A recent visit to San Fernando by Wilderone found lot's of water... this is the road at the petroglyph cliff, west of the mission.David K - 4-3-2005 at 03:13 PM
Beyond the cliff, were boulders covered with petros...David K - 4-3-2005 at 03:16 PM
Here's the third photo Wilderone emailed me... Now, I can't wait to go see these myself! I have visited the petro cliff several times since 1974, but
never continued past... Thanks Wilderone!JESSE - 4-3-2005 at 04:20 PM
Thats awesome!! are those flowers?David K - 4-4-2005 at 07:36 AM
Looks like moss on the rock, to me...
New Mexico Petroglyph
academicanarchist - 4-5-2005 at 06:40 AM
This is one of the photos I took of petroglyphs in New Mexico last month. It is interesting to see similar designs in different regions.Bruce R Leech - 4-5-2005 at 06:53 AM
those are nice do you have more David?could you post?Don Jorge - 4-5-2005 at 07:04 AM
Those are lichens.
[Edited on 4-5-2005 by Don Jorge]David K - 4-5-2005 at 07:22 AM
Of those rocks, no... Wilderone just sent those three (which were too big to post without reducing).
Of the other petros at San Fernando mission (a mile west of), yes...
This is going to be a really stupid question, but I will never know if I don't ask.
How do you know that they are old and not just something someone put there a few years ago?Neal Johns - 4-5-2005 at 12:26 PM
There are many sites where modern graffiti has been placed near or over petros and the difference is apparent to the casual observer. The old ones
have a coat of "desert varnish" over them while the new ones are much lighter in color.
Desert varnish is clay and iron/manganese oxides deposited by a complex bacterial process. Ronald Dorn has done a lot of work over the decades dating
petros by analyzing these deposits.wilderone - 4-6-2005 at 09:51 AM
Also, if one is asinine enough to think it's ok to deface archaeological sites, their graffitti is something like "Harold 1984", or "Ben + Betty", or
a smiley face or some ridiculous stick figure, and does not have the skills nor expertise to endeavor to deliberately inscribe graffitti using the
same techniques as the original "rock artists", making it distinguishable. Anyone who respects rock art and its significance will protect it. And
as Neal has stated, it is important to not even touch rock art, as it disturbs the bacterial growth and/or deposits foreign substances onto the site,
thus making accurate analysis more difficult.Bruce R Leech - 4-6-2005 at 10:10 AM
I have GPS locations on many sites in the Mulege aria that I have explored many I found my self rock climbing . and many that my Friends on the
ranches have shown me. and I don't share these locations with many people because of the graffiti problem.wilderone - 4-6-2005 at 11:08 AM
Therein, lies the basis for a $35 day trip!! I'd sign up.Bruce R Leech - 4-6-2005 at 11:17 AM
Quote:
Originally posted by wilderone
Therein, lies the basis for a $35 day trip!! I'd sign up.
what do you mean?wilderone - 4-8-2005 at 08:53 AM
Well, Bruce, in a previous post you and I had exchanged ideas regarding the economy, vis a vis local business, of locals in Mulege and elsewhere (the
former discussion originating in the failed new San Ignacio saltworks proposal). I suggested then that there should be plenty of ways to draw in
tourist dollars since the locale contains such unique resources.
Your discovery of some pictographs where most people don't go or don't know about, would be a good day trip for tourists, backpackers, campers, etc.,
similar to the daytrips offered now in Mulege to see rock art. You (or someone) could offer a day trip, with some hiking, a stop at a ranch with
drinks for sale, a view of the pictographs and maybe something else thrown in. I realize that when more and more people learn the locations of rock
art, that it puts them in jeopardy, but I think if people are taken with a guide and the guide explains the protocol, then it would result in a better
understanding of such things and would be a benefit, overall. You could require advance notice, with a loose schedule. More than one person could be
trained to do the trip.Bruce R Leech - 4-8-2005 at 09:49 AM
Oh I see Now dumb me.
no we have several sites that are easy to git to that the local guides take people to . but the end result is not good . usually they return with
there Friends and no guide and trash the place up.
all I'm doing for now is photographing and documenting as best as I can then I put the sites on a map with gps . some day or when I die it will go to
some one I trust. about half of them require rock climbing experience and equipment to reach. some sites are caves with mummy's and artifacts in
place. I have seen what happens to these sites when ether the Mexican gov. or national geographic git wind of them.burro bob - 4-8-2005 at 10:19 AM
Bruce
I like the way you think. It is nice to see your concern for these site overrides any desire to impress others with your discoveries.
Unless a site is very remote it will get vandilized even with a good petroglyph protection message.
Several years ago I led a group (members of Bruce Barbers San Felipe Association of Retired People) to show them the "River of Tears" petroglyph site
I had found. This site was much further up canyon than Bruce had ever explored before.
The site has several living areas and had numerous metates (grinding areas). I found a couple of manos (the rounded stones that did the grinding) and
put them back on the metates. When I led this group, of what I figured were responsible adults, I went through the whole spiel about conservation and
why it was improtant not to distrub anything by digging. I thought I got the message across. When I went back by myself a few weeks later the manos
were gone and there had been some digging at one of the home sites. Someone I had led there went back and ripped off the site.
I no longer take anyone to any petroglyph sites I find. I just take photos.
burro bobBruce R Leech - 4-8-2005 at 10:35 AM
burro bob it is sad but truewilderone - 4-8-2005 at 01:29 PM
Well, I'll leave it to your discretion then. I appreciate your efforts to protect such sites. However, I'd like to see your photos. ok - here's
one: a slide show, $3 at the door, beers $1.50!!
It is more important to protect the sites
academicanarchist - 4-8-2005 at 07:08 PM
I agree that it is more important to protect the sites from the arrogant and stupid tourists who think it is funny to damage such sites. The same
goes for the mission sites.Bruce R Leech - 4-8-2005 at 07:29 PM
Quote:
Originally posted by wilderone
Well, I'll leave it to your discretion then. I appreciate your efforts to protect such sites. However, I'd like to see your photos. ok - here's
one: a slide show, $3 at the door, beers $1.50!!
