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terrybird - 4-6-2005 at 07:11 PM

I just got hit bigtime at me e-mail address by someone, and all or most of you may be involved. If you get any e-mail from a tobyrds it was sent by somebody with access to this site. Sorry for the inconvenience I pray I was the only one affected. :wow:

Ken Bondy - 4-6-2005 at 07:12 PM

I got about 40 of them.

Bruce R Leech - 4-6-2005 at 07:18 PM

I learned my lesson a long time ago on that one I check all mail before downloading and opening. how did you Know it was connected to the Nomad forum?

terrybird - 4-6-2005 at 07:18 PM

Ew! I got 60, sorry to hear that. I hope it is over.

David K - 4-6-2005 at 07:33 PM

Well... what seems to have happened is one person (maybe more) wanted off Ted's (Baja Talk Radio) Mexico news e-letter. However, instead of following the easily seen remove instructions (at the bottom of Ted's news letter), that person(s) hit 'reply all' and his complaint flooded everyone's email... then more followed suit... Before I knew how big this list was, I responded to a reply all from Marla, explaining who to contact... that went to all, as well... before I knew it was a LOT! Using Blind Carbon Copy BCc would have prevented this, I think...

Here is a sample of the responding:

[Mexicovisitor] Please take me off your list.

Show me where I called YOU an idiot?

But anyway. We're unlikely to convince the twit running mexicovisitor.com
that adding a bunch of people to a mailing list without their permission is
not a good idea. He's obviously a spammer.

The best bet would be for those of you who are annoyed enough to contact the
web hosting service who are running the mail server sending all these
message out:

NETHERE INC.
***********
**********
*********
**********

Someone in San Diego please give ******* a call and inform him that
one of his clients has filled a mailing list with stolen email addresses and
is bugging the chit out of a bunch of innocent people.

Patrick, please arrange a meeting with the owner of mexicovisitor.com and
introduce him to Mr ClueBat.

Thanks,

On Apr 6, 2005, at 3:43 PM, ****** wrote:

> These are not coming from Me. For some reason I am on the receiving
> end of Mexico visitors crap so don't call me an idiot e-mail them at
> www.mexicovisitor.com and all them idiots.
>
> ----- Original Message ----- From: *****
> To: <mexicovisitor-list@lists.mexicovisitor.com>
> Sent: Wednesday, April 06, 2005 1:07 PM
> Subject: Re: [Mexicovisitor] Please take me off your list.
>
>
>>
>> Could you idiots please stop sending "remove us" messages to the list.

[Edited on 4-7-2005 by David K]

Bruce R Leech - 4-6-2005 at 08:07 PM

wow that is strange

jeans - 4-6-2005 at 08:07 PM

Blind CC is not applicable in this instance. Ted was using a listserve and it was functioning properly. However, it is intended for groups who want to interact with each other and it was the wrong format for his newsletter.

I was one of the first to reply with "what's going on?" when I got the first communications, then the flood started and I realized what had happened. Ted must have two addresses for me because I got TWO of everything. I called his cell and left a message.

It was almost funny to see post after post of people who just did not "get" it...and the ones who were trying to make others "get" it. Tempers were starting to flare.

All in all I think it was an innocent mistake on Ted's part.

[Edited on 4-7-2005 by jeans]

spam

terrybird - 4-6-2005 at 08:13 PM

After looking at it I see it came from (mexico visitor), Ted. I hope that was the only flurry. hell, Ted was going to send me a T-shirt maybe now I will get 60

terrybird - 4-6-2005 at 08:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by grover

David K - 4-6-2005 at 09:01 PM

Ted's email about the spamming duplicated here:
---------- ---------- -------------- -------------- ------------- ------------
Hi Keri,
I am so sorry for what is happening/happened. I had no idea and from the emails I just checked I can see there is a huge problem. I think my webhost was hacked, but not sure.

I am in Acapulco at a tradeshow to promote Baja Talk Radio and MexicoVisitor, but will call my webhost in San Diego early in the morning to take care of this. I am taking eveyone off the list and will not use an email update again.

Once again I am so sorry for all the problems and in no way would I ever do this intentionally. I am not a spammer, just wanted to get the word out.

Ted

[Edited on 4-7-2005 by David K]

Ted Donavan just sent me this. Please read

Keri - 4-6-2005 at 09:02 PM

Hi Keri

I am so sorry for what is happening/happened. I had no idea and from the emails I just checked I can see there is a huge problem. I think my webhost was hacked, but not sure.

I am in Acapulco at a tradeshow to promote Baja Talk Radio and MexicoVisitor, but will call my webhost in San Diego early in the morning to take care of this. I am taking eveyone off the list and will not use an email update again.

Once again I am so sorry for all the problems and in no way would I ever do this intentionally. I am not a spammer, just wanted to get the word out.

Ted

David K - 4-6-2005 at 10:22 PM

TED SAID: "Once again I am so sorry for all the problems and in no way would I ever do this intentionally. I am not a spammer, just wanted to get the word out."

It is too bad you think Ted is being untruthful... Having met him at The Baja Cactus Cultural Fiesta, and twice been an on-air guest on his Internet radio show, I believe I may 'know him' a little more than you... Don't be so hard on a guy who is very enthusiastic about promoting Baja and brings many interesting people to our listening pleasure. Baja Nomad gets over 8,000 different visitors a month, so promoting his show here (and the other message boards) has got to be a great and effective way to enlighten us Baja nuts about future shows... many of great interest or assistance to us all.

Natalie Ann - 4-6-2005 at 10:27 PM

Lucky me - I received several hundred of these emails. I ran out of amusing thoughts about it soon as my email boxes filled up and I had to sit here for 3 hours straight deleting every email that came in, just to make room for the email I wanted. I did write to the site - their very first email gave a place to ask questions or make complaints - but got no response whatsoever. Also wrote Ted and figured out he was away.

Then a solution occured to me.... pretty easy, check the Properties/Details.
This shows you the trail from which the emails were sent; and you find a listing for abuse@nethere.com. Send an email to them briefly explaining the problem along with copies of several of the emails you're receiving.
This should alert the server to the fact of what is happening..... be sure to mention that you never signed up to be on this mailing list. Sure hope this puts an end to it.

David K - 4-6-2005 at 10:31 PM

Thanks Natalie...

I wonder why some got so many? You would think I would get the most, but I might have gotten 60 max, and all except a couple (from known friends) went right to my junk mail box (you gotta love MSN email, if nothing else from Bill Gates)!

David K don't defend an obvious ploy

The Gull - 4-6-2005 at 10:32 PM

Yeah, I didn't know the gun was loaded either.

In this day and age, there are no mistakes like this on the Internet, especially from people who make communications their livelihood.

The dude isn't credible.

Natalie Ann - 4-6-2005 at 10:44 PM

Don't know why I got so many either, David. Perhaps because I'm such a popular woman.

While I am not angry with Ted - I realize he would not do this on purpose - but I did lose an entire afternoon of work time, which put me in quite a p***y mood by afternoon's end. When Ted's back I'll be talking with him; still don't get how this happened.

The good part? I (finally) figured out how to get my email program to block mail by SUBJECT, not people/places it's from. So now I have a new skill to add to my limited resume of computer skills. :spingrin:

David K - 4-6-2005 at 10:48 PM

But Gull, he was in Acapulco attending a trade show when this happened... So blame his web host or ???

In the days of my Viva Baja events, I only had WebTV for emailing invitations and updates... There is no 'blind carbon copy' feature on WebTV... A couple people (as in this case) hit 'Reply All' instead of Reply (only to the sender) in their responces or comments and one person added the list to his email for sending out jokes or whatever...

Anyway, it wasn't my fault that person used 'reply-all'.... as it wasn't Ted's. I since added a big warning to the bottom of my mass emailings to not spam your fellow Baja amigos or use their emails. Everyone understood, and all ended well... I do have a computer now as well as the WebTV.

How so many more folks got on his email is unknown to me, but at the bottom is the feature to be removed from the list.

I think Ted is credible and certainly wouldn't do anything to pee off the people he wants to be friends with or provide information for... IMHO.

Price - 4-7-2005 at 02:02 AM

I just got home from work - had 65 of these e-mails - none even addressed to my e-mail address !!!!!! BIG PAIN IN THE A__!!!!! :fire:

Today's Posts - 4/5

Price - 4-7-2005 at 02:21 AM

Just realized I had read Ted's post yesterday - and - today am flooded with junk - I am computer challenged - how did this happen ?? :?:

mulege marv - 4-7-2005 at 06:15 AM

yes i believe it was hacked as recieved 100 messages in my email this morning, all spam !

BajaNomad - 4-7-2005 at 06:34 AM

As Jeans stated, Ted was using a mailing list as a newsletter - but it was left in a condition to allow anyone on the list to reply to everyone else (instead of a one-way communication).

One person yesterday replied with a remove request (instead of following the remove instructions at the bottom of each email that was sent), and then it became a snowball of everyone on the list replying "hey, what's with all this email"... and worse.

One of the replies was some travel agency on the list viewing it as an opportunity - and THEY then spammed the list with a commercial message.

Ick.

Anyway, it didn't appear to be a hacker opening up the mailing list, just a mailing list that wasn't administered properly. Again, that's the way it appears from this side of things.

--
Doug

email spam

Steve in Oro Valley - 4-7-2005 at 07:32 AM

How did they get my email address??

I am very carefull about this. I have given my email out to only a few people(over the last few years) on amigos and the nomad forums.

David K. and Oso are the only two I can think of that I may have given my email to. Oh yeah, and that other (Bajanet) message board requires that I give them one to read and participate.

It could have been someone else that mined the system for my email address. Thanks to Norton Antispam, the emails seem to have stopped.

Steve in Oro Valley

David K - 4-7-2005 at 07:48 AM

Fear not Steve or anyone on my email book... I do not share your emails, without your knowledge. In fact, if someone wants your email from me, I will contact you first and let you know who... that way you decide.

elgatoloco - 4-7-2005 at 08:26 AM

It's the internet. chit happens. If you REALLY think someone in Ted's position would do something like this on purpose then flame away. I think it was a MISTAKE.

Give the guy the benefit of the doubt. As much time as we all waste on 'the internets' is it REALLY that big a deal? Think about the people being slaughtered in the Sudan.

So we had to hit delete 60 or 70 times. We all made it through and no one really got hurt?

If it turns out Ted did it on purpose then I will NEVER post again on this or any other of 'the internets'. :yawn:

Bob H - 4-7-2005 at 08:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by elgatoloco
It's the internet. sh-t happens. If you REALLY think someone in Ted's position would do something like this on purpose then flame away. I think it was a MISTAKE.

Give the guy the benefit of the doubt. As much time as we all waste on 'the internets' is it REALLY that big a deal? Think about the people being slaughtered in the Sudan.

So we had to hit delete 60 or 70 times. We all made it through and no one really got hurt?

If it turns out Ted did it on purpose then I will NEVER post again on this or any other of 'the internets'. :yawn:

WOW - well said! Hitting the delete button is pretty darn easy. Remember, we all make mistakes - this one seems pretty minor if you ask me - especially now that it will get resolved (or already has been resolved).
Bob H

Emails

meme - 4-7-2005 at 08:53 AM

I agree! BIG Mistake unfortunatley for TED!
He would have to be going NUTS to do this to his business on purpose!!

Let's get it straight

The Gull - 4-7-2005 at 09:14 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K
But Gull, he was in Acapulco attending a trade show when this happened... So blame his web host or ???

Anyway, it wasn't my fault that person used 'reply-all'.... as it wasn't Ted's. I since added a big warning to the bottom of my mass emailings to not spam your fellow Baja amigos or use their emails. Everyone understood, and all ended well... I do have a computer now as well as the WebTV.

Who is responsible for this? OJ? Micheal Jackson? Bush? NO!

At the very heart of this condition in America, i.e., "You can't blame me" is the kind of rationalization which appear in above posts. He's a good guy, people make mistakes, hey it didn't hurt, I like him, he would be crazy to do it...excuses for the initial act that was wrong. All these excuses and more for the taking...all free...all too common.

Here is what was wrong...someone, I would not care to find out, used some of our e-mail addresses WITHOUT OUR CONSENT. Is that clear, David? That started the snowball. Not the "reply all" singsong.

The UNAUTHORIZED use of someone's E-mail.

If someone, again I could care less, wants to admit to doing that, then responsibility has found a home and that person has connected the dots. In an American society in days of old, that was the standard and we all have the obligation to hold to that integrity standard, no matter what the sliding scale of society offers as a salve to the pain of personal accountability.

Got it yet, David? If one cannot stand up for their actions, then Martha Stewart, OJ, Darlene Druyan, Robert Blake, Micheal Jackson, and Mr. Peterson were all falsely accused and only for the sake of arguement some of them got lucky, some not. The first act was the wrong act.

bajaandy - 4-7-2005 at 09:26 AM

As Natalie Ann has said, it's a simple process of configuring your email program to filter the subject line. I used the keyword [mexicovisitor] as the filter. Once this issue gets corrected, the filter can be removed if necessary.

Natalie Ann - 4-7-2005 at 09:54 AM

Yep, Andy, that worked perfectly. Unfortunately some of are not very computer literate - figuring out that was an option took me a long time. Doing it was easy.

One thing I would like to clear up, though. A rough count this a.m. was 357 deleted emails I'd received regarding this. On the original email at the bottom there were a couple of links - only one of which would unsubscribe. I now see that each time I APPROPRIATELY clicked the "correct" link, I received a new radio announcement from the MXVisitors place - which triggered another round of the exact same emails from others on their list.

It ended shortly after I reported the mailings to the "abuse" address for the MXVisitors site. That simply alerted the server of what was happening; I did state I thought the errors were inadvertent and asked for their assistance in contacting the MXVisitor site.

And of course Ted did not mean for us to be spammed big time. He's a real good guy. It just became a comedy of errors. And I don't have room in my aging body to house angry feelings towards anyone. We're all here to learn.

theBajabum - 4-7-2005 at 11:45 AM

I think everyone needs to cut TED and co. poquito slack.
Blame here....blame there.......
I'm guessing this it the first time it's happened and it will die down soon.

Drink Tequila and be happy
Nimodo gente :smug:

David K - 4-7-2005 at 11:16 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Gull

Quote:

Mr. Gull, please don't compare Ted to the above list of people... as I wouldn't remain silent if someone accused you of the same... We all may not have yet met, but we are part of a family here... Baja Nomads. Sure there are a few bad Nomads in this bunch, but Ted isn't one... and neither are you from what I gathered from reading your posts over the years.

I value Baja Talk Radio, more than wanting to keep a grudge over a day of deleting unwanted emails... You can bet that when Ted returns from his business trip, he will do everything he can to remedy this folly.

So, be angry if you must, but allow him to make ammends. No murder, tax fraud, or child rape occured because of Ted's web site mistake. Do you still want to punish him? Well, Corona is one his sponsors... So, drink Pacifico or Dos Equis instead!

Wonders of the Internet Connective Zone Never Cease to Amaze me...

SO - 4-8-2005 at 05:04 AM

Now that I am coming out of my self induced retirement coma, I once again manage close to 100 individual emails a day, especially over the past few months, and then there is the 300 or more spam and the craziness of the listserve kind a day to filter, so I set up filters to help me from going real Maddog crazy.

Oh thank heaven for being able to hike and take a break from it all, as the craziness of our people helper computers can and will drive you crazy if you let it get to you. Will watch what listserves I sign up for in Baja when I make it down south tranquility zone way. I will still listen to Baja Talk Radio no matter if I get spammed. Haven't checked that other email yet today.

I have listened to Baja Talk Radio, find it very enjoyable when I can find time to listen in, and would not ever bang my noodle to much over a day of deleting unwanted listserve emails... If you sign up or are in the web expect that if it is human related, it will happen to you sooner or later.

As said above, I'm sure Ted (whom I have never met) will quickly return as mentioned from his business trip, and if he is a real biz person that cares about his audience, which I think he is, he will do what he can to recover his CFC (Customer Focused Company) kind of guy image, as he probably will bend over the coals and hot flaming fire to do everything he can to remedy this mistake that is made by many a content provider, as I have done the same long long ago. As CEO, I would fly to meet the people to recover from any error, as it is important to admit mistakes and correct them. We all make mistakes... SO I will sign up to the receive Baja Talk Radio emails and set my filters to just receive one email if it is the same.

To be smarter than the tool u are using is never easy, especially when it comes to personal computers.

Have a good weekend all, if you can. :biggrin:

RandyMacSC/SO
(soon to be back into one screen name personality (he he) by Doug's help, as I made a mistake recently signing on to Baja Nomad; two names which is not allowed and I should have been more aware, and I will flog myself for it)

[Edited on 4-8-2005 by SO]

[Edited on 4-8-2005 by SO]

Now if I could only get off the 6 at dinner phone spam list?

SO - 4-8-2005 at 05:34 AM

Hello, can I talk to the owner?

"Owner, what owner, I am a just burgular who touches everything that rings a bell. The owner is not home right now, please call back later, and if you don't get an answer, I have the owner's number in my bag."

Humor them if you can, cause allowing the stress inside the noodle zone will shave those wonderful days in Baja Nomadsville off your life, if you let it.

"Okay, Telus Mobility take me off your call at dinner time list or I'll wack something close to me."

RandyMacSC/SO
(crazy Canadian gone Baja Nomad, and planning to live to 150 or more, if I can stay focused and positive long enough, as the final 75 I will spend in tranquility with my second home base in a nice little hunk of heaven in Baja California when I find the time.

:lol:

[Edited on 4-8-2005 by SO]

David, thank you for the reply

The Gull - 4-8-2005 at 10:52 AM

...but you have not responded to the basic issue

Someone and I did not mention names in my last message (so do not get your underwear in a bunch) DID NOT GET PERMISSION TO USE MOST OF THE E-MAIL ADDRESSES. THAT MAKES IT SPAM.

You defend someone (no names on my part) has the right to UNAUTHORIZED USE OF E-MAIL addresses, just because you like him/her? :no:

If yes, then I leave this thread to you. :fire:

If no, then advise someone (your acquaintance) that the protocol of apologizing begins with the demonstration that he/she will not use this UNAUTHORIZED method of communication again. :biggrin:

Your acquaintence can send me two cases of Corona. I know some stupid people who will trade me one case of Pacifico for two cases of Corona.

Check out another Nomad's opinion on this: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=9800#pid74111

[Edited on 4-8-2005 by The Gull]

theBajabum - 4-8-2005 at 11:01 AM

Nimodo

Baja Bernie - 4-8-2005 at 12:00 PM

This whole thing concerned me when I got the first 200 but then I talked to someone knowledgeable and followed his instructions and unsubsrcribed my self and the problem was eliminated. I had sent Ted a slightly nasty email about what was going on AND I now feel foolish for doing so.
I know that I never make mistakes and I read one or two others who don't either---When I learned what was going on and how it happened all I did was learn a little more about this crazy machine that I pretend I know how it works.
It was a mistake as far as I'm concerned--and I did learn something from it.

Spammer gets 9 years in prison

The Gull - 4-8-2005 at 04:26 PM

LEESBURG, Va. - A man convicted in the nation's first felony case against illegal spamming was sentenced to nine years in prison Friday for bombarding Internet users with millions of junk e-mails.

However, Loudoun County Circuit Judge Thomas Horne delayed the start of Jeremy Jaynes' prison term while the case is appealed, saying the law is new and raises constitutional questions.

A jury had recommended the nine-year term for the Raleigh, N.C., man.

Jaynes, 30, who was considered among the top 10 spammers in the world at the time of his arrest, used the Internet to peddle pornography and sham products and services such as a "FedEx refund processor," prosecutors said. Thousands of people fell for his e-mails, and prosecutors said Jaynes' operation grossed up to $750,000 per month.

Jaynes was convicted in November for using false Internet addresses and aliases to send mass e-mail ads through an AOL server in Loudoun County, where America Online is based. Under Virginia law, sending unsolicited bulk e-mail itself is not a crime unless the sender masks his identity.

While prosecutors presented evidence of just 53,000 illegal e-mails, authorities believe Jaynes was responsible for spewing out 10 million e-mails a day. Prosecutors said Jaynes made millions of dollars from the illegal venture.

Prosecutor Lisa Hicks-Thomas said she was pleased with the ruling and confident that the law would be upheld on appeal.

But defense attorney David Oblon argued that nine years was far too long given that Jaynes was charged as an out-of-state resident with violating a Virginia law that had taken effect just weeks before. He planned to challenge both the constitutionality of the law, as well as its applicability to Jaynes.

"We have no doubt that we will win on appeal, therefore any sentence is somewhat moot. Still, the sentence is not what we recommended and we're disappointed," Oblon said outside court.

Horne said he might also reconsider the sentence if Jaynes loses the appeal.

"I do not believe a person should go to prison for a law that is invalid," he said. "There are substantial legal issues that need to be brought before the appellate court."

A judge has ruled Maryland's anti-spam law unconstitutional because it seeks to regulate commerce outside the state's borders. However, an appeals court in California and the Washington state Supreme Court have upheld state laws that had been declared unconstitutional by lower courts on grounds similar to the December ruling in Maryland.

Many states have criminal laws against spam, but Virginia's makes it easier than others for prosecutors to obtain a felony conviction, which carries more jail time than a misdemeanor, said Quinn Jalli of the online marketing firm Digital Impact.

Jaynes told the judge that regardless of how the appeal turns out, "I can guarantee the court I will not be involved in the e-mail marketing business again." He remains under $1 million bond.

The jury also convicted Jaynes's sister, Jessica DeGroot, but recommended only a $7,500 fine. Her conviction was later dismissed by the judge. A third defendant, Richard Rutkowski of Cary, N.C., was acquitted of all charges.

David K - 4-8-2005 at 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by The Gull
...but you have not responded to the basic issue

Someone and I did not mention names in my last message (so do not get your underwear in a bunch) DID NOT GET PERMISSION TO USE MOST OF THE E-MAIL ADDRESSES. THAT MAKES IT SPAM.

You defend someone (no names on my part) has the right to UNAUTHORIZED USE OF E-MAIL addresses, just because you like him/her? :no:

If yes, then I leave this thread to you. :fire:

If no, then advise someone (your acquaintance) that the protocol of apologizing begins with the demonstration that he/she will not use this UNAUTHORIZED method of communication again. :biggrin:

Thank you Gull... on that point you are correct...
I think the o.k. thing to do is to post (here on the Internet message boards) a request to all, asking IF you would like to get his free Mexico newsletter... Not send it to every email and expect those who don't want them to 'unsubscribe'.

Have a great weekend... I am going to Baja Sunday for a drive south of Tecate and over to La Mision, then a dinner a Chela's or ?? :bounce:

David K - 4-8-2005 at 05:57 PM

I think asking a question, pertaining to Baja or Baja Nomads is quite acceptable IMHO. If his newsletter was not free, then naturally he should post the question in the classified ads section here... (again, in my humble opinion).

Have a great weekend Lencho!

David

The Gull - 4-8-2005 at 06:20 PM

La Perlita across the street from Chela's.

Bob H - 4-8-2005 at 06:35 PM

It amazes me how some people get so riled at something so minor - this is such a small case - just delete the 40 or so emails and realize that this was just a simple mistake! We are not talking about a major spam case here. I really think Ted had good intensions to spread the news of Baja. Wow.
Bob H
PS: Ugh, I usually don't get involved in controversy, but I just had to vent on this one.

Debra - 4-8-2005 at 08:42 PM

Wow! I'm glad that I'm too much of a computer dummie to have done whatever happened to cause this 'spamming'!......I didn't get a one.

WHOOPS! Did I just paint a big red target on my forehead? :biggrin:

Must be a slow "news day" (2 pages?, Sheese!)

Bill Gates cant even put out a foolproof

Hook - 4-8-2005 at 10:49 PM

operating system and some are chastising this guy for not knowing every nuance of the internet.

Give the guy a break!

Hook

The Gull - 4-9-2005 at 06:53 AM

Using someone's e-mail address without their permission is not a nuance. It is a felony when associated with mass mailing.

The reference to Bill Gates is a non-sequiter.

If you don't care, fine! One court in our land has chosen to decide not "to turn the other cheek". (see above post)

:yes:

My buddy gets drunk and drives a car. When he makes it home, we all say "that's old buddy" and go about our business. Buddy drives drunk nearly all the time because everyone likes buddy and we all look the other way. How long will it be before something unplanned and undesired happens with or to buddy? You want to score this action, "no harm no foul?" We feel comfortable with our dual standard allowing buddy the grace to drink and drive, as long as he doesn't kill one of my kids on the road.

Now, hit the delete key in this all too complex Internet world.

[Edited on 4-9-2005 by The Gull]