BajaNomad - Will our house be safe while we're away?

Will our house be safe while we're away?

ciaomary - 1-11-2013 at 11:05 AM

Is there any source for obtaining crime statistics in southern Baja?

We want to buy land and build a modest house near La Ventana. The area we want to build is mostly undeveloped still (only a dozen neighbors or so within a 1/2 mile radius.) We only want to live in the house in the winter.

It seems like our house would be very vulnerable to break-ins and thefts... and yet, so many people here do leave their homs unattended so it must be reasonably safe... right?

We do plan to take the following precautions:
- Install security/hurricane shutters (despite their high cost)
- Build our 1 bedroom, 2 floor house with security in mind (no sliding glass doors for example.)
- Install a basic battery alarm system.
- Employ a property manager to potentially rent and look after our home when we are away.
- Get a dog for when we do live here.
- Build a simple fence and gate (we do not want a fortress, just a fence.)
- Leave nothing valuable in the home while we're away aside from furnishings.

We're spending this winter here in the area to ensure we love it here (so far we do), but we so far haven't found any good source of crime information. Leaving a home unattended anywhere in this world for months on end is a big risk it seems, but we want to make this happen if the risk is reasonable.

Any advice/insight for us? We'd be very interested in the opinions of those who have done the same...

monoloco - 1-11-2013 at 11:08 AM

If you leave your house unattended and there are no neighbors in close proximity to watch it, you pretty much have about a 100% chance of being robbed.

DENNIS - 1-11-2013 at 11:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ciaomary

We want to buy land and build a modest house near La Ventana. The area we want to build is mostly undeveloped still (only a dozen neighbors or so within a 1/2 mile radius.)

Just don't bother locking your door and put everything of value in a pile on the bed. That way they won't have to toss your house looking for loot.

You should spend more time talking to your distant neighbors because you don't seem to have a clue as to the realities of the area.

desertcpl - 1-11-2013 at 11:11 AM

you need a live on premises care taker

wessongroup - 1-11-2013 at 11:17 AM

Might check this out, not sure if it fits into your life style

World’s Most Secure House: A Zombie Bunker

http://www.bitrebels.com/lifestyle/worlds-most-secure-house-...

ciaomary - 1-11-2013 at 11:30 AM

We will have some neighbors, possibly a neighbor right next door if we get the property we're after and, another right across the street that live here mostly year-round. However, the area behind is so far undeveloped and the next houses over are a couple lots away and only part-time new residents (like we'll maybe soon be.)

We may very well be clueless... that's why we're living here first and trying to talk to everyone we can, forums included, to seek out as much information as we can BEFORE we buy.

We don't find much value in subjective opinion comments that don't provide any first hand experience or background info btw.

EnsenadaDr - 1-11-2013 at 11:34 AM

sounds like the guy wanting a safe apartment in Tijuana...

wessongroup - 1-11-2013 at 11:34 AM

Been going down since 1952 ... last time down Oct 2009 to Jan 2011, take it for what it's worth

bajadreamer - 1-11-2013 at 11:41 AM

Ciaomary,
Check your U2U.

bajadreamer

monoloco - 1-11-2013 at 11:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by ciaomary
We will have some neighbors, possibly a neighbor right next door if we get the property we're after and, another right across the street that live here mostly year-round. However, the area behind is so far undeveloped and the next houses over are a couple lots away and only part-time new residents (like we'll maybe soon be.)

We may very well be clueless... that's why we're living here first and trying to talk to everyone we can, forums included, to seek out as much information as we can BEFORE we buy.

We don't find much value in subjective opinion comments that don't provide any first hand experience or background info btw.

Maybe you should come down and see what La Ventana looks like in August. It's pretty much a ghost town compared with this time of year, I wouldn't rely on neighbors being around 24/7. I know many people in La Ventana who were cleaned out in the summer, one couple had thieves chisel through their bodega, load their wheel barrow with their stuff, and go door to door in the neighborhood selling it. The realtors probably won't tell you that story though.

mcfez - 1-11-2013 at 11:46 AM

Two ways to deal with this issue.

We have a home in San Felipe that we spend less than a month a year there. The home is furnished with basic needs. No electronics. Nothing new. NEVER had a issue for ten years now :-)
http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=55461

or......

We have some land out by the hills of San Felipe....no one but a few coyotes around and a few bandits I am sure......We plan to create a small rancho there........first priority is building a small one room w/ bath, house. This will be for a caretaker......rent free. This is done in many desolated areas. You'll need someone to water your landscape as well...call in for water when you are coming down....bla bla bla

Many homes along the Sea of Cortez that are vacations homes....the crime is NOT rampid as one reads about. It does happen.....but it's not like world at it's end. Thousands enjoys this type of setting......think about that!

-Install security/hurricane shutters (despite their high cost)
Bars may help you sense of security....but wont help if your home is out in the boonies.

- Build our 1 bedroom, 2 floor house with security in mind (no sliding glass doors for example.)
Cheaper to stay at the Mexicali jail.

- Install a basic battery alarm system.
And who is going to show up :-) More false sense of security

- Employ a property manager to potentially rent and look after our home when we are away.
Most likely will be your first issue to have...is with these so called property managers that have zero licenses. You really expect then to overlook your home 24/7? We have a on site property girl.....she does our bills for water and power.

- Get a dog for when we do live here.
Stop believing that all of Baja is evil infected with murderers and rapist! Take a dog for companionship ....in fact.....adopt one from the many rescues in Baja. Again....there are THOUSANDS of folks living in Baja that dont have issues :-)

- Build a simple fence and gate (we do not want a fortress, just a fence.)
Great idea to keep the neighbors dog from pooping in your yard.......otherwise worthless to keep the bad guy out.

- Leave nothing valuable in the home while we're away aside from furnishings.
This is true!!!!!!

Make sure your rent for a year where ever you end up deciding to build. Ask many questions. Then ask more!

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by mcfez]

DavidE - 1-11-2013 at 11:48 AM

A house sitter is the way to go, but make sure they do not plan to go away for days at a time. Nevertheless, bars on the windows, sliding or swinging bar doors on the entryways. ENCLOSE entryway padlocks with a 3-sided steel box welded onto the bars making bolt cutter access impossible.

Without this AND a vigilant neighbor or two I would offer odds of 00.00% that the home would not be stripped of every single screw leaving only scarred concrete.

MMc - 1-11-2013 at 12:16 PM

I would ask this to everybody you meet while you are there. We all have our agendas here and there is nothing like the local knowledge. My house in Baja Norte was broken into twice. After the first time the shades were always pulled back so the neighbors could see in, and the thief could see there wasn't much to take. The second time a guest didn't lock the door while we at the beach. oops.
If a new thief shows up, all bets are off. Myself and many others in my community got to know the cops and made offering to their Christmas club. It helped hold their interest when we maid a report them.
Yes there is a high chance that your place will be checked out.

mtgoat666 - 1-11-2013 at 12:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wessongroup
Might check this out, not sure if it fits into your life style

World’s Most Secure House: A Zombie Bunker

http://www.bitrebels.com/lifestyle/worlds-most-secure-house-...

great design, i like the modernist look when it's set down in pretty desert and surrounded by open space. but looks pricy to build those large sliding concrete panels.

mcfez - 1-11-2013 at 12:21 PM

Come on Wily......this is really the bunker you had constructed.....to place JoeJustJoe in....... once you capture him. :lol:

Quote:

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by mcfez]

grizzlyfsh95 - 1-11-2013 at 12:28 PM

Quote:

O
We may very well be clueless... that's why we're living here first and trying to talk to everyone we can, forums included, to seek out as much information as we can BEFORE we buy.

We don't find much value in subjective opinion comments that don't provide any first hand experience or background info btw.

You will find plenty of that (subjective opinion) on this site. :lol:

Pompano - 1-11-2013 at 12:29 PM

Ciao. Welcome to this forum...and brace yourself!

BajaNomads has many members with great experiences.

Mary, your closest neighbors are the best source for crime statistics in your area. They have a vested interest in maintaining good information. Of course, you already know this and one would assume you have already been advised.

I've owned 3 different homes in Baja Sur over the last 35 years and had one break-in. The odds are I should have had more...but i'm not knocking it...except to knock on wood. If and when it does happen....a large reward for the imprisonment of any perp breaking into your home is a good method of deterring further crimes.

Take heart and give it a try. Anything worthwhile usually has risks. Living in Baja is well worth the risk.

Martyman - 1-11-2013 at 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by wessongroup
Been going down since 1952 ... last time down Oct 2009 to Jan 2011, take it for what it's worth

Ain't worth much since we don't know what you are saying.

Martyman - 1-11-2013 at 12:36 PM

A friend who was in the security business told me a very loud alarm works well. Try and get one of those speakers off the top of the cars that drive throughout Mexico selling crapola.

micah202 - 1-11-2013 at 12:49 PM

...just in case you're not aware of it yet,,,here's the address to ventana's daily email newspaper........occasional theft reports in there
ventana.view2@gmail.com,,,put 'subscribe' as the subject.......cheers

.......personally,,I'd go with the idea of a nice RV--you can store it for ~$200/year at Pablo's when you're not around,,,move it when your interests change,,,,or perhaps get a peice of land when you decide where you want to be.

...RV storage is very low price!

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by micah202]

gnukid - 1-11-2013 at 01:08 PM

It's possible to build everything from cement and have no appliances or anything worth stealing. In la ventana and el sargento there are many many home robberies in the summer. Even a person living there has to leave sometimes and the robbers will steal everything and the police are of no help out there at all. I caught robbers in the act a few times and brought the police who refused to do anything. But there are many happy people there, a method that works is to have a super secure bodega and put things in there like the fridge and stove and leave the rest basically open. Even a motor home will get broken into or infested by rats. So less is more in this case unless you are in a closed and secure community like Mister Bills. We put everything in a big old van that doesn't even run and leave it at Pablos then we tow it each year to where we use the stuff.

Robbers will break through cement and metal, nothing can stop them except having nothing they want. I did see hurricane door/window coverings that are pretty strong.

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by gnukid]

micah202 - 1-11-2013 at 01:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by gnukid
It's possible to build everything from cement and have no appliances or anything worth stealing. In la ventana and el sargento there are many many home robberies in the summer. Even a person living there has to leave sometimes and the robbers will steal everything and the police are of no help out there at all. I caught robbers in the act a few times and brought the police who refused to do anything. But there are many happy people there, a method that works is to have a super secure bodega and put things in there like the fridge and stove and leave the rest basically open. Even a motor home will get broken into or infested by rats. So less is more in this case unless you are in a closed and secure community like Mister Bills. We put everything in a big old van that doesn't even run and leave it at Pablos then we tow it each year to where we use the stuff.

Robbers will break through cement and metal, nothing can stop them except having nothing they want. I did see hurricane door/window coverings that are pretty strong.

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by gnukid]

...have you heard of motorhomes being robbed while in Pablo's or am I quoting you wrong?

Robbers????

bajaguy - 1-11-2013 at 02:19 PM

I'm pretty much thinking we are referring to "burglars".....there is a difference.

Now back to your scheduled programming........

shari - 1-11-2013 at 03:05 PM

much depends on the area you plan to live. Some expats here put plywood over all entrances the 6 months they are away and have had no problemas at all. Generally tweakers wont be bothered to unscrew alot of screws but opt for easier jobs....this way all the windows are safe too from being broken...the plywood also is used for hurricaine protection as well...and way cheaper than storm shutters. We now plan our new window sizes to accommodate plywood sheets.

But as mentioned no matter what you do if someone wants to break in...they will...house sitters are the best bet...but real hard to find and come with their own issues sometimes.

Just My Two Cents

Gypsy Jan - 1-11-2013 at 03:31 PM

After almost two decades in the Northern Baja gringo strip and being robbed three times (once when we were in residence).

You are going to build your house hiring local workers. They will know the intimate details of your house and go home to discuss the daily events with their family, because you will be an exotic and interesting addition to the area and anything you will be of interest. A local telenovela.

Now, that is not necessarily bad, if you have good people working for you and if they don't have greedy relatives/acquaintances looking to go through the "feelthy rich" gringo stuff. It doesn't matter how modest you consider your possessions, the people living around you have so much less.

A live-in caretaker is the best idea. BUT, how do you figure out if he/she/they are reliable. You have to spend a great deal of time with them and go with your gut.

Dogs are another great suggestion, but they need to be fed and cared for and have a connection to your property, so, the live-in caretaker is still part of the scenario.

Vacant second homes in Europe routinely have roll-down metal shutters and serious alarm systems and security guard patrols. That sounds too expensive for your plans.

Loud alarms with nothing to back it up quickly become useless - the neighbors are gone, dead asleep or colluding. The guys watching your house will simply wait it out and come back.

I am not trying to discourage you, just trying to give you facts. Our friend who lived (notice the past tense) in a somewhat remote area in the highlands above Ensenada had to leave his house closed down to go to the States for knee replacement surgery. He planned ahead, informed his neighbors who could see his house clearly, he had two dogs (wolf/hybrids) and a guy who came everyday to feed the dogs; still, when he returned home, he found the house stripped - they took all the major and minor appliances, the toilets, the sinks and the copper wiring and the windows.

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by Gypsy Jan]

BajaBlanca - 1-11-2013 at 03:39 PM

dang. maybe come to la bocana instead. when there are thefts, we all know who it was and his dad comes around and pays you for whatever wasn't recovered and returned.

I kid you not.

ciaomary - 1-11-2013 at 05:24 PM

This has been helpful, thanks everyone for all the replies (well, most everyone.)

It sounds like to live this dream, without constant worry, we'd need an onsite caretaker. Unfortunately, I think that would be pretty hard to come by here. In the perfect world, we could find a few others also interested in this idea, and together we could build houses next to each other and we would share a year-round onsite caretaker. I think that is what some of the long-timers do here, but I'll have to find out more.

I think it's a great suggestion to whomever said that you can build the bodega in such a way that you need minimal furnishings. The place we're renting has a cement couch, bed, shelves. This means that only the mattresses and actual built in items (like the toilet and sink) can be stolen. Such a great idea, and it looks much nicer than it probably sounds too when done right!

mcfez - 1-11-2013 at 07:00 PM

Look at this site if you are looking for a retirement location
http://www.escapefromamerica.com/
Good luck on your decisions......

[Edited on 1-12-2013 by mcfez]

Osprey - 1-11-2013 at 07:08 PM

The Delivery

My uncle Judd moved to Mexico many moons ago. He was always a little quirky so the family was not surprised. He bought a lot in south central Baja California in a little town right on the beach. Had a house built there, hauled down a boat and a trailer full of stuff and hunkered down to fish and vegetate. I meant to go down there, visit with him, see the place, maybe go fishing but I’ve been busy up here in the states and just never got around to it until now.

My dad had some guns that belonged to uncle Judd and when I inherited all my dad’s hunting and fishing stuff I really wasn’t sure which was which. Then Judd sent me some Emails with serial numbers and I was able to match up three of them. He said he wanted me to drive down, bring the guns, do some fishing. I asked him if I would get in trouble if the Mexicans found the guns in my car and he assured me that the letter he was going to send me, giving specific permission, would be enough to satisfy them. It looked official enough but I don’t read Spanish so I really don’t know what the hell it said.

Looks like ole Judd really knows his way around down there because I had no trouble getting in – I hid the guns and ammo in a safe place in the truck, got the green light and was on my way. The kids with the automatic weapons spooked me a little at the military stops but, again, Judd had clued me in and there was no trouble on the road. So two days and nights and I found my way to Judd’s place. It was just after dusk. He sent me several maps and I had his cell number; I called him a bunch of times on the trip but there was no answer.

It would have been hard for me not to recognize the house because Judd had sent me some pix in Email messages so I knew I had the right house. Bunch of lights came on when I parked near the huge metal gate. There was a high wall around the whole property and more lights shined off the party colored bits of broken bottles cemented all along the top.

Then I heard “Butch, is that you? Go back to the truck and honk three times, then turn the truck lights off, walk back to the gate stand in the circle of light.”

So I did and after a minute or two he came out and let me in. We opened the big gate and I swung the truck into his big garage. The house was big, two stories with big steel doors and bars on all the windows. As I followed him into the living area, as we passed down a hall, through a small atrium with a fountain he stopped and put some weapons back into little hiding places.

“Judd, I’ve been calling you of and on for two days. No answer.”

“Sorry Butch, I ran out of minutes and I’ve been so busy here I just didn’t have time to go get more time on the cell phone.”

“What’s with all the lights and security, the hidden guns, have you been robbed, burglarized?”

“Nope, just better to be safe than sorry. I’ve got stuff all over. Near the rear door and the garage door I’ve got some weapons handy, some mace, wasp spray. I got most of the stuff down here but the ammo is really hard to come by.”

“I didn’t know the cartels were active this far down. Most of the news about the kidnappings and killings says they are along the border and in some places on the mainland.”

“Well Butch, we don’t have much protection down here. The police are a joke and bad guys can just roam up and down the peninsula without being noticed, then strike any rich gringo they see who hasn’t protected himself properly.”

“But what about when you’re out and about? You don’t stay in the house all the time. You must go out to fish, visit friends, go shopping, buy things for the house, stuff to maintain the place, the cars, and the boat.”

“Yeah but when I do leave, I have some weapons in the vehicles, some mace, some pepper spray and the house is really buttoned up tight.”

“Uncle Judd, all that sounds like a lot of trouble, a real pain in the butt. And who writes you a nice official letter if you get caught with those guns? Can’t they lock you up for that, deport you, maybe take the house?”

He got us both a beer from the fridge and we sat down on his big leather couch in the great room. “It’s a little risky but I’m used to it and it’s worth it to me just to be living down here in paradise.”

We didn’t go fishing. In fact, after coffee the next morning I told my uncle I had to get back, had some work I left unfinished. By the time he unlocked and deactivated and unsecured the place enough for me to get my truck back outside the big steel gate I was more than ready to head back up the highway.

Some paradise. He can have it. Anybody lives like that on purpose is just one taquito shy of a Mexican combo. Maybe when Judd decided this was the place to retire, he didn’t look at other options.

joerover - 1-11-2013 at 07:38 PM

Dont build.. ... .. rent
Next year rent in Chiapas or ¡¿
the year after that rent in Guatemala or¿¿¿¿

Bring a bag with a change of clothes in it, nothing else.
This works

gnukid - 1-11-2013 at 08:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by micah202

Quote:

...have you heard of motorhomes being robbed while in Pablo's or am I quoting you wrong?

No nothing has ever been stolen from Pablos, never in my experience. Generally most people do just fine there, so don't get the wrong idea. Just be reasonable and skip the big screen tv.

vacaenbaja - 1-11-2013 at 10:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaBlanca
dang. maybe come to la bocana instead. when there are thefts, we all know who it was and his dad comes around and pays you for whatever wasn't recovered and returned.

I kid you not.

So much for crime and punishment.

[Edited on 1-12-2013 by vacaenbaja]

MMc - 1-11-2013 at 10:49 PM

I knew a missionary that was in Mongolia he left all his stuff in a locked cargo container for 3 months when he got back the locks had been cut. The next year he had the container welded shut. When he came back they had ground off the welds. Because he American he was viewed as having more. It is what it is!

BajaBlanca - 1-12-2013 at 06:51 AM

ciaomary - the best advice, in my opinion, is to spend time at la ventana and get a feel for the area before committing. Finding a caretaker is not so hard, esp. if you build a little bungalow, you might even find someone who wants to stay rent-free.

Best of luck finding your piece of paradise.

Osprey - good story, as always!

Marla Daily - 1-12-2013 at 07:13 AM

EZ removal of window bars Baja-style:

Position a GATO (car jack) between the bars and wall and simply
engage the jack until the bars come out of the wall.

We learned this the hard way. Adding insult to injury, they broke into our Land Cruiser and used our jack to gain entry! I thought it was
pretty clever, actually.

bajalinda - 1-12-2013 at 07:48 AM

ciaomary - well, have you thought about (...shudder, gasp...) a gated community? Perhaps you should consider it if you are really concerned about security. I'm not sure what there is along those lines in the Ventana/El Sargento area. If that's not your cup of tea, then go into this with a realistic understanding that you'll have to deal with the apparently inevitable summer break-ins.

zoesterone - 1-12-2013 at 08:13 AM

Quote:

The "clueless" post was rude and unnecessary as obviously you are trying to do your homework.

willardguy - 1-12-2013 at 11:02 AM

it wouldnt be right if I didnt throw in my two cents, so we know physical security is expensive and vulnerable. I strongly suggest electronic security. yeah yeah all the nomad security experts have claimed there useless. I'll tell you what, even the most brazen burglar isnt gonna stay around when a couple 150db master blasters go off. just beware, dont test the system with children in the home, there will will be ear damage! and you'll never see your dogs again!
(40+years in home security)

Marla Daily - 1-12-2013 at 11:48 AM

And we know of a case where very sophisticated electric fencing was installed. Thieves simply put a long piece of rebar against two wires and shorted out the system. Easy entry after that.

willardguy - 1-12-2013 at 11:53 AM

or you just cut the red wire! or is it the blue wire? :?:

durrelllrobert - 1-12-2013 at 12:15 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Marla Daily
EZ removal of window bars Baja-style:

Position a GATO (car jack) between the bars and wall and simply
engage the jack until the bars come out of the wall.

We learned this the hard way. Adding insult to injury, they broke into our Land Cruiser and used our jack to gain entry! I thought it was
pretty clever, actually.

Assuming that you have electricity hook 120 volts directly to the bars via a big switch to turn on whenever you leave the house. When you come home and find bodies don't call the police; just drag them down the street somewhere and leave them.

Pompano - 1-12-2013 at 12:30 PM

Nothing stops a determined burglar...nothing.

Scare tactics will stop the timid. Here's an old-fashioned burglar deterrent on the Serinadad's rear walls. Ugly as can be, and delivers a pointed message.

Requires bleach clean-up.

Personally, if I had to resort to this, I wouldn't be there.

vandenberg - 1-12-2013 at 12:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by durrelllrobert
Assuming that you have electricity hook 120 volts directly to the bars via a big switch to turn on whenever you leave the house. When you come home and find bodies don't call the police; just drag them down the street somewhere and leave them.

Since 120V won't kill too many people, or even deter too many, you must put a tub of water in front of those windows with a sign " Please don't stand here ". :biggrin:

All lowlifes will defy your request of course and will perish.

[Edited on 1-12-2013 by vandenberg]

deportes - 1-12-2013 at 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by micah202
...just in case you're not aware of it yet,,,here's the address to ventana's daily email newspaper........occasional theft reports in there
ventana.view2@gmail.com,,,put 'subscribe' as the subject.......cheers

.......personally,,I'd go with the idea of a nice RV--you can store it for ~$200/year at Pablo's when you're not around,,,move it when your interests change,,,,or perhaps get a peice of land when you decide where you want to be.

...RV storage is very low price!

Where is Pablo's place?

[Edited on 1-11-2013 by micah202]

monoloco - 1-12-2013 at 01:21 PM

Quote:

They'd just take the copper wire. :lol:

High Voltage Electric Fence?

Gypsy Jan - 1-12-2013 at 02:23 PM

Please correct me if I am misinformed, but I have been told that this is illegal in Mexico, that the homeowner who installs that kind of system will be liable for any injuries or deaths resulting from contact with such system.

Some Have To Be More Determined Than Others...

DavidE - 1-12-2013 at 04:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pompano
Nothing stops a determined burglar...nothing.

Scare tactics will stop the timid.

[img]httphttp://hardcorehogdogs.com/images/f41fda9c69b919c20551815fd8e23707_0dyt.png://[/img]

DENNIS - 1-12-2013 at 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Gypsy Jan
Please correct me if I am misinformed, but I have been told that this is illegal in Mexico, that the homeowner who installs that kind of system will be liable for any injuries or deaths resulting from contact with such system.

That sounds more like California than Mexico.

Sandlefoot - 1-12-2013 at 07:10 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

That sounds more like California than Mexico.

As long as you drag the bodies away and don't "tell-a-phone, tell-a-graph, or tell-a-cop", who is going to enforce such a law? :biggrin: