BajaNomad - What now???? RATTLER!

What now???? RATTLER!

BajaBlanca - 10-3-2014 at 04:15 AM

We are sitting outside with friends 2 days ago, when a hissing sound started.......our amigo WAHOOLARRY says: sounds like a rattler.

Sure enough, our dog Rex was sussing this weird creature out.

Larry told us they r territorial and we should kill it.It was a young one with 4 rattlers.

what a year so far - scorpions in BED and now a rattler on the porch. Basta.

woody with a view - 10-3-2014 at 05:41 AM

Dinner!

grace59 - 10-3-2014 at 05:52 AM

Seems like it has been a big year for Sidewinders, too! I saw lots of "tracks" in the sand on my early morning walks in San Felipe this summer. Many more than past summers. So glad that I didn't run across the actual snake. Kept my walks to the road and not across the desert.

mulegemichael - 10-3-2014 at 07:21 AM

tastes like chicken!!

BajaDanD - 10-3-2014 at 07:40 AM

if you kill it Eat it.

BajaBlanca - 10-3-2014 at 07:46 AM

got a good recipe? In all seriousness, anyone eat it before and does anyone have a recipe?

bajabuddha - 10-3-2014 at 07:49 AM

We get at least 3 kinds of buzz-worms here in southern NM in the warm months. I love 'em when they're in their 'yard', but when they come into mine, sorry Charlie. They get dispatched. Sidewinders are extremely aggressive too; I got out of my car once to 'shoo' one off a lonely highway to save his life; the bugger chased me back to my car!! Didn't know this fat old man could run so fast. Needless to say, his fate was then in his... er.... skin....
:wow:

chuckie - 10-3-2014 at 07:52 AM

Actually, Chicken tastes like Rattlesnake...Skin it, cut it into about 1 inch chunks, use an egg wash, roll in seasoned bread crumbs, shake & bake or such...deep fry it...pretty good...sometimes chewy...My daughters would kill 20-30/yr....Sell the skins, feed the guests at Moms upscale c-cktail do's..

BajaBlanca - 10-3-2014 at 07:56 AM

the skin is really beautiful.

bajabuddha - 10-3-2014 at 08:00 AM

Once 'dispatched', the skin peels off very easily like a glove. Stretch it over an old broomstick (or the like) and set in the sunshine for a week or so, and protect from mice or critters that might eat it. Makes wonderful belts, hatbands, and comes with a story....

AKgringo - 10-3-2014 at 08:05 AM

If you flour it and fry it ,like chicken, it really does tastr like chicken! Honestly though, that one is a little small to mess with. When I was a kid in northern CA, we would kill a half dozen or so around my grandfather's cabin every year.
That made sense at the time, because kids and dogs need protection, but they are rarely seen in that area anymore.
The property is mine now, and last year I found the first one I have seen in 20 years. I live trapped it and released him miles away from any residences.

bajalearner - 10-3-2014 at 08:06 AM

No. I don't like that pet. I would drive it to a new territory. Too far to slither or hitch hike back. No, no, no that thing is not my idea of a good neighbor. And she might have kids in the area.

Do they have critters that eat them? Birds of prey? Cats do any good with harassing them?

sd - 10-3-2014 at 08:06 AM

I had some home made pickled rattle snake, Los Barriles hospitality. Lots of cartilage to chew on along with the meat. It was tasty. Sorry, I don't have the recipe.

micah202 - 10-3-2014 at 08:37 AM

.
....once went to a 'rattlesnake grill'...I suppose they raised the rattlers they cooked up,,but I couldn't see the point in building a business around such -bony-critters-....neither did the marketplace :yawn:

Archie - 10-3-2014 at 09:24 AM

Please dont kill it.

Knowing where you found it, the size, scale pattern and coloration, it can only be either Crotalus exsul or Crotalus ruber

Both are protected species under the Federal Law, the first has a "Threatened" status for the reduction of natural habitat and low population, the later is labeled as "Subjet to special Protection" in the 2010 version of the Mexican Official Norm for Protected and Endangered species of flora and fauna at risk (NOM-059-SEMARNAT-2010).

Just leave it alone away from people, dogs or cats.

Snakes are top pest control, and with this year abundance of food for insects and rodents, believe me, we gonna need them..

[Edited on 10-3-2014 by Archie]

chuckie - 10-3-2014 at 09:31 AM

Noble thoughts unelss you are running cattle or horses where they are plentiful....Couple 4-500 dollar vet bills, and then you start killing them...Out of curiousity, what pests do they control? And I didnt know Mexico had a federal law protecting them, the US does not...

mojo_norte - 10-3-2014 at 10:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Archie
Please dont kill it.

Knowing where you found it, the size, scale pattern and coloration, it can only be either Crotalus exsul or Crotalus ruber

Both are protected species under the Federal Law, the first has a "Threatened" status for the reduction of natural habitat and low population, the later is labeled as "Subjet to special Protection" in the 2010 version of the Mexican Official Norm for Protected and Endangered species of flora and fauna at risk (NOM-059-SEMARNAT-2010).

Just leave it alone away from people, dogs or cats.

Snakes are top pest control, and with this year abundance of food for insects and rodents, believe me, we gonna need them..

[Edited on 10-3-2014 by Archie]

I'm with this guy. Beautiful animal. How hard is it to toss it in a bucket and drive it out in the desert far away from everything and let it go?

micah202 - 10-3-2014 at 10:13 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mojo_norte
How hard is it to toss it in a bucket and drive it out in the desert far away from everything and let it go?

....I'd be hoping yer have a lid for that bucket--I can't imagine they'd be too 'chill' with car rides!

mojo_norte - 10-3-2014 at 10:22 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by micah202

Quote:

Originally posted by mojo_norte
How hard is it to toss it in a bucket and drive it out in the desert far away from everything and let it go?

....I'd be hoping yer have a lid for that bucket--I can't imagine they'd be too 'chill' with car rides!

used those standard 5 gallon plastic utility buckets w/ tight fitting lid before - w/ care

Whale-ista - 10-3-2014 at 10:31 AM

Too bad this one got too close to Rex and family. Maybe looking for water? Rodents living near houses?

Snakes are valuable in maintaining a balance of rodents in the natural environment, but unfortunately dangerous near homes with people and pets.

micah202 - 10-3-2014 at 10:39 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Whale-ista
Too bad this one got too close to Rex and family. Maybe looking for water? Rodents living near houses?

Snakes are valuable in maintaining a balance of rodents in the natural environment, but unfortunately dangerous near homes with people and pets.

.
....hmmm,,,holy threadjump,,,,but I was reading about the Meerkats in the scorpion thread--it seems they're related to the Mongoose family and 'friendly unless attacked'......these might be the right 'rodent' to play the balance!? :rolleyes:

willardguy - 10-3-2014 at 10:41 AM

"I'm with this guy. Beautiful animal. How hard is it to toss it in a bucket and drive it out in the desert far away from everything and let it go?"

I know this is the right thing to do. but I know it would follow my tire tracks right back to my porch. im sorry but I gotta go with wahoolarry on this one!
(and yes im scared to death of these serpents

)

monoloco - 10-3-2014 at 01:00 PM

Another vote here for relocation. No need to kill them, just take him for a drive!

motoged - 10-3-2014 at 02:32 PM

Some years ago I had some survival training and we had a rattlesnake seminar. We have rattlers in British Columbia, and the presenter's father operated a gamefarm in Kaleden, BC (since shut down). The snake guy had a box of them and we had a chance to learn a few things:

1) When he brought one out of the box, EVERYONE was quick to paste themself to the farthest wall away from the wiggler :biggrin:

;

2) A rattler cannot strike farther than 1/2 its body length;

3) the babies three inches long are as toxic as adults;

4) not every bite is accompanied with venom.

A year later I came across one in that area and decided to examine its behaviour and try to reduce my mammalian fear of reptiles. I had a shovel in the truck and blocked its intended path of escape....it went through a range of behaviours to warn me, threaten me, and to escape.

I eventually killed it as I wanted to taste it and I wanted the skin.

It was somewhat like the texture of chicken white meat. I fried it ("sauteed" as Udo would say

) with no seasoning other than a bit of black pepper..... Not delicious but good enough if starving, for sure.

When I skinned it, I cut it from pooper to its head on the belly side, stretched it out on a board with wet side out and with pins from the sewing kit. After two days I reversed it to continue drying (w/ all 6 rattles intact ).

it was a conversation piece for a while.....I kept it rolled up w/ rattlers on outside of roll when storing it away.

One time I placed it under the passenger side sun visor in the truck so, when the visor was lowered, it dropped on the passenger as it quickly unfurled and rattled its way onto the passenger's lap .... :lol:

(is what I thought).

This time I was going hiking w/ a buddy to find more snakes around Okanagan Falls/ White Lake area....and on the way I asked him to get a map from under the visor....

Needless to say, Mark thought it was funny after he peeled himself on the roof of the cab.... :biggrin:

Never killed another one and wouldn't unless necessary.

I also don't hunt or fish.....but I eat flesh, so no moralizing here.

Just a snake story.

[Edited on 10-3-2014 by motoged]

liknbaja127 - 10-3-2014 at 07:29 PM

not a big fan of reptiles! my feeling....The only good snake is a dead snake,
just sayin :rolleyes:

tehag - 10-3-2014 at 08:25 PM

Looks to me like Crotalus enyo, Baja California Rattlesnake. Not aggressive. Don't grow very large. If you decide to relocate one, which seems much better to me than does killing it, take it a good mile away from your own traffic areas and release it in similar surroundings if you can. Some species can and will find their way home from some distance.

[Edited on 10-4-2014 by tehag]

mtgoat666 - 10-3-2014 at 08:26 PM

I kill the rattlers and spare the gopher snakes.
Venomous snakes bad. Nonvenomous snakes good.

mtgoat666 - 10-4-2014 at 07:23 AM

Ginormous Baja rattlesnakes!

http://www.bcsnoticias.mx/atrapan-vibora-gigante-cerca-de-ci...

This one lived to tell his friends...

David K - 10-4-2014 at 08:32 AM

My daughter having watched too many Steve Irwin shows got closer to this red diamondback then I liked, but I had to take a photo as it wasn't going to happen again! This was on the road to Punta San Francisquito, south from Bahia de los Angeles in April, 2003. After the photo op, we let him go on his merry way.

Benjediver - 10-5-2014 at 02:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajabuddha
We get at least 3 kinds of buzz-worms here in southern NM in the warm months. I love 'em when they're in their 'yard', but when they come into mine, sorry Charlie. They get dispatched. Sidewinders are extremely aggressive too; I got out of my car once to 'shoo' one off a lonely highway to save his life; the bugger chased me back to my car!! Didn't know this fat old man could run so fast. Needless to say, his fate was then in his... er.... skin....
:wow:

The Sidewinder in NM might be aggressive. The ones in San Felipe BC are NOT aggressive at all and usually fairly small.

baconjr - 10-5-2014 at 02:34 PM

I have been told Benadryl for infants works well at combating venom in dogs. Dog owners in Borrego Springs keep it on handy seeing that there is no medical services available in the area. Has anyone had any experience with it?

bajaguy - 10-5-2014 at 02:39 PM

We have taken our Labrador Retriever to Rattlesnake Avoidance Training. That and an anti-venom shot every year. The shot slows down the toxic affects of the snakebite, allowing you to get to a Vet for treatment.

http://socalrattlesnakeavoidancetraining.com/home.php

Your Vet should know who is doing the training

Quote:

Originally posted by baconjr
I have been told Benadryl for infants works well at combating venom in dogs. Dog owners in Borrego Springs keep it on handy seeing that there is no medical services available in the area. Has anyone had any experience with it?

[Edited on 10-5-2014 by bajaguy]

BajaBlanca - 10-5-2014 at 05:28 PM

fascinating read! Of course I will relocate the beautiful snake next time! I am not afraid of them at all although I definitely do NOT want anyone around or Rex (the dog) to get bitten.

I had no idea how far they could strike and thought it was much further than half their body length.

bajabuddha - 10-5-2014 at 09:33 PM

I did two bug-worm bite runs while EMS in southern Utah. Learned a few things to pass on; anti-venin for snake bite can be as bad as the venom itself if not administered properly by the trained physician, there's many variables for taking it. I'd talk to my personal Veterinarian and grill 'em about giving a dog a 'JUST IN CASE' shot; why, and what's the side effects? Also, true, snakes can only strike 1/3rd (1/2, fine) of their body length WHEN COMPLETELY COILED AND DEFENSIVE. Young'uns are just as venomous, and effects depend on many variables; where the strike is, how long since the snake last fed (impossible to discern), age/health of victim, variety of snake.... and I do know it's a sumbiatch of a hurtful experience. Most snakebite victims are between 18-30 year-old males who are ETOH (borrachos) trying to 'handle' the snake... there by the grace of allah-yahweh-AndyMurphy go a lot of us.

For all the 'save the snakes' folks, let me preface; I AM TOO. I've carried many a buzz-worm down a riverbank for half a mile to protect it from the tourists. However, one in my yard here gets dispatched immediately. I don't kill Biuda(V?) Negras in the wild, either. Earlier post; tried to save a sidewinder, and drove away saying "Sherriff, YOU'RE ON Y'ER OWWWNNNN!" Rather save a snake to eat a mouse rather than protect your kids/grandkids/neighbor-kids/dogs/cats(well,cats....)... fine.

[Edited on 10-6-2014 by bajabuddha]

Paulina - 10-5-2014 at 10:21 PM

Regarding relocation, I'm curious about how to safely go about putting the snake into the bucket.

P >*)))>{

bajabuddha - 10-5-2014 at 10:32 PM

Paulina, first advice is, if you don't know, find someone who does. A simple shovel will do IF you can 'corral' the snake's upper-half of the body around the base of the shovel handle and spade. a VERY long stick, at least the FULL length of the snake can lift the thing, again, at least 1/3rd to 1/2 behind the head, and (important here) far enough away where it won't slide down to your location... then 'coax' it in ANY FREAKING WAY POSSIBLE, probably with several attempts.

If you're really brave, pin the head down with whatever available, grab the creature just behind the mandibles (jaws) and then simply lift, and tail-first, descend it into the receptacle. YEAH, RIGHT. 40 or so years ago, NO PROBLEM. A snake-wrangling hook would be nice, order on www.wherethehellisit.com.... Best yet, call someone who has experience and before c-cktail hour preferably......
:lol:

David K - 10-5-2014 at 11:03 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Paulina
Regarding relocation, I'm curious about how to safely go about putting the snake into the bucket.

P >*)))>{

Remember when the kids and I were there when the rattler was under your trailer?

BajaBlanca - 10-6-2014 at 03:13 PM

Has anyone here been bitten by a rattler?

on a scale of 1 to 10, how painful?

can you survive without anti-venom? Being that it would be a minimum 3+ hour drive to G Negro from here. And that is assuming that they have it there.

motoged - 10-6-2014 at 03:43 PM

Blanca et al,

http://www.wikihow.com/Treat-a-Rattlesnake-Bite

Does the bite hurt??? I dunno....waddya think?

http://www.rattlesnakebite.org/rattlesnakepics.htm

woody with a view - 10-6-2014 at 03:49 PM

nah, rub some dirt on it ya pansy!

bajabuddha - 10-6-2014 at 04:24 PM

Hemotoxic snakebite is extremely painful (Ged, was that surgery to alleviate toxins and debridement?), causes swelling, deep bruising, and all kinds of Mysery. Yes, most people survive rattlesnake bites; rarely fatal, although you might wish it was. Depends on placement of bite, victim situation (infant, elderly, heart-disease present). Some species of buzz-worm are more potent than others too. One of my patients wasn't given the anti-venin because the effects from it (if not a lot of venom present in the victim) can be almost as bad as the bite, so said our ER doc. Also, his bite was on the back-side of his 2nd finger-bone, so didn't penetrate deeply into muscular tissue. Needless to say, he still was not a happy camper.

This is what I told my river guests: they are more afraid of you than you of them. They aren't 'hunting' you for food, and unlike other poisonous snakes, they have a VERY definite warning system that sez, "LEAVE ME ALONE!". So if you hear it and haven't been struck, you have an excellent chance of taking it up on its' warning. Snakes have fascinated (and scared the hell outa) people since time immemorial. Just remember they are nice enough to tell you when YOU should maybe leave their house (as I said, MY HOUSE, MY RULES).

motoged - 10-6-2014 at 05:40 PM

BB,
Those pics are off the net so not sure about the medical procedure.

What I have seen are some pics that show a guy whose hand was bitten and his arm and shoulder swelled up so bad, his shoulder swelling was pushing his head sideways....massive swelling seems to sometimes occur and the skin splits (you can see that in the surgery pic around his thumb)

The toxins apparently spread through the lymphatic system....instead of the arteries/veins....unless on is punctured w/ venom.

Apparently those with respiratory ailments are more prone to negative results.

A story I heard from a fellow in BC was that there was a guy in Okanagan Falls who caught rattlers and provided them to someone who milked their venom for making anti-venom.

As it went, the rattler catcher liked to have a drink or two. One night he was into his cups with a friend and decided to show off his day's catch to his drinking buddy. Stumbling around a pailful of snakes is not my idea of fun, but the guy got one out and was promptly bitten.

The guy was not happy with the situation and proceeded to beat the snot out of the rattler by whipping it on top of his truck hood for some time. Figuring he had it all under control, he reportedly returned to drinking and then fell asleep after a while.

Poor guy died....apparently being intoxicated was also a risk factor :lol:

micah202 - 10-6-2014 at 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by motoged

The guy was not happy with the situation and proceeded to beat the snot out of the rattler by whipping it on top of his truck hood for some time. Figuring he had it all under control, he reportedly returned to drinking and then fell asleep after a while.

Poor guy died....apparently being intoxicated was also a risk factor :lol:

...stupid is as stupid does...I'll bet the snakes had a good 'laugh' over that one :rolleyes:

bajaspuds - 10-9-2014 at 04:39 PM

... glad y'all can laugh it off ... I'd still be, er, "rattled"

David K - 10-9-2014 at 04:45 PM

Don't the rancheros of Baja use cardón to treat sankebite? I saw it done to Damien in 'Bajo California: The Limit of Time' ! :light:

Bajaboy - 10-9-2014 at 06:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
Don't the rancheros of Baja use cardón to treat sankebite? I saw it done to Damien in 'Bajo California: The Limit of Time' ! :light:

David, you really should not believe everything you watch :light:

woody with a view - 10-9-2014 at 06:18 PM

someone here has a signature:

don't believe everything you think! I remind myself of that often.....

motoged - 10-9-2014 at 08:57 PM

Woody,
That's my line...public domain :yes:

Fernweh - 10-9-2014 at 09:20 PM

When I stayed at my friends little cattle rancho, below the Tres Virgenes volcano, I found an old braided rope in one of the supply boxes.
It looked all frayed, like the fibers would come apart, chose not to use it.....

Later on, my friend explained: this rope was made from cow hair (tails), and the vaqueros would lay it around their sleeping blankets, when staying overnight on the range, to keep the snakes away.

CaboSur - 10-10-2014 at 04:55 AM

Yes my dad always used an old rope we went camping. Don't know if its true but seems to have worked for him

David K - 10-10-2014 at 07:26 AM

I have heard the rope method as well... the snakes do not go over the rough rope. Another Baja method we learned at the Percebu fish camp in 1966 or so... The fishermen kept cloves of garlic in a jar and every night they placed the garlic around their cots claiming that kept away the vipers!

azucena - 10-10-2014 at 08:00 AM

Most of the species of Rattlesnakes in Baja have hemotoxic venom. There are perhaps several ( I know there is at least one )species which have neurotoxic venom, which can be more dangerous and difficult to treat. There is an excellent book with pictures by Ron Mc Peak on the reptiles and amphimbs of Baja. He describes their habitat, range and whether their venom is hemo or neurotoxic. if you are bitten it is very helpful to know what snake has bitten you and it's type of venom. I highly recommend this book for anyone who likes to go off the beaten path in Baja, and it is really interesting.

BajaBlanca - 10-10-2014 at 08:05 AM

and the largest snake antivenom producer is the INSTITUTO BUTANTAN in the Amazon forest.

David K - 10-10-2014 at 08:41 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by azucena
Most of the species of Rattlesnakes in Baja have hemotoxic venom. There are perhaps several ( I know there is at least one )species which have neurotoxic venom, which can be more dangerous and difficult to treat. There is an excellent book with pictures by Ron Mc Peak on the reptiles and amphimbs of Baja. He describes their habitat, range and whether their venom is hemo or neurotoxic. if you are bitten it is very helpful to know what snake has bitten you and it's type of venom. I highly recommend this book for anyone who likes to go off the beaten path in Baja, and it is really interesting.

bajalearner - 10-10-2014 at 09:29 AM

Way back when I was in the Army training at Ft. Hunter Ligget in Central CA, A solder found a 4 foot rattler laying at the bottom of a huge boulder near the mess tent. The boulder I sat on, with my feet dangling near the ground while eating breakfast. The solder carried the snake around in a cardboard box the size of beach ball to show everyone. When he came around my tent, I told the country boy, (Luckily, who I out ranked), to get rid of it and my preference is to kill that some B. He and the snake went away.

A little later, a young female Spec 4 working as a battalion aid medic came around asking if we needed sun tan lotion. I told her about the pet in the box and asked if a bite would be a bad thing. She said yes they are very harmful and should not be played with (No surprise there). I told her the country boy told me he always caught them and had one in an aquarium as a kid.

The medic said; "wow, I would think it would drown".

bajalearner - 10-10-2014 at 09:35 AM

Why am I so terrified of poisonous snakes? Is it a learned or natural fear? I grew up in a city and maybe saw one in the San Francisco zoo as a kid. I've encountered 2 rattlers in nature as an adult and both times I was terrified, maybe the most terror I have felt.

Is that learned or natural response? I see big animals like horses react with terror too.

Bajaboy - 10-10-2014 at 09:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajalearner
Why am I so terrified of poisonous snakes? Is it a learned or natural fear? I grew up in a city and maybe saw one in the San Francisco zoo as a kid. I've encountered 2 rattlers in nature as an adult and both times I was terrified, maybe the most terror I have felt.

Is that learned or natural response? I see big animals like horses react with terror too.

It might be part of our DNA: http://www.sciencedaily.com/releases/2008/03/080320132646.ht...

Terry28 - 10-10-2014 at 09:55 AM

I always return any snake I find around our property back "to the wild" I just do it one piece at a time!!

Cypress - 10-10-2014 at 09:57 AM

Some of the ranchers bury the head of a dead rattlesnake. They think that when yellow jackets eat the head they will absorb the rattlesnake venom and become venomous.

bajalearner - 10-10-2014 at 10:25 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Cypress
Some of the ranchers bury the head of a dead rattlesnake. They think that when yellow jackets eat the head they will absorb the rattlesnake venom and become venomous.

There may be something to that. After years of eating bacon, my belly is looking like a pigs' belly. :bounce:

BajaBlanca - 10-11-2014 at 03:50 PM

terror is horrible and ever so irrational. I do not understand why snakes nor spiders spook me.

[Edited on 10-11-2014 by BajaBlanca]

windgrrl - 10-11-2014 at 05:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaBlanca
terror is horrible and ever so irrational. I do not understand why snakes nor spiders spook me.

[Edited on 10-11-2014 by BajaBlanca]

Just the healthy old fight or flight response.

Mine nicely kicked in this summer when I almost stepped on a big beauty in my flip flops. As I opened the truck door, I heard that dry rattlle buzzing and thought, "What is that sound?" at the same that time I instantly stepped back, waaaaay back and thanked it for the warning.

We were sailing at Rattlesnake Dam in south eastern Alberta. We're used to rattlers and few people are bit. Did you know rattlers can swim?!!!

motoged - 10-12-2014 at 12:56 PM

Yep....

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4VBL03-19XQ