jrbaja - 6-22-2004 at 11:10 PM
How many people on here would be interested in an organized trip in the back country of south Baja to see places that haven't been seen by anyone in
hundreds of years?
What it involves.
1. 2 days driving on washboard and 1 to 5 mile per hour roads after about 20 hours on the transpeninsular.. Probably some digging and road building
necessary when in the back country..
2. Camping in tents or vehicles, eating pretty good during the vehicular travel part, maybe even some ice cream and movies.
3. Switching to backpacking, burros or horses to continue another 2 - 3 days into the hills. This means, the basics in amenities. Beans, rice,
chiles, tortillas and the basics in local fair. Meals will be prepared by the locals if there are any, and the guides using their local fare for ease
of travel.
There will probably be snakes and critters, there will be a lot of hiking and climbing, probably getting wet and for sure very very dirty.
Why we are doing it.
There are some places in Baja that haven't been explored before. Now that the locals are credentialized through PROFEPA and INAH, they are
interested in exploring certain areas that they have only heard about. We, ( my local guides) and I have been planning this trip since our first
expeditions into the hills when we first learned of these areas. We have waited until they were authorized which they now are.
From what I can find out, nobody alive has been to many of these places and this means the local folks as well as tourists.
What it also means is discoveries, documentation, and lot's of photos. This will be the first trip of it's kind into certain areas and it will be
an experience.
It will be hard work, a lot of walking, climbing, and probably being stuck at times. We will be stopping to pick up trash and teaching any locals
about it as well.
They are interested in tourism. Now they have a plan. This will be the first of it's kind trip and not by any means an easy one.
If interested let me know through U2U messages and I will give more details.
Any adventurers out there? This is a good one!
David K - 6-22-2004 at 11:16 PM
Sounds great! When, JR?
Is everyone on their own or are you collecting a fee (for the locals, naturally)? Jack Swords would be great to have along to document if this is when
he is at his La Paz address.
Bajaboy - 6-23-2004 at 12:57 AM
I'd definately be interested but would need a few more details....when, where, cost, length of trip...etc.
Zac
Mexitron - 6-23-2004 at 07:02 AM
YES, YES, YES!!!
Some details
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 08:04 AM
When? Sept.- Oct.
Where? South Baja.
Cost? $500-$1000 per person depending on our final plans. This money will pay for everything on the trip as well as paying for some badly needed
supplies that will be taken with us and distributed to the remote ranches.
Length of trip 10 to 15 days approximately including 4 to 6 days getting to and from the sites.
Since we are only going by stories that have been passed down, we really don't know exactly what is in store for us this time.
None of the guides have been to this area either. That's why it will be an adventure, big time!
I will be limiting this trip to 6 people to join us and, you must be in excellent physical shape.
It is an organized trip so no one will be on their own. As far as food goes, I was going to see what the majority would like to do after we know who
is going.
I have already arranged for local fare which I have become somewhat used to, (it is actually surprisingly good) but we are by no means limited to
that if the majority prefers caviar!
surfer jim - 6-23-2004 at 09:11 AM
SNAKES .......
Snakes
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 09:23 AM
Tastes like chicken
jide - 6-23-2004 at 09:42 AM
Can you give me more details?
I am already taking 3 weeks off in october to explore the peninsula with my brother and 7-8 friends from Europe, I don't know if they would be
interested or if that fits their budget.
I would definetely be interested myself if I was on my own.
Details
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 10:09 AM
The trip will be $1000.00 per person. It will be in the beginning of October. You will need a tent, sleeping bag, backpack, canteen, straw hat for
shade, sunscreen, long pants, long sleeve shirts, shorts, bathing suit, camera!!!!, and whatever else you can't do without. We will be carrying our
own stuff besides food and cooking gear so packing lightly is good.
We will supply all food and cooking gear, the guides will do the cooking, rural Baja style, and whatever else is voted on prior to departure.
You are expected to drive your own vehicles as far as we can get to by road or arroyo, depending on terrain. And then it will be on foot or burros.
I will have complete lists and itineraries shortly. I have one more meeting with the guides down south and we will have exact information.
We will be in areas where there are a lot of craftsmen who have been making things out of leather, metal, etc. for centuries.
I am trying to plan it so some of these ranchos can be visited prior to the expedition so that any orders made by us can be picked up on the return
trip.
I put a few of these items on this board under ranch crafts or something like that.
Wondeful...
BajaCactus - 6-23-2004 at 02:25 PM
This trip sounds great!!!!
Antonio M.
Let me rephrase that hahahahahaha
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 03:15 PM
I am 51 and am by no means considered a fantastic example of the perfectly fit body.
I abuse it quite often by various forms of recreation and other dumb things. (see www.confluence.org)
But, I have a sense of adventure and am not quite done yet. And in fact, one of the reasons I spend so much time in them thar hills is because of
the fountain of youth I discovered there.
But that will be on a different adventure!
Details to follow at a later date.
Only one question...
JZ - 6-23-2004 at 03:26 PM
"We will be carrying our own stuff besides food and cooking gear..."
Who carries the beer and ice!
That can be arranged
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 03:41 PM
and will be when it is decided who is going and what their preferences are. Normally, when we go backpacking, we do carry hydra paks. They hold
liquids. And they come in quite handy but I will get to that later.
This is going to be more of a "do it the way the locals do it" type of "outing".
And the way the locals do it is with Tequila. A couple shots here, a couple shot's there and no ice necessary.
If the majority wants ice cold beer, that's why there are burros!
But, I'll tell you one thing for sure. You have never had a better beer than a cold one after a few days backpacking in the hills of Baja. Tried n
true!!
Neal Johns - 6-23-2004 at 05:57 PM
quote:
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Originally posted by jrbaja ...you must be in excellent physical shape...
--------------------------------------------------------------------------------
Oh, if I were only 70 again....
For the hard of hearing,
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 06:26 PM
anyone who has pulled as many "dragon tails" as some on HEAR, can do this trip. I perhaps made it sound a little uncomfortable in the beginning but,
that was just weeding through the "martini in a hotel room group."
Here's the good part. I like to take pictures. I am fairly agile still but I run on Mexican time. And I like to take pictures. Most every trip, the
Mexicans (of all people) are waiting for me.
Not because I'm lazy, crippled, or trying to be annoying. Some of you will get that.
But because I like to take pictures. Period.
My dogs don't like it, my guides don't particularly care for it, and I am famous for it. And, I can't help it.
When I am on these little jaunts, I figure that while I am here, I am going to take advantage of it. Most of the places are pretty remote and it
may be a long time before I have confidence enough in my van to come back. So, I take pictures.
Come to find out, two things have happened because of this.
1. I don't get worn out and enjoy and see as much as I possibly can while on these trips and,
2. I have taught the locals that I truly understand what ma?ana means. So much so that I have been accused of being more Mexican than the Mexicans
when it comes to importance of punctuality in the mountains.
And, by the way, all this has been taken into consideration on the planned October adventure.
In My Dreams for This Adventure
jrbaja - 6-23-2004 at 06:36 PM
BajaLera and Steve of course, Neal Johns and Esposa, Jack Swords and Esposa?.
Hey waita minute here, there are a whole bunch more that would be on my list but heck, let's just see how it goes.
What a kick THAT would be.
And as far as people that weren't mentioned, Don Jimmy will be there in spirit no matter what prank he's up to right now.
David K - 6-23-2004 at 10:30 PM
I hope you have a grand time exploring! I will not be able to do this trip... However, don't worry... both Neal Johns and Jack Swords are excellent
with a GPS!!!
Is that time frame a fer shur???
frizkie - 6-23-2004 at 10:35 PM
If so JR..DRAT!!! I sure wish it was later like sayyyyyy Nov - Dec!!!
Cuz' it certainly would be good to have a NURSE/PARAMEDIC along wouldn't it? I'd even bring medical supplies including snake bite kit.
If you need any help or advise re first aid kits for your trip...I'm here for ya.
Anonymous - 6-24-2004 at 08:07 AM
I've never been to Baja, but I do enjoy backpacking and since I am familiar with logistics for survival, I have some questions: will a map of the
proposed route be made available for planning purposes prior to leaving home, and for ones family? Is fresh water available enroute, if no one's been
on the route, how can a regular supply be assured? Are the guides familiar with edible cacti, and/or trapping animals to augment the food supply. I'll
assume the talk about beer/ice/tequila was in jest; it should be obvious there will be higher priorities, "miles from nowhere" when the going gets
tough. Which brings up the question of turning back should that become necessary. How many guides? Sufficient to give one up to provide
escort/assistance with walking, should that become necessary? Later, if another member needs to turn back, another available guide? Do the guides
speak english? Could an alternative to leaving ones car unattended in the outback be explored, to avoid returning to a wheeless automobile? What type
of supplies would have to be carried for the people, I hope hoes, shovels and such, are not some of their necessities. Could the time frame be nailed
down a bit tighter, my boss needs a little more exactitude than "10 or 15 days" when I leave. That's all I can think of for now, I'm sure more will
come to mind, I just now saw this thread.
Good questions there Anonymous
jrbaja - 6-24-2004 at 08:36 AM
So good in fact, I think I'm going to stay home from now on. You scared the crap out of me with all that stuff.
I think I'll see if I can arrange for paramedics to take us out there, "just in case"!
I've been to Baja.
A map. Well, there's a bunch available. But, in the area where we will be going, the maps are all wrong so that probably won't work.
This is Baja. Of course there isn't any water. It's a desert.
The guides and their families are the original families of Baja. They have been living that lifestyle for hundreds of years and they are still
there. But, I don't trust them so I'm bringing space bars and M and M's for emergency survival rations.
Beer Ice and Tequila in Jest ? Boy, you haven't been to Baja have you?
Turning back, I always do that. As soon as I'm finished with whatever it is I am doing.
Guides. Well, not having been to these parts before I can't say for sure, but how it generally works is, the farther out there we get, the more
interest the locals have in what we are doing. So much so that last trip, we picked up a new guide from every ranch. This means there could actually
be hundreds of guides with us by the time we reach our destination.
Escort, assistance with walking ? I thought that's what the shovels were for.
Nope, no english from these guides so I really don't trust anything they say.
As far as leaving the cars unattended, They have pay parking lots on almost every corner and they are only into stealing hubcaps, not entire wheels.
Tell your boss it's 20 days, that way, if you are fortunate enough to live through a trip like this, we will have time to go get all our hubcaps
back.
And, I am so glad you saw this thread, you are exactly the type I have been looking for to go on this deepest darkest Baja adventure.
surfer jim - 6-24-2004 at 08:43 AM
I love it.....
If I were to go I would take a pocket full of PORK tacos with me in case food ran out....better than eating cactus....
[Edited on 6-24-2004 by surfer jim]
Bob H - 6-24-2004 at 09:06 AM
I would make sure I also had at least a dozen or so of some nice fat cigars!
Bob H
JR you are too funny
JZ - 6-24-2004 at 10:46 AM
I think you wrote the annon post just to make us laugh!!!
Positive Thinking/Action
Skeet/Loreto - 6-24-2004 at 12:27 PM
JR;
I applaud you for your Adventures!
Oh! if I were only 20 years younger!
Me thinks that you have improved you attitude in Life. I met you a year and a Half past and followed you words and Actions on the two Boards:JR you
have Changed!!
Did you get to one of those "Secret Spots" look out over the Water and Mountains and figure out that you have a "Purpose in Life"?
It seems that more and more of your energy is being directed toward the Love and Care of the Mexican People.The Actions of wanting to take and show
other "Unlearned People' ,the True
Mexican Mountain/Country People, is your way of Bridging the Gap.
I feel with you as I did that on a smaller basis with the Sea of Cortez so many years ago., living with the people of San Nicolas. You are undertaking
A Grand Adventue.
God Bless you in you Travels!
Skeet/Loreto
In God I Trust"
Anonymous - 6-24-2004 at 01:31 PM
I understand what the thousand dollars is for, your sense of humor. To hand it over to a stranger whose guides have never been to where they're
guiding, based on the strategies laid out so far, didn't make much sense, but nevertheless I thought I'd ask. Your defensive posture affirms what my
gut feeling told me, you're an impulsive amateur who wings it. Probably explains the lack of signups so far. Although your "Peanut Gallery" of Surfer
Jim and Bob H. do seem to be somewhat vague prospects. At least they have their respective dim views of what would keep them happy. Cigars and pork
rinds, that'll go well with your tequila.
You may decry the effing gringos at every opportunity, but you always seem to turn to a scheme that involves fleecing them, best example of a self
fulfilling prophecy I've seen.
Thanks for your opinion
jrbaja - 6-24-2004 at 01:38 PM
Sounds like you know a lot about Baja as well !
"you're an impulsive amateur who wings" it.
If you look this up in a dictionary, they have a picture of me !
[Edited on 6/24/2004 by jrbaja]
Money
jrbaja - 6-24-2004 at 03:19 PM
Kinda figgered it would get down to that
Any money that is made will be spent as I see fit. As many of you know, I have been doing this stuff for a couple years. I have made some pretty
good friends in many areas down south and continue to help them as they have helped me.
What my plans are for your money is to use it to buy some necessary supplies for the people down south, pay for guides, food, and supplies, and to
help me get it to them.
It is all part of an ongoing project that seems to be working for numerous reasons.
If anyone thinks it's all for me, so what. Don't go.
This is a once in a lifetime opportunity to see some things for the first time.
If any of you want to join me and local friends/ guides who know these areas as well as contributing $1000.00 to me and my donation program for 10
to 15 days in the wilds, that's fine too.
As far as my "winging it", I suppose that is what it could be called. It's true, my guides and I have never been to these areas, DUH!. That's why
we are going.
I haven't even told any of you the legends yet but that will come when it is decided who is going, if anyone besides the usual group. That is, me,
the dogs, and my guides.
We have been planning this for over a year. We have waited for the guides to get their papers so it is legal.
I have discussed these trips with PROFEPA and they like what I am doing
as far as helping the people and teaching about trash etc.
Almost anyone that wants to join me on the first trip to these regions, it's going to cost them $1000.00 period.
Margie - 6-24-2004 at 08:04 PM
I am not a good horsewoman so I can't go, anyways, I need bubble baths.
It looks like...
Herb - 6-24-2004 at 08:33 PM
Anon did not read the Title/Subject of the thread, "For the adventurers" Suspense and maybe even a little danger are kind of essential ingredients for
adventure.
Unless, of course, you're talking about the Spanish translation of the title of the US TV show known as "Rugrats."
surfer jim - 6-25-2004 at 12:30 AM
Hi...I am SURFER JIM and I am JR's side kick....like Johnny Carson and Ed Mc man I guess.....HaHaHa....
Fear!
Skeet/Loreto - 6-25-2004 at 05:52 AM
JR
You can "Smell the Fear" in some of the words of the Naysaysers.
They are so small minded and Fearsome that they do not have the Ability to Adventure!!
They can only Hide in their loathsome Words and type on their Keyboards, wishing in their Hearts that they could somewhere find the 'Guts to
Adventure"
So you might make a little money, then spend some of the money on Charity, maybe buy a new Van someday, take more,People on an Adventure, Keep it up
!!!
Just think, you might inspire one of you Customers to go out on their own and better their lives and understand another culture!
I might even find one of those Customers who would do an 'Act of Kindness" and take some jackets to the Children of Constitution.
Don't waste your time on the "Unlearned" spend it on the Positive!
Skeet/Loreto
"In God I Trust"
Those of you that know me
jrbaja - 6-25-2004 at 07:27 AM
also know that what is read on here means very little to me other than entertainment while I am waiting for pictures to download.
Unless of course it's from people I respect. There are quite a few and you know who you are.
I started this adventure thing now so I have time to weed through the people that are interested in going.
If any whiners, complainers do happen to slip through my weeding and actually make it on the trip, well, that is why we have the shovels!
And thanks you guys. I forgive em cause they know nothing of me or what they speak regarding me or my plans. Typical!
And Skeet, as far as a new van goes, mine hasn't fallen all the way apart yet. If I had a new one, I would be afraid to take it most of the places I
go!
burro bob - 6-25-2004 at 10:52 AM
The more you keep talking about this trip the more I think I'll sell something and join you. If anyone thinks $1000 is too much they only need to
check out the cost of other adventure travel outfits.
I can't imagine there is even anyone else out there that might have enough connections to pull this off. It sound to me like you have done
considerable preplanning already.
I also hike with a pair of dogs that can't keep up with me at times. I'm also 50 years old.
I've gone into many areas here in the Sierra San Pedro Martir with no map or advice from anyone. That way when I do see something really cool (all the
time), I get this great fealling of discovery. I'm not deluding myself that I'm the first person to see it, just that I found something that no one
told me about.
Also JR your take on the honesty of the people in the country is right on. If anything these people will go out of their way to take care of you and
try to get you home safe. I have heard of people getting ripped off when they left their rigs at the mouth of a canyon to go hiking, but it was other
people in dune buggies, not the locals that ripped them off.
A couple of questions though. Do any of the guides double as bartenders? Are there any massage therapists at the pools we will visit? Can we have
pizza at least one night instead of pork tacos? Can I get a discount if I bring my own burro? (He would like to travel and meet some nice southern
burras.)
burro bob
gonetobaja - 6-25-2004 at 12:42 PM
JR,
You have a great Idea!! Good luck!!
Keep up the honest answers.
Really though is that anonymys guy for real? All I can say is, if someone who is going into unexplored territory says they know exactly what will
happen then you know they are lying. JRs experience shows in his answers that an unknown is just that and the only way is to deal with your
expedition as it happens.
$1000.00 for 10-15 days????
Your way too cheap. You could get 3X that for what you are about to do JR. Just the opportunity to go to unexplored territory is a once in a
lifetime!
buena Suerte!
GTB
Wow, thanks everyone
jrbaja - 6-25-2004 at 01:48 PM
I actually do have quite a bit of time up there and I actually do love it and the people but I actually don't think I would be called a professional
by any means.
This trip will be just like the rest of my trips but with more people. I think I have some idea of who will be going and I think it will probably be
a most enjoyable if not down right awesome adventure. Personally, I have been looking forward to it for over a year.
There isn't going to be any babying, everyone will be contributing in one way or another, and we will all be "working" together.
I don't have any set schedule and if some want to go slower than others, that is how fast we will go. Remember, I like to take pictures!
I have taken this all into consideration as far as the length of time goes. There will be a minimum of 10 days. I expect to see a lot at a liesurely
pace. This is from past experience.
I know the original guides who will be joining us and I seriously doubt that I know others that will more than likely be joining us along the way.
That's just the way it works.
The farther away you get, the less people that know the areas. Including the locals. I have explored as many of these areas as possible without it
becoming a week long expedition as this will be.
Nobody has been to these areas out of anyone I have met and they are not aware of any other ranches out there. That doesn't mean there aren't any,
it just means they don't get out much
As far as the time frame goes, I know of 4 different areas that have been basically ignored over the years. If we should be so lucky as to cover a
lot of territory quickly, hahahahahaha , and exhaust a certain area, we will be traveling once again to one of the other areas for more of the same.
There are many stories in those hills. I am just sort of lookin into them in person
Massage therapy "It's in the water"!
Here's a clue
jrbaja - 6-25-2004 at 01:52 PM
Over the guy in the caves left is the area we are headed to first.
[Edited on 6/25/2004 by jrbaja]
This was the first of our crew
jrbaja - 6-25-2004 at 02:01 PM
on the www.confluence.org expedition.
Anonymous - 6-26-2004 at 11:01 AM
with that rope around his neck, it's hard to believe he was a volunteer
David K - 6-26-2004 at 11:35 AM
When I see a bunch of guys and a goat on a rope, I get worried!
If you end up in the Valley of the Dinosaurs or find a lost tribe of Amazons as you explore the new world, I know I will regret not going!
Seriously, this is what makes Baja so exciting to me, the knowing you will see something new or different... perhaps even undiscovered! There's not
that many places left on earth like that... specially just a few hours from a place like Los Angeles!
Actually
jrbaja - 6-26-2004 at 12:52 PM
That goat was on it's way for some birria tacos supplied by himself!
And David, we had on sandals. It just wouldn't work
trip
bajasmitty - 6-27-2004 at 10:51 AM
will big and andy have back pack's. and will the big C have one?
The "big C" and I
jrbaja - 6-27-2004 at 11:21 AM
are discussing the dogs even going this trip. She on the other hand probably won't need one as she will be either here or making mango salsa down
south!
"A Thought"
Skeet/Loreto - 6-28-2004 at 05:56 AM
JR.
It just might be that you allow one of the Weaklings into your Adventure, and in doing so they might Learn that you do not have to get "Wasted" on
DOPE or BOOSE to get a "High".
Maybe just maybe they will watch one of the Sunsets, get aquainted with some of the People, have an experience that will change their Life into
a"Learned" person with a Purpose of Life.
"Faith, Hope, and Charity!
Skeet/Loreto
"In God I Trust"
Actually Grover
jrbaja - 6-28-2004 at 06:23 AM
at least it's expected out of some of the females on here. It's the "HE" whiners that are the worst. And there's a mess of em on here!
Thus this time spent weeding! So far, everyone that wants to go have been to the real Baja before. And, I don't mean Bahia de los Angeles.