BajaNomad

How long has the road from San Juanica to the Lagoon been a toll road ?

AKtundra - 2-17-2014 at 12:28 PM

Not sure of it's been on tis forum or not, but a family has put a fence across the road between San Juanica and the San Ignacio Lagoon. The fence routes drivers up to their house, where an old, non english speaking fellow comes out, digs an old carefully folded yellow piece of paper with a note written in English. The note has had several additions over time, but basically states, they have run out of water, fuel, or could use some pesos. Besides, if you have any trouble ahead, they will be the closest help.

Don't mind sharing basic essentials, but don't like feeling like a shake down. What's the forum's feeling on rackets like this? Frankly had I known, probably would have brought a few gallons to swap for a lunch.

[Edited on 2-17-2014 by AKtundra]

woody with a view - 2-17-2014 at 12:53 PM

since you are new to the area a little reading might be beneficial. it's long, but full of info! thanks to my buddy, The Taxcutter.

North Road Thoughts....

I have traveled every road into S-bay since 1979. And even though I want less people in the water, I really want to stop people from making the wrong choices in roads. The photo of the dirt road on the web site looks too easy. Don't fool yourself. And please remember to be prepared for the camping conditions; shade, windscreen, lanterns, etc. However, I do stick to the one rule of helping fellow travelers that are stuck and broken down on the dirt road, usually in the middle of nowhere.

First, thanks Dave and Laurie for getting the message board up and running! And is the wireless working at the Cantina? I imagine Internet access is now working as well at the Cantina. Again, many thanks. The both of you work very hard and have to deal with a lot of funky people. Especially you, Lauire.
Before you go remember this, S-bay has a very, very small swell window and it could be flat for days, weeks. So before you go, think and plan very carefully about going to S-bay. Plus remember the tides, high tide can shut down 3rd point.

Another thing to consider is even though a swell maybe hitting S-bay, the surf is very lully or inconsistent. It makes it great to paddle out. Most times you can paddle out without getting your hair wet. But waiting for 20 minutes for a 3 wave set can tax your patience.
And remember this, if you are reading my post, on this web site, I imagine thousands of other people are eye balling S-bay. Last summer, June, July, August, the place was packed. Now it's not Newport Beach, but more than likely, it's packed and the prime campsites are gone. At least most people are somewhat respectful and share waves, but after a 20 minute lull, the crowd gets hungry.

Ok, I can understand you really want to go to S-bay. Please be respectful to your fellow travelers. And be very, very respectful to the Mexican locals. You are a guest in their country and it is the hyper-kooks that ruin it for the rest of us.

Regardless of which road, is your car up to the challenge? Although in 1980 a friend drove a VW Karmenn Gia via the south road (he got stuck in moon dust sand and was eaten alive my sand fleas while digging out) and three years ago, I saw a Porsche at S-bay, your car is your life and is your car up to the challenge?

May I suggest you bring an extra tire or 2 and dump any donut spare tire. And make sure the spare is properly filled with air. Get a good jack and lug nut wheel wrench. The standard car jack does not cut it and the standard lug nut wheel wrench does not have the torque to get the lug nuts off of your car. Bring an air compressor that plugs into your car cigarette lighter. And don't buy the small cheap air compressor. It gets too hot in the desert and either the device will shut down quickly or break. The combo battery charger and air compressor is my choice; it does not need the car cig lighter.

I always bring duck tape; zip ties, various hose clamps and ropes. The dirt road, North, East or South, will rattle any bolt, screw or clamp. So if you break down, maybe you can limp on out using some duck tape, etc. In April, my front grill rattled off on the upper North road. At San Ignacio, a fellow traveler, laughing at me, mentioned that he saw my grill on the side of the road just north of Cadaje. One year, I used my surf leash to tie up my back bumper. A zip tie saved me another year. One year I went thru 3 tires! Another year, I duck taped my radiator hose and poured beer into the radiator. Last year a shock mount busted and I had to get that wielded back on. Be prepared, please, or else!

Remember, every bolt, screw, clamp will be tested. The dirt road will rattle your car to pieces. One year my car CD player rattled loose and was stuck so hard inside the dash board that I could not get it out. I ended up listening to one CD for 3 weeks. Now I know the words to every song, POD plays. Even if you take the south road, your car will be tested.

This last April, my 4x4 Chevy Suburban broke down, going home on the upper North road. Just pass El Cuarenta, and just pass Senior Aguila's Ranch (the guy at the gate). The seal for the back end differential broke and the drive shaft popped off and the oil spilled out. The seal costs 2 bucks to replace. But I was stuck in the middle of nowhere. It took me 3 days to get out. And I was very, very lucky.

I am not a negative person, but get real. Your car will be tested and your camping skills will be tested. Be very, very prepared. As a general rule, if you did not bring it, you will not have it.

Here's one hot tip for camping. It gets really windy and if you are camping, go buy telephone pole stakes to hold down your tent and/or shade. I bought mine at Home Depot, located near the rebar and cement section. The ground is a hard as rock, in fact, it's lava rock. And forget about plastic stakes for your tent. You will not get plastic stakes into the ground. Even regular metal tent stakes break or bend. You need the heavy duty telephone pole stakes. Trust me on this one.

If it is your first time into Baja, or traveling with people that stress out easily, or speak none or very little Spanish, or have no time for a break down, or not well equipped, or just love your car, do not take the North or East Road. In fact, don't drive down. Fly to Hawaii and surf.

Upper North Road
I always fill up with gas at the Pemex station, on the main road, at San Ig, it is the last chance to purchase gas from a Pemex station. You can purchase gas in San Juanico from Camacho, and other local places along the dirt road, but it will be more expensive, if you can get it at all. One year, a friend purchased gas from a local, in the middle of nowhere, but soon afterwards, his car fuel injection system clogged up. Dirty gas, and you know what happened next. However, in San J, Camacho (Gasolinero Los Chinos) is a super cool local and I have never had any problems with gas from him. In fact, he is a great mechanic and has a super cool family.

Turning right off the Mex 1, the main paved road, I go into San Ig. Depending on the time, I stop off and get something to eat. Remember, it's 105 or so off road miles and generally takes 3-4 hours to get to San J. And if you start late in the day, it could be nite time by the time you get into S-bay. One golden rule: do not drive at night. Just too many stories and friends that die, crash or get lost at night. Please, do not drive at night. Regardless, you do not want to set up camp at night. It sucks and it's a hassle. Personally, I do not want you to camp next to me, if you pull up next to my camp at night. Again, show some simple respect! If you don't think you will make it to San J. before sundown, stop at San Ig. and stay at Rice and Beans. Super cool people, they speak English, clean rooms and more than likely, you'll run into some fellow surf travelers. On top of that, you can get a report on the North Road.
I always stop at the church in San Ig. I light a candle, pray for safe travels and donate some pesos. The church is at the main town square. If you go into the church, it will blow your mind away, super cool. Turning left, at the church, passing the square, the (I been doing it for so long, I don't even think about it) third street or so, I take a right, up a small hill, the satellite tower is on top, and turn left and that's the start of the dirt road to Laguna San Ig.
In April, taking the North Road, just outside of San Ig, the locals were dumping and covering the washboard with hard dirt. It was around Zacaria area, about 10 k outside San Ig. So be prepared to see dump trucks and a grader. Drive slowly and try not to kick up a lot of dust. Remember this motto, I am a guest, a tourist in Mexico. Show some, no, show a lot of respect. Don't be a hyper-kook from the big city. As they say, " take it easy."

About 30 miles on the washboard, heading towards Laguna from San Ig, more than likely, you will see a sign suggesting you to turn left. The sign should say something like Scorpion Bay, and has an arrow pointing left. A typical Mexican sign. You look at the sign and think is this for real? This is the start and of the route to take the upper North road. You have a choice to make. Keep going straight, and the road will take you pass Laguna and Fish camps and through the salt flats to San J or turn left on what I call the upper North road.

If you never have been on the North road, I suggest you turn left at the marker and take the upper North road. A lot of locals take this road (maybe, one car a day?). Since it is in daily?, weekly? use, the road is ok for being a washboard. For the first 30 miles or so, generally, it's flat. There are some sand sections, but not that bad. The last 30 miles it can get steep hilly with arroyo washouts. The arroyos can be nasty. But with a 4x4 car, it should no problem, maybe. Thankfully, I did not come across the famous moon dust, sand sections, this last April.

On dirt roads, at times, you will notice a parallel road to the main dirt road you are on. The locals, at times, start, make or travel on the parallel road. This is because the main road is too washboard or was washed out from rains the year before or for some other reason. But be aware. This parallel road is usually sandy and sometimes difficult to get back on the main dirt road or it will take you away in a different direction and you can get lost or worse you can get stuck. So if you are a rookie, stay on the road most traveled on, the main dirt road. If in doubt, stop and check out the dirt for tire tracks on the road. And when I say stay on the main dirt road, you will be laughing on what is considered the main dirt road.

On the upper North road, you will come across a little ranch just past an arroyo washout. It's about 25 miles from the laguna turn off around the El Cuarenta area on the map. You have to cross his property to continue south and usually he has a gate closed. No problem, his name is Thomas Aquila (last name may be misspelled, I know him as Senior Thomas). He has a huge family, something like 8 sons and who knows how many daughters and he knows everybody in the region. He even has a son, that's a fisherman. And the fishermans son lives next to the salt flats road. At one point, but not today, I'll tell you about him and the salt flats. Senior Thomas is around 70 years old and in great shape and does not speak English. But when he opens the gate for you, he will show you a piece of paper.

The piece of paper will ask you if, (very respectfully) if you can spare some water or some food. Please, show him some kindness and respect and offer/give his family whatever you can spare. If you flip over the piece of paper, hopefully you will see my comments. More importantly, if you are leaving S-bay, heading Northbound, give him everything you can spare. You don't need all your junk. You are leaving heading home. Not only is Senior Thomas a nice guy and great family, not only he knows everybody in the region, more than likely if you get stuck, lost, broken down, whatever, he will help you. He has help many of my friends and me. Please give what you can. Remember, Karma.

This upper North Road is pretty much straight. No major decisions on which fork in the road to take. If you make a wrong choice and turn left, you will end up in the mountains. If you make another wrong choice, and turn right, you will end up at the ocean. Remember to look for tire tracks on the road. You may make a turn, go around a bend but you should end up heading South again. And if you make a wrong choice, you will know pretty quickly. If you took the salt flats, you can get lost very easily. The East Road is very, very easy to take a wrong fork in the Road. And you must be lame if you get lost on the South Road. Again, look for the road most traveled!

From his ranch, you are a little less than half way there. The road is washboard and at times can get a little hilly. Be careful on the hills. Another rule: If you can't see the road ahead of you, slow, slow down. It just seems a lot of people crash around the hilly sections because as they go around a corner, a cow, a horse, a mule, a donkey, a person, a car, the burm, a rut, soft sand and so many other reasons, something makes your crash.

In the early days of my Mexico travels, I met this guy at S-bay. He told me, a couple of years earlier, he was driving alone, at night, in a new camper/truck to S-bay and he hit a cow. He totaled his car. Furthermore, if you hit a cow, it's like hitting a family member!
Remember, you are automatically guilty if you get into a car accident and more than likely to will go to jail until the police figures it out. Which means "getting money from you." So here's my plug; I always get my Mexico car insurance at www.mexicanautoinsurance.com/ It's Lewis & Lewis and even though Old man Lewis is retired, his son is a great person and he a some great stories of idiot/stupid/horror stories of American drivers in Baja.
Anyway, this guy did not have Mexican car insurance and after the accident some Americans grabbed him, hush, hushed, him into their car and drove him North and across the boarder. This guy had to leave everything he owned and he was in bad shape. But he was very grateful and alive. Can you imagine being thrown into a Mexican jail and you need a doctor? However, when he hit the cow, the cow bounced up over the hood and smashed into the windshield and the cow hit his head and leather burnt his forehead and hair. So when I met him at S-bay, he had a big scar burn on the front quarter of his head and that section of his hair was gone and could never grow back again. Although it was a kinda funny story told to me many, many years ago at S-bay one night, please drive safe and not at night.

Around 10 miles before Ballena del Raymondo is the turn off for the salt flats. I'll talk more about the salt flats route later, much later.
Around Ballena del Raymondo (it's on the map) sometimes, the Military has a minor checkpoint. This last April, the Military boys were hanging out and stoped me. And when I say minor, it's usually just a couple of guys bored stiff. Sometimes, the Military guys are there. Sometimes they are not. And these guys almost never can speak a lick of English, so be prepared. I usually never get hassled because I speak Spanish. But, if you give them some gum or maybe a deck of playing cards, it will make there day. My buddy likes to give them Playboy Magazines!

This next section has plateau/hills. And going up and down the plateau's, the road get a bit steeper and you traverse thru some arroyos (washouts) that may have some water flowing. It can be round river rocky, and have soft sandy areas. The washout areas can have deep ruts. The local Mexican do not like or want to drive in the ruts or heavy washboards. Always look for the most traveled road. But it depends on the time of year and/or storms that year. Since my trip in April, the upper North Road was not bad at all (Last year 2003, late Aug/Sept. heavy rains from a hurricane washed out the South Road and the rumor is the South Road still has many soft sand areas). Going southbound, on the North road, on your left is a huge mountain range. It could be dry as a bone on the road, but up in the mountains, it could be raining hard and a flash flood could happen. So be advised, any arroyo, washout or riverbed can flash flood or have enough water to sweep your car away. I've seen it happen. So the hot tip is not to park in the center of the arroyo. If in doubt, stop your car and check it out before any crossing. Always look for the most traveled road.

This last April 2004, it was dry as a bone, except for a trickle at Cadaje.
Now Cadaje is like the county seat. It is where they make the decisions for the area, including San J. There is a small airport, a Military outpost and a school and a bunch of homes. On the North road, going south, you are on a plateau, you come around a corner, now going down a steep hill and there it is, Cadaje. At the school, turn right, cross the arroyo and back up the steep hill. If you miss the turn, the road ends in town. You're about 15 miles to San J.
But remember, anytime you travel thru a town, village or by a home, slow down. You don't want to kick up dust or run over a chicken and a lot of times a local policeman just may be hanging out just waiting for some gringo to fail to stop at some stop sign that is hidden or going faster than 5 miles an hour.
This is especially true as you head into San J. It's around 10-15 miles from Cadaje. And as you approach San Juanico, you are hot, tired and just want to get a beer at the cantina. But slow down. You are going down a gentle hill approaching San J. The local police can see you coming down this gentle hill. The police are really mellow, but they still have to make some beer money. Slow Down! As you enter the town, turn at the first left. Go slowly down the street. Please drive slow. Make a right at the end of the street. This is the Malcon and the ocean is right there. Go straight ahead on the Malcon, past Arthuro's liquor store, up gringo hill, and about half a mile from the Malcon is the Scorpion Bay Cantina.

Last year, I heard, a young girl, alone, in a VW camper bus took the upper North Road, drove in from San Ig and had no problems. A 2 wheel drive car can make it. I have taken the North Road with a 2 wheel drive van with little clearance. You see the Mexican locals do it all the time. But, I have also taken the South road in a 2 wheel drive car and I got stuck in the soft sand. But if you get stuck or break down, you have better have stocked up on the beer and ice before your trip.

On a closing note, be respectful, be patient, relax; it could be worse. Bring candy for the local kids and clothes for the families. Count the billion stars at night. Relax, you can always fix your car later. But be prepared to rattle every bolt, nut and screw in your car. And if you break down and I see you, please have a cold beer for me.

I will stop to help you.



[Edited on 2-17-2014 by woody with a view]

AKtundra - 2-17-2014 at 01:13 PM

I try to research my routes very carefully, but missed that info.

Nuts.... I had two 10 ltr fuel cans, but did not have gas in them. Last trip, never needed the extra fuel. This trip bought them at home depot, but never filled 'em.

Could have been better prepared

TMW - 2-17-2014 at 02:53 PM

When I have been thru there the gate was not locked. But I have given them food and batteries etc several times. Not the old old man (grandpa) but the father (maybe late 40s) told me his name was Martin and his son was Martin jr (late teens to mid 20s). There was another son but I don't remember his name. The wife and a couple of girls never came out of the house when I was there. Whatever you can spare is good. They do help if you get stuck etc.

Sweetwater - 2-17-2014 at 03:19 PM

I went through there heading south 3 years ago. Nobody came out of the house and it looked deserted. We were on 2 motos and were sure to button up the gate we went through. The silt beds were horrendous and there were rocks in the sandy sections. UGH

Two years ago I rode the salt flats through Datil on bigger motos. The sand was smoother and we made good time although we did get separated. I much prefer this road but you must clean your vehicle soon after because it gets loaded up with corrosive snot. San Juanico is such a great spot that it's worth the effort.

motoged - 2-17-2014 at 03:35 PM

Passing through private property has it's risks and costs at times. This ranchero is not "shaking you down" , but is presenting his position on paper as he may well not speak English.

I broke my leg in a silt bed 150 meters south of his rancho three years ago, so prefer to take the salt flat route in the future.

I suggest you appreciate your status as a visitor and demonstrate appropriate respect for this family.

If it was in the USA, you would likely have a redneck pointing a gun at you. :light:

rts551 - 2-17-2014 at 04:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by AKtundra
Not sure of it's been on tis forum or not, but a family has put a fence across the road between San Juanica and the San Ignacio Lagoon. The fence routes drivers up to their house, where an old, non english speaking fellow comes out, digs an old carefully folded yellow piece of paper with a note written in English. The note has had several additions over time, but basically states, they have run out of water, fuel, or could use some pesos. Besides, if you have any trouble ahead, they will be the closest help.

Don't mind sharing basic essentials, but don't like feeling like a shake down. What's the forum's feeling on rackets like this? Frankly had I known, probably would have brought a few gallons to swap for a lunch.

[Edited on 2-17-2014 by AKtundra]


imagine that. only speaking spanish (the national language) in Mexico.

Agreed x 2

captkw - 2-17-2014 at 04:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by motoged
Passing through private property has it's risks and costs at times. This ranchero is not "shaking you down" , but is presenting his position on paper as he may well not speak English.

I broke my leg in a silt bed 150 meters south of his rancho three years ago, so prefer to take the salt flat route in the future.

I suggest you appreciate your status as a visitor and demonstrate appropriate respect for this family.

If it was in the USA, you would likely have a redneck pointing a gun at you. :light:

Ateo - 2-17-2014 at 05:08 PM

I'm totally cool with kicking in a few sheckles. Having said that, I will never take that way in again. I lost my cow catcher off the front grill of my Isuzu Rodeo on that road back in 1994. I hit a big bump going too fast and that cow catcher flew over the top of my vehicle and landed behind us. That's how fast I was going. Oh to be a 20 year old again.

San Ignacio to San Juanico (Scorpion Bay) on Maps

David K - 2-17-2014 at 06:09 PM

Rancho Cuarenta is not on the AAA map, but it is by the mileage figure '30.7' between the lagoon and San Jose de Garcia, on the middle road.





The 2010 Baja 1000 came by Rancho Cuarenta (between RM 610 and RM 620):



Again in 2012:




2003 TOPO MAP:




ZOOM in on Cuarenta:

basautter - 2-17-2014 at 07:31 PM

I ran into the old dude about 6 years ago. We gave him some batteries, water and a few food items. I am guessing if we needed something, he would have done his best to help.

Ateo

captkw - 2-18-2014 at 12:10 AM

LOL...Locktite and a re torque now and then is needed once in a while in Baja !! I've found the local (myself) folks are priceless when SHTF way out in the middle of nowhere...That's the "real" Baja IMO...folks helping folks is the way of life in Baja....not TJ but most of the 1000 mile long fishing pier !!!....PS..BTW we used to need a cow THROWER back in the day...not needed anymore !!!

[Edited on 2-18-2014 by captkw]

gnukid - 2-18-2014 at 06:14 AM

The most dangerous section is the shakedown that happens once you arrive by 'surfers'. Be wary of gringos.