BajaNomad - What do you think?

What do you think?

JESSE - 7-4-2009 at 03:19 PM

http://www.hacienda-sol.com/

Click on "beach".
Help me find the adress.
Help me figure out why you need to pay $150us for reservations.

[Edited on 7-4-2009 by JESSE]

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 03:24 PM

think about what? Are you asking for a recommendation for this place?

Our family of 3 stayed there for a month in 2008, and had 2 friends and their baby join us for part of the time.

Before I go off, What are you asking?

edit for answers ot questions added-
It's in El Comitan, don't know the "why" of the deposit but it seemed like many people rent for 1-6 weeks, the $150 secures your reservation and you play the balance when you get there.

Are you asking for a recommendation or review of the place?

[Edited on 7-4-2009 by BajaNuts]

rpleger - 7-4-2009 at 03:34 PM

I think its to make sure you show up when you say you will...

Lots of places ask for your credit card number in advance...

Bob and Susan - 7-4-2009 at 03:42 PM

if people dont pay a deposit they dont show :saint:

"some people are good a taking reservations just not keeping them"
(seinfeld car rental episode)

"no beach for you!!!" :lol:

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 03:48 PM

Their whole gimmick is the "Red Cross non-profit" angle. They claim all their "profits" got to the Red Cross, and the $150 deposit is as rpleger said, to make sure you are serious about showing up. If you default on the reservation, the deposit goes to the Red Cross.

I'm sure they do donate to the Red Cross, but how much after the non-profit corporation pays for all the expences of this joint...........well, who knows..........from what I saw it's a gimmick.

This is all on their website. Now I'm waiting to hear if Jesse wants a review/recommendation before I tell of our family's experiences.

I already posted a review on tripadvisor if someone wants to go find it. There's much more to the story than what's in there.

comitan - 7-4-2009 at 04:09 PM

History I'll never tell. :no:

$150 is a deposit...

Dave - 7-4-2009 at 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE

Help me figure out why you need to pay $150us for reservations.

For the sombreros.

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 04:24 PM

not a sombrero............a thimble..................

[Edited on 7-4-2009 by BajaNuts]

JESSE - 7-4-2009 at 04:35 PM

This whole thing started because for a while now, theres been a lot of problems related to Tripadvisors reviews. This is not local, its global. For example, some closed restaurants and hotels in the La Paz-Cabo area, are for reasons i am trying to figure out, better ranked than others that have proven good service and record. I have contacted Tripadvisor about these irregularities, and have been denied any info based on the fact that right now, they are being threatened with lawsuits resulting from this very same problem in other areas of the world, mainly the US.

I looked into the La Paz Hotels reviews section in Tripadvisor, and i was surprised to find Hacienda del Sol as #1, a business i have never heard from in my years in La Paz. I asked other locals, and nobody knew, so i found their website and looked into it and to be honest, i found it very "suspicious" to tell the truth.

They have pics of white sand beaches in Comitan, wich are clearly altered. They claim its a Hotel, i do not think it is a Hotel. They say its close to town, any Comitan residents know its not very close. They ask for money in advance wich i find troubling considering the last points i have made. And they ask for $ donations online and also want used medical equipment for you to donate.

I am willing to be people at the Redcross are going to tell me a whole different story.

Dave - 7-4-2009 at 04:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by JESSE

I am willing to bet people at the Redcross are going to tell me a whole different story.

And I'll bet Hacienda would be interested in discovering a new source or revenue, also.

JESSE - 7-4-2009 at 04:49 PM

I just called Cruz Roja La Paz, and they say they don´t know them, and that they shouldn´t be asking for donations using the Red Cross name :mad:

I am going to contact the head of Cruz Roja this monday :fire:

ArroyoTaxi - 7-4-2009 at 05:05 PM

Jesse - I think that on websites like tripadvisor there is a great deal of "rave review" postings that are clearly planted there by someone with their own agenda, they are usually easy to spot, as are the malicious ones where you can tell a poster is just trying to stick it to someone. That's why word of mouth is so important (hey, its how we found you) I think hotels in Baja should be allowed to charge a night's fee for a no-show, otherwise they get stiffed. but pretending to donate it to the Red Cross? Well thats just skeezy.

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 05:23 PM

I have a few thoughts about items you mentioned. I'll try to talk about them one by one.

TripAdvisor- is basically personal reviews from people who have stayed at that particular place. In regards to why a closed business has a higher rating than an open one, I'm only guessing it might be because the closed restaurant had MANY good reviews while it was open which gives it a higher ranking than one which is still open with good reviews but maybe not as many. Definitely an issue tripadvisor needs to deal with.

As for the Hacienda Del Sol, the owners are tri-(or maybe even quad-)lingual and have webpages in english, german, and I would even venture to guess italian and spanish. They get travelers from all over the world. When I posted my report on tripadvisor, there weren't very many other reports. Since my negative report, the owner has been crusading for his reputation on tripadvisor, it seems like he is asking any and all guests to post good reports, which boosts his ratings.

They are marketing their accomodations as "hotel rooms" but they are actually licensed as some kind of long-term/apartment type licensing. They can only rent in 1 week minimum blocks. Guests are responsible for their own linens, food, toilet paper, and cleaning supplies, just like you would be in your own apartment. There are usually afew items left from the previous "tenant" to tide you over until you can get to the CCC.

Here's some quotes from their FAQ-
Q
Do we have to bring bed spread and towels like we have to do at other vacation rentals?
A
Yes and no. Since there is a different law for hotels and vacation rentals, we are not allowed to supply anything beside the furnishing. Please bring just the towels you like to take with you to the beach. We lost already way to much!! We will have all the other towels for you. Also, don't bring the bed spread. Officially, we will lend it to you and when your vacation time is over, you will give it back to us.
Q We like to come only for a few days, do we have to rent a whole week or can we gat daily rates? A We are a non profit organization and bound by the one week minimum stay.

These people have little white Red Cross donation jugs in each place, and there was probably $60 US in the jug in our place. (we had to make change one day for the washing machine "donation" box). If Cruz Roja in La Paz doesn't know these people by name.........................

I've been very suspicious of them for a number of reasons. If you need some more information or testimony, u2u me!

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 05:42 PM

from H d Sol's website-

http://hacienda-sol.com/REDCROSS/

midway down the page on the right is a picture of one of the owners with the Cruz Roja jug in hand.

More text from their FAQ-
"Q
Your prices are way below of comparable
places in La Paz area. WHY ?
A
At first, there is nothing comparable with our "Hacienda" here in La Paz. We know, it sounds snobby, but it is true. We are a retired couple and a few years ago, Renate had the splendid idea that we build a place where we can meet nice and interesting people from all over the world and we did. So, the "Hacienda" is our hobby and we keep the rental to a bare minimum to cover the cost.
This way great people with "small pockets" can afford a first class vacation too.
Our Hacienda is a fund raiser for the local Orphanage, Old Folks Home and the RED CROSS .
What ever is left after the business year will be donated to these really needy organisations.
Have a look and CLICK HERE".

{the CLICK HERE linked to the Red Cross link I posted above}

And just to be fair, here's their page showing donations. I haven't taken the time to add it all up, someone fluent in Spanish can do it in a minute or two. I'd be interested to know.....

http://hacienda-sol.com/REDCROSS/donations.html

[Edited on 7-5-2009 by BajaNuts]

[Edited on 7-5-2009 by BajaNuts]

[Edited on 7-5-2009 by BajaNuts]

Hook - 7-4-2009 at 06:06 PM

Most any rating service that casts such a wide net is going to have some plants. You just need to read the specifics of the reviews and see if the criteria they use to rate the places are important criteria for you.

If there is little evident criteria, then disregard the review and move on to the next.

I like the volume that tripadvisor gets and I like the fact that they allow the business owners to refute bad reviews.

Hey, it's not like they have people going out and checking on reviews. That would be a little like Doug making sure that everything posted on Nomads is on the up and up. :rolleyes:

Can someone point me to a better rating source than tripadvisor? I'm all ears.

Sounds like they're in need of a good accountant...

Dave - 7-4-2009 at 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNuts

What ever is left after the business year will be donated to these really needy organisations.

And a proofreader. :rolleyes:

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 06:31 PM

I agree with you, Hook.

And I think we should point out that there seems to be 2 topics in this thread, TripAdvisor's rating system which includes what Jesse originally posted about closed facilities having higher ratings than open ones... and this hacienda and their possible abuse of the Red Cross charity name to promote their own business.

just for giggles, I looked up Bahia-Asuncion and Bahia Asuncion on tripadvisor, no hits.
I looked up Playa Frambes.......1 glowing report from July 2008.

I wouldn't count that as a true representaion of these 2 places based on the glowing reports we read here all the time.

It just seems to me the owner of the hacienda is padding his resume. I had conversations and was personally involved with all the guests who were staying there at the same time we were; and out of 6 parties, 4 had significantly negative experiences, the other 2 posted "glowing" reviews on tripadvisor. I'm the only one who posted a negative review, even though the others had personal experiences as bad or worse than ours.

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 06:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNuts

What ever is left after the business year will be donated to these really needy organisations.

And a proofreader. :rolleyes:

JUST TO CLARIFY----that quote was from THEIR website, even though the quote box gives the credit to me :biggrin:

Oh yea, in regards ot the question about the pictures of the beautiful white sandy beaches on their website, we were told when we got there, "those pictures were taken before the hurricane, we just haven't had time to update the webpage yet...."

And the hurricane was in200(?4?).......so 5 years later, the website hasn't been updated? Sure goes against their claim of "what you see in the pics is truly what our place looks like".

[Edited on 7-5-2009 by BajaNuts]

wakemall - 7-4-2009 at 07:18 PM

Man................

Another "lets make some money from whomever"....

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 07:31 PM

I don't think I/we have posted about this place in the past. I just did a quick search and the only other references to this place was a "for sale" item in 2004 and a reference to "I'll be staying at xxx, let's get together".

Here's the very condensed version-
-we got several good tips on where to go/what to do/directions.
-Owner organized a couple of group outings and parties for everyone staying there at that time.
-Wife Renata was GREAT! Very accomodating, thoughful with Christmas trays for all the guests and a gift for the little one.
-Owner helped a guest who had an eye infection with some eye drops and checked on our friends' baby who had a bit of a fever upon arrival in MX.

Sounds pretty good so far.............

-Owner continually talked demeaningly about women in general and specifically about a couple of women who were there at that time (nothing "funny" about them, one was moving to La Paz, her friend traveled with her to get her set up). I heard some very nasty comments from the creep.
-Generally had a USA-bashing attitude
-would enter our casa un-announced and uninvited
-suspicion that he entered when we weren't there ("Ach, you don't have to lock your door! We are TOTALLY SAFE here in El Comitan. And here is the wall safe for all your money and documents. But don't change the code from xxxx or you'lll have to pay $50 for the locksmith to re-set it!"
-every time we used the outside bbq grill, owner would open the grill, look at it and say...'AAACH! you are doing it all wrong!"..."AAACH! You RUINED that fish!"
-we were also told several other first hand experiences from other people we met in the area, and I could relate some other instances that happened to guests who were there at the same time we were, but that might be too far removed from the source to post as reliable sources.

and the final straw...
-Snapped my bra strap one evening when he was pretty lit up
-snapped my 8-yr old's underwear at another party/bbq
-we were personally told by another adult guest that the owner had snapped his underwear also at the same party where he snapped my kid's underwear
-one guest was so upset at what the owner had said to them, they asked us to drive them to the airport because they didn't ever want to see that guy again! It totally ruined the last 2 days of their vacation.

Honestly, I was so flabbergasted when he snapped my bra strap, that all I could think of was....."don't tell the guys, they'll punch his lights out and we'll all end up in jail!".

I can handle the slanderous/negative comments, but that crossed the line by a MILE!

A few months later I spent a few weeks at Villaggio Turistico which is across the street from this other hacienda, and had a wonderful time. This is not Baja-bashing, it's only against this one particular individual.

longlegsinlapaz - 7-4-2009 at 07:32 PM

BAD person!!

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by longlegsinlapaz
BAD person!!

MEEEEE???

Aw, come on, 'Legs, I thought we was buddies!
:saint:

longlegsinlapaz - 7-4-2009 at 07:45 PM

No!!! Not you....you are a good person! Too good to have stayed there! And I'm not even angling for some salsa....I don't do hot! :lol:

JESSE - 7-4-2009 at 07:46 PM

Well, he aint going to steal no more money off La Paz red cross, i will make sure of that.

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 08:04 PM

Go for it and good luck, Jesse!

We had someone locally in the US who set up a "church", a legal religious organizarion, as the business structure for their plumbing business so they didn't have to pay taxes. I know there is a certain plumbing item referred to as "the throne", but I'm also sure that members of religious affiliations do NOT consider "worshiping the throne" as part of their personal walks of faith! That person used religion to their personal gain. These people are doing the same.

Any tally from those fluent in Spanish as to the "donation" value? I know the article claims $100,000us in DONATED MEDICAL ITEMS.

ArroyoTaxi - 7-4-2009 at 10:06 PM

Chronic snapping of undergarments - what is with that? If someone snapped my daughter's underwear he would be on the ground faster than you could say your middle name.

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 10:14 PM

Thanks, Lencho-

Still working on all the translations...... looks like someone got ticked at Eberfart over $1500, receipts, receipts of $1500 payments, tried to provoke Eberfart because of previous pro-fighting "foreigner" status would put him at risk.

Only thing that comes across as not acurate in the translators is the $100,000 donations. I can't say for sure, but I know they imported to Mexico used medical equipment. I believe they claim the glory for importing 100K of used/DONATED medical equipment and make it sound like they personally donated $100k of equipment out of their own pocket/profits.

When we were at their place, he was talking about their recent trip to Montana to pick up used hospital beds. Free stuff given to them, they donate it and get the tax write off and claim all the press.

[Edited on 7-5-2009 by BajaNuts]

BajaNuts - 7-4-2009 at 10:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ArroyoTaxi
Chronic snapping of undergarments - what is with that? If someone snapped my daughter's underwear he would be on the ground faster than you could say your middle name.

It was so surreal........a nice Baja/La Paz evening...... other guests sitting in a circle laughing at the host's semi-offcolor jokes. I went over to the circle of happy people to ask for another bottle of propane for the bbq, he started off by saying something about..."why are YOU here looking for propane, shouldn't your HUSBAND be taking care of that?"

I responded something like-"Oh, Everfart, I can handle changing a propane bottle. If you have a wrench, I can trade the bbq one with the one in back of the casa for the fireplace that doesn't work".
"Ah, a MAN's work is never done...I'LL get the propane bottle."

-SNAP-

I was standing there thinking........"I can't believe that just happened! If I wasn't in a foreign country, I'd deck the f*@<&R..............." but we were in a foreign country......and it was our first (but not last :biggrin

trip.

mtgoat666 - 7-5-2009 at 07:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNuts
other guests sitting in a circle laughing at the host's semi-offcolor jokes. I went over to the circle of happy people to ask for another bottle of propane for the bbq, he started off by saying something about..."why are YOU here looking for propane, shouldn't your HUSBAND be taking care of that?"

I responded something like-"Oh, Everfart, I can handle changing a propane bottle. If you have a wrench, I can trade the bbq one with the one in back of the casa for the fireplace that doesn't work".
"Ah, a MAN's work is never done...I'LL get the propane bottle."

while that is slightly sexist, it seems kind of mild relative to the slander and linching dished out in the prior posts. if that's the worst he said, i would say the roasting of the guy is out of line.

anyhow, if you don't like the hotel, then stay away,... i'm not sure why y'all are taking beyond a hotel review and trying to slander and linch the operator.

longlegsinlapaz - 7-5-2009 at 09:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666
while that is slightly sexist, it seems kind of mild relative to the slander and linching dished out in the prior posts. if that's the worst he said, i would say the roasting of the guy is out of line.

anyhow, if you don't like the hotel, then stay away,... i'm not sure why y'all are taking beyond a hotel review and trying to slander and linch the operator.

Fact is different than slander, if you can't accept the factual experiences of (granted) a very small number of posters here; people who have crossed paths with this jerk; I personally don't feel you have the factual knowledge to be making a snap judgment call that any negativity posted here is "out of line." There are a LOT of people in this area who have personal experience with him & what some who don't live here full-time are willing to post isn't even the tip of the tip of the iceburg. Suffice it to say this is not a nice person.

BajaNuts - 7-5-2009 at 10:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666

Quote:

Goat- it wasn't what he said, it's what he did.

Yea, he made some really sexist comments, I would have just written that off as him being a jerk and not gone back. But snapping my bra strap, and then my son's underwear is absolutely not acceptable to me or anyone else who was there with us.

Or maybe I'm just projecting a gringa attitude and it's ok for men in Mexico to make unwanted contact with women, and if I'm dancing with a man in Mexico who is not my husband I should let him grab my butt.

Do you think it was OK for him to do that? I'm just curious as to what you consider acceptable behavior.

BajaNuts - 7-5-2009 at 01:22 PM

Lencho-
here's the link to this place's website page that show copies of donation receipts-
http://hacienda-sol.com/REDCROSS/donations.html

And there are different subjects going on here. It appears they have made donations, the question is how much, and are they claiming to be donating more than what they actually are?

In the USA, non-profit organizations have an "open book" accounting. All their records must be available for anyone and everyone to look at. Is this the case for Mexican non-profits? If so, I'd be very interested to see their books. How much salary does the Director (aka OWNER) draw out of the charity? How much other expenses are taken out of the charity for the maintenance and operations of a sailboat?

They are promoting themselves as these really great do-gooders, especially on their website. If they are using the Cruz Roja name and mission, claiming to be this great charity, and not donating as much as they claim...........that's the question here. They also claim to support an orphanage and an old folks home.

One word to describe this guy.....Narcissistic. The same word used to describe serial killers who feel they are smarter, better, can do anything they want, and are above the law. That's the way he operates.

[Edited on 7-5-2009 by BajaNuts]

Cypress - 7-5-2009 at 01:44 PM

Yea, Those goats are entertaining! Have about 20 of 'em. They're chowing down on all the brush.

And doing a good job of it! :biggrin:

BajaNuts - 7-5-2009 at 02:14 PM

We stayed there for a month. I have serious questions about the legitimacy of their operation.

I hope you noticed I posted links supporting their claims, even though I saw many things while I was staying there that directly contradict what they claim on their website.

Added to the fact the guy did something that is considered sexual assault on other parts of the world..........

I am trying to be objective and keep the two subjects separate. And I have tried to be clear about what actually happened to me personally and the "facts" of their business operation.

They claim on their website that "what you see is what you get", and yet they have outdated photos of the beautiful white sand that used to be the beaches of El Comitan. I just believe he's running a scam and hopefully others who are in a position to do some research will be able to find out more facts.

Cypress - 7-5-2009 at 02:35 PM

lencho, The goats are a "lend-lease"deal. A seasonal brush-eating crew. Blackberries? They'll eat 'em and anything else nearby. :tumble:

Plus, they're fun to watch. Never know what a goat'll do next. :tumble:

They've been known to climb up on your vehicle and play "King of the Mountain".

Milk 'em? No! Our bunch has some nannies and some bottle babies. Goat cheese is good, mix it with some of those Baja olives. :yes:

BajaNuts - 7-5-2009 at 02:42 PM

Re- TripAdvisor-
That's the funny thing about the review I wrote for this hacienda place. I gave it what I believed to be a fair review. Good marks for the facility, location, welcome, etc. But I had to include what happened to us personally from the owner. He had his say in the reply, but only one thing in his reply was true. I didn't totally bash the place. Since then, it sounds like the owner's recuiting reviews to boost his ratings.

JESSE - 7-5-2009 at 02:47 PM

This would have never happened, if someone didn´t spend a lot of time putting this business in the spotlight, by making it the #1 Hotel on our city. If it wasn´t for that, i would have never cared. But the clues are there: A little motel-rv park in the outskirts of town is rated #1. Doctored pictures of beaches that are not real. Upfront request for a deposit in the form of $150us from a little place nobody knows. No adress anywhere, and for all of you who know, it would be hard for a local to find it, much less a traveler.

Furthermore, i have received a copy of the Mexican Red Cross guidelines for soliciting, and accepting funds. I have a translated a few things:

1.-Solicitation of funds for the Red Cross can in no way damage, or put into suspicion the reputation of the institution.

2.-All money solicitations have to be done according to the laws of the Red Cross.

3.-The Red Cross cannot accept funds from businesses with a questionable reputation.

4.-Collection of funds can only be made by Red Cross volunteers, DURING SPECIFIC campaigns of fund solicitation.

5.-Collection of funds cannot be made by third parties, the donor has to directly deposit the funds in official Red Cross accounts, offices.

JESSE - 7-5-2009 at 02:56 PM

I will ask from all of you to quiet down on this topic, i have contacted the national Red Cross offices via a friend of mine who is a top official with the Secretaria de Salud in Mexico City and he does not like what he sees. They shouldn´t be soliciting funds, they shouldn´t be asking for checks when they can tell their customers to deposit directly to the Red Cross accounts. And they shouldn´t be asking for used donated equipment and later claiming they are giving donations. Hacienda does not take that very lightly.

The proper federal authorities will now investigate, and they will be the ones to determine the outcome.

BajaNuts - 7-5-2009 at 03:03 PM

Thank you, Jesse.

No more from me, I will await further information from authorities.

Thank you for initiating inquiries.
A~

mtgoat666 - 7-5-2009 at 03:20 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaNuts
We stayed there for a month. I have serious questions about the legitimacy of their operation.

if half of what you say is true, why did you stay there for a month?????????? you should have left after a day, a week, 2 weeks, 3 weeks,... so did all of the bad stuff happen in week 4????? were you being held hostage??????
your story and timeline makes no sense.

JESSE - 7-5-2009 at 03:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by slammeddown
The proper authorities will investigate and all errant monies will find their way into the proper authorities pockets.
Justice, mexican style. Good grief... :cool:

You might be interested to know, that Mexican authorities, even the crooked ones, do have some institutions that are considered untouchable, sacred and not be made money off in any circumstances because it could destroy a political career. Even the cartels don´t mess with them. And they are:

1.-Church
2.-Firefighters
3.-RedCross

This will be my last post on this matter and i will ask Doug to close the thread.

Al G - 7-5-2009 at 05:29 PM

Nothing more then most dudes...makes statements and misses the real point. The cruz rojo is there to save your life...what little is lost due to some people that volunteer is...well what price does your life have.

DENNIS - 7-5-2009 at 07:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
Lordy I feel the love. :bounce:

At this very moment, Wiley, I'm giving you a great big kiss right on your face........con mucho amor.
You're one of my favorite people here. Thanks

BajaNomad - 7-8-2009 at 01:58 PM

Continued here:

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=39847