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NO wimps ?

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satmike - 12-3-2016 at 06:35 PM

Anyone been on no wimps recently or heard if it's in rideable condition? Starting a couple of week ride next week and still planning routes.

Thanks Mike

bajatrailrider - 12-3-2016 at 08:37 PM

Whats the plan Mike?

woody with a view - 12-3-2016 at 08:50 PM

off topic, but - i know of a place called WIMPS AND GIMPS! pretty sure you guys have no idea what that means.... enjoy the ride!

f5653b19dbd72df68955d20de71db267.jpeg - 70kB

f5653b19dbd72df68955d20de71db267.jpeg - 70kB

David K - 12-3-2016 at 09:01 PM

Mike, search posts by 4x4abc on that route south of El Barril.

motoged - 12-4-2016 at 09:32 AM

Tom (TMW) indicated recently that he and a few others were planning on scouting it out within the next few weeks....via Taco Trucks ("Harina, por favor....

)....

salttram - 12-4-2016 at 10:14 AM

Tried it last Dec. and the road was COMPLETELY wiped off the face of the earth past the turnoff to Santa Barbara. We met some mountain-bikers near there that were disappointed, as they wanted to go through.

The storm obliterated everything in and around La Fortuna Wash with large boulders everywhere. I would assume that whatever remains of the road south from there would be even more damaged. I may go back to hike out to the hacienda ruin near San Miguel to do some research on it . . . and that palo blanco forest must be one of the most beautiful places in Baja. Just watch out for the cranky burro that lives there.

David K - 12-4-2016 at 11:09 AM

Looking forward to your trip report!

TMW - 12-4-2016 at 01:42 PM

The squarecicle and I are/were planning on scouting out the NWT later this week. Our plan is to check out the northern section at the R Santa Barbara/R San Miguel jct. If and that is a big if, we can get thru without difficulty we'll take it all the way down to hwy 1. If not we plan to go down and drive up the trail from San Ignacio and go as far as we can. abc4x4 made it thru in March of 2015. They had to do some road building at the north end and the south end where it come from the SOC at Trinidad. Here is his report.

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=77320&pag...

Since then there has been a group of side by sides going thru to Trinidad at the south end. I say are/were because there has been a complication that may delay us a week or so.

satmike - 12-4-2016 at 02:47 PM

Thanks. We are going to be loaded pretty heavy as we are doing an unsupported trip we'll go around.
Thanks Mike

TW is....

John M - 12-5-2016 at 03:51 PM

Heck Mike, get TMW and SquareCircle to haul your gear - both good guys that would help in a flash! That way you can check the route ahead for them.

Just want to help

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 08:54 AM

We did the trail from El Barril to Ensenada La Trinidad and thru El Gato
about 6 weeks ago, did not look like anyone had been thru there in years,
the road was good to the Santa Barbara Ranch turn off, but was hard to
follow after that, alot of washouts and you had to make your own trail,
El Gato was destroyed, we had four Jeeps and it took us two days from San
Fransquito, we had 30 gallons of gas for each Jeep and 2 of the jeeps were
running low on gas a couple of miles short of Ensenada La Trinidad, I took my
Jeep and went to San Ignacio and filled up all the gas cans and came back
to where the other 3 Jeeps were camped, I had the tracks from a prior trip
in 2010, if you did not have the tracks you would not find your way thru El
Gato, we ended up with my Jeep going thru 3 times and the other 3 thru once which burned in the track some what, I have some pic's but never
could figure how to post them. We filled up in L.A. Bay and took the green
Door trail to San Fransquito which ate up alot of gas, the second half of the
Green Door trail had a few wiped out areas also.

David K - 12-6-2016 at 09:25 AM

Rich T, allow me to assist with your photo posting. U2U or email me as these new photos would be awesome to see. Thanks! info at vivabaja.com for email if not u2u.

bajatrailrider - 12-6-2016 at 09:39 AM

Thank you Rich T for update. I talked to Sat Mike other day we agreed good, Idea for him to skip no wimps trail at this time. Red flags are little day light,getting lost running out of fuel.No support truck at other end. I know Mike has a 5gal tank on his bike,but that makes it that much harder to ride. I would think on a off road bike Feb or March better time.

Bypass near the Rancho Santa Barbara junction

John M - 12-6-2016 at 09:42 AM

Rich T - So good to hear that you persevered to get through!

We got as far as the turn off junction to Rancho Santa Barbara early last year, and the boulder packed wash where we would have had to go looked like too much at the time. We got as far as w/p 191 and retreated, for some of us it was a gasoline issue as we also did some sight seeing along the way.

Shortly after our attempt, another Nomad 4x4ABC and two other four wheelers made it through. They did not proceed as far south as the boulder strewn wash but turned east at what on the Baja Almanac is shown as La Junta. Their route bypass is shown in white on the attach screen shot, with the gps reading at the beginning of their "detour."

The bypassed several other sections further south but this initial bypass I believe removed the worst of the hurricane damage. Somewhere is their trip report with photos of the difficulties they encountered.

John M

David K - 12-6-2016 at 10:02 AM

Here is the "No Wimps Trail" and the box is the area of John's Google map of the bypass area off the road to Rancho Santa Barbara...

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 10:07 AM

I was checking it out for a bike route next March, we usually do a six day
ride, but it would be pretty brutal on a motorcycle, especially El Gato, miles
of boulders and if you didn't know the area you could end up going miles
to find a dead end canyon and having to back track, once you made it thru El
Gato the last 45 miles into San Ignacio were easy.

Trinadad wash condition?

John M - 12-6-2016 at 10:11 AM

Rich, what was the condition of the Trinadad Wash - between La Trinadad & El Gato?

JM

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 10:12 AM

Hi David,
When I get a chance will send you some pic's, the route you posted is
the route we took.

David K - 12-6-2016 at 10:19 AM

OK... and I will also share the steps to post photos here (or any other forum)... the key is pixel size, not file size. High-quality photos that don't mess up forum pages by being bigger than the 800-pixel page.

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 10:49 AM

John M, it was muddy by La Trinidad and where the road used to be in El
Gato turned into a huge boulder field wash, you do not want to follow the wash, if you do you will end up in the wrong canyon, if you were ever thru there before you will remember how it felt like you were going in circles on the old road, you will find yourself zig zagging across the wash, pick up a piece of the trail and then you will be back in another wash, on our way back from San Ignacio it was at night and that was really interesting. If some one were to go thru now they could probably follow our wheel tracks for a good part of it.

round trip?

John M - 12-6-2016 at 11:09 AM

Did you do southbound then again north?

Tom, (TMW) and Roy (Squarecircle) hope to leave late this week to explore the trail - with your tracks they may do more than just "explore." - Tom will no doubt be on this thread later today. He's done the trail both directions a time or two.

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 12:31 PM

This trip we went south only, that was enough.

TMW - 12-6-2016 at 12:50 PM

Good news that your 4 wheeler got thru.

Roy and I will be leaving San Diego either Thursday or Friday morning. We will be exploring a mine near El Barril then down to the NWT to check it out. rich did you do a GPS track of the trail?

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 01:13 PM

Yes I have the tracks, just looked at them, I use a garmin 450T, trying to
remember how to send them. They are loaded in Base Camp.

PaulW - 12-6-2016 at 04:31 PM

Got curious GE PRO does not show the track. Bing is way better.
Coast line heading N starts at N27 52.14294, W112 46.26897. That is as far as I got in 2009 starting at San Ignacio. To far for a short day trip.

David K - 12-6-2016 at 05:14 PM

Some of that route (north of Santa Marta) is on El Camino Real. I would enjoy seeing photos of any of the mission road you see.

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 06:54 PM

David, I will send you the tracks along with TMW and Paul.

rich t - 12-6-2016 at 08:08 PM

TMW I sent you the tracks.

TMW - 12-6-2016 at 08:27 PM

Thanks Rich. I'm looking at them now.

PaulW - 12-6-2016 at 09:39 PM

Good job Rich

CALAMAJUE WASH, rich t photograph

David K - 12-7-2016 at 09:36 AM

Maps from Rich coming soon, thanks TW for the help!

First Photo:

[Edited on 12-7-2016 by David K]

Photos from rich t, No Wimps Trail

David K - 12-7-2016 at 09:55 AM

These (first 8) were spots we made a trail north of Ensenada La Trinidad

A region of Baja few get to see... Thanks Rich!

David K - 12-7-2016 at 10:22 AM

70: Where we camped about 3 miles north of Ensenada La Trinidad

74: 074 thru 080 is in El Gato

87: is a couple of Donkeys on the road to San Ignacio.

TMW - 12-7-2016 at 10:41 AM

Thanks Rich, I've downloaded the GPS track into my NUVI GPS and I've also converted them to Google Earth.

MAP-1 of 3 using rich t's GPS track

David K - 12-7-2016 at 10:45 AM

In order to show more trail at higher detail, I have oriented the map with north on the right. I have added a few place names to help locate the area on paper maps.

Map 2 of 3

David K - 12-7-2016 at 10:55 AM

In the background note the pins marking El Camino Real, The King's Highway. El Gato is on a branch of ECR and was a way station in mission days.

Map 3 of 3

David K - 12-7-2016 at 11:06 AM

rich t - 12-7-2016 at 06:24 PM

David, thanks for posting everything, TMW, remember the track that David
has showing from San Fransquito to El Barril gets narrow and you are going
thru some tight areas that have some cactus, it is a good bike route, you can do it in your Taco and the scratches will rub out, the other option is to follow my tracks from 2011.

TMW - 12-7-2016 at 09:13 PM

Thanks Rich I'll keep that in mind.

We'll be stopping at Cocos, Panchos, the El Barril La Sirena mine and Rancho Crestones. Rancho Santa Barbara is abondoned past R Crestones.

The Lady of the ranch

rich t - 12-7-2016 at 09:25 PM

TMW, say hi to Poncho, we camp there a couple of times every year

PaulW - 12-8-2016 at 09:19 PM

I wonder what the mileage is from LAB PMEX to San Ignacio PMEX?

David K - 12-8-2016 at 11:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

I wonder what the mileage is from LAB PMEX to San Ignacio PMEX?

200 miles.

Mexitron - 12-9-2016 at 06:20 AM

Great info, looks a fun area to explore.

PaulW - 12-9-2016 at 10:04 PM

LAB 2 ElBarril 84 mi per AAA map
Numbers from tack logs:
El Barril 2 ElGato 59.5 mi
ElBarril 2 Trinidad 49 mi
Trinidad to ElGato 10.5 mi
ElGato 2 San Ignacio 58 - 62 mi
ElGato 2 Graded Road 24.7mi
Graded road 2 Sanignacio 37.4mi
Total LAB 2 San Ignacio 206mi. About 4 or 5 miles short due to me breaking the tracks for miles

David K - 12-9-2016 at 11:04 PM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

L.A. Bay to El Barril 84 mi (per AAA map)
Numbers from track logs:
El Barril to El Gato 59.5 mi
El Barril to Trinidad 49 mi
Trinidad to El Gato 10.5 mi
El Gato to San Ignacio 58 - 62 mi
...(El Gato to Graded Road 24.7mi)
...(Graded road to San Ignacio 37.4mi)

Total L.A. Bay to San Ignacio 206mi. (About 4 or 5 miles short due to me breaking the tracks for miles)

I edited your notes a bit for clarity...

Thanks, Paul!

mcnut - 12-14-2016 at 10:03 AM

OT I know but...

Tom, most Garmin Nuvi models do not support importing tracks (there are workarounds though).
Most Zumos and all handhelds do support importing tracks.

Bruce

PaulW - 12-14-2016 at 11:49 AM

True there are many Garmin units that allow user direct importing tracks, but I do not know of any that are called Nuvi. All the good unit cost way more than any Nuvi because the contain SW and memory that accommodates the task.
However there are smart people can convert a track to a map and that works for a Nuvi. I only know of one guy that has mastered the methods. Learning for him was a very big deal.

StuckSucks - 12-14-2016 at 03:40 PM

No Wimps embedded in Google Maps

PaulW - 12-14-2016 at 05:30 PM

Looks good

advrider - 12-14-2016 at 06:54 PM

Would love to get someones old tracks, we are headed down in February and might try it on motos? Might depend on gas at SF, without it we would be cutting it to close for my liking. A gallon or two of gas will give us a little margin for error/navigation issues.

Gasoline

John M - 12-14-2016 at 07:40 PM

Several times we checked about gasoline at Rancho Piedra Blanca - about 15 miles west of the route, on the road to El Arco (assuming you'll be going south from Bay of LA). They had gasoline each time we asked. On the road from BOLA it's left to San Francisquito and right to Piedra Blanca.

GPS for Rancho Piedra Blanca: 28 11.669N& 113 12.255W (decimal degrees)

A couple of years ago someone told us gasoline MAY be found at El Barril - we asked around but got no offers. Perhaps bikes would fare better as they wouldn't take the gallons and gallons several 4x4s would have.

John M

David K - 12-14-2016 at 07:54 PM

Maybe check at El Barril, that ranch has become more of a village in recent years.

PaulW - 12-14-2016 at 08:02 PM

Quote: Originally posted by advrider

Would love to get someones old tracks, we are headed down in February and might try it on motos? Might depend on gas at SF, without it we would be cutting it to close for my liking. A gallon or two of gas will give us a little margin for error/navigation issues.

==
Hookup with a 4x4 and have company with gas. Se know a 4x4 can do it with gas to spare provided extra is carried in cans. I bet there are several guys in SF that would join you?
The trip is high on the bucket list.

Piedra Blanca facebook

John M - 12-15-2016 at 07:59 AM

https://www.facebook.com/Rancho-Piedra-Blanca-11752899493822...

Check out this facebook page - I've not looked into it but it might be worth a try before you plan to ride a 30 mile round trip only to find they do not have gasoline.

JM

AKgringo - 12-15-2016 at 08:23 AM

I have stopped at Piedra Blanca twice, but never looked for gasoline. It is a working ranch, and they produce commercial quantities of machaca, and cheese.

I was the only customer there at the time, but they cooked machaca burritos for me, served with their cheese.

It is a good stop!

ehall - 12-16-2016 at 10:26 AM

What is El Gato?

David K - 12-16-2016 at 10:47 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ehall

What is El Gato?

Today it is a corral at the end of a long, straight section of El Camino Real. The trail to La Trinidad passes it. The name is also applied to a nearby dry lake.

Maybe TW will have a photo of it?

KasloKid - 12-16-2016 at 10:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by ehall

What is El Gato?

PaulW - 12-17-2016 at 06:54 AM

Quote: Originally posted by ehall

What is El Gato?

=== =
The cat.
Maybe it lives in the corral?

AKgringo - 12-17-2016 at 10:03 AM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

Quote: Originally posted by ehall

What is El Gato?

=== =
The cat.
Maybe it lives in the corral?

I doubt that it applies here, but el gato is also 'the jack'. I stopped to help a guy with a flat tire, and he asked to use mine!

David K - 12-17-2016 at 10:35 AM

El Gato is located where the road to La Trinidad intersects with El Camino Real, east branch or the Golfo Camino Real.

Route

rich t - 11-6-2017 at 07:57 PM

Has anyone been on any of the three routes shown on David K's map from Santa Gertrudis to San Ignacio? Wanted to scout out another route going from San Fransquito, Santa Barbara Ranch to San Ignacio, this will be a bike trip in March 2018, will scout it out in my Jeep probably in January.

mtgoat666 - 11-6-2017 at 08:43 PM

Quote: Originally posted by rich t

Has anyone been on any of the three routes shown on David K's map from Santa Gertrudis to San Ignacio? Wanted to scout out another route going from San Fransquito, Santa Barbara Ranch to San Ignacio, this will be a bike trip in March 2018, will scout it out in my Jeep probably in January.

The map scale makes it hard to see what route is. But that is mostly protected area, you can’t enter w/o guide, and motorcycles are generally verboten. If you want to travel up there, it’s w/ guides, and usually traveling by foot/mule.
A really great place to travel, well worth the adventure of giving up internal combustion engines for a few days!

rich t - 11-6-2017 at 10:24 PM

The route I am most interested in is the eastern one from Santa Gertrudis which crosses the entrance to El Gato, we can take the road south from there, have done that several times, but have never been from Santa Gertrudis to El gato, is that a 2 track?

Desertbull - 11-7-2017 at 07:56 AM

drove thru a couple weeks ago the entire No Wimps ... a tractor / grader has cleaned it all up ... a new side road thru El Gato bypasses all the crappy rock trail ... it was less then a full day from San Ignacio to Punta San Fransiquito ... good times.

[Edited on 11-7-2017 by Desertbull]

rich t - 11-7-2017 at 08:07 AM

Thanks for the info, last year there was talk about someone buying a large parcel of property and putting up a gate and blocking El Gato, sounds like it never happened.

David K - 11-7-2017 at 09:26 AM

Quote: Originally posted by rich t

This lady (and others riding mules):

David K - 11-7-2017 at 09:28 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Desertbull

drove thru a couple weeks ago the entire No Wimps ... a tractor / grader has cleaned it all up ... a new side road thru El Gato bypasses all the crappy rock trail ... it was less then a full day from San Ignacio to Punta San Fransiquito ... good times.

[Edited on 11-7-2017 by Desertbull]

Interesting news Tim!
Word is a power cable will cross the gulf near El Barril and connect with the Baja Sur power grid near Santa Rosalia. Perhaps this grading is for that project? Can you draw us a map showing the new graded road in relation to the No Wimps Trail?
Thank you.

TMW - 11-7-2017 at 10:11 AM

Fencing has already started to be installed with gates. Whether the gates will be locked or not is not clear at this time. The person in charge has not made it clear in his communications. The person in charge is named Juan and he is working out of Rancho La Ilusion near El Barril. This is for a mountain goat preserve. I'm not sure of the total area involved. I was told it covered the Rancho Santa Barbara and Rancho San Miguel areas.

If anyone stops at Rancho La Ilusion they may be able to talk to Juan and get the latest info.

Harald, Nomad 4x4abc, may have more info on the power line going thru that David mentioned. He had a map of the basic route.

TMW - 11-7-2017 at 10:39 AM

I traced a route about 5 miles south of El Gato going northwest toward Santa Gertrudis but topping off before the 28th parallel rounding down to Hwy 1 at KM154. It looked to be all two track with a couple of ranches along the way.

David K - 11-7-2017 at 11:34 AM

You saying a 4 wheel vehicle can get from San Casimiro over the sierra to Santa Marta/ El Rosarito now? wow!

rich t - 11-7-2017 at 12:17 PM

TMW, did you actually run this or pick the roads up on google earth?

4x4abc - 11-7-2017 at 06:42 PM

not drivable with 4x4, Tom
maybe, maybe, maybe with a bike

I am pretty sure that when CFE is done with the new power line, the area will be closed off

the new power line (230kV) will run from a tad south of San Francisquito to Santa Rosalia along the coastline
good bye No Wimp trail

rich t - 11-7-2017 at 07:30 PM

Can you go from Santa Barbara Ranch, Santa Gertrudis, San Casimino, to El Trufino which ties into the No Wimps just west of El Gato?

TMW - 11-7-2017 at 07:43 PM

Quote: Originally posted by rich t

TMW, did you actually run this or pick the roads up on google earth?

I followed it on Google Earth. The GE map was 2014 so the storms from then may have made it impossible to run now.

TMW - 11-7-2017 at 07:49 PM

I don't think you can go from Santa Gertrudis to Rancho Santa Barbara except maybe on a motorcycle. At least that is the way it looks on Google Earth. There is a section closer to Santa Barbara that you lose the trail on GE.

rich t - 11-7-2017 at 08:16 PM

Has anyone tried going from San Francisquito, Rancho Piedra Blanca, Rancho Miraflores, Santa Gertrudis, San Casimino then to El trufino?

David K - 11-7-2017 at 08:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by TMW

I don't think you can go from Santa Gertrudis to Rancho Santa Barbara except maybe on a motorcycle. At least that is the way it looks on Google Earth. There is a section closer to Santa Barbara that you lose the trail on GE.

Santa Gertrudis to Santa Barbara and on to the coast was a mission supply trail.

It was done on m/c about 15 years ago by Kevin Ward. No 4x4s. Pretty crazy cliff the mission era trail drops down along.

rich t - 11-7-2017 at 08:24 PM

How about the route above your last post, do you know if it is doable David?

David K - 11-7-2017 at 09:45 PM

Show me El Trufino on a map and I will check my sources. From what I saw near Prosperidad a few months ago, I bet fences are going to be an issue.

rich t - 11-7-2017 at 10:27 PM

If you were heading north from San Ignacio and you reach the sign that says El Gato there is a turn to the North with a sign that says El trufino, it is about 13 miles South east of San Casimino.

Recently in El Barril

bburnsman - 11-8-2017 at 09:23 PM

I was in El Barril last week. We tried to go south from town to see how far we could get on the trail. Prior to doing so, we spoke to locals because we were interested in how the hurricanes had treated the area. Locals reported that might not be the biggest problem. They said something about a goat farm or ranch and that there are gates erected with locks and no trespassing signs. Being non-believers, we went down the trail and it wasn't two miles till we hit the gates and signs. closed up tight.

rich t - 11-8-2017 at 10:12 PM

The route I am interested in would by pass the No Wimps trail, going south you would leave San Francisquito and take the road heading to El Arco, after passing thru Rancho Piedra Blanca the road makes a Y, take the left spur which on my map goes to Rancho Miraflores, from there you would go thru santa Gertrudis, then head south pass thru El Carrizzo to San Casimiro, then to El Trufino which ties you back into the road to San Ignacio west of El Gato. The map I am using may have different names for some of the ranches, it is a programmable Mexican map.

PaulW - 11-8-2017 at 11:31 PM

Rich,
I cannot find El Trufino on the Almanac. Can you tell me a place nearby drainage, or mountain. I see no track leading north from near el Gato, but it shows the road we used to get to el Gato from the south.
Thanks

rich t - 11-9-2017 at 07:59 AM

Paul, we will be in Baja tomorrow, will talk to you then, if you look on Henrys map you will see El Trufino, there is also a sign on the road by the El Gato sign which is west of El Gato. The El Trufino road looks pretty good at that point.

David K - 11-9-2017 at 08:05 AM

I am with Paul on this Rich. I was at Guillermo Prieto and Prosperidad, as well as Miraflores to Santa Gertrudis this past summer, so I was all around.

The trails between Santa Gertrudis and San Ignacio (via San Casimiro and El Gato, etc.) are mission roads from the 1700s, known as El Camino Real. There were three routes between the two missions of San Ignacio and Santa Gertrudis: Sierra, Golfo, Pacifico.

Modern roads are over the top of some of these trails. Google Earth is your friend at following them.

[Edited on 11-9-2017 by David K]

David K - 11-9-2017 at 08:26 AM

El Gato and San Casimiro are pointed out.

PaulW - 11-9-2017 at 09:21 AM

Above on DK map. Found it on Henry's map (EL Triunfo). I suspect the route is the mid one passing thru San Gregorio drainage. Rich will clarify later.

David K - 11-9-2017 at 09:53 AM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

Above on DK map. Found it on Henry's map (EL Triunfo). I suspect the route is the mid one passing thru San Gregorio drainage. Rich will clarify later.

I see a Triumfo at the bottom of the above map but, nowhere near the line between San Casimiro and El Gato... unless there is another one, too?

PaulW - 11-9-2017 at 10:07 AM

Henry's map shows a road looping from El Gato road nw then S to San Gregorio. And it shows another SG north of the track? No connection for the road Rich describes. Clarification needed.
Probably driving the roads will give clarity.

David K - 11-9-2017 at 10:21 AM

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

Henry's map shows a road looping from El Gato road nw then S to San Gregorio. And it shows another SG north of the track? No connection for the road Rich describes. Clarification needed.
Probably driving the roads will give clarity.

Maybe you could show us what Henry's Map looks like?

PaulW - 11-9-2017 at 11:47 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K

Quote: Originally posted by PaulW

Maybe you could show us what Henry's Map looks like?

======= =
Screen shot

motoged - 11-9-2017 at 12:02 PM

El Triunfo or El Trufino ? ......dyslexics make poor cartographers :biggrin:

screen shot

PaulW - 11-9-2017 at 12:15 PM

Again
Learning new stuff

mtgoat666 - 11-9-2017 at 12:21 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K

I am with Paul on this Rich. I was at Guillermo Prieto and Prosperidad, as well as Miraflores to Santa Gertrudis this past summer, so I was all around.

The trails between Santa Gertrudis and San Ignacio (via San Casimiro and El Gato, etc.) are mission roads from the 1700s, known as El Camino Real. There were three routes between the two missions of San Ignacio and Santa Gertrudis: Sierra, Golfo, Pacifico.

Modern roads are over the top of some of these trails. Google Earth is your friend at following them.

[Edited on 11-9-2017 by David K]

Your blue-lined routes are mostly inside the world heritage site boundary, in area controlled by biosphere reserve and INAH.
why are y'all strategizing offroading in the restricted areas?

here is a map so you can stay out of trouble:

http://lugares.inah.gob.mx/images/zonas/croquis/Sierra_San_F...

the map on left is protected area boundary (not the inset map)

David K - 11-9-2017 at 01:32 PM

Nobody told the padres, goat. The blue lines are routes the CAMINO REAL from about 1750 to 1800s, even used beyond and to today. Most of the area is too rugged for automobiles and that is why car roads went around the mountains and not over them.

rts551 - 11-9-2017 at 02:41 PM

Yes...Too bad the padres didn't know about the biosphere. LOL

PaulW - 11-9-2017 at 02:43 PM

Goat,
Not a relevant comment. Nobody is suggesting we would drive off existing roads. Many of the roads we are discussing are not be depicted on the various maps, but many exist and we are just trying to find them before we drive.
David's blue lines are just for orientation to get us in the region of discussion.

TMW - 11-9-2017 at 05:56 PM

The Biosphere Reserve does not prohibit driving on existing roads. That's how the ranchers get around.

bajatrailrider - 11-10-2017 at 09:01 AM

Quote: Originally posted by TMW

The Biosphere Reserve does not prohibit driving on existing roads. That's how the ranchers get around.

That is true as all ranchers use the roads to travel in the reserves. MT has no knowledge of Baja just a clueless tourist.

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