BajaNomad

Lost & Found: It may not be a lost mission, but this time it's for real :)

elbeau - 7-12-2012 at 08:36 AM

Hi Nomads,

As some of you may remember from my Santa Isabel thread from last year, I like doing reading about Baja archaeology. Although I don't tend to zoom in quite as much when I use Google Earth these days, and although I don't have any wild treasure-hunting trips to send nomads on at the moment, I do have a fun story to tell.

Anybody who has read much about Archaeology in Baja has probably come across the name "William Massey". In fact, from what I understand, his wife and son are active Baja Nomads themselves. Anyways, William Massey worked doing archaeology in Baja California starting in the 1940's. He is known for his scientific approach and his work is still quoted in many modern publications. Among his work is an article published in the Southwest Journal of Anthropology in 1947 in which he states:

"For several miles to the west of the locality where the Arroyo de Comondu leaves its canyon, there is a plain of silts dissected by washes. From the faunal remains-bison, camel, and horse-which have been collected in this fossil location,it is known that in Pleistocene times it was a marsh. No artifacts have been found in place with these Pleistocene faunal remains,but the presence of longitudinally split bison bones, and reported camel and horse bones with burned ends suggest the work of contemporaneous humans."

To translate this for us non-scientists, he said: "We found really old animal bones with tool marks that makes us think that people ate them". Since these species appear to have all gone extinct about 10,000 years ago, these fossils could go a long ways towards documenting how long people have lived in Baja.

Unfortunately, just a few years after he wrote that article he wrote in another publication that although those fossils did exist, he could no longer produce them for further analysis. There are quite a few modern publications that reference this claim and which wish that the evidence of it could be found and have further testing done, but nobody had been able to track down where the fossils went.

One day on a whim I decided to take up the subject of where the fossils may have gone, so on a lunch break from my normal job I stopped by the University of Texas to see if I couldn't find something in their wonderful latin american libraries that might help. I didn't find anything new, but as I browsed the 1947 article which I had read before, I noticed the footnote that said "Our remains were identified through the kindness of Dr R. A. Stirton."

A minor amount of googling made it clear that he was referencing Reuben Arthur Stirton, the fourth director of the University of California's Museum of Paleontology. I soon found myself browsing through the online lists of the museum's collections and found several collections by Massey, but none that could be the fossils which he had mentioned. Before long I inadvertently bumped into a search result for a collection deposited by Annie Alexander in 1948 which includes "DIST TIBIA,SCAPULA FRAG,HUMERUS,METACARPAL" from a Quarternary Bison and which was collected from "Comondu Arroyo 1" in Baja California Sur.

I also soon found that the museum has a special section about Annie Alexander's collections which mentions correspondence between her and Massey.

Needless to say I thought I was onto something, and in very short order I contacted the museum and received the following response (edited for length):

"You are a top-notch historical sleuth!"

that was my favorite part :)

They went on to say "the bones...were right there in the drawer! I've taken a few quick pictures...They are now attached to the specimen record in our online database here
<http://ucmpdb.berkeley.edu/cgi/ucmp_query2?&spec_id=V38331&one=T> and also accessible here
<http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=&where-specimen_no=V38331>"

He also noted "They are definitely blackened here and there" but that tests would need to be performed to see if the blackening was from the fossilization process.

One thing that was lost in the mix was a separate email I sent them regarding other collections that Annie Alexander deposited from the same location at the same time. The other collections are horse and camel bones which makes it likely that they are the blackened bones that Massey mentioned. If you read the 1947 article it becomes apparent that there has been a misunderstanding about which fossils are expected to show the blackening. It's not the bison bones, it's the horse and camel bones. The bison bones are expected to be longitudinally split, which the online photographs show clearly. I am very curious to see what the horse and camel bones look like.

Again, I'm hardly a professional when it comes to this subject, but the bison scapula that the museum photographed for me looks intriguing to me. I have read that these scapula were often used to make hoes in prehistoric times. As you look at the photo of the scapula, you will note that it has a couple of holes in it. The larger hole looks particularly unusual to me and, in my completely unprofessional opinion, could have been made by a projectile point or lithic tool, but this is pure speculation on my part of course.

My best guess as to why the fossils were lost in the first place is that Annie Alexander died just a couple of years after depositing the fossils and Massey must not have known what became of them.

There are a couple of professional folks who are going to try to find some time to do some testing on the fossils, but they do not know when the work might get started yet.

Let's all take our hats off to the University of California at Berkeley, and to Dr. Pat Holroyd who has been instrumental in preserving the fossils for so long and specifically for her work and success in obtaining the funds and doing the labor necessary to document them and post them online. From what I understand, before she started at the museum, the fossils were not documented and were simply stored in boxes underneath the football stadium seats.

Dr. Holroyd, Thank you!

[Edited on 7-12-2012 by elbeau]

Taco de Baja - 7-12-2012 at 09:18 AM

Very cool!
In looking at the photos (had to go to the UCMP site, as your links did not work) the "burned" areas look like mineral stains to me. The other issue is, is if they were associated with humans, there would likely have been some artifacts, at a minimum some flakes, points, scrapers, grinding stones, charcoal, something. As a professional archaeologist, the person who found the fossil bones would have known what to look for. Of course, the "burned" bones he refers too may be other bones that are not in the UCMP collections.....But I have a strong feeling, that they too would turn out to be mineral deposits. Also, if there were people here longitudinally splitting bones, there would be stone tools all over the place that were used to split the bone. The split bones are likely natural.

My guess is, it is "simply" a fossil locality. Not that there is anything wrong with that. :)

I have dealt with Dr. Holroyd numerous times and also found her to be very helpful in paleontological research.

David K - 7-12-2012 at 09:32 AM

Hi Beau,

Of interest, my wife and I are leaving for La Paz this weekend and will be spending some time with the late Bill Massey's (step) son exploring sites in Baja California Sur.

Lot's of photos coming in 2-3 weeks!

elbeau - 7-12-2012 at 09:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Taco de Baja
Very cool!
In looking at the photos (had to go to the UCMP site, as your links did not work) the "burned" areas look like mineral stains to me. The other issue is, is if they were associated with humans, there would likely have been some artifacts, at a minimum some flakes, points, scrapers, grinding stones, charcoal, something. As a professional archaeologist, the person who found the fossil bones would have known what to look for. Of course, the "burned" bones he refers too may be other bones that are not in the UCMP collections.....But I have a strong feeling, that they too would turn out to be mineral deposits. Also, if there were people here longitudinally splitting bones, there would be stone tools all over the place that were used to split the bone. The split bones are likely natural.

My guess is, it is "simply" a fossil locality. Not that there is anything wrong with that. :)

I have dealt with Dr. Holroyd numerous times and also found her to be very helpful in paleontological research.


Like you and Dr. Holroyd said, it is likely that the blackening is part of the fossilization process, but I still would love to see some photos of the horse and camel bones. The horse and camel bones are listed in the museum's collections, but as emails were forwarded from one person to another when I looked into this, the one that mentioned the horse and camel bone collections did not make it to Dr. Holroyd before she went and took photographs so we only have photos of the bison bones for now.

Whether or not the bones end up showing human interaction, in the very least the issue Massey proposed back in 1947 now has potential to be put to the test.

elbeau - 7-12-2012 at 09:55 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Hi Beau,

Of interest, my wife and I are leaving for La Paz this weekend and will be spending some time with the late Bill Massey's (step) son exploring sites in Baja California Sur.

Lot's of photos coming in 2-3 weeks!


Now you're just trying to make me jealous! :P


...it's working

David K - 7-12-2012 at 10:05 AM

Isn't it fun... I get to tease you for a change with 'lost treasure' talk! :light:

elbeau - 7-12-2012 at 10:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Taco de Baja
...As a professional archaeologist, the person who found the fossil bones would have known what to look for....Also, if there were people here longitudinally splitting bones, there would be stone tools all over the place that were used to split the bone...


As far as I can tell, we cannot yet be sure who exactly collected the bones. Massey, an archaeologist, reported on them, but Alexander, a paleontologist (who celebrated her 80th birthday during that expedition), is listed as the person who deposited the collection in the museum archives.

In either case, Massey's quote still isn't quite clear enough to say that the fossils were necessarily found by their expedition, although it is likely.

Most of what Massey reported on archaeologically was not from the area he describes for the fossils. The fossils sound like they came from the alluvial fan which leaves the possibility that any tool usage might have happened upstream rather than at the collection site. ...agian, I'm just wildly speculating here.

More on Bill Massey

David K - 7-12-2012 at 04:13 PM

In this book:



Below are the full pages, followed by a zoom in of the Massey parts for easier reading:








dtbushpilot - 7-12-2012 at 04:21 PM

Sounds like this has all the makings of a Baja adventure.....who wants to go fossil hunting?.....dt

wilderone - 8-12-2012 at 07:29 AM

who wants to go fossil hunting?.....

Me.

elbeau - wonderful history study - thanks.

David K - 8-12-2012 at 12:16 PM

Seen my pics of Day 12?

TMW - 8-12-2012 at 06:50 PM

This is the first I've heard of camels being in Baja. I thought the US Army brought them over in the late 1800s for the deserts of the southwest.

David K - 8-13-2012 at 08:22 AM

I think they are talking fossil camel bones, like from before the last ice age?

woody with a view - 8-13-2012 at 08:25 AM

maybe if this global warming thing gets off the ground the camels will return to Baja. kinda like the swallows and Capistrano......:biggrin:

BajaBlanca - 8-13-2012 at 08:34 AM

what fun ...wish I could go back in time and study archeology. the local LA BOCANA fishing cooperative has a collection of bones that one guy found - no one here can figure out what the HUGE animal the bones belonged to.

BajaNomad - 8-13-2012 at 10:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by elbeau
They are now attached to the specimen record in our online database here
<http://ucmpdb.berkeley.edu/cgi/ucmp_query2?&spec_id=V38331&one=T> and also accessible here
<http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/cgi/img_query?query_src=&where-specimen_no=V38331>"


The search times-out. Anyone wanting to recreate the search can go here:

http://ucmpdb.berkeley.edu

And search for items in Baja California Sur (over 600 listed - but only this 1 has photos associated with it) OR simply search for "Spec no." 38331.

38331 has these 5 pics with it that Dr. Holroyd took in April:

http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/imgs/512x768/0000_0000/0412/17...
http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/imgs/512x768/0000_0000/0412/17...
http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/imgs/512x768/0000_0000/0412/17...
http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/imgs/512x768/0000_0000/0412/17...
http://calphotos.berkeley.edu/imgs/512x768/0000_0000/0412/17...

wilderone - 8-14-2012 at 09:55 AM

Blanca - do you know more about the bones? Where were they found? Does he still have them? Can they be identified as thigh, neck, foot, rib, etc?

elbeau - 8-14-2012 at 03:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K
I think they are talking fossil camel bones, like from before the last ice age?


At the end of the Pleistocene/beginning of the Holocene (roughly 10,000 - 12,000) years ago, there was a massive extinction of what the call the North American megafauna. This included American horses, camels, mammoths, HUGE bison (not the puny bison we have now), massive wolves, and many other species.

The fossils found in the La Brea tar pits in L.A. are some of the best examples of what you would have found roaming Baja back then.

With how isolated Baja is, and as a result, how prone Baja is to endemic species, it would be interesting if someone could establish the timeline for when these species went extinct in Baja. It's a remote enough place that it is possible that some animals might have survived the extinction longer on the peninsula...much like recent findings that small versions of the mammoth survived on remote islands near Alaska and elsewhere until just 5,000 years ago.

David K - 8-14-2012 at 03:50 PM

Yup, I am sure there are plenty of fossils still to find in Baja... look how easy it was for ys to walk around and find 'baby' prehistoric sharks teeth. Las Pintas and Santa Catarina and El Rosario have rich fossil discoveries.

bajalera - 8-25-2012 at 07:27 PM

To update the info on the two flat boards [tablas] mentioned by Homer Aschmann, these were described in "Tabla and Atlatl:Two Unusual Artifacts from Baja California" (Vol. 8 of the Pacific Coast Archaeologial Society Quarterly, 1972) by Lee Gooding Massey [me].

[Edited on 8-26-2012 by bajalera]

wilderone - 8-26-2012 at 09:12 AM

"...species went extinct in Baja. It's a remote enough place that it is possible that some animals might have survived the extinction longer on the peninsula... "

Find Journal of Paleontology 1974, Ralph E. Molnar 48: 1009-1017
re the Cretaceous-Tertiary extinction event which occurred approx. 65.5 million years ago (K-Pg event or K-T Event).
"Scientists theorize the the K-T extinctions were caused by one or more catastrophic events, such as massive asteroid impacts or increased volcanic activity. Several impact craters and massive volcanic activity such as that in the Deccan traps, have been dated to the approxiamte time of the extinction event. These geological events may have reduced sunlight and hindered photosynthesis leading to a massive distruption in Earth's ecology. On March 4, 2010, a panel of 41 scientists agreed that the Chicxulub asteroid impact triggered the mass extinction."

Some studies relating to the age of the hadrosaurs found in two places near El Rosario, state that one site is considerably older than the others. I would gleen from this that it took hundreds of years for the extinction to occur. Also, similar hadrosaurs were found in La Jolla and Carlsbad, california, so although Baja is separated from mainland Mex, dino habitat had thousands of miles of continuous North American coast to roam - from Alaska to Cabo.
See "A Review of Pacific Coast Hadrosaurs", William J. Morris, Journal of Paleontology V.4, No. 3, p. 551-561.

David K - 8-28-2012 at 05:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajalera
To update the info on the two flat boards [tablas] mentioned by Homer Aschmann, these were described in "Tabla and Atlatl:Two Unusual Artifacts from Baja California" (Vol. 8 of the Pacific Coast Archaeologial Society Quarterly, 1972) by Lee Gooding Massey [me].

[Edited on 8-26-2012 by bajalera]


Does anyone know if this is online or does anyone have it to share?

From Internet, The Index PDF:

Vol. 8(1) January 1972
Special Baja California Number

Shells from the Coasts of Baja California, Brush Drawing
by E. M. Elliott. 8(1):Frontispiece.
Shells from the Coasts of Baja California by Helen C.
Smith. 8(1):1.
The Making of Paddle and Anvil Pottery at Santa Catarina, Baja California, Mexico by Ralph C. Michelsen
and Helen C. Smith. 8(1):2-9.
New Discoveries of Cave Paintings in Baja California by
Ernesto Raul Lopez (Translated by Aileen McKinney). 8(1):10-14.
A Multiple Horizon Cave and Surface Site: Isla de
Cedros Baja California, Mexico by Thomas Jeffrey
Banks. 8(1):15-24.
Tabla and Atlatl: Two Unusual Wooden Artifacts from Baja
California by Lee Gooding Massey. 8(1):25-34.
Notes on the La Huerta Jat́am, Baja California: Place
Names, Hunting, and Shamans by Peveril Meigs.
8(1):35-40.
Chepa: A Kiliwi by Ila Alvarez. 8(1):41-44.
The Oasis of Kadakaamang by Thomas Jeffrey Banks.
8(1):45-60.

Tabla and Atlatl: Two Unusual Wooden Artifacts from Baja California by Lee Gooding Massey. 8(1):25-34

========================================


Massey, Lee Gooding

1968 - Baja's plants and Indians. Desert Magazine, October.

1972 - Tabla and atlatl: two unusual wooden artifacts from Baja California. PCASQ 8(1):25-34.

1974 - Jesuits and Indians: a brief evaluation of three early descriptions of Baja California. PCASQ 10(1):1-12. (Informes de Venegas/Burriel, Baegert, y Clavijero.)

[Edited on 8-29-2012 by David K]

elbeau - 8-29-2012 at 11:14 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Does anyone know if this is online or does anyone have it to share?


I haven't been able to find it, even the the UT library collections. Anyone else have a copy or know where we can find it?

Taco de Baja - 8-29-2012 at 04:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by elbeau
Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Does anyone know if this is online or does anyone have it to share?


I haven't been able to find it, even the the UT library collections. Anyone else have a copy or know where we can find it?


I have a copy of the PCAS Quarterly Vol. 8(1) January 1972, and can e-mail you a scan of the Tabla and Atlatl paper. Send me a U2U.

Tablas

John M - 8-29-2012 at 05:35 PM

I have some tablas information but it'll have to wait until Friday when we get back home. John M

David K - 8-30-2012 at 10:01 AM

U2U sent... and as soon as I have them, I will post here.

BajaLera's 1972 article:

David K - 8-30-2012 at 12:10 PM

Thanks go to Taco de Baja for taking time to scan and send it to me!









The tabla is 1.45 meters long






elbeau - 9-5-2012 at 02:46 PM

Here's a news article from yesterday that relates to similar fossils recently found in Mexico:

http://www.artdaily.org/index.asp?int_sec=2&int_new=5750...

David K - 9-5-2012 at 03:47 PM

Article says that was in Hidalgo (Mainland Mexico)...

Mexican fossils

academicanarchist - 11-7-2012 at 03:04 PM

David. I was checking this old topic, and noted the discovery of fossils at Atotonilco de Tula, which is located in southern Hidalgo just south of Tula. There is a 16th century convent there I have visited several times. I would note that at several convents I have visited there are displays of fossils, such as of Mastedons.

David K - 11-7-2012 at 03:07 PM

Thanks Robert... cool you have seen them!