BajaNomad - Club Marena Condo Purchase

Club Marena Condo Purchase

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lwpa - 3-3-2011 at 12:47 PM

After many years, over 45, my wife and I have decided to buy a unit in Club Marena. I thought we did our due diligence by interviewing current owners and looking into the track record of the owner, but after reading all the posts in this forum I may be having second thoughts. We have just started the purchase process with only a brief sales agreement and a small deposit. The unit is a resale, 3 previous owners and there is 38 yrs. left on the original 50 yr lease which each previous owner assumed rather than having the bank draw up a new 50 lease. We have been advised that it is cheaper to assume the existing lease.

The listing agent for the property is Baja Area Realty Group and representing us as buyers is the sales manager at Club Marena, Eduardo Ochoa, who seems to be experienced and honest. What advice can you give us at this point? We will be paying all cash, about $580,000. Are we making a hugh mistake?

dtbushpilot - 3-3-2011 at 01:07 PM

Where is Club Marena? Do you have a link to check it out?

racheldarlin - 3-3-2011 at 01:14 PM

Let me get this straight. You are planning on spending $580,000 for property in Baja and you are asking Nomads for their opinion? STOP!!!!!!!!!

Get a Lawyer to look into this for you.

[Edited on 3-3-2011 by racheldarlin]

Dave - 3-3-2011 at 01:23 PM

I wouldn't think being represented by the property sales manager as prudent. My suggestion is to find an attorney and have him represent your interest. The key is getting clean title. I would insist on a new trust and make the sale conditional on that happening, regardless of increased cost. Also, the seller must pay cap gains at closing, if applicable.

Do some market comparisons. I don't know what you're getting for 580k so I couldn't say if it seems high, or low.

Bear in mind, this is free advice and worth every penny. If it were me, I'd be very nervous about investing more than 1/2 a mil in Mexico, or anywhere else right now...

Unless is was as super, super deal.

DENNIS - 3-3-2011 at 01:40 PM

Arn't the owners of Club Marena the same that own Baja Country Club?

We have a Nomad here, Bajaguy, who would trust these people with his life. He should be along sometime soon to give you his input. He's probably at work sleeping right about now.

BajaNomad advice is not the worst you can find. It's free and many here have seen it all.

Be as careful as possible.

DENNIS - 3-3-2011 at 01:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
I would insist on a new trust and make the sale conditional on that happening, regardless of increased cost.

I didn't know that could be done with a condo. It used to be that a blanket trust was aquired at the beginning and the life of all trusts began at the same time.
Perhaps things have changed.

Dave - 3-3-2011 at 01:51 PM

Master trusts as final placement are history. Although, I suppose there are still some who's time has not expired. It has been my experience that most master trusts have been restructured...except those with title deficiencies.

Club Marena Condo Purchase

lwpa - 3-3-2011 at 02:24 PM

I was hoping to get the comments from Ramuma53 who appears to be extremely knowledgeable in Baja real estate laws in general and the Rosarito area in particular.

toneart - 3-3-2011 at 02:40 PM

Dave,

What 'trust" are you talking about? Fideicomiso? He is talking about an assumed "Lease". He would not own the tierra.

IWPA,

With that kind of money you can buy nice property in lots of desirable places. With all the Cartel activity in that area, why plunk your money there? You have a chance to run. Those who already have bought in Baja are stuck and have to make the best of it.

Today Obama met with Calderon. New promises, commitments, blah blah blah. New bloodshed intensity always follows that kind of B.S...the so called, "War On Drugs".

So far, we are not being targeted overtly. That could change. Some who live there, near the border area take positive attitudes and just deal with it. I doubt whether anyone, Americans, Canadians or Mexicanos can say they feel safe. I bet every one of them would love you to throw that money at them so that they could get out!

And I haven't even talked about all the pitfalls and ways that gringos can get separated from their money...some you could never even anticipate. Rarely in a game of chance do you get such a splendid opportunity to see how the cards are stacked against you.

Stop romanticizing with this dream.I know it is difficult to be talked down about a dream that your heart is set on. Listen to your head. You have a chance, NOW, to run. Do It!

Cypress - 3-3-2011 at 02:51 PM

Club Marena? $580K? Must be a fantastic place. I'd recommend expanding your property search beyond Baja.

BajaGeoff - 3-3-2011 at 03:03 PM

Is this the condo on the top of the Las Brisas tower?

I have friends and clients that live at Club Marena and love it. The property is well maintained, it has nice amenities and if you surf, well then it is a little slice of paradise.

If I was retired and looking for a place to spend my golden years on the coast of Baja with relatively close access to the states, Marena would be in my top 5. Great spot!

mtgoat666 - 3-3-2011 at 03:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
I was hoping to get the comments from Ramuma53 who appears to be extremely knowledgeable in Baja real estate laws in general and the Rosarito area in particular.

Read all 90 pages of the infamous turtle thread before you form an opinion about Ramuma53. He may know a lot about RE, he may also be an example of the type of character that makes RE purchases risky.

Russ - 3-3-2011 at 03:19 PM

3 previous owners?? It may be prudent to speak with them.

DENNIS - 3-3-2011 at 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by toneart
What 'trust" are you talking about? Fideicomiso? He is talking about an assumed "Lease". He would not own the tierra.

It's a condo Fideicomiso. I think his term, "lease", is incorrect.

El Comadante Loco - 3-3-2011 at 03:59 PM

I have dual citizenship and I would not do it... For that kind of money you can buy the land a house and have money left over for upkeep and expenses...

fandango - 3-3-2011 at 04:13 PM

WAIT!!!!!!!!!!

why would you pay ALL of the purchase price up front? get a note and make payments, keep the balance of your 500,000 in the US in case you need to run or you get run off. then you haven't lost every dollar.

unless, of course, that is completely disposible money. remember, never invest more than you can walk away from.

Investment in Your Safety

Gypsy Jan - 3-3-2011 at 04:31 PM

Some years back, we watched the first-built, smallest high-rise at Club Marena burn to the ground (this tower has since been rebuilt). The fire department ran out of water in the first few minutes and could only stand around helplessly.

I don't know if the situation has changed, but no Rosarito fire truck was equipped to send a ladder higher than the third floor at that time, according to reports.

Some reports said that a propane tank on the roof exploded and caught fire. Some reports said that an elderly woman tiving on a high floor perished in the blaze.

I would not buy or even rent a home in a high rise in Rosarito.

That being said, there is a huge supply of single family homes in gated communites in the Rosarito area and it is a buyer's market. Just do a little in-person investigation.

Rent and live down here for a bit to see if the location fits your needs.

We have lived here for years and love it.

lwpa - 3-3-2011 at 04:39 PM

Frankly I am surprised at most of the responses. I thought most Nomads loved or at least liked Baja, not Baja bashing. Regarding the reported violence reported by the U.S. press, in my opinion is completely blown out of proporation as it relates to the danger faced by those visiting Mexico. I am ex law enforcement and have researched the violent crime stats for the greater TJ/Rosarito area and they are less than almost every US city of similar population.
Regarding paying all cash instead of financing, Mexican Banks currently charge about 10% interest and you can only get a loan for about ten years. Also to those who don't even know Club Marena, I think it is unfair to knock them.

Cypress - 3-3-2011 at 04:53 PM

lwpa, Go for it!

mtgoat666 - 3-3-2011 at 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
Frankly I am surprised at most of the responses. I thought most Nomads loved or at least liked Baja, not Baja bashing.

love baja and mexico.
but would never invest significant money in property in Mexico.
fun money only, and only what I can afford to lose.
renting seems like a fine idea for mexican real estate.
$580K is a bit more than I would want to put at risk in a country with uncertain title records and little reliable title insurance.

wessongroup - 3-3-2011 at 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
I was hoping to get the comments from Ramuma53 who appears to be extremely knowledgeable in Baja real estate laws in general and the Rosarito area in particular.

Ditto's.....

Gaucho - 3-3-2011 at 05:22 PM

I would get a new fideicomiso for sure and not assume the existing one. If you are plunking down $580k in cash the new "fidi fees" are a drop in the bucket. You don't want to cut corners with that much cash down. I would also get title insurance by a reputable firm like Stewart Title http://www.stewart.com.mx/
As was mentioned above definately talk to previous and current owners. This IS a beautiful spot.

gnukid - 3-3-2011 at 05:23 PM

First and foremost:

Never use the seller as the buyer rep-Huge Red Flag. Run away.

Never allow the seller to dictate the terms of the fidi while reducing the value. Run away.

Second:

I think it's way too expensive for what it is-the real value to me is about $150,000US today compared to values round the country, I reviewed all the units for sale there online, the place is next to the freeway stacked up like sardines on a cliff with little access to the beach, and the beach has surf which while an advantage for some is a disadvantage for swimmers-yes I know there is a beach access- but you could have a much more desirable location, more space, better value, less risk, for lower price.

Looking closely at property development and history, it's unlikely this can go up and very likely to go down based on comparables. Worse with such a large building, you are dependent on a large number of people being able to maintain a second home and a vacation lifestyle which are the first things people default on in a crisis as we see.

You would be well advised to be less vulnerable to neighbor's failures, owner's and manager's failures, and regional problems by choosing a location and development more carefully.

As my father would say, "you could live very nicely on that amount for the rest of your life without any risk at all. Why take such a high risk?"

What could you possibly gain compared to what you most likely lose?

Consider Baja's advantages: Vast open beach front, easy access for walking, fishing, kayaking swimming for family and friends, inexpensive property and homes, great community, peace and quiet. This place has none of those. So what does it offer?

[Edited on 3-4-2011 by gnukid]

Bajahowodd - 3-3-2011 at 05:28 PM

I have to chime in on this, too. The amount that is being spent for a condo in Rosarito staggers my mind, especially in the current economy and housing turmoil NOB. Just have to wonder what you could do with that kind of money in places on the coast of CA, given all the distressed properties and foreclosures. And given that NOB, there would be much less likelihood that the ongoing drug war could adversely affect your purchase.

Maybe, as has been mentioned here many times before, about not investing beyond what you could walk away from, perhaps our friend has money to burn.

Just my opinion, but if I was going to invest a half a mil or more in Mexico, I'd better have alot more than that in the bank for back up. Times change. 20 years ago, I would have said, go for it.

[Edited on 3-4-2011 by Bajahowodd]

Gaucho - 3-3-2011 at 05:31 PM

For that kind of money I would look in Las Gaviotas. Safe, guard gated, nice ammenities, established, lots of character and a really nice beach.

Dave - 3-3-2011 at 05:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gaucho
For that kind of money I would look in Las Gaviotas. Safe, guard gated, nice ammenities, established, lots of character and a really nice beach.

I have several friends who sold in Gaviotas and moved to Club Marena because Gaviotas has much higher percentage of absentee owners who rent to weekenders and summer vacationers. At times the noise level and crowded streets are unbearable. Club Marena controls this to some extent through its CR's.

Woooosh - 3-3-2011 at 08:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
I was hoping to get the comments from Ramuma53 who appears to be extremely knowledgeable in Baja real estate laws in general and the Rosarito area in particular.

Try posting on a thread he is active on and ask him to follow this thread for you. Club Marena is indeed nice. But what if the price you are paying is from top of the market six years ago? Sadly, there is no MLS for Rosarito comp sales. If you find out a neighbor paid half what you did, or if a similar unit comes up at half the price you paid... will it bother you? If not- don't worry about price- just make sure the paperwork is correct. This price thing I described happens all the time in projects down here. You are definitely in the drivers seat down here right now- only 100 sales for Rosarito in 2010 if that tells you anything. Don't let anyone rush you or your money burn a hole in your pocket.

[Edited on 3-4-2011 by Woooosh]

Gaucho - 3-3-2011 at 08:30 PM

I could see that! I've partied there plenty :cool:

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave

Quote:

Originally posted by Gaucho
For that kind of money I would look in Las Gaviotas. Safe, guard gated, nice ammenities, established, lots of character and a really nice beach.

bajatravelergeorge - 3-3-2011 at 08:57 PM

Dam, why didn't I buy one for 290K when I had the chance back in 2003. Club Marena is one of the great success stories of the Gold Coast. Super property and being located at a world class surf break will help keep values up. But for 580K you had better be buying one of the penthouses or one with 250K in upgrades.

I wonder if you take over a fideicomiso, do you have to pay the 2% city tax on the sales price? Or is that only paid on a new fideicomiso.

IWPA

bajaguy - 3-3-2011 at 09:03 PM

Check your u2u....upper right corner of this page, by where you sign in..........

$580K

mcfez - 3-3-2011 at 09:33 PM

Ever occur to anyone here that $580K may be chump change to this guy?

I do agree...dont ask the questions here...get a legal pro to answer.

wessongroup - 3-3-2011 at 09:54 PM

And "Subject to"... comes to mind....

Think you will be getting some great input on this "location" and many other considerations....

Its all good... and a good question to ask right here...

As you can see many have a lot of knowledge and thoughts on this and the more you get from folks who have lived down here ... well, it can't get much better than that...

Don't think anyone is charging ...... yet...

[Edited on 3-4-2011 by wessongroup]

Von - 3-3-2011 at 10:05 PM

Way to much for it~ Rent one out first~ never give out all your cash~ or even 20% down~ good luck~ And i own land on the beach in Rosarito~

JESSE - 3-3-2011 at 10:06 PM

Club Marena is a nice place, no wonder Leonardo Di Caprio and James Cameron resided there during the filming of Titanic. 1/2 a million dollars might sound like too much for some people, but it isnt for a place like Marena. I have stayed there a few times and its a very nice place, wich in my opinion, its worth it if you have the $$$.

Now, i would agree with the advice of some members, get a lawyer who works for you, study your options carefully, and buy your condo.

Its a good property, in a safe area, secluded, no noise, and its worth it if you do your homework.

skipowell - 3-3-2011 at 10:22 PM

Having spent time at Club Marena, I can see why the values are still as high as they are. The units are beautiful, as well as the grounds. You can not even touch anything in the states for under 3 million with the features of Club Marena. Yes it is close to a highway as one person posted, but then what isn't in Rosarito/Ensenada area that is ocean front. The other premium condo's Los Olas (spelling??) are up in the same range if not even higher. You would not be able to get a home with anywhere near the same features in Gaviotas for that price and I agree Dave the weekend party crowd gets old in Gaviotas.
We currently own two homes in Mexico (in SADM) and feel relatively safe with our decision. Like I said in an earlier post, when we are ready to make the move from a house to condo living (no longer have big active dogs) Club Marena would be our first choice in Northern Baja.
For what it is worth there is a woman that is very active on the Rosarito Forum at the Trip Advisor website that lives in Club Morena that might be able to give you some insight.

SDRonni - 3-4-2011 at 05:07 AM

lwpa: Some said we were crazy when we bought at Las Olas Grand, but we have never been happier. You just can't put a price on that incredible view! Though we may never make money when (if) we eventually sell, many, many years down the road, we enjoy our place all the time, always commenting with each sunset how fortunate we feel. Many on this board pooh-pooh the idea of living in a high-rise condo, but, for us, it was a perfect choice. The security, the maintenance of the grounds and only having to show up to enjoy is just the ticket for us older, retired folks. We have friends who have lived at Club Marena for many years and they absolutely love it there. We have been to their place and it is very nice! I say go for it and enjoy! :tumble:

lwpa - 3-4-2011 at 08:33 AM

Thanks to all for the wide varied of opinions. Almost all who know Club Marena agree that it is one of the most premier properties along the gold coast. Values of units remain fairly stable and expensive because of the quality of contruction, maintenance of buildings and grounds, amenities such as two clubhouses, two swimming pools, two jacuzzi's and probably the most important factor an ocean view to die for. The unit we are buying is the penthouse which is two stories with 3600 sq feet and was totally remolded 2 yrs. ago.. If it were located anywhere in the US on the ocean the price would range from around 3.6 to 5 million. The cheapest unit in Club Marena would sell for $300,000. I guess I am a little crazy but at my stage in life I think I am making the right choice for me.

Good job

Dave - 3-4-2011 at 10:03 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
The unit we are buying is the penthouse which is two stories with 3600 sq feet and was totally remolded 2 yrs. ago

Forget everything everyone has said. That super, super deal I was talking about?

You just got it.

BornFisher - 3-4-2011 at 10:08 AM

Can I come over for the housewarming party? I`ll bring fresh caught fish and beer!!!!
Really, I think that place is great, I`m below it (K-38) in the low rent trailer park district!

DENNIS - 3-4-2011 at 10:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
The unit we are buying is the penthouse which is two stories with 3600 sq feet and was totally remolded 2 yrs. ago..

Jeeezo...that's about the size of Calimax.

toneart - 3-4-2011 at 10:35 AM

IWPA,

You had asked for advice and I gave you my honest opinion based on what I would do.

What some have brought up here is perhaps, more important to you and I understand that; one buys a house for a long-term occupancy, to enjoy. One should NOT consider a house as an investment, especially during these times. You have expressed that yours is a quality of life choice with the intention to live there for many years.

So, pending diligent research, go for it! I would suggest, however, that your mind was already made up before you posted on The BajaNomad. You were just looking for encouragement that would support your decision. Given the reputation and desirability of the Club Marena Condo Development, you have indeed found the support you were seeking.

To those who suggest that IWPA has "money to burn", I doubt whether he considers that he might have. I think that his decision is based on visualizing a life in the Club Marina.

In my experience, the more money one has, the more they feel threatened that they may lose it. I have never known any wealthy people who feel they have "money to burn" except for the "Nouveau Riche. For them it is all about the flash and the bling.

rhintransit - 3-4-2011 at 10:49 AM

I think Club Marina looks glorious in the real estate ads I googled. go for it!

now if anyone wants to help a poor deserving Bajanomad reach such a lifestyle, only 25k a day would make a big difference in the life of little Robertita (insert photo of big eyed child here). checks and money orders welcome or we can set up an autodeposit account for your convenience....

vandenberg - 3-4-2011 at 10:53 AM

Roberta.
25K , $25.000 a day?? Aren't you a little extravagant. :biggrin:

DENNIS - 3-4-2011 at 11:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by toneart

You had asked for advice and I gave you my honest opinion based on what I would do.

You don't have to explain yourself, Tony. lwpa's request for knowledgeable input on half million dollar condos here was not much different from asking the Mixtec field hands in Maneadero what they think of your new Ferrari.

tripledigitken - 3-4-2011 at 11:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by toneart

You had asked for advice and I gave you my honest opinion based on what I would do.

Would love to see a picture of your new Ferrari.

DENNIS - 3-4-2011 at 11:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
Would love to see a picture of your new Ferrari.

Tony has the new Ferrari. Not me. He's having a winch installed next week so he can go off-road.

toneart - 3-4-2011 at 11:20 AM

Keep your fingers off it...and get off my lawn! :lol:

Uh, the word is wench, not "winch".

[Edited on 3-4-2011 by toneart]

wilderone - 3-4-2011 at 11:21 AM

"... all cash, about $580,000. Are we making a huge mistake?"
Will this be your primary residence? Will your heirs have to sell it? Did you see many, many other properties in comparison? If you're going to spend a majority of the year in Baja CA, I would definitely see what else $500,000 will buy. And definitely get your own buyer agent. Can you rent a month or two before you make up your mind? Test the waters? The concept that a comparable property would be worth $3 million in the US is just too simplistic - don't let that sway you.

toneart - 3-4-2011 at 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by wilderone
"... all cash, about $580,000. Are we making a huge mistake?"
Will this be your primary residence? Will your heirs have to sell it? Did you see many, many other properties in comparison? If you're going to spend a majority of the year in Baja CA, I would definitely see what else $500,000 will buy. And definitely get your own buyer agent. Can you rent a month or two before you make up your mind? Test the waters? The concept that a comparable property would be worth $3 million in the US is just too simplistic - don't let that sway you.

Uh, you're too late for the moving day party, Wilderone.

Cypress - 3-4-2011 at 11:46 AM

IWPA, Always remember to look both ways before you cross the street. :yes:

lookingandbuying - 3-4-2011 at 11:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by toneart

Quote:

Uh, you're too late for the moving day party, Wilderone.

tripledigitken - 3-4-2011 at 11:54 AM

Asking for advice on this purchase is complicated.

Some won't even stop in RB.

Most don't have the money for a $580,000 house in the US, let alone to spend in Mexico.

It looks like a beautiful area and if you can afford it, I mean really afford it, and you will be happy to live in RB, go for it.

Ken

mtgoat666 - 3-4-2011 at 11:54 AM

Quote:

now that he has explained his purchase of large penthouse and that he is retired, sounds a little better.

best advice for sunset years is spend, baby, spend, because you can't take it with you!

of course, that is good advice for all years!

Von - 3-4-2011 at 11:56 AM

You guys and gals remember when one of the buildings burned up at club Morena? They just patched it all up again? Just redicoulos? Or am i just nutts? That tells alot about that place im sure theres a few of you that know what im talkin about? Why dont you ask the management group at club morena about that situation? Theres is no value in a burnt building thats been put back together. Maybe thats not the one your buying but that tells a lot about a place im just sayin~:-)

mtgoat666 - 3-4-2011 at 11:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
If it were located anywhere in the US on the ocean the price would range from around 3.6 to 5 million.

maybe so in so cal, but even in so cal you can get condo on beach for under $3.6M. and if you go to more remote locations, $3.6M will buy some pretty nice waterfront RE.

anywho, sounds like you found a place you like, and I say go for it (just don't use the condo mgt staff as your buyers agent, that sounds like ripe opportunity for COI)

Von - 3-4-2011 at 12:04 PM

Also i just remember that the hospital next to Club Morena is always dumping hospital bio~hazard in the water, one time i was surfng there at k~38 and all this crap was coming out from that place it was disgusting it looked like an oil spill just so sad that small bay was awesome back in the day ~

lookingandbuying - 3-4-2011 at 12:16 PM

A couple of comments/questions:

1) The $580k for this place is the listing price. Are you paying asking price?
If so, this is going to be one happy seller. I hope you end up being a
happy buyer too.

2) What is the amount of HOA fees?

Sure sounds like a lot of money for a condo is "today's" real estate market, more so in Mexico. I have been seeing some people doing a lease/option. This allows them to get a full feel for the place they are buying just to ensure they really want the place and also to fully learn everything about the individual unit and issues with the association etc.

You should keep in mind: YOU ARE IN THE DRIVERS SEAT!! Make sure you get everything you want. It is just so easy to fall in love with Baja. I have seen too many people buy a place for a big chunk of change and then it just sits empty for many various reasons. Was just down in the immediate area for the past month and the place we stayed had a good view of these towers. Could hardly see the place at night and remember saying to my wife "look at that...you can not even see those big towers like you can in the daytime...no lights on in any of the units."

I wonder how many total units are in this place, how many fulltime people reside there whether they are owners or renters. Also, how many people that own there are in default on the HOA dues.

It does really sound like you posted to get an endorsement rather than input. Not may people running around Baja plunking down a half a Mil or more for places at the moment. You are a rare commodity is this market, more so for Baja.

If I were spending the money I would grind on the price, grind some more and then grind a little more. You may find you can keep some of your money in YOUR pocket. And, I would not give a hoot that the place "was" worth $1.5M at one point in the time, the owner orginally listed the place at $1.2M and has reduced it blah, blah blah.

Have heard nothing but good things from other people that either own or have lived in this development.

Good-luck!!

Cypress - 3-4-2011 at 12:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by lookingandbuying
A couple of comments/questions:

1) The $580k for this place is the listing price. Are you paying asking price?
If so, this is going to be one happy seller. I hope you end up being a
happy buyer too.

2) What is the amount of HOA fees?

Sure sounds like a lot of money for a condo is "today's" real estate market, more so in Mexico. I have been seeing some people doing a lease/option. This allows them to get a full feel for the place they are buying just to ensure they really want the place and also to fully learn everything about the individual unit and issues with the association etc.

You should keep in mind: YOU ARE IN THE DRIVERS SEAT!! Make sure you get everything you want. It is just so easy to fall in love with Baja. I have seen too many people buy a place for a big chunk of change and then it just sits empty for many various reasons. Was just down in the immediate area for the past month and the place we stayed had a good view of these towers. Could hardly see the place at night and remember saying to my wife "look at that...you can not even see those big towers like you can in the daytime...no lights on in any of the units."

I wonder how many total units are in this place, how many fulltime people reside there whether they are owners or renters. Also, how many people that own there are in default on the HOA dues.

It does really sound like you posted to get an endorsement rather than input. Not may people running around Baja plunking down a half a Mil or more for places at the moment. You are a rare commodity is this market, more so for Baja.

If I were spending the money I would grind on the price, grind some more and then grind a little more. You may find you can keep some of your money in YOUR pocket. And, I would not give a hoot that the place "was" worth $1.5M at one point in the time, the owner orginally listed the place at $1.2M and has reduced it blah, blah blah.

Have heard nothing but good things from other people that either own or have lived in this development.

Good-luck!!

rhintransit - 3-4-2011 at 01:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vandenberg
Roberta.
25K , $25.000 a day?? Aren't you a little extravagant. :biggrin:

hey, I'll settle for 25 cents a day, but this is Baja...think big!

LaloinBaja - 3-4-2011 at 03:26 PM

:also..the is talk about building a marina in the area..don't know if its' true or not...look into it...could be goo or not....but the break will change

Woooosh - 3-4-2011 at 03:47 PM

I have seen many photos of the "Cameron" Penthouse there. Very beautiful layout, and now it has been remodeled? We had friends look it over pretty hard in 2004ish but passed on it. I think it was in the $299K asking price range then. "Never be afraid to buy the best- you'll always be happy with it". Even still- try to knock $50K off the price if only so you can have a boat in the new marina.

The Fire Disaster at Club Marena

Gypsy Jan - 3-4-2011 at 09:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy Jan
Some years back, we watched the first-built, smallest high-rise at Club Marena burn to the ground (this tower has since been rebuilt). The fire department ran out of water in the first few minutes and could only stand around helplessly.

I don't know if the situation has changed, but no Rosarito fire truck was equipped to send a ladder higher than the third floor at that time, according to reports.

Some reports said that a propane tank on the roof exploded and caught fire. Some reports said that an elderly woman tiving on a high floor perished in the blaze.

I would not buy or even rent a home in a high rise in Rosarito.

That being said, there is a huge supply of single family homes in gated communites in the Rosarito area and it is a buyer's market. Just do a little in-person investigation.

Rent and live down here for a bit to see if the location fits your needs.

We have lived here for years and love it.

mcfez - 3-5-2011 at 06:32 AM

Is this the place?

http://www.baja123.com/REAL_ESTATE_IN_CLUB_MARENA/page_19485...

Hell of a lot of units for sale there......

I'd be concerned with rental units. There's a huge number of rentals in that complex too. You have a unit next to a rental? PARTY PARTY PARTY TIME! Also..one little hot tub /gym for ALL the tenants/renters?

A: Your monthly Homeowners Association Fee starts at $195.00 for the smaller homes

Marked down from "One millon to 695" so a ad says here. Sounds suspicious that a unit ever would be priced at exactly $1,000,000 ......maybe $995,000.
http://www.rosaritobeachproperties.net/2009/09/29/spectacula...

Being a owner / lessee of investments on the Sea of Cortez side...I certainly regardless of amount of money I may have.....would look for a year at other properties. This complex has week to week rentals......and other small red flags that I read.

Google search this complex and you'll see a hell of a lot of rental ads :-(

[Edited on 3-5-2011 by mcfez]

JESSE - 3-5-2011 at 08:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
The unit we are buying is the penthouse which is two stories with 3600 sq feet and was totally remolded 2 yrs. ago

Forget everything everyone has said. That super, super deal I was talking about?

You just got it.

I second that, a great deal.

absinvestor - 3-6-2011 at 03:19 PM

My 2 cents worth is as follows: I think your mind was made up when you asked for comment. That is ok but I would be very cautious. We retired full-time in Baja for 2 years in the mid 90's. We love Baja but Mexico is not the US. Prior to retiring in Mexico I owned a real estate company and my personal sales were in the top 1% in the greater Denver,Boulder area. Even with my vast knowledge of real estate in the US I depended on an Ensenada attorney to review my planned purchase. That attorney talked me out of purchasing and we leased a house on the beach. Many US citizens think they have similar rights in Mexico but the court system is totally different. Many of my neighbors thought they had sound leases only to get evicted. We also found that winters are chilly if not cold on the Pacific side beaches in Baja Norte. Problems are difficult to solve- for example we had long distance charges on our home phone that we didn't make- when we contacted the phone company we weren't given the choice to press 1 for English. (I speak Spanish but trying to get a billing error corrected is much different than ordering dinner and drinks!!) Had we not paid the bill our service would have been immediately cut-off. You'll see other threads that verify that one day late on an electric bill means your service is cut-off. Restrooms, by US standards, can be filthy. Buying American brand food ie cereals etc and cleaning products is expensive. You have to be careful with the drinking water and how you wash and rinse the dishes. Medical service is not comparable to what we are accustomed to in the US. Also, we thought our children would often come to visit us on the beach but the truth is they get two or three weeks of vacation a year and the visits didn't materialize. We love Mexico and plan to return (this time to Baja Sur.) We will purchase a home. However, we are purchasing a very inexpensive home that we can afford to lose and will keep our home in Colorado so we will have closer ties to the grandkids. The condo that you are considering buying will be available a year from now (or one like it.) I don't know whether it is a great deal or not but I do know that if you are not happy the price you paid will not matter. (Three of our past neighbors decided that they didn't like the chilly winters etc and moved back to California and Oregon. Their homes in Baja are vacant and even though they have reduced the asking price several times the homes remain unsold.) Sounds like some of the condos in your complex can be rented. Why not rent one for a year to make sure that full-time Baja Norte retirement is what you want? Good luck.

Really well said absinvestor

mcfez - 3-6-2011 at 03:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
My 2 cents worth is as follows: I think your mind was made up when you asked for comment. That is ok but I would be very cautious. We retired full-time in Baja for 2 years in the mid 90's. We love Baja but Mexico is not the US. Prior to retiring in Mexico I owned a real estate company and my personal sales were in the top 1% in the greater Denver,Boulder area. Even with my vast knowledge of real estate in the US I depended on an Ensenada attorney to review my planned purchase. That attorney talked me out of purchasing and we leased a house on the beach. Many US citizens think they have similar rights in Mexico but the court system is totally different. Many of my neighbors thought they had sound leases only to get evicted. We also found that winters are chilly if not cold on the Pacific side beaches in Baja Norte. Problems are difficult to solve- for example we had long distance charges on our home phone that we didn't make- when we contacted the phone company we weren't given the choice to press 1 for English. (I speak Spanish but trying to get a billing error corrected is much different than ordering dinner and drinks!!) Had we not paid the bill our service would have been immediately cut-off. You'll see other threads that verify that one day late on an electric bill means your service is cut-off. Restrooms, by US standards, can be filthy. Buying American brand food ie cereals etc and cleaning products is expensive. You have to be careful with the drinking water and how you wash and rinse the dishes. Medical service is not comparable to what we are accustomed to in the US. Also, we thought our children would often come to visit us on the beach but the truth is they get two or three weeks of vacation a year and the visits didn't materialize. We love Mexico and plan to return (this time to Baja Sur.) We will purchase a home. However, we are purchasing a very inexpensive home that we can afford to lose and will keep our home in Colorado so we will have closer ties to the grandkids. The condo that you are considering buying will be available a year from now (or one like it.) I don't know whether it is a great deal or not but I do know that if you are not happy the price you paid will not matter. (Three of our past neighbors decided that they didn't like the chilly winters etc and moved back to California and Oregon. Their homes in Baja are vacant and even though they have reduced the asking price several times the homes remain unsold.) Sounds like some of the condos in your complex can be rented. Why not rent one for a year to make sure that full-time Baja Norte retirement is what you want? Good luck.

Yeah.....how real!
........"Also, we thought our children would often come to visit us on the beach but the truth is they get two or three weeks of vacation a year and the visits didn't materialize".

Fact is...we were planning g on moving to Baja full time too......but found that there are issues with doing that. We decided to keep the SF house very small, and to build a farm up here in Natomas (sacramento)...I (wify too maybe) will go to Baja for 3o days and the farm 30 days...so on. I can still have Baja and still have family!

[Edited on 3-6-2011 by mcfez]

Santiago - 3-6-2011 at 04:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
Also, we thought our children would often come to visit us on the beach but the truth is they get two or three weeks of vacation a year and the visits didn't materialize.

20 years ago I heard this complaint from my own parents, echoed by other retirees in their camp. Out of 5 kids, I was the only one to visit, and this was in the 1980s without my family. Can't imagine what it would be like today...

Woooosh - 3-6-2011 at 04:45 PM

From the Mayor of Rosarito: (This is the Mayor admitting to what the NOB media would not print about Rosarito, including the police crime. I give credit to this new mayor Robles for admitting what previous Mayor Torres never could as owner of the Rosarito Beach Hotel.)

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=51476

"Mayor Javier Robles says his top priority is to bring back tourists since tourism makes up about 70 percent of his community’s economy. Hotel occupancy rates have dropped to just 50 percent. Even though Americans make up about 20 percent of the city’s population, officials say many who once enjoyed the beach community have yet to return after hearing the reports of crimes that have taken place the past several years around the city, including the scenic 1 highway between Tijuana and Rosarito. The mayor says the city’s reputation has been so bad that many retired American residents haven’t even been able to convince their grandkids to visit again.

Since many crimes involved police officers, city officials knew one of the first things they had to do before tourists would return was combat corruption within its own ranks. The mayor is pleased to report that half of Rosarito’s police force has been replaced over the last three years. Robles thanks the San Diego Police Department for helping to train its officers."

[Edited on 3-6-2011 by Woooosh]

Cypress - 3-6-2011 at 04:49 PM

$580K for a condo? :biggrin:

Something is wrong with that picture. It's out of focus. Sorta blurry. Fuzzy.

toneart - 3-6-2011 at 06:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress
$580K for a condo? :biggrin:

Something is wrong with that picture. It's out of focus. Sorta blurry. Fuzzy.

Even on a clear day, sometimes, to see to the end of one's nose is blurry and fuzzy. Photoshop doesn't help, either! :no:

Bragging on a job half done

Dave - 3-6-2011 at 07:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
The mayor is pleased to report that half of Rosarito’s police force has been replaced over the last three years.

Are we to assume the other half are spotlessly clean.

Any bets?

Not that it would matter at Club Marena. It's very easy for a resident of this or any nearby gringo enclave to have virtually zero contact with Rosarito or the local populace. Like living in a separate world, really.

Dave is Correct

Gypsy Jan - 3-6-2011 at 07:20 PM

All of his comments are true.

norte - 3-6-2011 at 07:39 PM

lwpa

Hope you now realize that this was no place to ask for this kind of advice. Most of these folks aren't even close to being in your league. Go with the lawyer advice and forget the small timers and nay Sayers

Woooosh - 3-6-2011 at 08:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
The mayor is pleased to report that half of Rosarito’s police force has been replaced over the last three years.

The police force problem is temporary. Last I heard they will be replace by the new Baja State police force that is being formed. That still leaves the Tourist Police and whatever their role turns into while Rosarito goes looking for tourists. I see glimmers of hope with them and know a few good men in that department.

Sometimes I feel the big complexes and gated communities in Rosarito give residents a false sense of security. You're only as safe as the 1200 peso a week guy at the gate. There was an elderly Mexican guy held hostage by narcos at the Ocean Towers for months last year- the narcos felt safe. When you choose to live in these places- you create a disconnect from the community. I built a very secure house in a nice downtown fracciamiento so I would have both security and community. I think when you've decide to buy the penthouse, everyone in town is already beneath you. LOL

:saint:

[Edited on 3-7-2011 by Woooosh]

Woooosh - 3-6-2011 at 08:08 PM

" Even though Americans make up about 20 percent of the city’s population, officials say many who once enjoyed the beach community have yet to return after hearing the reports of crimes that have taken place the past several years around the city, including the scenic 1 highway between Tijuana and Rosarito. "

By "population" he must mean the 20% of ex-pats who actually live in Rosarito. I wonder how many have moved back north and what reasons they gave. What's the ex-pat refugee rate? About the same rate as affluent TJ families fleeing north to San Diego? What is Rosarito doing to bring them back?

[Edited on 3-7-2011 by Woooosh]

lwpa - 3-7-2011 at 08:24 AM

I agree that I probably made a mistake in asking for advice in this forum. Most seem to be focused on the price which they consider high not even knowing the development or what similar comps have sold for in the past year.

This condo is a second home for us to be used probably at most 6 months a yr. We never said we were staying all year long. I am not uninformed about Club Marena in particular or Northern Baja in general. We have been renting at Club Marena for over 10 years, and have rented at 4 other locations for another 10 years. I have been visiting Baja for over 40 yrs..

As stated by some, when I posted my mind was probably already made up as I said we had already signed a purchase agreement. Why did I ask for advice then? I was hoping someone knowledgable would provide some tips about the closing process. Instead most commented on what they consider an extremely large amount of cash for something that wasn't worth the price without any knowledge of my personal financial condition or the particular condo.

rhintransit - 3-7-2011 at 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa Why did I ask for advice then? I was hoping someone knowledgable would provide some tips about the closing process. Instead most commented on what they consider an extremely large amount of cash for something that wasn't worth the price without any knowledge of my personal financial condition or the particular condo.

folks can only work with the question(s) asked, not unspoken hopes...
enjoy your second home, it looks great.

mcfez - 3-7-2011 at 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
I agree that I probably made a mistake in asking for advice in this forum. Most seem to be focused on the price which they consider high not even knowing the development or what similar comps have sold for in the past year.

This condo is a second home for us to be used probably at most 6 months a yr. We never said we were staying all year long. I am not uninformed about Club Marena in particular or Northern Baja in general. We have been renting at Club Marena for over 10 years, and have rented at 4 other locations for another 10 years. I have been visiting Baja for over 40 yrs..

As stated by some, when I posted my mind was probably already made up as I said we had already signed a purchase agreement. Why did I ask for advice then? I was hoping someone knowledgable would provide some tips about the closing process. Instead most commented on what they consider an extremely large amount of cash for something that wasn't worth the price without any knowledge of my personal financial condition or the particular condo.

Perhaps you should had made this all clear in your original post, and save the helpful ones (us) the time. Thanks for your ungrateful response in this post above. I sure wont ever respond to any of your future postings...you freakin Dolt

[Edited on 3-7-2011 by mcfez]

ten.jpg - 23kB

Cypress - 3-7-2011 at 08:42 AM

lwpa, Each to his own.

DENNIS - 3-7-2011 at 08:53 AM

I get the feeling we've been "toyed" with.
"Ask the hired help what they think, then mock them for their inability to really understand."

Enjoy your vacation cottage, lwpa.

Woooosh - 3-7-2011 at 09:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
I get the feeling we've been "toyed" with.
"Ask the hired help what they think, then mock them for their inability to really understand."

Enjoy your vacation cottage, lwpa.

Not many former law enforcement people with a half-mil to blow... unless he came from Bell. :lol:

Cypress - 3-7-2011 at 09:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh

Quote:

Not many former law enforcement people with a half-mil to blow... unless he came from Bell. :lol:

DENNIS - 3-7-2011 at 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
Not many former law enforcement people with a half-mil to blow... unless he came from Bell. :lol:

WOW....really??? I missed that part. It's beyond my comprehension why anyone from the LE community would choose Rosarito as a home. I would think they would find someplace less agitated and threatening. You know....a leave it all behind you when you retire sort of thing. Oh well.....is there such a thing as kidnap insurance?

Nonsense aside, I wish him well.

jenny.navarrette - 3-7-2011 at 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lwpa
I am not uninformed about Club Marena in particular or Northern Baja in general. We have been renting at Club Marena for over 10 years, and have rented at 4 other locations for another 10 years. I have been visiting Baja for over 40 yrs.

You said, "there is 38 yrs. left on the original 50 yr lease." If you are unaware of the difference between a lease and a fideicomiso, the fact that you do not even understand the nature of the title on the property for which you intend to lay down $600,000 indicates that your Mexican experience is probably very overstated. Furthermore, in you other posts you asked such basic questions as, "Do we need the FM3 Visa as we will only be staying a maximun of 4 months a year?" and "Are the prices at the Costco in TJ about the same as the USA? What is the % sales tax?" and "Do the Pemex Stations accept Visa Credit Cards?"

No one with 40 years in Baja could ask such basic questions. If this condo purchase is for real, you are going to get screwed. Sometimes the best way to double your money is to fold it in half and put it back in your pocket.
:rolleyes:

Woooosh - 3-7-2011 at 10:02 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
Not many former law enforcement people with a half-mil to blow... unless he came from Bell. :lol:

"I am ex law enforcement and have researched the violent crime stats for the greater TJ/Rosarito area and they are less than almost every US city of similar population."

Isn't there a Rosarito club for these guys he will fit right in with?

:saint:

BajaGringo - 3-7-2011 at 10:09 AM

Somehow I missed following this thread but now going back and reading it from page one I have to agree with newbie jenny on this one. In fact it almost reads like a Rosarito RE blog trying to make the market look more "active".

But, I've been wrong before...

:rolleyes:

DENNIS - 3-7-2011 at 10:38 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
Isn't there a Rosarito club for these guys he will fit right in with?

:saint:

Called "The Footprinters." They begin their cross-cultural LE activities with cleaning the toilets at the PD.
I don't think it's only in Rosarito.

mcfez - 3-7-2011 at 10:45 AM

Quote:

Sorta the point I was making in a earlier response here....but not directly. I guess I'll go back to my direct cold responses here on out...with clowns such as this person.

absinvestor - 3-7-2011 at 10:54 AM

I gave my two cents earlier but I totally agree with Jenny and McFez. If he had truely rented in the complex he would have known the answers to the questions. My experience with BajaNomad has been excellent and I appreciate all the great advice I have received. Ron

norte - 3-7-2011 at 11:56 AM

and you are surprised?

Quote:

DENNIS - 3-7-2011 at 12:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by norte
and you are surprised?

I was completely duped. :lol:

mtgoat666 - 3-7-2011 at 01:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by absinvestor
I gave my two cents earlier but I totally agree with Jenny and McFez. If he had truely rented in the complex he would have known the answers to the questions. My experience with BajaNomad has been excellent and I appreciate all the great advice I have received. Ron

it wouldn't be nomadlandia if there weren't skeptics, conspiracy theories, and drunk posting (I think I see all 3 in this thread)

Woooosh - 3-7-2011 at 03:44 PM

Yup, and once their thread unravels and comes apart- heaven help them here. Now he has to create a new on-line persona and start over, which is also a Nomad tradition. huh.

DENNIS - 3-7-2011 at 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
Yup, and once their thread unravels and comes apart- heaven help them here. Now he has to create a new on-line persona and start over, which is also a Nomad tradition. huh.

The Nomadlandia Witness Protection Program. Many here have enjoyed it's benefits of resurrection.

Bajahowodd - 3-7-2011 at 05:24 PM

This thread has made my mind up. I'm gonna take my 1/2 mil and spend it elsewhere!

1/2 Mil $$

lookingandbuying - 3-7-2011 at 05:42 PM

I keep saying the days of 1/2 Million Dollar places are history in Baja Norte and then this guy comes along and says he is going to plunk down $580k for a condo. Makes no sense to me considering what's happening with R.E. If this guy has been going down for the past 45 years and can not see what has been happening to prices in the last 3 or 4 years then maybe him and his money deserve to be separated from each other, for life.

The guy's that bought places for a million or more a few years back thought it was such a great bargain. Then, they never use the place and are in severe denial about what the place is worth...paying for up keep and HOA fees all along.

My feeling is to rent, rent, rent...rent a little longer...keep renting and if a deal of a lifetime falls on your lap maybe just maybe consider buying the place. Even if that deal of a lifetime does come your way, it's still probably better to rent.

Just my thoughts...Glad I don't have a place to sell down there but if I did I sure would be one happy person if this guy came stumbling along.

JESSE - 3-7-2011 at 06:18 PM

Quote:

1/2 a million for a penthouse in Marena is a great deal, and it seems that those that really know the area and the development agree with this. I don't see any real and valid arguments not to buy, the negatives all come down to some people thinking its too much money to spend in Baja. But, whats too much money?? Mexicans think most americans pay way too much for real estate down here and consider them "locos" for paying so much. Americans on a fixed income seem to think middle class americans pay too much for property, and middle class americans think rich americans spend outrageous amounts of money for properties. So whos right and wrong?

If you can afford the condo, its a good deal, buy it. I grew up in the area most of my life, and know all the developments in the region, and Marena is worth it.

gnukid - 3-7-2011 at 06:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by norte
and you are surprised?

I was completely duped. :lol:

Impresionante

skipowell - 3-7-2011 at 08:03 PM

Good Luck with all your closing issues. It does take a lot of patience as nothing seems to happen quickly down there.
I am sure you will enjoy your home there!
Eduardo Rosales is an real estate attorney in Rosarito that we used for our transactions and felt he really took good care of us. One of our properties was a bit complicated as it was part of an estate and was also behind on payments. It might be worth having someone like him review your stuff.

"There is Waterfront"

Gypsy Jan - 3-7-2011 at 08:29 PM

"And There is Everything Else."

Or, so I have been told.

Comment?

GJ

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