BajaNomad - tonight on National Geographic

tonight on National Geographic

rts551 - 4-19-2012 at 07:46 PM

Documentary. "The End Of The Line." Could the ocean fisheries be depleted by 2048?

Bajajorge - 4-20-2012 at 09:18 AM

I don't particularly like to eat fish that much, so ya can't blame me if there ain't none left. :lol:

Cypress - 4-20-2012 at 09:26 AM

I some serious steps aren't taken right now, they'll be gone long before 2048.

Enrique2012 - 4-20-2012 at 09:44 AM

Ah yes, and all the oil will be gone also. But it's of little concern since we will all be dead from global warming, right? Did I say global warming? Sorry, I meant to say climate change.

[Edited on 4-20-2012 by Enrique2012]

rts551 - 4-20-2012 at 09:49 AM

Hey it was put here to be used, or so someone else said. Use it up before someone else does!

woody with a view - 4-20-2012 at 09:52 AM

is that tonight? or yesterday tonight?

or like a restraunt (sp?) sign once proudly proclaimed, "free food tomorrow!"

bufeo - 4-20-2012 at 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody with a view
is that tonight? or yesterday tonight?

or like a restraunt (sp?) sign once proudly proclaimed, "free food tomorrow!"

We watched it "last night"...Thursday, April 19, 2012.

Allen R

rts551 - 4-20-2012 at 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody with a view
is that tonight? or yesterday tonight?

or like a restraunt (sp?) sign once proudly proclaimed, "free food tomorrow!"

yesterday. interesting.... surprising was the amount of sea life that was taken to be processed into animal food (including feed for penned /farmed fish).

woody with a view - 4-20-2012 at 10:10 AM

i saw he posted it yesterday. it is sad how much is wasted to feed pets, and of those pets how many are wasted and put down EACH YEAR.

we're doomed!

vgabndo - 4-20-2012 at 05:53 PM

In keeping with Woody's restaurant sign, I've always loved this one, and it is taking on new meaning.
[/font]WE RESERVE THE RIGHT TO
SERVE REFUSE TO ANYONE

Cypress - 4-20-2012 at 06:02 PM

Enrique2012, Welcome aboard! No. We've got oil, it's just that the current US administration has barred drilling in many areas. Global Warming? The earth has been warming since the last Ice Age. Man didn't start it and man can't stop it. :tumble:

Enrique2012 - 4-20-2012 at 06:30 PM

Apparently you didn't catch the sarcasm Cypress. I'm with you amigo!

rts551 - 4-20-2012 at 06:55 PM

Bufeo

What did you think?

acadist - 4-21-2012 at 05:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Enrique2012
Ah yes, and all the oil will be gone also. But it's of little concern since we will all be dead from global warming, right? Did I say global warming? Sorry, I meant to say climate change.

[Edited on 4-20-2012 by Enrique2012]

I am going with the Mayans on this one :lol:

Let's have another shot of tequila :light:

Seriously now....

djh - 4-21-2012 at 07:29 AM

Some of my fellow Nomads who don't really like the results of all the scienctific research on human impacts on earth.... might want to consider . . . that all those fish are either being abducted by aliens ~ or might be falling off the edge of the earth (which is most certainly flat....).
^.~

Yeah, pass the Patron :-)...

[Edited on 4-21-2012 by djh]

Skipjack Joe - 4-21-2012 at 08:45 AM

Most of the sardine fishery off Peru, the world's richest fishery in tonnage at one time, went into fertilizer.

Global harvest

Skipjack Joe - 4-21-2012 at 08:55 AM

glocatch.gif - 11kB

David K - 4-21-2012 at 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
Most of the sardine fishery off Peru, the world's richest fishery in tonnage at one time, went into fertilizer.

Is that not a good thing? Fertilizer is for growing food... The kind of food Vegetarians prefer, plants! :light:

I wonder if they realize that animals died to grow their plants??

Skipjack Joe - 4-21-2012 at 09:05 AM

The status of fishery species:

statusfish.gif - 9kB

Enrique2012 - 4-21-2012 at 09:12 AM

Thanks for the insight djh. It's difficult to wrap ones mind around the idea that humans have an impact on this planet, or that the earth might not be flat, but with your wisdom I now see the error of my ways. Perhaps the issue here is that I, and many like me, refuse to morph every cycle of life and turn it into a political agenda. Perhaps the issue here is that we refuse to politicize every aspect of our lives.

So thank you, and please pass that bottle of Patron.

Skipjack Joe - 4-21-2012 at 09:15 AM

The demise of the world's leading fishery. This graph is typical. It could be Californias sardine fishery by adjusting the dates.

anchovy.gif - 4kB

Skipjack Joe - 4-21-2012 at 09:23 AM

Where they come from. Note the importance of baja'a lagoons and salt marshes. Upwelling? think asuncion.
Most biomass comes from a very small area.

prodmarg.gif - 15kB

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 09:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Enrique2012
Thanks for the insight djh. It's difficult to wrap ones mind around the idea that humans have an impact on this planet, or that the earth might not be flat, but with your wisdom I now see the error of my ways. Perhaps the issue here is that I, and many like me, refuse to morph every cycle of life and turn it into a political agenda. Perhaps the issue here is that we refuse to politicize every aspect of our lives.

So thank you, and please pass that bottle of Patron.

Guess I don't get it. Are you saying that nothing should be done about Human impacts? or that there are other alternatives? Maybe chaos is more acceptable?

David K - 4-21-2012 at 09:40 AM

Humans are a natural part of this planet, too... Sometimes these debates make it sound like we are an alien species to this planet...

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 09:44 AM

They are a natural part of the planet. Does that mean that the impacts from being here naturally should not be mitigated if possible? So is San Diego, but we import water so you can live there, Why don't you try it "naturally".

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 09:45 AM

Why is that the same people who say "drill baby drill" don't say "fish baby fish"

or are fish here unnaturally and therefor should be managed.

[Edited on 4-21-2012 by rts551]

David K - 4-21-2012 at 09:46 AM

I didn't comment if being a human was either good or bad, I just made an observation Ralph about the typical way these enviro debates go.

Ateo - 4-21-2012 at 09:48 AM

Humans have large brains. Were lucky to be able to see the impact we make on our environment and do our best to mitigate it.

Cypress - 4-21-2012 at 09:49 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by rts551
Why is that the same people who say "drill baby drill" don't say "fish baby fish"
or are fish here unnaturally and therefor should be managed.
[Edited on 4-21-2012 by rts551]

Why is it that some people can't tell the difference between apples and oranges? :biggrin:

[Edited on 4/21/2012 by Cypress]

[Edited on 4/21/2012 by Cypress]

David K - 4-21-2012 at 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ateo
Humans have large brains. Were lucky to be able to see the impact we make on our environment and do our best to mitigate it.

Exactly! We have the ability to mess up a place, but we also have the ability to learn our mistake, clean up the mess and do it better next time! :light:

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 09:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress

Quote:

Why is it that some people can't tell the difference between apples and oranges? :biggrin:

[Edited on 4/21/2012 by Cypress]

[Edited on 4/21/2012 by Cypress]

You tell me. since in these cases both are talking about managing a natural resource. or is it one of the resources more sensitive to you than others.

Cypress - 4-21-2012 at 10:08 AM

rts551, One is alive and has the capacity to reproduce, increase and recover, the other isn't. Both resources are vitally important to me, you and everyone else.

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 10:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress
rts551, One is alive and has the capacity to reproduce, increase and recover, the other isn't. Both resources are vitally important to me, you and everyone else.

I agree. thanks .

Cypress - 4-21-2012 at 10:27 AM

rts551, You're welcome. :tumble:

LaPazGringo - 4-21-2012 at 11:54 AM

Here's the problem with the narrow, unenlightened, sanctimonious environmentalists: they hate human beings and want them to die so nature can return to perfection. It's hypocritical self-interest. To them humans are the source of all problems on Earth, even natural cycles. They hate humans and they hate you and I.

Want a dose of reality to cut through all the BS?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=eScDfYzMEEw&feature=playe...

[Edited on 4-21-2012 by LaPazGringo]

woody with a view - 4-21-2012 at 12:23 PM

in response to Skipjack, the pelicans were almost killed off in SoCal 40 years ago due to ddt. they are getting as thick as seagulls nowadays. there must be an awful lot of anchovies/sardines to keep this population afloat.

i happen to think nothing is better than it was 30, 20, 10 years ago, but it might just be memory related.

danaeb - 4-21-2012 at 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by LaPazGringo
Here's the problem with the narrow, unenlightened, sanctimonious environmentalists: they hate human beings and want them to die so nature can return to perfection. It's hypocritical self-interest. To them humans are the source of all problems on Earth, even natural cycles. They hate humans and they hate you and I.

This is one of the funniest posts I've ever read on BN. Where to start..... :rolleyes:

Cypress - 4-21-2012 at 12:41 PM

LaPazGringo, Reality? Go catch a big mature grouper or pargo within miles of any population center along the Sea of Cortez. Take a picture. I'm ready to be enlightened. :biggrin:

LaPazGringo - 4-21-2012 at 12:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by danaeb

Quote:

This is one of the funniest posts I've ever read on BN. Where to start..... :rolleyes:

If starting with a response to something I said is too far beneath your obvious superiority, how about responding to some of George Carlin's logic? You know, the video you removed when you quoted my post?

Oh wait, I almost forgot the :rolleyes:

LaPazGringo - 4-21-2012 at 12:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress
LaPazGringo, Reality? Go catch a big mature grouper or pargo within miles of any population center along the Sea of Cortez. Take a picture. I'm ready to be enlightened. :biggrin:

And what will that prove/disprove? Will that mean we'll all be dead within a certain period of time, or that the SOC is already dead, or what? What will it mean, Cypress? :spingrin:

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 01:00 PM

Gringo,went back and looked at your posts. I see a lot of whining, and BS. Not once do I see any facts or even what your position is on this particular issue. Do you just like to throw stuff out and see if it sticks?

Back on track "Could fisheries be depleted?"

[Edited on 4-21-2012 by rts551]

LaPazGringo - 4-21-2012 at 01:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rts551
Gringo,went back and looked at your posts. I see a lot of whining, and BS. Not once do I see any facts or even what your position is on this particular issue. Do you just like to throw stuff out and see if it sticks?

Back on track "Could fisheries be depleted?"

[Edited on 4-21-2012 by rts551]

Talk about the pot calling the kettle black! :lol:

See the video I posted. It expresses my sentiments better than I ever could. And I venture to say there will be zero response or even acknowledgement of that video by any who are campaigning to save the planet from the evil, ignorant humans.

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 01:29 PM

I don't see any video addressing depleting of fisheries. Since you obviously did not watch the program, and can only resort to Rush-like cliches, I'll just assume you are ignorant of the facts.

David K - 4-21-2012 at 02:33 PM

What is a Rush-like cliche ? Canadian rock band lyrics? :rolleyes:

woody with a view - 4-21-2012 at 02:35 PM

:lol:

that's a good 'un, eh?

David K - 4-21-2012 at 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody with a view
:lol:

that's a good 'un, eh?

Pass me a Moose Head, eh?

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 03:42 PM

AHHHH KIA.... since you entered the "discussion"on your own. You ought to know what those cliches are, you parrot them all the time. With no job, you have lots of time to listen to the radio....now, if we could just get you to listen critically.

Skipjack Joe - 4-21-2012 at 04:05 PM

That George Carlin tape is BS.

Initially he trashes the enviro wackos as being concerned for personal reasons. But he concludes with a very fatalistic discourse of how we are really insignificant in the history of the planet. We will come and go like all in the past leaving plastic.

The point is you and I don't want to go. What fool is going to keep eating to the point of starvation. Look, you can only take out as much as comes in. How can you blindly assume that it will come in at the same rate. After all you are continuously taking, depleting. Why are those bringing the bad news being blamed. They're only doing it because like you, they want to stay.

Please look at the Peruvian anchovy chart. It's occuring in baja right now. Once you exceed maximum sustainable yield you change the composition of a population. You have enough mature adults to only replace themselves. It takes years for a robust population to return. A growing population.

That's important because it stops as much coming in as we're taking out. When this happens we ultimately starve. Nobody wants that.

Most of the world fisheries have now been analyzed. Unfortunately much of it is after the fact, after the crash. Market forces cause government to ignore the knowledge and continue to fish until maximum yield is reached and rely on the crash to regulate it's fishery. This seems to be occuring in baja. That and the panguero who feels it's his right to starve himself. It's very self destructive.

So if your desire to survive is strong you should take all measures to do so. No assumptions. Measurements, regulations, law enforcement is the only way. Don't talk of enviro conspiracies. This is straight science and not very complicated at that.

rts551 - 4-21-2012 at 05:33 PM

Igor,

These people either

Stick their head in the sand or
are selfish and do not care as long as they have theirs.

and based on the lifestyle and history of some... maybe some of both!

On edit: oh yes. signed Ralph

[Edited on 4-22-2012 by rts551]