BajaNomad

Fishbuck (banned) was right!

LancairDriver - 2-20-2022 at 04:19 PM

This link is an article about the Boeing 737 Max’s that dived into the ground killing many. Fishbuck worked at Boeing building these airplanes and complained frequently on the Baja Nomads forum about the numerous problems at Boeing before he got out of there. Too bad no one listened, it would have saved Boeing billions of dollars.

https://share.smartnews.com/NGDY9

David K - 2-20-2022 at 04:48 PM

Fishbuck posts (almost) daily on Facebook and just bought his new plane and was flying it back to California, between weather events. He is fine with his banishment from Nomad, no hard feelings.

mtgoat666 - 2-20-2022 at 07:03 PM

Quote: Originally posted by LancairDriver  
This link is an article about the Boeing 737 Max’s that dived into the ground killing many. Fishbuck worked at Boeing building these airplanes and complained frequently on the Baja Nomads forum about the numerous problems at Boeing before he got out of there. Too bad no one listened, it would have saved Boeing billions of dollars.

https://share.smartnews.com/NGDY9


Fishflock was nuts. Maybe still is.

pacificobob - 2-21-2022 at 07:56 AM

There never was anything wrong with the max8.
Poorly trained pilots was to blame. As I recall both major incidents were with carriers in underdeveloped countries....=second rate training.
I operated and trained pilots in a variety of Boeing aircraft.
Fishbuck as both uninformed and confused. His single engine private pilot
Certificate didn't qualify him to make informed observations. IMO.

wilderone - 2-21-2022 at 08:24 AM

This is old news, and Boeing has been brought to task - thoroughly investigated - blame all around.

David K - 2-21-2022 at 09:38 AM

Quote: Originally posted by pacificobob  
There never was anything wrong with the max8.
Poorly trained pilots was to blame. As I recall both major incidents were with carriers in underdeveloped countries....=second rate training.
I operated and trained pilots in a variety of Boeing aircraft.
Fishbuck as both uninformed and confused. His single engine private pilot
Certificate didn't qualify him to make informed observations. IMO.


Fishbuck worked at the Boeing plant. His pilot certificate had nothing to do with his Boeing observations. Working there did.

BajaTed - 2-21-2022 at 10:52 AM

I'm retired Boeing IT, when the company adopted software engineering standards for SW testing created by the DoD, SSG & Defense Systems adopted them. BCAG said we are the tail that wags the dog and don't follow anybody.
The rest is history.

The Max 8 is inherently design flawed
https://mishtalk.com/economics/boeing-737-max-major-design-f...

pacificobob - 2-21-2022 at 04:14 PM

So as an IT guy you have a great deal of time using the max8 flight management systems?
You should report your opinions to the NTSB and FAA.
why are they still flying?
I recently survived a couple legs on max8.

LancairDriver - 2-21-2022 at 05:41 PM

As I recall from the Ethiopian 737 max crash, the pilot who last flew the airplane had the same pitch departure on the day before. He, and probably others simply took corrective action for the problem and must have considered it minor enough to discount it or report it. I worked around test pilots for Lockheed and McDouglas for several years as a manufacturing tech rep and some pilots would test an airplane and pronounce it was a piece of cake to fly. Others would test the same airplane and claim it was a death trap. The ones who liked to race airplanes at Reno were the ones who didn’t mind pushing the envelope just for the fun of it. The point is with any machine, race car or airplane, etc. some people feel instinctively comfortable and in tune with the machine.

pacificobob - 2-21-2022 at 08:19 PM

The goal is to design a/c that are easy to fly.[B-747] and most Boeing products
And not like the MD-11... dozens of software changes to the landing pitch control behavior that was a challenge for pilots and resulted in many tail strikes.

Stickers - 2-21-2022 at 09:10 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Fishbuck posts (almost) daily on Facebook and just bought his new plane and was flying it back to California, between weather events. He is fine with his banishment from Nomad, no hard feelings.


Do you know what type of plane he’s flying?

WestyWanderer - 2-21-2022 at 10:16 PM

Quote: Originally posted by pacificobob  
There never was anything wrong with the max8.
Poorly trained pilots was to blame. As I recall both major incidents were with carriers in underdeveloped countries....=second rate training.
I operated and trained pilots in a variety of Boeing aircraft.
Fishbuck as both uninformed and confused. His single engine private pilot
Certificate didn't qualify him to make informed observations. IMO.


According to the US government Boeing was to blame hence the criminal charges brought against the company.

David K - 2-22-2022 at 08:06 AM

Quote: Originally posted by Stickers  
Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Fishbuck posts (almost) daily on Facebook and just bought his new plane and was flying it back to California, between weather events. He is fine with his banishment from Nomad, no hard feelings.


Do you know what type of plane he’s flying?

It is a Piper but I don't know which model. It looks like the one Captain Mike used to fly. I think I misread his post in that he will wait for spring to fly it back.

It is a Piper Cherokee.

[Edited on 2-22-2022 by David K]

David K - 2-22-2022 at 03:24 PM

Some articles on the Boeing problem:

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/how-m...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/30/politics/boeing-sensor-737-ma...

JDCanuck - 2-22-2022 at 05:53 PM

Since the initial crash last October, Boeing has been updating the MCAS software on the 737 Max to use data from the plane’s two AOA sensors, rather than relying on one sensor. Critics question why the airplane’s system wasn’t originally designed that way.

“From the beginning it should have been a fail-safe design, which would have relied on two inputs to make sure that you weren’t sensitive to one failure,” said Peter Lemme, a former Boeing flight-controls engineer who helped design systems for the 757 and 767.

Lemme, who was subpoenaed by a grand jury in an investigation into the 737 Max, said he doesn’t understand why it took two fatal crashes for Boeing to make those changes.

mtgoat666 - 2-22-2022 at 06:05 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Some articles on the Boeing problem:

https://www.seattletimes.com/business/boeing-aerospace/how-m...

https://www.cnn.com/2019/04/30/politics/boeing-sensor-737-ma...


DK:
Wow! You refer people to left wing news for information! Wonder of wonders!
Seattle time is pretty liberal. Ya know, the Seattle times got a Pulitzer Prize for their year of reporting on Boeing and the max debacle.

[Edited on 2-23-2022 by mtgoat666]

RFClark - 2-23-2022 at 06:53 AM

Pacificobob,

Generally, I feel that Boeing designs and builds the best large transport AC in the world. That said their AC have not been w/o any flaws and poor design features over the years! The original 727s had several losses and near losses as a result of both the primary and emergency power systems running in the same conduit to the Flight Engineer’s station! Then there was the 737 rudder boost valve issue that went on for years and resulted in a few losses. Speaking of tail strikes there was that Japanese commuter 747 that was lost after being incorrectly repaired by Boeing because of a tail strike.

Boeing 7 series AC have always had black boxes attached to the flight control system designed to deal with specific flight issues. Originally these BBs were stand alone analog computers that monitored ram and static air pressure to rase the nose if the speed approached a critical value (tuck) or shake the stick if the air speed approached stall speed.

The AC and these safety system require reliable ram and static air pressure to operate. They also need alternate sources for back up. Without them a loss is almost inevitable! As the French and Air Bus demonstrated.

This brings us to the MAX! Ultimately the crew have the final responsibility for AC safety and need, for better or worse to be able to control the AC. This includes overriding the black boxes that are there to “help” them fly the AC and can kill them if they have issues. It was and is the responsibility of Boeing to have straight forward methods to deal with these systems and to inform the flight crew about them.

This seems not to have been the case with the MAX! The “why” doesn’t matter to the dead! Boeing didn’t do their job!