BajaNomad

bacquito

David K - 4-2-2013 at 04:34 PM

Hi Ron... are you going for another climb?

Graham - 4-4-2013 at 09:51 AM

Wow! I'm impressed. What's the latest on your Picacho attempt?

Will you be coming up Canyon Diablo or dropping down to Campo Noche from the forested plateau?

I was thinking about an attempt to climb the peak or get as far up as I'm able, but earliest I could go is mid-May.

David K - 4-4-2013 at 10:39 AM

How cool would that be!:bounce:

Desert Rat was so inspired by Graham's first book, he attempted to follow the route of Graham, in 1994: http://www.vivabaja.com/desert_rat/index.html

Desert Rat - 4-4-2013 at 12:02 PM

Hi Graham. I'm still waiting to hear from Bacquito concerning the trip. I am choosing the Diablo Canyon route because I know the route. I do not know the route from the Parque plateau but I could probably figure it out. Three years ago, I drove to the Parque to make an attempt but the ranger said that there was a new regulation stating that all Picacho climbers using the Botella Azul route must have an official guide with them. I was alone at the time so I did not do the hike. Possibly, I could have made the attempt without a guide and not get caught, but I didn't want to take the chance. I don't know what the penalty would have been. The Diablo Canyon route is not controlled by the Parque rangers therefore no guide is required. This is why I'm choosing the Canyon route. Besides, the canyon is a great hiking experience. If Bacquito cannot make the trip with me during April and you still have the desire to make an attempt in May, I would like to go with you.

And.......Yes, David K, that would be "cool!"

Ateo - 4-4-2013 at 12:26 PM

You guys are hard core. Just looking a that peak almost made me pee my pants last year.

Picacho del Diablo, 10,154'

David K - 4-4-2013 at 04:15 PM

Climbing route details: http://www.dankat.com/swhikes/devil.htm

Map: http://www.dankat.com/swhikes/maps/devil.htm

Photos: http://www.dankat.com/swhikes/slides/devil.htm

JohnMcfrog - 4-4-2013 at 06:19 PM

I remember Campo Noche and the big day from there to the peak. I had some climbing shoes and they worked on the big rock slabs. The guide hugged me at the top and broke my $100 glasses. Will knew the route and it was a good hike. We bivouac'd at the peak and I had a bag that wasn't up to the test. Was into a 25 minute cycle where I put my head in the bag, slept and then woke up paranoid in the dark, repeat, repeat... The next week a guy got hit by a snake 1.5 inches between the fangs. I never saw a snake there, but they are supposedly more aggressive than most. The terrain is so similar that it was hard to get your bearings without the aids of gps etc. This was in the early 80's.



Juanito

[Edited on 4-5-2013 by JohnMcfrog]

Graham - 4-4-2013 at 06:54 PM

Yes, Picacho Diablo has been both calling me and intimidating me for years. I must have looked across at it thirty or forty times... dreaming!

Thanks for all the advice and info... U2U me Desert Rat if you want to have a go. This is a trip I definitely wouldn't do alone. Quite prepared to accept failure if it's beyond me. All you can do is try and relish every moment!

Graham - 4-7-2013 at 09:00 AM

Great picture John... inspiring to see you there at the top.

When you see Picacho from across the park it looks like a relatively simple approach from the plateau.



But as you get closer you realize there is a dizzying descent to Canyon Diablo to be tackled first.




And in places it looks almost impossible - not a good place to get lost. This picture with Picacho in the background gives a good idea of how steep the drop is from the park side into the canyon.



Once you're down all you have to do is climb thousands of feet up an almost sheer wall of boulders and rock.

To be able to stand on top and see what John saw will indeed be a fantastic achievement.

And if all else fails... it's good to know the condors will be looking out for you!


JohnMcfrog - 4-7-2013 at 01:08 PM

Love your pictures Graham..

Juanito

nandopedal - 4-8-2013 at 08:22 AM

A bit of info for the Picacho crowd, there is a guy by the name Francisco Detrell certified with the park he is in Ensenada, Ecotours is the name of his outfit if ever interested to tackle the "hill" from the West he is the person to go to, his fee is very reasonable for what he offers. I personally can vouch for his services, I have summited twice unfortunately I am very compu challenged so I don't know how to post pictures:no:

Graham - 4-8-2013 at 10:34 AM

Thanks Juanito. I bet you've got some more amazing shots from the peak.

And thanks Nandopedal for the tip about the guide... appreciate the recommendation.

Graham - 4-8-2013 at 10:54 AM

This is how Picacho Diablo appears before dropping into the canyon... almost seems close enough to touch!

But looking down into the awesome expanse of Canyon Diablo will quickly free your mind of the illusion.


JohnMcfrog - 4-8-2013 at 04:24 PM

Graham,

I had posted some other pics. Here is a blog which encapsulates a previous post here. http://johnfrogsblog.blogspot.com/2012/08/highway-1-brings-m... If I ever go thru my slides and find anything else, will get in contact.

Juanito

Desert Rat - 4-8-2013 at 10:11 PM

Don Jorge, Our attempt to climb Picacho made for great memories. The canyon hike was quite a challenge but it was well worth it. I will always be grateful for your help in getting me to Campo Noche and up Night Wash. This next attempt coming up in May could be the winner. Thanks for cheeriing us on.

David K - 4-12-2013 at 09:39 AM

Ron, you have a big cheering crowd wishing you success or just good adventure! :bounce::bounce::light:

bacquito - 4-12-2013 at 07:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by nandopedal
A bit of info for the Picacho crowd, there is a guy by the name Francisco Detrell certified with the park he is in Ensenada, Ecotours is the name of his outfit if ever interested to tackle the "hill" from the West he is the person to go to, his fee is very reasonable for what he offers. I personally can vouch for his services, I have summited twice unfortunately I am very compu challenged so I don't know how to post pictures:no:


I tried to call Francisco Detrell but the number was no longer in service.

nandopedal - 4-13-2013 at 07:17 PM

@ BAQUITO, I believe you can look him up on Facebook if the phone# is no longer, also google "ecoturs", yes just like that turs not tours and you should be able to get an e-mail address, I have not talk with him in about five years, good luck.

Desert Rat & Graham Mackintosh on the mountain!

David K - 5-24-2013 at 07:56 AM

Got the first SPOT signal last night:


David K - 5-24-2013 at 02:10 PM

I will be out of town camping for the 3 day weekend, so no daily SPOT maps until I get back, unless someone else can... I wish them great fun... and I will be seeing Diablo from our camp (I hope)!

MexicoTed - 5-24-2013 at 04:26 PM

I can vouch for Francisco Detrell too. He is a great guy, knows Baja well and I have been with him for a couple great trips. He also guided one of the hosts for the former Lonely Planet TV show and used to guide A-16 Travel groups too. The last email I had for him was ecoturbc@gmail.com. Tell him Ted Donovan says hi!!

On Blue Bottle 5-27-13

David K - 5-27-2013 at 10:13 PM

I received the second SPOT signal today from Graham (a bit after 2pm) and it looks like thay are on Blue Bottle Mountain/ Peak... Note the topo map below shows two Picacho del Diablos. The true one is the top-right/ northern one with 'Cerro' in front.

What we don't yet know is if they made the climb and forgot to send a spot until getting back to Blue Bottle (which is on the main ridge)... or they have yet to try...???


nandopedal - 5-28-2013 at 09:34 AM

It doesn't appear that they are using the desert route, if you look at the spot on the 24th and 27th they both appear to be on the West ridge of the canyon? I was up on the park this weekend but did not see them, we did see a few mexicans trying for a 24 hour or less record from the West.

David K - 5-28-2013 at 06:29 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by nandopedal
It doesn't appear that they are using the desert route, if you look at the spot on the 24th and 27th they both appear to be on the West ridge of the canyon? I was up on the park this weekend but did not see them, we did see a few mexicans trying for a 24 hour or less record from the West.


Correct, as you can see from Graham's first Spot map, they are going from the SPM plateau, not the San Felipe desert up.

As of 6:30 pm, no third SPOT message from Graham.

Graham - 5-29-2013 at 01:53 PM

It didn’t go quite according to plan but what a fantastic Baja adventure.


Roger (Bacquito)and Ronnie (Desert Rat)

And what a pair of tough old Nomads for companions. About now Ronnie (Desert Rat ), Roger (Bacquito) and I were hoping to be safely returning to camp after standing on top of Picacho Diablo, Baja’s awesome high point.

Roger was good enough to let us leave our vehicles at his house in Ensenada and then drove us to the park. Ronnie had driven all the way from his home in Laredo, Texas.

We arrived at the San Pedro Martir on May 23, and set out mid-morning on Friday, May 24 to begin the long, heavy haul from the Padre Kino campsite with 5-6 days supply of food and a few pints of water each.


Roger and Ronnie

We intended to camp at the Botella Azul trailhead, and then next evening down at the bottom of Canyon Diablo, at Campo Noche, where there is plenty of water.

Temps were in the upper 70s during the day as we made our way through the pine and aspen forest. It was predictably tough going with rugged, steep slopes and many fallen trees to deal with.


Roger again leading the way.

As agreed, we settled on an easy pace to minimize risk of injury and we all knew the odds were long that we would make it all the way to the summit, and we might not even make it to Campo Noche.



Five hours or so into the attempt, at a spring before we reached Blue Bottle, we caught up with a party of Mexican hikers who were en route to Picacho. While they pushed on we filtered water and assessed our situation. Thinking about what we had passed through and the long steep drop to the canyon bottom ahead, and the rapidly deteriorating condition of his boots, Roger reluctantly but very wisely decided to abandon his quest, camp for the night by the spring and return to camp next morning.


Purifying water at the spring

Ronnie at 70 knew if he didn’t go for the summit now, it would probably never happen. So we agreed that he would continue, hoping to hook up with the Mexican party ahead, and I would return with Roger the next morning.

A couple of hours later Ronnie made it all the way to the Blue Bottle trailhead and met the group there. They kindly agreed to let him join them… but Ronnie, worried that he might slow them down, decided to race the night all the way back to where we were camped.

It was dark before he found us and he eventually made camp alone just a few hundred yards from where we were.

Luckily, Roger and I were in no hurry to leave next morning, and Ronnie wandered up just as we were finishing breakfast and packing up.

Ironically, at midnight that night, by the light of a full moon, a couple of young Mexicans set out from Padre Kino attempting to set a record for the fastest roundtrip climb of Picacho Diablo from the Kino campground. They had support crew at Blue Bottle, at Campo Noche and up on Picacho. We heard the two record chasers rushing by around 1 AM. What took us five hours took them a little over one! [I’ll post the story and pictures in a separate thread]

In spite of our disappointment, it was a good feeling to be all back together... and after 4 or 5 hours safely back in camp.


Graham looking across Canyon Diablo

While Roger recovered, Ronnie and I explored the edge of Canyon Diablo and peered wistfully over at the peak, examining the route we hoped to one day take. And just for a few moments we caught sight of a figure standing triumphantly on the summit. We guessed correctly it was one of the party that Ronnie nearly joined.



We were back in camp to applaud the record setting duo’s triumphant return. They had made it there and back in just over 15 hours where they were greeted by their friends and family and “observers.” There was quite a party and celebration with beer and wonderful food. We were graciously invited to partake. The quesadillas and ceviche were great after a day subsisting on trail mix and cereal bars.


The record setting team and some of their support crew and gringo guests.

Last day, Ronnie and I hiked to the top of Blue Bottle to further contemplate the route to Picacho and dream and scheme about another attempt.


Desert Rat gazing down to the desert from Blue Bottle



Approaching the top of Blue Bottle

Roger felt terrible about not going further but at least he tried and bravely hiked as far as he did, a fantastic achievement at 72. He was sensible enough to know his limits and take heed of what his legs were telling him.

And I felt privileged to camp in the peace of the San Pedro Martir with two amazing Baja Nomads… listening to tales of Roger’s life as an agricultural inspector and Ronnie’s teaching and army service with a heavy mortar battalion and the 82nd Airborne.

As they say, the journey is sometimes more important than the destination. It was a peak experience even if we didn’t make it to the top of Baja.

Mexitron - 5-29-2013 at 02:42 PM

Sounds like you had a great time anyway----way to go for at least trying! I might want to try Picacho one of these years before I get too old.

Barry A. - 5-29-2013 at 03:08 PM

Well, I certainly understand your feelings-------back in 1954 or 55 I stood at Blue Bottle with Edward "Bud" Bernhard and felt exactly like you probably did, but I lost my resolve also----------the chasm between us on Blue Bottle and the main peak was just awe-inspiring and intrepid, steep and rough, and I knew right then that I was never going to climb that peak from the west side. We sat on Blue Bottle for over an hour-----just comtemplating. I was 16 or 17 at the time. I had already climbed Mt. Whitney, and many other peaks, but THIS mountain was just formidable and beyond my nerve and stamina to climb, and I knew it. Bud Climbed that mountain many times (but then he was super-man), and pioneered several routes up her. And later next year, or so, NOMAD "Vince" had topped it with Bud and other's, and I was blown away with his accomplishment.

Well done, guys, and thanks for the photos and reports.

Barry

David K - 5-29-2013 at 05:42 PM

Thanks for the post Graham... We were on Shell Island looking at Diablo at sundown Saturday and Sunday nights wondering if you guys were looking at us! Better to have enjoyed the time where you were than risk injury when you aren't sure. I was concerned when I only got the two SPOT signals, but glad to hear you and the other Nomads are safe. I traveled with Desert Rat for a week, back in 2001... isn't he a riot!? :spingrin:

Graham - 5-29-2013 at 06:31 PM

So glad you were monitoring and sharing our Spot signals David. Muchas Gracias!

We had a great view of the desert and the Sea of Cortez from on top of Botella Azul... and probably were gazing right down on all the fun you were having.

Yes, Bacquito and Desert Rat were amazing. Hiking some of the wildest, most rugged country out there in their 70s.

I tell you, they breed them tough in the 82nd. I gave Ronnie an hour's head start when we went to Blue Bottle, thinking I'd catch him in an hour, two at the most. I didn't reach him till we were on the final rise to the peak. I was humbled by his stamina.





BajaBlanca - 5-29-2013 at 06:56 PM

If my jaw were not attached to my mouth, it would be on the floor, shattered.

Congratulations, what an incredible endeavor! There is no way i wd even try. What a mountain!

nandopedal - 5-30-2013 at 06:56 AM

Hi there Graham, if I only would have known that you guys were up there on that weekend!.......I was up there the same time, we were hiking and mountain biking, I am happy for you guys, with the help of a little perspective you did summit....Botella Azul. Cheers mate! In case you are wondering I am Fernando from the College area :D

Graham - 5-30-2013 at 12:04 PM

Hola Fernando. What a pity we didn’t meet up there… Hope you had a wonderful time. I was really grateful for all the good advice you gave us.

You’re right, the hike and view from Botella Azul was well worth the trip. Fantastic breathtaking scenery. Gave us a good perspective on what the climb to Picacho entails. I was able to take pictures of the steep slopes and challenges leading to the peak.


Ronnie on Blue Bottle checking out the approaches.



Detail of Picacho just below the summit


And before anything, you just have to drop down into the canyon... then find the energy to make it all the way up the other side... and then some!


Barry A. - 5-30-2013 at 01:46 PM

-------and Graham, unless you have made arrangements to be picked up at the bottom down Diablo Canyon, after climbing to the peak you have to come all the way back down, and then up out of Diable Canyon back to Blue Bottle----------it's like climbing two seperate mountains.. THAT is what always deterred me from the attempt.

-----and the speed-climbers do all that in ONE DAY?!?!?!?!? Truly amazing!!!!

All the photos are truly incredible, and show the beauty of that entire area. Thank you.

Barry

David K - 5-30-2013 at 04:32 PM

Indeed... Wonderful photos Graham!

I need to go search for BajaAndy's panorama photos he took from the top of Diablo a few years ago. ... I hope they are still on Nomad...

Great, here are the two threads from 'bajaandy':

Panorama from Diablo, 2007: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=24340

Top of Baja, 2007: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=24221

[Edited on 5-30-2013 by David K]

bacquito - 5-30-2013 at 05:41 PM

Thanks for the posting Graham, if I learned one thing it is that my legs are shot! One of the highlights of the trip is meeting both Ron and you and seeing some pretty country.
It is strange that less than two years ago my stepson and I hiked Blue Bottle and Mirador a few days apart.
I felt bad about abandoning my effort so soon after my attempt but I was exhausted and felt I was a danger to myself and others.
No mas Picacho from now on it is water sports (swimming and kayaking) and casual walking.
Thanks for sharing your time with me Ron and Graham!

bacquito - 5-30-2013 at 05:44 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Mexitron
Sounds like you had a great time anyway----way to go for at least trying! I might want to try Picacho one of these years before I get too old.


Yes, go for it while your young enough. I waited too long.

bajaandy - 5-30-2013 at 09:30 PM

Awesome pictures! And a fantastic attempt by all of you! As you said, it's not always the destination, but the journey that makes the trip. How grand a place to hike and camp is the San Pedro Martir. Congratulations on your trip. I know only too well the feeling of defeat on Diablo. The first year I attempted it, we made it to Campo Noche and then got horribly off route when we started the actual climb. The following year, we did much better and actually made the summit. It truly is an awe inspiring peak for more than one reason. Again, congratulations on your trip!

Maderita - 5-30-2013 at 10:29 PM

Thanks for ther TR (trip report) and excellent photos!
Going to the summit of Blue Bottle is a wonderful hike. If the goal is to get out and have fun, you succeeded 100%. From Blue Bottle to the summit of Picacho del Diablo it's just a lot of work. All for maybe 50' - 100' of interesting third-class slab.

Did you find out about the official regulations or permit process for climbing Picacho del Diablo? Did you go covert?

Should you guys want to stretch your legs on some superb slab climbs on perfect granite, hit me up. Only a 15 minute approach! 5.3 (beginner level) or harder if you prefer, with hundreds of routes to choose from. The summer temps at 5,000' are usually mild enough.

David K - 5-31-2013 at 10:46 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by nandopedal
Hi there Graham, if I only would have known that you guys were up there on that weekend!.......I was up there the same time, we were hiking and mountain biking, I am happy for you guys, with the help of a little perspective you did summit....Botella Azul. Cheers mate! In case you are wondering I am Fernando from the College area :D


nandopedal (Fernando) just emailed me his photos at the top of Diablo Mountain to share with everyone...










nandopedal - 5-31-2013 at 11:40 AM

Thanks David, I forgot to describe so here it goes: The first two are looking NE and SE respectively, third one is looking straight towards the observatory, 4th one is.......wait a minute, what is that guy doing there? somebody probably gave him the wrong info he is too far from the border fence:tumble: And the last one is looking straight South, enjoy!

nandopedal - 5-31-2013 at 11:44 AM

Wohoo! I just made "junior" do that means I get a pony ride at the fair?

Graham - 5-31-2013 at 12:21 PM

Thanks David for posting Fernando's pics and the link to Baja Andy's panoramas and pics. Wonderful shots from the top of Baja.

Helps me appreciate even more the achievement of those two young men who we met on our trip.

On May 25 they set out at midnight from the Padre Kino camping area planning to hike from the plateau down to the bottom of Canyon Diablo and immediately up to the top of Picacho del Diablo and back again to Padre Kino... all in under 24 hours!

Their goal was to establish an officially verified and sanctioned record, and possibly make it into the Guinness Book of Records.

Victor Manuel Lopez Meza, age 31, (Rayo de Ensenada) had been to Picacho peak 7 times, and has been traveling and guiding on and around the mountain for over 10 years.

His companion Luis Felipe Vea Ávalos, age 23 (Skywalker) had met Victor and committed himself to the project just a month before. But in that time he prepared and trained hard every day. It was his first climb of Picacho.

An unexpected and worrying problem they had early on was with their headlights. Night travel in such wild and rugged conditions was hazardous enough, but when their lights started to fail they lost 45 minutes finding a fix and were fearful they would not be able to set the record.

After they had reached the top of Picacho Diablo, and were heading back down tired and thirsty, there was another anxious time as Felipe developed cramps in his legs. Victor said he was motivated both by establishing the record and ensuring that Felipe made it safely back as his mother and father were waiting for him in camp.

After overcoming their problems and successfully completing their journey, both Victor and Felipe humbly expressed their gratitude to each other, and to all the people who helped them reach their goal.


Victor and Felipe greeted by Felipe's father on their return


Felipe and Victor enjoying some well-deserved ceviche


Victor and his 4 year old son and Felipe signing a poster for me... exhausted support team member in between


They acknowledged that they could not have done it without their six man support team out there awaiting them at Botella Azul, Campo Noche, and on Picacho itself with food, water, and medicine.


Two of the support team return and are united with their families


They were also grateful for the support and backing of the San Pedro Mártir park authorities who made available access to the Padre Kino area and all park facilities. And they were sending Spot location signals via satellite to the park authorities and also mountain rescue teams in the area who were ready to assist if needed.

But, above all, both men sincerely thanked their families and friends who were there to cheer them off into the night and anxiously await their return. That moral support clearly meant everything and it was wonderful to be there for the emotional cheers, hugs, and tears as the record setters (and later their support crews) wandered back from their exertions and adventures.


Event poster and official recognition certificate

Parque Nacional San Pedro Mártir personnel issued them an official certificate verifying that they had returned in less than 24 hours. Indeed, they made the journey in an amazing 15 hours and 25 minutes, much of it in the dark, a mind-blowing achievement to all those who know the terrain.



A privilege to be a part of it

The joy and celebrations were infectious… and these wonderful people kindly and graciously invited Roger, Ronnie and me – we had just returned exhausted from our own hike - to join them for a revitalizing delicious forest banquet of quesadillas, ceviche, beans and salsa.

It was a day and an event to remember, and I wish “Rayo de Ensenada” and “Skywalker” good luck and happy trails for all their future adventures and record setting events.

Their next is likely to be hiking up Canyon Diablo to the peak and then up to the park from there.

Also on the cards is an attempt to pedal all around the perimeter of Mexico.

David K - 5-31-2013 at 03:33 PM

Thank you Graham... wonderful adventure indeed!

BornFisher - 5-31-2013 at 04:20 PM

Damn guys---- great try!! Graham-- amazing reports and photos. Seems like every time you go up to the park, something great happens!!

Desert Rat - 5-31-2013 at 09:14 PM

Hello fellow nomads. I just returned from the two day drive from Roger´s home in Ensenada. First chance I´ve had to check in with Bajanomad and was pleasantly surprised to see how quickly Graham had composed a report of the trip. Graham´s report touched on the major events of the trip and is well done. I have nothing more to add other than to say thank you to Graham, Roger, and all the nomads who gave suggestions, etc., for our benefit. If you have never been to San Pedro Mártir Parque and want to see an amazing place, then please give yourself a treat and GO!

Kgryfon - 6-1-2013 at 03:27 AM

"As they say, the journey is sometimes more important than the destination. It was a peak experience even if we didn’t make it to the top of Baja."

Well said. The entire adventure sounds amazing and I thank you for posting it. It's good to know your limits and you had a great adventure nonetheless! Cheers to you and your hiking mates!

Ateo - 6-2-2013 at 04:05 PM

I was really stoked to read this thread. You guys gave it your best and that's all you can do. I really respect this type of stuff. Thanks.

mtgoat666 - 6-2-2013 at 07:54 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Desert Rat
Maderita, I made it a point to talk to a ranger concerning the requirement for a certified guide to hike and climb Picacho from the Parque. He said that a guide is absolutely required and that the guides certification paper will be checked. And no, we did not go covert.


Really!? Who did you enlist as guide? What certification are they looking for?

Maderita - 6-3-2013 at 01:25 PM

Desert Rat,
I'm confused. You stated, "...a guide is absolutely required..." and, "...we did not go covert".
That seems to imply that you had an officially recognized guide.
Then you wrote, "No guide was enlisted for the trip".
What am I missing?

Graham - 6-3-2013 at 02:18 PM

Yes, I think the situation IS confused. If you read the early exchanges in this thread, we were trying to clarify if a guide is necessary or not. And sometimes, I've found, you'll get slightly different answers from different rangers, and maybe different answers from the same ranger depending on who is asking the question, and how you ask the question!

I think they might cut you some slack if you're obviously well equipped, have experience, and are in possession of a Spot device or similar.

What is certain is the route to Picacho is extremely rugged, remote and hazardous, and the park staff have seen several cases of people breaking bones, getting lost, or otherwise getting into trouble and requiring rescue. And they absolutely have a right to try to minimize the number of these misadventures.

I'm looking forward to getting back to the park soon and exploring a little more in the direction of Canyon Diablo.

I'll try to get a more definitive answer... if there is one.

Desert Rat - 6-3-2013 at 08:12 PM

Maderita and others. I understand the confusion caused by my succinct statement concerning the fact that we did not go covert. The question was, "Did we go covert?" and I simply answered, "No, we did not go covert". I neglected to explain in detail as to why. As Graham mentioned, the rangers might cut you some slack if...well equipped, experienced, possess a Spot device, etc.

A major event that took place at the Parque played a big part in helping the rangers decide to allow us to make the Picacho attempt without our own guide.

During the time that we would be on the trail to Picacho, there were four different groups of climbers with guides on the route, also. One group was there to support two men who were attempting to set a time record for the fastest ascent of Picacho. The support group members were stationed at the three critical points on the route to the summit. A doctor was in the group, also.

From the trailhead to the summit, hikers and guides would be strung out along the route to Picacho. This practically assured the rangers that help would not be far away if needed. The decision was made to allow us to make an attempt.

I apologize for confusing the issue earlier.

mtgoat666 - 6-3-2013 at 08:21 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Graham
Yes, I think the situation IS confused. If you read the early exchanges in this thread, we were trying to clarify if a guide is necessary or not. And sometimes, I've found, you'll get slightly different answers from different rangers, and maybe different answers from the same ranger depending on who is asking the question, and how you ask the question!.


...and sometime it is better to not ask the question and so never get an answer!

Have not been there in about a year,... Is the road to padre kino CG still in good shape and passable for normal cars? Still pretty safe to park cars there overnite when hiking back country?

P.s. nice trip,reports,... Love the plateau, always a good time in the park

Maderita - 6-3-2013 at 09:33 PM

Desert Rat,
Certainly no apology needed. Thanks for clarifying the issue. It's what I guessed - that the ranger has some discretion on the policy which requires a guide.

It seems the rangers are trying to sort the experienced from the unprepared noobies. Their "guide required" solution may have an unintended and opposite outcome. Guides will bring in more people who would otherwise not undertake the climb. Radios, SPOT, and satellite phones lead to more people requesting rescue and costly emergency evacuation. In the old days, if you got yourself into a predicament, you had to get yourself out, with rare exceptions.



[Edited on 6-4-2013 by Maderita]

Graham - 6-4-2013 at 09:02 AM

I've been traveling to the San Pedro Martir for 20 years and it's been interesting to see the changes in the park and the increasing amount of regulation and enforcement... especially since the ease of access with the paved road.

It's been a place I've always enjoyed taking my dogs in the summer... plenty of cool places for them to run free and play... and I've never seen a rattlesnake or scorpion up there... though I have seen bobcats, a cougar, and numerous coyotes.

I've always found the park staff to be helpful and reasonable, and I've always felt very safe and secure parked inside the park - perhaps because of the need to sign in and out at the park gate and pay an entrance fee?

Not once has my vehicle or campsite been molested... and I spent four months in Padre Kino in 2001 when I wrote "Nearer My Dog to Thee."

As I mentioned in the book... I was sometimes the only guest in the park and once I even became the ranger in charge as the only official had to leave for a day or two! A few hours after this unexpected promotion I noted with alarm a large forest fire burning to the west! Such were the good old days!

The road to Padre Kino is generally OK but there are a couple of small arroyos to cross that would make car access difficult. You will need high clearance.

The main vehicle controls in the park are the locked gates... this is the one on the road to Padre Kino, about a mile from the main trailhead to Blue Bottle and Picacho




Because of all the activity Desert Rat mentions - May is perhaps the main month to climb Picacho from the park - it was open when we were there.

But don't be surprised if you find the chain in place and locked.

mtgoat666 - 6-4-2013 at 09:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Graham

The main vehicle controls in the park are the locked gates... this is the one on the road to Padre Kino, about a mile from the main trailhead to Blue Bottle and Picacho

But don't be surprised if you find the chain in place and locked.


it seems the hike to picacho diablo and blue bottle peak area is now 1 mile longer :lol::lol::lol:

i have noticed that the park does more things each year to keep people from venturing much off the main road :(:(

thanks for info :bounce:

bacquito - 6-4-2013 at 09:54 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Maderita
Desert Rat,
Certainly no apology needed. Thanks for clarifying the issue. It's what I guessed - that the ranger has some discretion on the policy which requires a guide.

It seems the rangers are trying to sort the experienced from the unprepared noobies. Their "guide required" solution may have an unintended and opposite outcome. Guides will bring in more people who would otherwise not undertake the climb. Radios, SPOT, and satellite phones lead to more people requesting rescue and costly emergency evacuation. In the old days, if you got yourself into a predicament, you had to get yourself out, with rare exceptions.





[Edited on 6-4-2013 by Maderita]


As I recall, when we were leaving the park the question regarding whether a guide was needed at the park and it was stated a guide was needed but but that Graham was considered a qualified guide.

[Edited on 6-4-2013 by bacquito]

Vince - 6-4-2013 at 05:40 PM

Graham, thanks for the adventure! Fun reading about that area and to know it is still a challenge. As Barry noted, we visited Blue Bottle Ridge several times with Bud Bernhard and the Sierra Club in the early '50's. He was a real pioneer in that area, a great climber. It was fun to go with him when he was younger, but I heard the heat really bothered him in later life, early '70's in age. He had to be helped out of the area. I climbed Picacho with him in the late 1950s when he was at his peak. He hauled a transit on his back and measured both peaks to their relative height, one was like 6 feet higher. Can't remember which one. We stayed on the south peak and he left, carrying the instrument all the way over to the north peak while we held the measuring device and he scoped it. Then he rescued the Kellog kids from La Jolla after that (they were lost on the mountain). One of them wrote DEVIL'S MOUNTAIN.

bacquito - 6-4-2013 at 07:57 PM



I have not posted pictures in such a long time so I am stumbling along. Graham and Ron on our recent trip to Parque Pedro San Martir.

[Edited on 6-5-2013 by bacquito]

[Edited on 6-5-2013 by bacquito]

bacquito - 6-4-2013 at 08:16 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=QsXFI8tH6PE

This is from You Tube and is a shortened video from the done I sent to You Tube. But none the less it is interesting

bacquito - 6-4-2013 at 08:22 PM

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sZAefWBZTw

Hopefully this works!

bajaandy - 6-5-2013 at 06:33 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by mtgoat666

...and sometime it is better to not ask the question and so never get an answer!


What is the old saying? "Better to ask forgiveness than to ask permission."

bacquito - 6-5-2013 at 10:01 AM


bacquito - 6-5-2013 at 09:01 PM


Graham - 6-6-2013 at 10:17 AM

Thanks Vince and Barry for the fascinating information about Bud Bernhard and your visits to Botella Azul and Picacho in the 50's.

Bud Bernard was a true legend and pioneer of the established route for ascending the mountain. I've been in awe of his Picacho experience and resolve ever since reading John Robinson's "Camping and Climbing in Baja."

[Edited on 6-6-2013 by Graham]