BajaNomad - Interesting story of American couple in San Blas

Interesting story of American couple in San Blas

Santiago - 1-15-2012 at 07:31 AM

Jorge of Ms Tioga met this couple from Oregon who moved to San Blas a few years ago with a total of $2000. Read their story here.

woody with a view - 1-15-2012 at 07:52 AM

pretty cool story. i've known since high school that the farther i got south of the border the nicer the people got, also.

DENNIS - 1-15-2012 at 08:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Santiago
Jorge of Ms Tioga met this couple from Oregon who moved to San Blas a few years ago with a total of $2000. Read their story here.

"Vic Pittman is a freelance writer from Scotts Mills, Oregon who resides in Mexico today. He is the holder of no literary awards, journalistic awards or college degrees. He has at one time or another been a honor student, inmate, biker, Christian, pothead, father, radical, pacifist, anarchist, artist, heavy metal guitarist, model citizen, lawbreaker, business owner, illegal marijuana grower, and volunteer for various causes. He is proud to be a "common man"
-------------------------

With creds like this, I'm proud to know he's representing the USA in Mexico. When he gets time, he'll have to add "illegal alien" to his resume.
He and his bride are a good advertisement for Pacifico anyway. It's every man's panacea.

EnsenadaDr - 1-15-2012 at 02:46 PM

one of his attributes list "illegal marijuana grower"...hmmmm...$2000 doesn't go too far in Mexico these days...

grizzlyfsh95 - 1-15-2012 at 02:52 PM

Quote:

Loretana - 1-15-2012 at 03:13 PM

Why would you want to move from Oregon where you have resources and citizenship and MOOCH off your neighbors there in San Blas? (Not to mention work illegally and probably not be up to date on immigration status...)

Geeze!

DENNIS - 1-15-2012 at 03:18 PM

I don't know how much he makes from tattooing the natives, but I hope it's enough for insect repellent. San Blas is one big hive of bugs.

sancho - 1-15-2012 at 04:44 PM

Not in reference to this guy, but I can remember a few I've met
in Mex, seemed to be living there, younger no means of support,
seems a few were trust fund babies, or family gives him $ just to
get lost, weed growers, some running from the law, etc. In hindsight,
looks like I should raise the bar on my acquaintances

BajaBlanca - 1-15-2012 at 04:51 PM

what is most incredible is that they did get their immigration status straightened out according to what they say ... how can you manage that when you have no original valid visa to be in the country ? weird ...

my recommendation is to exchznge english classes for spanish classes - tht they could have done from day 1 on.

DENNIS - 1-15-2012 at 05:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaBlanca
what is most incredible is that they did get their immigration status straightened out according to what they say ... how can you manage that when you have no original valid visa to be in the country ? weird ...

Well.....we won't ask. :rolleyes:

Loretana - 1-15-2012 at 07:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
I don't know how much he makes from tattooing the natives, but I hope it's enough for insect repellent. San Blas is one big hive of bugs.

Just what I was thinking. The bugs there are mindboggling.

BornFisher - 1-15-2012 at 09:33 PM

Frankly this guy sounds like a likely candidate for some terrorist group of the "Blame the USA" crowd. Really I think he is a very bitter man who hates those who plan for their future and take advantage of our freedom here in the States. Maybe he should get his neighbors together to "Occupy San Blas"!!!

Bajatripper - 1-15-2012 at 09:33 PM

Quote:

That's an easy one; you go down to immigration and get the proper visitor's visa first, paying a fine for not having one in the first place, and then proceed with the FM-3 (or work visa, if that is what he has) from there.

But it probably would be a challenge to get a work visa painting signs since those visas are supposedly issued for doing things that one can't find qualified Mexicans to do. Cutting the locals' bids on sign painting by half wouldn't seem to meet that requirement.

I am surprised by the amount of animosity expressed against the couple here. I didn't catch the part in the article where they spit on the US. What I read was that they had a renewed appreciation for the advantages we have for being US residents. Puzzling.

[Edited on 1-18-2012 by Bajatripper]

DENNIS - 1-15-2012 at 10:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
That's an easy one; you go down to immigration and get the proper visitor's visa first, paying a fine for not having one in the first place, and then proceed with the FM-3 (or work visa, if that is what he has) from there.

Not so easy without showing proof of income. Maybe marijuana futures will cover that, but I'd guess not.

Santiago - 1-16-2012 at 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
I am surprised by the amount of animosity expressed against the couple here. I didn't catch the part in the article where the they spit on the US. What I read was that they had a renewed appreciation for the advantages we have for being US residents. Puzzling.
[Edited on 1-16-2012 by Bajatripper]

BT: that was my reaction also. The writer's political-world view and the way he made his living in Oregon was at most a side bar to the more interesting, at least to me, point of how the two cultures worked.

Cardon Man - 1-16-2012 at 08:11 AM

Yeah...what's up with all the animosity towards these folks? The reactions remind me of a great quote about "being free"by Jack Nicholson's character in the movie Easy Rider...

"Oh, yeah, that's right. That's what's it's all about, all right. But talkin' about it and bein' it, that's two different things. I mean, it's real hard to be free when you are bought and sold in the marketplace. Of course, don't ever tell anybody that they're not free, 'cause then they're gonna get real busy killin' and maimin' to prove to you that they are. Oh, yeah, they're gonna talk to you, and talk to you, and talk to you about individual freedom. But they see a free individual, it's gonna scare 'em"

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cardon Man
Yeah...what's up with all the animosity towards these folks?

What?? Well...they have earned a little of it with their attitude of being above the law due to their efforts to be free spirited throughout their lives. Being free doesn't mean leaving one's fate in the hands of others, which is what brought this couple to godforsaken San Blas to begin with. They are reaping what they have sown.
That, I can deal with on an understanding level. What I can't and won't try to deal with is their total disregard for the laws of whatever country they find themselves in at the moment.
Working illegally in Mexico? And, it's admirable because they need an income to buy beer? C'mon. This is the attitude of many about our southern border that has led to the near disintigration of our economy and society. How could anyone but an "open borders" advocate think this is romantic or selectively tolerable?
Or...perhaps some of you actually believe they got themselves normallized with immigration when the price of a Caguama of beer was problematic enough to write about as a budget problem.
What really gets to me is the attitude that laws are in place only for others, and when times get tough, personal well-being trumps the law. That just ain't the way it is and if someone thinks differently, they should keep their decisions to themselves and quit making them the subject of a fledgeling creative writing career.

That's what. :biggrin:

bacquito - 1-16-2012 at 11:27 AM

Good read and great comments. It seems that Vince Pittman is an angry person, angry at corporations, angry at his native country, angry at God, and not very skilled (prepared). He seems like an aged dropout.
He likes the locals because they give him fish, veggies and beer "como regalos". Does he return the favor?

Islandbuilder - 1-16-2012 at 11:40 AM

I wonder how he got over the border with all those different tools? I have friends that had difficulties getting a large set of mechanics tools across several years ago, isn't there some restriction on bringing in tools and supplies?

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 12:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Islandbuilder
I wonder how he got over the border with all those different tools? I have friends that had difficulties getting a large set of mechanics tools across several years ago, isn't there some restriction on bringing in tools and supplies?

Depends on the day and the inspector.

scouter - 1-16-2012 at 12:57 PM

interesting read .... there is definitely more to this story....

the mooch alarm went off for me too..... and move away from kids and grand kids?? running from something...... maybe just his reality.....

[Edited on 1-16-2012 by scouter]

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 01:51 PM

I've seen it way too often, people coming down from the states overloaded with self-perceived talent, thinking they will "cut a fat hog" by offering their skills to the expat community and expecting some type of blood loyalty only to receive a cold shoulder.
In the first place, expats in their own community here don't want to hire one of their own. They want to hire Pepe and Juan because that's who their new peer group told them to hire. Talent doesn't mean squat, but a robust sense of Noblesse Oblige means everything.
Another thing....expats won't trust one of their own if there is any evidence of neediness. They'll wonder "why" in a hundred different ways.
I can only hope this couple can overcome these obstacles, for their own sake, but they sure picked a strange place to take on the challenge. If there is a bustling expat community in San Blas, I would imagine a good share of them are in the same desperate boat.

Magic number is 5

Dave - 1-16-2012 at 02:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
They want to hire Pepe and Juan because that's who their new peer group told them to hire.

They want to hire Pepe and Juan because they think they can get a days work out of them for 5 dollars and that they'll be pleased as punch to get it and work extra hard. :rolleyes:

First thing a gringo told me [shouted] when I moved here was FIVE DOLLARS, FIVE DOLLARS... DON'T PAY MORE THAN FIVE DOLLARS! DON'T RUIN IT FOR THE REST OF US!

24baja - 1-16-2012 at 02:53 PM

It is with some slight admiration that I write this comment, I do not know many of my friends or family who would sell everything they could and put the rest in a van, leave family and friends and the comfortable existance to start over again in a new land, especially with $2000.00. Moochers? possibly but who are we to call them that, we are not walking in their shoes.

I know that we have planned out pretty much to the penny what we will be able to have available to us when we relocate to BOLA. We have already secured a home and boat to enable us to fish for our food. And have made some very comforting and supportive friends. I don't think I would like to be as hand to mouth as the Pittmans were. To each their own....

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 03:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Dave
First thing a gringo told me [shouted] when I moved here was FIVE DOLLARS, FIVE DOLLARS... DON'T PAY MORE THAN FIVE DOLLARS! DON'T RUIN IT FOR THE REST OF US!

Jeeeezo...how many times have I heard that. Still do.

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 04:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
I don't think I would like to be as hand to mouth as the Pittmans were. To each their own....

If it weren't for the illegal issues in the states, which I have strong feelings about, I wouldn't care less what they do, but I just won't live with a double standard. That's just me......being me.

Here, in Punta Banda, there are a healthy number of expats who earn extra money in cottage industries, such as home cooked foods sold in a group store on Fridays, and other means of generating income....Yoga.......Accupuncture and Art/Craft sales....to name a few.

I repell from this type of arrogance that tells one the law doesn't apply to him.
It does apply, but for lack of enforcement, it goes unheeded....and unrespected. I have a real problem with this. It makes me wonder why I pay the expense to do it by the book........and they don't.

24baja - 1-16-2012 at 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
I don't think I would like to be as hand to mouth as the Pittmans were. To each their own....

Dennis, I am sorry if my comments upset you, it was not my intention and I was not being arrogant, I just meant that they are resposible for their actions and I for mine, I am not their Keeper I follow the rules and expect others to be responsible.....my apologies for offending you.

J.P. - 1-16-2012 at 05:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
I don't think I would like to be as hand to mouth as the Pittmans were. To each their own....

I dont only repell them ,they would truly starve before I subsidize one of them. case in point a local citizen that occupied that building where they do buisness saved for several years and built a nice place across the street stands there with empty pockets and watches the illeagel activity go on in his old spot :fire:

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by J.P.]

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 05:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
Dennis, I am sorry if my comments upset you, it was not my intention and I was not being arrogant, I just meant that they are resposible for their actions and I for mine, I am not their Keeper I follow the rules and expect others to be responsible.....my apologies for offending you.

No...no offense at all. I wish I could champion the free spirit cause, as others here do, but I happen to be involved as one who is compromised by the "F---It" attitude.
Baja ain't an "Occupy Zone." There are rules and regulations....even laws that guide our life here. People have to respect that....even if they don't understand it.

Anyway...thanks for the clearance.

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by BajaNomad]

24baja - 1-16-2012 at 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

So glad we are good, I was sweating it there for a minute.

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by BajaNomad]

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 05:24 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by J.P.
I dont only repell them ,they would truly starve before I subsidize one of them. case in point a local citizen that occupied that building where they do buisness saved for several years and built a nice place across the street stands there with empty pockets and watches the illeagel activity go on in his old spot :fire:

I saw that from day one, John. I didn't like it then, and I don't like it now.
I made an effort to post my feelings of illegal business operations on the local PBBB board but was met with my normal deaf ear from the mods.

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 05:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
:spingrin:

So glad we are good, I was sweating it there for a minute.

Frightening....isn't it.....your memories of the old DENNIS. :lol:

J.P. - 1-16-2012 at 05:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Same here but i found out why, Not to mention any names they were solicited to write a Food Review on that upright bunch of solid citisens :lol:

EnsenadaDr - 1-16-2012 at 05:42 PM

Talking about rules and regulations, if you pay a Mexican a regular wage week in and week out, as an employer so to speak, of a gardener or whatever, are you, according to Mexican law responsible for their health coverage costs and/or taxes to the Mexican government??? I really don't know the answer to that....

Dave - 1-16-2012 at 05:44 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
I repell from this type of arrogance that tells one the law doesn't apply to him.
It does apply, but for lack of enforcement, it goes unheeded....and unrespected. I have a real problem with this. It makes me wonder why I pay the expense to do it by the book........and they don't.

As long as these folks are living hand-to-mouth no one will care. But the second they get ahead of the game the "man" will show up. Guaranteed.

Roberto - 1-16-2012 at 06:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
I know that we have planned out pretty much to the penny what we will be able to have available to us when we relocate to BOLA. We have already secured a home and boat to enable us to fish for our food.

This one got my attention. Seems like you have planned things meticulously, so I ask you if you mean supplement by fishing or actually procuring most of your food by fishing. Seems to be that it would be considerably cheaper to buy the fish from the locals than regularly spend money on gas to get them yourself. So I ask - how close are those two costs?

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 06:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
Talking about rules and regulations, if you pay a Mexican a regular wage week in and week out, as an employer so to speak, of a gardener or whatever, are you, according to Mexican law responsible for their health coverage costs and/or taxes to the Mexican government??? I really don't know the answer to that....

Actually, you don't even know the question. A worker who performs a task on a weekly basis is not your responsibility. He's contract labor....hired and fired at the beginning and end of his shift.
We recently covered this ad nauseum.

EnsenadaDr - 1-16-2012 at 06:36 PM

actually I had a woman that worked for me like that, and according to the Mexican government, I owed her a vacation...among other things!! What a gringo thinks and what the Mexican Government thinks are two different things!!!

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

DENNIS - 1-16-2012 at 06:45 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
actually I had a woman that worked for me like that,

Like what? Daily......weekly........what?

.

805gregg - 1-16-2012 at 08:17 PM

As Barnam said there's an a$$ for every seat (or slum).

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by 805gregg]

Roberto - 1-16-2012 at 08:18 PM

This being the slum?

slum...

EnsenadaDr - 1-16-2012 at 08:22 PM

Come on Roberto..we ARE in Baja..how about using barrio instead of slum..!!! However, I don't consider this board the slum of all posting boards...ummm...I will leave that one unmentionable as per the fifth amendment...

Quote:

Originally posted by Roberto
This being the slum?

805gregg - 1-16-2012 at 08:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Roberto
This being the slum?

The $65 a month slum in San Blas, you don't think that a nice house at $2.16 a day, do you?

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by 805gregg]

Your Mexican workers have rights too!!!

EnsenadaDr - 1-16-2012 at 09:03 PM

My daughter was 6 years old when I first came to Ensenada, so I needed a person to watch her and pick her up from school (1st grade). The lady worked from 9 to 3 at first then 9-1, and was with me almost a year. I gave her a paid vacation just a month before I fired her for some very good reasons, and she took me to the Government building. Lucky for me, the attorney in charge of the hearing asked if I had paid her vacation, and she said yes. The lady also had IMSS through her husband who passed away, so health insurance wasn't an issue. But the Mexican government stated that because she was a regular employee, I had certain financial obligations..they said I had to give her severance, and I offered her $1000 pesos, but she refused, and wanted to take me back to Court...but the attorney said she was being selfish and would have to pay to have another hearing which she never paid for.

Quote:

Originally posted by lencho

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
actually I had a woman that worked for me like that, and according to the Mexican government, I owed her a vacation...among other things!!

No kidding. Was she working enough hours to be considered full time?

The law in Mexico

EnsenadaDr - 1-16-2012 at 09:46 PM

You are totally right...I did get off lightly, but evidently others on this Board feel they still live in California, USA...can fire and hire at will with no repercussions...and certainly no labor laws to follow...

Quote:

Originally posted by lencho

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
...they said I had to give her severance, and I offered her $1000 pesos, but she refused, and wanted to take me back to Court..

I think you got off lightly. Anyone that wishes to be an employer in Mexico should read the Ley Federal de Trabajo. One thing to be said about Mexican law, it does recognize the working (wo)man. The U.S. could probably learn some things from its neighbor in that respect...

bacquito - 1-17-2012 at 08:27 AM

what an interesting discussion! Realise, that this all started with an article written by a "ner-do-well" living in San Blas, Mexico and has evolved into a discussion on worker's rights in Mexico.
I truly enjoy Baja Nomad!

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by bacquito]

DENNIS - 1-17-2012 at 08:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bacquito
what an interesting discussion! Realise, that this all started with an article written by a "ner-do-well" living in San Blas, Mexico and has evolved into a discussion on worker's rights in Mexico.
I truly enjoy Baja Nomad!

Threads morph. That's the essence of BajaNomad. It's a healthy reflection of people's need to talk and be heard. Very enjoyable, as you say.
Hey....didja hear the one about............... :biggrin:

bajabass - 1-17-2012 at 09:21 AM

Breaking the law in two countries set aside, I found it very interesting to hear how the locals accepted a pair of broke gringos into their community. I wonder also if they are as giving as their new neighbors. Heading to a new country, no money, no job, hoping for the best. Something I kinda wish I'd tried in my early twenties. Now, no way! Way too proud to be looked upon as a "charity case". I'd be back to work in the States in no time flat!

Islandbuilder - 1-17-2012 at 12:23 PM

I think that these folks are in equal parts to be condemned and praised. It took either great bravery or supreme foolishness to make their move, at their ages with so little resource. They were pretty well guaranteed to become charity cases from the outset.

Something powerful must have been behind their move; a family or community falling out, a severe loss of assets, or just facing late middle-age and regretting risks not taken when they were younger.

In some of those scenarios they would have become destitute wherever they were, in others they perhaps should have worked through the conflicts rather than bail and run. But at the end of the day, we all deal with these issues in varying degrees. And we all make choices, some of mine haven't been very wise in retrospect.

The inspiring thing about this story is how they seem to have been embraced by the local community. And how they have become integrated, perhaps legally, but for sure socially.

I know that when and if we move to Mexico, or Costa Rica (where we have a small farm) I will be both richer (in assets) and poorer (in community connectedness) than my new neighbors. I will give what I can, either in funds or skills, but I also know I will be reliant on my neighbors in many ways. I will be a cultural and community charity case.

In the valley where our farm is located, the locals have lived and worked in a very self-sufficient manner for generations. They tell us that everything they need to live, except salt, can be found in the valley. The other farms on either side still use ox carts on a daily basis. Very few lights, and very few machines are within view. If I move in with a few hand tools, a chain saw and a cordless drill I am instantly a rich man, as far as stuff goes. But I have no idea what to plant when, or what rotation will produce the best results, or when the small local deer are ready to be culled, or......a million things.

I guess I liked that the author "owns" his weakness and needs; not something we N Americans do very well.

I don't "approve" of his breaking the law, and it's not something I would choose to do myself, but there are some things to be learned from their story.

mtgoat666 - 1-17-2012 at 12:44 PM

i like the story. i say more power to the adventurers. who cares if they broke a few minor laws about immigration and working papers? i don't. we should applaud people that set off on adventure instead of getting stuck in a rut in the rat race because it is the safe, secure, sensible thing to do.

i do notice that it is only the rats in the rat race (or retired rats sitting next to race course) that are complaining about the rats that veered off of the race course in their own direction.

sancho - 1-17-2012 at 01:10 PM

Quote:

That reminds me of a post here recently from 1 of the BN
who resides around the Cape re: Hotel Maids making
$5.50 A DAY, having to sign 28 day contracts so employer
doesn't have to pay Mex SS,etc. I find myself quoting
those #'s to my friends flying down to the Mex
Beach Resorts, just to make them pause a second

toneart - 1-17-2012 at 05:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by mtgoat666
i like the story. i say more power to the adventurers. who cares if they broke a few minor laws about immigration and working papers? i don't. we should applaud people that set off on adventure instead of getting stuck in a rut in the rat race because it is the safe, secure, sensible thing to do.

i do notice that it is only the rats in the rat race (or retired rats sitting next to race course) that are complaining about the rats that veered off of the race course in their own direction.

Thanks, Goat!
I was waiting for someone to point this out.

I rarely post here anymore and almost forgot why. Oh Rats!...I do remember. :light:

Fear is only a driver if you are too frozen to drive yourself. It will stunt your growth and render you stunted and insignificant.
And now I continue on this fantastic adventure called LIFE...Off to the races! :coolup:

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 10:18 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Not so easy without showing proof of income.

From my experience in their office, they're very lax on that aspect of the program, so it hasn't been a problem for the people I've assited in getting enrolled.

In fact, you may have noticed that (assuming you have an FM status other than "tourist") in the past couple of years the Mexican government has quit caring what our income is for immigration purposes, either.

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 10:27 AM

Quote:

[quoteWhat?? Well...they have earned a little of it with their attitude of being above the law due to their efforts to be free spirited throughout their lives. Being free doesn't mean leaving one's fate in the hands of others, which is what brought this couple to godforsaken San Blas to begin with. They are reaping what they have sown.
That, I can deal with on an understanding level. What I can't and won't try to deal with is their total disregard for the laws of whatever country they find themselves in at the moment.
Working illegally in Mexico? And, it's admirable because they need an income to buy beer? C'mon. This is the attitude of many about our southern border that has led to the near disintigration of our economy and society. How could anyone but an "open borders" advocate think this is romantic or selectively tolerable?
Or...perhaps some of you actually believe they got themselves normallized with immigration when the price of a Caguama of beer was problematic enough to write about as a budget problem.
What really gets to me is the attitude that laws are in place only for others, and when times get tough, personal well-being trumps the law. That just ain't the way it is and if someone thinks differently, they should keep their decisions to themselves and quit making them the subject of a fledgeling creative writing career.

That's what. :biggrin:

OK, Dennis, I see where you're coming from. But I still admire them for what they're doing. It isn't something most of us could do--me included, even with good Spanish.

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 10:41 AM

Quote:

It makes me wonder why I pay the expense to do it by the book........and they don't.

Because you have your standards you live by AND you can afford it.

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 11:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 24baja
Dennis, I am sorry if my comments upset you, it was not my intention and I was not being arrogant,

Wise move, 24baja :lol:

Been there, done that, DON'T WANNA DO IT AGAIN!!! :lol:

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 11:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
Come on Roberto..we ARE in Baja..how about using barrio instead of slum..!!!

I don't think I'd equate "barrio" with "slum," Doc. While undoubtedly a barrio can be a slum, slums only make up a small percentage of the total number of barrios in Mexico. My Velázquez dic. defines slum as "barrio bajo y sucio de una población."

Just sayin'

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 11:19 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by 805gregg
The $65 a month slum in San Blas, you don't think that a nice house at $2.16 a day, do you?

[Edited on 1-17-2012 by 805gregg]

Someone else who confuses "viviendas populares" with slums. Or is the definition of "slum" we use stricktly an economic one, even in the developing world?

DENNIS - 1-18-2012 at 11:24 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
But I still admire them for what they're doing. It isn't something most of us could do--

I can almost see your list of iconic Americans, Steve. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abe Lincoln, Bonnie and Clyde, Ted Kaczynski........ :lol:

Slum vs. Barrio...

EnsenadaDr - 1-18-2012 at 11:27 AM

Then again, how many barrios in Mexico would be considered slums in the U.S.??? Just sayin´

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
Come on Roberto..we ARE in Baja..how about using barrio instead of slum..!!!

J.P. - 1-18-2012 at 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
But I still admire them for what they're doing. It isn't something most of us could do--

I can almost see your list of iconic Americans, Steve. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abe Lincoln, Bonnie and Clyde, Ted Kaczynski........ :lol:

Dont forget the Geezer Bandit,

If you havent been to San Blass you couldnt Imagine poooooooooooooor the would not have to try very hard to rise above the poverty level there.

[Edited on 1-18-2012 by J.P.]

DENNIS - 1-18-2012 at 11:32 AM

slum (slm)
n.
A heavily populated urban area characterized by substandard housing and squalor.
---------------------------

Viviendas Populares

Infonavit Housing comes to mind and most I've ever seen, if they don't start as a government built hovel, they soon enough end up as one. Bars over the windows are a bigger selling point than the flushing toilet.

Mana and San Blas...

EnsenadaDr - 1-18-2012 at 11:33 AM

One of the most beautiful and haunting songs by the Mexican group Mana is El Muelle de San Blas..has anyone seen the Muelle??

Quote:

Originally posted by J.P.

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
But I still admire them for what they're doing. It isn't something most of us could do--

I can almost see your list of iconic Americans, Steve. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abe Lincoln, Bonnie and Clyde, Ted Kaczynski........ :lol:

Dont forget the Geezer Bandit,

If you havent been to San Blass you couldnt Imagine poooooooooooooor the would not have to try very hard to rise above the poverty level there.

DENNIS - 1-18-2012 at 11:35 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by J.P.
If you havent been to San Blass you couldnt Imagine poooooooooooooor the would not have to try very hard to rise above the poverty level there.

I've been there. The insects and aligators own the place.
Torinos Bar is the bright spot in town. [I wonder if it's still there?]

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 11:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
But I still admire them for what they're doing. It isn't something most of us could do--

I can almost see your list of iconic Americans, Steve. George Washington, Thomas Jefferson, Abe Lincoln, Bonnie and Clyde, Ted Kaczynski........ :lol:

Interesting how things (according to your list) went to sh#t right about the time that the GOP was formed. Coincidence? Perhaps, but ... :lol:

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 06:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS
slum (slm)
n.
A heavily populated urban area characterized by substandard housing and squalor.
---------------------------

I guess that's my point. What do we call substandard housing and squalor that isn't in an urban zone?

What comes to mind are my years in the Philippines. There, most of the country lived in substandard housing that often included squalor. But when I was in the countryside, I didn't usually fear for my safety in such places--at least, not in the day time. Now, put me on the edge of Tondo, one of the most historic "barrios" in Manila, and I fear for my life, at ANY time. That is one scary, poor, poor, poor place.

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 07:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
One of the most beautiful and haunting songs by the Mexican group Mana is El Muelle de San Blas..has anyone seen the Muelle??

I like the song and love the group, Doc. An interesting note (at least, to me) is the history of San Blas. That was the Mexican ship repair center for the Manila Galleons (Cavite, on Manila Bay, was it's Philippine counterpart). I haven't made it there yet, but will one day, for the historic significance of the place (after so many years as a working port, the beaches are bound to be ugly).

805gregg - 1-18-2012 at 08:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
My daughter was 6 years old when I first came to Ensnada.

I feel sorry for your daughter.

EnsenadaDr - 1-18-2012 at 08:32 PM

Don't feel sorry for her....she is fully bilingual..didn't know a word of Spanish when she came here...and now people think she was born here..is a dual citizen...and will be eligible ot go to a Veterinary school in Mexico that is accredited by the U.S. and only $300 a semester...(check out the tuition of UC Davis)

Quote:

Originally posted by 805gregg

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
My daughter was 6 years old when I first came to Ensnada.

I feel sorry for your daughter.

DENNIS - 1-18-2012 at 09:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
I haven't made it there yet, but will one day, for the historic significance of the place (after so many years as a working port, the beaches are bound to be ugly).

Beaches are, in fact, beautiful and the surf is noteworthy. Above town on a hilltop is the remnant of a fort with crenolations to cradle cannon barrels of a long gone era.
The place is dripping with history, but, unfortunatly, overrun with blood-thirsty bugs. If not for that scourge, Hilton would be the most prominant employer.
When I was last there, the local Mota dealer had that distinction.

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 09:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by 805gregg
Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
My daughter was 6 years old when I first came to Ensnada.

I feel sorry for your daughter.

From the "quote" there, I'm gathering that gregg feels sorry that Doc's daughter has been raised in Ensenada. As someone raised in Mexico and the father of a daughter raised in Mexico and a son who got a good dose of Philippine and Japanese cultures in his youth, I've gotta say, I don't get your point, gregg. Care to expound a bit? Just curious as to your thinking.

Reminds me of the old joke that Europeans are said to have:

What do you call a person who speaks two languages? a: bilingual.

What do you call a person who speaks three languages? a: trilingual.

What do you call a person who speaks four languages? a:quadrilingual

What do you call a person who speaks only ONE language: a: an American

Bajatripper - 1-18-2012 at 09:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajatripper
I haven't made it there yet, but will one day, for the historic significance of the place (after so many years as a working port, the beaches are bound to be ugly).

Thanks for the info, Dennis. All the more reason to go there.

wilderone - 1-19-2012 at 10:43 AM

I went in the late 70's. There was a campground full of tourists, plenty of gringos. All were complaining about the no-seeums. Some were so bitten up they were sick. If we went out after dusk, you had to completely cover yourself and use bug spray. The boat ride to the fresh water lagoon was wonderful. We were allowed to go swimming in it - like Sparkletts water. The beach was littered with shark eggs and I saw my first and only gila monster on the beach. In the evening, the townspeople would come out to the central esplanade for socializing. Our hotel room had no hot water, no window glass (just a screen), and small lizards came out in the evening on the walls and ceiling. $6/nt. We really enjoyed San Blas, except for the no-seeums.

DENNIS - 1-19-2012 at 12:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wilderone
the fresh water lagoon was wonderful. We were allowed to go swimming in it - like Sparkletts water.

I was there quite a while before that and there was a large, concrete bathtub-like thing full of baby gators and the lagoon bottom was littered with beer cans.
After seeing the gators, all thoughts of swimming vanished..

Bajatripper - 1-19-2012 at 01:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wilderone
The beach was littered with shark eggs and...

Nice story, wilderone, and the date of your visit would definitely give you bragging rights to something.

Just a minor point, I'd guess those were probably turtle eggs you saw on the beach. While I'm no shark expert, among the little I do know about them is that they are born fully functional out of the womb. At least, the ones I've seen local fishermen catch are that way.

[Edited on 1-19-2012 by Bajatripper]

What about the beer cans??

EnsenadaDr - 1-19-2012 at 02:56 PM

I would have thought that there would have been no obstacle to getting down to the beer cans...

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by wilderone
the fresh water lagoon was wonderful. We were allowed to go swimming in it - like Sparkletts water.

DENNIS - 1-19-2012 at 03:01 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EnsenadaDr
I would have thought that there would have been no obstacle to getting down to the beer cans

Right. The alligators got down there with ease. The water was so clear it may have been twenty feet deep.
Anyway....that was before recycling. The cans may have been steel so they wouldn't last too long anyway.

sancho - 1-19-2012 at 03:12 PM

Was there in 1972, my 1st International Surf trip of sorts, I believe the break a little so. of San Blas was called Matachen Bay,
even at 2', the right was rideable for 200'.
Very fun

DENNIS - 1-19-2012 at 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by sancho
Was there in 1972, my 1st International Surf trip of sorts, I believe the break a little so. of San Blas was called Matachen Bay,
even at 2', the right was rideable for 200'.
Very fun

http://www.wannasurf.com/spot/Central_America/Mexico/Sinaloa...

David K - 1-19-2012 at 03:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wilderone
I went in the late 70's. There was a campground full of tourists, plenty of gringos. All were complaining about the no-seeums. Some were so bitten up they were sick. If we went out after dusk, you had to completely cover yourself and use bug spray. The boat ride to the fresh water lagoon was wonderful. We were allowed to go swimming in it - like Sparkletts water. The beach was littered with shark eggs and I saw my first and only gila monster on the beach. In the evening, the townspeople would come out to the central esplanade for socializing. Our hotel room had no hot water, no window glass (just a screen), and small lizards came out in the evening on the walls and ceiling. $6/nt. We really enjoyed San Blas, except for the no-seeums.

Went to San Blas when I was 13 (1970-71) ... remember the no-see-ums (slept in a camper at a trailer park), the Spanish fort on the hill, the river ride way up to the giant fresh water source with a rope swing over the river at that restaurant. Iguanas everywhere. Lot's of American hippies there and talk about rounding them up and forcing them to have hair cuts and lectures on masculinity! :lol:

Santiago - 1-19-2012 at 04:20 PM

Hey, what in the wide, wide, world of sports happened to my thread? I guess the next time I wish to get some insight on cultural differences, subtle or otherwise, I'll start off by asking about tires....

wilderone - 1-20-2012 at 12:03 PM

tripper - no, they were shark egg cases. Goggle "shark egg case photo"

sancho - 1-20-2012 at 12:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Santiago
Hey, what in the wide, wide, world of sports happened to my thread? I guess the next time I wish to get some insight on cultural differences, subtle or otherwise, I'll start off by asking about tires....

Was that quote from 'Blazing Saddles' intentional?
I like Yokahama tires

Santiago - 1-20-2012 at 12:39 PM

Yes

805gregg - 1-20-2012 at 07:13 PM

If I did something stupid like that, my wife would leave me, and I wouldn't blame her. They must be getting away from something north of the border, because the road north to better jobs is still there.

[Edited on 1-21-2012 by 805gregg]

Bajatripper - 1-21-2012 at 01:48 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by wilderone
tripper - no, they were shark egg cases. Goggle "shark egg case photo"

I did as you suggested, wilderone. Saw the images. Would have to say that you must be a marine biologist to recognize shark eggs in the wild, since they show no resemblance to "eggs" as most people know them.

Thanks for the info, I didn't know that some species of sharks don't give birth to live sharks. I didn't, however, check how many of those sharks with the weird eggs are common to the eastern Pacific about the latitud of San Blas. I'll just have to trust you on that one.