BajaNomad - Bad news for El Triunfo

Bad news for El Triunfo

weebray - 9-22-2013 at 04:33 PM

Mexico's answer to Wall Mart, oxxo, is planning an outlet in El Triunfo. El Triunfo needs an oxxo like the world needs genital warts. I quickly learned to dislike the chain when they spawned like rabbits about 3-4 years ago. I am on a perosnal crusade to boycott the operation. Now that'll send 'em a message!

bajagrouper - 9-22-2013 at 05:48 PM

Mexico's answer to Wal-Mart is Wal-Mart de Mexico.....
Mexico's answer to 7-11 is OXXO.................

Udo - 9-22-2013 at 06:07 PM

Hey...

The do have great coffee in the morning!

mulegemichael - 9-22-2013 at 07:18 PM

really really sad; el triunfo stands for history and small town and uniqueness and tranquility and homemade and, did i say small town?...yeah...all that...when the maestro died so did a lot of the town...roz and i miss him...and now oxxo....wow!...so sad.

chuckie - 9-23-2013 at 03:03 AM

michael..spell oxxo backwards....

Tbone - 9-23-2013 at 05:08 AM

Genital warts are over rated.

Pescador - 9-23-2013 at 07:18 AM

Geez, why don't you tell us how you really feel.

Now I will have a pic in my head of genital warts every time I see an OXXO. :light:

mulegemichael - 9-23-2013 at 07:19 AM

well, chuckie, that would be oxxo....there ya go!

weebray - 9-23-2013 at 07:26 AM

Quote:

Now I will have a pic in my head of genital warts every time I see an OXXO. :light:

Ha, ha, Yeah like "you better stay away from that one, got a bad case of oxxo I hear".

weebray - 9-23-2013 at 07:30 AM

Quote:

The do have great coffee in the morning!

You don't have to go to oxxo for a good cupa joe. Why not support the dozens of small coffee stands everywhere in the Baja instead of genital warts.

David K - 9-23-2013 at 08:10 AM

Why the hate? Is 7-11 that bad? Why not shut them down in the U.S.? We telling Mexico they can't have convenience stores is kind of hypocritical, isn't it? If the ma & papa stores are popular, then the Oxxo won't last. If there is a market that isn't being addressed by the ma & papa stores, the Oxxo may succeed. Either way, the consumer wins because the consumer, not the government makes the choice.

tjsue - 9-23-2013 at 08:48 AM

And more 7-11's are popping up in San Diego. The corporation is buying up empty buildings, and turning them into 7-11 stores. At least there will be a business at that location, instead of just a boarded up building.

bajabuddha - 9-23-2013 at 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pescador
Geez, why don't you tell us how you really feel.

Now I will have a pic in my head of genital warts every time I see an OXXO. :light:

Geez, I'm curious how you know what they look like in the first place? :?:

bajaguy - 9-23-2013 at 09:46 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by weebray
You don't have to go to oxxo for a good cupa joe. Why not support the dozens of small coffee stands everywhere in the Baja instead of genital warts.

Yeah, I do.

I also like 7-11 coffee. I have never found a small coffee stand that has GOOD Joe. I don't do starbucks in the US or Baja, but DeVolada in Ensenada has decent coffee

PS: in "the baja"....are you Canadien?????

motoged - 9-23-2013 at 10:00 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

PS: in "the baja"....are you Canadien?????

Do you mean Canadian? Or is that the Ameriken
spelling? :biggrin:

dtbushpilot - 9-23-2013 at 10:06 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

PS: in "the baja"....are you Canadien?????

Do you mean Canadian? Or is that the Ameriken
spelling? :biggrin:

Is DK rubbing off on you ged? :lol:

TMW - 9-23-2013 at 10:20 AM

I'm not too thrilled with 7-11. When the 7-11 on the south side of San Felipe next to the gas station was an AM/PM they had the best hotdogs and hamburgers around with plenty of stuff to put on them. After changing to 7-11 it all went down hill.

bajaguy - 9-23-2013 at 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

PS: in "the baja"....are you Canadien?????

Do you mean Canadian? Or is that the Ameriken
spelling? :biggrin:

Eggs-Actly what I mean......and as part of America, Canadians should be the last ones to talk about spelling.....like Color and Neighbor....eh???

Bubba - 9-23-2013 at 11:27 AM

Walmart just opened another food center here and call it "your neighborhood market". :spingrin:

weebray - 9-23-2013 at 11:53 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Why the hate? Is 7-11 that bad? Why not shut them down in the U.S.? We telling Mexico they can't have convenience stores is kind of hypocritical, isn't it? If the ma & papa stores are popular, then the Oxxo won't last. If there is a market that isn't being addressed by the ma & papa stores, the Oxxo may succeed. Either way, the consumer wins because the consumer, not the government makes the choice.

What a load of crap. Get down off your high horse and smell the roses. I’m too old to suffer fools espousing antiquated Reganomics and wagging the flag of capitalism. The truth is that mega chains are NOT good for the consumer. With the demise of the mom and pop’s comes the demise of choice. The local producer of hielitos or assorted nuts and snacks hasn’t a snowballs chance in hell of showing up in 7 come 11 or oooooxxo. If you are happy with one brand of snacks and one brand of beer with several different percentages of water then you can see the future at your nearby oxxo. By the by I never said anything about their right to build more stores. My point was that an oxxo would be out of place in El Triunfo and that additionally I would not set foot in one.

bajaguy - 9-23-2013 at 12:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by weebray

What a load of crap. Get down off your high horse and smell the roses. I’m too old to suffer fools espousing antiquated Reganomics and wagging the flag of capitalism. The truth is that mega chains are NOT good for the consumer. With the demise of the mom and pop’s comes the demise of choice. The local producer of hielitos or assorted nuts and snacks hasn’t a snowballs chance in hell of showing up in 7 come 11 or oooooxxo. If you are happy with one brand of snacks and one brand of beer with several different percentages of water then you can see the future at your nearby oxxo. By the by I never said anything about their right to build more stores. My point was that an oxxo would be out of place in El Triunfo and that additionally I would not set foot in one.

Mom & Pops (and other businesses) either make the necessary business changes to survive or are replaced.

And if you don't set foot in an OXXO, good for me...you won't be in front of me in the coffee line

David K - 9-23-2013 at 12:17 PM

Consumer choice not government control or non Mexicans telling Mexicans where to shop is what should be happening, right?

motoged - 9-23-2013 at 12:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy
....Eggs-Actly what I mean......and as part of America, Canadians should be the last ones to talk about spelling.....like Color and Neighbor....eh???

BG,
Uh....that would be "part of the Americas"...as there are three Americas: north, central, and south :light:

But I know you know that...

As for spelling....yes, we out here in the colonies still use the Queen's English. It is understandable that folks in the USA need to abbreviate their words.... keeping track of all those letters can be time consuming and challenging....

Throwing tea into the harbour was such a world-changing event that it had to be celebrated with some sense of eunuch identity by tweaking the spelling ....I mean "unique"....

Now, the important stuff: We do have 7-11'a up here in the frozen wastelands....it would be great to have a few Oxxo's....just so I could get some lime-flavoUred peanuts :lol:

But it is a bit of a shame to see "progress" taint these small and wonderful pueblos.

[Edited on 9-23-2013 by motoged]

bajaguy - 9-23-2013 at 12:25 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy
....Eggs-Actly what I mean......and as part of America, Canadians should be the last ones to talk about spelling.....like Color and Neighbor....eh???

BG,
Uh....that would be "part of the Americas"...as there are three Americas: north, central, and south :light:

But it is a bit of a shame to see "progress" taint these small and wonderful pueblos.

[Edited on 9-23-2013 by motoged]

Up the Rebels!!!!!

Would be glad to send some lyme, uh, I men lime FLAVORED peanuts (and a dictionary....lol) your way.....u2u me an address.... :lol:

J.P. - 9-23-2013 at 01:12 PM

There's a location in Ensenada where you can see THREE OXXO'S in your line of sight there is one directly across the street from another. ??????????????????
:lol:

motoged - 9-23-2013 at 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy
....Would be glad to send some lyme, uh, I men lime FLAVORED peanuts (and a dictionary....lol) your way.....u2u me an address.... :lol:

Thanks....I have a dikshunary....but the peanuts can be sent to my gallery ....(I have a few....they are like my sea-shell collections.....they may be found on beaches all over the world):

http://www.complex.com/art-design/2012/10/worlds-100-best-art-galleries/

:cool:

monoloco - 9-23-2013 at 02:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Consumer choice not government control or non Mexicans telling Mexicans where to shop is what should be happening, right?

It all depends where they're going to put it. I don't know about El Triunfo, but in Todos Santos, there are zoning regulations requiring that anything built in the downtown historical district has to comply with architectural guidelines to maintain the character of the town, which IMHO is a good thing, so it would actually be a case of Mexicans telling Mexicans what should be happening.

fdt - 9-23-2013 at 03:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Udo
Hey...

The do have great coffee in the morning!

if you like liver and onion tasting coffee

DANG

fixtrauma - 9-23-2013 at 03:32 PM

BFS - 9-23-2013 at 04:06 PM

That really is a shame.

Bwana_John - 9-23-2013 at 04:49 PM

Quote:

My point was that an oxxo would be out of place in El Triunfo

So... would something more appropriate like a stamp mill and smelter or a cyanide leach pit make you happier?

Bajahowodd - 9-23-2013 at 05:09 PM

Oxxo is owned by Coca Cola de Mexico. Up until a couple of years ago, Coca Cola de Mexico also ownd one of the largest beer manufacturers in the world. Their deal is to basically cut out the middleman.

That said, also a couple of years ago, a couple of major Pemex franchisees were persuaded to sign a contract with 7-11, a company located in Asia. Those of you in the Ensenada area witnessed the transition from AM/PM to 7-11 a couple of years ago. It's all about the dinero.

That said, I really don't think that life in El Triunfo is going to Hades just because the folks there are going to be able to buy Coke, Michelada and Takis that are not stale.

bajagrouper - 9-23-2013 at 06:29 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Oxxo is owned by Coca Cola de Mexico. Up until a couple of years ago, Coca Cola de Mexico also ownd one of the largest beer manufacturers in the world. Their deal is to basically cut out the middleman.

I believe Coca Cola and OXXO are both owned by Fomento Económico Mexicano, S.A.B. de C.V or FEMSA.....

fdt - 9-23-2013 at 07:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajagrouper

Quote:

I believe Coca Cola and OXXO are both owned by Fomento Económico Mexicano, S.A.B. de C.V or FEMSA.....

It's the other way around, It all started with Cerveceria Cuahutemoc

woody with a view - 9-23-2013 at 07:11 PM

ask a Philipino what takis means!!!

:lol:

hint: it's twice as much as #1!

[Edited on 9-24-2013 by woody with a view]

monoloco - 9-23-2013 at 07:59 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fdt

Quote:

Originally posted by bajagrouper

Quote:

I believe Coca Cola and OXXO are both owned by Fomento Económico Mexicano, S.A.B. de C.V or FEMSA.....

It's the other way around, It all started with Cerveceria Cuahutemoc

FEMSA sold Cuahuatemoc to Heineken but retains 20% of the stock, they own 70% of CocaCola Mexico with the CocaCola corp retaining 30%, they own 100% of OXXO and just bought Doña Tota, which is a restaurant chain. They seem to be a well run company and their stock has done very well. CocaCola Mexico is the largest CocaCola bottler/distributor in the world, which is not surprising, as fond as Mexicans are of Coke.

DavidE - 9-24-2013 at 02:24 PM

If the Mexicanos do not want it, it will not come or it will not survive. I can tell you for a fact that one of the worst traits a gringo can show to a Mexican is one where the "Gringo Knows Best" or to put it more bluntly "The Mexicans Are Backward". If that El Truinfo Oxxo is not productive it will close it's doors. It is a franchise. If it does survive it will not be because of gringo subsidization. If you have faith in Mexico and Mexicans then you will know that aesthetics will sooner or later make its appearance. Until then there are a hundred and ten million Mexicans eager to shed the image of being "backward" or "second rate" and this means "stuff" is going to happen whether gringos like it or not.

David K - 9-24-2013 at 02:30 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bwana_John

Quote:

My point was that an oxxo would be out of place in El Triunfo

So... would something more appropriate like a stamp mill and smelter or a cyanide leach pit make you happier?

... the things that attracted EVERYONE to live or visit there from its beginning! Although, I hear the piano museum has its own fan base now? :light:

weebray - 9-24-2013 at 04:12 PM

My my, You merry pranksters have been busy since my last rant. I see that dumb and bummer are still missing the point. An oxxo in El Triunfo is like a wart on the Mona Lisa. Anyone that thinks that an oxxo in El Triunfo would not be an inappropriate eyesore is, to put it bluntly, full of chit. The people of Triunfo are predominantly not in favor of it. There are protests being planned as we speak. This is not one bit about consumer choice, it’s about corporate greed and whether or not the people want it, the corporation will decide. Trust me oxxo is not going to build a store that reflects the style and character of El Trinufo. They are there to sell COKE and contribute to the obesity of the nation. And don’t give me that BS about us telling Mexicans what they can or cannot do. I have numerous Mexican friends living and doing business in Triunfo. I have yet to meet one that supports an oxxo. Your simplistic view of the power and goodness of the free market is a fifties fantasy. Big business, Big government and our all American armed forces feed us the pap they want us to suck. To paraphrase Orwell “all animals are created equal but some are created more equal than others.” I also don’t give a rats ass if like oxxo so start another thread if you feel the need to spread the love.

SFandH - 9-24-2013 at 04:15 PM

Most everybody understands the nostalgia for old Mexican ways and how they are lost to change. I like OXXOs though. The basics are there, even some fresh produce and they are clean and efficient. Plus, I think, they provide some things the old Mom and Pop stores don't, and I'm not speaking of goods. They provide good jobs, steady hours, benefits, and perhaps a retail career path. They also collect and pay sales taxes which public services rely upon. Not sure what percentage of the Mom and Pop stores do those things.

For old Mexican ways I'll drive my PU onto the beach, set up camp, build a campfire, and drink some beers with friends while we gaze into the fire. All of which are illegal in San Diego and most all of the US.

DianaT - 9-24-2013 at 04:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by weebray
..... The people of Triunfo are predominantly not in favor of it. There are protests being planned as we speak.

That, and only that is what matters. It should matter not at all as to what any visitor or ex-pat wants. Some towns or cities may want an OXXO, and that would be their choice.

And they do not need to be told what is best for them --- not only do they really resent it, then some who read English will read things on forums like, "slowly but surely, we are teaching them about _______ and they are learning and progressing" (Fill in the blank. ) and some wonder why they are so disliked by the locals?

Quote:

Originally posted by SFandH

For old Mexican ways I'll drive my PU onto the beach, set up camp, build a campfire, and drink some beers with friends while we gaze into the fire. All of which are illegal in San Diego and most all of the US.

Driving your truck on the beach is also illegal in Mexico, it is just not enforced in very many places in Baja. Many locals I know would like to see it enforced, but there are also many who do NOT want to see it enforced.

The benefits or no benefits of an OXXO, or whether driving on the beach should or should not be allowed, can be debated endlessly by a bunch of gringos, but....................

mtgoat666 - 9-24-2013 at 04:36 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by weebray
They are there to sell COKE and contribute to the obesity of the nation.

actually, they are there to sell coke, and they dont care about or even consider the consequential poor nutrition or obesity.
like drug dealers, oxxo and 7-11 (and coca cola company) don't think about their affect on society, nor do they care if their customers die from eating their goods (plus, these are slow acting diseases, so the customer life span is sufficiently long). and they know another bumpkin will be along to replace any customer that dies of diabetes. these companies measure success or failure only in terms of money.

i would not mind an oxxo in a historic neighborhood, if they followed an architectural guideline consistent with the location, and if they toned down their monstrous color scheme on front of building and sign banners.

perhaps they can set up shop in one of the quaint old buildings, eh? :light:

DavidE - 9-24-2013 at 04:45 PM

The "disappointments" aesthetics, and ringworm on Mona Lisa's posterior has barely started. How about a McDonald's on the rim of the Canyon in Divisadero? Or a Starbucks downtown San Cristobal de Las Casas, maybe near the mercado central?

In 2001, mind you, twelve years ago in Tecate, a McDonalds opened up. The gente lined up ALL THE WAY ROUND A VERY BIG BLOCK to be able to purchase a Big Mac and fries at a price that is (still) around 20% more in dollar cost than a McDonalds in the USA. Yeah I did - I drove round that block twice. The people were excited, and jocular their very own McDonalds.

Even though I disapprove of some things down here I keep it entirely to myself. I give no clue whatsoever to the gente.

Do you?

weebray - 9-24-2013 at 04:47 PM

I like OXXOs though.

What part of "I don't care what you think about oxxo" didn't you understand?

Circle the Ks

EdZeranski - 9-25-2013 at 09:17 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by J.P.
There's a location in Ensenada where you can see THREE OXXO'S in your line of sight there is one directly across the street from another. ??????????????????
:lol:

They must have copied the zoning in Tucson....no more than three blocks between Circle K stores.

EdZ

watch the hole

EdZeranski - 9-25-2013 at 09:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Now, the important stuff: We do have 7-11'a up here in the frozen wastelands....it would be great to have a few Oxxo's....just so I could get some lime-flavoUred peanuts :lol:

[Edited on 9-23-2013 by motoged]

When I was in Kandahar Afg they had a Canadian Donut shop(Horton?)...very popular We really like looking through Baja markets to see what is different that we might like. Most trips we come back with cans of something to try or do kitchen 'experiments'...part of the fun of Baja.

EdZ

durrelllrobert - 9-25-2013 at 06:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by EdZeranski

Quote:

[Edited on 9-23-2013 by motoged]

Yea, that would be Tim Hortons eh.

Tim Horton

bajaguy - 9-25-2013 at 07:43 PM

Wal-mart sell some of his stuff in the frozen food section - breakfasts

motoged - 9-26-2013 at 09:45 AM

Tim Horton was a famous Canadian hockey player some years ago....he started a coffee-donut chain that is VERY popular in Canada....their franchises have infected our landscape and , for the life of me, I don't understand why people line up for their coffee (supplied by the same folks who supply coffee to Mc Donalds in Canada....as told to me by a McD's manager.....although I like McD's regular coffee).

A few years ago Tim Horton's was "amalgamated/bought ??? by Wendy's burger joint and there were great hopes TH would take the USA by storm.

Well, it hasn't and Wendy's is going downhill with their cheeky new redhead Wendy wannabe.

An Oxxo in a small"quaint" town is like a McD's /7-11 in_________________ (fill in the blank)

Some love ....some don't.

P.S Tim Horton donuts are smaller than they used to be and are mass-produced in distant kitchen instead of the back of each TH's....quality control at its best.....eh?!

DavidE - 9-26-2013 at 10:05 AM

Then the franchisee is ska-rewed. Ain't capitalism wunderfill?

bajagrouper - 9-26-2013 at 10:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged
P.S Tim Horton donuts are smaller than they used to be and are mass-produced in distant kitchen instead of the back of each TH's....quality control at its best.....eh?!

Maybe the size of a hockey puck?

durrelllrobert - 9-26-2013 at 11:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

P.S Tim Horton donuts are smaller than they used to be and are mass-produced in distant kitchen instead of the back of each TH's....quality control at its best.....eh?!

Maybe that is true in Kamloops, BC but certainly untrue in Edmonton. The Corp. that my wife's daughter is part of has 7 francises there and all of the baked goods are made fresh everyday in all but the one in the West Edmonton Mall and that's only because they are not allowed to have a kitchen there.

Also, Conventional wisdom might have forecast a national revolt after Canadian icon Tim Hortons was bought out by our neighbours to the south. But instead, the donut chain boomed across the country. While efforts to expand Tim's to the U.S. yielded mixed results, joint Tim Hortons/Wendy's locations began to pop up across Canada at a time when Tim’s headed into a phase of monumental growth. In 1995, Tim Hortons, which still operated as its own entity while under the Wendy's banner, had 1,000 stores; today, there are more than 4,500. Mount Royal University's David Finch agrees the Tim Hortons/Wendy's merger was a rousing success. However, the relationship would not last. Wendy's sold its stake in Tim Hortons, and in 2009 the donut chain was repatriated as a Canadian public company THX on the NYSE.

As of June 30th, 2013, Tim Hortons had 4,304 system-wide restaurants, including 3,468 in Canada, 807 in the United States and 29 in the Gulf Cooperation Council.

[Edited on 9-26-2013 by durrelllrobert]

David K - 9-26-2013 at 12:20 PM

Gee, makes me want to try it, just to see what the fuss is all about (a-boot), eh? :biggrin:

Bob H - 9-27-2013 at 07:11 AM

Tim Hortons locations can presently be found in Michigan, Maine, Connecticut, Ohio, West Virginia, Kentucky, Pennsylvania, Rhode Island, Massachusetts and New York, with responsible expansion continuing in these core markets.

Bob H - 9-27-2013 at 07:18 AM

Quote:

This from their web site:

Tim Hortons donuts and baked goods are prepared at our bakery in Brantford, Ontario, Canada. Prior to serving, they are baked and finished (with fillings and/or glazes/icings) at your neighborhood Tim Hortons restaurant. Staff can bake in small batches throughout the day, so that guests should find their favorite products on the shelf more often. We believe this baking system offers our guests the best product, each and every time.

rhintransit - 9-27-2013 at 08:44 AM

whatever one thinks about the products available at OXXO's (and they are simply more numerous than the colas and chips and peanuts sold by the mom and pop stores) it is great to have clean, well maintained bathrooms available wherever they spring up. less toilet paper strewn highways?

as to competition, small or otherwise stores will adapt or die. it's kinda nice here in Loreto now...Ley's moved in, the only other large grocery in town has cleaned up/reorganized, and sales people actually greet and smile at customers. the other day at in another well known grocery store in town, owner came over to shake my hand when I walked in.

our gringo input on the matter of what store where is irrelevant...

David K - 9-27-2013 at 02:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by rhintransit
whatever one thinks about the products available at OXXO's (and they are simply more numerous than the colas and chips and peanuts sold by the mom and pop stores) it is great to have clean, well maintained bathrooms available wherever they spring up. less toilet paper strewn highways?

as to competition, small or otherwise stores will adapt or die. it's kinda nice here in Loreto now...Ley's moved in, the only other large grocery in town has cleaned up/reorganized, and sales people actually greet and smile at customers. the other day at in another well known grocery store in town, owner came over to shake my hand when I walked in.

our gringo input on the matter of what store where is irrelevant...

Right on... the consumer should win, and the free market benefits all... the public bathrooms are an interesting twist I hadn't considered... healthy for the environment!

DavidE - 9-27-2013 at 03:03 PM

Snotty businesses are hard to endure anywhere. Want S-N-O-T?

The gasolinera in Sta Rosalia years ago.

They greeted you with a sneer. Worse than a 1989 Home Club or 2006 Home Despot.

Want a bad day. Get processed through the thieving PJF Puesto de Control at the entroque transpninsular in Sn Ignacio, and then have to run the gauntlet at the gasolinera in Sta Rosalia.

OXXO Benefit

bajaguy - 9-27-2013 at 03:15 PM

I can pay my Telnor bill there without having to drive into town to the Telnor office

DavidE - 9-27-2013 at 04:24 PM

Just wait'll you need to decide

The Oxxo

or

Squat

tiotomasbcs - 9-27-2013 at 04:41 PM

New Oxxo and Pemex in Bahia Asuncion yet? I think Shari said the locals would like it?! I try to avoid ours in Pescadero and buy from the small local stores. Nice people-real people; the kids help me load those garafones/5 gal water bottles. Nice touch! Tio

David K - 9-27-2013 at 04:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DavidE
Just wait'll you need to decide

The Oxxo

or

Squat

OH DAH-VEED, SO FUNNY!

Bajahowodd - 9-27-2013 at 04:56 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Right on... the consumer should win, and the free market benefits all... the public bathrooms are an interesting twist I hadn't considered... healthy for the environment!

Hate to break it to you, but the free market does not necessarily benefit ALL.

Behemoths like Walmart, for instance move in and shut down many local businesses, while offering minimum wage jobs with little or no benefits. That does not benefit ALL.

Free market is more like economic Dawinism, Where the big consume the little.

Barry A. - 9-27-2013 at 05:26 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Right on... the consumer should win, and the free market benefits all... the public bathrooms are an interesting twist I hadn't considered... healthy for the environment!

Perhaps sometimes, but the FREE MARKET in general DOES benefit all if they are willing to compete, and the citizens are willing to support their neighbors in small business. Many small business's remain viable by offering what the big-box stores can't, PERSONAL SERVICE. Many citizens frequent the small business for this reason alone---------I certainly do. It's worth paying a little more for that service. Competition always raises the bar-----for everybody generally speaking, IMO. Nothing works perfectly, however.

Barry

bajaguy - 9-27-2013 at 05:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd

Hate to break it to you, but the free market does not necessarily benefit ALL.

Behemoths like Walmart, for instance move in and shut down many local businesses, while offering minimum wage jobs with little or no benefits. That does not benefit ALL.

Free market is more like economic Dawinism, Where the big consume the little.

Hey, Odd.......I hate to break it to you.......

When was the last time you were in Ensenada on a Sunday????

Both Wal-Marts, COSTCO, Home Depot, Mc Donald's, Carl Jr.......can't find a parking place, "big box" stores all full of people shopping, spending money and employing local residents raising their standard of living.

Mom & pops either need to compete, offer something different or work for the "big box" where they will probably make more than they did running their little store....where they didn't have benefits or a guaranteed wage

[Edited on 9-28-2013 by bajaguy]

Bajahowodd - 9-28-2013 at 03:56 PM

My response to David K was because of his absolutist conviction on the free market. Sure, those big chain outlets are doing gangbuster business.

This is a very complex issue, and there are clearly differences between large cities such as Ensenada, and smaller towns.

Do you really believe that those big box businesses that pay minimum wage and offer little to no benefits are somehow improving the local economy?

As for DK, I just want to make one point. DK is a small business owner. The huge corporations are playing the small business people for their own advantage. The last thing small business owners ought to want is an environment where the huge corporations are free to do whatever they want.

Sadly, the corporatocracy controls way too much of our politicians. There needs to be some way to give relief to small business, while tightening regulation on the huge corporations.

durrelllrobert - 9-28-2013 at 04:08 PM

"This is a very complex issue, and there are clearly differences between large cities such as Ensenada, and smaller towns."

..and that's why WalMart, Sam's Club and Home Depot aren't there. Nobody is forcing us to shop there and the people that work there are very happy with the wages they get. Only the unions (that don't represent them) are complaining about wages and benefits in an attempt to sign these people up so they can collect monthly dues from them.

Wal-Mart offshoot

bajaguy - 9-28-2013 at 04:24 PM

That is why you see the Bodega Aurrera stores popping up in smaller cities...........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodega_Aurrer%C3%A1

durrelllrobert - 9-28-2013 at 05:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy
That is why you see the Bodega Aurrera stores popping up in smaller cities...........

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Bodega_Aurrer%C3%A1

Yep, when we were at a resort in Puerto Penesco the desk clerk told my wife that there was a WaMart in town and gave us directions. Sure enough it was actually a Bodega Aurrera and it was right next door to a Sam's Club.

monoloco - 9-28-2013 at 06:46 PM

Down here in La Paz and los Cabos they are putting up Sorianas everywhere, they're even putting one in the Paraiso Mall in Cabo San Lucas. Should be handy for the folks with boats in the marina.

David K - 9-28-2013 at 06:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
My response to David K was because of his absolutist conviction on the free market. Sure, those big chain outlets are doing gangbuster business.

This is a very complex issue, and there are clearly differences between large cities such as Ensenada, and smaller towns.

Do you really believe that those big box businesses that pay minimum wage and offer little to no benefits are somehow improving the local economy?

As for DK, I just want to make one point. DK is a small business owner. The huge corporations are playing the small business people for their own advantage. The last thing small business owners ought to want is an environment where the huge corporations are free to do whatever they want.

Sadly, the corporatocracy controls way too much of our politicians. There needs to be some way to give relief to small business, while tightening regulation on the huge corporations.

So no jobs beats a LOT of entry level pay jobs? Ma and Pa stores hire family members and maybe 1 or 2 others.

Bajahowodd - 9-29-2013 at 04:48 PM

I give up. Go to your tea parties. :yawn:

mulegemichael - 9-29-2013 at 08:03 PM

i give up too....kindof...big box stores employ folks that are mostly unemployable ...minimum wage kinda stuff....and they crank stuff out at unbelievably low prices...but they do NOT offer,or GIVE anything about community...they do NOT ask how your mom is or how was the coming of age party last night...they are not the folks that will be at your bbq this sunday....MOST of the employees come from outside the community and do not contribute to the soul of what is important to the community....i guess my point is, how does one weigh the affordability of a faucet against the relationship with ones neighbors???....did i make any sense here????...probably not...but i'm used to criticism

David K - 9-29-2013 at 09:49 PM

You get some false assumption that I like the big box stores... I don't. I prefer the ma and pa places. It is just a matter of what business is it of some gringos to dictate what Mexicans can have or do in Mexico? Wal-Mart and 7-11s are a part of the scene in the USA, but Mexico can't have them too? Nobody forces anyone to shop there. If the people want ma and pa stores to stay in business than they can choose to keep things unchanged by not shopping in the big or franchise stores. Voting with their money...

As for tea parties, I think the last one I went to was in 1962 when the little neighbor girl had one for me at 5 years of age! :lol:

..and more than 50% of what they sell in Hecho en Mexico which does help the economy

durrelllrobert - 9-30-2013 at 08:07 AM

"Walmart boasts that 87 percent of its merchandise sold in Mexican stores comes from national suppliers — companies such as Guadalajara-based Nopal Industrializado, which sells low-calorie and high-fiber tortillas, tostadas and totopos made from cactus flour under the “Señor Cactus” label."

From Wikipedia, the free encyclopedia

Wal-Mart de México y Centroamérica (BMV: WALMEXV), is a Mexican public corporation. It has been traded in the Mexican Stock Exchange since 1977 (as Cifra).[1] The company was founded in 1958 as Cifra by Jerónimo Arango. The company grew and in 1991 Cifra and Wal-Mart Stores, Inc., signed a joint venture agreement. This agreement allowed cooperation between the two companies and the opening of Walmart stores and Sam's Clubs in Mexico. Then in 1997 Walmart increased its stake by acquiring 51% of Cifra stock. Once the acquisition was completed Cifra was renamed, the new company became Wal-Mart de Mexico, S.A. de C.V. Walmart again increased its stake in Wal-Mart de Mexico to 60% in April 2000.[2] After completing the acquisition of Walmart's operations in Central America, in January 2010, Walmart Mexico absorbed Walmart Centroamérica and changed their name to Walmart de Mexico y Centroamérica.

At the end of December 2011 Walmart operates 2037 retail outlets in Mexico including restaurants and supermarkets, under the names Walmart, Superama, Suburbia, VIPS, Sam's Club and Bodega Aurrerá. As of 2012 the company was Mexico's largest private sector employer with 209,000 employees. One fifth of the Walmart stores in the world are in Mexico.[3] It competes with Soriana, Comercial Mexicana, Chedraui, H-E-B, Casa Ley, and S-Mart.

Wal-Mart de México y Centroamérica is the biggest retail company in Latin America.

Walmex's restaurant division, Vips, was acquired by the Mexican restaurant company, Alsea, in September 2013 for around $626 million.[4]

bajaguy - 9-30-2013 at 08:27 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mulegemichael
"....MOST of the employees come from outside the community and do not contribute to the soul of what is important to the community...."

And where do you get this info???

So the employees of the Ensenada two Wal-Marts, the Home Depot and the COSTCO are from outside of the "community"?????.........not eating that sandwich.

laventana - 9-30-2013 at 08:55 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by monoloco
It all depends where they're going to put it. I don't know about El Triunfo, but in Todos Santos, there are zoning regulations requiring that anything built in the downtown historical district has to comply with architectural guidelines to maintain the character of the town, which IMHO is a good thing, so it would actually be a case of Mexicans telling Mexicans what should be happening.

This is true in Durango, Mexico, in the old town of Durango all buildings must meet that areas period old look. and the McDonalds there is absolutely stunning, no external lighted signage. (can not remeber but maybe no sign outside what so ever.) It is built to fit in the theme and boy did they meet that criteria. Probably the nicest looking McDonalds I have ever seen and inside, i have seen some (very few) nice ones in the US. Puts the new modern looking ones to shame. So zoning does work if they have it.

LaVentana, not far from El Triunfo is also getting our OXXO as we speak, they broke ground a month ago. I am not sure they can survive in our town. Two years ago another similar theme opened several hundred yards down the street and failed almost immediately. Well they were not a chain and not organized. This will be the difference if OXXO succeeds here. Plus it will be interesting to see where OXXO can find employees to work for LaPaz wages. Our local wages are 2-3 times higher than LaPaz.

motoged - 9-30-2013 at 12:32 PM

"Maybe that is true in Kamloops, BC but certainly untrue in Edmonton. The Corp. that my wife's daughter is part of has 7 francises there and all of the baked goods are made fresh everyday "

Quote:

Originally posted by Bob H

Quote:

I suppose some folks can be fooled into thinking their donuts and stuff are made "on-site", but those who know....don't :cool:

They put pre-made stuff in an oven and bake it these days....in the "old days" TH shops made their own from a recipe on site........and offered variations.

So, Bob, Edmunchuck doesn't really do it differently....even at the W.E. Mall...... :biggrin:

[Edited on 9-30-2013 by motoged]

laventana - 10-3-2013 at 11:15 PM

The locals here in LaVentana are organizing a protest march against OXXO here in LaVentana. They are asking what right do they have to come to this town, and issues like they pay low wages and take the money from the locals away. The translation on the internet is close to this.

So lets see OXXO will have no business from the local Mexicans. So summer will be a bit tough we go from about 1000 gringos in the winter to 30 gringos in the summer. And most of these gringos will not support the OXXO.

dtutko1 - 10-4-2013 at 07:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by tiotomasbcs
New Oxxo and Pemex in Bahia Asuncion yet? I think Shari said the locals would like it?! I try to avoid ours in Pescadero and buy from the small local stores. Nice people-real people; the kids help me load those garafones/5 gal water bottles. Nice touch! Tio

Say what you want about Oxxo, but if you're in Pescadero some night and need a Magnum ice cream bar. :lol:

To OXXO or not to OXXO

shari - 10-4-2013 at 07:28 AM

Quote:

I dont recall saying the locals would like it...but my take on if Asuncion's new gas station has an Oxxo in it is that people will certainly go there...especially if they are getting gas....just like I go to Miramar if I am at the old gas pump...cause it's close!!!
Locals here go to whatever store is closest....and I'm talking withing 100 meters....which is why there are alot of Ma & Pa stores in every barrio... or people will go to a store that has the cheapest or coldest beer or fresher veggies. The area of the new Pemex has nothing right there and several houses and a new restuarant/bar have been built around it. My point is people look for both convenience & the products they want.

I wanna tell you a little story,..last week I took the bus up to Ensenada and I usually grab a taco at the taqueria next to the bus depot when we stop in El Rosario....but it was closed...BUT there was THIS....

a brand new OXXO and I thought of this thread....well I'm not a fan of chain stores in any way...but I wanted a beer so I went in. I bought a lovely sandwich on linaza grain bread!!!! but couldnt believe they had no beer so I had to go a half block to a little tienda to get one. In the Oxxo, they were training the staff and the girls were all from El Rosario and very stoked about thier new job!

If an Oxxo were to open here, I'm pretty sure they would be hiring local people...women who really need work...and it will be like any other local store where we exchange pleasantries and ask about each other's families. People in the hood and those getting gas will go there..I will certainly grab a coffee now and again.

I highly doubt there will be a boycott or any protesting going on and most likely the palomilla will like the new stuff it has, clean bathrooms and uptown feeling.

I remember when the Modelorama came in and put up it's big flashy brightly lit sign....it just looked so out of place as do the new Pemex signs...luckily it's sort of on the outskirts of town (sorry to you peeps who have places near it).

I do certainly agree that a place like Triunfo should have bylaws protecting the integrity of the place...like San Jose de Comondu has...so stores must "fit in" aesthetically.

While I feel bad for our pal Hilario, the owner of the gas pump in town as he will most likely be out of business when the new Pemex opens....most people here agree that it will be fantastic to have a Pemex here...cheaper gas and a station that is open most of the time! progress....

Pescador - 10-4-2013 at 07:39 AM

I find this whole topic terribly amusing as I watch people who were only going to buy a cold beer or a hot coffee decide what each community needs or does not need. I can remember the same thing happening in Steamboat Springs when they fought the Wal-Mart coming in. But guess what, the business became a smashing success and all those fair minded protesters ended up buying things from the store they hated so much in the development stages.
This is pretty much the same deal. It will either be a success or a failure depending on the people who buy there and how well the staff runs it. If you like it go there, if you don't then don't buy things.

But it sure makes good afternoon c-cktail discussion.

willardguy - 10-4-2013 at 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari

Quote:

were you on ricea when you took that?? everythings in neon, even the car! how do you do that? :?:

DavidE - 10-4-2013 at 09:42 AM

I couldn't care less if they put 600 Oxxos here. The new gasolinera is not getting an ATM machine (too far out of the way to maintain). After driving 253 miles yesterday to go get money and not finding 6 out of 7 medications, four for my heart, I guess I am a little crabby today. The ATM in the BanaMex in Guerrero Negro worked perfectly. The last time I tried the pseudo BanComer in Vizcaino, four gringos ahead of me walked away shaking their head. Two machines, four ATM cards, patooie. If still like the "Su Saldo $00.00" the best. It does not have the ring of "Contacto Su Banco".

I also love the price of TERAZOSINA 800 pesos for 30 tablets. Check the price for the flagship brand of terazosin at a Rexall or Wallgreens in the states. Full retail price for the flagship patented brand. Anyone who moves here and depends on medication is, well let me put it this way "An Optimist". Need cash? Good luck with an ATM card.

shari - 10-4-2013 at 03:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by willardguy
Pretty far out eh Willardguy....it's a photo tweak on Picasa photo editing...I love it! psychedelic Oxxo
here is another one of the ships in Ensenada harbour & my sushi

motoged - 10-4-2013 at 04:00 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pescador
I find this whole topic terribly amusing .....But it sure makes good afternoon c-cktail discussion.

Yeah, too bad that the "afternoon" starts at 8:30 A.M. for some :biggrin:

Pescador - 10-5-2013 at 07:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

Quote:

Originally posted by Pescador
I find this whole topic terribly amusing .....But it sure makes good afternoon c-cktail discussion.

Yeah, too bad that the "afternoon" starts at 8:30 A.M. for some :biggrin:

And you can tell that by the quality of the posts :biggrin:

DavidE - 10-5-2013 at 03:34 PM

And you can tell that by the quality of the posts :biggrin:

Waddaya mean c-cktails? How does a person inhale a c-cktail and hold it? Oh I get it; a shot glass with a built-in roach clip :biggrin:

laventana - 11-15-2013 at 05:36 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by laventana

Quote:

Update,,,, our OXXO is to open tomorrow. They had some delays due to our hurricane issues and some unusual rains, but man were they quick. Locals still say they will not shop there.

We have a very large off road bicycle competition here tomorrow I am sure the out of town people will be happy with the timing.

chuckie - 11-15-2013 at 06:27 AM

My Terazosin cost me 8.00 us for 6 months supply.....