BajaNomad - In Defense of Shockingly Dangerous Desert Racing in Mexico

It is done in the USA... and Africa... and Australia... and South America... but there is only one BAJA! That is where off road racing was born.

Oh my goodness. I have never seen any thing in the news like this guy describes. They must keep it quiet for some reason. Where do they have an area 1000 miles long in the USA to do this?

MMc - 6-17-2015 at 06:34 PM

There are a number of off road races in the world. The Baja 1000 is the longest point to point race, Dakar is the longest rally event, local there is the Best of Desert and others, Oz has a bunch of off road events. Euros have a bunch of rally events on dirt roads.The euros come pretty close to spectators all the time. DK is just spewing about the 1000 out of his love for it.

gnukid - 6-17-2015 at 06:35 PM

How dangerous is Football? Baseball? Boxing? Horse back riding? Car racing is the number #1 sport of Baja I doubt it is going anywhere soon.

MMc - 6-17-2015 at 06:45 PM

My big fear for racing in Baja is the farmers and land holders don't allow racers across their land anymore. There are many places that no longer like the race. Pre-runners not closing gates, hitting livestock, not caring about the land they cross. Most of the racers are good caring people that also give back to the folks of Baja, (Racers & Ranchers). But the roads take a beating and more and more land is being closed down. I hate to say it but I don't think we will still be watching this race in 15 or 20 years.

AKgringo - 6-17-2015 at 06:45 PM

It is done in the USA... and Africa... and Australia... and South America... but there is only one BAJA! That is where off road racing was born.

Oh my goodness. I have never seen any thing in the news like this guy describes. They must keep it quiet for some reason. Where do they have an area 1000 miles long in the USA to do this?

Well, the Iditarod trail race (AK) is over a thousand miles, but you have to wait for freeze up! We have lots of room for a long race, but we went and paved the couple of roads that serve this huge state, so not much else to race on.

[Edited on 6-18-2015 by AKgringo]

MMc - 6-17-2015 at 06:56 PM

A bunch of lawyers also made it a bit more difficult to race in USA too.

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo

It is done in the USA... and Africa... and Australia... and South America... but there is only one BAJA! That is where off road racing was born.

Oh my goodness. I have never seen any thing in the news like this guy describes. They must keep it quiet for some reason. Where do they have an area 1000 miles long in the USA to do this?

Well, the Iditarod trail race is over a thousand miles, but you have to wait for freeze up! We have lots of room for a long race, but we went and paved the couple of roads that serve this huge state, so not much else to race on.

TMW - 6-17-2015 at 07:32 PM

It is done in the USA... and Africa... and Australia... and South America... but there is only one BAJA! That is where off road racing was born.

Oh my goodness. I have never seen any thing in the news like this guy describes. They must keep it quiet for some reason. Where do they have an area 1000 miles long in the USA to do this?

Best In The Desert (BITD) will have the longest off-Road race in the U.S. in August. Las Vegas to Reno. It's 500+ miles. Same race vehicles as SCORE has in Baja. More restrictions than in Baja. Not as spectator friendly as Baja. In the U.S. the BLM and Forest Service and other government agencies place a lot of restrictions on the race promoter, especially in CA. BITD has several races a year some motorcycle/ATV only. I think it was 2000 that BITD did a 2000 mile race rally style in NV. Went all around the state as I recall. Environmentalist have used the desert tortoise as an excuse to get the government to close areas where racing use to be, such as the very popular Barstow to Vegas MC race.

Off road Racing

J.P. - 6-17-2015 at 07:33 PM

In it's self it can be very entertain The Problem being the hype they put out is total B.S. all the Money they bring to the economy and the list goes on The Cars and drivers are transported into the county and leave the same way The big problem being the Knuckle Dragging White Trash that tags after them they are the ones that that display no respect for the Mexican People or their property and leave a bad taste long after the organized part of the race is back home

TMW - 6-17-2015 at 07:36 PM

J.P. you don't have clue as to what you are talking about.

Clue

J.P. - 6-17-2015 at 07:55 PM

I have lived here 14 years and I admit I probably don't Have a Clue as to how bad it really is but as one small example please explain why a bunch of drunks in high powered Pre Runners that aren't involved in the race should be allowed to trespass on private property and run the public roads with complete disregard for public safety. I will admit it can be somewhat amusing to watch some of the locals act out during the frenzy with their hatchet job trucks.
I am not Anti Race. the group needs to police it's self better or the same thing will happen to them that happened in the High Desert.

mtgoat666 - 6-17-2015 at 09:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by J.P.

In it's self it can be very entertain The Problem being the hype they put out is total B.S. all the Money they bring to the economy and the list goes on The Cars and drivers are transported into the county and leave the same way The big problem being the Knuckle Dragging White Trash that tags after them they are the ones that that display no respect for the Mexican People or their property and leave a bad taste long after the organized part of the race is back home

watch out! Now you have gone and offended the knuckle dragging white trash (surprisingly, a few of them can read), and they will soon be puffing up their chests and fanning their peac-ck feathers! Pretty soon they will be spouting that tree huggers and liberals are socialists and fascists,...

[Edited on 6-18-2015 by mtgoat666]

bajadogs - 6-17-2015 at 09:34 PM

but there is only one BAJA! That is where off road racing was born.

Mister K, My great-grandfather was in the original Indy 500 in 1910-1912 on bricks. His name was Johnny Jenkins. Look him up. He was in an off-road race from Santa Monica to Phoenix that went through San Diego and over where HWY 8 now exists and had to dip down into Mexico to avoid the sand dunes before arriving back up in Yuma. Maybe the first automobile race ever in what is now Baja. Maybe 1914 (?). BUT, he had been racing off-road for many years before that and I have his medals to prove it. Off-road Racing was not born in BAJA, though it may die there.

vgabndo - 6-17-2015 at 09:35 PM

It is done in the USA... and Africa... and Australia... and South America... but there is only one BAJA! That is where off road racing was born.

African off road racing is mostly a club level sport on closed courses. WOMZA organizes a few 200 km. races a year, but the equipment wouldn't be considered competitive for Baja. In Australia, the minimum length of a race is 150 km. and the longest is 250 km. these off road races are run on closed courses that must be at least 15 km. per loop. no comparison with 1000 miles on public roads. Off road racing was certainly not born in Baja. The racing is STILL done completely on roads. Some of them paved. People have been racing cars on dirt roads in organized events since the sunset of the 1800's. Southern California off road racing does indeed owe a lot to the former lawlessness of Baja but I too predict that it will end pretty soon. Spectating at the last three 1000 mile races/rallies, I didn't see ANY Mexicans making ANY money. NORRA is better than SCORE in that respect, but still after finishing their day north of Vizcaino this year, the NORRA motorcycles headed right to San Ignacio to spend the night. The checkpoint crew, ambulance drivers, race crews and pit people outnumbered the spectators 3 to 1. Vizcaino might have sold a little extra gas, some food and beer, but that didn't put new shocks on anybody's ranch truck.

A little more off-road racing history

tripledigitken - 6-17-2015 at 09:58 PM

Early off-road racing on an insane course!!

Panamint Valley

Here's more of the story..........

http://www.smithsonianmag.com/history/paris-or-bust-the-grea...

David K - 6-18-2015 at 06:51 AM

Man has always raced... this is not new. To not push ourselves to the limits of our endurance (or our vehicles) would be un-natural.

So, yes, there was racing before there was paved highways. The 'modern' form of off road racing, using Jeeps, dune buggies and motorcycles was indeed born in Baja with the organization of the 1967 NORRA Mexican 1000.

I do recall some short course off road events in Riverside, CA... called the Off Road Grand Prix, or something like that from the 1960's, as well. I believe the first American long course off road race was the Mint 400, out from Las Vegas, a year or two after the first Baja off road race.

Working off my memory, as I was around 10 back then, and my dad got Four Wheeler Magazine, and I read them.

vgabndo - 6-18-2015 at 10:44 AM

Since I don't remember the motorcycle racing in Baja having been interrupted by WW I or WWII, which was the case with the actual "birth" of off road motorcycle racing, I'm going to continue in the belief that the ISDT which began in 1913 and has been run continuously since is where 'motorcycle' off road racing was born. It took decades for Americans to get good enough to win any of those races. What is true, David, is that Baja off road racing was born in Baja. But then, we knew that.

StuckSucks - 6-18-2015 at 11:15 AM

Quote: Originally posted by J.P.

I have lived here 14 years and I admit I probably don't Have a Clue as to how bad it really is but as one small example please explain why a bunch of drunks in high powered Pre Runners that aren't involved in the race should be allowed to trespass on private property and run the public roads with complete disregard for public safety. I will admit it can be somewhat amusing to watch some of the locals act out during the frenzy with their hatchet job trucks.
I am not Anti Race. the group needs to police it's self better or the same thing will happen to them that happened in the High Desert.

Interesting fantasy world you live in, J.P. What TMW said.

I can't speak for all teams, but I believe the team I work with is representative of other teams in the sport.

Drinking while prerunning? I don't think so. If your team drives expensive prerunners with a multi-million dollar annual racing budget, you act accordingly.

Disregard to public safety? Our Team Owner has said, repeatedly, that if we see anyone - racers or non-racers, who need help - help them. Medical or mechanical, it doesn't matter.

Hatchet job trucks? Completing the trifecta J.P., you are once again proving that you have no idea what you're talking about. Our Team's Trophy Truck cost almost a half million dollars to build. After every race it gets torn down to the frame, then rebuilt. Does this sound like a hatchet job to you?

Non-sequitur: someone once said that man started racing the day they built the second car.

STUCK

J.P. - 6-18-2015 at 12:41 PM

Your Reading comprehension must not be all that great. When I referred to Hatchet trucks I wasn't Referring to the actual race team trucks but to the local driving around the streets acting out in their beater truck's.
I know a person that builds Quality Trucks and he is a Class act But don't try to Justify the Jerks that race around DRUNK in some of the Yes Very expensive pre runners acting like the Low Class Knuckle Dragging Fools they are. i

norte - 6-18-2015 at 01:16 PM

I see...yes while in Mexico, people like to drink in excess. Not a good reason to have a race of any kind.

mtgoat666 - 6-18-2015 at 01:24 PM

I see...yes while in Mexico, people like to drink in excess. Not a good reason to have a race of any kind.

any kind?

how about a drinking game? anyone up for a game of shots and mumbledy peg?

TMW - 6-18-2015 at 06:26 PM

Goat stick to Off_topic with your blandering BS we don't need a dumbazz jerk like you around here.

liknbaja127 - 6-18-2015 at 07:34 PM

TMW, Well put!

norte - 6-18-2015 at 07:40 PM

wow. is this what is meant by "puffing up their chests and fanning their peac-ck feathers"

mtgoat666 - 6-18-2015 at 08:56 PM

wow. is this what is meant by "puffing up their chests and fanning their peac-ck feathers"

Yep. Though their feathers are gray, and a bit thin these days. Sorry looking birds.

bajadogs - 6-18-2015 at 11:48 PM

My dad got Four Wheeler Magazine, and I read them.

This explains a ton bro. Keep talking.

David K - 6-19-2015 at 06:33 PM

Do you have a clue as what Four Wheeler Magazine was about...? Does "tread lightly" ring a bell? Family camping and back country driving, the right way, is always encouraged. Four wheel drive reduces damage. It is 2WD vehicles that spin tires, lacking traction, the digs ruts and tears up roads.

vgabndo - 6-19-2015 at 08:28 PM

Do you have a clue as what Four Wheeler Magazine was about...? Does "tread lightly" ring a bell? Family camping and back country driving, the right way, is always encouraged. Four wheel drive reduces damage. It is 2WD vehicles that spin tires, lacking traction, the digs ruts and tears up roads.

Forty-four thousand three hundred and twenty posts and you just keep getting funnier!

This image from Fourwheeler.com clearly shows how two wheel drive would have not "treaded lightly" and very likely would have been damaging to the environment. Good thing these guys are doing back country driving "the right way" and not ripping the crap out of the creek. Notice how they are not leaving ruts, or tearing up the road. You're a crack up!

129-0807-02-z+land-rover-discovery-argentina+river-crossing.jpg - 96kB

129-0807-02-z+land-rover-discovery-argentina+river-crossing.jpg - 96kB

monoloco - 6-19-2015 at 10:18 PM

Quote: Originally posted by gnukid

How dangerous is Football? Baseball? Boxing? Horse back riding? Car racing is the number #1 sport of Baja I doubt it is going anywhere soon.

Those sports aren't dangerous for the spectators like Baja offered racing.

mtgoat666 - 6-19-2015 at 10:29 PM

Do you have a clue as what Four Wheeler Magazine was about...? Does "tread lightly" ring a bell?

I have not seen trophy trucks treading lightly. Isn't this thread about Baja racing?

David K - 6-20-2015 at 08:45 AM

The insult to me and/or Four Wheeler Magazine was also not about racing. How do you miss that?

ncampion - 6-20-2015 at 08:51 AM

Quote: Originally posted by monoloco

Quote: Originally posted by gnukid

How dangerous is Football? Baseball? Boxing? Horse back riding? Car racing is the number #1 sport of Baja I doubt it is going anywhere soon.

Those sports aren't dangerous for the spectators like Baja offered racing.

Spectators choose to spectate, nobody makes them go out there. They also choose to do stupid things like stand in the path of the racers. They should just stay home.

Bajazly - 6-20-2015 at 09:12 AM

They've just brought the game of Frogger to fruition and they are pros.

AKgringo - 6-20-2015 at 09:28 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Bajazly

They've just brought the game of Frogger to fruition and they are pros.

That is a mental image that will be hard to squash!

bajatrailrider - 6-28-2015 at 09:56 AM

You have pro off road here.You have clueless off road.You have CFs here.What is CF its control freak. The CFs can rant,but that's all they can do.Will it stop anyone I know from Off road.Don't think so.

BajaBreak - 7-2-2015 at 01:43 PM

Quote: Originally posted by bajatrailrider

You have pro off road here.You have clueless off road.You have CFs here.What is CF its control freak. The CFs can rant,but that's all they can do.Will it stop anyone I know from Off road.Don't think so.

Well said.

As a motorcycle enthusiast who has spent much time around off-road racing, trucks and what have you since childhood, I'd have to agree there are a lot of knuckleheads down in Baja pitting and pre-running around race time. Fortunately they seem to be a minority, but I avoid riding down there for that reason. It'd be nice if a happy medium could exist, but many people like to see things suit their agenda.

I like going 'off-road', the environment, animals, helping people, and enjoying myself. Am I a unique snowflake? I'd like to think not in this regard. I read my father's Four Wheeler magazines as a kid too, but I'm pretty sure that doesn't make me a knuckle dragger.

David K - 7-2-2015 at 01:52 PM

Correct, they (Four Wheeler magazines) make you appreciate dirt roads, camping, four wheeling, and being out in Nature. Tread lightly is four wheeling, not at all the same as off road racing (primarily a 2WD sport).

BajaBreak - 7-2-2015 at 03:23 PM

Agreed. I was mostly responding to all the sensational banter on here, and hadn't read the original article. Good, well written article I must say. After helping with some pitting years ago, I was hooked on exploring it on my own terms. Running around the desert trying to find a broke down car to possibly work on is for the dogs!

David K - 7-2-2015 at 05:52 PM

Agreed. I was mostly responding to all the sensational banter on here, and hadn't read the original article. Good, well written article I must say. After helping with some pitting years ago, I was hooked on exploring it on my own terms. Running around the desert trying to find a broke down car to possibly work on is for the dogs!

LOL!

I went from camping and fishing in Baja, to off road race spectating and pitting ('78-'85)... and was in the '79 Baja 1000... back to camping and slow, 4WD trips (see our Pole Line Road report), and researching the old Spanish missions in Baja.

norte - 7-2-2015 at 07:09 PM

Yes pls, review the entire thread. Some have their own unique way of interpreting "tread lightly". TP in the desert, cutting locks on gates, building roads, slipping and sliding everywhere and thinking "isn't this great".

bajatrailrider - 7-2-2015 at 08:15 PM

Yes pls, review the entire thread. Some have their own unique way of interpreting "tread lightly". TP in the desert, cutting locks on gates, building roads, slipping and sliding everywhere and thinking "isn't this great".

Again Mr CF ,you and your other 3/4 freaks,on this off road forum.Norte get a life you are out gunned by the hundreds of pro off road on this forum.Yes you do have the right to rant,but I have the right.To tell you are a sick puppy.You like to pick on David some others.There kind to you on there answers,I wont be.do your control freak with your own family.You wont get away with it here.

BajaBreak - 7-3-2015 at 04:03 AM

Are you referring to me? I did read the entire thread before I posted, I said I hadn't read the originally posted article. I'll keep slippin' and slidin' in many facets of life, and enjoy it. Be sure to tell the locals where to leave their TP in person when you have a chance, should go over well.

Get off the off-road forum and find something better to do with your time, or at least somewhere else to post, ya whiney perrita...

BajaBreak - 7-3-2015 at 04:22 AM

Quote: Originally posted by vgabndo

Didn't realize you were there to witness their driving. I can only imagine the damage that would happen if a flash flood were to come through that wash...oh the horror!. Those irresponsible Range Rover drivers/station wagon testers should have built a bridge across that creek.

I can't speak for the current magazine, but the ones from the 90's were good, and my favorite part was 'The Wanderers' articles. I don't recall much condoning 2wd pre-runners going out driving trails. I like the machinery, but am personally not a big fan of the 'pre-runner' crowd.

[Edited on 7-3-2015 by BajaBreak]

norte - 7-3-2015 at 06:48 AM

Ya gotta luv these guys. "If you don't like the way I tear up the environment, then do not look at what I am doing." ANswer for Chit and TP every where....tell someone else. Brilliant.

norte - 7-3-2015 at 07:26 AM

poster children for off-roading. Probably crap in their own back yard, do doughnuts in the front yard, and hope a flash flood comes through to clean it all up. Fly that battle flag high boys.

bajatrailrider - 7-3-2015 at 07:34 AM

More TP post from Norte Get outta this forum.Your crap post,is just coming outta your ears.Your such a sick puppy,Start thinking of the fool you are.You hate life,anybody having a good time,while your up to chit.

chuckie - 7-3-2015 at 08:17 AM

Jeees!

norte - 7-3-2015 at 08:48 AM

Quote: Originally posted by bajatrailrider

More TP post from Norte Get outta this forum.Your crap post,is just coming outta your ears.Your such a sick puppy,Start thinking of the fool you are.You hate life,anybody having a good time,while your up to chit.

Why is it that so many 4 wheelers never made it past the 4th grade? Take a look at the spelling, punctuation, incomplete sentences, spacing, etc. I guess their drivers license exam came in the form of a comic book.

vgabndo - 7-3-2015 at 09:39 AM

When liberals run out of facts, they resort to insults and name calling.

Where is the 'open-mindedness' and 'accepting other cultures and life styles' that liberals love to brag only they possess?

:light:

Right on, just ask Donald Trump.

Check

BajaBreak - 7-3-2015 at 11:30 AM

norte is an angry person who hates freedom and thinks anyone who enjoys the outdoors with an 'off-road' vehicle is an elementary school drop out. Duly noted. Generalize much? Do you have any higher education in Biology? I agree with some of the land closures, but people like you take it to extremes. You better hope you never get hit by a car, and then the only way you can get far off the beaten path is with a 'four-wheeler'. Some off-roaders I know have UCSD Neuroscience degrees.

You are a fool as far as I can tell. I will simply ignore anything you post from here on. I may save 1 response for your simple-minded comeback before I start though.

David K - 7-3-2015 at 11:51 AM

Let me also say that one of the strongest advocates of four wheeling in Baja, is Jeep Rubicon owner Ken Cooke, a good friend who does not fit norte's ideas in the least. Four wheeling is not a white, Republican, uneducated's hobby, and Ken is living proof of all those norte ideas!

norte - 7-3-2015 at 01:35 PM

norte is an angry person who hates freedom and thinks anyone who enjoys the outdoors with an 'off-road' vehicle is an elementary school drop out. Duly noted. Generalize much? Do you have any higher education in Biology? I agree with some of the land closures, but people like you take it to extremes. You better hope you never get hit by a car, and then the only way you can get far off the beaten path is with a 'four-wheeler'. Some off-roaders I know have UCSD Neuroscience degrees.

You are a fool as far as I can tell. I will simply ignore anything you post from here on. I may save 1 response for your simple-minded comeback before I start though.

Yes I have a higher education degree, though not in biology. So? What is with the hit by a car threat? It makes no sense. Maybe it is best you ignore, because most of what you say makes no sense. Remember...Wise men speak because they have something to say; Fools because they have to say something.

norte - 7-3-2015 at 01:38 PM

Let me also say that one of the strongest advocates of four wheeling in Baja, is Jeep Rubicon owner Ken Cooke, a good friend who does not fit norte's ideas in the least. Four wheeling is not a white, Republican, uneducated's hobby, and Ken is living proof of all those norte ideas!

"ken is living proof of all those norte ideas"? hmmm Don't know whether to say thank you or review the quote in the above post.

BajaBreak - 7-3-2015 at 02:19 PM

Not a threat, I was just speaking from personal experience. Imagine you were once a young, flower admiring nature lover, who could no longer go for long treks through the outdoors under your own 0(?) emission power? Would you still avoid using an off-road vehicle to enjoy what you want to protect, so that you could maintain your self-righteous values?

It is probably too far out of your small box to think on such a large scale, so this will be my last reply to you on this 'off-road' thread.

*The original link to the Wired article that Stuck originally posted is good, I recommend others read it first, before getting caught up in the nonsensical replies that I, and others post...

Adios, Amigos

SFandH - 7-3-2015 at 03:15 PM

It was the liberal media that made it racist... I heard that Trump said "illegal alien" and not "Mexican"?

Not true, look it up.

chuckie - 7-3-2015 at 04:27 PM

Does Trump drive a class 10? Or what?

elgatoloco - 7-3-2015 at 06:47 PM

It was the liberal media that made it racist... I heard that Trump said "illegal alien" and not "Mexican"? Can you verify Trump said the women reported being raped by "Mexicans" vs. law breakers (non racial term)? Thank you Perry.

http://time.com/3923128/donald-trump-announcement-speech/

:saint:

Trump/Hastert 2016!

:lol:

chuckie - 7-4-2015 at 03:47 AM

There are certainly strong views on both sides of the off road issues. I have been riding and racing in Baja since before some of you were born. I see things now that I don't like and too much of it. Example:Two years ago, Willie Airstream , I and a couple of friends were spectating the Vintage Rally/race at the check North of Loreto. One of the crews were drinking beer and smashing the bottles on rocks. I asked that they not do that and was told, it's Mexico, don't make any difference, they don't care! I told them, this is my home, I live here and I care...Things got heated but they quit....I am sure that we will hear that seldom happens etc. But it happens too often. The insane driving by the non racing bunch wannabes is just that, insane.NO respect . Mexico, Baja is changing, more farms more people, more commerce...Yet more and more events are being run with more and more problems.....Whats the answer, I have no clue...BUT to say it's not a problem is wrong.....WRONG!

BajaBreak - 7-4-2015 at 04:37 AM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie

There are certainly strong views on both sides of the off road issues. I have been riding and racing in Baja since before some of you were born. I see things now that I don't like and too much of it. Example:Two years ago, Willie Airstream , I and a couple of friends were spectating the Vintage Rally/race at the check North of Loreto. One of the crews were drinking beer and smashing the bottles on rocks. I asked that they not do that and was told, it's Mexico, don't make any difference, they don't care! I told them, this is my home, I live here and I care...Things got heated but they quit....I am sure that we will hear that seldom happens etc. But it happens too often. The insane driving by the non racing bunch wannabes is just that, insane.NO respect . Mexico, Baja is changing, more farms more people, more commerce...Yet more and more events are being run with more and more problems.....Whats the answer, I have no clue...BUT to say it's not a problem is wrong.....WRONG!

Awareness is the only 'solution'. You can't control everyone's actions, but hopefully they can be influenced. A little respect goes a long way, as does a little disrespect, unfortunately. People that think they just entered the wild west after crossing the border to help pit for their friends may have a different view about disregard for law and order after someone pops a couple shots at their feet and tells them to dance.

I will enjoy spectating in Baja for now, as long as it lasts, because it is an amazing experience. There is a Bob Bauer 'post' that I've seen, which sums it all up quite well, for those potential pit crew members.

bajatrailrider - 7-4-2015 at 07:12 AM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie

I had same problem on the beach,some of the locals.Campfire breaking beer bottles on the beach.I was told this is Mexico,I told them this is your country.We just started to pick up broken glass,They give in,helped us pick up glass and trash.Lucky one knew me from town.So it went easy,one victory ay a time.

rts551 - 7-4-2015 at 07:54 AM

I agree... a lot of nonsense. Distracts from the real issues sometimes (sometimes there are no issues). And it does seem to bring out another side of people (not their best) and sometimes down right entertaining. For real info I go elsewhere anymore.
Nomads, nomania, nominds...

now, what was the topic?

chuckie - 7-4-2015 at 08:20 AM

Beef Ribs? Just put em in the cooker..Be ready in 4-5hours....

David K - 7-4-2015 at 11:50 AM

"ken is living proof of all those norte ideas"? hmmm Don't know whether to say thank you or review the quote in the above post.

Sorry it wasn't clear... Ken is living proof of that your descriptions of four wheelers are anything but true, on all three counts named above.

As for the Trump thing... we are both correct or both wrong... he did NOT say "Mexicans". He said "Mexico was sending..." and that could mean illegal Guatemalans just as much as any race or nationality. Can we just talk about people and not race? Bad people are bad, no matter what they look like!

chuckie - 7-4-2015 at 12:06 PM

Geez...You drag politics and race into this thread, and try to sweetcoat it....You are really an oaf.....

rts551 - 7-4-2015 at 12:57 PM

There have been a number of insulting people here. The first insults had nothing to do with "norte". Now superman David, you sling mud with the best of them; how can you say your here to clean it up? You are the one that misquoted Trump trying to defend his racist statement. You should have left well enough alone. Did ever think you might be part of the problem, instead of saying you are always the solution.

chuckie - 7-4-2015 at 01:22 PM

He doesn't think, can't think...too busy working on his sainthood program...A Buffoon....Beef ribs are starting to smell REALLY good, time for the onions to go in to carmelize....Think I'll have a beer....That's OK aint it?.......

SFandH - 7-4-2015 at 01:54 PM

I neither started insulting Trump here, nor classified a group of people with false insults as norte did, also in this thread.

That's not true. You said:

When liberals run out of facts, they resort to insults and name calling.

That statement insults the intelligence of millions of Americans.

[Edited on 7-4-2015 by SFandH]

elgatoloco - 7-4-2015 at 06:58 PM

Fact - bad people are bad

[/rquote]

As for the Trump thing... we are both correct or both wrong... he did NOT say "Mexicans". He said "Mexico was sending..." and that could mean illegal Guatemalans just as much as any race or nationality. Can we just talk about people and not race? Bad people are bad, no matter what they look like! [/rquote]

Fact - this is the EXACT part of the Donald's speech. His words:

"When Mexico sends its people, they’re not sending their best. They’re not sending you. They’re not sending you. They’re sending people that have lots of problems, and they’re bringing those problems with us. They’re bringing drugs. They’re bringing crime. They’re rapists. And some, I assume, are good people."

Fact - the GOP of today is a circus. The Donald happens to the biggest clown and he will make some of the others seem reasonable in comparison. IMEO.

Feliz Quatro de Julio Amigos! :biggrin:

vgabndo - 7-4-2015 at 07:59 PM

Quote: Originally posted by vgabndo

Right on, just ask Donald Trump.

Since this went right over your head David I'll explain it. You accused "liberals" of not being open minded and accepting of other cultures. Since Donald Chump had just finished making a damned fool of himself in from of the world, I used him as an example of the kind of people you could be expected to support who are actually guilty of being closed minded and unwilling to accept other cultures. It was admittedly a "dig" at your VERY well known political trolling. You don't need to thank me for it.

David K - 7-4-2015 at 08:07 PM

Sure, you guys are right and there is nothing ever false or untrue from the left. ...

Oh, and if you like your health care you can keep it and the average family will pay $2,500 less for it. Oh, and you need more than one cell phone for more than one email account! LOL!!! Wow!!!

rts551 - 7-4-2015 at 08:21 PM

Sure, you guys are right and there is nothing ever false or untrue from the left. ...

Oh, and if you like your health care you can keep it and the average family will pay $2,500 less for it. Oh, and you need more than one cell phone for more than one email account! LOL!!! Wow!!!

Universal Health insurance is a done deal...get over it. If all you can do is complain about emails, no problem, your 15 other candidates might as well give up.

David K - 7-4-2015 at 08:24 PM

Prohibition was repealed, as any bad law should be.

chuckie - 7-5-2015 at 08:16 AM

After reading DK's latest illogics (sp) I am convinced he has totally lost it. When the men from the funny farm pick him up, I hope it gets videotaped, with tire tracks, of course...Cell phones? Prohibition? How about 8 tracks....????

Ateo - 7-5-2015 at 08:34 AM

Prohibition was repealed, as any bad law should be.

So you are for ending marijuana prohibition? Awesome. Me too. :lol:

LancairDriver - 7-5-2015 at 08:43 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K
Sure, you guys are right and there is nothing ever false or untrue from the left. ...

Oh, and if you like your health care you can keep it and the average family will pay $2,500 less for it. Oh, and you need more than one cell phone for more than one email account! LOL!!! Wow!!!

No comprehend? Quote below Looks like too many years have gone by since a reading comprehension class.

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie

After reading DK's latest illogics (sp) I am convinced he has totally lost it. When the men from the funny farm pick him up, I hope it gets videotaped, with tire tracks, of course...Cell phones? Prohibition? How about 8 tracks....????[/quote

[Edited on 7-5-2015 by LancairDriver]

David K - 7-5-2015 at 08:49 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Ateo

Prohibition was repealed, as any bad law should be.

So you are for ending marijuana prohibition? Awesome. Me too. :lol:

Yes Jon, but maybe not for the same reasons as you, however. I don't smoke anything, but am convinced marijuana has medical value for many painful conditions that traditional pharmaceuticals don't or don't without side effects or ridiculous costs.

To Chuckie, Ralph, etc.
You guys really don't know me (who haven't spent any time with me)... Those of you who don't know me, seem to feel threatened in some way when I post my comments here, yet have no problem when others from your politics post comments that I find crazy... but I don't have any problem with freedom of speech or ideas and don't try to silence any of you with ugly, personal insults or interpret your words. I have also apologized for any misunderstanding or unintentional hurtful comments... NONE of you have ever apologized to me.

SFandH - 7-5-2015 at 08:59 AM

Those of you who don't know me, seem to feel threatened in some way when I post my comments here.

For me, threatened is the wrong word, ANNOYED is the correct word. When you say "liberals" associated with an insult it is extremely irritating.

Who the eff do you think you are?!?!

[Edited on 7-5-2015 by SFandH]

bajabuddha - 7-5-2015 at 09:33 AM

..... Leftist NONSENSE?"

I was going to post something, but i'm too busy laughing my azz off... :lol:

...and he's not insulting anyone.... :lol:

SFandH - 7-5-2015 at 09:35 AM

never am annoyed for the stupidity posted by liberals

You did it again, called me stupid.

And after I said these types of posts annoy me.

Nice guy.

rts551 - 7-5-2015 at 09:37 AM

"To Chuckie, Ralph, etc.
You guys really don't know me (who haven't spent any time with me)... Those of you who don't know me, seem to feel threatened in some way when I post my comments here, yet have no problem when others from your politics post comments that I find crazy... but I don't have any problem with freedom of speech or ideas and don't try to silence any of you with ugly, personal insults or interpret your words. I have also apologized for any misunderstanding or unintentional hurtful comments... NONE of you have ever apologized to me."

Who do I think I am? A person who also has feelings for things, and never am annoyed for the stupidity posted by liberals but fearful for America's future.

That you think only liberals can post their beliefs here and conservatives are to shut up, is really sad.

Just because most conservatives or libertarians don't waste the time to counter the leftist nonsense, doesn't mean their isn't a huge, silent majority, who want America to succeed for our children and the future.

I suggest reading the Bill of Rights... and Happy Independence Day weekend.

Who is insulting who? David, you are not threatening at all. Like was said, annoying sometimes....and some of your statements are beyond belief. But not threatening at all. And like most extremists, although you might want to, you DO NOT represent the silent majority. You remind me somewhat of a poor Donald Trump.

KasloKid - 7-5-2015 at 10:33 AM

This thread is officially in the sewer...
Absolutely nothing to do with Desert Racing in Mexico

Ateo - 7-5-2015 at 10:44 AM

Quote: Originally posted by KasloKid

This thread is officially in the sewer...
Absolutely nothing to do with Desert Racing in Mexico

Off Road and off topic and into the Pacific! :lol:

:LOL:

DianaT - 7-5-2015 at 10:50 AM