're not too old to LEARN how to admit when you make mistakes!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

And in response to Bajahowodd's question, since I only drive during daylight hours, GN has always been open & I've been asked for my authorization to be in the country EACH & EVERY southbound trip! In my case, that's an FM3 & it's in my purse 365 days a year & in my possessions anytime I leave my home.

David K - 6-11-2009 at 07:09 AM

Legs... I said the BS was the taking of money to pay for an FM-T there and bug spray... Dove's post was right on...... You are mistaken if you think there is only one LEGAL road crossing the state border... I just mentioned some of the others... to avoid the cash collecting operation. IF you actually read what I typed you will see that I recommend getting the FM-T at Tijuana... Jeeze!
=============================================================

Ken, there are two INM windows/ offices at Tijuana... One faces the secondary parking lot and the other is BEHIND it, facing the pedestrian crossing. It has been posted here many times that if the car side is vacant, walk through the hallway to the pedestrian side where there is always an officer on duty.

I have always found someone on the car side, but I don't cross in the dark.

tripledigitken - 6-11-2009 at 08:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
=============================================================

Ken, there are two INM windows/ offices at Tijuana... One faces the secondary parking lot and the other is BEHIND it, facing the pedestrian crossing. It has been posted here many times that if the car side is vacant, walk through the hallway to the pedestrian side where there is always an officer on duty.

I have always found someone on the car side, but I don't cross in the dark.

David,

When we crossed that Saturday and another time a few years ago, NO ONE was available to sign FMT's. Call it a "perfect storm" but it does occur.

We will go back to our old custom of going down to TJ for a day trip prior to needing the FMT for a trip south. We got out of that habit with all the problems in TJ putting a damper on our day tripping there.

We also didn't sweat not having it signed before the insurance issue was raised.

If we are ever in that situation again we will head to Tecate to get it signed, rather than risk heading south without a signiture.

Ken

msteve1014 - 6-11-2009 at 09:40 AM

I'm surprised this keeps coming up, over and over again. The FMT cost about $20, and unless you are trying to sneak in a whole house, the import tax is not that much either. It will take all of a half hour to do things right, as you cross, and then no worries.

Woooosh - 6-11-2009 at 10:18 AM

Yesterday when crossing into TJ at San Ysidro by car the loaded truck in front of me got a green light but the inspectors ahead still tried to pull them into secondary. The driver pulled over (but not into secondardy) and was protesting because he had a green light. I doubt he won that battle. I don't think a greenlight overules anyone else there thats wants to check you out. If they want to check you with a green light they will. The guy in the lifeguard chair breathing all the exhaust fumes all day with the clicker in his hands doesn't catch every truck they want to look at.

If you voluntarily enter the "items to declare" area and park there to get the FM3, you do need to press the inspection button when driving out. I don't know if the odds of red or green are any better there. You can park on the USA side and walk to get your FM3 at the window, return to your car on the USA side and then just drive across in a normal lane though.

Bajahowodd - 6-11-2009 at 10:24 AM

I'm just guessing, here, but it's probably less likely that you'll be stopped and search after you pull into the declare section and obtain your visa. I've watched so many folks try to stay left when entering, only to be waived over.

Bajaboy - 6-11-2009 at 10:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by msteve1014
I'm surprised this keeps coming up, over and over again. The FMT cost about $20, and unless you are trying to sneak in a whole house, the import tax is not that much either. It will take all of a half hour to do things right, as you cross, and then no worries.

I didn't think you could import things on a FMT.....only a FM3. Please advise

pacside - 6-11-2009 at 10:57 AM

Quote:

Thanks everyone for your suggestions and comments. I think this is probably what we will do. We don't have a whole lot of stuff. What is the import tax? So what do you do, you pull in to that parking lot and flag someone down to ask to pay a tax?

Because last time I went with a fully loaded 4runner (albeit nothing to declare as it was personal belongings etc.) and nobody approached us. This was very early morning. Oh and btw we had to walk around to the main immigration office as the one facing the parking lot was closed. Then go back to bank then go back to immigration to get stamped. Not a big deal if there is no big busload in front of you. But we did take our time as it was the first time doing this and we had a 5 year old who really liked the whole border crossing scene with the official uniformed looking people and everything. He even spoke a bit of spanish to one of them and they were quite nice. It was very peaceful and with a loaded down 4runner they never asked to see what was inside.

As another poster mentioned I will have a plan "B" whereby we park in the declare parking lot to obtain our FMT's and have receipts at the ready for our 'gear'.

That would be a bummer if the main immigration office around the corner is not manned...as TDKen mentioned. At that point what do you do? You want those stamps for the mx insurance to be valid.

Thanks again...always a big help.

pacside

Woooosh - 6-11-2009 at 11:07 AM

The tax is 10%. They do give you the option of turning around and going back to the USA if you don't want to pay it (or if you need to go back to get your reciepts).

gnukid - 6-11-2009 at 11:18 AM

Basically, you pull in for your FMT, if your car looks loaded they will glance at you. The guy is right there with a table and a simple pad of import receipts. Importation of many things are allowed with no tax, such as 1 computer, 1 dvd, a bunch of crap basically for camping and they are very flexible. But if you have an office chair, a big 4 poster bed and a dresser, they will say let's have a look.

All you do is declare the value, simple, tell them a long story about your grandma and how the bed is really not worth much at all, except to you, just throw out a reasonable number like $200 dollars and you will pay a tax, I think its about 18% but may vary. So you would be given an import ticket to pay the guy $36. Its no big deal. Have fun with it, relax, pay your fee and go and you'll have an import ticket. If later at a military inspection someone feels crazy they may say, do you have a import ticket for the crap, if not they can say they must impound it. Last year I know of many stories of people getting their stuff impounded by a rogue military station.

All of this depends on a simple government formula based on the color of your hair and possibly the size of your wife's breasts, combined with your tone.

You can also make the clear argument that you use the chair, bed, dresser at your camp and you will return with it, obviously, its camping gear.

If you don't like what they say, you can also leave and go to another border crossing or come back later. No problem. You are on vacation remember?

I have found the more reasonable you are with a good attitude the more reasonable they are and honestly I have never paid more $20 for a full load of household items.

Remember people do this all day every day. No problem.

pacside - 6-11-2009 at 11:20 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
The tax is 10%. They do give you the option of turning around and going back to the USA if you don't want to pay it (or if you need to go back to get your reciepts).

THAT is important information to know. Thank you.

How come these importation companies charge 25-33% import fee?

Also, I heard if you bring in anything worth over 1k you need to have an importer import it? Is that true?

pacside

DENNIS - 6-11-2009 at 11:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by pacside
[THAT is important information to know. Thank you.

How come these importation companies charge 25-33% import fee?

Also, I heard if you bring in anything worth over 1k you need to have an importer import it? Is that true?

pacside

They charge that much because they want to make a lot of money...just like you and me.

True story on the 1K...that is if they play by the book. It's nice to have a computer and printer and a bit of imagination. You can have a receipt for any amount you want. :lol:

pacside - 6-11-2009 at 11:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

I understand more fully now how all this works...or should I say how there is so much gray area here. How does anyone know something wasn't sold to me at a huge discount or as a used item that has less value. Gnukid had some good suggestions above as well as to how to handle bringing goods across. I do think I will sleep better knowing I am doing it the 'right' way.

I am a software reseller so print receipts/invoices all the time... thanks Dennis.

pacside

woody with a view - 6-11-2009 at 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
Basically, you pull in for your FMT, if your car looks loaded they will glance at you. The guy is right there with a table and a simple pad of import receipts. Importation of many things are allowed with no tax, such as 1 computer, 1 dvd, a bunch of crap basically for camping and they are very flexible. But if you have an office chair, a big 4 poster bed and a dresser, they will say let's have a look.

All you do is declare the value, simple, tell them a long story about your grandma and how the bed is really not worth much at all, except to you, just throw out a reasonable number like $200 dollars and you will pay a tax, I think its about 18% but may vary. So you would be given an import ticket to pay the guy $36. Its no big deal. Have fun with it, relax, pay your fee and go and you'll have an import ticket. If later at a military inspection someone feels crazy they may say, do you have a import ticket for the crap, if not they can say they must impound it. Last year I know of many stories of people getting their stuff impounded by a rogue military station.

All of this depends on a simple government formula based on the color of your hair and possibly the size of your wife's breasts, combined with your tone.

You can also make the clear argument that you use the chair, bed, dresser at your camp and you will return with it, obviously, its camping gear.

If you don't like what they say, you can also leave and go to another border crossing or come back later. No problem. You are on vacation remember?

I have found the more reasonable you are with a good attitude the more reasonable they are and honestly I have never paid more $20 for a full load of household items.

Remember people do this all day every day. No problem.

gnu

very entertaining reading here. most all of the crap is true, including the part about your wife's cha-cha's.....

msteve1014 - 6-11-2009 at 12:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajaboy

Quote:

I didn't think you could import things on a FMT.....only a FM3. Please advise

I have never been asked to show the FMT or FM anything while declaring and paying the tax. Again, that IS something that could come up if you get caught trying to sneak things in.

toneart - 6-11-2009 at 03:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by pacside

Quote:

Originally posted by msteve1014

As another poster mentioned I will have a plan "B" whereby we park in the declare parking lot to obtain our FMT's and have receipts at the ready for our 'gear'.

That would be a bummer if the main immigration office around the corner is not manned...as TDKen mentioned. At that point what do you do? You want those stamps for the mx insurance to be valid.

pacside

That was me, Pacside. I had stated that immigration docs and importing goods are two different things. I have an FM3, so I do not have to stop to buy an FMT. The "plan B" reference only pertained to importation.

If there is nobody manning the immigration office, they are probably out for a short while. About all you can do is wait. You do need to get your FMT stamped. Knowing what TDKen has experienced, perhaps you can anticipate, if you worry that nobody will be there, and plan your crossing during normal business hours. TJ is usually open 24 hours though. Can you count on it? Who knows? It's Mexico. Inconveniences of this kind will test your patience and are a good indication of whether you and Baja are a good match. Sh** happens and you just have to roll with it.

I think all the advice you have gotten in this string is giving you the best possible information for having a smooth crossing, all things considered. I haven't seen any antagonistic BS (in this string). Just Nomads trying to help.

Vie Bien! :bounce:

pacside - 6-11-2009 at 04:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toneart

Quote:

Originally posted by pacside

Quote:

Thanks Toneart for the info. I agree this has all been very helpful. I have an FM3 too but it is in La Paz getting renewed. Don't you need to get that stamped upon entering? Or I guess if you never get it stamped when driving how do they know when you leave and enter. My problem is I'm missing an exit stamp and on my last drive down the tijuana main immigration office guy admonished me and said I need to get it stamped when I enter and exit. Well darned if I was going to go park somewhere in Tecate and get it stamped prior to entering the lane to leave mx. I did inquire to the U.S. border guy as to where I could get this thing stamped and he had no idea what I was talking about...which makes sense.

Thanks all.
pacside

rocmoc - 6-11-2009 at 05:07 PM

Sorry to side track a bit, but what is the buy spray at GN?

rocmoc n AZ/Mexico

toneart - 6-11-2009 at 08:51 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rocmoc
Sorry to side track a bit, but what is the buy spray at GN?

rocmoc n AZ/Mexico

Guerrero Negro is the state line. It divides Baja (north) and Baja Sur (south). When going south, at the inspection station they collect 10 pesos (mandatory) and you drive through as a guy sprays your tires.

Bajahowodd - 6-11-2009 at 11:44 PM

Actually, they built the sprayer into the roadway, so after you pay, you just proceed slowly and get gassed from below. Poor guy used to have to wear a hazmat suit and walk around your car with a pump sprayer.

On the other issue, while it might seem redundant, if you are in the midst of having an FM-3 renewed and have no paperwork with you, it wouldn't hurt to get an FMT at the border- the free 7 day one, just in case you get stopped on the way down. I don't know how well kept the Mexican immigration records are, or for that matter if they even keep a data base of FMTs. But the hassle of being stopped on the way down and having nothing more than the truth, makes me shudder.

DENNIS - 6-12-2009 at 06:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rocmoc
what is the bug spray at GN?

Probably water.

gnukid - 6-12-2009 at 06:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Actually, they built the sprayer into the roadway, so after you pay, you just proceed slowly and get gassed from below. Poor guy used to have to wear a hazmat suit and walk around your car with a pump sprayer.

On the other issue, while it might seem redundant, if you are in the midst of having an FM-3 renewed and have no paperwork with you, it wouldn't hurt to get an FMT at the border- the free 7 day one, just in case you get stopped on the way down. I don't know how well kept the Mexican immigration records are, or for that matter if they even keep a data base of FMTs. But the hassle of being stopped on the way down and having nothing more than the truth, makes me shudder.

This is incorrect - when you submit the form for FM-3 renewal you receive a stamped copy of the application. A copy of that application is your valid temp visa.

Do not get an fm-t, it is considered a big no no, a federal offense to request two visas simultaneously and it will likely be noted, either by accident by you or by reporting. Its best to have no visa as opposed to two.

If someone submitted your fm-3 for renewal, they have got the stamped application form, have them fax or scan a copy to you for transit, it doesn't need to be stamped on entry, you simply need to check in to INM where you live to further your visa when you arrive, bring a toll road receipt or dated hotel receipt to show evidence of your timing of passing-in case you are asked for proof.

Its possible you would pay an extension fee of about 200 pesos for the period to your home inm office. But you won't be deported.

[Edited on 6-12-2009 by gnukid]