BajaNomad - North Road to Scorpion Bay

North Road to Scorpion Bay

ogfast50 - 10-2-2014 at 08:44 AM

Does anyone know if North road (high road ) is
passable yet? Low road mud flats?
East road from HWY 1 to La Purisma?

woody with a view - 10-2-2014 at 08:54 AM

south road only in a truck. unless you feel lucky!

Russ - 10-6-2014 at 06:32 AM

Has anyone tried to go over the mountain from Mulege to Scorpion Bay?

Ateo - 10-6-2014 at 08:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Russ
Has anyone tried to go over the mountain from Mulege to Scorpion Bay?

Yes, I have. But not recently.

oladulce - 10-6-2014 at 09:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Russ
Has anyone tried to go over the mountain from Mulege to Scorpion Bay?

A friend with family on a rancho in the mountains along the road from Mulege to La Ballena (the road Russ is referring to) says he tried on his motorcycle and it wasn't possible. His Dad told him it's horseback only. This was before the heavy downpour we had last night.

motoged - 10-6-2014 at 10:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ateo
Yes, I have. But not recently.

Road Conditions into Scorpion Bay

ogfast50 - 10-7-2014 at 06:02 AM

Does anyone know if North road is passable yet?
East Road from HWY 1 to La Purisma?
All experienced riders on XR650's

BajaBlanca - 10-7-2014 at 06:07 AM

Let me just say that the clouds outside are a solid black and I bet those mountains sustained massive rains last night as well as strong winds, which are expected to last all day today.

experienced or not- ogfast50 - now does not seem like the right time to go.

welcome to baanomads!

woody with a view - 10-7-2014 at 06:52 AM

if you're on bikes I can think of no reason you won't be able to find a way through.

supsurfhb - 10-7-2014 at 10:00 AM

i'm trying to figure out if my planned trip to scorpion bay is going to be doable in the next couple of days.

does anyone know if the south road is passable. i'll be in a 2 wheel drive van with reasonable clearance. also, any show stopper issues on hwy 1 or 53?

thanks,

tom

proneman - 10-8-2014 at 03:24 PM

Just heard of a guy who drove in on the south road from Insurgentes....What would normally be less than 3 hours took him 12 hours.....
Oh BTW, word is that the points are marginal after losing massive amouts of sand....

bajaspuds - 10-9-2014 at 03:19 PM

Sounds gnarly. Any rain from Simon would only make it worse.
Is the road getting any serious reconstruction work yet?

BCSTech - 10-11-2014 at 08:05 AM

I heard yesterday from one of the locals that the south road from Insurgentes is just barely passable for a 4X4 vehicle, but it is not yet in good condition.

After the scare we had going through one of the vados there three weeks ago after Norbert, I would wait a bit. Water came up to the headlights on a Suburban. I hope I never do anything that stupid again.

Zola - 10-16-2014 at 01:55 PM

The south road is passable.

Any reports on the north roads from San Ignacio into San Juanico?

North road (high road)

Jasha - 10-18-2014 at 08:10 AM

I've heard the salt flats are no good but has anyone heard about the high road from San Ignacio to San Juanico (scorps) along the mesa's?

[Edited on 10-18-2014 by Jasha]

Udo - 10-18-2014 at 10:32 AM

I don't have an answer for you, Jasha...

But I wish you a hearty welcome to Baja Nomads!!!

joel - 10-18-2014 at 01:19 PM

I know someone who made it through on the Middle Road. They said that there was water on parts they'd never seen before. Heading north, you need to cut off the middle road about 15 miles before Ballena to head towards the mesas. Sounded like an adventure.

Jasha - 10-18-2014 at 02:04 PM

Thanks Udo! This is my first trip down so I'm not familiar with the roads. I've talked with a friend who's made the trip a lot and he's shared with me the salt flat road(s), the high road and the long paved road staying all on road. Joel, is the middle road part of the high road? Also in coming from San Ignacio down and it sounded like you were talking about heading north.

Thanks already for the quick replies everyone. I'm excited to head out on Tuesday. Anyone else going down that way?

[Edited on 10-18-2014 by Jasha]

Zola - 10-19-2014 at 03:29 PM

I arrived yesterday in San Juanico from the north by the middle road. Do not even think about driving on the north road unless you have an 4X4 with high clearance. Instead of driving west to the Lagunas sign and then turning left (south) onto the high road, you must take an unmarked detour that is to the east (before) the usual turn-off. The detour is not marked, and shortly after you take it you must drive through a pretty deep stream of water. There are several other streams and a lot of mud at points. I have an FJ Cruiser, and for me it was fun and an adventure, and it is a beautiful drive. After the detour, the middle road is marked for the Baja 1000, but with all of the water I do not think that this is not a good offroad trial unless you have already driven it before.

I would not try it if this is your first time. The south road is passable, but for it too you need a 4X4 with lots of clearance because of flooded arroyos in parts (at least, that is what I have heard). I hope that this helps.

[Edited on 10-19-2014 by Zola]

rts551 - 10-19-2014 at 03:43 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Zola
I arrived yesterday in San Juanico from the north by the middle road. Do not even think about driving on the north road unless you have an 4X4 with high clearance. Instead of driving west to the Lagunas sign and then turning left (south) onto the high road, you must take an unmarked detour that is to the east (before) the usual turn-off. The detour is not marked, and shortly after you take it you must drive through a pretty deep stream of water. There are several other streams and a lot of mud at points. I have an FJ Cruiser, and for me it was fun and an adventure, and it is a beautiful drive. After the detour, the middle road is marked for the Baja 1000, but with all of the water I do not think that this is not a good offroad trial unless you have already driven it before.

I would not try it if this is your first time. The south road is passable, but for it too you need a 4X4 with lots of clearance because of flooded arroyos in parts (at least, that is what I have heard). I hope that this helps.

[Edited on 10-19-2014 by Zola]

plus you are going to start seeing some pre-run traffic adding to the fun.

Jasha - 10-19-2014 at 11:56 PM

Thank you Zola!! I have a 98' FJZ100 but I don't have a snorkel installed. I've driven off-road enough to be comfortable with a challenge. I know things change but in your opinion is not having a snorkel an issue with making it through?

Zola - 10-20-2014 at 04:08 PM

I am likely an ignorant driver, as I did not even know there is such a thing as a snorkel that can be fitted onto a car. I did have this advantage: I speak Spanish fluently and was able to ask for guidance at the Pemex and then again out on the trails, where I met a man by the tractor who told me where to take the detour. He said that my car would make it through, that it might look bad, but that the bottom is hard, and it would work. I am also very familiar with the route. If you have not gone before, or if your car does not have very high clearance and excellent 4x4 capacity, this is not the time to come here from the north. (Besides, there is no surf, and they say that the sands have been washed away from the points, affecting the quality of the wave.)

If you go, try to come over the trails when the tide is low. There was water in places where I had never seen it before. If you drive too far towards the Laguna, you will approach a newly formed estuary directly underneath your precarious sand bridge, and then you will have to back up very delicately, as I did. That is why I approached the man by the tractor after turning back. You have to take the left onto the detour. Shortly afterwards you will traverse the high water.

From there it is all a beautiful, invigorating ride, assuming you have made it to there!

[Edited on 10-20-2014 by Zola]

Sweetwater - 10-20-2014 at 09:37 PM

I am astounded to keep reading these reports.....I've done both the high and salt flats roads on motos over the past 5 years...The maps show that the low (salt flats) road is the route for this years Baja Mil....if there's a new estuary and and the need for snorkels on 4x4's, how's that going to work out for the race?

TMW - 10-21-2014 at 07:32 AM

The Baja 1000 marking crews have already been thru there and they have not reported any problems only the section from San Javier to hwy53 which they say will or should be cleared yesterday or today. Surely the people from El Datel have been using the road to get to San Ignacio. If you don't see any vehicle tracks don't go that way.

Zola - 10-21-2014 at 09:52 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Sweetwater
I am astounded to keep reading these reports.....I've done both the high and salt flats roads on motos over the past 5 years...The maps show that the low (salt flats) road is the route for this years Baja Mil....if there's a new estuary and and the need for snorkels on 4x4's, how's that going to work out for the race?

I did not use a snorkel and made it, but the water at the detour approached my headlights. I think that it is the section of the trail to which the last poster referred. Also, the Baja 1000 markers run along the middle road along the salt flats, not the low road. It has been sunny and dry here every day. Maybe everything is drying out quickly. After the one high-water section, there were a few other streams that we also crossed, but they were not nearly as gnarly. I do not think a motorcycle could have made it on the day when we went -- last Saturday. I presume it is better now.

[Edited on 10-22-2014 by Zola]

Zola - 11-7-2014 at 11:36 PM

Here is an update on the condition of the north roads from San Juanico to San Ignacio, going through Campo Datil and taking the middle road. There is a lot less water than there was three weeks ago. There was a lot of sand on the middle road, almost too much sand. There were high waters in Campo Datil because of high-level high tides, but it was all easily passable. Some of the Baja 1000 markers have fallen off, and the route is not as perfectly marked as it was when we came down. Because of the hurricane waters before and the high-level high tides right now, motorists should take special care to stay on trails that have tire-marks. We tried making our own trail from the middle road to the high road and very nearly became hopelessly stuck in no time at all. It was a stroke of luck that we were able to break clear and return to the middle road. The detour from the paved road to the high road is in worse shape now than it was three weeks ago. A lot of sand has blown onto it, and it is not as well marked as it was three weeks ago. There is still standing water that you must clear at one part, but it is only half as high now as it was before. Overall there are many more people out and about on these trails than there were three weeks ago. The Baja 1000 will come through shortly. I hope that this is helpful to someone out there.

A local rancher told us that the high road remains unpassable. The low road is also a bad call because of the high-level high tides occurring right now.

[Edited on 11-8-2014 by Zola]

TMW - 11-14-2014 at 12:19 PM

On Monday the 10th left San Ignacio and unloaded Tunaeater for pre-run on the race course which turns off the main road about 7.5 miles from SI. I continued down the main road. It's paved for about 25 miles. After the pavement there is one spot where the right side was covered with dirt with the left lane OK. A little further a wash crossing had some minor damage. Passed an 18 wheeler coming out from the Laguna area. Two single lane sections in the dirt before the Laguna. First one maybe 1/4 mile long with no pull overs for passing. Second one a little longer with pull overs. Turned south at the San Jose de Gracia sign reconnecting with the race course and Tunaeater. He went ahead to El Datil where I met him. Several places of soft sand. No problem going around mud flats, stay on most used road and SCORE markers.

Bike would not start at El Datil so loaded on carrier. Same conditions some soft sand spots and again stay on most used road around mud flats. Did not see any standing water. On the San Juanico road. One bridge out with detour around. Hit pavement at San Juanico. Pavement good to arroyo crossing way west of La Purisima bridge out. Again detour around it. Highway OK until road construction north of Santo Domingo. Pavement good down to hwy 1.

[Edited on 11-14-2014 by TW]

Ateo - 11-14-2014 at 12:23 PM

Excellent road update TW.

TMW - 11-14-2014 at 12:29 PM

Several friends I know were pre-running in four wheelers, trucks and buggies, south of El Datil and followed the SCORE GPS track and it went across a mud flat area instead of following the road around. It was Wednesday evening and they all got stuck. They finally got a tractor in and got out Thursday. Note the SCORE markers followed the most used road.

most used track?

AKgringo - 11-16-2014 at 11:24 AM

I think I found that mud flat when I came through a water crossing north of Datil in late October. The most used track had been drifted over with sand from a stiff breeze and I could not see the next score marker, so I followed the most obvious track.
It was apparently made by a couple of pre-runners who made a prematuhe crossing, found a place to turn around and followed their own tracks back through it. It sure made it look like the main track! The mud was like quicksand and got worse with every track put in it.
It took me an hour to get myself out of that mess, and another hour helping a local get his produce truck back on the trail.
That place gets locals too, he makes a business out of hauling produce from Vizcaino to Datile and San Juanico, and he got fooled!
By the way, three pre-runners passed by with no offer to help, and I can't help but think their trophy trucks could have pulled that 3/4 ton Chevy out better than my Kia Sportage did.
G.L.

Zola - 12-26-2014 at 12:59 PM

Any word on conditions of the north road from San Ignacio to San Juanico? Is it still necessary to take the detour a little to the east of the Laguna? Is the high road still closed?

Here is the update on my very solid off-road car after driving it through streams without a snorkel: The mechanics at the authorized dealer where I purchased it brand-new in 2013 tell me that it has a lot of rust on the underside, and that I can either replace a lot of components now or wait until they start to malfunction a few years from now.

So this is how I have learned about the need to place a snorkel on your car before attempting to cross streams in it!

woody with a view - 12-26-2014 at 03:50 PM

you should know that salt water is not your friend when a vehicle is involved.....

AKgringo - 12-26-2014 at 04:05 PM

Am I missing something here? To me a snorkel kit just keeps the water out of the air intake, and possibly a breather. The underside of the vehicle and other components won't be helped by that! Thorough cleaning and lubing are the treatment for salt exposure.

Tomas Tierra - 12-26-2014 at 04:42 PM

The ONLY way to avoid underbody rust on the north road is to take the upper/Mesa road.. Go anywhere near Datil and it is guaranteed to start.. And like my dock neighbor Neil Young says.. Rust never sleeps.
5 trucks over 20 years have proven this to me.. Wouldn't do it different. Love those people! Soy Datilero!!!!

Zola - 12-26-2014 at 07:59 PM

I have had the car inspected here in SD after each journey to San Juanico, and I have taken the high road only once. Until now the car (an FJ Cruiser) has gotten fine reports each time, with no problems. But the last time I had to drive through a stream that came up to the headlights and also through several other lesser streams (it was after Simon, in mid-October). That is what really got to my car. The mechanic says that the components on the undersigned are all rusted and will start to fail within 2-3 years.

Is it better to replace everything now or wait for another year or two?

woody with a view - 12-26-2014 at 08:07 PM

trade it in.....

fresh water up to the hood is an undercarriage rinse. toss in salt water and RUN AWAY!

Zola - 12-26-2014 at 08:22 PM

Wow!! I just bought it, brand new!

woody with a view - 12-26-2014 at 08:34 PM

since it's a Toyota you should have better luck. electrical components don't lkike to get a salt water E N E M A. too many minerals that will conduct electricity! you might get lucky?

worst case, check out our friends here who learned the hard way. watch every minute until you see what the water did to their circuit boards..... BRUTAL!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=13VXI9F3VTk

[Edited on 12-27-2014 by woody with a view]

Zola - 12-26-2014 at 09:20 PM

Sounds as though I need to bite the bullet, belly up to the bar, pay the piper, smell the coffee, and reap what I have foolishly sown! I will replace all of the components underneath the car that the mechanic says must be replaced. I love this car, it is by far and away the best off-road vehicle I have ever driven.

Next time, if it is inondated on the north roads, we will drive around Loreto and come in from the south! Saving eight hours, or however much it is, is not worth having to replace the entire underside of your brand new car. It has only 9k miles on it!!

Zola - 12-26-2014 at 09:22 PM

Sounds as though I need to bite the bullet, belly up to the bar, pay the piper, smell the coffee, and reap what I have foolishly sown! I will replace all of the components underneath the car that the mechanic says must be replaced. I love this car, it is by far and away the best off-road vehicle I have ever driven.

Next time, if it is inondated on the north roads, we will drive around Loreto and come in from the south! Saving eight hours, or however much it is, is not worth having to replace the entire underside of your brand new car. It has only 9k miles on it!!

Zola - 12-26-2014 at 09:41 PM

Sounds as though I need to bite the bullet, belly up to the bar, pay the piper, smell the coffee, and reap what I have foolishly sown! I will replace all of the components underneath the car that the mechanic says must be replaced. I love this car, it is by far and away the best off-road vehicle I have ever driven.

Next time, if it is inondated on the north roads, we will drive around Loreto and come in from the south! Saving eight hours, or however much it is, is not worth having to replace the entire underside of your brand new car. It has only 9k miles on it!!

AKgringo - 12-26-2014 at 10:47 PM

Zola, it sounds like you bought the right car for what you love to do, and I sure wouldn't quit doing it to make your rig last forever.
It is hard to imagine having have enough damage in nine thousand miles that you need to replace very much. I think I would get a second opinion, external rust doesn't necessarily mean ruined.

Zola - 12-27-2014 at 08:53 AM

You guys are definitely right about one thing -- the drive between San Ignacio and San Juanico is an adventure and indescribably beautiful every time!

[Edited on 12-27-2014 by Zola]

CP - 12-27-2014 at 11:14 AM

The 'long way' around from SI to SJ has some of the most beautiful vistas in all of Baja. Four hours longer, not so hard on the vehicle.

Zola - 2-5-2015 at 06:24 PM

Quote: Originally posted by woody with a view

trade it in.....

fresh water up to the hood is an undercarriage rinse. toss in salt water and RUN AWAY!

Correct answer! I today received a review and estimate for necessary repairs from the Toyota dealer in Kearny Mesa: Serious corrosion of key parts. Estimated cost of repairs, 20K + or 26K plus if I get a new "differential," plus they recommend that I have it professionally sealed. I paid 34k for the car brand new in 2013. I just paid off the loan. It has 9100 miles on it. I love this car.

[Edited on 2-6-2015 by Zola]

woody with a view - 2-5-2015 at 06:51 PM

the dealer is not your friend. find a local mechanic to look at it. my neighbor is an ASE Toyota Master grease monkey. U2U if you'd like an honest opinion.

Ateo - 2-5-2015 at 07:45 PM

I'll be taking this road soon! Can't wait. Checking the tides for the salt flats July 25th!

woody with a view - 2-5-2015 at 07:58 PM

I guess that's "soon"?