BajaNomad

Advice on Batteries

Ken Bondy - 8-14-2010 at 07:51 AM

I have been using two Odyssey PC1200 drycell batteries in my Hummer H1 for six years during which they functioned well. Recently they became very weak (dead after three days of inactivity) and I replaced them with an identical set of Odysseys that I carried as a backup. I have a few questions for you experienced off-roaders:

1) What is your preferred battery for your offroad vehicle? Wet cell or dry cell?

2) Is 6 years a reasonable expected life for these types of batteries?

Appreciate the help,

++Ken++

Pescador - 8-14-2010 at 07:57 AM

The Gel-cell by Optima seems to last a lot longer than the dry-cell. They will not spill and use a gel wrapped around a core. I used them also in my aerobatic airplane and had at least 20 years on it when I sold it.

Ken Bondy - 8-14-2010 at 08:02 AM

Thanks Pescador. The H1 configuration requires that the terminals be side-mounted rather than top mounted (The Odysseys can be used either vertically or on their sides). Will this work with the Optimas?

Ken Bondy - 8-14-2010 at 08:04 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
I use a Optima redtop in my built 1966 bronco with a 9000lb winch. Next time around I will go yellowtop. I have never used the Odyssey batteries, but I have heard good things about them.

I thinks 6 yrs is outstanding, especially if the car is in Baja full timeo you run a winch?

I jumped my buddies rig yesterday with a dead battery. It was a 10y/o diehard that finally kicked the bucket. 10yrs on a sears battery is very impressive.

[Edited on 8-14-2010 by fishabductor]


Thanks fishabductor. The H1 is not based in Baja although it has made two long Baja trips using the drycells. I do have a winch but it is rarely used. As I said to Pescador the terminals need to be side mounted.

Ken Bondy - 8-14-2010 at 08:09 AM

Thanks again fishabductor, and thanks for the link. I will check into the optimas.

TMW - 8-14-2010 at 08:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Bondy
Thanks Pescador. The H1 configuration requires that the terminals be side-mounted rather than top mounted (The Odysseys can be used either vertically or on their sides). Will this work with the Optimas?


Not on a redtop Optima.


I run red tops in my GMC and was in my Toyota and they have lasted longer than regular lead acid types. Why do you say the red top can't be on their side?

Ken Bondy - 8-14-2010 at 08:15 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
Here is another link to the exact battery you'd need. i think the H1 was only made in 2000. This is for that year.

http://www.optimabatteries.com/battery_selector/


Wow, that was great. Actually my H1 is a 1996 and the battery selector had it and took me right to the Redtop 78 (9078-109). The terminals are side mounted. It looks like just what I need. Really appreciate the help.

Ken Bondy - 8-14-2010 at 08:26 AM

Thank you so much fishabductor, Pescador and TW. What an incredible resource this board is!!!

BajaGringo - 8-14-2010 at 08:35 AM

Assuming that your alternator and electrical systems keep the battery on an even charge, the bumps in the road will probably take a heavier toll on the batteries than time. I tell everybody that if they have an alternator going bad they can expect their battery to quickly follow. Car batteries don't do deep cycling very well. Personally I prefer the glass mats to gel in car batteries, especially in high heat.

But that was just my limited experience with gels.

monoloco - 8-14-2010 at 09:14 AM

I had the red top Optimas in my f350 and they only lasted for 3 years, which was pretty disappointing considering the price and the fact that they only have a 3 year warranty. I replaced them with Kirkland batteries that were less than half the price and have a 3 year full replacement and 100 month prorated warranty.

woody with a view - 8-14-2010 at 09:16 AM

Quote:

however I heard it 2nd hand from an unknown source.


that is usually regarded as FACT!:lol::light::P

TMW - 8-14-2010 at 09:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
I was just saying they didn't have side mounted terminals..However I now stand corrected as I just sent Ken a link with the redtop he needs for a H1 that is side mounted. My redtop is a top mounted style.


I understand. The red tops I use have both top and side terminals. I got 6 years on the one I had in my Toyota. I got rid of the Toyota in 07 but kept the red top as a spare. I usually have only gotten 2-3 years on a lead acid on any vehicle I've had. Maybe it's the desert heat.

woody with a view - 8-14-2010 at 09:19 AM

my 03 tundra was starting strong on the original battery 6 years later. i replaced it tho, it's a no brainer that it was gonna leave me stranded soon.

i got the cheap walmart battery in it and notice now it is leaking from the vents. i guess and optima is in my future.....

Debra - 8-14-2010 at 10:48 AM

Thanks for the opening for the battery question Ken.............

While on the topic, can anyone advise me about the best battery for solar panals? I hear the gel is what most in Baja use, but, can't find them up here.......any advice?

landyacht318 - 8-14-2010 at 10:54 AM

There are 3 types of lead acid batteries.
Flooded
Absorbed Glass Matt(AGM)
Gel

While OPtimas and Odysseys are often referred to as gel batteries, they are not, they are AGM.

Gel batteries have very specific charging requirements and are not suitable for vehicular use unless they have their own special charger or voltage regulator. Over charge a Gel once and it has lost a portion of it's capacity forever.

Optima a couple years back decided to rely on their good name and started cutting corners using recycled lead and other measures to fill the fat cats pockets even further. They have since returned to the higher quality production but I won't reward them.

Optima's also have less amp hours(capacity) than a similarly sized Odyssey due to the 6 pack configuration. Agm's have less resistance, and Higher CCA ratings, but not any more capacity than a flooded battery of the same weight.

Die hard platinum are a rebadged Odyssey. Same case, same manufacturer. Whether the internals are exactly the same is up for debate.

For more info than you ever needed to know about batteries:

http://www.batteryfaq.org/
Good luck.

Mexicorn - 8-14-2010 at 11:10 AM

Great Thread!

Cypress - 8-14-2010 at 11:21 AM

Thanks fishabductor, No matter what the problem there's at least one Nomad that has the solution.:biggrin:

Taco de Baja - 8-14-2010 at 01:52 PM

My red top optima in my Tacoma is over 6 years old and still going strong. It has both top and side posts. I got it at Costco for $100. I have left the interior light on by accident several times over night with essentially no loss in voltage. I also had it sit for over 30 days earlier this year without starting it; again no loss in voltage.

monoloco - 8-14-2010 at 03:04 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Debra
Thanks for the opening for the battery question Ken.............

While on the topic, can anyone advise me about the best battery for solar panals? I hear the gel is what most in Baja use, but, can't find them up here.......any advice?
Probably the best would be Surette flooded lead acid batteries provided there is someone around all the time who understands how to maintain them. I got tired of battery maintenance and messy FLA batteries so I recently changed to Concorde SunExtender AGM batteries. I haven't had them that long so I have no long term data on how they hold up but they sure are cleaner, which incidentally what I liked about the Optima batteries. I was just disappointed in their service life and short warranty. From what I have read, I would not consider gel cell batteries.

monoloco - 8-14-2010 at 05:03 PM

The Concorde Sunextenders that I have are 305ah batteries and they are similar in size or maybe a bit smaller than an L16. Like I said, I don't have any long term experience with them, but they seem to be really well made. The reason I chose them is because the self discharge rate is much lower than an FLA battery (about 5% a month) so when I leave for a couple of months I will be able to remove the solar panels from the roof and not have to worry about the batteries discharging or someone stealing my panels. It's also nice to not ever have to water the batteries or clean the terminals.

monoloco - 8-14-2010 at 05:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
We use surrette 460's and so do most of the other people around us. Before that Trojan L16's were the battery to have. The surrettes at my parents are now 6 yrs old and still going strong. We are running a 24 volt system with 8 460's. The house I manage/live has 40 surrette 460's.

I'd like to here more about the Concordes Sunextenders...Are those the really big batteries?
Wow, 40 Surrettes, that was quite an investment. What are they running, AC? I bet it's a chore to water and clean all of those batteries. How often do you have to add water?

BajaGringo - 8-15-2010 at 12:43 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
This set up batteries was bought new in dec. I have added only 6 gallons to date. I add water every month, but it usually is not much. Only adding a little and spraying all the terminals and keepingthings clean is about 1.5 hrs.

We have 5 seperate ac units, but they only run when the generator runs, the generator also runs the pool equipment, we have a 2 casitas that have 2 fridges and we also have a large chest freezer, we run the generator 4 hrs a day, to cycle the pool and run the ac as well as top off the batteries. The main house is over 9000 ft2 and has 15,000 watts of invertors, and 10kw in generation.



Wow, nice setup. So how many guests stay at your hotel???

monoloco - 8-15-2010 at 01:00 PM

Are you using combiner caps on the Surrettes?

skippermike - 8-16-2010 at 10:04 AM

I see lots of Optima AGMs in off road applications - seem very rugged.
Take a look at newer generation of AGMs, like Northstar. They are more compact, have a very rugged case and have a neat recessed terinal design. I've used one (equivalent to a Grp. 27) for two years as the auxiliary battery in my truck, for lights, radio, inverter, etc. with good results.
You for sure don't want lead acid or gell cell for that application.
For deep cycle applications, with heavy loads like inverters, lead acid/water filled batteries are still the most effective/economical - if you are willing to do a simple maintenance program. I second the comment that it is only an hour or so/month to do. We had Trojan deep cycles as an inverter bank on our boat for 5 years+, with no issues. If you can't/don't want to do that, then AGMs (like Lifelines) are the way to go - just $$$$$.
Good luck.

Sunman - 8-16-2010 at 01:25 PM

FYI, for those interested the Sears Die Hard Platinum is essentially a rebadged Odyssey for less money.

I tried to install one on my Tundra but they do not make the correct size for it yet. Went with a Die Hard International "wet" battery instead.

Bob and Susan - 8-16-2010 at 02:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
This set up batteries was bought new in dec. I have added only 6 gallons to date. I add water every month, but it usually is not much.


if you've used only this much water since december your batteries are probably "dead"

my 36 surretts used 3 gallons last month
and average 2 to 2 1/2 gallons a a month

you need to check them with a $1 hydrometer from NAPA auto parts

remember voltage means very little

Bob and Susan - 8-16-2010 at 02:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Bondy
I have been using two Odyssey PC1200 drycell batteries in my Hummer H1 for six years
++Ken++


why change batteries...6 years for batteries in a truck or car is
A LONG TIME!!! :light:

torch - 8-16-2010 at 05:11 PM

I love interstate batterys recomended by my mechanic in buisness for 30 years

Bob and Susan - 8-16-2010 at 05:11 PM

my surrettets are 4 years old
i think they are over-rated

trojans are working just as well over here
and are cheaper $$$

so...how many "balls" do you get today:o:o

Ken Bondy - 8-16-2010 at 07:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bob and Susan
Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Bondy
I have been using two Odyssey PC1200 drycell batteries in my Hummer H1 for six years
++Ken++


why change batteries...6 years for batteries in a truck or car is
A LONG TIME!!! :light:


That's what I was asking.