BajaNomad

Requirements when traveling back/forth often

loretojohn - 8-16-2019 at 01:30 PM

We own a property in Loreto. We plan to drive there from the US in mid-October 2019 and drive back in April 2020. We plan to travel back to the states about every two months by air. How should we handle the Mexico tourist card, etc? Also, we need to take items with us for the extended stay. We are looking at the best way to handle our situation. The vehicle with stay in Loreto for the 6-month time frame. By the way, both my wife and I have our global entry card.

Should we apply for temporary residency? What are the pitfalls and benefits? Your insights will be helpful.

John

MMc - 8-16-2019 at 01:45 PM

You need to have temporary residency to have any legal standing.

amigobaja - 8-16-2019 at 01:46 PM

benefit not having to stop and get a tourist visa and eventually a percent residence card.
non benefit the cost (which is low) and if you're schedule doesn't permit you to be there when its time to renew you have to start everything all over towards your permanent card. took me 12 years because at the time my work schedule.
Get the card way easier.

bajaguy - 8-16-2019 at 02:10 PM

Actually, not true. As long as you are in the country legally (FMM), you have legal standing

Quote: Originally posted by MMc  
You need to have temporary residency to have any legal standing.

larryC - 8-17-2019 at 08:59 AM

If you actually own property then you can get your permanent residency card. I don't know of any pitfalls.

David K - 8-17-2019 at 09:38 AM

A property owner, and thus now a part-time resident, is no longer a "tourist" (someone traveling on a vacation).

As I understand the new rules, it is like bajaguy said, with the tourist card, you do have rights and can even purchase a property.

However, it is now time to begin the process of getting the correct visa, as the others mention. Don't be living in Mexico on a tourist card, a temporary resident visa is the next step, yes? Maybe now you can go right to the permanent resident card? Thanks LarryC.

MMc - 8-17-2019 at 10:15 AM

If you are newey purchasing land maybe, if you are 3 plus years on a lease or feda. not so much.

"If you go to court over any property issue you will lose with a FMM.A tourist doesn't lease or own property", as per my mexican lawyer.

My point is, make sure you as legally covered if something hit the fan.


Quote: Originally posted by bajaguy  
Actually, not true. As long as you are in the country legally (FMM), you have legal standing

Quote: Originally posted by MMc  
You need to have temporary residency to have any legal standing.

Loretana - 8-17-2019 at 11:21 AM

The INM office in Loreto is user friendly and easy to deal with.
You may want to start the process now, as summer is the slow season and your documents will be expedited quicker.

You will, however, need to start your application for temporary or permanent resident status at the Mexican Consulate nearest to your residence in the US.

You will find this link most informative
www.mexperience.com Look under "Mexican Visas and Immigration"

[Edited on 8-17-2019 by Loretana]

BajaMama - 8-18-2019 at 04:54 PM

According to the Consulate web-site you can apply for a permanent resident Visa if you plan on living in Mexico longer than 4 years. You do not need a temporary one first. Make an appointment, submit 6 months copies of bank statements indicating adequate non-Mexican income and/or 12 months of statements indicating adequate investment. Have your original passport and a copy of it and all stamped pages. Give $36 along with your application and you are good to go. I am in bay area and will do this when the time comes.

Hook - 8-19-2019 at 12:07 AM

Well, I must say it is very refreshing to be able to discuss this topic without the usual vitriol that was always injected into this discussion by a certain ex-Nomad.

36.00 is for the application. The cost of the Permanent Resident Visa is a little over 5,000 pesos or about 270.00 US. This is what people use if they want to use the verified income method of qualifying for a Perm Res Visa. I believe you have to show an income outside of Mexico of around 2,700 or over 100,000 US in the bank. If you have a spouse or other dependent, add another 500.00US or so to the monthly qualifier.

If you go the route of four consecutive years of Temporary Resident Visa to then get a Permanent Visa, that's an additional 9300 pesos or about 490.00US.

So, about 770.00 US, over the course of four years for both visas.

You can also pay for each individual year of Temp Res Visa, instead of the four-year rate. That's a bit over 4,000 pesos per year. There are also two and three year rates.

You start to realize why some are just fine with simply getting the occasional tourist visa at around 550 pesos for six months. Especially if it is ONLY six months per year they are there. Especially if they are over, say, 65 and not sure how much longer they want to live in Mexico. To invest 770.00 per person might not be the wisest way to go.

Then there's the cost of paying someone to shepherd you through these processes if you aren't willing to do it yourself at the INM offices. That cost varies widely. Getting a tourist visa can be done by anyone.

Theoretically, having the Temp or the Perm will avoid having to pay for the tourist visa that is almost always included in the cost of an airline ticket when flying into Mexico. But there are many stories about not being able to avoid this charge and/or the difficulties of getting a refund for it. Maybe that's easier now?

BTW, even with a Temp or a Perm, YOU ARE SUPPOSED TO CHECK IN AND OUT OF AN INM OFFICE WHENEVER YOU CROSS THE BORDER BY LAND, SEA OR AIR. That's generally unavoidable by sea and air and relatively painless, if anything related to an airport or cruise dock can be called painless.

Many don't, however, when leaving or arriving by land, just like with the tourist visas. See, that can mean waiting in the same line as the tourist visa people, at times. Sometimes they will move you to the head of the line, sometimes they dont. The lines can be really bad in the three weeks before Xmas, as lots of Mexicans and Mexican-Americans living in the US, come down to visit and deliver gifts to relatives.

I also seem to recall that IF you end up getting a Perm Res card, there is a legal limit to the number of days you can be OUT of Mexico. Dont recall what it is and never heard of anyone being "busted" on this. Maybe they did away with this; others might know.

One other thing. If you are holders of Perm Res card, you will not be issued a permit to take your US plated car outside of Baja or northern Sonora. So, no ferry trips to Mazatlan or Topolobampo or driving down through the mainland. Temps and tourist visa holders can get those.



BajaMama - 8-19-2019 at 07:03 AM

Hook, that is fantastic information. Thank you! Seems like the FMM is the best way to go, as we will have a house but will only spend 1-3 months in the spring and fall.

David K - 8-19-2019 at 07:13 AM

Thank you Hook. Great!

RnR - 8-19-2019 at 07:43 AM

HOOK has it exactly right and the information is current.

Ditto on not being able to obtain a vehicle TIP to visit the mainland. Permanent residents are just that - permanent residents of Mexico. As such, permanent residents are supposed to drive vehicles registered in their Mexican State of Residence not registered in the US. Not applicable to Baja (still classified as "frontier states").

You will be denied a TIP at the La Paz ferry terminal if you are a PR with US plates on your vehicle. IE - you can not visit the mainland with your vehicle or pass through the mainland on your way to the eastern US or Canada.

[Edited on 8-19-2019 by RnR]

karenintx - 8-19-2019 at 10:19 AM


X2 what Hook said with one exception. When we picked-up our R/P in June 2013 I asked the INM agent..."how long can we be out of Mexico each year?" The INM agent's answer was "With a R/P there are no restrictions on the days you are out of Mexico, that was a FM2's restriction."

We know several Canadians that have their R/P and they are out of Mexico for at least six-months a year. According to one of our Canadian friends, he has never had an INM agent (at the SJD airport) say anything to him about being out of the country for six months when he is entering Mexico every year.

https://www.mexperience.com/time-limits-on-mexico-visitor-an...

We will return to CSL around mid-October. Since the SJD airport allows R/P & T/P's to go through the Mexican citizen line I will ask/confirm with the airport INM agent "what is the maximum days per year a R/P can be out of the country?"

Now that I am thinking about it, INM agents (at the SJD airport) have never ask us how long we have been out of the country nor does it ask that question on the INM form. However when we fill out the customs form, it does ask if you are a tourist how long will you be in Mexico or if you are a "residents" how long were you out of the country. When going through the airport everyone is required to go through INM then through custom...two different areas, two different forms.

Hook - 8-20-2019 at 09:01 PM

One other thing that should be mentioned that I noticed on the Mexperience site.

If you are planning on applying for Mexican citizenship after having a Res Perm Visa, you must have had that Visa for at least five years AND you cannot have been out of Mexico for more than 180 days in the last two years before applying for citizenship status.

This probably doesnt apply to the original poster (wherever he/she went), but it is good information.

People consider applying for citizenship as a way of taking possession of their land without a fideicomiso/bank trust. This was more popular in the recent past when the citizenship test was easier and there were test exemptions for persons over a certain age. But I believe those have been toughened up in the last couple years.

Also, many banks charge a LOT of money to dissolve a trust. For us, it simply wasnt worth considering. It was like 12-15 years worth of trust fees to end the trust, as I recall. In addition, a trust does provide inheritance rights on the land, without the need for a Mexican will.

loretojohn - 8-23-2019 at 11:28 AM

I am the person who asked the original question. The replies have been most helpful.

One additional question relates to our personal situation. We plan to drive to Loreto in mid-October. Then in November we need to fly back to Oregon until December 5 and then return to Loreto by air. In Feb. 2020 we need to fly back and forth again. In late April, we will drive the vehicle back to Oregon.

If we use an FMM what a happens when we fly back and forth? We plan on making the FFM valid from October for 180 days so that does not get us enough time. It appears the best solution is a temporary resident visa. We are not going there to work, just live and enjoy.

One last question regards auto insurance. The vehicle is registered in Oregon. It seems like I will need to purchase an annual policy. Any recommendations as to who to use?

Thank you to everyone who has responded.

John

SFandH - 8-23-2019 at 12:20 PM

You may be overthinking the issue. Just go with the flow. You may have to turn in your FMM when you board the plane to leave Mex. You'll get another on the flight back, talk to the airline rep for details. Buy car insurance here. It's all online.

https://www.bajabound.com/

Loretana - 8-23-2019 at 04:20 PM

It's true, loretojohn,
You will just cycle thru FMM visas as you enter and leave Mexico.

I had the same drive/fly scenario while we were building our Loreto home. It won't be problematic.

I also recommend Bajabound, I drive an Oregon plated Jeep in and out of Mexico. Expect to pay around $450.00 per year for a Chubb Platinum Policy. I also tow a small LoadRunner trailer, which is included in my policy.

And by the way, welcome to Baja Nomad and Loreto!!

SFandH - 8-23-2019 at 04:24 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Loretana  

I also recommend Bajabound, I drive an Oregon plated Jeep in and out of Mexico. Expect to pay around $450.00 per year for a Chubb Platinum Policy. I also tow a small LoadRunner trailer, which is included in my policy.

And by the way, welcome to Baja Nomad and Loreto!!


For comparison purposes, you can get a liability-only policy for around $150 a year from Bajabound.

Alm - 8-25-2019 at 12:34 PM

Property doesn't necessitate getting RT/RP status.

Neither it changes your tourist status, though technically you have done certain steps that tourists don't normally do - left a property and belongings there while leaving. Tourists are not supposed to do this. On a practical level, INM and customs don't care whether a tourist is keeping home and belongings, and US car, in Baja (or anything else, except for, TAD, boats and RV).

Hook is right, you still must get FMM every time even with RT/RP status, free of charge, for statistical purposes. It might also come handy if you leave by air.

"Some" consulates allow property to be included when calculating 100-something grand of minimum assets for RP, some don't. The process of applying is rather straightforward and has been well documented and explained in gringo web, most forms are available online at INM site, but it can still be daunting and time-consuming. To start the process, just go to closest Mex consulate, no facilitator is needed. Later, with local INM, some choose to hire a facilitator for leg work. With Mex inland govt offices a little patience will go long way, it is not as smooth as it should be, though doable on your own as well.
But you don't really "need" RT/RP, in your scenario.

One useful thing about RT/RP is eligibility for Mex national health coverage Seguro Popular, though it is more useful for those living all-year round (the OP is not), and for nationals of countries other than US (too far from home country and too expensive to be treated in the US) - and the OP is not one of them either.

"Taking items for extended stay" can be tricky. You are only given one chance to bring a lot of stuff tax-free, when moving in with Rt/RP status, and you must have a proper customs form, I think the form itself costs a little. After that, even with RT/RP, you are treated by customs the same as any tourist, $300 tax free per person (or whatever is their current limit), there is a lot of discretion on their part in what you can bring additionally tax-free and what not. So you will pay some tax from time to time. Just relax and let it be.

[Edited on 8-25-2019 by Alm]

Thank you for all replies

loretojohn - 9-16-2019 at 11:18 AM

Again, I have learned so much reading the wisdom of the experienced Baja residents and travelers.

So, we will get an FFM each time we travel. We own a house in Loreto Bay and plan to travel back and forth every two months. We will drive down in October and back in late April. Like one other person who responded, we live in Oregon.

Maybe this question should be asked in a new post but driving to Loreto where are the good places to stay and to avoid?

Again, thank you for sharing your knowledge.

John

unbob - 10-4-2019 at 08:51 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Hook  

You start to realize why some are just fine with simply getting the occasional tourist visa at around 550 pesos for six months. Especially if it is ONLY six months per year they are there. Especially if they are over, say, 65 and not sure how much longer they want to live in Mexico. To invest 770.00 per person might not be the wisest way to go.

Then there's the cost of paying someone to shepherd you through these processes if you aren't willing to do it yourself at the INM offices. That cost varies widely. Getting a tourist visa can be done by anyone.
Re the cost of obtaining perm res card - the fact that I'm over 65 is the primary reason I obtained the perm res card last year. I figure at some point I'll be staying somewhere in Mexico permanently and plan to spend my last days there - so having the perm resident card will be a necessity eventually. I spent about $450 usd to get the card including $150 usd to hire a Mexican "facilitator" to make it happen. It was an easy and simple process and I have no regrets. I never had a temp res card.

unbob - 10-4-2019 at 08:56 AM

Quote: Originally posted by larryC  
If you actually own property then you can get your permanent residency card. I don't know of any pitfalls.
I have perm res card and never owned property in Mexico.

David K - 10-4-2019 at 09:13 AM

Quote: Originally posted by loretojohn  
Again, I have learned so much reading the wisdom of the experienced Baja residents and travelers.
...

Maybe this question should be asked in a new post but driving to Loreto where are the good places to stay and to avoid?

Again, thank you for sharing your knowledge.

John


My picks are:
1) Baja Cactus Motel if on Hwy. 1, El Rosario (next to the gas station), 225 miles south of the border, 5-6 hours.
2) Hotel La Huerta, just past the mission in San Ignacio, 500 miles from the border.

If using Hwy. 5 to go south, Hotel Sky Blue, Km. 182, north of San Felipe, 115 miles south of the border.

BajaParrothead - 10-4-2019 at 09:19 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Hook  


Also, many banks charge a LOT of money to dissolve a trust. For us, it simply wasnt worth considering. It was like 12-15 years worth of trust fees to end the trust, as I recall. In addition, a trust does provide inheritance rights on the land, without the need for a Mexican will.


I paid $1800 US to dissolve the fideicomiso on property we purchased last year.

surabi - 10-4-2019 at 07:05 PM

Quote: Originally posted by loretojohn  
Again, I have learned so much reading the wisdom of the experienced Baja residents and travelers.

So, we will get an FFM each time we travel. We own a house in Loreto Bay and plan to travel back and forth every two months. We will drive down in October and back in late April. Like one other person who responded, we live in Oregon.

Maybe this question should be asked in a new post but driving to Loreto where are the good places to stay and to avoid?

Again, thank you for sharing your knowledge.

John


Don't use the term FMM as a synonym for a tourist visa- that is incorrect. (I know a lot of people on this forum use the term that way, but it's wrong)
An FMM is a Mexican migratory document which ALL non-citizens have to fill out when flying back and forth. Temporary and permanent residents have to fill them out as well. The difference is that the bottom half of the form is retained by tourists and serves as your tourist visa and has an expiry date when you have to leave the country. Residents hand the top half of the card in to immigration when they fly in, and the smaller bottom half is stamped by immigration and handed in at the airline desk when you check in for your flight out of Mexico.

David K - 10-4-2019 at 07:18 PM

Surabi, I think most of us on Nomad travel by land. The flying FMM is different as I also have flown in and bought one of those, too.
Indeed the term "tourist visa" is incorrect as it is not a visa but so similar to a visa, you can hardly blame anyone for using the term. It is (or was) officially a "tourist card" or tourist permit, since it never was a 'card' but a paper.

Alm - 10-5-2019 at 10:24 AM

Flying in and out is very common for Mexico mainland expats and part-time expats, regardless of their status. Less common for Baja, though people living in La Paz / Cabo area often choose to fly.

Loreto is in between, those living farther than Ca still use LTO airport often, exceptions are people with many dogs or those who just like to be on the road for days.

I would think twice before moving to spend my last days in Mexico with RP. If anything happens, in Baja you're in the middle of nowhere except for Tij-Rosarito corridor, the fun of being in that location is questionable - and still too far for emergency. On the mainland, unless you're prepared to pay big money for private hospital (think dozens thousand dollars), you have to live in urban hubs like Guadalajara or CDMX where air quality sucks.

surabi - 10-7-2019 at 01:39 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Surabi, I think most of us on Nomad travel by land. The flying FMM is different as I also have flown in and bought one of those, too.
Indeed the term "tourist visa" is incorrect as it is not a visa but so similar to a visa, you can hardly blame anyone for using the term. It is (or was) officially a "tourist card" or tourist permit, since it never was a 'card' but a paper.


I have driven and flown, both many times. There was never a difference in the actual form itself.

AKgringo - 10-7-2019 at 03:59 PM

I am pretty sure that the second M of the FMM stands for 'multiple(use)'

PaulW - 10-7-2019 at 04:06 PM

John, If you decide to leave a rig at each end on your plane ride be sure it has very low value because it will soon deteriorate. Keep a reliable nice rig at your home in each place and find a good mechanic at each end to get the airport car functional enough to get you home.
A quick trip to any airport you will find these clunkers stored. Never will you see a nice one unless it is for a very short plane trip.
IMO, the best solution is to use a taxi to get from the airport to your home at each end. If the airport is to far for a taxi find a friend to drive you.

surabi - 10-7-2019 at 09:04 PM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
I am pretty sure that the second M of the FMM stands for 'multiple(use)'


Forma Migratoria Multiplé´

Not a "tourist card", which is just one of the uses for it. Used by Mexico for statistical purposes to keep track of entries and exits of foreigners, whether tourists or residents. Residents are required to fill one out when flying, they don't seem to require it when driving, although many residents do hand them in when driving.

[Edited on 10-8-2019 by surabi]

[Edited on 10-8-2019 by surabi]

Alm - 10-7-2019 at 10:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
I am pretty sure that the second M of the FMM stands for 'multiple(use)'

I think "multiple" means various purposes, not multiple use. Makes sense if you consider that this is a mandatory document for all kind of US/CAN visitors regardless of their purpose. Used to be a single-entry - even after they changed the form name from FMT to FMM, but now it is apparently multiple-entry, or so INM says. Messy...

surabi - 10-7-2019 at 11:51 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Alm  
Quote: Originally posted by AKgringo  
I am pretty sure that the second M of the FMM stands for 'multiple(use)'

I think "multiple" means various purposes, not multiple use. Makes sense if you consider that this is a mandatory document for all kind of US/CAN visitors regardless of their purpose. Used to be a single-entry - even after they changed the form name from FMT to FMM, but now it is apparently multiple-entry, or so INM says. Messy...


Yes, various purposes. I've never heard of the same piece of paper being used for multiple entries in and out of the country- a new one has to be filled out each time. You hand one part to INM when you fly in, and the other part to the airline when you fly out. Same if you drive. But I haven't been a tourist for a long time, maybe there's some special one for tourists that they can come in and out on until it expires, but I've certainly never heard of that. The info I've always known to be true is that once a tourist leaves the country, legally his stay is over and he has to hand in the tourist card and get another when he comes back.

David K - 10-8-2019 at 07:23 AM

The 180 day (land travel) FMM is valid for 180 days, once it is validated at the border, on your first trip with it.
It does NOT need to be returned.
It could be for one long trip or several short trips within the 180 days.

David K - 10-8-2019 at 03:36 PM

It is not me making the rules... I asked the INM personal at Tijuana, Tecate, and Mexicali, more than once... and that is the answer I have repeated got, going back to 2009.

Alm - 10-8-2019 at 04:42 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
It is not me making the rules... I asked the INM personal at Tijuana, Tecate, and Mexicali, more than once... and that is the answer I have repeated got, going back to 2009.

They are not making the rules either - they are "making it up" :). As a frequent tourist to Mexico you are probably aware that INM officers are neither quoting the law nor responsible for whatever they say.

Here is another law-related gossip, from Discover Baja: "the INM has recently said that FMM tourist permits can be used for multiple entries in and out of Mexico, through the end date of the permit". Until we see this officially published by Mex govt, this is but a gossip.
But then, they got some other marvels there, ex. "Your temporary resident or permanent resident card already functions as your permit to be in Mexico. You do not need to obtain an FMM tourist permit on top of this" - a dangerously misleading statement. You do need to obtain FMM if you are RT/RP, even though it doesn't serve as a "permit" for a holder of RT/RP.

Just goes to show that the law and what people are saying about the law are 2 different things.

[Edited on 10-8-2019 by Alm]

surabi - 10-8-2019 at 07:21 PM

Living on the mainland and having driven across the border in Nogales several times, as well as having driven across the border in Baja a few times, I have found that the INM border officials in Baja are not fully conversant with immigration law, which is federal. So yes, they are "making it up".
Nor are the Baja customs officials informed. Years ago, when I became a permanent resident and had to get my Japanese made, Canadian plated car out of Mexico, I took the ferry to Baja, visited family in Todos Santos, then drove up to the border. Once I found the customs office in Tecate, which wasn't easy, I asked that they scrape off my sticker and give me the documentation that I had removed the vehicle, as I could no longer use it in Mexico due to being a permanent resident. The customs guy asked me where I'd heard such a thing. I tapped the badge on his chest and said "From your jefes in Mexico City". He hadn't heard anything about the new regulations.


[Edited on 10-9-2019 by surabi]

[Edited on 10-9-2019 by surabi]

John Harper - 10-10-2019 at 04:56 PM

Quote: Originally posted by goldie12  
Surabi wrote," he customs guy asked me where I'd heard such a thing. I tapped the badge on his chest and said "From your jefes in Mexico City". He hadn't heard anything about the new regulations."
______________

I hope this is a BS story, because only an idiot American, would poke his big fat finger, on a Mexican official's chest, and tell him he is WRONG!

Who does that?


It reads to me like it was just a friendly tap, like having a laugh with the guy about the rules. Did not read as aggressive or obstinate to me. Maybe you're looking for something that isn't there?

John

PaulW - 10-10-2019 at 08:23 PM

Alm, The two statements you quoted were exactly what the head if INM told us at a meeting in San Felipe.
Fmm is good per date on the paper and good for multiple entries.
The PR TR allows freedom to cross the border without an FMM. The INM person at the border does not even read the card. All I do is flash it.
Not gossip. Not misinformation. Been crossing with no issue for several years with my PR card.
Your misinformation is harmful to many reading on Nomads.

mtgoat666 - 10-10-2019 at 09:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Living on the mainland and having driven across the border in Nogales several times, as well as having driven across the border in Baja a few times, I have found that the INM border officials in Baja are not fully conversant with immigration law, which is federal. So yes, they are "making it up".
Nor are the Baja customs officials informed. City".


I think you are full of chit.
The Mexican customs people at TJ and Otay know their chit. You mistake your infrequent interaction with low-level agents at the border as infusing you with “knowledge” of the border — you say you crossed Nogales or Baja border “a few times,” and now you (and other nomads) are experts. The amount of trade between socal and TJ is immense. The TJ/SY border xing is one of the busiest in the world. The DF guys AND local guys got a system, they know their laws, they got objectives/plan, and are probably doing OK at meeting objectives/plan — and they are making the border work for them — not for you. Your myopic misperceptions are based on occasional jaunts across the border to get cheap dental work.
The anecdotes of a few car-camping tourists or gringo pensioners getting or not getting FMMs are meaningless. Your occasional small-scale tourism visits pale in comparison to the daily cross border trade and regular commuting across border (workers, business people, students, shoppers).



surabi - 10-10-2019 at 10:34 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Living on the mainland and having driven across the border in Nogales several times, as well as having driven across the border in Baja a few times, I have found that the INM border officials in Baja are not fully conversant with immigration law, which is federal. So yes, they are "making it up".
Nor are the Baja customs officials informed. City".


I think you are full of chit.
The Mexican customs people at TJ and Otay know their chit. You mistake your infrequent interaction with low-level agents at the border as infusing you with “knowledge” of the border — you say you crossed Nogales or Baja border “a few times,” and now you (and other nomads) are experts. The amount of trade between socal and TJ is immense. The TJ/SY border xing is one of the busiest in the world. The DF guys AND local guys got a system, they know their laws, they got objectives/plan, and are probably doing OK at meeting objectives/plan — and they are making the border work for them — not for you. Your myopic misperceptions are based on occasional jaunts across the border to get cheap dental work.
The anecdotes of a few car-camping tourists or gringo pensioners getting or not getting FMMs are meaningless. Your occasional small-scale tourism visits pale in comparison to the daily cross border trade and regular commuting across border (workers, business people, students, shoppers).





Presumptuous much? I've been living on the mainland for 20 years, I'm not a tourist who comes to get my teeth fixed on the cheap, nor a pensioner. I run a business and pay taxes in Mexico, drive a Mexican-plated car and speak Spanish. And am a lot more informed about INM and customs regulations than you, apparently.
And your reading comprehension skills are sadly lacking. I clearly said I was a permanent resident. And my "occasional jaunts" across the border were from Mexico, where I live, to Canada for short visits, not from the US into Mexico for a short visit.
Idjit.

[Edited on 10-11-2019 by surabi]

paranewbi - 10-11-2019 at 03:36 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Living on the mainland and having driven across the border in Nogales several times, as well as having driven across the border in Baja a few times, I have found that the INM border officials in Baja are not fully conversant with immigration law, which is federal. So yes, they are "making it up".
Nor are the Baja customs officials informed. City".


I think you are full of chit.
The Mexican customs people at TJ and Otay know their chit. You mistake your infrequent interaction with low-level agents at the border as infusing you with “knowledge” of the border — you say you crossed Nogales or Baja border “a few times,” and now you (and other nomads) are experts. The amount of trade between socal and TJ is immense. The TJ/SY border xing is one of the busiest in the world. The DF guys AND local guys got a system, they know their laws, they got objectives/plan, and are probably doing OK at meeting objectives/plan — and they are making the border work for them — not for you. Your myopic misperceptions are based on occasional jaunts across the border to get cheap dental work.
The anecdotes of a few car-camping tourists or gringo pensioners getting or not getting FMMs are meaningless. Your occasional small-scale tourism visits pale in comparison to the daily cross border trade and regular commuting across border (workers, business people, students, shoppers).





Presumptuous much? I've been living on the mainland for 20 years, I'm not a tourist who comes to get my teeth fixed on the cheap, nor a pensioner. I run a business and pay taxes in Mexico, drive a Mexican-plated car and speak Spanish. And am a lot more informed about INM and customs regulations than you, apparently.
And your reading comprehension skills are sadly lacking. I clearly said I was a permanent resident. And my "occasional jaunts" across the border were from Mexico, where I live, to Canada for short visits, not from the US into Mexico for a short visit.
Idjit.

[Edited on 10-11-2019 by surabi]


Don't bother surabi...the goatman doesn't observe what it is before he chews on it...that's just what goats do.