BajaNomad

Excellent medical treatment in La Paz!

bajateresa - 10-26-2009 at 06:47 PM

We're making this posting about 1 year after symptoms began that led to a cancer diagnosis and surgery down here in Baja Sur. We want to tell the tale, in some detail, to encourage gringos living here to feel confident in the intelligent and personal care that's available in La Paz.

Last fall, Gary, who is 62 and in overall good health, began to have problems. He couldn't sleep on his stomach or side without burping up some bile-tasting stuff. He had to sleep on his back with head elevated. During the day, he felt great, had no problem eating or eliminating.

We traveled over to the mainland last winter, and while visiting friends in Zihuatanejo, Gary saw an English-speaking Mexican doctor who misdiagnosed his problem as acid reflux and prescribed some meds that didn't help. In February, back near Mulege, where we live, our local doc at the time, Dr Daniel Silva, thought it might be a hiatal hernia but recommended going to La Paz to see his colleague, Dra. Margarita Chiapa, for an endoscopy.

Off to La Paz, to the Centro de Especialidades Medicos, a private hospital, we went in late Feb for the endoscopy with the friendly and English-speaking Dra Chiapa. Endoscopy #1 had to be aborted because there was a food mass in Gary's stomach. After Gary fasted a few days, Dra Chiapa did Endoscopy #2, which was also unsuccessful because the food mass was still in there. So after more fasting plus several cans of Coca Cola (a so-called "lavage" to "wash" the stomach), Endoscopy #3 revealed inflamed tissue in the stomach. Dra. Chiapa took several biopsies of the tissue, Gary had some abdominal x-rays, and we returned home to Mulege to await results.

Dr Silva shared the difficult diagnosis with us a few days later: Cancer. We returned to La Paz to talk with Dra Chiapa and her English-speaking colleague Dr. Napoleon Rodriguez, a surgical oncologist. The stomach tumor was large and blocking the opening to the colon. Dr. Napoleon said we had not long to decide what to do -- go back to the U.S. for a gastrectomy, or have the surgery done there at CEM. "How long do i have to decide?" Gary asked. "Less than a week," Dr. Napoleon advised. Gary had lost 20 pounds by this time and could not eat solid food. Waiting any longer than a week would render him not a viable candidate for surgery.

That was a Monday. We told Dr. Napoleon we'd let him know by Wed if we wanted to have him perform the surgery. We returned to Mulege on Tuesday, and on Wed we called him with the green light. He assembled his surgical team on Thursday as we drove back to La Paz and checked into CEM. The surgery was done on Friday evening.

Dra. Chiapa had told Gary he was not a likely target for stomach cancer but that a partial gastrectomy he'd had in his 20s (the treatment for a bacterial ulcer, at the time) had set him up for the development of this tumor. Dr. Napoleon said he had performed complete gastrectomies on people who'd had partial gastrectomies before, but usually sooner than 40 years after the first surgery was done.

There was so much scar tissue from the first, partial gastrectomy that Dr. Napoleon spent 2-3 hours at the beginning of Gary's surgery just cutting away that scar tissue. Dra. Chiapa was present for most of the surgery, wanting to follow the progress of her patient, and Dr. Olveras, the anethesiologist who had worked Gary's 3 endoscopies, and who we liked very much as well, was part of Dr. Napoleon's team.

Gary spent 7 days in the hospital. Dr. Napoleon gave us his cell phone number and told us to call him any time, day or night, if there were problems. The CEM nurses, who did not speak English, were attentive and gentle. (Note: Terri, Gary's wife, speaks some Spanish, and we got along fine.) Pain management was exceptional. Terri slept on the sofa in the room, which was a welcome accommodation.

Dr. Napoleon visited Gary daily and also spoke with our U.S. insurance carrier to communicate the emergency nature of the surgery so that it would be covered at 100%. He also arranged for us to leave the hospital with copies of all the chart notes that the insurance company required. (An aside: We later had to have all the chart notes translated into English and submit them to Blue Shield with copies of all bills -- 77 pages in total. We received full reimbursement. Dr. Napoleon's surgical team cost US$5K, and the weeklong hospital stay, including medications, another US$5K. What would this have cost in the U.S.?????)

We returned to the U.S. after Gary recovered from surgery, and at Dr. Napoleon's recommendation, Gary underwent several rounds of chemotherapy this summer there. It's standard post-cancer-surgery treatment, and it was delivered in the typical U.S. impersonal and expensive way: Gary's out-of-pocket expenses from the chemo under our high-deductible, "catastrophic" plan with Blue Shield totaled close to US$40K. The good news: A CT scan in August shows that Gary is cancer-free.

We write this because many gringos are not aware that there is such excellent and caring treatment available right here in Baja Sur. We hope ours is a common story -- that we received the correct diagnosis for our emergency and the perfect surgery and aftercare, incredibly quickly and efficiently. If any health emergencies should befall us in the future, we'll return to CEM.

Meanwhile, Terri's going to have her first colonoscopy with Dra. Chiapa next month. Have you been putting off having a colonoscopy like Terri has? If so, schedule yours now with Dra. Chiapa! Her office number is: 124-04-00.

Best regards,

Terri & Gary Myers
Posada Concepcion

Russ - 10-26-2009 at 07:01 PM

Thanks a lot for sharing your experiences with us. I saved it to my med file for future reference for myself and other.

Juanita - 10-26-2009 at 07:26 PM

This subject interests me enormously. I, too, have saved the information because La Paz is certainly where I would rather go for medical care. Yes, I have been putting off a colonoscopy, because the lead-up is too complicated for my brief yearly vacation in California. I will enjoy being in La Paz for that.

Along these same lines, I have had root canal work with a very fine dentist in La Paz. His office was so much more peaceful than that of my old dentist in California and his equipment at least as modern, possibly more so. He made everything seem easy, was reasonable in cost, and I have had a year of good service from the tooth. He is Dr. Talamantes, the son of another Dr. Talamantes in the same office. 612-122-7343. His office is on Reforma, between Serdan y Guillermo Prieto. There is a miniature lighthouse in front on the sidewalk.

Who would have thought that, with all the joys and benefits of living down here, medical care would also be available? Thank you so much for your post, Bajateresa.

Thank you for sharing

Dianamo - 10-27-2009 at 06:18 AM

your personal information. What would the chemo have cost in LaPaz? Did your insurance fully reimburse the $10K total from the surgery and hospital stay?

My husband has only catastrophic coverage, and the potential out-of-pocket expense concerns me.

Pescador - 10-27-2009 at 07:39 AM

It would be very benificial to find out the cost of the colonoscopy when you do go in to have that done.

bajateresa - 10-27-2009 at 07:51 AM

we don't know what Gary's chemo would have cost in La Paz -- every chemo is different re number and type of drugs in the "c-cktail," how many cycles, etc. I can tell you that we saw the U.S. chemo center's bills to the insurance company, and the charge for EACH round for Gary's chemo was $20K. The chemo was covered, but many attendant expenses were not: for ex, our ins plan allows 6 doctor office visits per year and puts a $2500 cap on blood work and diagnostic x-rays, and Gary blew thru those limits the first month we were back int he U.S.

More impactful was the fact that our "catastrophic" plan does not cover outpatient scans. Cancer treatment is all about scans, and they're all done on an outpatient basis. in total, Gary had one PET scan and 3 CT scans at about $5K each. One important note: all scanning equipment is not created equal, and if you can afford it, going to a medical center with a state-of-the-art scanner may be worth it. We had one scan at a small, regional hospital that missed critical info; we are contesting that charge.

last response to a question above: Blue Shield Worldwide reimbursed us 100% of the La Paz surgery and hospitalization costs because the situation did qualify as an emergency.

hope this further info is helpful.

capt. mike - 10-27-2009 at 11:30 AM

http://www.medtogo.com

i happen to know these folks. they run a legitimate service. Dr. Page personally prescreens and qualifies every Dr. and hospital they refer to in Mexico.

JESSE - 10-27-2009 at 11:39 AM

A group of some of the best doctors in Tijuana who work at Angeles Hospital and in theor own clinics is building a modern Hospital with all the latest equipment here in La Paz. It will be at least 1 or more years before they are finish, but some of the names in that group are among the best in Mexico. They are fed up with the violence up there so their loss is our gain.

Skeet/Loreto - 10-27-2009 at 11:48 AM

I strongly support the Medicals in La Paz as well as those in Constitution,
I would not hesitate a minute to go to the Soldiers/Sailors Hospital in La Paz nor any of the General Hospitals across Mexico.
Skeet

Don't know if this helps but

Dave - 10-27-2009 at 12:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Pescador
It would be very benificial to find out the cost of the colonoscopy when you do go in to have that done.


I just paid $450 in TJ with general anaesthetic.

Video included. :rolleyes:

DENNIS - 10-27-2009 at 12:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave

Video included. :rolleyes:



Nothin' like home movies on a rainy afternoon.

lingililingili - 10-27-2009 at 01:22 PM

We were quoted $3,000 pesos for a colonoscopy in La Paz

arrowhead - 10-27-2009 at 01:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajateresa
Gary saw an English-speaking Mexican doctor who misdiagnosed his problem as acid reflux and prescribed some meds that didn't help. In February, back near Mulege, where we live, our local doc at the time, Dr Daniel Silva, thought it might be a hiatal hernia but recommended going to La Paz to see his colleague, Dra. Margarita Chiapa, for an endoscopy.


I dunno. Maybe I'm being too picky, but I would not describe two misdiagnoses of your husband's problem before finding the correct diagnosis as "excellent medical treatment".

1 for 3?

Glad he is OK.

To boldly go......

Dave - 10-27-2009 at 02:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
Quote:
Originally posted by Dave

Video included. :rolleyes:



Nothin' like home movies on a rainy afternoon.


There wasn't a soundtrack so I added the theme from Star Trek.

bajalinda - 10-27-2009 at 04:07 PM

Bajateresa - thank you so much for your report.

Am I right in thinking that CEM (Centro de Especialidades Medicos) is the hospital that is also known as "the purple hospital" in La Paz? I also had a major surgery there a few years ago and was very pleased with the doctors, the nurses, and the treatment I received.

We know people in La Paz who swear by CEM and others who swear by Salvatierra Hospital - I went with CEM and I have no regrets. I think you just have to do due diligence and research your doctor here or in the US.

As for the mis-diagnosis....the way I read your report, there was 1 mis-diagnosis from the doc in Zihuatanejo. The doc in Mulege wasn't sure, so sent you to a specialist. Same thing could probably happen north of the border too.

In any case, glad to hear that Gary is cancer-free.

Bajahowodd - 10-27-2009 at 04:18 PM

.333 is a batting average that will get you into the AllStar game. Seriously, I truly believe that posters such as bajateresa do a great service to those of us who may fall ill while in Mexico. My personal experience includes knowing a medical professor who teaches at the university in Guadalajara. As an aside, his wife is a legislator in Guerrero. Point being that from my perspective, Mexican healthcare offers world class care.

arrowhead - 10-27-2009 at 04:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Mexican healthcare offers world class care.


Yep, if you have a big fat wallet it does. Look how it works for the 93% of Mexicans who don't.

http://rosaritoenlanoticia.blogspot.com/2009/10/dejaron-mori...

I'd translate the article, but it is just too sad. This happened today. An innocent girl shot by a stray bullet lay on the ground and bled to death while an ambulance took over one hour to collect her. This was in Rosarito.

Bajahowodd - 10-27-2009 at 04:51 PM

Yeah, yeah, yeah. And like there's no hole in the coverage in other countries? No government or culture has an iron clad lock on doing things right in in the real world.

BajaBruno - 10-27-2009 at 08:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajateresa
Dr. Napoleon's surgical team cost US$5K, and the weeklong hospital stay, including medications, another US$5K. What would this have cost in the U.S.?????)


Well, I don't know, but my cervical spine surgery a few months ago, with three days in the hospital (UCSF Med Cntr), was $83,000. It's safe to say that cancer surgery would have been a lot more than $10,000.

oladulce - 10-27-2009 at 11:49 PM

Thank you for taking the time to write about your experience. I'm glad to hear your husband is doing well and is happy with the care he received.

I was filling out the application for our retirement medical insurance today as a matter of fact, and will take a closer look at the coverages after reading about your out of pocket costs for care in the US.

Pescador - 10-28-2009 at 08:06 AM

While we were busy fighting cancer last year I would talk to people in the waiting rooms of radiation and chemotherapy and when they found out I was an Insurance agent, they almost all had questions about coverage. For cancer treatment, in general, the medicaid advantage plans will usually have a gap in coverage because chemo and radiation is normally done out-patient and many that I talked to found that their Med-Advantage plans only covered 80%, which left a really big bill in the offing. Those that had Medicaid and a supplement were the best off and found that their coverage had no gaps unless they got into the experiemental or non-approved medicines, but they may be covered by clinical trials.
We looked in to chemo and radiation in La Paz but made the decision to return home to Colorado to have treatments done. The chemo was just not up to snuff in terms of being state of the art. Radiation is pretty good unless you need a specific treatment like cyber-knife or one of the newer treatments. We also found that surgery was readily available and people were certified with the newer credentials but robotic was not readily available.
I am glad that this discussion is happening and would have been useful when we first started dealing with some of those issues, and our perception was that there were some very good services available in La Pa and Tijuana but for the most part the level still fell below what was generally available in the United States. From an insurance perspective I always reccommended to my clients that they avail themselves of treatments in their expatriate country that were of an acceptable level but be sure to maintain coverage in the United States should they need to utilize a higher level (which was exactly what Bajateresa reports).
So I have a little trouble with the idea that medical treatment in Mexico is as good as the United States because the information available does not justify that position and where that gets reported is usually for more basic procedures. I do have a friend that felt that her knee replacement in La Paz was better than the one done in the United States but I think one needs caution in terms of generalizations. We felt that it was important to evaluate but remain flexible in terms of options so we always maintained our US Insurance and evacuation insurance so that we did not have to take that option off of the table.

arrowhead - 10-28-2009 at 09:07 AM

Thanks for a more balanced view. The World Health Organization (WHO)prepares a ranking of the medical systems in most countries of the world. Mexico is far, far down on the list and way below the US.

[Edited on 10-28-2009 by arrowhead]

Pescador - 10-28-2009 at 03:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
Thanks for a more balanced view. The World Health Organization (WHO)prepares a ranking of the medical systems in most countries of the world. Mexico is far, far down on the list and way below the US.

[Edited on 10-28-2009 by arrowhead]


Yeah, but that is a terrible indicator actually because the WHO is a leftist leaning orginization and if you look at the criteria, then you rapidly become aware that they are projecting lots of social issues on the agenda like access to abortion and availability of propholactics, which would raise havoc in a primarily Catholic country.
Interesting aside is that the average expenditure for health care in the US is something like $4400 dollars a year and while the US has the best cancer treatment in the world, the life expectancy for that much money is around 76 years, wheras Mexico spends around $423 per person, per year and their life expectancy is right around 70.

Skeet/Loreto - 10-28-2009 at 03:58 PM

Having experienced the Medical care in both the States and Mexico, and where in the village of Constitution a couple of Mexican Docters saved my wife"s life in 1992, I have to say that both countries have good medical. Mexico does not have the very latest of the Machines but has some of the the better trained Doctors{out of the University of Mexico}.
There are quite a few American Doctors that finish their Schooling at the University.
As in any Country, money speaks loudly. Some of the "Social Change Nuts" are always trying to excite and scare the lower income people into beleiving that they are being neglected by their Govt. Just one of the many Scams going around each day on the various Media Outlets.

Arrowhead. The little girl was killed by a Bullet, bled to death as a result of the Bullet.'
Might it be said that the delay of the Ambulance was caused by some "Drugged" americans in a car , holding up the Ambulance????

I say that the main reason Mexico has good Medical is the COMPASSION of the people working in the system.

Skeet

Bajahowodd - 10-28-2009 at 04:06 PM

I'll get onboard with Skeet to the extent that I also believe there is a cultural factor involved. Caring can trump a certain amount of lack of equipment or education. That said, the WHO deals with overall statistics. Any ex-pats in Mexico should realize that too. Just as in the US, even with an overall higher ranking, knowledgeable people are aware that there's a pecking order of health facilities. Johns Hopkins, Cleveland Clinic, Mayo Clinic, UCLA Medical Center, Stanford. Anyone with any amount of education living in LA would certainly choose Cedars-Sinai over Garden Grove Community Hospital if they had a serious medical problem. So, in Mexico, there are medical centers in Mexico City, Monterey, Guadalajara and Merida that can be compared favorably to any country. It's just a matter of getting there.

[Edited on 10-28-2009 by Bajahowodd]

arrowhead - 10-28-2009 at 04:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Pescador
Yeah, but that is a terrible indicator actually because the WHO is a leftist leaning orginization and if you look at the criteria, then you rapidly become aware that they are projecting lots of social issues on the agenda like access to abortion and availability of propholactics, which would raise havoc in a primarily Catholic country.
Interesting aside is that the average expenditure for health care in the US is something like $4400 dollars a year and while the US has the best cancer treatment in the world, the life expectancy for that much money is around 76 years, wheras Mexico spends around $423 per person, per year and their life expectancy is right around 70.


That is true. The WHO is a very biased organization and they hate the US with a passion. However the social issues are not necessarily an explanation as there are 3 Latin American countries whose medical systems are ranked higher than the US. And it is not relevant to list dollars per capita as price levels are different in each country. For example, if a bag of oranges cost $1 in the US and only 25 cents in Mexico, would you be correct in concluding that US oranges are four times better than Mexican oranges?

arrowhead - 10-28-2009 at 04:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
Having experienced the Medical care in both the States and Arrowhead. The little girl was killed by a Bullet, bled to death as a result of the Bullet.'
Might it be said that the delay of the Ambulance was caused by some "Drugged" americans in a car , holding up the Ambulance????


No, Skeet. The Cruz Rojo has published its explanation in the newspapers and it was not a drugged American. And if you read Spanish you'll see she did not even bleed to death. The bullet punctured her thorax and she could not breathe well. Immediate first aid could have saved her.

http://afntijuana.info/blog/?p=20585

By the way, where did you say you had that quadruple bypass operation?:lol:

JESSE - 10-28-2009 at 05:05 PM

La Paz in general, has very poor healthcare. Most locals that can afford it travel to Guadalajara or Tijuana for care. Fortunately that is changing fast. After four years in the area i now agree with the locals view. For small things, get it fixed here, for serious stuff, go out of the state. Theres a lot of stories of people who tried many doctors here in La Paz to no avail, only to get a solid serious diagnosis in Guadalajara or Tijuana. Many have died.

I wouldn't trust any local doctor with anything related to major surgery or cancer.

Skeet/Loreto - 10-29-2009 at 09:23 AM

Arrowhead:
It was a Triple Bypass,had it done at Modesto Calif. Memorial by a Hindu Doctor who had traied in India.

Being in the Political Field at this time I as an Alderman of Timber Creek village of about 400 people have been resisting an Emergency Service Distrect/ In my opinion and study of this situtation I have deternimed that it is a Political Ploy of some people who wish to start another Govt. program.

Response time would not be increased at all.

We cannot blame the Ambulance drivers nor the Govt. when people die. Just think of the many Cowboys way out on the Range, or Mountain climbers in Montana, Fishermen on the ocean.
Just have Faith!


Skeet/Loreto

bajateresa - 10-29-2009 at 08:10 PM

having read the responses to my original post, i want to point out that while my husband, Gary, did have a great surgery in La Paz, he decided to return to the U.S. for the follow-up chemotherapy. in other words, he did choose to avail himself of treatment in both countries. because of our good experience -- and good outcome -- we have probably idealized the healthcare situation in La Paz, just as others who have had bad experiences might trash it. it's individual like that anywhere.

i want to add one more bit to our story: at the time of his cancer diagnosis, Gary accidentally broke his foot in La Paz -- 2 oblique breaks (among the worst kind, we were told). the surgery to repair those fractures was done by Dr. Gonzales Osuna at CEM (the purple hospital). about 3 months after the surgery, when we were back in the U.S. my husband saw a highly respected orthopedic foot surgeon in Santa Cruz, CA, to take out the 3 pins that Dr Gonzales had placed in his foot. the Santa Cruz surgeon looked at the x-ray we'd brought with us from CEM next to the one taken there in his office and pronounced the repair a beautiful job.

Dr Gonzales's fee for the several-hour foot surgery and follow-up visits was about US$800 (reimbursed by Blue Shield). the ortho surgeon in Santa Cruz who saw Gary for 15 minutes to look at an x-ray and take out 3 pins billed Blue Shield for $3750. Blue Shield took its usual "adjustment" and paid the guy about $2000.

last thing: Gary has had a bridge and several crowns done by Dr Talamantes, the La Paz dentist mentioned in this thread. he has been pleased, and the dental work has held up well.

4x4abc - 8-18-2018 at 08:23 AM

La Paz has decent medical support.
It even has some very good doctors, if you know how to find them.
If you don't know how to find them and for better medical care in general take a flight to Mexico City or Guadalajara.
Aside from bad doctors, La Paz (and Cabo) have money traps designed for foreigners. Still cheaper than the US, those hospitals have much higher prices for foreigners than for Mexicans.
The hospital mentioned by the original poster is especially bad for fleecing you.

Even the general hospital in La Paz (Salvatierra) has slightly higher prices for foreigners, but you get a nicer room.
Expect about $6,000 peso for the surgery room (no matter how many hours) and one night stay. About $2,000 pesos for each additional day.
Surgeons charge around $8,000 pesos (that includes the anesthesiologist and up to 2 assistants).

Anyone with a permanent residency can sign up for the Mexican health system Seguro Popular for about $USD 400 a year. Then you don't have to worry about medical costs.

However, if you decide to parallel do doctor visits and basic services out of pocket for a number of reasons - it will not burden you at all.

Doctor visits in La Paz are between $600 Peso to $1,200 Peso. Most common charge is $600 and $800. That usually gives you one full hour of the doctor's time. You feel very well taken care of.
Services like blood tests ($800) and x-rays ($600) are affordable out of pocket.
Generic medicine from Farmacias Similares is dirt cheap.

Bottom line - you are well taken care of by decent doctors for low prices in Baja Sur. For super service and special needs fly to Mexico City or Guadalajara.

One thing to remember for Hospital Salvatierra in La Paz - you get a nice room but no pillow and warm cover. They are proud of their cold AC, so bring your own pillow and comforter and you'll be set.

BajaBlanca - 8-18-2018 at 09:31 AM

welcome naranayan - are you aware that the original post is 9 years old?

In that interim, I think that both dentists and doctors as well as medical care, has all improved so much.

Just yesterday I was mentioning to weebray that our seguro popular has been incredible. I get my insulin and a health check up within 20 minutes of walking into the clinic. No need to make an appt. although this gringa did insist on it the first month LOL What did I know?

Not only that, when we spent a month in La Paz (500 miles south of us), I was able to walk into the La Paz clinic with my paperwork and I got insulin within 10 minutes and an x-ray of my knee within 30 min. after that, at no cost out of pocket. I can't think of anywhere else in the world where that would be the case. All of this for $200 a year seguro popular payment.

Bill Collector - 8-18-2018 at 09:55 AM

Thank You Blanca for pointing out the post is from 2009....I’ve had 2 total knee replacements done at hospital H is San Jose..The second one just 8 weeks ago..That happens to be a 1st class hospital with all the top of the line equipment..Mexico has changed drastically since 2009..

bajamary1952 - 8-18-2018 at 10:10 AM

I had bilateral cataract surgery at Hospital Angeles in Tijuana back in 2010 and NEVER had problems and still see great today! It was cheaper for me to have surgery there rather than paying a high deductible & co-pay here in U.S.
I reality I trust Mexican doctors AND veterinarians much more than in U.S. as they are not after your $$$.

TMW - 8-18-2018 at 11:25 AM

Medical treatment in any given local is often tempered by the experience of the medical staff. While I think Bakersfield has many good doctors and hospitals there are times when it is best to transfer the patient to a better more experienced facility. Case in point my wife needed a section of her colon removed. She has severe COPD so the local doctors, especially her lung doctor thought it best to transfer her to UCLA Santa Monica. All went well. In talking with the anesthesiologist before the operation to get a feel of his experience his specialty was working with lung transplant patients. UCLA Santa Monica had a lot of experience dealing with COPD patients where the local hospitals did not.

Alm - 8-18-2018 at 12:16 PM

Post is old, but so are the current problems :)

What 4x4abc said - even in places like la Paz and Cabo you still have to look for a better specialist and a better clinic. Unless you're on socialized healthcare like Seguro Popular or IMSS where you don't get to choose.

With few exceptions, Seguro P (public hospitals) and IMSS clinics are terrible when you have to do any major surgery. They are Ok for free/cheap non-urgent procedures and some medications. La Paz Salvatiera is one of exceptions, it's relatively new.

From what I hear, it can also be a logistics problem to pay when a foreigner has no Seguro P coverage (or in a private clinic). You must pay in full before you leave the clinic. There is often no direct pay from insurer to Mexican hospital. Mexican credit cards (for residents) are a joke, few thousand USD limit, and some places will refuse to take US credit cards. In private clinics they may ask for USD 2K-3K deposit up front. Elective surgery you plan ahead, but I can see how payment can be a problem in emergency.

[Edited on 8-18-2018 by Alm]

Hubschraubear - 8-18-2018 at 10:16 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc  

Anyone with a permanent residency can sign up for the Mexican health system Seguro Popular for about $USD 400 a year. Then you don't have to worry about medical costs.


Not everyone, there are stipulations.

I hold a FM2 respective now called "Residente Permanente" 15+ years and did not qualify.

I would not need to ask for help and run a crowdfund raiser if my medical bills would have been covered by them......
https://fundrazr.com/gofundmyleg

However, they told me as soon as my naturalization procedure to become Mexican citizen is finalized I can re-apply and will get it.

I have to very strongly back the remarks on hospital mentioned by the original poster..... think twice and look for alternatives.
I do recall acquaintances in the USA explaining me the expression "she cleaned me out" when getting divorced..... THEY will do the same!!!

I can only recommend again and again Hospital General Juan María de Salvatierra.

4x4abc - 8-19-2018 at 08:38 AM

now that needs to be clarified - I have several friends who have recently signed up for Seguro Popular (the have Permanente Residente status).
Can you or can you not sign up for Seguro Popular with PR?

I actually plan to do the same very soon

4x4abc - 8-19-2018 at 08:43 AM

https://yucatanexpatlife.com/rules-tightened-for-foreigners-...

http://www.topmexicorealestate.com/lets-retire-in-mexico/201...

[Edited on 8-19-2018 by 4x4abc]

Seguro Popular

Hubschraubear - 8-19-2018 at 09:59 AM

I can only speak for me in that regards but BOTH options available are pending on my naturalization process respective finalization of it.

I will either qualify instantly for Seguro Popular or Maria can take me in under her insurance coverage (you need to be married or live in a marriage-like relationship (union libre) as soon as I'm a Mexican.

Fee's do also come in different dimensions. If you got nothing it's free.

https://www.gob.mx/tramites/ficha/afiliacion-al-seguro-popul...

Otherwise I'm aware of one foreigner (Canadian with investor visa) that got turned down due to fact that he was basically a rich person with multiple businesses in CAN and Mexico + Canada has already their own public health service/coverage.

Alm - 8-19-2018 at 10:10 AM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc  
now that needs to be clarified - I have several friends who have recently signed up for Seguro Popular (the have Permanente Residente status).
Can you or can you not sign up for Seguro Popular with PR?

You can. Not only RP, but also RT. The other poster meant that that they refused him because his (not being issued anymore) FM2 was technically not the same as RT/RP, - or so they decided.

Oddly, I don't see requirement to possess either card published anywhere. Only CURP, phot ID and proof of address.

I read about those tightening rules for expats earlier - that you can only have Seguro P if you are ineligible for IMSS. They repeat a statement made by one gringo "relocation specialist", I don't see this requirement published yet.

About that Canadian investor... There were explanations in many sources about Seguro P intended for people who can't afford private coverage AND who are also not members of any socialized plan. Canadian living abroad for more than 7 months a year is not covered by Canadian govt plan, it expires and would take 3 months to reopen the file again if he resumes residing in Canada. If he remains an expat, he is not a member of Canadian plan. In reality, they don't enforce this rule - if this is even a rule. Americans keep Medicare and/or private plans and successfully apply for Seguro Popular. That investor person with multiple businesses in Canada and Mexico was so obviously rich that they just couldn't let it slip.

I appreciate personal experience - was smiling reading your post about missing pillow and blanket. Good ol' Mexico... On the mainland people are saying - bring your own toilet paper too, in Seguro P or IMSS hospitals.

[Edited on 8-19-2018 by Alm]

Hubschraubear - 8-19-2018 at 02:26 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Alm  
The other poster meant that that they refused him because his (not being issued anymore) FM2 was technically not the same as RT/RP, - or so they decided.

I may not stated that correctly - I do have a RP (used to be be FM2 before the changed name) and I got refused to be processed due to ongoing naturalization procedure.
Yes the Canadian was well known and so was his wealth.....
Quote: Originally posted by Alm  
I appreciate personal experience - was smiling reading your post about missing pillow and blanket. Good ol' Mexico... On the mainland people are saying - bring your own toilet paper too, in Seguro P or IMSS hospitals.[Edited on 8-19-2018 by Alm]

Blanket and pillow are important..... much more important:
Either have somebody to empty your "pelicano" or make sure you have 2, 3 with you in bed. Nurses are not always available......

Alm - 8-19-2018 at 07:53 PM

Good, now I know what "pelicano" is, if it comes to this.
Not that there is anything funny about unavailable nurses or missing blankets - didn't mean it of course.

4x4abc - 8-20-2018 at 07:37 AM

reminds me of that one hospital stay where I pushed the call button one night
no response
no response for a long time
no phone in the room to call anyone
I did not have the phone number of the hospital
googled the hospital to get number
due to intermittently dying internet this took about 20 minutes
then finally called front desk
the guy answering wasn't even surprised that a patient in his own hospital called for help
if I had been a patient with seriously urgent need for help, I would have been dead

Hubschraubear - 8-20-2018 at 10:18 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Alm  
Good, now I know what "pelicano" is, if it comes to this.


The other piece of "equipment" is called "pato". So with both birds you got full service..... roflmao
Quote: Originally posted by Alm  
Not that there is anything funny about unavailable nurses or missing blankets - didn't mean it of course.


In hindsight everything can be funny! To me it was only the 3rd time in my life in hospital, the second time with a illness so all was strange. One of the first questions from them was about relatives available. It was past their comprehension range that somebody has none.
Later when I was in there for ambulant treatment I seen why.
Almost every room at station i was (somewhat quarantine with infection warning signs on main door and a lock-type room to go in and out - some used and put paper type uniforms on, others not - and big aquarium like windows) had family members "on call" 24 hrs, there was a constant flow and chatter........

However, no complains, they saved my leg, been always friendly and try their best to make me feel comfortable (different, firmer mattress after 3 days, call several nurses from other stations to get me into shower after medico ok - not so simple with 6'3/240 guy)

I had some longer conversations with some of the younger doctors and learned that lot's of the issues are related to funding. At the time (Dec. 2016) they did not receive federal $'s for 2 month

Alm - 8-20-2018 at 10:51 AM

However horrible, I hope this system will still be there when I apply. Better than nothing. It's still horrible - everybody is telling me about Drs and nurses ignoring you unless you are in the operation room. Not enough personnel, not enough money.

4x4abc, may I ask - was there any problem getting into public hospital as a "pay patient", without Seguro Popular coverage?

4x4abc - 8-20-2018 at 01:31 PM

Hospital Salvatierra is open to any patient, non Seguro Popular patients get nicer rooms - otherwise service is the same.
The La Paz doctor of your choice that will do the surgery, will book surgery room and patient room for you.
However, a personal trip to see the person in charge at Salvatierra (Claudia) to receive an estimate is mandatory before you check in.
Mexico likes things with double paperwork and extra visits.
You pay according to the estimate when you check in. No charges after surgery, unless you need extra services or a longer stay.

here is how the estimate for a one hour surgery plus a one night stay looks like (surgeon charges are extra)


Alm - 8-20-2018 at 02:24 PM

Thanks Harald.

Need help with long term chronic pain

Eysia - 8-21-2018 at 05:44 PM

I’m new to Ensenada. I knew it would be difficult to get my meds down here, but I didn’t think it would be this difficult. I knew to bring my medical records and even handwritten prescriptions, which I knew were not going to be able to be filled but I hoped it might be helpful to show the truth of my need. I’m almost out, maybe a few days.

I read about Dr Raymundo Esquer in Maneadero, Southern Ensenada.

This posting I read here was from 2009. I read he has a controlled substance license, that sounds like someone I can trust.... does anyone have any more current information? I will be in withdrawal soon, I can only imagine what that will be like I will try to google him while I wait to hear from you all. One more thing, I see expat groups for a lot of areas but so far not for Ensenada, any pointers?

ZipLine - 8-22-2018 at 12:27 PM

Way back to 4x4abc question about signing up for Seguro Popular. I did it with RP. Just went to the hospital, stood in line, signed a few things - done. I don't have a CURP card but the number is on your RP card and that is what they used.

I've never used SP, but I am glad it is there - just in case.

Edit: In spite of my poor Spanish, I found the staff helpful, patient and professional.

A friendly smile goes a long long way.

[Edited on 8-22-2018 by ZipLine]