BajaNomad

Grey Whale Concerns

motoged - 5-1-2019 at 03:05 PM

It seems some whales aren't doing so well....

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/grey-whales-stranded-west-coast-1.5119056

OCEANUS - 5-1-2019 at 03:45 PM

Explanations span from malnourishment to potentially reaching their population carrying capacity. Necropsies support malnourishment idea, as many stranded whales were "skinny." Something similar happened back in 1999-2000. At that time, it was the younger whales succumbed to starvation first, and the mortality event extended into a second year with adults dying later as they arguably had more reserves of fat to sustain them.
It would be interesting to hear what Shari and others observed with this year's class. Did these whales appear arrive underweight? Did lagoon fasting complicate the survival prospects for what was already an undernourished individual?
Time will tell...

shari - 5-1-2019 at 03:58 PM

This season the whales arrived in OJo de Liebre very late supposedly because the ice pack in the Bering Straight didnt freeze over so they had access to food later....and the numbers across all the lagoons were about half of mother's and calves we usually have.

There were many thin, young solitary whales and 8 dead whales that I knew of...most were young or yearling female whales and very thin which supports the malnutrition theory. I had never seen so many mortalities in one season.

Gray whales are known to limit reproduction based on food supply which may be why there were fewer calves and we saw hardly any mating either so perhaps they are compensating for a food scarcity.

They also left the lagoon earlier than usual probably because they were so hungry. So yes I did notice more small whales in poor condition this season. It will be interesting to see what 2020 brings.

Bob H - 5-1-2019 at 05:39 PM

Very interesting stuff. Thanks Sheri.

OCEANUS - 7-11-2019 at 10:50 AM

In today's news, 7 gray whales washed ashore in Alaska over the weekend:

https://www.cnn.com/2019/07/11/us/alaska-dead-gray-whales-tr...

The starvation explanation is still the go to at this point in time.

shari - 7-11-2019 at 11:59 AM

from what I have learned, amphipods that Gray whales eat are starving because they are fed by algae that grows on the underneath side of the ice pack in Alaska....it dies and drops off the bottom and falls onto the ocean floor where it feeds the amphipods. So because there is significantly less ice and in some areas where gray whales feed...none at all so the amphipods died. This makes the most sense to me and answers why whales are going to look for food in areas they dont usually feed in.

Bubba - 7-13-2019 at 05:34 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Bob H  
Very interesting stuff. Thanks Sheri.


Yes, very good stuff, thank you.

JoeJustJoe - 7-13-2019 at 07:26 AM

It doesn't take a climate scientist, Inspector Clouseau, or a Baja whale tourist guide, to determine that man made global Arctic warming is behind the gray whale deaths due to their food chain supply being disrupted because of the record-low levels of sea ice.

However, the scientists at this time are still investigating other possible causes of death as well as global warming.

_________________________________________

Could Arctic warming be behind gray whale deaths in Alaska, and elsewhere? Here’s why scientists are asking.

The region is warming twice as fast as the rest of the world, and scientists have observed record-low levels of sea ice in the past few years. As a result, the ocean ecosystem there is in “state of flux,” Foy said.

That has to do with the way sea ice affects the marine food web, and the growth of the tiny phytoplankton that form its base.

When ice is present late into the spring, it creates conditions that cause most of the phytoplankton to fall all the way to the ocean floor, known as the benthos. At the bottom, the phytoplankton supports an ecosystem dominated by invertebrates, like crabs and sea stars – there aren’t typically a lot of fish like cod and pollock swimming around. And that “benthic-dominated” ecosystem is what supports gray whales’ primary prey – shrimp-like creatures called amphipods.

https://www.alaskapublic.org/2019/06/10/could-arctic-warming...

BajaRat - 8-9-2019 at 07:17 PM

Any reports on this years food supply?
Lionel :cool:

BajaBlanca - 8-10-2019 at 12:51 AM

The ramifications of climate change are just astounding. One can only hope that the whales can somehow adapt faster than they die off.

BajaRat - 8-10-2019 at 08:48 AM

We are so fortunate to be able to diversify our food sources
I wonder what alternatives they have and if so what kind of numbers it will support.
It seemed like they were making quite a comeback and now another devastating blow.
Amazing how this specialized food web now has the potential of negative impact on residents of BCS and the other creatures that benefit from the grey whales wellbeing.
Lionel :cool:

defrag4 - 8-10-2019 at 09:02 AM

not just the grey whales unfortunately, Orcas dying off as well :(

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/three-southe...



[Edited on 8-10-2019 by defrag4]

BajaRat - 8-10-2019 at 09:08 AM

Quote: Originally posted by defrag4  
not just the grey whales unfortunately, Orcas dying off as well :(

https://www.cbc.ca/news/canada/british-columbia/three-southe...



[Edited on 8-10-2019 by defrag4]


And the PCB levels they are recording are off the charts
Lionel

bajamary1952 - 8-10-2019 at 09:09 AM

I read several biologist reports that speculate that the whole area is oversaturated with whales & they have reached their maximum capacity for the area. That sounds more plausible than the other theories & most articles from different sources mention this:
https://www.oregonlive.com/environment/2019/05/after-a-spike...




[Edited on 8-10-2019 by bajamary1952]

SFandH - 8-10-2019 at 09:28 AM

If the die-off continues for several years, that will be evidence of decreasing food supply which might be attributed to warming arctic waters. Hopefully, the population just exceeded the carrying capacity and the unusual amount of deaths will end with a decrease in population.

It may take several years of observation to understand what's going on.


[Edited on 8-10-2019 by SFandH]

AKgringo - 8-10-2019 at 10:00 AM

Even without human caused influences, a stable, unchanging ecosystem is almost unheard of in nature. Boom or bust is more common, with one species filling the void left by the decline of another one.

The brutal whaling industry of the last century left a lot of food for species like pollack to flourish, and sea lions along with them. The recovery of the whale population, along with the human industry that has grown around commercial fishing, has made it tough to guess what is 'normal' anymore!

BajaRat - 8-10-2019 at 11:24 AM

Quote: Originally posted by bajamary1952  
I read several biologist reports that speculate that the whole area is oversaturated with whales & they have reached their maximum capacity for the area. That sounds more plausible than the other theories & most articles from different sources mention this:
https://www.oregonlive.com/environment/2019/05/after-a-spike...



[Edited on 8-10-2019 by bajamary1952]



I think we can reasonably assume that there is a cap on what the environment will support
But without that particular food source in play it will surely alter that previous number
Lionel

BajaRat - 8-10-2019 at 11:28 AM

One things for sure
Change
Lionel :cool:

David K - 8-10-2019 at 12:27 PM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaRat  
One things for sure
Change
Lionel :cool:


Exactly, change is normal!

BajaRat - 8-10-2019 at 01:04 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Quote: Originally posted by BajaRat  
One things for sure
Change
Lionel :cool:


Exactly, change is normal!


Change is a consequence

Lee - 8-10-2019 at 04:03 PM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  

The brutal whaling industry of the last century left a lot of food for species like pollack to flourish, and sea lions along with them. The recovery of the whale population, along with the human industry that has grown around commercial fishing, has made it tough to guess what is 'normal' anymore!


Japan has resumed whaling and there's nothing the US is going to do about it. The norm? Not really.

MX gill fishing off Pescadero. Miles of nets. Cabo Harbor Master knows about it.

Choose your battle. Planet going to hell in a hand basket. Got my popcorn.

BajaRat - 8-10-2019 at 04:12 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Lee  
Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  

The brutal whaling industry of the last century left a lot of food for species like pollack to flourish, and sea lions along with them. The recovery of the whale population, along with the human industry that has grown around commercial fishing, has made it tough to guess what is 'normal' anymore!


Japan has resumed whaling and there's nothing the US is going to do about it. The norm? Not really.

MX gill fishing off Pescadero. Miles of nets. Cabo Harbor Master knows about it.

Choose your battle. Planet going to hell in a hand basket. Got my popcorn.



Unfortunately Lee I think this is the battle for our lives as well
Lionel :cool:

Skipjack Joe - 8-12-2019 at 06:13 PM

Malnutrition and carrying capacity go hand in hand. I don't understand how they theorize it could be one or the other. You don't starve unless you're running out of food. Carrying capacity means lacking food. The carrying capacity has likely dropped and we're seeing starvation. It should be easy to show if the amphipod populations have declined.

SFandH - 8-12-2019 at 06:16 PM

The question is, Is the food supply decreasing due to global warming, or has the population exceeded the amount of food normally available?

Skipjack Joe - 8-12-2019 at 07:39 PM

Animal populations in a stable environment approach their capacity as a sigmoidal curve. That is, as they reach that limit the birth and death rate are virtually the same. Healthy mature animals are not the ones to go. It’s the young and aged.

Animals living in unstable populations have massive die offs due to facing hostile conditions they can’t cope with. Those populations never reach the carrying capacity of the good environment before it changes and there is massive die off. These die offs occur every year so these species have adapted by having lots of offspring quickly.

The grey whale is a species evolved for a stable environment. When their habitat crashes they’re in big trouble.

So, in summary, the pattern of whale die off is not what you’d expect from reaching a stable carrying capacity.

Hope this makes sense.

mtgoat666 - 8-12-2019 at 07:40 PM

Millions of species are at risk of extinction because of the greed, gluttony, selfishness and idiocy of humans. The best thing that could happen to reverse the pollution and habitat/climate destruction of man, and save the whales, is for Ebola or another disease to wipe away 83% of the world human population.
Maybe then good sport fishing would return to baja, eh?

Skipjack Joe - 8-12-2019 at 08:00 PM

That's a bit extreme, don't you think?

Are there any volunteers for such a correction?

The thing is that climate deniers don't seem to understand the principles of animal survival. One well known denier here pooh poohed the difficulty of polar bears "Don't worry about the bears. They'll manage". No they won't. Without a return of their lost habitat they'll sit in zoos, artificially propagated for all eternity. There are no zoos for grey whales.



[Edited on 8-13-2019 by Skipjack Joe]

mtgoat666 - 8-12-2019 at 08:28 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Skipjack Joe  
That's a bit extreme, don't you think?

Are there any volunteers for such a correction?


Not extreme.
All species die out eventually. Paleontology tells us so. History repeats itself.
Perhaps the best thing for the earth is for humans to go extinct, the earlier the better, from the perspective of other species that human activity is driving extinct.

BajaRat - 8-12-2019 at 08:53 PM

^ what Skip Jack said. I think they are in trouble
Lionel

SFandH - 8-13-2019 at 04:00 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Skipjack Joe  
Animal populations in a stable environment approach their capacity as a sigmoidal curve. That is, as they reach that limit the birth and death rate are virtually the same. Healthy mature animals are not the ones to go. It’s the young and aged.

Animals living in unstable populations have massive die offs due to facing hostile conditions they can’t cope with. Those populations never reach the carrying capacity of the good environment before it changes and there is massive die off. These die offs occur every year so these species have adapted by having lots of offspring quickly.

The grey whale is a species evolved for a stable environment. When their habitat crashes they’re in big trouble.

So, in summary, the pattern of whale die off is not what you’d expect from reaching a stable carrying capacity.

Hope this makes sense.



Makes sense, thanks.

Whale-ista - 8-13-2019 at 01:01 PM

Change has happened throughout the history of this planet- but not at the current rate, and not for the reasons we see today.

These latest changes are related to anthropogenic impacts- primarily resulting from the burning of fossil fuels in various forms.

And warming has certainly happened in past millenia. So has cooling. But the rapid increase of CO2 in the last 50-60 years, and related warming of oceans, seas, and melting of glaciers- is unprecedented in speed and scale.

Yes- grey whales have adapted and survived in a changing world for millions of years- one that has been warming and cooling long before humans were here.

But the rapid rate of melting ice and warming seas may be beyond their adaptive strategies.

https://www.star2.com/living/2019/07/17/grey-whales-starving...

And this:

The broader context

The Arctic climate has seemingly gone off the rails this summer. There is no longer any sea ice present in Alaskan waters, with Bering Sea ice having melted out beginning in February, and ice in the Chukchi Sea already pulling back hundreds of miles north of the state. Alaska had its hottest month on record in July. Wildfires are burning across the state, and fires in Siberia have sent plumes of dark smoke into the Arctic, where soot particles can land on the ice and snow and speed up melting.

In July alone, the Greenland ice sheet poured 197 billion tons of water into the North Atlantic, which was enough to raise sea levels by 0.5 millimeter, or 0.02 inches, in a one-month time frame. On Aug. 1, Greenland had its biggest single-day melt event on record, with 12.5 billion tons of surface ice lost to the sea.

Across the Arctic, sea ice is at record to near-record low levels for this time of year and is likely to end the melt season with one of the five lowest ice extents on record in the satellite era, according to the National Snow and Ice Data Center in Boulder, Colo. Sea-ice extent is probably the lowest it has been in at least 1,500 years, based on recent research.

https://www.washingtonpost.com/weather/2019/08/12/lightning-...

[Edited on 8-13-2019 by Whale-ista]

BajaRat - 8-13-2019 at 05:02 PM

The observations they have been recording are off the charts
Unfortunately the torture these different species have been enduring may take them beyond the brink
Sad future for the travelers
Lionel

Marc - 8-21-2019 at 09:34 AM

Quote: Originally posted by OCEANUS  
Explanations span from malnourishment to potentially reaching their population carrying capacity. Necropsies support malnourishment idea, as many stranded whales were "skinny." Something similar happened back in 1999-2000. At that time, it was the younger whales succumbed to starvation first, and the mortality event extended into a second year with adults dying later as they arguably had more reserves of fat to sustain them.
It would be interesting to hear what Shari and others observed with this year's class. Did these whales appear arrive underweight? Did lagoon fasting complicate the survival prospects for what was already an undernourished individual?
Time will tell...


April 1999 we found this juvenile Grey at the southern beach near La Mona in the BOLA. Had washed ashore during the night.


[Edited on 8-21-2019 by Marc]

[Edited on 8-22-2019 by BajaNomad]

LancairDriver - 8-21-2019 at 10:35 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by Skipjack Joe  
That's a bit extreme, don't you think?

Are there any volunteers for such a correction?


Not extreme.
All species die out eventually. Paleontology tells us so. History repeats itself.
Perhaps the best thing for the earth is for humans to go extinct, the earlier the better, from the perspective of other species that human activity is driving extinct.

If you pay any attention to the militaristic action accelerating rapidly in the world today, primarily led by the US, human extinction shouldn’t take much longer.

BajaRat - 8-21-2019 at 10:52 AM

I hope we can keep this topic on track.
The climate information coming to light has a very bleak outlook for the Grey whale in the near future
Not in 50 Years , NOW
Lionel :(

Gscott - 11-16-2019 at 10:09 AM

Revived for interjection of actual facts: California Gray whale population is about 27000. Nearly extinct in the 50s, they are doing just fine. Maybe to fine. Too much competition and they starve to death.

caj13 - 11-16-2019 at 07:38 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Gscott  
Revived for interjection of actual facts: California Gray whale population is about 27000. Nearly extinct in the 50s, they are doing just fine. Maybe to fine. Too much competition and they starve to death.


while you're at it, why not dig up the facts on plankton production in the oceans, what controls that production, food chains and webs etc. here's a hint for you, whales head to the polar regions to eat - because of cold water - huh - wonder why? and if that water warms up a bit, or gets less saline, or the Ph changes - what happens then?

I'll be waiting for your report back on those facts!

Floatflyer - 11-16-2019 at 07:43 PM

Sorry to report that the Makah Indian Tribe of the NW corner of Washington has petitioned to be allowed to take(KILL) 2=3 grey whales for the next 10yrs. Looks like the NOAA is supporting this.

AKgringo - 11-16-2019 at 08:20 PM

Quote: Originally posted by caj13  


while you're at it, why not dig up the facts on plankton production in the oceans, what controls that production, food chains and webs etc. here's a hint for you, whales head to the polar regions to eat - because of cold water - huh - wonder why? and if that water warms up a bit, or gets less saline, or the Ph changes - what happens then?


You are missing a huge factor in your analysis. It is the midnight sun that triggers the explosive growth in the food chain. The whales follow the sun north, then south again.

OCEANUS - 11-17-2019 at 08:49 AM

Quote: Originally posted by caj13


while you're at it, why not dig up the facts on plankton production in the oceans, what controls that production, food chains and webs etc. here's a hint for you, whales head to the polar regions to eat - because of cold water - huh - wonder why? and if that water warms up a bit, or gets less saline, or the Ph changes - what happens then?


You are missing a huge factor in your analysis. It is the midnight sun that triggers the explosive growth in the food chain. The whales follow the sun north, then south again.


Gringo
Your argument that whales are "following the sun" is incorrect for the following reasons:

1. While the sun plays a role in (phyto)plankton production, what triggers the "explosive growth" in plankton populations is the availability of nutrients. Nutrients are a limiting factor which means when all the basic requirements of photosynthesis have been met (Water, CO2, and light), nutrients are the factor that differentiate the productvity of one area over another. These nutrients are more abundant in colder, deeper waters. When events like wind upwell these nutrients to the surface, you get plankton blooms.
In the case of gray whales (and humpback whales) they time their feeding to coincide when the gulf of Alaska/Bering Sea is coldest. Coldest water correlates with more nutrient upwelling events, more nutrients correlates with the "explosive growth of the food chain", which correlates with more food for our whales.
2. Whales do not follow the sun south for the purposes of food. Instead, you should view it as a trade off. Whales are leaving a good thing in the north, in this case food, to capitalize on a good thing to the south which in this case is warm, protected and highly saline bodies of water in Baja to calve and nurse their young. Their epic journeys south take them through relatively warmer, nutrient deplete waters that do not provide the abundance of food as their Alaskan waters did. This lack of food is tolerable because the conditions in the lagoons of Baja's west coast provide the safest, warmest, and most buoyant waters in the North Pacific at that time of year. These conditions allow for their calves to translate more of their calorie intake to growth and fat over the 1-2 months that they will spend in the lagoons before they make the ~6,000 mile journey north for the spring upwelling events in Alaskan waters. These upwelling events will again fuel the explosion of food that will re-nourish their bodies after spending so much energy to complete the journey.

So, caj13 is correct. The nutrients are the ticket. And when we face changing conditions to our oceans like temperature and pH, you should have the mindset that tries to predict how these changes will affect nutrient availability.

AKgringo - 11-17-2019 at 10:14 AM

Oceanus, your explanation of that part of the whale's existence is well stated, and I am aware of the importance of all parts of the cycle.

For the sake of brevity, I stated that the whales follow the sun, which I admit is a poor analogy, but no worse than Caj13's statement that "they go there because the water is cold"!

I was just pointing out that he omitted a huge component of the equation in his reply to Gscott. I also tried to do it without resorting to sarcastic, mocking retorts!

As far as my mindset, I am not in denial, I am concerned about the future of our planet, but the prediction of consequences is beyond my paygrade.

bajaric - 11-17-2019 at 11:23 AM

Quote: Originally posted by OCEANUS  


In the case of gray whales (and humpback whales) they time their feeding to coincide when the gulf of Alaska/Bering Sea is coldest. Coldest water correlates with more nutrient upwelling events,

end quote
Wait a minute. The whales migrate south in the winter. They feed in the arctic in the summer. You are saying that the water in the arctic is colder in the summer?

27,000 whales consume a lot of cephalopods. Maybe due to protected status they have reached their maximum population. I do not really like the idea of killing these intelligent creatures but maybe nature is just self limiting the population. Would being harpooned and made into whale jerky be worse than starving and washing up on a beach?

[Edited on 11-17-2019 by bajaric]

David K - 11-17-2019 at 12:16 PM

*When you reply to a quote, make sure to begin your reply after the ending quote tag ... that tag looks like [ /quote]. Otherwise, your reply is included in the other Nomad's quote. You can edit your reply and add the tag [ /quote] (without the extra space) before your part begins.

caj13 - 11-17-2019 at 05:01 PM

Ric - Nice try. But I will assume you know you and your proposed ideas are logical fallacies, but i guess you figured it was worth a try - anything to support team climate denier - right!

So why would that stupid CAJ make such a dumb staement about migrating to cold water?
I guess you guys are setting him straight - imagine he's too dumb to understand that the temperature of the ocean in Laguna ojo de Libre in Jan - march is "MUch warmer" than the Arctic ocean at the same time - right, so CAJ is clearly wrong - because if they were migrating to cold for more food - they would be up in the arctic in the winter - right!

Wait - wait - seems to me they don't eat during the time they are in Baja? so why bother = Oh - take a guess, warm water with much less predators makes it a great growth environment for calving?

so why in the world to the head north for the summer ? whats the water temp of the arctic ocean in July, as compared to Baja - and one more time - what does water temp have to do with copopod and Krill productivity?

So these idiotic whales head south for warmth and safety to protect the young, but then have to migrate back to cold water to find the volume of food they need.

and all of a sudden their food supply is reduced by 30% - So what would happen to you if I reduced your food by 1/3, then sent you on a forced 5000 mile march with no food?

This isn't that hard guys, pretty basic biology - very well known and worked out. I'm sorry if it conflicts with your personal agenda but at some point - don't you think you ought to actually deal with facts and data, instead of fabricated nonsense based on logical fallacy and invented ideas with no evidence supporting it!

[Edited on 11-18-2019 by caj13]

Skipjack Joe - 11-17-2019 at 09:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by bajaric  
Quote: Originally posted by OCEANUS  


In the case of gray whales (and humpback whales) they time their feeding to coincide when the gulf of Alaska/Bering Sea is coldest. Coldest water correlates with more nutrient upwelling events,

end quote
Wait a minute. The whales migrate south in the winter. They feed in the arctic in the summer. You are saying that the water in the arctic is colder in the summer?

27,000 whales consume a lot of cephalopods. Maybe due to protected status they have reached their maximum population. I do not really like the idea of killing these intelligent creatures but maybe nature is just self limiting the population. Would being harpooned and made into whale jerky be worse than starving and washing up on a beach?

[Edited on 11-17-2019 by bajaric]


from https://earthobservatory.nasa.gov/features/SeaIce

"When the ice melts in the summer, it releases nutrients into the water, stimulating the growth of phytoplankton, the center of the marine food web. As the ice melts, it exposes ocean water to sunlight, spurring photosynthesis in phytoplankton. When ice freezes, the underlying water gets saltier and sinks, mixing the water column and bringing nutrients to the surface."

The phytoplankton in the Arctic are like the plants in your backyard. Your plants need sunlight but they also need to be fertilized. 'Fertilization' in the arctic occurs by upwhelling water that brings nutrients from the bottom. The arctic is rich in life because when the ice freezes the saltier water sinks and there is an up and down current. The tropics, in comparison, are pretty much devoid of life in the open seas. The water has plenty of sunlight but no nutrients. So if you reduce the ice caps you get more sunlight but fewer nutrients. Fewer nutrients mean fewer phytoplankton which means fewer amphipods which means the carrying capacity for whales drops and they start to starve. In fact, as the food chain collapses lots of critters begin to starve.

Also - grey whales consume amphipods (crustaceans) not cephalopods (molluscs)

bajaric - 11-18-2019 at 09:50 AM

Its all about the plankton, eh? Don't get me wrong, I like whales. I am especially disgusted by the use of military sonar that disrupts their hearing. I simply wanted to point out that there must be a certain carrying capacity beyond which there are too many whales to be supported by the existing food source, even without considering the detrimental effects of global warming. I looked up the whale take back in whaling days and it was not that many, I think several thousand taken out of Scammon's lagoon if I remember right, so even back then before the industrial revolution put all that CO2 in the atmosphere there was a limited number of whales that could be supported by the existing food chain.

I wonder when the human population on earth will reach its apogee. Like the Dow Jones Industrial Average hitting an all time high, then starting an irreversible decline.

Baja_Traveler - 12-4-2019 at 11:16 AM

They do eat during their time in Baja - I have personally observed them feeding at the mouth of San Ignacio Lagoon just last year. Scripps Institution of Oceanography has also documented them feeding during their migration right off of Scripps pier in San Diego.

shari - 12-4-2019 at 01:24 PM

Gray whales will eat if food presents...for example they surface gulp when crab larvae float to the surface. But there is very little food available for them...they are just snacking when possible. They also teach their calves how to drag the bottom too but may not be feeding...although there are some ghost shrimp clouds near the bottom at times too.

Gray whales arent plankton eaters but plankton feeds what grays do eat so yes it all goes back to the importance of plankton.

motoged - 12-5-2019 at 08:41 AM

A few years ago they had a permit and were using a 50 cal gun....not hand-held harpoons....

Don't ya love "sport" fishing :biggrin:
Quote: Originally posted by Floatflyer  
Sorry to report that the Makah Indian Tribe of the NW corner of Washington has petitioned to be allowed to take(KILL) 2=3 grey whales for the next 10yrs. Looks like the NOAA is supporting this.

LancairDriver - 12-5-2019 at 10:37 AM

Quote: Originally posted by motoged  
A few years ago they had a permit and were using a 50 cal gun....not hand-held harpoons....

Don't ya love "sport" fishing :biggrin:


Quote: Originally posted by Floatflyer  
Sorry to report that the Makah Indian Tribe of the NW corner of Washington has petitioned to be allowed to take(KILL) 2=3 grey whales for the next 10yrs. Looks like the NOAA is supporting this.


And I understand they were towed out in their traditional canoes with their 50 cal by powerboat. Yes, gotta love their “following old traditions”.

LancairDriver - 12-5-2019 at 10:52 AM

There has been movement in the Northwest by Fish and Game in developing ways of modifying Crab gear to prevent entangling Whales in the buoy ropes which has been part of the problem in killing whales. Presently a crab fisherman calls and reports an entangled whale and there is supposed to be a team ready to go help, which of course has had limited success. Developing an effective way to accomplish this is a huge challenge.