BajaNomad - 12 V air compressor recomendation?

12 V air compressor recomendation?

Aldervale - 12-30-2015 at 01:21 PM

Who has anything to say about 12V compressors ...looking for durabilety and long life....for airing up after off road.

Ride on

Aldervale

BigWooo - 12-30-2015 at 02:04 PM

I've had one of these on my truck for over 15 years. It's outlived two trucks and is still going strong. It's mounted within the compartment in my bumper where a winch would normally go.

Extreme Air

David K - 12-30-2015 at 02:09 PM

Only get the ones that clip directly onto the battery and not into a cigarette lighter... unless you don't mind a long wait!

I have had two of the battery clip on ones.
Harbor Freight General Pneumatic was $49 on sale back in 2006.
It adds air at the rate of 6 psi per minute. So, about 3 minutes per tire to pump up from beach driving pressure (15 psi) to street pressure (33 psi).

Compared to a Coleman cigarette lighter tire pump, that filled at 2 psi per minute, that was great! Four tires x 3min or x 9min makes a big difference!

I was given a slightly more compact pump that worked great, delivering 5 psi per minute. It is very popular and available on Amazon, called a Tsunami MV-50. I had it for years also. Used it more because it took less room in the truck. Last trip, while moving to the last tire to fill, I accidentally P-nched the air tube and that blew out the pump.

Our choice

John M - 12-30-2015 at 02:31 PM

Viair 400p

http://viaircorp.com/

Not as good as an engine mounted/converted air conditioning compressor but really reliable and pretty fast.

Much more $$ than the ones that cost less.....huh?

John M

Udo - 12-30-2015 at 02:53 PM

I'm going with DK.

I too have owned the same one for 5 years. I like that it's fast.

shari - 12-30-2015 at 02:56 PM

we have the one DK has and love it...make sure you air down for a smooth ride out on the whale lagoon road! But there are so many llanteras...tire fixing places that can air you back up....we dont use the compressor much...for example coming out of the lagoon you can just go to a llantera in Guerrero Negro and they will air you up for 10 or 20 pesos

pacificobob - 12-30-2015 at 04:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by John M

Viair 400p

http://viaircorp.com/

Not as good as an engine mounted/converted air conditioning compressor but really reliable and pretty fast.

Much more $$ than the ones that cost less.....huh?

John M

i am a fan of the viair compressors. duty cycle and cubic feet@minute are the important specs

bkbend - 12-30-2015 at 04:39 PM

It will extend the life of lower priced compressors if you start the pump then put it on the tire. You'll blow fuses or burn switches if you start it after connecting to your tire.

David K - 12-30-2015 at 04:41 PM

Good web page John, but no prices as they sell through distributors. Off Road Warehouse is the local distributor down here in San Diego County.

Bob53 - 12-30-2015 at 04:51 PM

I have the Viair 300P. It has been very reliable and inflates flat tires fast.

Aldervale - 12-30-2015 at 05:05 PM

Thanks all

It looks like a slightly more powerful model is made of the Tsunami MV-50....a 1050. We have always carried a OLD fashioned hand air pump for the truck and some other chores....

It sounds like the unit DK recommends is a good value for the price.

A friend has the AC compressor set up on all his tow service vehicles...it works great but not doing that to my '16 Tacoma !!!

There is an commercial 12V 220 PSI unit advertised locally on Craigslist but that is overkill for my needs...weight issues, etc.

Shari, thanks for tire shop tip....we want a pump for some more remote areas we plan to visit.

David

Aldervale, Or

Viair costs

John M - 12-30-2015 at 06:16 PM

They are more expensive and whether the old adage "you get what you pay for" applies here, I cannot say. The Viair has a less expensive line I think, but the higher priced models - the 300 - 400 series and so forth I believe are $150 and up, up, up. I paid more but bought it as a last minute purchase before a fairly rugged Baja trip and wanted the dependability I believe I got. John

4x4abc - 12-30-2015 at 06:40 PM

4x4 is my profession - last 30 years or so
i sometimes air tires up and down a few times a day
a good compressor is a must
the #1 tool for anyone off-road
I have owned many different tire compressors
none of them as good as the one I found 6 years ago
Puma PD1006

I hate Viar
noisy, expensive, no air volume, no duty cycle

many different sources for the Puma
usually the best deals are on ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Puma-12V-air-compressor-/27209021053...

[Edited on 12-31-2015 by 4x4abc]

Bob53 - 12-30-2015 at 06:52 PM

Besides carrying a Viair 300P, I also carry a 15 lb. Co2 bottle w/regulator and hose.

Lee - 12-30-2015 at 07:04 PM

Got a Viair in my car, another for my truck/RV. Fast and noisy. They've worked for years. Will consider a Puma for a replacement.

BooJumMan - 12-30-2015 at 08:25 PM

Bang for the buck, I prefer the MV50. I'm on my second one, my first one lasted me 10 years and half of its life was hard mounted outside underneath the truck. I've run 35" tires for the last 7 years and this will inflate fairly quickly.

If you got a lot of room though, the Puma that was posted above are the best higher end you can buy right now from what I've read.

http://www.amazon.com/Industries-MV50-SuperFlow-12-Volt-Comp...

[Edited on 12-31-2015 by BooJumMan]

Aldervale - 12-30-2015 at 09:31 PM

It will extend the life of lower priced compressors if you start the pump then put it on the tire. You'll blow fuses or burn switches if you start it after connecting to your tire.

Hmmm...tell me more !

Ken Cooke - 12-30-2015 at 11:13 PM

I run the dual Viair 'Extreme' with an air tank. If I could do it all over again, I would run the dual ARB compressor setup under my hood, and reclaim lost interior space.

There's also the WARN POWERPLANT.

bkbend - 12-31-2015 at 10:33 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Aldervale

It will extend the life of lower priced compressors if you start the pump then put it on the tire. You'll blow fuses or burn switches if you start it after connecting to your tire.

Hmmm...tell me more !

I don't know the details behind it. I can only guess that connecting the air line to the pump hose introduces back pressure the compressor needs to overcome before it can start pushing air and that requires a lot of amps. I blew fuses and a switch before I got that tip, but I've also upgraded to a higher quality compressor.

BigBearRider - 12-31-2015 at 10:52 AM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

4x4 is my profession - last 30 years or so
i sometimes air tires up and down a few times a day
a good compressor is a must
the #1 tool for anyone off-road
I have owned many different tire compressors
none of them as good as the one I found 6 years ago
Puma PD1006

I hate Viar
noisy, expensive, no air volume, no duty cycle

many different sources for the Puma
usually the best deals are on ebay

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Puma-12V-air-compressor-/27209021053...

[Edited on 12-31-2015 by 4x4abc]

Thanks for the tip, Harald. How fast is it?

willardguy - 12-31-2015 at 11:17 AM

Quote: Originally posted by bkbend

Quote: Originally posted by Aldervale

no doubt, there's all kind of hacks that will hot-rod these compressors but the simplest is to ditch the undersized wiring and cheesy fuse set-up, remember these compressors will draw 30 amps yet come with 14awg (10 or 12 feet??) for a $50 Chinese compressor these are hard to beat, just make em a little more efficient.

4x4abc - 12-31-2015 at 01:50 PM

how fast is the Puma?

Well, I have 295/75R16 tires (similar to a 33" tire), they are not small tires.
With a quadruple Viair I could pump 3 tires by hand with an upright bicycle pump by the time the Viair had finished 1 tire

With the Puma I don't bother using the hand pump any longer

never measured the time - but my guess would be that it takes less than 2 minutes to go from 10 psi to 30 psi with my tire size

the pump produces 3.5 cfm @ 90 psi

look for cfm when you buy a compressor - not for psi (you rarely ever need more than 35 psi anyway). We need high volume in a short period of time - not high pressure.

If they don't advertise the cfm - they don't have a product worth looking at.

BigBearRider - 1-1-2016 at 05:46 AM

Thanks, Harald.

I needed an inflator quickly before Thanksgiving and bought this from amazon:

http://www.amazon.com/Slime-40026-Heavy-Direct-Inflator/dp/B...

It claimed to inflate a truck tire in 2 mins. I didn't time it, but I was a little disappointed when I tried it. Maybe I was expecting too much.

basautter - 1-1-2016 at 07:06 AM

I have a Viair compressor that I like except for the cheap air hose (it broke). Viair specifies how long it takes to get different tire sizes up to a given pressure. My only regret is I wish I got a faster model because of the time it takes to get my F250 tires up to 80 psi. I recommend getting the fastest one you can afford/fit, and getting a high quality air hose.

4x4abc - 1-1-2016 at 10:30 AM

Erik,

the compressor you bought barely produces 1 CFM under load
I would expect it to take at least 4 minutes for your tires

I'll do a test run in the afternoon to get real life numbers for the Puma

just looking at the specs the Puma will inflate a pickup tire in 1 minute from 10 psi to 35 psi
this is not counting the restriction imposed by the Schrader valve

let you know later

willardguy - 1-1-2016 at 10:47 AM

well if time is of the essence......a $50 Q-50 will pump up a 285/75/16 from 15# to 30# in 3 minutes.
for the price, buy two, heck buy four and have all running at the same time! AND if one poops out on ya you'll always have a spare!

woody with a view - 1-1-2016 at 11:02 AM

i'm on my 3rd Q50. it is a backup to my CO2 tank which is quick and convenient.

4x4abc - 1-1-2016 at 11:34 AM

the Q 50 is not bad for the money
well, that was before they raised the price to $100

Most of the negative reviews on this compressor center around the same problems:

1. The air fittings are a non-standard size, as are the threads on the fittings.
2. The power cord overheats with extended use.
3. When re-starting against a significant head of pressure, the compressor will often blow it's fuse.
4. The relay sometimes fails/melts.
5. The air hose can melt with extended use and/or crack in cold weather.
6. The pressure gauge is inaccurate.

The negative reviews make up about 27% of the 186 product reviews on Amazon, with the remaining 73% being 4 Stars or better.

So, if you are into re-building before you even pump one tire this one is right for you.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/131953-bfads-supe...

willardguy - 1-1-2016 at 12:13 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

the Q 50 is not bad for the money
well, that was before they raised the price to $100

Most of the negative reviews on this compressor center around the same problems:

1. The air fittings are a non-standard size, as are the threads on the fittings.
2. The power cord overheats with extended use.
3. When re-starting against a significant head of pressure, the compressor will often blow it's fuse.
4. The relay sometimes fails/melts.
5. The air hose can melt with extended use and/or crack in cold weather.
6. The pressure gauge is inaccurate.

The negative reviews make up about 27% of the 186 product reviews on Amazon, with the remaining 73% being 4 Stars or better.

So, if you are into re-building before you even pump one tire this one is right for you.

http://www.toyota-4runner.org/3rd-gen-t4rs/131953-bfads-supe...

now that 4runner guy is one nutty tinkerer!

woody with a view - 1-1-2016 at 12:21 PM

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=59459#pid7165...

landyacht318 - 1-1-2016 at 01:08 PM

Sorry about the broken Pictures link on the Link Woody provided above.

My Mv-50 is still working better than when new, because there are some serious quality control issues with these out of the box.

First, the air filter's inlet holes are all obscured by plastic flashing left over from the mold. Remove these obstructions with a razor knife and it can pump more air and heat up less doing so. Do not use without the air filter!

Second is the 14 awg wiring to the internal relay. They use crimp nuts with NO strain relief where the wires enter the back of the unit. Minor forces can pull the wire from this connector rendering the unit inoperable.

Third the cylinder is not really contacting the finned heat dissipating cylinder head very well, so it does not efficiently transfer heat from the cylinder to the head. Which necessitates short duty cycles to allow the unit to cool down. The bolts holding the head to the unit are either not tightened enough at the factory, or loosen up on their own to a finger tight status, and a portion of the air pumped, can leak out the sides.

The list can go on. Those who have tinkering ability can easily improve this inexpensive compressor into a quality unit, but out of the box they are limited and of dubious reliability.

These have a 30 amp fuse, but pull about 16 to 18 amps at 12.8v, but likely only 10.5v is making it to the motor. Increasing the wire AWG will significantly speed up the motor and inflation times, as well as amp draw as they will spin faster.

I really despised the original tire chuck which needed to be threaded on and would leak if pressure was exerted on the fitting in 8 directions out of 10.

Here one can see the crimp nut inside the plastic housing with no strain relief:

Do not use the unit without the air filter, it will contaminate the cylinder quickly:

When this dirty, it would only pump upto 45 psi or so before just becoming a noise maker.

I retapped the head for 1/4 npt threads so I could use standard air fittings:

But one needs to make sure that the unit cannot build up pressure.

I drilled out a locking tire chuck so that it cannot exceed 150 psi and blow up the unit:

Here one can see 1 area where the cylinder touches the head and a large air filled gap between head and cylinder. I filled these with grease to better transfer heat, and this combined with the 80mm fan, I no longer worry about overheating the unit

I do not use any quick release fittings, and have upgraded the air hose as well to something with a smaller coiled diameter, more flexible, and with less memory.

My other modifications include adding a 12v 80mm fan to blow over the head, using a thick high temp grease between cylinder wall and head to better transfer heat, and upgrading the wiring to 10awg to get more voltage to the motor, and using a higher quality relay and better quick connects on that relay, crimped and soldered for less voltage drop and higher reliability.

I also added a cord grip on the 10 awg power cord so I can swing the unit around by the power cord like a weapon if I had to.

Viair units earned a reputation a while back as they were made in the USA, but like everything else production has moved to Asia, and quality has followed the usual path. They are likely higher quality than the Mv-50 but how much more so I cannot say.

That 12v Puma looks interesting, but is larger than I want to carry around.

BigBearRider - 1-1-2016 at 01:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

Erik,

the compressor you bought barely produces 1 CFM under load
I would expect it to take at least 4 minutes for your tires

I'll do a test run in the afternoon to get real life numbers for the Puma

just looking at the specs the Puma will inflate a pickup tire in 1 minute from 10 psi to 35 psi
this is not counting the restriction imposed by the Schrader valve

let you know later

Thanks, Harald. I'll time my compressor at home. I know it felt like it was slow in the middle of the night at Laguna Chapala...

CFM for the Viair 400P

John M - 1-1-2016 at 01:58 PM

This just below my posting is information from the Viair website.

I suppose the time it takes to inflate to a reasonable highway tire pressure is quite meaningful to some folks. Whether it is two or four minutes, or even five per tire simply hasn't been that important to me, or others we travel with. As you read the Viair information, note it cautions on use of the hose. I have found what they say to be accurate, and so I carry a spare hose.

John M

400P Portable Compressor
For up to 35" Tires
150 PSI / 2.30 CFM
150 PSI / 2.54 CFM P/N 40043 - 12V
P/N 40050 - 24V

400P is a larger portable compressor kit that can inflate up to a 35-inch tire from 0 to 30 PSI in less than 5 minutes. Used and approved of by off road enthusiasts worldwide, the 400P can save you when you’re miles from home.

Please Note: The air hose supplied with this kit may become brittle from prolonged exposure to UV/sunlight. - Stow when not in use. Never allow the hose to come into contact with the head of the compressor during use (melting hazard). The use of the included air hose is not recommended in sub zero or freezing conditions. The 400P does not work with Presta bicycle valves.

Included Parts:
- 5-in-1 Inflator/Deflator with Inline 100 PSI Gauge
- Vibration-Resistant Diamond-Plate Sand Tray
- Deluxe Dual Compartment Carry Bag
- 40-amp Inline Fuse Holder
- Dual Battery Clamps
- 3 pc. Inflation Tips Kit
- Power Cord: 8 ft.
- Air Hose: 25 ft.

willardguy - 1-1-2016 at 02:03 PM

interesting that the Q-50 advertises the exact cfm, 2.54. hmmmm....

David K - 1-1-2016 at 02:20 PM

Here's the latest Harbor Freight model: http://www.harborfreight.com/12volt-150-psi-compact-air-comp...

4x4abc - 1-1-2016 at 02:48 PM

Erik mentioned airing up at Chapala - that rang a bell.
I have a picture airing up with the Puma at Chapala
and no, it is not a small compressor
(as often as I use the compressor, I should hardwire an outlet for 12V)

willardguy - 1-1-2016 at 02:59 PM

can you buy the compressor without the tank?

wessongroup - 1-1-2016 at 03:06 PM

landyacht318 ... nice work and good job

mtgoat666 - 1-1-2016 at 03:16 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

Erik mentioned airing up at Chapala - that rang a bell.
I have a picture airing up with the Puma at Chapala
and no, it is not a small compressor
(as often as I use the compressor, I should hardwire an outlet for 12V)

Why doesn't the Beverly Hills station wagon come with a stock built in compressor? For the cost, you should expect such :lol:

David K - 1-1-2016 at 03:50 PM

There are 4x4s with built in tire inflators/ deflators you control from the dashboard! That would be so sweet as often as us Baja off roads change the tire pressure. Most of my past flat tires were the result of my not wanting to be bothered with the process of dropping pressure for the graded roads.

chuckie - 1-1-2016 at 04:17 PM

Install a big enough inverter, use a Sears Craftsman REAL air compressor 115 Volt, carry an impact wrench..be done with it..You may have to get a big enough truck...Its only money, after all...

4x4abc - 1-1-2016 at 09:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by willardguy

can you buy the compressor without the tank?

yes, the compressor is available without the tank (model DE07):

http://www.pumaairusa.com/products-08.html

Aldervale - 1-2-2016 at 09:07 AM

Hi Harald

How are the Puma compressors marketed.....what retailers?

Many thanks

Aldervale

4x4abc - 1-2-2016 at 10:11 AM

pretty much all stores for professional air supply carry Puma
Amazon sells them
best prices usually on ebay

https://www.google.com.mx/search?q=puma+1006+compressor&...

Many thanks

Aldervale - 1-2-2016 at 01:01 PM

Many thanks Harald

You folks must think we don't have internet in Oregon ....(sometimes we don't !)

I searched for PUMA and their site does;t really direct you anywhere for sales....

BTW, are you related to an old line of Viking or English kings ? ,,the spelling of your name leads one to think maybe Danish ?

4x4abc - 1-2-2016 at 02:30 PM

good eye!
Yes indeed the name is used in the Nordic countries.
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Harald_V_of_Norway

David K - 1-2-2016 at 02:35 PM

My Viking/Norwegian Fish Club name is Balder. My Norwegian family name is Hanson.

"big enough inverter"

Aldervale - 1-2-2016 at 03:54 PM

Chuckie

"Install a big enough inverter, use a Sears Craftsman REAL air compressor 115 Volt, carry an impact wrench..be done with it..You may have to get a big enough truck...Its only money, after all... "

The new Toyota Tacoma TRD off road models HAVE a big enough inverter standard....400 watts with motor running in the rear bed.

I have lots of small 110 compressors from my career in cabinet making....I don't want to carry the weight.

BTW, pro auto road racing teams just use lots of nitrogen cylinders for airing the tires but also for air tools in the pits and paddock on race weekends....I was a transport driver and all around helper for a Grand Am team ...we always had 6-8 heavy tall cylinders...bazillion PSI.

Aldervale

willardguy - 1-2-2016 at 04:00 PM

you're not gonna run much of a compressor off a 400 watt inverter!

landyacht318 - 1-2-2016 at 08:37 PM

My 5 gallon porter cable compressor is rated at 10 amps at 120v, which would require a minimum of a 1200 watt inverter, but likely considering the ~85% efficiency of an inverter, would require at least 1600 watts with double that surge rating.

Such an inverter would require 2/0 cable or thicker over a short distance to the battery with proper thick walled ring terminal terminations and an appropriate size fuse/circuit breaker to protect that cabling. Since MSW inverters cause electric motors to run much hotter, it would reduce compressor motor life to some degree. PSW inverters, well increase the price by 3 to 4x.

This would place an ~ 100 amp load on the alternator, if the engine were running, which would quickly heat up an alternator to and perhaps beyond 220F, which is as hot as one ever wants to let their alternator get. At Idle speeds, even if the alternator can produce this much amperage, the alternator fan is not spinning fast enough to dissipate the tremendous amount of heat generated.

A 130 amp alternator making 100 amps will heat up faster than the cold engine turning it.

If the engine is not turning, most healthy fully charged automotive batteries could run this inverter powering this 1200 watt load for only a minute or two before the low voltage alarm started screeching and soon after the inverter would shut down.

At least 4 hours of driving would be required before this battery could be considered 100% fully charged again, and only if the vehicle's voltage regulator allowed mid 14's to be held for that 4 hours, which is extremely unlikely.

Alternators are not the instant magical battery chargers that the general public believes of them.

There is always more than one way to skin a cat, but getting a huge inverter just to power a large carpenter's air compressor, just to fill tires, makes No sense, especially when there are 12v compressors which can perform the task and take up 1/10 the space and cost 1/10 the price to accomplish the same task for 1/6th the amp draw.

If one is travelling with a large RV, then perhaps carrying a large 120v compressor makes sense as one could just fire up the generator to run it, or already have a large enough inverter and a large enough battery bank to power it for the time required.

I'll stick with my modified Mv-50.

4x4abc - 1-2-2016 at 09:45 PM

I love cold hard knowledge vs hot and steamy opinions

David K - 1-2-2016 at 09:53 PM

That's great Harald!

Aldervale - 1-2-2016 at 10:36 PM

And I don't want to carry the weight....

Many thanks All !

Aldervale

wessongroup - 1-3-2016 at 12:59 AM

All good stuff .... thanks to all

4x4abc - 1-9-2016 at 03:46 PM

sorry for the delay - I promised to give you numbers for airing up
pressure switch died right before the test.

hot wired the Puma compressor for the speed test

tires 295/75R16 (equivalent to a 33" tire)
tires on the ground carrying 7,000 lb (1,750lb ea)

Puma (3/4 HP) - 2 minutes from 10psi to 30psi
shop compressor (2.5 HP) - 2 minutes from 10 psi to 34 psi

will provide 10 psi to 35 and 40 psi a little later

[Edited on 1-9-2016 by 4x4abc]

David K - 1-9-2016 at 06:13 PM

So 10 psi per minute off the battery. Great!

To compare to the two small, cheap pumps I have
The MF-50 did 5 psi per minute
The Harbor Freight did 6 psi per minute
The cigarette plug Coleman pump did only 2 psi per minute

[Edited on 1-10-2016 by David K]