BajaNomad

Warning Naranjos Mulege

janey1948 - 11-5-2009 at 04:58 PM

Do Not rent at Naranjos in Mulege.

My husband and I have moved and are finally free to report the truth.
We are safe in the USA.

Renters that have paid rent in advance are now being charged more AFTER the rent was agreed and paid.

One renter has to pay an extra $1000 (us) now or move. He can't get a refund either.

Other renters that are already paid now have to pay 700 pesos ($60)for water every month even though the rent included water when the deal was made.

One renter didn't want to move his palapa location and it was burned down.
I guess he moves now.

Armando Naranjo has been shooting his rifles at animals and birds.
This keeps the residents in fear so they won't complain.
Where is the army when someone is shooting weapons?

During the last hurricane, Naranjos lost alot of beach. The Naranjos are taking sand from the desert and extending the beachfront.
The hole they have dug in the desert is so deep a new lake has been made.
Where is Profepa?

After the huricane several palapas were broken into.
Kitchen things were spotted in the restruant.
The landlord is the thief.

Again, this is a WARNING!
DO NOT rent from Naranjos in Mulege.

David K - 11-5-2009 at 05:17 PM

This is the same place the Mexray had a place at for so many years... near Bob & Susan's Playa Frambes Lighthouse Resort?

JESSE - 11-5-2009 at 05:25 PM

Mulege, again.

Sounds like theres a lot more to it.

DENNIS - 11-5-2009 at 05:31 PM

I sympathize with you. I truly do. This is the down-side of the land lease which is nothing more than a rental agreement. You have no control over your future in these situations.
I have a similar rental agreement and I know it could come to an end this moment. Probably won't but, it could.
With that in mind when I built, I allowed for three inch tubes running under the house to carry gasolene for a final adios.
I won't be quietly dispossed.

arrowhead - 11-5-2009 at 06:05 PM

Well, now we know why the Naranjos look so happy.




Maybe the Playa Frambes people who post here will tell us que pasa?

capt. mike - 11-6-2009 at 06:51 AM

Why would you...should you...think you can trust anyone or rely on an unenforceable written or verbal contract in Mexico (or USA for that matter) with a citizen who has the upper hand?

sorry you got screwed but the reality is...pay yer $$ and take yer chances.

805gregg - 11-6-2009 at 07:36 AM

When I drove through there it looked like a dump, it reminded me of Salton City.

k-rico - 11-6-2009 at 07:37 AM

Perhaps the landowner's expenses have gone up.

Here's what I'm thinking. While at Santispac last month I noticed a new palapa being built, somewhat back from the shoreline. I talked to the guys building the palapa and they said that all new palapas will be at least 20 meters back from the shoreline because closer would put them in the federal zone and the ejido does not want to get and pay for a federal concession.

Perhaps land owners / ejidos are now being forced to follow the laws and the Naranjos have to get and pay for a concession.

I don't know, just guessing and reporting what was told to me. Are the houses in the federal zone?

Has anyone asked the Naranjos why they're increasing the rents? Maybe they have a good reason.......maybe.

[Edited on 11-6-2009 by k-rico]

arrowhead - 11-6-2009 at 11:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by k-rico
Perhaps land owners / ejidos are now being forced to follow the laws and the Naranjos have to get and pay for a concession.

Has anyone asked the Naranjos why they're increasing the rents? Maybe they have a good reason.......maybe.


Naranjo already owns the federal concession there and it does not expire until 5/10/2018 (DGZF-532/03), those things can be looked up. Actually, he owns two federal concessions there. His son, Armando Naranjo Rivera, is the big kahuna delegado for that area. No gringo has a snowball's chance in Hell of ever prevailing over these burrohats. Remember the Punta Arena fire last year?

And there is an alternative to Capt. Mike's, "pay yer $$ and take yer chances" philosophy. The alternative is to not pay yer $$ and take your marbles elsewhere. Let those pendejos try eating their federal concession sand when they get hungry.

If Nomads should be doing anything, it is to warn off their fellow Nomads, and not try to sell their palapas to the next sucker coming down the pike and then get out of Baja.

vandenberg - 11-6-2009 at 11:43 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
If Nomads should be doing anything, it is to warn off their fellow Nomads, and not try to sell their palapas to the next sucker coming down the pike and then get out of Baja.


That maybe sound and nice advise, but not likely heeded by anyone soon.:biggrin:

Woooosh - 11-6-2009 at 12:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by vandenberg
Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
If Nomads should be doing anything, it is to warn off their fellow Nomads, and not try to sell their palapas to the next sucker coming down the pike and then get out of Baja.


That maybe sound and nice advise, but not likely heeded by anyone soon.:biggrin:


no kidding. Some people just got sold the concession land in front of our house. (Seller just paid the back taxes and created a new title). When they fenced it off and put a "private property" sign up, we filed and posted a "denuncia ambiental" protest pronto. They aren't happy they purchased land they can't use, but it's their own fault for having more money than brains. Not a common problem down here. You should have seen their faces when we showed them photos of "their land" under three feet of water. But... they pulled up in a new Benz and Range Rover- so they will probably bribe their way into a building permit somehow... such is Mexico.

Woooosh - 11-6-2009 at 01:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Geez. Sorry if I failed to make any political connection with Mr. Woooosh's post. Methinks he was merely reiterating a univarsal axiom that "money talks".


Yup- that was it. I'm sorry for not being clear- these were Mexicans driving the new Benz SUV and Range Rover. They didn't like having their photo taken much and the lady hid in the SUV when she saw my camera. Figured they were narcos so we played nice with them and took the "educational" approach. In fact- instead of arguing we encouraged them to build fast so the rubble of their structure would protect the houses on our side of the sea wall. LOL. All the city people who have come to follow up on our complaint agree it is federal zone, that it is unbuildable, and they can't get a street number assigned for a building permit (the cassatos dept). Even still I bet they find away with their money and connections...

oh yeah. Voted for Obama. No shame in that- yet.

[Edited on 11-6-2009 by Woooosh]

Bajahowodd - 11-6-2009 at 02:31 PM

OK Vandenberg. My bad. Guess it boils down to "live by the sword, die by the sword".;)

capt. mike - 11-6-2009 at 04:32 PM

easy fix. just rent.
did it for 7 years. can't wait to do it again.

me buy....not likely. then you have to worry about selling some time in the future.

Woooosh - 11-6-2009 at 04:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
easy fix. just rent.
did it for 7 years. can't wait to do it again.

me buy....not likely. then you have to worry about selling some time in the future.

I still think it's better to build something small and cheap but custom to your needs, than to rent something you'll never feel secure in or be happy with. Butthen again, I don't borrow tools either. We're all different with different expectations for Baja.

Bajahowodd - 11-6-2009 at 05:45 PM

Renting obviously eliminates the loss of invested funds. But, since so many folks who are looking at Baja are retirees, there still exists the problem of being kicked out after they've moved all their stuff in and don't know where to go. I buy in to the rent thing, with some reservation. Mostly because way too many of these folks are vulnerable.

Wow...It's Mexico, what can I add...

Mexray - 11-7-2009 at 12:04 AM

...except that during our stint there on Bahia Concepcion, we tried to say out of any disagreements the owners might of had with any particular tenant...but we never had any particular 'beef' with them...We always brought a few items we thought they might need or enjoy when we visited, which may of had some effect in our negotiations with the owners, don't know, - it was only meant as a friendly gesture.....Armando Naranjos definitely has his own way of operating, and could cause some 'friction' with a tenant at times, I understand...:rolleyes:

I'm sure there are several points of view about the actions of the owners, but it all boils down to that it's their property, and either you pay the 'fare' and enjoy the beach, or move on...

The owners raised the annual rent after the closing of Santispac to the extent it wasn't realistic for us to stay with our limited use of 'our' palapa...trying to get tenants to pay additional rent after paying the agreed upon annual fee seems a bit out of line - even with the 'handshake' nature of doing business there...in fact, during past years, I understand discounts were offered to renters that wished to pay ahead a couple of years...

Additional fees for water usage by those who lived on the beach for the winter season were common, as far as we knew - Armando had to truck water in his own tank truck from the valley east of Mulege every other day or so, which can't be cheap these days...understandably, Armando had a sharp eye out for excessive water use by tenants...we always saved our ice chest melt water for washing our car windows!

With all that being said, Playa Naranjos, was still one of the nicest places to 'hang your hat' in that whole area of Baja! With many of the palapa's being located on the beach in the Zona Federal, our porch was only about 15 feet from the wonderful waters of the Bahia!...we've spent many, many mornings and evenings lowering our blood pressures as we sat on the porch, watching the critters and creatures nearby - the sun changing the colors of the mountains across the Bahia - the first warming rays of the sun as it poured into our palapa to begin each day...yes, we loved the place!

The Naranjos' always kept their 'resort' clean, dumping the numerous trash barrels several times a week - kept water trucked in for use by the guests and for the flush toilets and showers - they even had their 'staff' rake the beach of any seaweed, and haul it away, after being washed up on shore after wind storms!

As with anyplace I would consider 'renting' in Mexico, I'd do a bit of research, talk to the neighbors to try and find out about the what's, why's, etc., of the area before spending my hard earned $'s...

[Edited on 11-7-2009 by Mexray]

KAT54 - 11-8-2009 at 02:25 PM

Let us see. More problems in Mulege.
People are paying rent for houses on the beach.
They make the deal and pay.
Later during the lease the landlord raises the rent.
He tells them if they do not want to pay they can leave.
They then lose their investment.
The landlord reaps the profits.
If the landlord does not like you he burns your place down.
The landlord has rifles and fires them all the time to scare the renters and keep them quiet while he kills animals.
The landlord is taking sand from the desert to extend his property into the ocean thus getting more beachfrontage to rent.
Is there anything normal down there?

surfer jim - 11-8-2009 at 03:32 PM

...note to self.....do not go to MULEGE....(also...lacks surf)....:lol:

mulegemichael - 11-8-2009 at 03:43 PM

people...all of these posts here do not reflect what really goes on in mulege...while naranjos is just south of town a bit, it is not actually IN mulege..we have a place down here and have not heard of any problems occurring in our pueblo, altho i'm sure some have happened....there are nefarious critters everywhere on this planet, folks...we have never been happier than in mulege

DianaT - 11-8-2009 at 04:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by 805gregg
When I drove through there it looked like a dump, it reminded me of Salton City.


Everyone does see things through different eyes. We stayed there a few years ago and really liked it. The cabins looked rustic from the outside, but the inside looked like something out of a Bogart movie. We enjoyed our stay.

Sorry to hear there may be problems

big deal

capt. mike - 11-9-2009 at 08:55 AM

1. his land.
2. his business.
3. his country.
4. their rules.
5. their money.
6. success or lack thereof rides solely with him.
Quote:
Originally posted by KAT54
Let us see. More problems in Mulege.
People are paying rent for houses on the beach.
They make the deal and pay.
Later during the lease the landlord raises the rent.
He tells them if they do not want to pay they can leave.
They then lose their investment.
The landlord reaps the profits.
If the landlord does not like you he burns your place down.
The landlord has rifles and fires them all the time to scare the renters and keep them quiet while he kills animals.
The landlord is taking sand from the desert to extend his property into the ocean thus getting more beachfrontage to rent.
Is there anything normal down there?

arrowhead - 11-9-2009 at 10:14 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
1. his land.
2. his business.
3. his country.
4. their rules.
5. their money.
6. success or lack thereof rides solely with him.


I cannot agree with your item 4. What Naranjo is doing is illegal in Mexico too. You can bet your last peso he would not try that on a Mexican. He is an opportunist who does it because he can get away with it.

capt. mike - 11-9-2009 at 10:26 AM

you're right. let me clarify - i meant they - as in his. not Mexico's.

clearly he makes his own rules. the problem lies in the fact that the local constabulary likely could care less. especially since it it affects expats.

elgatoloco - 11-9-2009 at 11:48 AM

In the immortal words sung by David Bowie...."This is NOT America..sha la la la la...."

KAT54 - 11-11-2009 at 06:58 AM

Is there some small claims court like the US?
Can the renters fight back?
You guys seen to think this is ok just because they are in mexico.

Paradise

Dave - 11-11-2009 at 11:09 AM

I have friends who have places in Naranjos. They put up with their landlord's eccentricities because they enjoy living in 'paradise'. They understand that they don't have a legal lease and can be 'on the street' at a moments notice. None seem to mind.

If it's OK with them, it's OK by me.

Sorry for your misfortune but this could have been avoided by practicing due diligence.

You live and learn.

Sharksbaja - 11-11-2009 at 11:31 AM

That's right, always ask your future landlord if he's gonna screw you.

vandenberg - 11-11-2009 at 12:19 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Sharksbaja
That's right, always ask your future landlord if he's gonna screw you.


And likely he will respond " Sure, but no set timeframe "............... " Yet " :biggrin:

elgatoloco - 11-11-2009 at 12:58 PM

I do not think it is ok. It is reality that it could happen to anyone and there is not much you can do. It is Mexico. My family has "owned" a place on the beach for 49 years. Started with a 99 year lease. That got torn up. Then it was a lease that was one day short of 10 years. That got torn up. Then we were paying yearly for a while. Since the early 80's we were told to pay every six months because it was not clear if we would be able to stay at all. The nature of the beast taught us to treasure each and every day in paradise that we spend down there. In 1983 the storms of El Nino washed a few of our neighbors homes into the ocean and we thought that may be our fate. The last few years with the orgy of development on the coast we were very close to being "Santini-ized" but we are still enjoying it all while we can.

As for being able to do much about it, I doubt it especially if you are a gringo. Over the years our campo naively spent a lot of money on chitty lawyers who told us they could help us protect our "rights" by forming an HOA and appllying for concessions that we later found out could only be achieved if the constitution of the country was changed.

Life is short, enjoy it while you can.

DENNIS - 11-11-2009 at 01:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco
In 1983 the storms of El Nino washed a few of our neighbors homes into the ocean and we thought that may be our fate. The last few years with the orgy of development on the coast we were very close to being "Santini-ized" but we are still enjoying it all while we can.



Campo Lopez, perhaps?

elgatoloco - 11-11-2009 at 05:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco
In 1983 the storms of El Nino washed a few of our neighbors homes into the ocean and we thought that may be our fate. The last few years with the orgy of development on the coast we were very close to being "Santini-ized" but we are still enjoying it all while we can.



Campo Lopez, perhaps?


People have told me you are the smartest Nomad ever, I always assumed they meant smartburro? :lol::saint:

toneart - 11-11-2009 at 06:10 PM

Well, I hope Janey1948, a newby, hasn't been scared off of the Bajanomad.

If someone gets a raw deal anywhere in the world, I think it is the responsible thing to do to post a warning so that others don't make the same mistake.

Baja is full of opportunists as is The United States. Times are getting tougher and more people than ever are trying to figure out how to part you from your money.

While some people can exist in the same development (Naranjo's) without a problem, others may have a very different experience. If Naranjo is indeed cheating people, then a warning to others is probably the only recourse. If I were to relocate off of the river, Naranjo's is a place I would be wary of. A pattern is emerging and I am grateful for the tip off.:)

DENNIS - 11-11-2009 at 06:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco

People have told me you are the smartest Nomad ever, I always assumed they meant smartburro? :lol::saint:



I guess that means it wasn't Campo Lopez. :?:

elgatoloco - 11-11-2009 at 08:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco

People have told me you are the smartest Nomad ever, I always assumed they meant smartburro? :lol::saint:



I guess that means it wasn't Campo Lopez. :?:


No. It means you are smart. You figured it out. :yes:

DENNIS - 11-11-2009 at 09:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco
[
No. It means you are smart. You figured it out. :yes:


Oh Oh...that's not good. It means the memory isn't the first thing to go. :lol:

Desertbull - 11-11-2009 at 09:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco orgy of development


epic verbiage...made me chuckle

Did you learn this phrase from the fireman? This would be a good topic while solving life's problems on the patio of our favorite bar...which I visited two days ago!

On a serious note...

Nice post, head on about living, vacationing or temporarily relocating in Baja...you have once again nailed it! Say hello to the gorgeous one of the family...

DB

elgatoloco - 11-11-2009 at 09:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Desertbull
Quote:
Originally posted by elgatoloco orgy of development


epic verbiage...made me chuckle

Did you learn this phrase from the fireman? This would be a good topic while solving life's problems on the patio of our favorite bar...which I visited two days ago!

On a serious note...

Nice post, head on about living, vacationing or temporarily relocating in Baja...you have once again nailed it! Say hello to the gorgeous one of the family...

DB


This is one instance where orgy is a bad thing. hee hee.

We were talking about the 1000 coming up and recalled that relaxing afternoon we spent with you and the crew at your "office". Can't wait for the next oppurtunity to do it again!

Best to you and yours!

EGL

KAT54 - 11-12-2009 at 06:39 AM

It looks like Naranjps is a crook.
He takes money for a lease then wants more.
I would avoid renting there

Desertbull - 11-12-2009 at 10:51 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by elgatolocoWe were talking about the 1000 coming up and recalled that relaxing afternoon we spent with you and the crew at your "office". Can't wait for the next oppurtunity to do it again!

Best to you and yours!

EGL


With the race starting on Friday morning and Contingency on Thursday...we'll be in the office for Monday & Tuesday Happy Hour before heading north on Wednesday for all the stuff....Hope to see you. Tim

KAT54 - 11-13-2009 at 03:43 PM

Where is Janey1948?
Is the Desertbull going to Mulege?
Can he check out the action?
Is this normal for leases in Mexico?
Does the landlord raise the rents after the rent is paid?
I thought there was a law "no guns in Mexico"
Why does this guy get to shoot rifles at his place scaring the residents?
Is there another resident with the guts to stand up to this guy?
Is this all true?

bajamigo - 11-13-2009 at 04:07 PM

"Yes" to all of your questions.

DENNIS - 11-13-2009 at 04:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by KAT54
I thought there was a law "no guns in Mexico"

Is there another resident with the guts to stand up to this guy?
Is this all true?


If you want to stand up to him, don't use this nonsense as ammo. Most, if not all Mexicans have guns. They don't have the machine type but, they have guns.
The blown-out-of-proportatin law is for us. Not Nationals.

Dave - 11-13-2009 at 05:12 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by KAT54
Is this normal for leases in Mexico?

These aren't leases. More like a handshake agreement you would have with a stranger to put your trailer on his back 40. Set up as monthly rentals but most residents pay a year in advance. He doesn't even own the property where the palapas are built as they're in the federal zone. I doubt he pays taxes on the income. I doubt there are written rental agreements...probably just gives a receipt...maybe not.

Normal leases are enforceable by both parties. They are in writing, signed and recorded.


Does the landlord raise the rents after the rent is paid?

Typically there are legal clauses written into most Mexican lease agreements that allow for increases. Again...these are legal leases signed by both parties. At Naranjos he can probably raise fees anytime he wants. You have the option to pay...or leave. :-)


I thought there was a law "no guns in Mexico"

For tourists it's not allowed. Mexican citizens can own guns. So can foreign residents. Permits are required.


Why does this guy get to shoot rifles at his place scaring the residents?

'Cause it's his place. If you don't like it you can always leave.


Is there another resident with the guts to stand up to this guy?

Look...Most of the residents put up with this guy because they want to be there. Most have little invested and are only there 5 months out of a year. The rents are cheap and if need be, they can pick up and head down the road at any time.


I would add that because of the damage done by the last storm most of my friends who have winter homes there expected there would be increases. They didn't mind. To them, it's truly paradise. Worth every penny.

KAT54 - 11-15-2009 at 06:29 AM

So these renters have no rental argeement?
What fool would do that in this day and age?
Now, do they have FM3's or just tourist visas?
Could he steal all their stuff and burn it as soon as they leave?
Sure could.
What do these renters do leave their brain at the border?

mulegemichael - 11-15-2009 at 09:15 AM

i talked with a couple of long time residents of naranjos the other day and they just raved on and on about him in a very positive way...so there ya go..i guess it all depends..on something..what, i don't know....

Russ - 11-15-2009 at 09:45 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by KAT54
So these renters have no rental argeement?
What fool would do that in this day and age?
Now, do they have FM3's or just tourist visas?
Could he steal all their stuff and burn it as soon as they leave?
Sure could.
What do these renters do leave their brain at the border?


There are a lot of good landlords out there! As was just reported. Tenants also very in there dealings with the landlords. I know here the contracts we had with our landlord he could refuse to renew the lease but had to pay for any improvements made before he could lease/sell it to another person.
So KAT54, before you make such a damning statement maybe you should know a little more of how things work in honest/many situations. And there are a lot of them! Still one should really not make improvements they can't afford to leave behind on a lease or rental agreements.

Terry28 - 11-15-2009 at 12:55 PM

There are plenty of less than honest people out there as well....we lost our home to one last year.....took our $$,looked us in the eye,shook our hands and lied!!!! Where?? Buenaventura!!! who?? Munoz!!!! we had owned the house for over 10 years.....now nothing......you have no "rights", the locals do what they want......everything else is BS!! Gee, think I am bitter??just wait your turn.........never again....

Truly sorry for your misfortune but...

Dave - 11-15-2009 at 01:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Terry28
we had owned the house for over 10 years.....now nothing.....you have no "rights", the locals do what they want......


I doubt you ever 'owned' anything. In Mexico, as the world over, "rights" aren't conveyed by handshake.

Terry28 - 11-15-2009 at 01:23 PM

Dave, It's a very long story..we had paperwork etc. I am not a fool and this was not my first bbq....the papers were as worthless as the mans word. Oh, we could have continued to spend large $$ on more worthless and corrupt attorneys,and years of "amparos" and still not have a home......ARRRRRRRRRG

Falsification of documents is fraud

Dave - 11-15-2009 at 01:49 PM

A serious offence. A good attorney presenting evidence to a sympathetic judge who would issue a demanda. The guy either pays up or goes directly to jail.

I've done it...Works. ;)

arrowhead - 11-15-2009 at 05:34 PM

Más vale un mal arreglo que un buen pleito.

DENNIS - 11-15-2009 at 05:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by arrowhead
Más vale un mal arreglo que un buen pleito.


A bad deal is better than a good lawsuit

Agreed but

Dave - 11-15-2009 at 08:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
A bad deal is better than a good lawsuit


This ain't a lawsuit. It's a criminal complaint. If issued the defendant has to disprove their guilt. :biggrin:

DENNIS - 11-15-2009 at 08:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave
Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
A bad deal is better than a good lawsuit


This ain't a lawsuit. It's a criminal complaint. If issued the defendant has to disprove their guilt. :biggrin:



OOOPS...Sorry. Mine wasn't a statement. It was a Google translation. Should have mentioned that.

tripledigitken - 11-16-2009 at 01:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Russ
Still one should really not make improvements they can't afford to leave behind on a lease or rental agreements.


true words indeed

Mulege

Finaddict - 1-9-2010 at 09:42 AM

Ditto, Mike. I guess these nay sayers have not spent any time in Mulege. Stay where you are...we do not need any more people in Mulege.