BajaNomad - US CAN sieze you laptop at the border

US CAN sieze you laptop at the border

Russ - 1-3-2014 at 07:23 AM

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/magazine-25458533

elgatoloco - 1-3-2014 at 08:47 AM

They can take it 100 miles from the border of Mexico, Canada or Florida Keys too.

Islandbuilder - 1-3-2014 at 08:52 AM

Wow.

Why doesn't CBP just get what's on my laptop from the NSA? What happened to inter-agency cooperation?

At the very least this may prompt me to back up my data on an external drive, which I will leave at home, before bringing my laptop on my next trip out of the country.

In the last 10 years the mood of CBP has seemed to go from being our nations border ambassadors to being our neighborhoods unrestrained pit bull. (no offense toward pit bulls intended) There has to be a way they can do their job without being so overtly rude. It seems like they take classes in aggressive behavior and frowning, because those traits seem to show up across the board.

And Canada is doing their best to be as rude as the US folks are being (but they struggle with that because, well, they're Canadians)

monoloco - 1-3-2014 at 08:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by elgatoloco
They can take it 100 miles from the border of Mexico, Canada or Florida Keys too.

Or within 100 miles of any coastline.

durrelllrobert - 1-3-2014 at 09:52 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by monoloco

Quote:

Originally posted by elgatoloco
They can take it 100 miles from the border of Mexico, Canada or Florida Keys too.

Or within 100 miles of any coastline.

¡Qué suerte tengo!

Laptop and The Law

Pompano - 1-3-2014 at 10:59 AM

On a late summer afternoon this last July, I was stopped by a local state trooper for doing 75 in a 65. My error for sure, but not so rare in that particular area on the ND/Manitoba border, as there is little to no traffic and flat open highways.

As I pulled out all the documents asked for, I kicked myself for not paying better attention...and wondering what the speeding ticket was going to do to my clean driving record.

The officer asked why I was in a hurry. I said I was just coming back from a fishing trip to Lake of the Woods and wanted to get my walleye fillets into the skillet for a great dinner. Pretty lame, but the truth...I was famished!

He smiled, 'Yeah, I fish that lake too, whenever I get the chance. How were they biting? Did you fish the big bay or the islands?'

I said, 'I mostly do the islands and reefs. Either troll my downriggers or drift and jig. But hold on, I'll show you.'

I reached over and keyed 'Today's photos' on my laptop. I upload my photos daily to a disc, and has lots of walleye stuff from that weekend on it...and I was eager to show them to this fellow fisherman.

He marveled at my use of a clip-on downrigger system I had been using for many years, my favorite reefs...and my catches. I told him where to get some clip-ons on his next trip up there...and how to use them. We yakked some about minnow and leeches.

I think by now we had both had almost forgot why we had stopped.

He wrote down the clip-on name and the tackle store, then got out his ticket book...and said...'75 would get you a couple bad points, so I'm writing you a warning for 70 with no fine and no response needed. Just a reminder to keep it down... and thanks for the photo show.'

That laptop saved the day.

edit to add the photo

[Edited on 1-3-2014 by Pompano]

BajaBlanca - 1-3-2014 at 11:31 AM

that was a good ending!

David K - 1-3-2014 at 11:34 AM

Sure he didn't also spot the 'got baja?' hat??? :biggrin:

NO Worries

MrBillM - 1-3-2014 at 12:00 PM

I've yet to read of any VERIFIED abuse in the program.

And, have NEVER worried that there might be anything on ANY of MY Computers that I didn't want the Government to know about.

I would worry about those who DO worry.

What are THEY hiding ?

monoloco - 1-3-2014 at 12:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MrBillM
I've yet to read of any VERIFIED abuse in the program.

And, have NEVER worried that there might be anything on ANY of MY Computers that I didn't want the Government to know about.

I would worry about those who DO worry.

What are THEY hiding ?

There have been many cases where US and foreign business travelers have had laptops confiscated and not returned for days or weeks. I can't imagine why anyone would worry about that. :lol:

durrelllrobert - 1-3-2014 at 05:08 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by monoloco

Quote:

There have been many cases where US and foreign business travelers have had laptops confiscated and not returned for days or weeks. I can't imagine why anyone would worry about that. :lol:

Illegal downloading of copywrited software for one.

Bureaucracy CAN Move Slowly

MrBillM - 1-3-2014 at 09:38 PM

I would imagine that the Feds aren't too concerned with Prompt Customer Service IF they find it necessary to temporarily retain a Laptop. In fact, I would "think" the opposite might occur.

Understandably.

Given the HUGE volume of travelers who cross the border with Computers, it would appear (as a percentage) that the number of units "seized" is fairly small.

Which, like all confrontational Citizen/Law-enforcement encounters makes one suspicious of the "Citizen" behavior that brought about the negative result.

As one who (in younger days) "Challenged" Authority at any given opportunity, I found that the attitude of those authorities reflected my own.

And, I haven't had a bad encounter in many, many years as a result of pleasant cooperation.

A novel concept, I know.

Bajafun777 - 1-4-2014 at 11:36 PM

My friends, relatives nor I have ever experienced these big bad law enforcement types either, it must be our polite behavior and positive attitude. When crossing an International Border we all know of the possibilities of delays and possible confiscation of personal items we are crossing with. It is nothing new and if people are not prepared to handle such possibilities then maybe just maybe they shouldn't be crossing any International Border.

It really makes me wonder what the heck these poor offended souls are up to in getting all of this negative attention from law enforcement types. Maybe just maybe it is not law enforcements bad attitudes and behavior but actually the behavior and actions of those crying foul so much! When pointing your fingers at them just remember to look at the fingers pointing back at you!

Just relax and enjoy the FUN in Baja and USA instead of making every day a DRAMA DAY. Be aware that every day is precious, so enjoy it like it is your last day because it just might be. Too many great things in life to focus on the little things and if the border is such a DRAMA for you then stop crossing it. Note that this also is definitely not a healthy thing for you. Take Care & Travel Safe-----"No Hurry, No Worry, Just FUN" bajafun777

Gulliver - 1-5-2014 at 12:35 AM

I have personally been worked over. Here's a personal case.

I went to the Dominican Republic with my wife to visit her daughter who was in the Peace Corps. There was some chance of doing some camping so I took my expensive gasoline camp stove. I washed out the sig bottle and the stove with soap and water. I know better than to take gasoline on an airplane. I didn't use the stove so it was still clean and packed on my return trip.

No problem leaving the U.S. at Seattle and no problem loading at SantoDomingo. But when I transferred at New York the fat bastard looked at the stove, said, "This has had gas in it at some time in the past." and took it away. $150 down the tube just to justify his absolute authority.

I'm a retired white guy and polite to a fault. I asked for a form so I could have it shipped to me and he refused.

Maybe it was a New York thing. I've been treated fine at Phoenix.

But they Do abuse their authority with NO provocation at all. I wrote letters and was told that they had no record of the incident.

Mike

Bajafun777 - 1-5-2014 at 11:21 AM

Gulliver, any type of gas container should NOT be allowed on any commercial plane, whether or not you think you washed it out perfectly fine too dangerous. What goes in a sig bottle Gulliver? You should have figured this was going to be an issue with everything that is excluded from air travel now. If this was allowed when you were leaving Seattle someone did not do THEIR JOB!

Maybe a NEW YORK thing you THINK?? No abuse of power here and again NO TYPE of gasoline container should ever be allowed on any plane especially a commercial plane that I am on. Shoe bombs, container bombs with more ways to kill people in the air than you can think. The agent in New York did his job period!

The way our stuff was gone through in leaving Los Angeles and Costa Rica you would have gotten the same response there also. Again, no abuse of power seen here but clearly attitude is seen loud and clear. Additionally, I don't care what color you are either, however the safety of others on the commercial plane is more important than giving you an ok. Others watch for weakness in shipping and allowing this type of item on a commercial plane only gives nut cases the idea to use this to blow up a plane.

Times have changed big time and taking chances for a few just should not happen, especially as I said when I am in the plane. I am sure you can find other creative ways to do camping without trying to take a used gasoline camp stove on a commercial plane. If this makes you mad so be it, as I know you will get over it. Still, I just don't see why you would want exceptions on things like gasoline containers to ever be allowed for others to put in the cargo area of a commercial plane. Again I say leave the DRAMA where it belongs and just ENJOY LIFE, BAJA, USA or any other country, as life is shorter than you think! Take Care & Travel Safe-----"No Hurry, No Worry, Just FUN" bajafun777

Gulliver - 1-5-2014 at 09:08 PM

So only new camp stoves can fly? Any time I want to camp outside the US I have to buy a new camp stove? That's silly. And it's silly to say that something having once has gas in it is dangerous. So there was a scent of gas. I deliberately left the cap off the SIG bottle so that no accumulation of vapors could happen. And it sat for a month before leaving. I can get on a plane with that much smell on my hands. The plane stinks more than that.

And he grabbed the stove too. Nothing there but aluminum.

Since then I have gotten in a conversation with an off duty TSA woman in Phoenix and her take was that the guy was out of line.

You weren't there. I was. He was wrong and you are mistaken and the whole TSA thing is out of control. They need to get some professionals involved. Fly ELAL for a different experience. They have trained personnel who target the right people and they have had no problems.

Bajafun777 - 1-5-2014 at 10:08 PM

Ok, let's just say I am wrong to help make you get happy and past this DRAMA. This is why when the few times I travel by air, I only take very basic things just to avoid anything being taken from me. I even purchase some of my personal items when I get to where I am going. So, I hear your anger but it is misplaced over this item. I guess this is where we agree to disagree on this matter.

If you were talking to an off duty TSA woman and she was saying it was fine to travel with a used stove that had gas in it then she was out of line. She should not be telling you to take such items on a plane especially since she wasn't the agent having to make the call. Now, a new unopened camp stove could have been shipped direct to where you wife's daughter was without any problems. I know you wouldn't have done that just like I wouldn't have, however you are resourceful and will figure another way to do it in the future.

I know your peeed but TSA gets it anyway they go especially if they allow something on a commercial plane that causes harm to other passengers. Too many things out there that can be used to take down a plane, so the lists of what is allowed or not allowed is a moving target. Unfortunately, what you wanted to board with was a direct hit on that moving target list that day.

Look, TSA is strict and our freedoms have been shorten due to 9/11, we all hate the way our World is now. Sad but our world is upside down most of the time due to the idiots out there trying to harm others and use cowardly attacks on us. Being a TSA agent is like being an IRS agent both professions have a lot of anger towards them. They both get heat from all directions in doing their jobs. They are making judgment calls just like referees in sports and a lot of Monday Night quarterbacking happens after the call, go figure. LOL

Hope you have lots of FUN travels and this DRAMA gets easier as time passes for you. If we ever run on to each other in Baja I will pop a cold one for you. Take Care & Travel Safe---"No Hurry, No Worry, Just FUN" bajafun777

durrelllrobert - 1-6-2014 at 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajafun777
Gulliver, any type of gas container should NOT be allowed on any commercial plane, whether or not you think you washed it out perfectly fine too dangerous. What goes in a sig bottle Gulliver? You should have figured this was going to be an issue with everything that is excluded from air travel now. If this was allowed when you were leaving Seattle someone did not do THEIR JOB!

Maybe a NEW YORK thing you THINK?? No abuse of power here and again NO TYPE of gasoline container should ever be allowed on any plane especially a commercial plane that I am on. Shoe bombs, container bombs with more ways to kill people in the air than you can think. The agent in New York did his job period!

The way our stuff was gone through in leaving Los Angeles and Costa Rica you would have gotten the same response there also. Again, no abuse of power seen here but clearly attitude is seen loud and clear. Additionally, I don't care what color you are either, however the safety of others on the commercial plane is more important than giving you an ok. Others watch for weakness in shipping and allowing this type of item on a commercial plane only gives nut cases the idea to use this to blow up a plane.

Times have changed big time and taking chances for a few just should not happen, especially as I said when I am in the plane. I am sure you can find other creative ways to do camping without trying to take a used gasoline camp stove on a commercial plane. If this makes you mad so be it, as I know you will get over it. Still, I just don't see why you would want exceptions on things like gasoline containers to ever be allowed for others to put in the cargo area of a commercial plane. Again I say leave the DRAMA where it belongs and just ENJOY LIFE, BAJA, USA or any other country, as life is shorter than you think! Take Care & Travel Safe-----"No Hurry, No Worry, Just FUN" bajafun777

When I worked for DoD I needed some INERT explosive simulant to test some new loading tooling and the only place it was made was at the PANTEX facility in Amarillo, TX so I flew there to pick up a kilogram. This stuff hardens at room temperature so they gave it too me in a Dewar packed on dry ice.

When I went to board my return flight security said that they needed the pilots permission to take it on board. After he examined the Dewar and I explained what was in it he said "You can't have dry ice in the main cabin but you can put it in the c-ckpit with me" This was on an American Airlines flight.

WTF? dry ice is too dangerous for the passengers but not the pilot? And why did he believe me when I told him that it was INERT and not LIVE explosives?

[Edited on 1-6-2014 by durrelllrobert]

Bajafun777 - 1-6-2014 at 06:24 PM

Bob, you just never know what the person making the judgment call will say, especially now with all of the coward pieces of crap trying to harm and kill people for their own selfish means. This is funny and alarming all at the same time and probably if the airline knew what he did he would have had big problems. Times for all of us have change my Nomad brother but we will get through it all finding our ways to have FUN!! LOL Take Care & Travel Safe-------"No Hurry, No Worry, Just FUN" bajafun777

Life's NOT an airborne GAS ?

MrBillM - 1-7-2014 at 10:47 AM

The prohibition of a "Gas" camp stove with residual fumes would seem an easy call in today's environment and a fairly weak exhibit in support of a Bureaucracy gone Berserk.

MOST would want to see a better example.

monoloco - 1-7-2014 at 01:24 PM

It also happened to this woman in Phoenix over breast milk:

http://youtu.be/2XhnZlmLGK8

http://www.dailymail.co.uk/news/article-1334228/Breast-feedi...

monoloco - 1-7-2014 at 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by soulpatch
For what it is worth each airport sets the criteria for how their TSA people conduct business.
I have found Phoenix more than pleasant and San Diego searched my 8 year old twins head to toe.....

You can't blame them after all the incidences of Al Qaida terrorists using anglo children to carry out attacks on commercial aviation. :lol:

Straighten UP and Fly RIGHT !

MrBillM - 1-15-2014 at 10:15 AM

Given the FACT that the TSA and other security procedures have been in effect for quite awhile now and virtually ANYBODY can (for the most part) secure information on what is or isn't allowable, WHY make it a sport to TEST the system ?

And, then Whine, B-tch and Moan over the consequences ?

Comply and Fly.

Simple.

Granted, that there are going to be instances where individual agents go overboard, BUT the degree to which so many of these confrontations begin with a questionable act on the passenger's part and are further egged on by said passenger ranting over his "Constitutional" or other RIGHTS, makes it clear that simple compliance and cooperation would reduce the number of problematic encounters by a great amount.

I found long ago that my Border Crossings became much simpler and pleasant when I became more pleasant and cooperative. Reducing those confrontational events to ZERO in the last 10-15 years of crossings.