BajaNomad

Constitution cops... Again.

Reeljob - 1-13-2016 at 07:58 PM

Little fat guy tracked us from the frontage road all the way thru town. We stopped completely at every sign and as we passed the last one he hit the lights.

Told him we video"d the entire trip thru town and to please speak into the camera.

He just turned around and hurried back to his truck.

Also checkpoint into and out of La Paz the cops Are trying to extort 500 np if your dog is not in a kennel

TMW - 1-13-2016 at 08:29 PM

Good for you. He must still be paying for Christmas.

bajaguy - 1-13-2016 at 08:30 PM

OUTSTANDING on the camera!!!
Quote: Originally posted by Reeljob  
Little fat guy tracked us from the frontage road all the way thru town. We stopped completely at every sign and as we passed the last one he hit the lights.

Told him we video"d the entire trip thru town and to please speak into the camera.

He just turned around and hurried back to his truck.

Also checkpoint into and out of La Paz the cops Are trying to extort 500 np if your dog is not in a kennel

Howard - 1-13-2016 at 08:52 PM

Good for you!

Dog in a kennel?

AKgringo - 1-13-2016 at 08:57 PM

Is that a law, or a shakedown? Even a medium sized kennel is to big for my little SUV, and I wouldn't want to coop my girl up for a trip that long anyway!

I did buy a harness that clips into the rear seat belt, I wonder if that would keep us out of trouble? I bought it mainly to keep her from jumping or bouncing out of the car when I have the top off, and to protect us both in case of an accident.

Thanks for bringing this up, it is news to me!

[Edited on 1-14-2016 by AKgringo]

Dash cam

fixtrauma - 1-13-2016 at 08:59 PM

We came south through there yesterday 41 ft with 17 ft more of trailer. Had the dash cam all lubed up and running. Drove 15 mph all the way through town with complete stops at every stop sign. Not a cop to be seen. Sort of disappointed!
:saint::saint:

BornFisher - 1-13-2016 at 09:02 PM

Whoa------ a family of people is fine in the back of a truck, but a dog inside a vehicle has to be kenneled??? Like to read that law.

toronja - 1-14-2016 at 11:04 AM

A dash cam! Ingenious. Way to go. I only wish you had video of him hustling back to his truck.

Interesting on the dog/kennel front. You say cops, so I'm assuming not the military checkpoint. Were they federales or state/local policia?

I know I've read that dogs have to be in a kennel when crossing the border (not that I've ever seen it enforced), but in general in Baja? What a joke. The best we've seen was a truck with a 16ft panga precariously lashed to it, sitting upright in the bed with the prow up over the cab - as we drove past, two kids were giggling and peeking out of the back of the panga. Terrifying!

Reeljob - 1-14-2016 at 11:11 AM

Local cops. Think there is some kind of rule that dogs:) need to be "restrained" when in a vehicle. Not real sure where I got that.

4x4abc - 1-14-2016 at 11:26 AM

local cop tried to pull "your dog has to have a muzzle while in the car"
on a checkpoint south of La Paz a month ago
I was was with a bunch of locals and they questioned his IQ
he walked away "to call his boss"
he came back with an apology

Bob and Susan - 1-14-2016 at 02:12 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Reeljob  
Little fat guy tracked us from the frontage road all the way thru town. We stopped completely at every sign and as we passed the last one he hit the lights.

Told him we video"d the entire trip thru town and to please speak into the camera.

He just turned around and hurried back to his truck.


so where is the video???

Bajahowodd - 1-14-2016 at 06:02 PM

Although we have never had a problem driving through, we always drive VERY slowly, and make all the stops.

This problem there has been reported about for over a decade.

And I thought it had been eradicated. Oh, well.

Lee - 1-14-2016 at 07:23 PM

Think I'll velcro my Nikon Coolpix to my dash.

DawnPatrol - 1-15-2016 at 01:54 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Reeljob  
Little fat guy tracked us from the frontage road all the way thru town. We stopped completely at every sign and as we passed the last one he hit the lights.

Told him we video"d the entire trip thru town and to please speak into the camera.

He just turned around and hurried back to his truck.

Also checkpoint into and out of La Paz the cops Are trying to extort 500 np if your dog is not in a kennel


Niiiiiiccccccceeeee!!!!!

DENNIS - 1-15-2016 at 03:38 PM



You folks of a different culture will just never get it.
Didja ever take the time to research the issue of police impunity, and human rights abuse, at all levels, in Mexico?
Would you think, just for a minute, that the officials to whom you might complain, are free of the same infractions? The captain behind the desk spent his time on the streets too......and Serpico doesn't work here.
You won't change anything, so why keep trying?

Udo - 1-15-2016 at 03:56 PM

The little fat guy must get around...he also works in Tecate and likes to follow people around, and then, just before you leave town, he turns on his red lights.
Quote: Originally posted by Reeljob  
Little fat guy tracked us from the frontage road all the way thru town. We stopped completely at every sign and as we passed the last one he hit the lights.

Told him we video"d the entire trip thru town and to please speak into the camera.

He just turned around and hurried back to his truck.

Also checkpoint into and out of La Paz the cops Are trying to extort 500 np if your dog is not in a kennel

Udo - 1-15-2016 at 03:58 PM

And so probably did the judge.
Quote: Originally posted by DENNIS  


You folks of a different culture will just never get it.
Didja ever take the time to research the issue of police impunity, and human rights abuse, at all levels, in Mexico?
Would you think, just for a minute, that the officials to whom you might complain, are free of the same infractions? The captain behind the desk spent his time on the streets too......and Serpico doesn't work here.
You won't change anything, so why keep trying?

Lee - 1-15-2016 at 03:59 PM

Quote: Originally posted by DENNIS  


You folks of a different culture will just never get it.
Didja ever take the time to research the issue of police impunity, and human rights abuse, at all levels, in Mexico?
Would you think, just for a minute, that the officials to whom you might complain, are free of the same infractions? The captain behind the desk spent his time on the streets too......and Serpico doesn't work here.
You won't change anything, so why keep trying?


Wow. What's your point, Dennis? I mean, what do you suggest? Stay away, or pay up?

What would you have done in the CC scenario?

Bob and Susan - 1-15-2016 at 04:09 PM

don't get all excited...until you see this video...

or

did he fib to the cop...and then...
is reeljob telling a fib here to get everyone
worked up again

just because its printed on the internet doesn't mean its true or real

DENNIS - 1-15-2016 at 04:37 PM


Whatever went down, [where is this video? I don't see any gawdamm videos] I'd have done the only thing we have as defense to armed robbery. Shut my mouth an stare off into the distance. "Lets go to the station."

I don't give a big eff what anyone does, but please quit trying to bring a US style of culture, law and order to another country. It's arrogant and offensive.
Again I say, did anyone here ever research the studies by, especially Dutch Social Scientists, concerning impunity for law enforcement in Mexico?
Lemme answer that for you...."No."



[Edited on 1-15-2016 by DENNIS]

JoeJustJoe - 1-15-2016 at 04:55 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Bob and Susan  
don't get all excited...until you see this video...

or

did he fib to the cop...and then...
is reeljob telling a fib here to get everyone
worked up again

just because its printed on the internet doesn't mean its true or real


Thank you very good post.

I don't know how many times I have seen forum members at various Baja forums, claim they made corrupt Mexican cops back down from their bribe attempt.

After reading these reports it makes me wonder why some of these corrupt Mexican cops even try to attempt to shake down an American tourists, because it seems they get backed down all the time.

Obviously, not all the tourists are making corrupt Mexican cops back down, because it still goes on from time to time in certain cities in Mexico.

That said, I still rather be pulled over by a Mexican cop than a US cop with a unwritten traffic tickets quota to make. Because if a US cop pulls you over, it's going to cost around $400 dollars after paying the fine and signing up for traffic school.

At least with the Mexican cop, I might be able to get out of the so-called traffic infraction, with a $20 dollar payment that I pay the Mexican cop directly.

I don't know if Reeljob, is telling the truth or not, but it's more likely if that stop actually occurred, he just told the cop he recorded the whole event on video, than if he actually recorded it.

I think it's a personal choice to pay a bribe or now. If you stand up to a corrupt cop, more than likely they will eventually back down, but you will be pressured. So I have nothing against paying a bribe.

What I do suggest if you do decide to pay a bribe, is get the corrupt cop to negotiate for a lessor amount. They might ask for $100 dollars, but will probably settle for $20 to $40 dollars

But what I wouldn't do is follow some advice from some Yahoo on the internet that tells you to never pay a bribe because they always stand up to corrupt Mexican cops. You don't really know if they stand up to the cops or not. Chances are when a corrupt cops stops them, they lose bowel control, and quickly pay a bribe even if the Mexican cop didn't hint for a bribe.

Bajahowodd - 1-16-2016 at 05:27 PM

All this excitement about corrupt Mexican traffic cops, while the cartels keep on going, and keep on going.

Reminds me of some of those websites, that I do not personally subscribe to, about the US shadow government that actually calls all the shots about what happens despite an elected government.

Maybe the internet should be condemned for all the upset it has created. Seriously, although the internet has done so much to improve the quality of life, it has also created an ability for the disenfranchised and hate mongers to communicate.

ligui - 1-17-2016 at 08:00 AM

Damn a 400 hundred dollar ticket ...:biggrin: What the heck were you doing on the road to get that much of a ticket .

I think a speeding ticket here in colorado is about 50 bucks .

Sweetwater - 1-17-2016 at 08:48 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ligui  
Damn a 400 hundred dollar ticket ...:biggrin: What the heck were you doing on the road to get that much of a ticket .

I think a speeding ticket here in colorado is about 50 bucks .


I've gotten one speeding ticket in the past 45 years of driving, 3.5 years ago in the USA. Went to court to get it reduced to less than 10 mph over the limit so it cost $125. My insurance company raised my rates for the next 5 years until it comes off my record. You pay much more for a speeding ticket than the price of the LEO.

Cyanide41 - 1-17-2016 at 04:13 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JoeJustJoe  
Quote: Originally posted by Bob and Susan  
don't get all excited...until you see this video...

or

did he fib to the cop...and then...
is reeljob telling a fib here to get everyone
worked up again

just because its printed on the internet doesn't mean its true or real


Thank you very good post.

I don't know how many times I have seen forum members at various Baja forums, claim they made corrupt Mexican cops back down from their bribe attempt.

After reading these reports it makes me wonder why some of these corrupt Mexican cops even try to attempt to shake down an American tourists, because it seems they get backed down all the time.

Obviously, not all the tourists are making corrupt Mexican cops back down, because it still goes on from time to time in certain cities in Mexico.

That said, I still rather be pulled over by a Mexican cop than a US cop with a unwritten traffic tickets quota to make. Because if a US cop pulls you over, it's going to cost around $400 dollars after paying the fine and signing up for traffic school.

At least with the Mexican cop, I might be able to get out of the so-called traffic infraction, with a $20 dollar payment that I pay the Mexican cop directly.

I don't know if Reeljob, is telling the truth or not, but it's more likely if that stop actually occurred, he just told the cop he recorded the whole event on video, than if he actually recorded it.

I think it's a personal choice to pay a bribe or now. If you stand up to a corrupt cop, more than likely they will eventually back down, but you will be pressured. So I have nothing against paying a bribe.

What I do suggest if you do decide to pay a bribe, is get the corrupt cop to negotiate for a lessor amount. They might ask for $100 dollars, but will probably settle for $20 to $40 dollars

But what I wouldn't do is follow some advice from some Yahoo on the internet that tells you to never pay a bribe because they always stand up to corrupt Mexican cops. You don't really know if they stand up to the cops or not. Chances are when a corrupt cops stops them, they lose bowel control, and quickly pay a bribe even if the Mexican cop didn't hint for a bribe.


About 2 month ago I got pulled over on my way to the Sentri lane in San Ysidro on an early weekend morning. The cops says "I pulled you over for speed and I can smell alcohol." Speeding? ..... I plead the quinta, but I called him out that he did not smell booze because I was on my way to work and hadn't had a drink for days. "Maybe it's your after shave." Right, that must be it. I paid the mordida because I was running late and I may or may not have been guilty. I think it was $20.

Cops 1 - Gringo 0

JoeJustJoe - 1-18-2016 at 02:57 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ligui  
Damn a 400 hundred dollar ticket ...:biggrin: What the heck were you doing on the road to get that much of a ticket .

I think a speeding ticket here in colorado is about 50 bucks .


I was caught in a speed trap by the CHP where a 40 mph street suddenly changes to a 25 hour mph because of a few houses on the end part of that street, and the CHP knows they can write a lot of tickets in the area because of the natural speed trap unknown motorist don't see.

I guess you don't live in California, or Los Angeles county like I do, or else if you receive a traffic ticket, you could be facing fines and added fees of between $300 and $500 dollars.

Take a look at this article where I highlighted a main point:


The average traffic ticket has skyrocketed thanks to state legislation jacking up fees to backfill court budget holes. As a result, a $100 ticket is $490 with all the add-ons.

http://www.latimes.com/opinion/opinion-la/la-ol-traffic-tick...

However, I consider myself lucky, because if I was black living in a place like Ferguson. The DOJ came out with a report a few months ago showing the local police, judge, and city government were in cahoots against the citizens of Ferguson, where the police would pull over blacks over dubious or minor infractions so they could hit them with high traffic fines, and in some case put the citizens in debtors' prison when they couldn't pay these high fines and add-ons that compound when you can't pay a traffic ticket.

So give me a corrupt TJ cop, over a supposedly law abiding US cop with a radar gun in his hand any day of the week.

At least I could tell a Mexican cop, to write me the ticket and I'll mail it in, or follow him to see a judge and then pay a small traffic fee. However, if I'm in a hurry, or don't want to be bothered, I could just ask the Mexican cop is it OK to just pay him directly and then give him $20 dollars, and be on my way. ( a better way is wait to them to hint for a bribe)


David K - 1-18-2016 at 04:03 PM

Since when or where does the HIGHWAY PATROL give speeding tickets on a CITY street? Unless that street happens to also be a California State Highway and there is no local police or Sheriff department?

JoeJustJoe - 1-19-2016 at 11:09 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Since when or where does the HIGHWAY PATROL give speeding tickets on a CITY street? Unless that street happens to also be a California State Highway and there is no local police or Sheriff department?


The California Highway Patrol has jurisdiction all over California highways, and acts as the state police. The CHP also has authority in the entire state, and they can pull you over anyplace in California.

However, in my case, I believe the CHP was acting in the capacity of the state police in a kind of rural area on a short cut street off the main highway.

A couple of years ago I was on the freeway and I passed up a city street cop going about 70mph. A female city street cop pulled me over, because she could not believe I passed up a police officer in their patrol car.

After I showed her I was remorseful and forgot she was there, she left me off with a warning. So cops will cross their normal jurisdictions and can pull you over and write you traffic tickets. A CHP officer will rarely if ever let you off with a warning on a freeway because of the danger of pulling you over on a freeway.




KurtG - 1-19-2016 at 11:16 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Since when or where does the HIGHWAY PATROL give speeding tickets on a CITY street? Unless that street happens to also be a California State Highway and there is no local police or Sheriff department?


The CHP mantra is "Any Road, Any Code." They can and do write speeding tickets on our local streets and also are the primary parking ticket enforcers in unincorporated areas at least in San Luis Obispo County.

Phil S - 1-20-2016 at 09:23 AM

What is a Mexican cop doing with U.S. dollars on his possession unless he's recently pulled over a vehicle & "copped" a bribe from an American. Wonder how many Canadians have tried to pay them with Canadian dollars? Maybe I should travel with some Canadian dollars, and if pulled over, offer him a Canadian twenty dollar bill.????? Anyone tried this one???

cocomo - 1-22-2016 at 08:53 AM

Thank you for the notice on the traffic cops in Constitucion. I will video with my phone when I go through. It's a great idea!

chuckie - 1-22-2016 at 09:34 AM

A whole lot of what is suggested here is Keyboard Kourage...Its easy to be brave when you don't have 2 big cops with guns leaning in your window. "Don't mess with me, I'm taking your picture"? May get you a trip to the proctologist to get your camera removed, or worse.....

Lee - 1-22-2016 at 10:26 AM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie  
A whole lot of what is suggested here is Keyboard Kourage...Its easy to be brave when you don't have 2 big cops with guns leaning in your window. "Don't mess with me, I'm taking your picture"? May get you a trip to the proctologist to get your camera removed, or worse.....


Yeah and it sure sounds like you're suggesting tourists just bend over and take it with a smile? Just another form of courage, eh?

Assuming the camera story is true, it worked with at least one cop. No harm in trying it with other cops.

And Chuckie? I get out of my vehicle and stand face to face with cops when I'm speaking with them. And I'm not intimidated by cops with guns. Sounds like you are?

Whale-ista - 1-22-2016 at 10:44 AM

FYI- in Baja it's mordida. In CA, the problem is the state and local law enforcement agencies are becoming accustomed to all that revenue from these tickets- $130 million last year.

But there is a proposal to reduce at least one penalty in California:

"$500 fine for red-light 'California stops' excessive?
Jerry Hill says the punishment should be halved

A San Mateo state senator is renewing his effort to have the $500 fine for "California stop" red-light violations reduced to a sum that low-income people can afford.

Sen. Jerry Hill thinks the current punishment for the slow, rolling right-hand turns doesn't fit the crime. He introduced legislation last week that would cut the fine in half.

In California, a red-light violation costs a driver about $500, by far the highest fine in the nation, according to the traffic-watch site TheNewspaper.com. The fine is a whopping $540 in Hill's district in San Mateo County. In most states, it's around $100.

"Many people are making $3,000 a month, $2,500 and when you take taxes, their net take-home pay, this is over a fourth of what they take home," Hill told ABC 7.

In 2014, Redflex Traffic System, which administers the red-light camera ticketing program for the city of San Mateo, issued 4,462 tickets worth $2.4 million, according to TheNewspaper. Sixty-three percent of these tickets went to drivers who made "California stops," also known as "Hollywood stops."

The exorbitant fine can make drivers reluctant to make even legal right-hand turns at red-light camera intersections, causing traffic to back up behind them. Would you trust a camera to recognize that you came to full stop before turning?

This isn't the first time Hill has tackled the fine in the Legislature. A bill authored as an assemblyman passed in 2010, but then-Gov. Arnold Schwarzenegger vetoed it, arguing a reduced fine would send the wrong message to drivers about traffic safety.

State Sen. Joe Simitian, D-Palo Alto, took a cut at the issue in 2013, writing a bill to prohibit use of the camera tickets merely to raise revenue, and to make it easier to fight them in court. But Gov. Jerry Brown vetoed it.

"There are accuracy issues, privacy issues and due process issues with these tickets," Simitian told the Chronicle's Kevin Fagan. "The trouble is that more and more cities depend on this for revenue."

Simitian does not advocate that red-light cameras should be eliminated, saying they do have a safety value. "I just don't think the current system gives the public a fair shake," he said.

The state Department of Finance estimated in 2014 that red-light cameras bring in more than $80 million annually to the state and $50 million to cities and counties.

chuckie - 1-22-2016 at 10:51 AM

WOW! That Lee is really a tough guy...mano a mano.....I'm impressed!

bajaguy - 1-22-2016 at 10:55 AM

Red light cameras are a scam.....and in some cases the citations issued are probably not valid.

Many municipalities are removing the cameras as they are not "cost effective"........the municipality still gets charged $$$ from the camera company if the citation is dismissed.

However, if you run a red light or make a "California Stop" you deserve the citation

Lee - 1-22-2016 at 12:57 PM



Your comments are off the mark, Chuck. Want to explain your point in your other post?

I'm not that tough. Men with guns don't intimidate me. I know that's not the case with everyone.

People get courage somewhere. Sometimes in life experiences, sometimes it comes with practice.

I've been intimidated once in Baja. South of TJ, 5am, red flares set out on the road with barricades, 2 men dressed in black wearing balaclavas, surrounded by other men with rifles, stopping me in an RV. Let's say I was pensive. They had me, checked me out, let me go, but I was definitely not comfortable.

Seriously, it's best to prepare mentally down here for cops and I believe in calling bluffs. Just how I am. If I'm guilty of something, I pay up. I don't pay scams.

I also believe psychologically I am on equal footing speaking with a cop face to face, standing, rather than sitting inside a vehicle.

It really is a man to man thing. Not a problem for me.

PS -- ask Dennis if cops with guns intimidate him?

chuckie - 1-22-2016 at 01:10 PM

I recounted, several months ago, my shakedown experience of Sept. 2014. Was I intimidated? Yes .Did I pay? yes. Given the same circumstances would I do the same thing? yes. I don't need to explain or apologize to anyone.

Gulliver - 1-22-2016 at 02:18 PM

The ostensible purpose of traffic fines is to deter certain behaviors. $400 to me is a lot. $400 to Mr. Gates is pocket lint.

In much of Scandinavia the fines are proportionate to your income. The head of Nokia got busted for speeding in 2002 and his fine was $103,000.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38660951/ns/world_news-europe/t/sw...

I like it!

bajaguy - 1-22-2016 at 02:23 PM

I guess you should carry around your W-2 form
Quote: Originally posted by Gulliver  
The ostensible purpose of traffic fines is to deter certain behaviors. $400 to me is a lot. $400 to Mr. Gates is pocket lint.

In much of Scandinavia the fines are proportionate to your income. The head of Nokia got busted for speeding in 2002 and his fine was $103,000.

http://www.nbcnews.com/id/38660951/ns/world_news-europe/t/sw...

I like it!

Gulliver - 1-22-2016 at 02:26 PM

Dunno how they do it. But my impression from the original story was that the cop had access to the right info as soon as he went back to his car and checked in with a data link of some sort.

akmaxx - 12-23-2016 at 09:23 AM

Which thread on here had the number of who you call to report the CD Constitucion cops? Minister of Tourism, Comandante of CD, or what?

Neighbor got shaken down yesterday, including scary trip around town "following the cop to the station" until it got dark and then they "bargained" down from 5K US to $3,500 pesos, all they had on them, just to get out of town.

Cop followed them from South to North and then pulled them over for an "infraction".

She didn't get a badge number or a photo because it was the first time she has been pulled over and was rattled. She also knew about the rep there and was driving very carefully.

I turn on my cell phone camera and wedge it into the seats when I drive through there but I haven't been stopped. Would love the disgraceful cops who pulled this to be booted in the new "clean sweep of corruption campaign" but I am not holding my breath.

:fire::fire:

rts551 - 12-23-2016 at 09:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by akmaxx  
Which thread on here had the number of who you call to report the CD Constitucion cops? Minister of Tourism, Comandante of CD, or what?

Neighbor got shaken down yesterday, including scary trip around town "following the cop to the station" until it got dark and then they "bargained" down from 5K US to $3,500 pesos, all they had on them, just to get out of town.

Cop followed them from South to North and then pulled them over for an "infraction".

She didn't get a badge number or a photo because it was the first time she has been pulled over and was rattled. She also knew about the rep there and was driving very carefully.

I turn on my cell phone camera and wedge it into the seats when I drive through there but I haven't been stopped. Would love the disgraceful cops who pulled this to be booted in the new "clean sweep of corruption campaign" but I am not holding my breath.

:fire::fire:


without a picture or badge number...its all hearsay. good luck.

chuckie - 12-23-2016 at 09:31 AM

:lol: Clean wseep of corruption?

David K - 12-23-2016 at 10:05 AM

Quote: Originally posted by akmaxx  
Which thread on here had the number of who you call to report the CD Constitucion cops? Minister of Tourism, Comandante of CD, or what?

Neighbor got shaken down yesterday, including scary trip around town "following the cop to the station" until it got dark and then they "bargained" down from 5K US to $3,500 pesos, all they had on them, just to get out of town.

Cop followed them from South to North and then pulled them over for an "infraction".

She didn't get a badge number or a photo because it was the first time she has been pulled over and was rattled. She also knew about the rep there and was driving very carefully.

I turn on my cell phone camera and wedge it into the seats when I drive through there but I haven't been stopped. Would love the disgraceful cops who pulled this to be booted in the new "clean sweep of corruption campaign" but I am not holding my breath.

:fire::fire:



In the past, Nomads said to photocopy this, tape it to the back window...


akmaxx - 12-23-2016 at 10:15 AM

This is an old number but he may know who takes complaints now...also thought the number of the director of SECTUR was posted somewhere but can't find it.

Happy National Day of Police..........

LICENCIADO MIGUEL ANGEL VILLALEJO, the Director of the police in Constitution,


this thread had the names and phone numbers ....

613 100-1910 cell phone number but someone should call and double check that this guy is still in office since gvt has changed.

Loretana - 12-23-2016 at 02:20 PM

I was stopped by a cop in Ciudad Constitucion last week on my way back to Loreto from Todos Santos, right in town, going north.

I had stopped at the Michoacana Ice Cream store for a limon ice and saw him standing at the corner watching me. My friend and I (another lady) were in a California plated Jeep Laredo. When I got back in my vehicle he stood in front of us and asked me for my license. He checked out my ID and gave it back, and then said "Adelante".

He was kind of creepy.....short, stocky....like something out of a "Porky Pig" cartoon. My dog really didn't like him. :rolleyes:

jdshipman83 - 12-23-2016 at 11:36 PM

Quote: Originally posted by DENNIS  


You folks of a different culture will just never get it.
Didja ever take the time to research the issue of police impunity, and human rights abuse, at all levels, in Mexico?
Would you think, just for a minute, that the officials to whom you might complain, are free of the same infractions? The captain behind the desk spent his time on the streets too......and Serpico doesn't work here.
You won't change anything, so why keep trying?


I think we all "get it" buddy, but call me crazy, just because something is a widespread and endemic problem doesn't mean we should all just sit back and let it happen. Don't think for a second that it's a waste of time for us Gringos to push back on stuff like this. How people respond to these situations matters. If we all started pushing back on these types of shakedowns and making things more difficult on local officials (instead of just rolling over), these shakedowns would be less frequent. That's a fact. These officials are trying to make easy money, and people with your mentality are making that possible.

My hats off to the poster. They handled the situation well. And I hope others will do the same thing. At the end of the day, we (Gringos) have an obligation to show respect for Mexicans and local culture, but that does not mean that we have to accept unlawful or pretextual shake-downs. This isn't the wild west. I am always very respectful to police and local officials, but I will never pay for the privilege of being a Gringo in Mexico. If I am being accused of some dubious offense, and the officer wants to take me into town to see the judge, that's fine. He can roll the dice and take his chances. Either way it goes, my money won't be easy money.

jdshipman83 - 12-23-2016 at 11:49 PM

Quote: Originally posted by DENNIS  

I don't give a big eff what anyone does, but please quit trying to bring a US style of culture, law and order to another country. It's arrogant and offensive.
Again I say, did anyone here ever research the studies by, especially Dutch Social Scientists, concerning impunity for law enforcement in Mexico?
Lemme answer that for you...."No."

[Edited on 1-15-2016 by DENNIS]


So it's arrogant and offensive for us to push-back when local officials are trying to collect a mortida when there has been no violation of the law? That's preposterous. We aren't colonizing the place - it's about respecting the rule of law.

Yes - you are correct that Mexico has a long history of corruption, impunity for law enforcement, etc. These are all objectively bad things, and frankly, it is these very conditions that are hindering Mexico's transition to a more developed economy. Your logic of simply throwing our hands up in the air and accepting things as they are is the same line of logic that was used by the Germans at Nuremberg. It was bad logic then, and it's bad logic now.

jdshipman83 - 12-23-2016 at 11:54 PM

Quote: Originally posted by DENNIS  

Again I say, did anyone here ever research the studies by, especially Dutch Social Scientists, concerning impunity for law enforcement in Mexico?
Lemme answer that for you...."No."

[Edited on 1-15-2016 by DENNIS]



And no, I have not read any of these studies you reference. I don't need a Dutch social scientist to tell me that there has been an impunity for law enforcement in Mexico. I think we are all on the same page on that one. In any case, I doubt that these studies concluded that the best course of action is to just ignore the issues and accept the status quo.

jdshipman83 - 12-24-2016 at 12:16 AM

Quote: Originally posted by chuckie  
I recounted, several months ago, my shakedown experience of Sept. 2014. Was I intimidated? Yes .Did I pay? yes. Given the same circumstances would I do the same thing? yes. I don't need to explain or apologize to anyone.


You're right - it's your prerogative to pay a bribe. But people like you are the very cause of these problems, and every time you roll-over, it endorses what these officials are doing, and it makes things more difficult for all of us. Like you said, you don't have to apologize. Some people are easily intimidated, and they are willing to be part of the problem so long as it avoids any confrontation or personal inconvenience. If you are okay being one of those people, that's fine. No apologies necessary.

Like I said in my earlier post, I think we all have an obligation as visitors (for lack of a better word) to accept and respect local culture. I don't expect special treatment as an American expat. But Mexico is a Western democracy with an established rule of law, and by God, if you're carrying a blue passport, then as far as I'm concerned, you are a citizen of godd*mn Rome. You don't pay off local officials when you are acting lawfully.

Lee - 12-24-2016 at 07:01 AM

Quote: Originally posted by jdshipman83  
Quote: Originally posted by chuckie  
I recounted, several months ago, my shakedown experience of Sept. 2014. Was I intimidated? Yes .Did I pay? yes. Given the same circumstances would I do the same thing? yes. I don't need to explain or apologize to anyone.


You're right - it's your prerogative to pay a bribe. But people like you are the very cause of these problems, and every time you roll-over, it endorses what these officials are doing, and it makes things more difficult for all of us. Like you said, you don't have to apologize. Some people are easily intimidated, and they are willing to be part of the problem so long as it avoids any confrontation or personal inconvenience. If you are okay being one of those people, that's fine. No apologies necessary.

Like I said in my earlier post, I think we all have an obligation as visitors (for lack of a better word) to accept and respect local culture. I don't expect special treatment as an American expat. But Mexico is a Western democracy with an established rule of law, and by God, if you're carrying a blue passport, then as far as I'm concerned, you are a citizen of godd*mn Rome. You don't pay off local officials when you are acting lawfully.


Man, your rant is just a bit behind the curve on this stuff. You register last month and you're taking on Chuckie and Dennis in a post that's a year old? You must be up late drinking, again.

The CC cops have been discussed at length in many posts you'll have to go back and read. There are 2 distinct sides to corruption: pay or don't pay. Save your morality and ethics for North of the border.

Don't like Baja, Mexico? Don't come down.

Oh, by the way, Merry Christmas ya'll.

chuckie - 12-24-2016 at 07:56 AM

Keyboard Kourage.. Maybe sometime he will wear the moccasins. I have nothing to prove. Merry Christmas all...stay well

AKgringo - 12-24-2016 at 09:32 AM

For what it is worth, I drove through Constitution, and Insurgentes Tuesday afternoon (12/21) and saw no sigh of any police activity. Two years ago just before Thanks giving, on the same drive, I saw five different police stops. All Mexican plated vehicles.

In fact, from La Paz north, I saw no evidence of increased police activity all the way to the border!

kiterkip - 12-26-2016 at 08:37 AM

This thread has me nervous. 3 years ago this "little fat guy" ticketed us for illegally parking in front of the coffee shop... in a parking space THAT HE GUIDED ME INTO.
I'm coming through Cd C with the New Years rush of Gringos on 1/2. My plan is to of course drive uber slow, stop at every intersection, never stop for any business.
Oh.... and dog secure inside kennel crate here and nearer to La Paz.

[Edited on 12-26-2016 by kiterkip]

AKgringo - 12-26-2016 at 09:00 AM

There is no room for a kennel for my large (85 lb) dog in my small car. I use a harness that is designed to work with standard seat belts, or I use a short leash strapped to the roll bar when the top is off.

BajaTed - 12-26-2016 at 09:17 AM

As taught to me by my father; when you sense a bad situation, if possible, always ask the cop if he is married. Then ask quickly what your wife would do if you got fired by the Sindictura.

motoged - 12-26-2016 at 09:32 AM

....and if he's not married?