BajaNomad

The palm tree is going two feet under water

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Lee - 6-21-2023 at 08:04 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
SF&H,

I have no idea how old you are but, I’m old enough to have lived through and listened to “my betters” tell me that Communism was the “inevitable future” and the rest of us were just saving their parking place. However did that turn out?

I was also raised on the idea that if the US didn't allow the Russians and Chinese to have their way we’d all die in an awful nuclear war. Ever read a chit book called “On The Beach” I think it was also a chit movie. Both based on junk Science. The LA Times, a junk “news outlet” serialized “On The Beach” to scare the chit out of everyone back when it was written in the ‘50s.

Then there were the “Drop Drills” and air raid siren tests at 10:00AM on the 3rd or last Friday of the month. Guess when the bad guys would have attacked?

There were at 3-4 news flashes over the years that we had found all the oil in the world and that “the end was neigh” because there was no more oil.

Some of these “learned pronouncements” were from the same bunch who clung to the notion that continents couldn’t possibly move as they were way too big.

However did all of that and more turn out?

I could go on for hours in the same vain but you get the idea.

75+ years of that tends to bring out the skeptic in a person. It also makes you hold on to your wallet when yet another “the end of the world is coming because —————-. (Insert reason here)!


Interesting but boring. Scratching my head wondering who gives a chit. Just outed yourself. Skeptic and a tightwad.

surabi - 6-21-2023 at 08:22 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
SF&H,

I have no idea how old you are but, I’m old enough to have lived through...


75+ years of that tends to bring out the skeptic in a person. It also makes you hold on to your wallet when yet another “the end of the world is coming because —————-. (Insert reason here)!


Funny how so many of us lived through the same things, yet didn't turn out with attitudes like yours.

Don't try to rationalize your mind set on your age or the generation you grew up in. It has nothing to do with that.


RFClark - 6-21-2023 at 08:27 PM

S,

Most of the Technical and Engineering people I know have worse attitudes than mine. I find nothing wrong with requiring authority to show me the proof for what ever. science is not about belief. It’s about the best facts you can get. That said it’s ofter wrong!

surabi - 6-21-2023 at 08:59 PM

"Science is not about belief". Gee, thanks for mansplaining that. What a revelation. Make sure to let the majority of the world's top climate scientists in on that.

Obviously most of the Technical and Engineering people you know are simply those you chose to hang out with. Most of the Technical and Engineering people I know are liberals.

RFClark - 6-21-2023 at 09:30 PM


Lee,

The guy who designed the Tacoma Narrows bridge was an optimist as were the guys who did the protection and backup systems for the Japanese nuclear plant disaster.

S,

Being there Stoned isn’t the same as being there. Still no answers from you just snark!

[Edited on 6-22-2023 by RFClark]

[Edited on 6-22-2023 by RFClark]

surabi - 6-21-2023 at 10:19 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  


S,

Being there Stoned isn’t the same as being there. Still no answers from you just snark!


"Being there stoned" isn't snark? I can assure you, I was never stoned. Weed has never been my thing.

What answers? I'm not a climate scientist. Nor do I spend my time coming up with all kinds of reasons why initiatives to mitigate climate change are pointless. I do what I can in my own life not to contribute to what is ultimately bad for the planet and life on it, which is all most of us can do.

mtgoat666 - 6-22-2023 at 07:33 AM

Dogs will become more ‘hostile’ to humans as the planet heats up
https://www.euronews.com/green/2023/06/19/dogs-could-become-...







Don Pisto - 6-22-2023 at 10:31 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Dogs will become more ‘hostile’ to humans as the planet heats up
https://www.euronews.com/green/2023/06/19/dogs-could-become-...








swell more angry animals! Orcas, bears, crocs, seems they've all had it with us! here ya go more on dogs.....:P

https://www.yahoo.com/news/having-three-dogs-bad-environment...

JZ - 6-22-2023 at 11:37 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Don Pisto  


https://www.yahoo.com/news/having-three-dogs-bad-environment...


Oh ffs. Fast forward a few years and you know these loons will be trying to ban dogs to satisfy their Climate Crisis God. It never ends.

surabi - 6-22-2023 at 01:00 PM

Researching and documenting how much carbon footprint pets create is no different from you talking about how forest fires negate other reductions in CO.

Information does not equal plans to ban anything. Typical right wing scare mongering. "They're coming to take your guns!" "They're coming to take your gas stove!" "They're coming to take your gasoline-fueled vehicles!" "They're coming to take your pets!" "They're trying to turn your children gay!" "They're trying to eliminate white people!" "They're killing full term babies!"

[Edited on 6-22-2023 by surabi]

Cliffy - 6-22-2023 at 01:44 PM

Well THEY are!

Some just can see the forest for the trees

Lobsterman - 6-22-2023 at 01:45 PM


Information does not equal plans to ban anything. Typical right wing scare mongering. "They're coming to take your guns!" "They're coming to take your gas stove!" "They're coming to take your gasoline-fueled vehicles!" "They're coming to take your pets!" "They're trying to turn your children gay!" "They're trying to eliminate white people!" "They're killing full term babies!"

[Edited on 6-22-2023 by surabi][/rquote]


S,
That's a pretty good summation of your and the left's intensions if those GOP, Trump-loving conservatives would just get out of our way. Thanks for the clarification.

surabi - 6-22-2023 at 02:32 PM

Nice confirmation that Cliffy and Lobsterman and RrFClark are gullible conspiracy theorists subscribing to baseless fears concocted by social media manipulators and idiots.

[Edited on 6-23-2023 by surabi]

JZ - 6-22-2023 at 03:42 PM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Nice confirmation that Cliffy and Lobsterman are gullible conspiracy theorists subscribing to baseless fears concocted by social media manipulators and idiots.


Conspiracy theorists? That's exactly what your kind labeled people who were suggesting Covid came from a lab leak. How is that looking now?

This is South Park from 8 years ago.

surabi - 6-22-2023 at 05:04 PM

"That's exactly what your kind labeled people who were suggesting Covid came from a lab leak."

None of "my kind" labelled people conspiracy theorists who "suggested" Covid came from a lab leak. No one knew where it came from, and lab leak was always one of the possibilities. Always seemed highly plausible to me, considering it seemed to originate in a city where there are multiple biological labs.

The people who got labelled conspiracy theorists are the ones who "know for sure", without any proof or any training in science, who wouldn't have the first clue about how to scientifically investigate anything. Complete with more conspiracy theories regarding it purposely being let loose, how it's covered-up, how Fauci created Covid to control people, etc. ad nauseum.

There's a vast difference between there being a lot of theories that need to be investigated, and claiming that something is undeniably true simply because it's what you happen to believe. You obviously haven't learned that yet. "Suggesting" that something could be possible has nothing to do with falling for, or starting, conspiracy theories.

[Edited on 6-23-2023 by surabi]

[Edited on 6-23-2023 by surabi]

[Edited on 6-23-2023 by surabi]

RFClark - 6-22-2023 at 08:08 PM

S,

So what is it called when a not-man person mansplains? Gullible? You’re the one who believes SwiftBoat.

You still won’t acknowledge that the difference between our positions on climate change is what you are pushing won’t solve the problem because it fails to address the source of the problem.

China out pollutes the next 6 countries on the top 10 list!

mtgoat666 - 6-22-2023 at 08:20 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
S,

So what is it called when a not-man person mansplains? Gullible? You’re the one who believes SwiftBoat.

You still won’t acknowledge that the difference between our positions on climate change is what you are pushing won’t solve the problem because it fails to address the source of the problem.

China out pollutes the next 6 countries on the top 10 list!


Why you calling him swiftboat? Kerry volunteered and served in combat - 3 Purple Hearts, bronze star, silver star. Your party (cult) leader Trump faked bone spurs to avoid draft. You chicken hawks and desk-jockey veterans are nothing compared to Kerry.

[Edited on 6-23-2023 by mtgoat666]

surabi - 6-22-2023 at 08:37 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
You’re the one who believes SwiftBoat.


China out pollutes the next 6 countries on the top 10 list!


First of all, using deragatory nicknames for people makes you look like you have nothing to say. It's what bullies and jerks do to discredit those they don't agree with, because they have no actual cogent arguments. It's incredibly childish.

Secondly, I have never read or listened to anything from John Kerry, so it would be rather impossible for me to "believe" him.

Thirdly, you still don't get it that every little bit helps when it comes to solving problems. You keep using heavy polluters to justify the pointlessness of anyone else doing anything to mitigate climate change.
If your neighbors burn plastic garbage in their yard, do you think, "Oh well, I might as well burn my plastic garbage, too, it'll save me a trip to the dump."?


RFClark - 6-22-2023 at 08:59 PM


S,

Respect is earned not deeded. Names, Oh, you mean like goat and others here do. No, I think my carbon footprint is probably lower then yours especially if you are hooked up to CFE. We also recycle most of our water and drive on solar power.

You can shuffle around the deckchairs to your hearts content. It won’t save the ship cause it’s not enough.

Note, I’m not saying stop, I’m saying grow a pair and make the other guys do it too! We both know that’s not going to happen.



RFClark - 6-22-2023 at 09:14 PM

Goat,

I’m just a “grasshopper” and I have but a single bottle of ketchup to my name. That said I do know some real heros! My cousin who died near Bastogne in January 1945 as well as the people I grew up with who fought across the pacific in WW2. Or my other cousin who fought in Korea. They are the real heros

surabi - 6-22-2023 at 09:24 PM

China is the major polluter because of all the crap they manufacture that people all over the world buy. The way you get them to stop polluting is to stop buying the stuff they produce. That that doesn't happen is because no one wants to give up buying cheap stuff or think they need so much.

I have a pretty small carbon footprint. I'm not a big consumer, I am on CFE, but use little electricity (no AC, no pool, no pressure pump- my bills are about 160 pesos for 2 months, that gives you an idea how much electric I use). All my grey water runs through pipes to various areas of the garden. I do what I can.

SFandH - 6-23-2023 at 12:38 AM

From Bard AI:

Here are the top 5 countries for carbon dioxide emissions in 2021, according to the World Bank:

Rank Country
Share of world emissions (%)
CO2 emissions per capita (metric tons)

1 China
29.18%
7.3

2 United States
14.02%
15.5

3 India
7.09%
1.9

4 Russia
4.65%
11.4

5 Japan
3.13%
9.7

These five countries account for more than half of the world's total emissions.

Overall, the per capita carbon dioxide emissions indicate which countries have the most significant impact on climate change. These countries need to take urgent action to reduce their emissions if we are to avoid the worst effects of climate change.

==============================

SFandH - 6-23-2023 at 12:45 AM

More from Bard AI:


Internal combustion engines are responsible for about 14% of global carbon dioxide emissions. This is the second-largest source of CO2 emissions after electricity and heat generation, which accounts for about 25% of emissions.

Here is a breakdown of the percentage of global CO2 emissions from different sources in 2022:

Electricity and heat generation: 25%
Transport: 24%
Industry: 21%
Agriculture, forestry, and other land use: 14%
Other: 6%

It is important to note that these percentages are estimates, and the actual amount of CO2 emitted by each sector may vary depending on the source of data.

Airplanes are responsible for about 2.5% of global carbon dioxide emissions. This is a relatively small percentage, but it is growing rapidly. In 2005, airplanes accounted for only 1.9% of global CO2 emissions.

The main reason for the growth in aviation emissions is the increasing number of people flying. In 2005, there were about 2.2 billion air passengers worldwide. By 2020, this number had grown to 4.5 billion.

pacificobob - 6-23-2023 at 07:02 AM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
S,

So what is it called when a not-man person mansplains? Gullible? You’re the one who believes SwiftBoat.

You still won’t acknowledge that the difference between our positions on climate change is what you are pushing won’t solve the problem because it fails to address the source of the problem.

China out pollutes the next 6 countries on the top 10 list!


Swiftboat??..... firstly, thanks for your service! Remind me the military branch you served with? In viet nam i worked with guys who had been on the rivers.... I've never seen more severe PTSD. Did you manage to complete your military service with experiencing life crippling fear? Please share with us.... chicken hawk.

mtgoat666 - 6-23-2023 at 07:25 AM


mtgoat666 - 6-23-2023 at 07:40 AM






mtgoat666 - 6-23-2023 at 08:02 AM


JZ - 6-24-2023 at 01:22 PM

The war in Ukraine is having a massive impact on the environment.

"A team of carbon accounting experts has evaluated the climate impact of the first year of the conflict, which started in February 2022.

They found that a total of 120 million metric tons of planet-heating pollution can be attributed to the first 12 months of the war, according to the report published Wednesday. That’s equivalent to the annual emissions of Belgium, or those produced by nearly 27 million gas-powered cars on the road for a year."

https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/07/europe/ukraine-war-climate-ch...

The rub is that Putin doesn't even evade if the US doesn't look so comically weak in Afghanistan.



SFandH - 6-24-2023 at 04:06 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  


The war in Ukraine is having a massive impact on the environment.


They found that a total of 120 million metric tons of planet-heating pollution can be attributed to the first 12 months of the war, according to the report published Wednesday. That’s equivalent to the annual emissions of Belgium, or those produced by nearly 27 million gas-powered cars on the road for a year."

https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/07/europe/ukraine-war-climate-ch...




"27 million gas-powered cars"

According to Bard AI, there are 1.5 billion passenger vehicles on the road worldwide. Look it up.

27,000,000 / 1,500,000,000 = 27/1,500 = 0.018 * 100 = 1.8%

1.8%, yup, "massive impact". :rolleyes:

Caveat - I'm gettin' old. The arithmetic may be wrong.


[Edited on 6-24-2023 by SFandH]

surabi - 6-24-2023 at 04:39 PM

Why is it that so many links that JZ posts go nowhere? That link brings up an error page.

SFandH- your math doesn't relate to the statement. If 27 million cars put out 120 billion metric tons of planet-warming pollution, that has nothing to do with how many cars there are in total on the planet, except you'd multiply 120 billion by 55.55 to find out how many metric tons all the cars in total put out.

As the cnn link is broken, I can't see if the article actually said something different than JZ's interpretation, which is often the case.

SFandH - 6-24-2023 at 05:23 PM

I just thought that 27 million cars output 1.8% of the pollution that all the cars output. Not much of an increase. Faulty logic?

Besides, I don't understand what the point is that JZ is trying to make by saying war increases pollution.

Yes, his link is incomplete, truncated.


[Edited on 6-25-2023 by SFandH]

mtgoat666 - 6-24-2023 at 05:51 PM

Summer time
and the living ain't easy
the fish are jumpin’
and we all might die


RFClark - 6-24-2023 at 08:14 PM

Climate Projections Very Likely Underestimate Future Volcanic Forcing and Its Climatic Effects

“Climate projections are the simulations of Earth's climate in the future using complex climate models. Standard climate projections, as in Intergovernmental Panel on Climate Change Sixth Assessment Report, assume that explosive volcanic activity over 2015–2100 are of the same level as the 1850–2014 period. Using the latest ice-core and satellite records, we find that explosive eruptions could emit more sulfur dioxide into the upper atmosphere for the period of 2015–2100 than standard climate projections. Our climate model simulations show that the impacts of volcanic eruptions on climate, including global surface temperature, sea level and sea ice extent, are underestimated because current climate projections do not fully account for the recurrent frequency of volcanic eruptions. We also find that small-magnitude eruptions occur frequently and can contribute a significant effect on future climate.”

https://agupubs.onlinelibrary.wiley.com/doi/10.1029/2023GL10...

[Edited on 6-25-2023 by RFClark]

[Edited on 6-25-2023 by RFClark]

Goat, I always liked this one!

RFClark - 6-24-2023 at 08:28 PM



IMG_4312.jpeg - 124kB

mtgoat666 - 6-25-2023 at 11:08 AM


JZ - 6-25-2023 at 11:42 AM

Since you are on a photo kick, here is 1 of the 100,000 children who are mining the raw materials for your EV batteries.



[Edited on 6-25-2023 by JZ]

mtgoat666 - 6-26-2023 at 09:27 AM

Humans approaching limits of ‘survivability’ as sweltering heatwaves engulf parts of Asia

“Long-term projections indicate that Indian heatwaves could cross the survivability limit for a healthy human resting in the shade by 2050,” the study said. “They will impact the labor productivity, economic growth, and quality of life of around 310 - 480 million people.”

https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/26/india/india-heatwave-extreme-...

RFClark - 6-26-2023 at 09:59 AM

Goat,

The view from under your bed!

“ 2022 marked the 50th anniversary of the Club of Rome’s landmark report, ‘The Limits to Growth’. This report – first published on 2 March 1972 – was the first to model our planet’s interconnected systems and to make clear that if growth trends in population, industrialisation, resource use and pollution continued unchanged, we would reach and then overshoot the carrying capacity of the Earth at some point in the next one hundred years.”

The view if you go outside and look up at night!

“Only the 16th asteroid to be discovered, Psyche was found in 1852 by Italian astronomer Annibale de Gasparis, who named it for the goddess of the soul in ancient Greek mythology.

What gives asteroid Psyche great scientific interest is that it is likely rich in metal. It may consist largely of metal from the core of a planetesimal, one of the building blocks of the Sun’s planetary system. At Psyche scientists will explore, for the first time ever, a world made not of rock or ice, but rich in metal.”

JZ - 6-26-2023 at 10:08 AM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Humans approaching limits of ‘survivability’ as sweltering heatwaves engulf parts of Asia

“Long-term projections indicate that Indian heatwaves could cross the survivability limit for a healthy human resting in the shade by 2050,” the study said. “They will impact the labor productivity, economic growth, and quality of life of around 310 - 480 million people.”

https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/26/india/india-heatwave-extreme-...


Yet it has been 290 days since Las Vegas hit 100 degrees. 2 days away from breaking the all time record. And SoCal recorded its 5th coldest Spring ever.

Lets not forget that 50 years ago you were predicting a glacier was going to cover the US.

SFandH - 6-26-2023 at 10:17 AM

The effects of atmospheric warming due to the burning of fossil fuel:

hot will be hotter
cold will be colder
wet will be wetter
dry will be drier
storms will be stronger
floods will be deeper
wildfires will be wilder
etc.

It's called climate change.

The atmosphere contains more energy. All types of weather and its effects will be more extreme, more devastating.

It's happening now, watch the news.


[Edited on 6-26-2023 by SFandH]

surabi - 6-26-2023 at 10:30 AM

"It's happening now, watch the news."

A. The deniers don't care about people in India. They will only care when it affects them directly. JZ thinks the temperature in Las Vegas and So Cal are relevant as proof that it's all some overblown hoax.

B. Deniers don't deny that it's happening, they just maintain that "the weather has always been changing, it's a natural phenomenon."

Nothing wakes these people up.

surabi - 6-26-2023 at 12:13 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  


Yet it has been 290 days since Las Vegas hit 100 degrees. 2 days away from breaking the all time record. And SoCal recorded its 5th coldest Spring ever.




And this is relevant how, other than pointing out that you live in an area where you find the temperature comfortable?
Temp in Puerto Vallarta today is 93, with a "feels like" of 109.

mtgoat666 - 6-26-2023 at 12:27 PM


mtgoat666 - 6-26-2023 at 12:33 PM


mtgoat666 - 6-26-2023 at 06:06 PM

Some of you denialists say man cannot change the earth. Scientist would say you are kooky…

Humans pump so much groundwater that Earth’s axis has shifted, study finds
https://www.cnn.com/2023/06/26/world/pumping-groundwater-ear...

RFClark - 6-28-2023 at 09:40 AM

News about positive effects of our ever changing climate.


https://phys.org/news/2023-06-future-turbulence-alleviate-in...

RFClark - 6-28-2023 at 09:51 AM

Even if carbon emissions are reduced to “0” world wide tempatures will continue to increase for at least a decade.

https://phys.org/news/2023-06-cooling-planet-doesnt-net-scie...

mtgoat666 - 6-28-2023 at 10:43 AM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
Even if carbon emissions are reduced to “0” world wide tempatures will continue to increase for at least a decade.

https://phys.org/news/2023-06-cooling-planet-doesnt-net-scie...


Clarkles,
Is that another one of your excuses for doing nothing?

RFClark - 6-28-2023 at 10:43 AM

SFandH and Goat,

The Chinese, Russians and Iranians account for almost 50% of the emissions. There currently is no plan to do anything about that without a world war which will solve the climate and overpopulation problems in a way no one will like.

This post is in support of my past statements that the plan as put forward doesn't address the problem as stated. As a technical type, I see solutions that don’t address the stated problem as just moving the deckchairs around. The ship will still sink.

I am doing my part!

[Edited on 6-28-2023 by RFClark]

IMG_2565.jpeg - 95kB

[Edited on 6-28-2023 by RFClark]

JZ - 6-28-2023 at 12:39 PM

They came for our gas cars. Then they came for our gas dryers. Next it was our gas stoves.

And now they are taking wood flame grilled pizzas from us?? Where will the madness end?



https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/nyc-pizzerias-torch-dem...


[Edited on 6-28-2023 by JZ]

RFClark - 6-28-2023 at 04:05 PM

JZ,

They’re coming for the cheese and pepperoni next! Sausage too!

JZ - 6-28-2023 at 04:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
JZ,

They’re coming for the cheese and pepperoni next! Sausage too!


I'll shoot the bastards if they try to come for my dogs!

Our pets are part of the climate problem.
https://www.cnn.com/2022/09/15/us/pets-climate-impact-lbg-we...

surabi - 6-28-2023 at 04:27 PM

Relax, JZ. You're white, male and heterosexual. "They" aren't coming to take anything away from you. You can come out of your basement now, all clear.

RFClark - 6-29-2023 at 09:59 AM

Mexican Climate News

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2023/jun/29/mexico-power-g...

https://www.theguardian.com/world/2021/feb/15/mexico-coal-fo...

surabi - 6-29-2023 at 10:12 AM

Huge transformer blew in my town 2 days ago, because of all the AC and fans that are being used in the unrelenting 100 degree temps we've been having for the past couple weeks. It took 24 hrs for them to restore the power. Miserable sweaty night for everyone with no cooling, and lots of food gone bad for anyone without a generator or solar.

RFClark - 6-29-2023 at 10:33 AM

CFE = can’t find electricity!

JDCanuck - 6-29-2023 at 10:57 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Huge transformer blew in my town 2 days ago, because of all the AC and fans that are being used in the unrelenting 100 degree temps we've been having for the past couple weeks. It took 24 hrs for them to restore the power. Miserable sweaty night for everyone with no cooling, and lots of food gone bad for anyone without a generator or solar.


If you could afford enough solar just to run a fridge and a small single room AC unit to keep temps liveable, it would be a big benefit for the future. Backup generator, while its a quicker solution, tends to be problematic long term.

surabi - 6-29-2023 at 11:12 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck  


If you could afford enough solar just to run a fridge and a small single room AC unit to keep temps liveable, it would be a big benefit for the future. Backup generator, while its a quicker solution, tends to be problematic long term.


Solar would never be cost-effective for me. While it would come in handy if the power goes out, which it normally doesn't for long enough to be an issue, my electric bills are never more than 200 pesos for a two month billing period and usually even less. Solar installation cost would never pay for itself in my lifetime unless I wanted AC, a pool, etc, which I don't. Even if I had solar, I wouldn't have AC- I prefer fans.

KurtG - 6-29-2023 at 11:19 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
They came for our gas cars. Then they came for our gas dryers. Next it was our gas stoves.

And now they are taking wood flame grilled pizzas from us?? Where will the madness end?



https://www.foxbusiness.com/politics/nyc-pizzerias-torch-dem...




[Edited on 6-28-2023 by JZ]


Another view. The Fox and NY Post articles seem like manufactured outrage at which they both seem to excel.
https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/jun/28/rightwingers-sa...

JDCanuck - 6-29-2023 at 11:24 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck  


If you could afford enough solar just to run a fridge and a small single room AC unit to keep temps liveable, it would be a big benefit for the future. Backup generator, while its a quicker solution, tends to be problematic long term.


Solar would never be cost-effective for me. While it would come in handy if the power goes out, which it normally doesn't for long enough to be an issue, my electric bills are never more than 200 pesos for a two month billing period and usually even less. Solar installation cost would never pay for itself in my lifetime unless I wanted AC, a pool, etc, which I don't. Even if I had solar, I wouldn't have AC- I prefer fans.


That seems to be the issue with solar reluctance in Mexico. Small electrical loads cost very little for most and the additional cost of solar is seldom viable over a short term.
We did away with all necessary butane uses and justified a completely electric house based on comfort, safety, reliability, EV charging, distilled water production and finally cost compared to running power in on CFE poles. As a percentage of total home cost when building, it was surprisingly cheap at around 12.5% of total home costs.
A CFE supplied similar sized lot alone would have eaten up at least two thirds of that cost.



[Edited on 6-29-2023 by JDCanuck]

JZ - 6-29-2023 at 11:38 AM

Quote: Originally posted by KurtG  


Another view. The Fox and NY Post articles seem like manufactured outrage at which they both seem to excel.
https://www.theguardian.com/food/2023/jun/28/rightwingers-sa...


Forcing small businesses to come up with $20K cash minimum. And you know if you give these people an inch they will come back and take a mile in the future.

They have regulated everything so much that industry is ground to a halt. For example all their regulations have basically killed new construction in CA. And that fuels the homelessness problem.

They only fund and support the pet projects they approve of. Regardless if those projects actual hurt the Earth or not (i.e. huge/massively expensive and very inefficient wind and solar fields).



JDCanuck - 6-29-2023 at 12:07 PM

JZ: I beg to differ on the expense of solar and wind fields. Utilities and their investors are increasingly putting them in not to gain Liberal praise, but because they are far cheaper even with grid and battery costs than the alternatives like Nuclear, coal and gas.
The funny part is...the politicians are taking credit on sweeping financially based changes in power generation begun 4 decades ago and increasingly accelerating.
Here's a good table displaying the progress that's been made recently by various countries up til 2022, and the US does not rank badly compared to all others. Sierra Leone and Denmark are the most impressive:

https://ourworldindata.org/grapher/carbon-intensity-electric...

[Edited on 6-29-2023 by JDCanuck]

surabi - 6-29-2023 at 12:49 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck  




That seems to be the issue with solar reluctance in Mexico. Small electrical loads cost very little for most and the additional cost of solar is seldom viable over a short term.




[Edited on 6-29-2023 by JDCanuck]


I guess it depends on what you consider short or long term. For instance, my 200 peso CFE bills over the course of 30 years, which I would consider to be long term, would only amount to less than about $2000US.
Installing solar costs more than that, especially if you are retrofitting it rather than installing as part of the original build.

JDCanuck - 6-29-2023 at 01:06 PM

I guess it depends on what you consider short or long term. For instance, my 200 peso CFE bills over the course of 30 years, which I would consider to be long term, would only amount to less than about $2000US.
Installing solar costs more than that, especially if you are retrofitting it rather than installing as part of the original build.



I agree, hopefully CFE continues to subsidize low energy users as they convert to non carbon power sources as much as they have on their present carbon dependent sources. Retrofitting is far out of the reach of most native Mexicans, while it is easily within the reach of the highest power users that supply the excess funds for the subsidies. Mexico has a unique opportunity in solar and wind alternatives and they seem to finally be grasping it.

surabi - 6-29-2023 at 01:45 PM

Here's an interesting story. My Mexican son-in-law is from a village on the mainland that up until about 20 or so years ago, was not serviced by CFE- they had no electric there. So the govt. had given the residents solar panels.

Then CFE brought in electrical lines. My daughter and son-in-law got a bunch of solar panels for free to use at their place in Baja from his rellies in the village because they were no longer using them.

When some friends of mine heard about that, they drove up to that village to see if they could also score some. Within half an hour of arriving and making it known what they were looking for, lots of locals showed up with solar panels, which my friends bought dirt cheap.

JZ - 6-29-2023 at 06:18 PM

Welp, no power in Nebraska for a while.

https://cowboystatedaily.com/2023/06/27/baseball-sized-hail-...

SFandH - 6-29-2023 at 06:48 PM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Welp, no power in Nebraska for a while.

https://cowboystatedaily.com/2023/06/27/baseball-sized-hail-...


Yup, nature. Sort of like when the tidal wave wiped out the Japanese nuclear plant.

Or when the winter weather crippled the Texas power grid.

Or......



[Edited on 6-30-2023 by SFandH]

JDCanuck - 6-30-2023 at 05:03 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Welp, no power in Nebraska for a while.

https://cowboystatedaily.com/2023/06/27/baseball-sized-hail-...


It seems the suppliers of the panels overstated their hail resistance. According to the others in the state that had excessive damage to other equipment but their panels survived several heavy hail storms, having been previously tested with baseballs fired out of cannons and even had vehicles driven over them.
"Jason Bloomberg, a Cheyenne physician and proponent of renewable energy, said the solar panels on his property have had plenty of hail impacts over the years, and they’ve been fine. Hail has damaged other parts of his property, he said, but not the panels.

The company that sold him the panels demonstrated their ability to resist hail damage by firing baseballs at it with a baseball cannon. They also drove a pickup over them.

“They’re very durable,” he said.

Bloomberg suspects that high winds drove large hailstones into the Scottsbluff panels, which exceeded their hail resistance limits"

2023 Baja storm season is still ahead, having been surprisingly light so far this year. Time to check the stability of your system still.

[Edited on 6-30-2023 by JDCanuck]

Don Pisto - 7-2-2023 at 10:36 AM

Quote: Originally posted by SFandH  
Quote: Originally posted by JZ  
Welp, no power in Nebraska for a while.

https://cowboystatedaily.com/2023/06/27/baseball-sized-hail-...


Yup, nature. Sort of like when the tidal wave wiped out the Japanese nuclear plant.

Or when the winter weather crippled the Texas power grid.

Or......



[Edited on 6-30-2023 by SFandH]



wonder what your car must look like!

surabi - 7-2-2023 at 02:02 PM

The term global warming was exchanged for climate change because of dummies who don't bother to educate themselves on the science- that it will get colder in some places and warmer in others, that it causes extreme weather events and disasters, and affects every living thing on the planet, But it didn't do any good- the dummies still don't get it.

JZ - 7-2-2023 at 02:29 PM

It was changed to Climate Change to be ambiguous, as they got called out for being wrong on a 100 more specific predictions over 60 years. So a genius solved that annoying problem: Let's just be vague and carry-on.

Trying to change language is a top play of dishonest people. They try to redefine bad ideas with clever terminology.


Glidergeek - 7-3-2023 at 08:23 AM

How's that palm tree doing?

JZ - 7-4-2023 at 12:52 PM

First the came for our gas stoves, now they are coming for our fireworks? You guessed it, some cities are substituting drone shows for fireworks to help with the "Climate Crisis." Where does it end?


SFandH - 7-5-2023 at 02:29 PM

World registers hottest day ever recorded

"Unfortunately, it promises to only be the first in a series of new records set this year as increasing emissions of [carbon dioxide] and greenhouse gases coupled with a growing El Nino event push temperatures to new highs,"

https://news.yahoo.com/world-registers-hottest-day-ever-1550...

------------------------------

A "super" El Nino is predicted for the next year. It's gonna be stormy.

Don Pisto - 7-5-2023 at 04:01 PM

well that record has already been broken.......hang on!

RFClark - 7-5-2023 at 04:53 PM

OK, China, Russia and Iran emit about 65% of the CO2. The US is about 25%.
What is the plan to get them onboard so we’re not the only ones doing the heavy lifting? China, also makes most of the fireworks.

Mexico also makes lots of fireworks. Pemex and CFE are major polluters as well.

SFandH - 7-5-2023 at 05:58 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
OK, China, Russia and Iran emit about 65% of the CO2. The US is about 25%.
What is the plan to get them onboard so we’re not the only ones doing the heavy lifting? China, also makes most of the fireworks.

Mexico also makes lots of fireworks. Pemex and CFE are major polluters as well.


Yup, every country pollutes.

[Edited on 7-6-2023 by SFandH]

Don Pisto - 7-5-2023 at 06:17 PM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
OK, China, Russia and Iran emit about 65% of the CO2. The US is about 25%.
What is the plan to get them onboard so we’re not the only ones doing the heavy lifting? China, also makes most of the fireworks.

Mexico also makes lots of fireworks. Pemex and CFE are major polluters as well.


lets go out on a limb here and suggest metal box guy meant "India" not "Iran"?

pacificobob - 7-6-2023 at 09:43 AM

Metal box.... that's funny.
Whenever i enter my closet and see the shoe boxes stacked within, I'm reminded of that construction style.

JZ - 7-6-2023 at 01:43 PM

You hippies sold your souls to the man.


surabi - 7-6-2023 at 02:21 PM

Better gather up all your toys and batten the hatches and lockdown, JZ before "they" come to take it all away.

RFClark - 7-6-2023 at 03:03 PM

Dpiso,

Lets go out on a limb and suggest that I meant Iran. Iran is #6 on the list. Russia and Iran combined about equal India and will never reduce their CO2 emissions or stop selling oil until they run out. China isn’t going to stop either.

Whats better about living in a concrete box? Most of which leak when it rains!

surabi - 7-6-2023 at 03:31 PM

My "concrete box" doesn't leak when it rains. Neither does almost anyone else's I know.

RFClark - 7-6-2023 at 04:46 PM

S,
Great, there are a number of $1M US + block houses around us that fix the roof every year after it rains. I’m glad your’s doesn’t leak.


To the other climate extremists, it’s a lot easer to talk the talk than walk the walk.

We walk the walk!

Solar bread, baked by the sun!



[Edited on 7-7-2023 by RFClark]

IMG_2626.jpeg - 85kB

[Edited on 7-7-2023 by RFClark]

surabi - 7-6-2023 at 06:11 PM

It requires maintenance, like everything in this climate. I go up every year or two, powerwash the roofs and apply another coat of waterproof paint. And use the fiberglass sealer fabric over any cracks that develop. The people with million dollar plus houses aren't hands-on, so they aren't aware of things to check until it becomes a problem.

RFClark - 7-6-2023 at 07:50 PM

S,

The 1st roof we did in San Felipe in 2006 has never leaked. We used the snow roofing system. Only needs a coat of elastomeric white coating every few years

JDCanuck - 7-7-2023 at 05:25 AM

A million-square-mile gravity hole that is lowering the oceans

300 feet lower sea level? Thats a huge difference!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/giant-gravity-hol...



[Edited on 7-7-2023 by JDCanuck]

mtgoat666 - 7-7-2023 at 07:05 AM

Quote: Originally posted by JDCanuck  
A million-square-mile gravity hole that is lowering the oceans

300 feet lower sea level? Thats a huge difference!

https://www.scientificamerican.com/article/giant-gravity-hol...



[Edited on 7-7-2023 by JDCanuck]


gosh darnn scientists!

mtgoat666 - 7-7-2023 at 07:10 AM

What, me worry?

‘We are in uncharted territory’: World records hottest day ever for the third time in just four days

The planet registered its hottest day since records began for the third time in just four days this week, deepening fears about the far-reaching changes taking place in Earth’s system because of the climate emergency.

Unofficial data from U.S. researchers showed the planet’s daily average temperature soared to 17.23 degrees Celsius (63.01 degrees Fahrenheit) on Thursday, surpassing two previous heat records registered in recent days.

The extraordinary feat comes shortly after the European Union’s climate change service confirmed the planet observed its hottest June on record, with unprecedented sea surface temperatures and record low Antarctic sea ice.

Climate scientists are deeply concerned.

Indeed, the U.N. weather agency recently warned that the combination of ever-increasing greenhouse gas emissions and the return of El Niño is likely to mean the worst is still to come.

“The global temperature record smashed again yesterday,” Bill McGuire, professor emeritus of geophysical and climate hazards at University College London, said via Twitter.

RFClark - 7-7-2023 at 08:07 AM

Goat,

The “we” is us. The planet has been here before! Move to BCS it’s nice here!

pacificobob - 7-7-2023 at 08:14 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
My "concrete box" doesn't leak when it rains. Neither does almost anyone else's I know.


No leaks at my house. A steel house 300 yards from saltwater? What could possibly go wrong?

RFClark - 7-7-2023 at 08:40 AM

PB,

Got rebar? Got drywall? Both rot in this level of humidity, you just can’t see it.
Our place is cement on the outside and inside. The steel is in the middle just like rebar, but unlike rebar it’s all coated so it won’t rust. Containers are 10 year rated for salt spray on a ship without any extra coating. We have coating, cement and sealer on the cement.

What’s in your walls? Think condos in Florida here!

[Edited on 7-7-2023 by RFClark]

[Edited on 7-7-2023 by RFClark]

AKgringo - 7-7-2023 at 09:23 AM

I worked for almost a year on a missile defense project in the Aleutian Islands. All of the rebar used in that project was epoxy coated to prevent it from rusting out over time.

Due to either a change in design, or an error in the original plan we had to demolish some of the early construction about six months into the project. The way the concrete separated from the rebar, you would think it was coated with teflon.

RFClark - 7-7-2023 at 09:34 AM

AK,

A lot of Mexican construction leaves the rebar sticking out at the top and ends which can allow water to seep in. There’s also a blow through problem with block walls in very high winds. Even ones coated with cement or plaster. (Cracks!)

Most of the US buyers here never watched their houses being built. If they had and knew anything about construction they’d never buy some of them.

But you also need to consider the source.

surabi - 7-7-2023 at 09:48 AM

Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
AK,

A lot of Mexican construction leaves the rebar sticking out at the top and ends which can allow water to seep in.



It isn't really water "seeping in". It's that the rebar sticking out starts to rust and the rust travels along the length of the rebar. And rust never sleeps.

stillnbaja - 7-7-2023 at 09:59 AM

Quote: Originally posted by surabi  
Quote: Originally posted by RFClark  
AK,

A lot of Mexican construction leaves the rebar sticking out at the top and ends which can allow water to seep in.



It isn't really water "seeping in". It's that the rebar sticking out starts to rust and the rust travels along the length of the rebar. And rust never sleeps.


is it true they leave rebar sticking up so that the building isn't finished and there's some tax savings?? or is that wives tale?

RFClark - 7-7-2023 at 10:02 AM

S,

Water is why the steel rusts. Steel takes Oxygen from the water and for most steels the oxide coating is soluble in water. Aluminum is far more reactive in water than is steel but aluminum’s oxide coating isn’t as soluble as steel’s so it protects the aluminum from further oxidation

The reason stainless steel won’t rust is because it’s passivated so that most of its surface is really nickel. Passivation removes the surface steel and leaves the nickel.

SB,

No, that’s the reason “Taxes”!

[Edited on 7-7-2023 by RFClark]

surabi - 7-7-2023 at 10:15 AM

Of course water, in the form of rain, or high humidity is what causes steel to rust. Duh. I don't know why you think it necessary to mansplain the obvious to me.

What I was saying is that you could seal really well around rebar sticking out of the roof, so no water could seep in, but the exposed rebar will rust and the rust will eventually travel through the length of the rebar in the walls.

RFClark - 7-7-2023 at 10:21 AM

S,

You’re the one who said, “it isn’t really the water seeping in”! But it really is!

mtgoat666 - 7-7-2023 at 12:19 PM

Y’all are professional engineers, eh? Experts in structural, corrosion and civil!
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