BajaNomad - Covid-19 deaths in USA fall to the lowest levels since March

The important numbers are new hospitalizations and deaths.

[Edited on 6-22-2020 by JZ]

I agree with that. Both numbers have nothing to do with the amount of testing. And I think new hospitalizations for COVID is the most telling number. It shows the number of people getting severely sick.

A decrease in the deaths could be due to better treatment and younger patients, in addition to a decrease in infections.

[Edited on 6-22-2020 by SFandH]

SFandH - 6-22-2020 at 01:33 PM

California Hits New High In COVID-19 Hospitalizations

June 22, 2020 2:38 PM ET

"California has reached a new high in the number of hospitalizations related to COVID-19, surpassing the previous peak in late April."

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/0...

Not good news.

[Edited on 6-22-2020 by SFandH]

bajatrailrider - 6-22-2020 at 04:05 PM

Quote: Originally posted by bajatrailrider

Fake news

Alm - 6-22-2020 at 05:39 PM

The number of hospitalizations (and cases in ICU) is more important than deaths or daily cases. But I don't see any graph for hospitalizations, only tables.

Here in Canada in 2 biggest provinces hospitalizations are holding steady and NOT declining in the last 2 weeks.

In Mexico it's bad and getting worse. All numbers keep rising - new cases, deaths, active cases.

Deaths show how deadly the virus is overall, regardless of the epidemic stage. Despite the increasing testing, deaths per infected have been higher than initially predicted 3-4%. Mexico: 12%, Canada: 8%, USA: 5.5%. A far cry from 0.5% deaths by seasonal flu.

JZ - 6-22-2020 at 06:09 PM

The number of hospitalizations (and cases in ICU) is more important than deaths or daily cases. But I don't see any graph for hospitalizations, only tables.

Here in Canada in 2 biggest provinces hospitalizations are holding steady and NOT declining in the last 2 weeks.

In Mexico it's bad and getting worse. All numbers keep rising - new cases, deaths, active cases.

Deaths show how deadly the virus is overall, regardless of the epidemic stage. Despite the increasing testing, deaths per infected have been higher than initially predicted 3-4%. Mexico: 12%, Canada: 8%, USA: 5.5%. A far cry from 0.5% deaths by seasonal flu.

If you legit think it is anywhere in the zip code of 5.5% in the US... you should never speak on this, or any topic, again.

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by JZ]

Tioloco - 6-22-2020 at 06:47 PM

If you legit think it is anywhere in the zip code of 5.5% in the US... you should never speak on this, or any topic, again.

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by JZ]

JZ is correct. Your numbers are ridiculous. Please stop spreading fear with false numbers.

motoged - 6-22-2020 at 06:48 PM

If you legit think it is anywhere in the zip code of 5.5% in the US... you should never speak on this, or any topic, again

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by JZ]

Slick,
Reading comprehension and cultural sensitivity are not your strengths...stick with your pics and drone vids.

Who TF are you to tell anyone when and about what they may speak.... keep that for your dog and family

https://www.cnn.com/2020/06/22/health/us-coronavirus-monday/index.html

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by motoged]

4x4abc - 6-22-2020 at 07:04 PM

on the contrary - Mexico is catching up to the US
highest daily death rate so far - 1,000+

Screen Shot 2020-06-22 at 8.01.49 PM.png - 24kB

Screen Shot 2020-06-22 at 8.01.49 PM.png - 24kB

4x4abc - 6-22-2020 at 07:07 PM

and by the way, even thought the rates are as low as Germany (and that means LOW), La Paz is experiencing a 2nd wave. Not pretty

la paz 2nd wave.png - 62kB

Tioloco - 6-22-2020 at 07:07 PM

Quote: Originally posted by motoged

If you legit think it is anywhere in the zip code of 5.5% in the US... you should never speak on this, or any topic, again

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by JZ]

Motoged,
Quoting a CNN article, which quotes a POS like Bill De Blasio who is a Marxist... is an even bigger joke. Sorry Ged, you are way off on this one. And your numbers are just plain wrong. I think you are a thoughtful person based on your posts. I disagree with many of your posts but this is ridiculous. Stick to known facts. The death rates arent anywhere near that number. Fact.

P.S. I for one am very happy for everyone that the numbers are much lower. I wish all people could be happy for any good news at this time.

JZ - 6-22-2020 at 07:08 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

on the contrary - Mexico is catching up to the US
highest daily death rate so far - 1,000+

Yeah, MX is getting hit really hard.

Doesn't have the hospital system to deal with it. As well as the inability to social distance. Really sad.

SFandH - 6-22-2020 at 07:14 PM

deaths per infected have been higher than initially predicted 3-4%. Mexico: 12%, Canada: 8%, USA: 5.5%. A far cry from 0.5% deaths by seasonal flu.

Numbers like these are suspect because nobody accurately knows the number of infected people and testing protocols differ from one country to the next.

Or am I missing something?

Where did you get this info?

SFandH - 6-22-2020 at 07:20 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Tioloco

P.S. I for one am very happy for everyone that the numbers are much lower. I wish all people could be happy for any good news at this time.

Not true, California just hit a record high in hospitalizations.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/0...

JZ - 6-22-2020 at 07:20 PM

There are whack-ado sites out there that put the US at 5%. Anyone who thinks about it with an unbiased mind knows it's about 500% lower.

JZ - 6-22-2020 at 07:23 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

and by the way, even thought the rates are as low as Germany (and that means LOW), La Paz is experiencing a 2nd wave. Not pretty

This is still the 1st wave. Second wave will be late fall/winter.

I had an hour long call with one of my friends in Germany last week. He's feeling much better about the German economy right now.

SFandH - 6-22-2020 at 07:28 PM

There are whack-ado sites out there that put the US at 5%. Anyone who thinks about it with an unbiased mind knows it's about 500% lower.

Will you guys stop making claims without back-up references, please. Am I just supposed to believe you?

Tioloco - 6-22-2020 at 07:31 PM

Quote: Originally posted by Tioloco

P.S. I for one am very happy for everyone that the numbers are much lower. I wish all people could be happy for any good news at this time.

Not true, California just hit a record high in hospitalizations.

https://www.npr.org/sections/coronavirus-live-updates/2020/0...

I am referencing the death rate being much lower than what Motoged had stated.

4x4abc - 6-22-2020 at 07:45 PM

it is interesting to see that some of you are still arguing the numbers - dead people and people that can't breathe are hard to hide
those numbers are pretty acccurate
and even if they are manipulated - they are always manipulated in one direction
so, even if 100 is actually 200 - the trend that we can read out of graphs can't be manipulated
This is middle school level guys!

JZ - 6-22-2020 at 07:55 PM

Quote: Originally posted by 4x4abc

it is interesting to see that some of you are still arguing the numbers - dead people and people that can't breathe are hard to hide
those numbers are pretty acccurate
and even if they are manipulated - they are always manipulated in one direction
so, even if 100 is actually 200 - the trend that we can read out of graphs can't be manipulated
This is middle school level guys!

The hospitalization and death toll is pretty close. Inflated a bit, but close. What isn't close is the number of infected.

College football players returned to campuses all over the nation two weeks ago for voluntary workouts. 23 players from the Clemson football team (100 kids) tested positive for Covid this week. Most other schools won't release the numbers.

It's the denominator that the crazies are manipulating.

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by JZ]

Bajazly - 6-22-2020 at 09:46 PM

... 23 players from the Clemson football team (100 kids) tested positive for Covid this week...

That is a fairly high infection rate in just under two weeks, and granted these kids are young and the odds are on their side, with high infection rates comes higher death rates in the general population, just delayed a while. What is the argument of infection rates are going back up so damn the torpedoes and lets open the E'fer up? Down here it's still cases up deaths up, we have seen no leveling off yet.

caj13 - 6-23-2020 at 06:24 AM

Despite opening things up everywhere and more cases.

Hey JZ, can you tell me where you found that graph? i tried looking in wikipedia, which is cited as the source for the data, but I have not found that graph there, and I can't seem to find the data on wikipedia to support this graph. so please, could you provide a link or source to that graph? thank you

BigBearRider - 6-23-2020 at 07:11 AM

If you google "us coronavirus cases" on your iphone, this graph is one of the early hits.

It is amazing that there are some people who think the virus is not a real concern. So many uneducated, poorly informed people out there. Fox, Hannity, Tucker, Ingraham, Alex Jones and their ilk have been a real success story in that sense. For these people, it is not real until it hits them or their family. Many of these same people are the ones who are against welfare, while being the biggest net recipients of government handouts (read "red states" being the biggest recipients of federal payments).

But, what should one expect? There are crazies out there claiming the earth is flat, that the moon landing was faked, that palm trees are somehow proof there is no climate change, and so on.

Shaking my head.

mtgoat666 - 6-23-2020 at 08:19 AM

Covid-19 deaths fall to the llowest levels since March

Despite opening things up everywhere and more cases.

You cant trust the numbers. Trump has admitted he has directed his admin to falsify the numbers

Trump now says he wasn't kidding when he told officials to slow down coronavirus testing, contradicting staff

"I don't kid, let me just tell you, let me make it clear," Trump told a reporter on Monday, when asked again if he was kidding when he said Saturday he instructed his administration to slow down coronavirus testing.

Trump’s original comment: "When you do testing to that extent, you're going to find more people; you're going to find more cases. So I said to my people, 'Slow the testing down please.' "

JZ - 6-23-2020 at 08:24 AM

Quote: Originally posted by BigBearRider

If you google "us coronavirus cases" on your iphone, this graph is one of the early hits.

It is amazing that there are some people who think the virus is not a real concern. So many uneducated, poorly informed people out there. Fox, Hannity, Tucker, Ingraham, Alex Jones and their ilk have been a real success story in that sense. For these people, it is not real until it hits them or their family. Many of these same people are the ones who are against welfare, while being the biggest net recipients of government handouts (read "red states" being the biggest recipients of federal payments).

But, what should one expect? There are crazies out there claiming the earth is flat, that the moon landing was faked, that palm trees are somehow proof there is no climate change, and so on.

Shaking my head.

Virus is real. It impacts a very small portion of the US population severely.

Shutting down the economy for an extended period of time is not a real solution to deal with it.

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by JZ]

JZ - 6-23-2020 at 08:30 AM

[

Hey JZ, can you tell me where you found that graph? i tried looking in wikipedia, which is cited as the source for the data, but I have not found that graph there, and I can't seem to find the data on wikipedia to support this graph. so please, could you provide a link or source to that graph? thank you

Goggle Covid-19 deaths by state.

SFandH - 6-23-2020 at 09:00 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666

Trump’s original comment: "When you do testing to that extent, you're going to find more people; you're going to find more cases. So I said to my people, 'Slow the testing down please.' "

During the congressional testimony that is happening now, the 4 men in charge of fighting the virus all said testing is increasing and Trump has not told any of them to slow it down.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FGDw6QThjdw

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by SFandH]

David K - 6-23-2020 at 09:25 AM

Thanks for correcting Goat's fake news post, but the PBS recording is not very good quality, hard to hear well.
If you can, maybe find the recording of the President saying these words instead of a PBS person repeating them? I heard him on the morning news, so I know what he said already.

SFandH - 6-23-2020 at 09:39 AM

Trump did say at the Tulsa rally he told "my people" to slow down testing. My point is he didn't tell the people in charge of testing to slow it down. Evidently and fortunately his people aren't in charge.

Goat's post is not fake news.

[Edited on 6-23-2020 by SFandH]

HIS People may soon be In Charge ..............

MrBillM - 6-23-2020 at 10:35 AM

Elsewhere.

My concern has (until recently) been that DT was a fairly good bet for reelection.

NOW, the concern is that his [political] demise may take the Senate with him.

While I'd be happy (well, OK, ecstatic) to see Moscow Mitch get the boot, my nightmare scenario is for the Dems to control BOTH houses under a President Biden.

Especially NOW, divided government is GOOD.

KurtG - 6-23-2020 at 10:49 AM

The view from Europe.

https://www.nytimes.com/2020/06/23/world/europe/coronavirus-...

Alm - 6-23-2020 at 11:38 AM

deaths per infected have been higher than initially predicted 3-4%. Mexico: 12%, Canada: 8%, USA: 5.5%. A far cry from 0.5% deaths by seasonal flu.

Worldometer, John Hopkins - anywhere. Divide the number of deaths by total cases. If total cases is a suspect number, then so is statistics for any other epidemic and we may just light a candle, sing Kumbaya and go around our business as usual.

Alm - 6-23-2020 at 11:45 AM

Quote: Originally posted by BigBearRider

For these people, it is not real until it hits them or their family. Many of these same people are the ones who are against welfare, while being the biggest net recipients of government handouts (read "red states" being the biggest recipients of federal payments).

But, what should one expect? There are crazies out there claiming the earth is flat...

Ah, yes, the famous poll of 2018

... 24% of Americans aged 25-34 believe that the Earth is flat.

mtgoat666 - 6-23-2020 at 12:59 PM

In managing disease spread, Usa is doing worst of all developed countries.
This is due to president’s dismissal of the seriousness of the disease. His low IQ base is significant portion of the populace, and many in his base claim the disease is fake, and they are not practicing basic public health hygeine.
What his base doesnt realize is that while trump makes light of the disease, he is also rigorously testing the people he comes in contact with, and preventing the sick from being near him. So trump is lying to his base. He tells them to not worry, but he is Privately very worried and making huge effort to avoid getting sick.

Bad leadership leads to bad results.

BajaNomad - 6-23-2020 at 01:00 PM

https://www.google.com/search?q=covid+deaths+usa

Goggle Covid-19 deaths by state.

BajaNomad - 6-23-2020 at 01:08 PM

Please remember this topic is only relevant to the Baja forum as it relates to people traveling to Baja... and is not a rant-fest location about USA politics, which is for the off-topic forum. Thank you for your kind consideration.

As far as "fake news"... just to be clear... Trump stated today he wasn't kidding about his remarks:

" I don’t kid."
https://www.whitehouse.gov/briefings-statements/remarks-pres...

Fauci stated today that nobody's told them to slow down testing:
https://youtu.be/uKtbQ6fewrA

It is what it is.

Stay on topic - or this will go to the off-topic forum. Thank you!

BajaNomad - 6-23-2020 at 01:54 PM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaNomad

https://www.google.com/search?q=covid+deaths+usa

Goggle Covid-19 deaths by state.

Here's another one you may want to bookmark - seems to be the data that the most credible news sources are referencing... and you can't get back here without bookmarking it... just sayin'..

https://gisanddata.maps.arcgis.com/apps/opsdashboard/index.html#/bda7594740fd40299423467b48e9ecf6

Cases Surge in Ca, Az, Tx, Fl

Alm - 6-24-2020 at 10:53 AM

https://www.wsj.com/articles/coronavirus-latest-news-06-24-2... - full article requires subscription but you'll find same info elsewhere in news.

30% week over week increase in Texas (my comment - hard to believe that this is because they are now testing more).

In Texas more than 50% of those infections were in people in the 20-49-year-old age range. The virus still appears to be most lethal among the elderly.

Cases in Florida were similarly concentrated among people between the ages of 25 and 54, accounting for 50% of all positive test cases.

Cases in Arizona have jumped nearly 50% from a week earlier, the largest increase by any state in the country. Nearly 48% of all positive cases were among people between the ages of 22-44.

The percentage of ICU beds in use throughout Arizona continue to hover in the mid 80% range for the last 7 days, up from the upper 60% and mid-70% range throughout March, April and May.

[Edited on 6-24-2020 by Alm]

SFandH - 6-24-2020 at 02:46 PM

"30% week over week increase in Texas (my comment - hard to believe that this is because they are now testing more)."

----------------------------------------------

at 30% per week, approximately 18 days for the number of cases to double.

[Edited on 6-24-2020 by SFandH]

Alm - 6-24-2020 at 05:02 PM

"30% week over week increase in Texas (my comment - hard to believe that this is because they are now testing more)."

----------------------------------------------

at 30% per week, approximately 18 days for the number of cases to double.

[Edited on 6-24-2020 by SFandH]

The surge might not last 18 days, so we might not see the double.

What looks more serious to me is the record numbers of hospitalizations in AZ and TX - don't remember about CA, there is no comprehensive source with graphs for this important marker. Number of deaths reflects how serious it was 2-3 weeks earlier, number of hospitalizations reflects more current situation.

Another report today noted increased positivity in these states, i.e. higher percentage of tests comes positive, so increased incidence of cases is not caused by increased testing alone.

SFandH - 6-25-2020 at 12:28 AM

I think you're right. Hospitalization and percent of tests that are positive are telling numbers, and graphs of them over time would show the all-important trend lines. As you said, deaths are a lagging indicator (by 2 - 3 weeks??). That's largely why there can be a lower death count with an increased infection count on any given day.

The map at the following link shows new cases in the US. You can zoom in using the plus/minus on the upper right. Moving your cursor over the map shows data by county including two-week trend lines. It's an interesting and well-done graphic that is updated daily.

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-us-c...

[Edited on 6-25-2020 by SFandH]

caj13 - 6-25-2020 at 05:56 AM

Back to the original post: anyone bother to check the latest version of JZ's graph?
Anyone care to explain away the 300% increase in deaths since JZ paraded out the lowest # of deaths!

and BTW - in my opinion, the number we need to be seeing is rarely shown. That is the % of tests that are coming back positive.

Over 5% - thats bad
under 5% - things trending in the right direction!

deaths - death rates - there is good news there - the medical system is getting better at dealing with severe cases - even though they are not giving sunshine enemas and bleach injections, and stopped killing their patients with Hydrocholorquin.

plus, younger patients - even if very sick, have a better chance of recovery.

But there is still a bottom line here, and everyone seems to ignore that, especially as they whistle past the graveyard:
2.43 million, and 124, 000. those 124000 people that died - and their families and loved ones - they don't think this is a hoax!

stay safe and do the others around you the respect of wearing a mask - show them you value their life, over your personal comfort

mtgoat666 - 6-25-2020 at 07:56 AM

Covid-19 cases are skyrocketing in California and Arizona and Texas,...
Things looking very bleak. Many more people expected to die.
Crazies are raging against public health measures, screaming nonsense about their constitutional rights to be Typhoid Marys. Wtf?
Meanwhile, sanity prevails in Europe, people are getting back to life, and observing public health measures like responsible public-minded citizens, and cases are declining.... proof that socialism works!

caj13 - 6-26-2020 at 06:37 AM

Hey JZ, sometimes those facts and figures, taken as a snap shot, come back to bite you in the butt eh? hows that graph treating your personal beliefs now?

and FWIW, health experts predicted a huge increase in infections 2-3 weeks after memorial day - uh - looks like they may be right - eh?

and one more thing - these same prognosticators predicted a big jump in deaths 5-6 weeks after memorial day. Time will tell, but sometimes, whether you like it or not - science gets it right, and if that contradicts your personal beliefs - thats too damned bad!

so all of you non mask wearing people, time to get back onto your huffing Lysol , mainlining Clorox, and getting sunshine blown up your butt hole!

us science nerds, we will continue to show our respect for everyone else by wearing our masks! we will continue "ingesting" new data, and alter our behaviors and beliefs as necessary to fit with those data driven medically backed suggestions and procedures !

mtgoat666 - 6-26-2020 at 06:45 AM

[Edited on 6-26-2020 by BajaNomad]

caj13 - 6-26-2020 at 07:17 AM

That data is 10 days old goat - get the current numbers - that will really open your eyes! Or at least make the Hoax crowds head explode!

mtgoat666 - 6-26-2020 at 07:44 AM

The facts!

https://www.nytimes.com/interactive/2020/us/coronavirus-us-c...

The disease is raging out of control. Federal leadership is absent, and incompetent. The White House is preventing public health actions to stop the disease, all because they want to make the disease response a political issue.... their politicking will lead to many thousands of additional deaths

Alm - 6-26-2020 at 10:29 AM

Hey JZ, sometimes those facts and figures, taken as a snap shot, come back to bite you in the butt eh? hows that graph treating your personal beliefs now?

I recall his firm belief was not that Covid-19 wasn't lethal, but that it would only kill "some old lady" while a 40-year old father of family could keep working and traveling as usual. Here is a news for a manlier half of the population - women tend to last longer than men under most any disease, including Covid-19. Old ladies are also very cautious when it comes to personal safety.

Graph in the post #1 is correct. Those not willing to subscribe to NYT may bookmark this link: https://www.worldometers.info/coronavirus/country/us/. Scroll down to graphs. Deaths were declining until approximately mid-June, then leveled up. Not dropping anymore. We shall see. Most cases (in this recent surge) are focused on 25-45 age segment, they die less, but they're spreading the disease to those who are more likely to die. Hospitalizations have surged, this is not good. There were studies earlier that many survivors had heart and lung complications afterwards.

[Edited on 6-26-2020 by Alm]

JZ - 6-26-2020 at 10:40 AM

Hey JZ, sometimes those facts and figures, taken as a snap shot, come back to bite you in the butt eh? hows that graph treating your personal beliefs now?

Why are you rooting for ppl to die?

The point of the post was to discuss good news of the death rate coming down. If you look at the graph, it always spikes back up from the low point. So nothing new there.

Of course there are more cases. More testing, huge protest crowds, rallies, things opening up. The number of cases going up is to be expected.

In sum, not sure what point you are trying to make other than being an burrohat.

BajaNomad - 6-26-2020 at 10:54 AM

Quote: Originally posted by BajaNomad

From above link... most recent info available from Johns Hopkins University of new daily cases charts. And remember, Mexico has said they chose to not implement testing widely... so their #'s are likely the most under-reported.

[Edited on 6-26-2020 by BajaNomad]

David K - 6-26-2020 at 10:57 AM

Doug, are there graphs adjusted to the population of these four regions? The population of Canada is hardly close to others but the graph scales are the same, at least visually.

Alm - 6-26-2020 at 11:01 AM

If you look at the graph, it always spikes back up from the low point. So nothing new there.

You are making conclusions about things you don't understand. There are lows and highs on the graphs but there are also averaging curves, trends. Right now the trend (of deaths) is neither up nor down. Other markers - new cases and hospitalizations - have surged.

BajaNomad - 6-26-2020 at 11:08 AM

Quote: Originally posted by David K

Doug, are there graphs adjusted to the population of these four regions? The population of Canada is hardly close to others but the graph scales are the same, at least visually.

Click on the image to see the #'s on the left.

BajaNomad - 6-26-2020 at 11:12 AM

While death rates are highly relevant, there are also other factors to contend with for some % of the survivors. Seems like it's not quite like overcoming typical influenza? Actual impact to be determined at a later date/decade/etc.

https://www.bbc.com/future/article/20200622-the-long-term-ef...

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/articles/2020-05-12/covid-19-...

Alm - 6-26-2020 at 11:27 AM

David, graph doesn't need to be population-adjusted to see whether numbers are rising or dropping.

Per capita cases in Canada are lower than in the USA.

JZ - 6-26-2020 at 11:42 AM

No one will ever take you seriously on anything again after you told us the death rate is 8% in Canada and 5.5% in the US.

Cases more than doubled where I am!

AKgringo - 6-26-2020 at 11:46 AM

In western Nevada County (CA) we have been largely spared from the virus. The count of confirmed cases stood at 12 for two months, but since June 16 the total has risen to 30!

In an interview with the management of the local hospital (aired on our local radio station) it was disclosed that the number of people requiring hospitalization is seven, with no deaths. An outbreak here could be bad, since this side of the county is a retirement community.

The eastern side of the county has a much smaller and younger population, but they have more active cases than the west. The entire county population is about 100k +/- .

Nevada County Corona dashboard; https://mynevadacounty.com/2924/Coronavirus

Don Pisto - 6-26-2020 at 11:47 AM

No one will ever take you seriously on anything again after you told us the death rate is 8% in Canada and 5.5% in the US.

I thought his tutorial on buying rice and beans in LAbay did that! :lol:

JZ - 6-26-2020 at 11:53 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Don Pisto

I thought his tutorial on buying rice and beans in LAbay did that! :lol:

Oh my, I forgot about that one. Incredible.

surabi - 6-26-2020 at 04:42 PM

9,000 new infections in Florida in the past 24 hours. A nation of idiots.

John Harper - 6-26-2020 at 05:20 PM

A nation of idiots.

Proud idiots.

John

caj13 - 6-26-2020 at 05:22 PM

Hey JZ, sometimes those facts and figures, taken as a snap shot, come back to bite you in the butt eh? hows that graph treating your personal beliefs now?

first of all whos rooting for deaths? other than people who refuse to wear masks and ignore recommendations and health officials policies - I don't know anyone behaving like that! Do you?

I believe it is you who don't give a damn about deaths of Americans unnecessarily, as long as it doesn't directly affect you, you just keep whistling past the graveyard.

the point I'm making is very simple, and you know exactly what that point is. You chose to pick one specific day and point to those data as "good news" unfortunately, as everyone here understands (well almost everyone) single data points are pretty useless, look at trends, best fit curves etc.

when you do that - your "good news " well not so much eh!

and back to deaths. how do you defend numerous actions and behaviors that have lead to very high numbers of death in the USA - both % and hard numbers, as compared to the countries that took this seriously at the beginning?

125,000. doesn't matter to you right, as long as its not you or your family and friends. How many is enough for you? is there a number that will make you say - huh - maybe there is something too this other than some political hoax!

JZ - 6-26-2020 at 05:44 PM

The graph shows the trend. Not sure what you don't understand. It shows the peaks and valleys.

Even at the peak of the last week it is the lowest since March. I never said anything about a specific day.

Then when it went up from the very lowest "day", as expected, you decided to say, "Gotcha. "

You aren't as crazy as rice and beans and rocks Alm. Keep it that way.

[Edited on 6-27-2020 by JZ]

caj13 - 6-27-2020 at 05:53 AM

The graph shows the trend. Not sure what you don't understand. It shows the peaks and valleys.

Even at the peak of the last week it is the lowest since March. I never said anything about a specific day.

Then when it went up from the very lowest "day", as expected, you decided to say, "Gotcha. "

You aren't has crazy as beans and rice Alm. Keep it that way.

[Edited on 6-27-2020 by JZ]

Yup , it shows a trend - and what exactly is that trend since the day you chose to point out" good news - lowest deaths".

Go ahead post your graph here so everyone can see that "good news" trend!

gnukid - 6-27-2020 at 06:58 AM

Read the recent CDC COVID19 update, which conflates all Pneumonia, Common Influenza Like Illness and COVID, says combined deaths from pneumonia, common influenza, and covid, are 124,325 provisional suspected deaths 2020 (post peak season, though zero from COVID officially) and perhaps 10x more infections than currently reported. CDC states in their Technical note linked below, in reference to data, "they should not be considered comparable with final data and are subject to change."

https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/excess_deaths.htm

Meaning: COVID cases and deaths in in the range of a normal year, being revised downward each report, but much less risk than normal flu, which has a higher death rate (revised this week).

Great News, COVID is lower risk than common flu according to CDC. See the report, we are lower, negative excess deaths year to year overall, overall, and unique deaths associated to COVID while provisionally caused concern of epidemic, actually upon revision is low, and actual confirmed is still zero. It was all a big mistake, gross errors and exaggerations caused modeling and prediction errors, Whoops! Faushied!

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/covidvi...

Today we are in range of a normal Flu season, and COVID19 is in range of a normal flu-like illness.

After revision of data historically, Pnuemonia is the vast majority of the flu-like illness death cases, generally associated to pre-existing conditions. When all other causes of death are ruled out, injury, and data parsed, comparing year to year, the end result very few unique cases can possibly remain to be assigned to COVID19, certainly, at most COVID19 associated deaths are well within normal range of flu like deaths, which are actually very few, and nothing out the ordinary.

CDC states, in the technical note below, "Deaths due to COVID-19 may be misclassified as pneumonia or influenza deaths in the absence of positive test results, and pneumonia or influenza may appear on death certificates as a comorbid condition."

See previous years of parsed data, after ruling out of the rcuases the final official number of deaths caused by flu, results in very few deaths. Often times in the hundreds in the USA, not thousands. See excess deaths reports and read the entire report including the Technical note. I'll post the specific report for 2004 to show only 500 deaths are specific to flu-like illness after ruling out other causes, after final review.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/tech_notes.htm

CDC states cases and deaths are in the range of %99.74 recovery rate at worst with no medicine nor planned response.
https://www.cdc.gov/nchs/nvss/vsrr/covid19/tech_notes.htm

CDC is clearly revising data weekly to note there is nothing outside of normal, and admitting gross errors in modeling and reporting.

Those who continue to fan the flame of pandemic, isolation, face masks, fear, promoting fantom morbidity, are pursuing an agenda which is fraudulent and extremely harmful.

https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/covidvi...

[Edited on 6-28-2020 by gnukid]

gnukid - 6-27-2020 at 07:12 AM

Most important take away is, data in often conflated for all respiratory illness. It's hard to find data separated and assigned to unique illness, such as COVID, it doesn't exist today. Data shows cases and deaths in the range of normal year to year.

Conflations, of assigned cause of death to COVID19, caused confusion, exaggerating appearance of a unique illness.

Revision shows COVID19 is less of a risk than common flu, as well as many other health risks.

No data supports isolation, restriction of mobility nor masks for general public.

Fear, ignorance, arrogance caused a great deal of harm, precipitating increased isolation of geriatrics, who suffered greatly from abandonment restricted from their loved ones and ignored health care professionals in nursing homes causing increased risk to them and subsequently increased deaths from pre-existing conditions.

All of the above is condemnation of incentivized failures in the health care system resulting in increased harm to mental, physical and financial health, apparently by systemic institutional failure to address individual needs and exploit a manufactured crisis for control and financial gain. Those who played leadership roles, broadcasting confusion, conflicting messaging and intentionally misleading as they have admitted, are guilty of fraud causing severe harm to health and increased deaths of seniors unnecessarily.

We have witnessed the greatest loss of productivity, increase in unemployment and wealth transfer in recent history. Increase in poverty is the leading cause of increased deaths, including suicides.

The data set revealed by CDC is an inditement of gross negligence with knowledge, which is a subject to civil penalties, fines and prison when harm causes death.

[Edited on 6-27-2020 by gnukid]

motoged - 6-27-2020 at 10:02 AM

Quote: Originally posted by John Harper

A nation of idiots.

Proud idiots.

John

And, as you know, the concept of pride is double-edged....
pride isn't always a good thing.

and..... some of my best friends are Americans....I have deleted the idiot ones over time. :coolup:

Ateo - 6-27-2020 at 10:32 AM

We love Freedom!!!!! Not wearing a mask is FREEDOM!!!!!

Do these Trumpers really believe THAT is freedom?

Sad...............

Gnostic Gnu Gnattering

MrBillM - 6-27-2020 at 01:52 PM

His logic is elementary.

Well suited to the simple-minded.

vandy - 6-27-2020 at 04:02 PM

US covid rates?
There is no US covid policy.
Only states.

John Harper - 6-27-2020 at 05:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by vandy

US covid rates?
There is no US covid policy.
Only states.

Dust off the Articles of Confederation?

John

BigBearRider - 6-27-2020 at 08:30 PM

https://www.yahoo.com/news/u-sees-record-breaking-45-1331006...

In Texas and Florida, two of the nation's largest states, governors are reversing course and tightening restrictions after coronavirus numbers jumped following their reopenings. Texas reported that more than 5,100 coronavirus patients are currently hospitalized – a record high for the 15th consecutive day.

Hospitals in the Texas Medical Center, located in Harris County in the heart of Houston, are now reporting intensive care units 100% full.

The county is reimposing stay-at-home orders.

"Our situation is far worse today than when we issued the first stay-home order in Harris County, and when the state issued their first stay-home order," said Harris County judge Lina Hidalgo. "This is unacceptable."

[Edited on 6-28-2020 by BigBearRider]

It's ALL a Hoax !

MrBillM - 6-27-2020 at 09:01 PM

Fake Data.

According to the Gnowledgeable Gnu:

" ........ Great News, COVID is lower risk than common flu ......... "

gnukid - 6-28-2020 at 07:32 AM

I shared CDC links which show an evolution from modeled exaggerations of extreme pandemic to revision showing normal flu ike illness year to year. It's entirely up to the individual to make u their own mind, I am not here to convince Karen that her fear of fantoms is irrational. It's a personal choice, though I do note, that there are the same posters here, who provide no substance, though constantly create rancor because apparently they have no point. That is not an attack as much as an observation.

Do you own research to consider Germ Theory of disease versus Terrain Theory or Exosome Theory, there is an evolution of epidemiology. https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5eSRK-_IYrY

gnukid - 6-28-2020 at 08:26 AM

It is illegal to force a mask on people in USA or Mexico, especially by force. Each person has personal health requirements and can be restricted or discriminated for their individual health requirements and disabilities.

John Harper - 6-28-2020 at 08:38 AM

Hopefully, he's as adamant about not wearing a seat belt, chain smoking, and riding a motorcycle without a helmet as he is a face mask.

It's all about MY freedom and to hell with YOUR rights!

John

Taking Gnu Seriously ..........

MrBillM - 6-28-2020 at 08:54 AM

Down the Rabbit hole ?

Seriously ?

gnukid - 6-28-2020 at 10:14 AM

Interesting that sharing the CDC data showing revision and evolution toward a normal flu like respiratory illness season provokes such disappointment and rancor with the morbid obsessed. I'll share the CDC COVID Viewer link again for review. Make up your own mind, though be aware this data is conflated Pneumonia, common Flu, and COVID19 SUSPECTED PROVISIONAL, that is revised each week, providing increased clarity. Zero excess deaths are attributed to COVID19 today officially according to CDC.
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/covid-data/covidvi...

gnukid - 6-28-2020 at 10:48 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lightfeet

Quote: Originally posted by gnukid

It is illegal to force a mask on people in USA or Mexico, especially by force. Each person has personal health requirements and can be restricted or discriminated for their individual health requirements and disabilities.

Probably true, but there are no laws that say stores and public places have to allow COVID-19 a-hole deniers in their stores without a mask.

If they have a health condition that requires them not to wear a mask, they must prove it with a doctor's note.

If this ever went to the courts, the courts would probably side with the mask wear crown, because health and safety overrules any personal freedom of not wearing a mask.

Gnukid, put your mask on!

I also look forward to the day that pig cops stop white a-hole Trumpsters, and demand they put on their masks for the safety of the community and when the Trumpsters refuse, the pig cops beat the hold chit out of them, because that's what pig cops do best.

[Edited on 6-28-2020 by lightfeet]

Absolutely, it's illegal to require or to ask someone to physically restrict their nose and mouth with a face mask or to ask them why their personal health requirements requires they do or don't wear a mask, covered in the ADA and HIPPA acts.

No Mask ?

MrBillM - 6-28-2020 at 11:23 AM

No Access.

Simple. And legal.

TMW - 6-28-2020 at 01:00 PM

A lot of places here are enforcing wearing a mask. As soonj a you walk in no mask you are asked to leave and if you don't want to leave several employees will help you. Story in the local paper about an ACE Hardware store where the lady owner confronts you when you come in, no mask no service.

Stickers - 6-28-2020 at 02:12 PM

The column written by Dr. Jeremy Samuel Faust, MS, an emergency medicine specialist affiliated with Brigham and Women’s Hospital in Massachusetts, states that flu deaths are estimated while COVID-19 deaths are confirmed cases.

He notes that during mid-April the “counted deaths” for COVID-19 in the United States were around 15,000 per week. During a typical “peak week” for the flu, the “counted deaths” are about 750.

Faust concludes that COVID-19 deaths are actually anywhere from 10 times to 44 times the number of influenza fatalities.

Other experts say there are also reasons beyond the raw statistics that indicate COVID-19 is more dangerous than influenza.

[Edited on 6-28-2020 by Stickers]

surabi - 6-28-2020 at 10:14 PM

"FDA approves a drug that reduces your chance of getting COVID-19 by 5X

Its trade name is Wearamaskbuttcrack. Side effects include mild inconvenience, being ostracized by anti-vaxxers, and the power to stop your own asymptomatic transmission as we dive into the next viral wave.

Check with your doctor (or really anyone) to see if Wearamaskbuttcrack is right for you.

*Shared from a reliable source: Everyone with a remedial understanding of how infectious diseases are transmitted. "

John Harper - 6-29-2020 at 05:24 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lencho

"FDA approves a drug that reduces your chance of getting COVID-19 by 5X

Wait a minute.

I'm all for masks (I care about others), but you're saying that wearing a (non-N95) mask reduces your chances of getting infected by 5x (80%)? I question that assertion.

It's satire, read the entire post.

EDIT: Oops, maybe the 5X part is correct, this from another post:

"An analysis of 172 studies across the world found that using a mask or respirator might reduce the risk of getting infected to 3.1%, compared to 17.4% without a face covering."

That's roughly 80% reduction.

Still, surabi's post was surely in jest.

John

[Edited on 6-29-2020 by John Harper]

caj13 - 6-29-2020 at 05:44 AM

Bahaaaa ! I knew it was coming to "Nomads" but my money was on paranewbi pulling out this Gem!

I suspect he's now a bit chaffed because Gnukid beat him to the punch!

Gnukid posts this nonsense making the rounds!

"Absolutely, it's illegal to require or to ask someone to physically restrict their nose and mouth with a face mask or to ask them why their personal health requirements requires they do or don't wear a mask, covered in the ADA and HIPPA acts"

This of course is complete - uh - Bovine Excrement, easily shown to be completely false if one uses that new fangled information finder - I think they call it the google?

Heres the history of this crap,
https://www.insider.com/anti-mask-protesters-cite-ada-disabi...

or look at snopes
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/valid-face-mask-exemption-...

Hijacking a law meant to protect individuals with real diabilities to allow you to continue to ignore the health and safety of others around you - how cute.

it's not your right to infect others with a deadly disease - what makes you think it's OK?

Now - heres the good news for you no mask Democratic Hoax, 125000 dead people dont matter crowd. it looks like you will soon be able to publicly state your opinions and ideals by refusing to get vaccinated for this disease.

All of us here can make our own choice !
if you fall into the:
" Those stupid lefty libs will line up to get vaccinated, but us "right" minded individuals, who can discern truth from no fact, or even counter to facts - we will make our point clear - no Vaccines for us special people!"

Guess what, i wholly support your decision to not get vaccinated. it's your chance to prove once and for all that you are right about this covid BS!

I hope the vaccine gets here soon- as i want to see who here really stands behind their words!

paranewbi - 6-29-2020 at 08:37 AM

Bahaaaa ! I knew it was coming to "Nomads" but my money was on paranewbi pulling out this Gem!

I suspect he's now a bit chaffed because Gnukid beat him to the punch!

Gnukid posts this nonsense making the rounds!

"Absolutely, it's illegal to require or to ask someone to physically restrict their nose and mouth with a face mask or to ask them why their personal health requirements requires they do or don't wear a mask, covered in the ADA and HIPPA acts"

This of course is complete - uh - Bovine Excrement, easily shown to be completely false if one uses that new fangled information finder - I think they call it the google?

Heres the history of this crap,
https://www.insider.com/anti-mask-protesters-cite-ada-disabi...

or look at snopes
https://www.snopes.com/fact-check/valid-face-mask-exemption-...

Hijacking a law meant to protect individuals with real diabilities to allow you to continue to ignore the health and safety of others around you - how cute.

it's not your right to infect others with a deadly disease - what makes you think it's OK?

Now - heres the good news for you no mask Democratic Hoax, 125000 dead people dont matter crowd. it looks like you will soon be able to publicly state your opinions and ideals by refusing to get vaccinated for this disease.

All of us here can make our own choice !

if you fall into the:
" Those stupid lefty libs will line up to get vaccinated, but us "right" minded individuals, who can discern truth from no fact, or even counter to facts - we will make our point clear - no Vaccines for us special people!"

Guess what, i wholly support your decision to not get vaccinated. it's your chance to prove once and for all that you are right about this covid BS!

I hope the vaccine gets here soon- as i want to see who here really stands behind their words!

Pulled my name out of a hat Caj? Just a little dig at me, I know. Not a snowflake, go at it.

I do wear my Immune Avoidance Device (mask) at all times when I'm around others in public...for them.
That way I can also pay for an Immunity Injection (shot) and support the pharmaceutical industry for taking the risk of investing in research.

Just the same way I do with my annual flu shot. Vaccines don't bother me at all. What does bother me:

World wide deaths from Covid are at 500,000 now
World wide deaths from abortion are at 21 million so far this year.
Not to worry Caj, you and I have avoided being one of those who had a 30% chance of being aborted (based on 66 million 'live births' so far this year).

[Edited on 6-29-2020 by paranewbi]

pacificobob - 6-29-2020 at 11:58 AM

should i assume you have adopted a number of children paranubie? generously donated to charities serving unwanted kids?

bajaric - 6-29-2020 at 12:25 PM

Obviously, the more testing that is done,
the more cases that will be documented.
actual deaths is another thing

I saw today that in NY deaths were only six in one day
down from 800 a day in the early stages.
What is going on here?
Did the virus sweep through and cull out the most vulnerable population, and then peter out? Or was social distancing to credit.
Or, does everyone already have it. been feeling like crap for months

surabi - 6-29-2020 at 08:09 PM

Quote: Originally posted by John Harper

Quote: Originally posted by lencho

"FDA approves a drug that reduces your chance of getting COVID-19 by 5X

Wait a minute.

I'm all for masks (I care about others), but you're saying that wearing a (non-N95) mask reduces your chances of getting infected by 5x (80%)? I question that assertion.

It's satire, read the entire post.

Of course it's satire. It's really sad that we should even have to come up with satire about this stuff. That people refuse to wear a mask, as if they're being forced to donate a kidney, is unbelievable. The number of videos online right now documenting Americans having total freak-out violent meltdowns about being asked to put on a mask to enter a store is shocking. Americans are the laughing stock of the world, while they continue to die from COVID at the highest rate on the planet.
There's no fixing stupid, and the US breeds a unique type of crazy.

surabi - 6-29-2020 at 08:14 PM

Quote: Originally posted by pacificobob

should i assume you have adopted a number of children paranubie? generously donated to charities serving unwanted kids?

As far as I'm concerned, the only people who have the right to an anti-abortion stance are those who have adopted unwanted children. Everyone else, i.e. the vast majority of anti-abortionists, are raving mad.

What's really rich is that those are the self-same people who are ranting against mask-wearing and distancing and self-isolation. Pro-life, what a joke.

John Harper - 6-30-2020 at 05:25 AM

Quote: Originally posted by John Harper

Quote: Originally posted by lencho

"FDA approves a drug that reduces your chance of getting COVID-19 by 5X

Wait a minute.

I'm all for masks (I care about others), but you're saying that wearing a (non-N95) mask reduces your chances of getting infected by 5x (80%)? I question that assertion.

It's satire, read the entire post.

When there is a complete and utter failure of leadership at the federal level, this is what you get. This is not how you fight a "war" that affects the entire country and the world at large.

John

paranewbi - 6-30-2020 at 05:55 AM

Quote: Originally posted by pacificobob

should i assume you have adopted a number of children paranubie? generously donated to charities serving unwanted kids?

Not to pat myself on the back... but two of you are bent towards opinions only being valid when evidence of fulfillment is made aware, here you go;

Worked in orphanages in Mexico

Paid a mother 'child support' for 3 years not to abort her child (no not my own for your sick minds... someone who came to me with indecision). She eventually married a great man who took her child under his wings.

Hired a mother to be into my company so she wouldn't abort. Child now a successful adult.

Donated personal and employee time and funds to birthing clinic in El Cajon, CA.

Supported (continuing) family in Guatemala ongoing 19 years sending two kids through college in addition to raise standard of living to enhance ability to ability to provide for generations to come (Kids are now adults and have children). About $3600 annually. App. $90,000 over history.

Support two(2) young mothers in Guatemala with monthly stipend and occasional medical costs as presented. average about $2500 annually.

Now... tell me how many abortions have you two paid for in support of your ethics of pro-abortion?
How many young mothers have you counseled to abort?
and by the way your taxes sent to PP are not voluntary and neither are mine.

You both miss the point of my post. There is such an outcry against a relatively minor percentage of deaths attributed to a contaigon juxtaposed against a great percentage of children aborted without a thought by you and those who shed tears over a virus.

Oh I forgot, it's just so "inconvenient" to raise those bothersome kids.

Go ahead and post your nonsense about me being a (insert your snide remark) now.

[Edited on 6-30-2020 by paranewbi]

pacificobob - 6-30-2020 at 06:29 AM