BajaNomad

Cascabelles - Rattlesnakes

Curt63 - 5-12-2012 at 08:51 PM

Some of my mountain bike buddies are seeing lots of Rattlers lately in north San Diego county.

I understand its the mating season and the males are searching out females and moving around a lot.

Is anyone seeing rattlers in Baja lately? ... pics please

Bajaboy - 5-12-2012 at 08:53 PM

I've seen more rattlers this year than I have in the past. Just about stepped on one on Wednesday. My wife saw four on one six mile run. Not sure about Baja but snakes in San Diego are thriving this year.

ElCap - 5-12-2012 at 09:37 PM

I almost stepped on a big rattlesnake about two weeks ago in San Ignacio. It was coiled and ready to strike when it started rattling as I was walking just feet from it on a dirt road. Scared the crap out of me (and him), I jumped 10 feet, and he slithered down in some rocks and continued to rattle. I could hear his rattle from 100 feet away afterward.
http://im1.shutterfly.com/media/47a2db33b3127ccef04dbba527a4...

[Edited on 5-13-2012 by ElCap]

David K - 5-12-2012 at 10:47 PM

April is the only month I consistantly see rattlers in Baja... when driving or hiking.

DENNIS - 5-13-2012 at 01:36 AM

One of the local gardeners has caught and relocated two babies in the last few weeks. They're out there.
Usually we don't see too much of them until later in the summer when they start getting closer to home looking for water.

chuckie - 5-13-2012 at 02:21 AM

Lots of comments about people seeing them here in Mulege. I have seen 3. Neighbor killed one in their kitchen...:no:

CortezBlue - 5-13-2012 at 03:35 AM

My neighbor found a baby and being from the desert in AZ he asked me to move it. Baby rattlers are very dangerous as they don't have much control if their venom and release all of their load.

I used a shovel and relocated the little guy.

Oh, he was in 2 pieces when he was moved :o

chuckie - 5-13-2012 at 04:22 AM

thats the way I usually move them. I had a "live and let live" attitude for a long time, but after we bought our ranch in NW kansas it changed. Cattle, horses, dogs and me bitten...I now kill every one I see....Just sold the ranch, really full time in Baja now..but I doubt my attitude will change back...:saint:

rattlers in the Southland

Osprey - 5-13-2012 at 06:41 AM

With 7 long years of drought, not many animals survive. Those that do are hardy critters. I'm the local snake remover guy around town and here's one I took from a people place to the far boonies; a nice fat Pacific diamondback.

[Edited on 5-13-2012 by Osprey]

Rsnake Nomad.jpg - 14kB

rts551 - 5-13-2012 at 06:42 AM

friends dog just died in Cabo Pulmo after abite.

nbacc - 5-13-2012 at 06:44 AM

I got my dog the snake bite shot. My vet says it is like buying insurance. Might never happen but when it does you wish you had it. Nancy

goldhuntress - 5-13-2012 at 07:23 AM

I give my dog the rattlesnake vaccine too. It's one shot then 30 days later another so plan a month ahead if you need it before a trip to Baja. Then it's once a year but you can get it more often if necessary. I get mine 2 times a year, both times right before I go to Baja, that way it's still working at it's best. And, if bitten, you still need to get the dog to the vet asap as they will need antibiotics, fluids and more than likely the antivenom. The photo is of a baby Baja California Rattlesnake I ran into a couple years ago.

chuckie - 5-13-2012 at 07:23 AM

My dogs all have the snake bite shots. One has been bitten since, got very sick, but didnt die. We keep a piece of garden hose handy in case a horse or cow gets bitten. Goes down the nasal passage so they can breathe until we can move them to the vet...since they almost always get bit on the nose the swelling will cause them to strangle...Not fun, and expensive...

DavidE - 5-13-2012 at 08:40 AM

Thanks for the heads-up, with cataract and bad hearing I'm going to keep this in mind.

Archie - 5-13-2012 at 08:44 AM

Hello Goldhuntress

Can you give me the name of the shots you got for your dogs?

Im always with one or two of my 6 labs... already lost one by snakebite 7 years ago near GN.

in the summer of 2011 i saw a german sheperd in a local rancho fighting with a rattler, the snake bite the dog but the dog eventually killed it and ate it. Then started salivating profusely and got a swollen neck the size of a basketball. The rancher only gave the dog fresh water and told me that this dog had survived another bite in the front leg a few years back.

I guess it was a dry bite, just a warning to back off but that c-cktail can do some seriuos harm even if its a dry bite.

Vaccine

bajaguy - 5-13-2012 at 08:59 AM

Our vet in Ensenada does not carry the vaccine. Had to get the shot in the states.

Also recommend Rattlesnake Avoidance Training for your dogs. We have Labs and took them to the clinic, then two refresher sessions......it works.......!!!!!

http://rattlesnaketraining.com/

rts551 - 5-13-2012 at 09:06 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Archie
Hello Goldhuntress

Can you give me the name of the shots you got for your dogs?

Im always with one or two of my 6 labs... already lost one by snakebite 7 years ago near GN.

in the summer of 2011 i saw a german sheperd in a local rancho fighting with a rattler, the snake bite the dog but the dog eventually killed it and ate it. Then started salivating profusely and got a swollen neck the size of a basketball. The rancher only gave the dog fresh water and told me that this dog had survived another bite in the front leg a few years back.

I guess it was a dry bite, just a warning to back off but that c-cktail can do some seriuos harm even if its a dry bite.


Dogs (and cats) can survive a bite. one of our Golden Retrievers head grew like a watermelon, but with benadryl and anti-biotics. he survived. Neighbors dog in Arizona survived a neck bite with only rest. And I have known other dogs to die. On a dry bite nothing happens (saw that happen to our current dog).

goldhuntress - 5-13-2012 at 09:23 AM

Hi Archie, I think this is the only company that makes it vaccine and so all the vets use it. I actually talked to them when I was first looking into it had a good conversation with them. Here's the website http://www.redrockbiologics.com You can ask your vet what a good emergency kit would be too. I bring benadryl and an antibiotic with me so I can be a proactive as possible.
Also this site has some good do's and don'ts http://www.raidthewind.com/snakebite.htm
Quote:
Originally posted by Archie
Hello Goldhuntress

Can you give me the name of the shots you got for your dogs?

Im always with one or two of my 6 labs... already lost one by snakebite 7 years ago near GN.

in the summer of 2011 i saw a german sheperd in a local rancho fighting with a rattler, the snake bite the dog but the dog eventually killed it and ate it. Then started salivating profusely and got a swollen neck the size of a basketball. The rancher only gave the dog fresh water and told me that this dog had survived another bite in the front leg a few years back.

I guess it was a dry bite, just a warning to back off but that c-cktail can do some seriuos harm even if its a dry bite.

Barry A. - 5-13-2012 at 01:44 PM

Some amazing rattlesnake photos here:

http://www.fieldherpforum.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=6&t=...

Curt63 - 5-13-2012 at 01:49 PM

Great pics!

Thx

DavidE - 5-13-2012 at 02:30 PM

I always try and keep in mind that venom is the snake's predigestion fluids at work. It serves to break down tissue, and that a bite from a foot and a half long baby rattler could possibly be a lot more deadly than one from a larger snake. I certainly am no expert but I know enough to get to la clinica pronto if I should ever be unfortunate enough to be bitten. About 25-years ago I and two pangueros from Agua Verde searched for and found a couple of "rattle-less" rattlesnakes on Isla Catalán.

El Jefe - 5-13-2012 at 04:04 PM

From the classes I had in the FD I learned a couple of things. The venom does start the digestion process on your skin and that combined with the heavy swelling can leave terrible scarring. I've seen the pics.

Also, we were taught that rattlers are territorial. If you relocate one it is likely going to be into another rattler's area. They will fight to the death. So, this helps me to be able to just kill them when they come into my territory..

Osprey - 5-13-2012 at 05:12 PM

Jefe, works the same for me with baby surfers.

DavidE - 5-14-2012 at 09:55 AM

Osprey, you digest them? Ewwwwww!

Skeet/Loreto - 5-14-2012 at 10:13 AM

Hey!

Dont you people bother my Sankes on Sta Catalana Isla.
I transplanted 6 Rattlesnakes there last year and hope that they will intergrate with the Rattleless Snakes There. it will be interesting to see what happens, If you just want to watch them they are easy to find on the Northwest side of the Isla.

If any of you really want to find out about the Snakes go to the Sweetwater Texas RattleSnake Round up every year the third Week of March.

The way we handles a Bite as a Kid was to use a Razor Blade and make a cut where the Fangs went in then Suck out the Posion/sure and wash your mouth outh good after several good Sucks.

Osprey - 5-14-2012 at 11:24 AM

Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.

Barry A. - 5-14-2012 at 11:32 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.


Rattlesnakes are dangerous enough when they rattle, but when they don't rattle you have a real problem. Rattlesnakes without rattles are a recipe for disaster. As a person that has been hit (deflected by leather boots) 3 different times by rattlers, I am hyper about this. Evolution or not, man's safety takes precedence in my book.

Barry

mtgoat666 - 5-14-2012 at 11:33 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.


skeet is just telling tales like usual. he said he did this last year? he may have tried it 40 years ago, but doubt he did it last year. skeet and facts rarely coincide

Skeet/Loreto - 5-14-2012 at 12:28 PM

I was very selective in my choice of Snakes to be tranplanted. They were all Diamond Backs with 6 rattlers and good condition. Taken from a Den 7 miles South of Sweetwater Texas. They were safely transported and when freeded were left with the Carcess of two Rabbits for food.
I had been on the Isla and knew where the Rattless snakes Hang out during April. They are easy to spot.

It will be interesting to see what will happen in the next few years. I have made sure my Grandson has all the Pappers and Photos when I pass on.

Confessions of Skeet

tehag - 5-14-2012 at 04:42 PM

Pretty public place to openly confess to breaking a whole load of US, Mexican, and international laws concerning transportation and deliberate liberation of species. If the biologists currently engaged in herpetology studies on that island find any physical evidence of such activity they won't have much trouble finding the culprit. They can denounce said culprit to all interested authorities.

Starlings, mongooses, cottontail rabbits, etc. have demonstrated very clearly that that kind of f'ing around with nature is potentially disastrous.

Skeet/Loreto - 5-14-2012 at 04:54 PM

"Potentially Disastrous""???

Are you referring to "Global Warming" ???

There are "No laws broken it what I did".

Please list them in your next Post.

Canot you just see a bunch of thos Eco Nuts even having the Balls to go to the Isla where there are Snakes!! Those wimps like to stay Home and collect the donated Money and spend it on DOPE.

rts551 - 5-14-2012 at 04:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.


Rattlesnakes are dangerous enough when they rattle, but when they don't rattle you have a real problem. Rattlesnakes without rattles are a recipe for disaster. As a person that has been hit (deflected by leather boots) 3 different times by rattlers, I am hyper about this. Evolution or not, man's safety takes precedence in my book.

Barry


So what would you do with the venomous snakes that don't have rattles. More park rangers are wildlife biologists. guess you were.....

rts551 - 5-14-2012 at 04:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Skeet/Loreto
"Potentially Disastrous""???

Are you referring to "Global Warming" ???

There are "No laws broken it what I did".

Please list them in your next Post.

Canot you just see a bunch of thos Eco Nuts even having the Balls to go to the Isla where there are Snakes!! Those wimps like to stay Home and collect the donated Money and spend it on DOPE.


bull pucky. thats a protected area....but I guess you are for "do what ever you want, where ever you want"

goldhuntress - 5-14-2012 at 05:08 PM

They are classified as critically endangered.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crotalus_catalinensis

mtgoat666 - 5-14-2012 at 05:10 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.


Rattlesnakes are dangerous enough when they rattle, but when they don't rattle you have a real problem. Rattlesnakes without rattles are a recipe for disaster. As a person that has been hit (deflected by leather boots) 3 different times by rattlers, I am hyper about this. Evolution or not, man's safety takes precedence in my book.

Barry


barry:
sounds like you advocate for extinction of all species you consider dangerous to humans. every year humans kill more humans than rattlesnakes do, so might as well exterminate humans too! or practice selective elimination of anyone that barry finds objectionable...

bears have killed humans, so exterminate them! or cross breed them with golden retrievers so they lick you to death...

Skipjack Joe - 5-14-2012 at 05:25 PM

Looks like Skeet is still fishing. Only now he's reeling in nomads.

I don't believe any of it.

Barry A. - 5-14-2012 at 05:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by mtgoat666
Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.


Rattlesnakes are dangerous enough when they rattle, but when they don't rattle you have a real problem. Rattlesnakes without rattles are a recipe for disaster. As a person that has been hit (deflected by leather boots) 3 different times by rattlers, I am hyper about this. Evolution or not, man's safety takes precedence in my book.

Barry


barry:
sounds like you advocate for extinction of all species you consider dangerous to humans. every year humans kill more humans than rattlesnakes do, so might as well exterminate humans too! or practice selective elimination of anyone that barry finds objectionable...

bears have killed humans, so exterminate them! or cross breed them with golden retrievers so they lick you to death...


Hmmmmm, That sounds like the old "bad behavior" is justified by more "bad behavior" argument. Since humans kill humans, then snakes killing humans is ok, by your standards?? Interesting. The National Park Service moves and kills dangerous animals all the time when they are deemed a threat to man--------duh!!!!! It's all a matter of priorities.

Barry

goldhuntress - 5-14-2012 at 05:54 PM

These live on an island and are protected. I don't think we have to worry about them biting us.

rts551 - 5-14-2012 at 06:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by mtgoat666
Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Skeet, you suck and your Darwin Jr. playing God/Gomer thing does too.

It took millions of years for the Red Rattlesnake to lose his rattles. Now you want to hybrid them back in one afternoon!

You need a Texas whuppin for that.


Rattlesnakes are dangerous enough when they rattle, but when they don't rattle you have a real problem. Rattlesnakes without rattles are a recipe for disaster. As a person that has been hit (deflected by leather boots) 3 different times by rattlers, I am hyper about this. Evolution or not, man's safety takes precedence in my book.

Barry


barry:
sounds like you advocate for extinction of all species you consider dangerous to humans. every year humans kill more humans than rattlesnakes do, so might as well exterminate humans too! or practice selective elimination of anyone that barry finds objectionable...

bears have killed humans, so exterminate them! or cross breed them with golden retrievers so they lick you to death...


Hmmmmm, That sounds like the old "bad behavior" is justified by more "bad behavior" argument. Since humans kill humans, then snakes killing humans is ok, by your standards?? Interesting. The National Park Service moves and kills dangerous animals all the time when they are deemed a threat to man--------duh!!!!! It's all a matter of priorities.

Barry



Barry duh.. how many "rattlers" were tagged as dangerous? so extinguish all of them???

[Edited on 5-15-2012 by rts551]

bajachris - 5-14-2012 at 06:09 PM

My dog gets rattle snake vaccine one per year. Vet says may not need much treatment if bitten. A better approach is to have your dog take rattlesnake awareness training. My dog saved my husband's life by not letting him out the door to the house. Coiled up rattler right outside. The training is incredibly effective. Another time I was walking the dog, he saw a snake on the trail ahead and he made me turn around. The guy who trained my dog was awesome, but he passed away of old age. Not sure who I would recommend now. They need refresher training about annually. I started going less than annually because I noticed my dog did not forget and I felt bad putting him through the terrifying training. Especially if you show up to training and are downwind from the snake and your dog knows there's a snake and doesn't want to get out of the car. The training involves a milked mouth bound rattler. The handler makes your dog aware of site, sound and smell of the rattler. Dog has a shock collar around neck. It only took one time for my dog to never want to get near the snakes again. Sometimes large sticks freak him out..

Rattlesnakes: You never know when...or where?

Pompano - 5-14-2012 at 07:23 PM

This happened today at a Walmart in Washington state. I read it while having a streamside lunch on the Bighorn River in eastern Montana.

(Reuters) - When Mica Craig reached down to brush what he thought was a stick off some mulch in the garden section of a Washington state Walmart, it turned around and sank its fangs into his hand.

The Friday encounter with a rattlesnake sent Craig, 47, to the hospital, where he said he remained in excruciating pain and may lose feeling in two fingers. Wal-Mart Stores Inc has apologized.

"I reached down to grab the stick to move it out of the way, and the snake stretched out, turned around and got its fangs in my right hand," he said. "I slung it off and I did a tap dance on it until it was dead."

Craig was rushed to the hospital by fellow customer Maria Geffre, who told Reuters she saw him crumple to the ground after crying out that he had been bitten by a snake.

"He had punctures on his hand and there was the dead rattler he'd stomped on," Geffre said, describing the snake as at least a foot long with four buttons, or rattles.

Craig, a married father of two, said the mulch was for his marijuana plants, which he is licensed to grow for medical reasons. It was unclear whether the snake came from an adjacent field or arrived at the store along with garden supplies.

Craig said doctors who initially thought the snake had inflicted only a "dry bite" - or one that did not inject venom - treated him with six bags of anti-venom after his right hand swelled to the size of a melon.

End of news article.

______


So..after that... What do I come upon at this Bighorn, Montana rest stop but this




Note: It's damn tough for me to 'hover' over the grass, but I managed pretty well.

There are some VERY big ones out there.

"Stay levitated, my friends."






[Edited on 5-15-2012 by Pompano]

goldhuntress - 5-14-2012 at 07:39 PM

See how dangerous marijuana is! I think it's time to watch reefer madness again:) Seriously, that is bad luck. I would hope I could tell the difference between a stick and a rattlesnake but I can see how your senses could be less than aware if you were in a store

Archie - 5-15-2012 at 09:06 AM

Been too close too many times to Cascabeles to trust them.

I work in wildlife management for conservation in most of the ejidos south of El Rosario, we had one of our crew members bitten in 2005 near catavina on the road to el faro de san jose. Classic hero move, he tried to pick it by the tail for a picture and got hit in his right hand index.

Other coleague is a certified paramedic and stopped him from injecting the anti-viper serum we always carry in the camping kit. He explained us the danger of using a serum that may provoque an allergic reaction worst than the poison itself. We used instead a sirynge type venom extractor directly on the wounds.

I got to drive and the paramedic and the guy holding his hand in a clean shirt climbed on the back seat and headed to the way out, some miles ahead found a military patrol, asked if they had a radio or sat phone. Negative.

Short of options we rushed to the paved road and had to make a quick decision between driving 10 minutes to Cataviña and see if they can help us, or drive the 100 kilometers to El Rosario that i know they had a medic and a clinic (a graduated student at least). So far had been some 25-30 minutes from the bite and my friend just whines from intense pain and swelling but hes not shocking or collapsing, so we decide to go north.

The first hour its the most dangerous so we gave him lots of gatorade and kept him distracted while the paramedic used the venom extractor. As soon as we had cellphone reception called *112, thats the emergency number of Policia Federal de Caminos, explained the situation and they called El Rosario local police who waited for us at the town entrance and escorted us to the Seguro Popular clinic, there the resident medic had to split herself in two between taking care of the bite and two local girls that arrived at the same time because they smashed themselves and their ATV to a wall. No helmet of course.

The guy saved his hand but lost movility of the finger. The doctor explained the venom of this particular species is hemolytic, meaning it destroys blood, muscle and bone tissue.

(sorry, its the least gross picture i got from that day)


This guy is Lalo the park ranger in San Pedro Martir, hes always with two labs. He was the owner of the labrador we lost to a rattler in el Llano del Berrendo.

Thats why i dont trust snakes.

[Edited on 5-15-2012 by Archie]

DavidE - 5-15-2012 at 11:02 AM

Appreciated detailed info --- thank you!