BajaNomad

Cabo San Lucas Angler Licenses

CaboMagic - 4-30-2005 at 03:17 PM

Hi folks,
Licenses is a confusing and frustrating issue for us as well as for visitors.
We do not make the rules, we do however follow them. AND sometimes there canbe a problem with translation - huh? Yes there are times when the same question gets a dfiferent answer by PESCA. Sort of like when you call the IRS in the USA ... hmmmm.
There are BOAT Fishing licenses and ANGLER Fishing Licenses.
All boats must have valid BOAT Fishing licenses on board.
ALL PASSENGERS, on all boats that have fishing tackle/gear aboard, must have a VALID Angler Fishing License on board.
That means even someone who has come along for the ride, and will never touch any piece of equipment must have an ANGLER Fishing license too.
We have told folks time and again that there is a STAMP that must be on all local angler fishing licenses .. By STAMP we dont mean the 'lick&stick" or "Self-adhesive" kinds, we mean the kind that Mexico uses for every document and piece of paper .. Remember when you enter Mexico and the Immigration Official STAMPS (with an old fashioned inkpad gizmo) your tourist visa with His/Her Stamp showing Date, Time and Location? Might also have their name on it .. In any event, and in THIS EVENT, the local PESCA STAMP is what we are referring to. I have sent an email to Pam at Baja Big Fish in Loreto to see if a LORETO PESCA STAMP is on all of their Angler Licenses ...
We have always required every passenger on board to have a valid LOCAL Angler Fishing License - well before they began the recent practice of randonly boarding boats and checking for ALL licenses ... We will not permit any boat to depart the marina aboard one of our charters without them .. not for eleven dollars. It surely is not worth the penalites, nor the embarassment either, to save those dollars. We dont charge a service or processing fee for them either - we sell them to our clients for exactly what we pay for them. Some local charter companies use it as a money making opportunity - charge fourteen dollars for each license that cost them the equivalent of eleven ... To each their own ...
Our Cabo San Lucas office is on the same street as the new PESCA office. Their hours of operation are not always predictable and sometimes it is difficult to understand why .. Thats why we plan ahead and buy these licenses in bulk .. Sometimes we have to gulp when handing over Two thousand two hundred dollars to PESCA for 200 daily licenses but we prefer to be prepared.
Thank you Bernie Swaim for your always ready extended hand of friendship .. you are a gem ...
Lori Garcia

Bruce R Leech - 4-30-2005 at 03:37 PM

all licenses and permits sold in Mexico have the stamp. so why is it an issue? if you bye a license from some one and it doesn't have the stamp then they are selling the licenses illegally.

CaboMagic - 4-30-2005 at 04:39 PM

Its obviously not an issue for you Bruce.

It is an ongoing issue for visitors to our area, Cabo San Lucas, who purchase San Diego for what they are told is a license that will be valid in all parts of Mexico.

Ethan "Pascuale" posted an incorrect interpretation of my email to him.

the post I made is meant to clarify.

Thank yo for your input.

Osprey - 4-30-2005 at 05:53 PM

Cabo Magic Lori

Still not clear. A guy buys an Annual Mexican Fishing license from a tackle shop in San Diego. The shop bought the licenses in bulk, charges $42.70. the same as the Pesca offices anywhere in Mexico. He drives to Loreto, Mulege, San Felipe, wherever. Is he legal or not? Are you saying that Cabo San Lucas Pesca office wants the license to bear a Mexican stamp? How would the guy get his license stamped? How much would he pay? He has already paid to fish anywhere in Mexico. It has nothing to do with a boat. He owns no boat. He simply pays to fish from a boat.
Thanks,
I'll wait for your reply.

BajaNomad - 4-30-2005 at 05:58 PM

I'm gettin' the drift that what they are communicating is the CSL office, right or wrong, is requiring a stamp from the CSL office.

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by BajaNomad]

CaboMagic - 4-30-2005 at 06:18 PM

Thanks Doug for measuring in. That is the message.
We do not make the rules we follow the rules as given to us for guests to fish in our waters aboard any CABO MAGIC Team Vessel.
I respectfully refer you to the PESCA Office in Cabo San Lucas where you can discuss this until clear.
I cannot comment to the requirements in any other part of Mexico - I am stating what the PESCA Office in Cabo San Lucas has told us as recently as Wednesday 27 April 2005. Any guest aboard any boat that departs the marina in Cabo San Lucas must have a current and valid license from Cabo San Lucas.

stamps

pascuale - 4-30-2005 at 06:26 PM

Hey lori,

You need to be more clear about alot of things and get your facts straight. I bought a license from Pam in Loreto not in San Diego, and it has a stamp on it displaying the time and date so any official will know when it was purchased. One day licenses all have them so you know they are only one day. One year licenses have them so you know that they expire one year from the day they were issued. I recieved mine from Pam Bolles and her awesome operation that was much more helpful in everyway than Cabo Magic. if you cant explain the facts then your gonna lose alot of business. I understand what you are trying to accomplish but you need to find out the problem with the Cabo Pesca because they are giving out false information. A year long license WORKS ANYWHERE in MEXICO!

Ethan "Pascuale"

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by pascuale]

Bruce R Leech - 4-30-2005 at 06:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by CaboMagic
Its obviously not an issue for you Bruce.

It is an ongoing issue for visitors to our area, Cabo San Lucas, who purchase San Diego for what they are told is a license that will be valid in all parts of Mexico.

Ethan "Pascuale" posted an incorrect interpretation of my email to him.

the post I made is meant to clarify.

Thank yo for your input.


sorry I did not realize that were selling licenses in the us that are illegal . If they don't have the ruber stamp imprint they are illegal here also.

Do any of you Nomads have the non stamped Licenses? if so you had better bye a new one.

if any one Wants to sell you one of those tell them they are not legal down here and don't pay.

thanks CaboMagic for alerting us to this problem

CaboMagic - 4-30-2005 at 06:31 PM

Ethan I have refunded your $70.00 and invite you to take your business elsewhere. *We are charged $3 to process your echeck and $3 to refund your $10 per hour deposit paid by you on April 22nd*
Your license from Pam in Loreto has the LORETO PESCA STAMP ON IT.

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by CaboMagic]

Hey

Baja Bernie - 4-30-2005 at 06:32 PM

I ain't no silly fisher-person but anybody what's been in Baja for little more than a minute has learned that the rules are Federal but the spin on them is always definitely local.
I wouldn't take one of those big, expensive, boats out without making sure that the 'locals' would be happy that I was following 'their' rules.

Here is rule number one for me and my friends---"Baja is Friends helping Friends."

Tommy and Lori Garcia are two of the nicest people I have NEVER met--And that is Baja too!

CaboMagic - 4-30-2005 at 06:37 PM

Tommy & Lori Garcia's
CABO MAGIC Sportfishing Keeping it reel ? 2000
FISH know CABO MAGIC and PENN TACKLE are the TEAM to get HOOKED ON ? 2000
First Class ~ Affordable ~ Experience It ~
Visit us online www.cabomagic.com
Setting New Standards in Cabo San Lucas since 1999
Home of the Original Daily Catch Report
Call us in Cabo San Lucas
Tollfree from the USA /Canada
Dial 888-475-5337
Local Tel/Fax 10-50403
CABO MAGIC ~ Always a Leader .


[Edited on 5-1-2005 by CaboMagic]

Reeljob - 4-30-2005 at 06:51 PM

Well, I'll reiterate. The Fishing License's that I bought (helped some friends buy) in Cabo San Lucas were EXACTLY Like the license I purchased at Fishermans landing in San Diego.

There is no extra or geographical "Stamp" on the license and the port captain, who happened to have a bunch of fellows with AK47's stopping ALL boats leaving the harbor, accepted my license just like they accepted the ones just purchased at the Pesca office in Cabo.

pascuale - 4-30-2005 at 10:31 PM

Good luck with your business and thank you for my refund.

mrchuck - 5-1-2005 at 07:25 AM

Lori, since you ARE THE OWNER, and since your Business Office is only 3 doors away from the Pesca office in CSL, it is mandatory that you, the business owner, get over there immediately, with an interpeter with you, in case the Pesca official tries the "no comprende" routine. Also take in David Flores, the editor of the "Gringo Gazette" newspaper.
Then ask the questions to them!

The daily Federal Mexican fishing license cost is 11 dollars, we all agree. This is helpful for the fishermen who fly in without any license at all and can get one thru the charter company.
BUT, an annual Mexican Federal Fishing License, that most Baja travelers get in San Diego at their local fishing supply store, or the same annual license the residents and people who reside in Mexico get in La Paz, CSL, at the PESCA office, ARE ALL THE SAME!
. I repeat, all Mexican Federal licenses are the same.
There IS NO LEGAL extra 11 dollars SURCHARGE needed to pay for one who chooses to fish out of CABO SAN LUCAS,provided you already have a valid Mexican Federal annual license.
PERIOD.

Since you are a "extranjero" doing business in CSL, IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY AS A BUSINESS OWNER to go get the accurate info from PESCA.
And remember, Pesca is only a few doors away, you say!

What will be the answer? I expect that it will all be a mis-understanding, that yes, all the annual Mexican licenses are valid, whereever legally purchased!

Saludos,,,,mc

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by mrchuck]

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by mrchuck]

Bruce R Leech - 5-1-2005 at 08:03 AM

what info do you want . it is simple if you bought a license or permit that dose not have a official rubber stamp imprint on it . you don't have a valid license or permit any where in Mexico. what could be more clear.

I sale Licenses here in Mulege and they all must be this way. don't bye a Bogus license from some one that doesn't have the official rubber stamp.

CaboMagic - 5-1-2005 at 09:15 AM

I appreciate your input Mr Chuck as well.

My responsibility is to follow the rules. We are required to have a valid angler fishing license on boats for each and every person on board. And we do without exception.

I cannot offer an explanation why there have been licneses rejected by the CSL PESCA office previously - I just know they have been.

All of these young men with their AK47's who are given the responsibility of checking documetnation may or may not know how to read - - might that have an effect as to their acceptance or rejection of any paperwork?

Surely you have experienced personally in all your years of living in BCS that which could only be explained off as 'ni modo' ...

Over the last 2+years, commencing right around when an American boat owner who has a charter boat irritated the local PESCA officials by writing a lenghty report about Licenses that was posted on an unreal number of discussion boards, Gene Kiras fish report and many other places, calling Mexican nationals and PESCA Officials unflattering terms, and, specfiically complained about one local official, there have been a multitude of 'crackdowns' by many officials who benefit from the economics of enforcement ... We never forget that this is Mexico and not Newport South. There are no plans to change, rather, will continue to do what we do how we do it, as we are supportive and supported for our business practices and ethics.

That there is a misunderstanding because of a level of comprehension, or kneejerk reaction to our policies and/or procedures, will not affect our business practices either.

I offered for Ethan to have his license checked and "ok'd" by PESCA. Unfortunately his interepretation of my words seemed to twist what I said and I offered the clairification.

We know that there are those who are perfectly happy paying $14 for a license that costs $11 .. We know as well there are those who fail to understand what supporting the unlicensed brokers that wander town and the marina really does. We accept that we cannot make everyone happy all of the time, and that despite and inspite of all best efforts, there will be misunderstandings and unhappy clients ...

As Bernie pointed out in a private email, this is not something that happens very often. Still every time it comes up, I will continue to refer clients to the PESCA office to have their license checked. Why? Because on the off-chance that the wind has changed direction, and brought a change to the answer to that same question, we wont be the ones with guests fish being confiscated, or with trying to explain to a visitor what happened

Thank you everyone for your opinions and input.

Lori Garcia

.

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by CaboMagic]

Bruce R Leech - 5-1-2005 at 10:00 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by mrchuck
Lori, since you ARE THE OWNER, and since your Business Office is only 3 doors away from the Pesca office in CSL, it is mandatory that you, the business owner, get over there immediately, with an interpeter with you, in case the Pesca official tries the "no comprende" routine. Also take in David Flores, the editor of the "Gringo Gazette" newspaper.
Then ask the questions to them!

The daily Federal Mexican fishing license cost is 11 dollars, we all agree. This is helpful for the fishermen who fly in without any license at all and can get one thru the charter company.
BUT, an annual Mexican Federal Fishing License, that most Baja travelers get in San Diego at their local fishing supply store, or the same annual license the residents and people who reside in Mexico get in La Paz, CSL, at the PESCA office, ARE ALL THE SAME!
. I repeat, all Mexican Federal licenses are the same.
There IS NO LEGAL extra 11 dollars SURCHARGE needed to pay for one who chooses to fish out of CABO SAN LUCAS,provided you already have a valid Mexican Federal annual license.
PERIOD.

Since you are a "extranjero" doing business in CSL, IT IS YOUR RESPONSIBILITY AS A BUSINESS OWNER to go get the accurate info from PESCA.
And remember, Pesca is only a few doors away, you say!

What will be the answer? I expect that it will all be a mis-understanding, that yes, all the annual Mexican licenses are valid, whereever legally purchased!

Saludos,,,,mc

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by mrchuck]

[Edited on 5-1-2005 by mrchuck]


it will never cease to amaze me how people will tell you what your responsibilitys are and how to run your business when they don't have the responsibility to know what they are talking about .:lol::lol:

Although Los Cabos

jrbaja - 5-1-2005 at 12:40 PM

has made Newport Beach look like childs play when it comes to gringo tourists, I find it hard to believe that they are able to make up their own rules and ignore federal law and regulations.
I suppose anythings possible.

turtleandtoad - 5-1-2005 at 01:55 PM

I have an annual fishing license, with stamp, that I got through the Vags.

Now you're telling me I have to get another license to fish in Cabo because mine wasn't purchased locally?

How do they know where it was stamped? Does Cabo use a different stamp? :?:

pascuale - 5-1-2005 at 06:21 PM

We'll looks like Cabo is not part of Mexico and Mexican fishing licenses do not work. Ladies and gentelman, welcome to the Republic of Cabo, where fishing licenses are only $11 dollars a day, sold at your nearest Pesca office or your nearest fine fishing establishment.:lol:

Bruce R Leech - 5-1-2005 at 07:39 PM

welcome to Mexico

pascuale - 5-1-2005 at 08:22 PM

Thanks for all the info from everyone about this topic. I hope someone learned something. Bruce, you couldtnt have said it better . "Welcome to Mexico"

It's such a great place because it's so unpredictable.

....and of course a million other things too!

David K - 5-2-2005 at 08:40 AM

Too bad $11 is ruining your vacation!

Lori, just increase your boat ride fee by $11 and not try to explain Mexican politics to gringos who think the American way of fair business is practiced everywhere they vacation.

If $11 is too much, then they sure don't need to go all the way to Cabo to fish or ride a boat!

Best of luck to your business, and keep on telling us exactly what you find in Cabo, no matter if it is fair, legal, or dumb...
Afterall, one can enjoy the whole entire Baja peninsula without Cabo, as it is on the very tip... So, don't shoot the messenger (Lori), she has taken the time to post the info. here!

Local stamp issue

flyfishinPam - 5-2-2005 at 11:57 AM

I know that PESCA's policies change at whim but in Loreto any vaild Mexican fishing license is acceptable whether or not it was purchased or stamped in Loreto.

I just had a couple from LA come and fish who used annual licenses purchased in a local LA tackle shop and have stamps from BCN. Lots of guys that come here from the San Diego area have annual licenses because they fish the Mexican waters off Baja Norte, perfectly legal.

In taking a look at my own license issued in Loreto the stamp doesn't say anything about being from Loreto, it is actually half the stamp, the other half being on the internal copy in the PESCA office. And the zona de pesca is "Litoral Mexicana" which means its good any Mexican waters.

What's that office in Cabo pulling anyway?

I'm glad to finally see that in Cabo they're requiring it too as the licenses have been enforced since 1997 here and very strictly too.:cool:

pascuale - 5-2-2005 at 12:00 PM

Yeah ok,
I guess I should just let everyone take all of my money because thats the way it is in Mexico, right? Get real! Everyone should try to make all business in mexico legitamate dont you agree? It's not $11 dollars David, its the principal that someone out there is trying to make an extra buck (Not Lori or Cabo Magic) when I have paid already for a year long Mexican fishing license. I have nothing against Cabo Magic and I appreciate Lori for addressing this issue, however it could not be resolved, so....I will still fish Cabo but with someone who accepts a year long Mexican fishing license.

You guyz in Cabo can buy them in bulk??

flyfishinPam - 5-2-2005 at 12:01 PM

I sure wish we could. We cannot. We need to know the angler's names and states or residence and dates of fishing before we can buy them. Its been like that for two years now as others have abused the pre-buy method. I do charge a fee to get them as its a hassle and our time is worth charging for. I also photocopy all of them and put into client files so we have all the information to fill out the bitacoras (embarcation papers).

In looking harder at this stamp...

flyfishinPam - 5-2-2005 at 12:23 PM

...or my half of the stamp it does say "eto, B.C.S. I guess that's the second half of "Loreto" so the stamp does identify Loreto. But still its supposed to be good for any Mexican waters as it says. I remember getting Ethan his license and cannot understand why it won't work in Cabo San Lucas. I remember hearing this issue with Cabo before though..

CaboMagic - 5-2-2005 at 04:18 PM

Hi Pam! I so appreciate your jumping in too ..

As re: Ethan - I told him he could take his license in to the PESCA office for their ok, which is what I do whenever anyone comes in with a license purchased from anyone other than us ... Its not up to me to ok the license, so I defer all to the agency official to decide. Sometimes they are ok'd and sometimes not - not something I understand but, not my job ...

As I stated, Ethan misinterpreted my answer which led to 'this' thread and series of accusations and attempted clarifications. However, for whatever reason in his private email to me, he demanded a refund which we gave.

I cannot offer any explanation, reasonable or otherwise, why, other than what I have already provided .. I suspect its partly due to the aforementioned boat owners comlpaints that led to the ensuing series of events and enforcement that may or may not make sense to anyone ... and as everyone makes a point of, Cabo is 'different' in many ways. I certainly have no intention of confronting any official and insisting on an explanation of his/her 'decision'.

Yes we do buy licenses in bulk - and have been for a long time. This is perhaps another example of how the same 'agency' operates differently in Cabo than in say Loreto for example ...

Most of us want everyone to operate their businesses in a manner 'consistent' with the standards that Ethan refers to .. but this is mexico ~ ahem ...

A possible topic for another subject thread would be "Tell us about the situations you encountered where the answer to a question, or the rule changed because the wind changed direction" ...

A friend of ours in Cabo, an expat who has lived here for nearly 20 years recently shared a tale that would fit the topic nicely ... He had to travel to the USA to take care of some paperwork but needed first to update his Mexico papers ... everytime he went to the local Immigration Office they were 'out' of the particular document he needed ... what to do what to do! Needless to say, by the time he returned from the USA, they had changed the form anyway and had to start all over anyway ...

Those of us that operate a business in Mexico are quite familiar with the changing climate and attempt to be able to seamlessly accomodate our guests - We ask that visitors and guests try to understand we are not the rule makers, rather, as David K points out, the messenger ...

I never pretend to know all the answers ~ and welcome the opportunity to learn something new ... leaving room for the everchanging parameters we find ..

Thank you all for your time and understanding.

Lori Garcia

Pam

jrbaja - 5-2-2005 at 04:22 PM

I used to get multiple licenses at the Pesca offices in San Diego. I bet you could send them the money and get as many as you like.

Bruce R Leech - 5-2-2005 at 04:31 PM

even if you git the licenses you don't have the rubber stamp and that is what makes it legal.

Bruce

jrbaja - 5-2-2005 at 04:41 PM

I'm still confused about Los Cabos needing a special license or "stamp".
But, when you buy a license from the Mexican Dept. of fisheries, or any number of u.s. tackle shops, the licenses come stamped, T's crossed, I's dotted and ready to use in all Mexican waters or get lost in the luggage.
I've personally never asked for the special "Cabo" stamp and figure I would be laughed at if I asked for one at the Mexican Dept. of Fisheries.
I'm sure it is just a misunderstanding but, there is no such thing needed to fish in Mexican waters.
I wonder if that bridge is still for sale in the pesca office down there as well!:lol:

From the Dept of Fisheries point of view !!

jrbaja - 5-2-2005 at 04:48 PM

WE INVITE YOU TO PRACTICE RESPONSIBLE SPORTFISHING

Oficina de Pesca, 2550 Fifth Ave., Ste. 101, San Diego, CA 92103.

Telephone 619-233-6956; Fax 619-233-0344



Any non-resident alien 16 years or older must possess a valid Mexican Sport fishing License before fishing in Mexican waters. This license covers all types of fishing and
"is valid anywhere in Mexico."
Everyone aboard private boats in Mexican waters must have a fishing license if there is fishing gear of any kind, or fish, or fish parts on board. Licenses for people fishing on commercial sport fishing boats are normally provided by the boat operators. A fishing license is also required for underwater fishing. Fishing licenses are issued for periods of one week, one month, and one year, effective at 12:01 am on the starting date specified on the license application. The prices for Mexican fishing licenses are as follows:

Bruce R Leech - 5-2-2005 at 06:10 PM

Jr. as far as I know you are right . all the Licenses we sell here come from Mexican Dept. of fisheries. and are stamped by there official stamp. and the dept. tells me they are good in all Mexican waters.

I live in Loreto so...

flyfishinPam - 5-4-2005 at 11:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jrbaja
I used to get multiple licenses at the Pesca offices in San Diego. I bet you could send them the money and get as many as you like.



..this suggestion would be damn near impossible. Would you tie up thousands of dollars waiting for fishing licenses that may never come, or go to the local office in town and just deal with their local bull instead?:lol:
I think you have the answer.

Thanks for the Dept of Fisheries point of View

flyfishinPam - 5-4-2005 at 11:30 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jrbaja
WE INVITE YOU TO PRACTICE RESPONSIBLE SPORTFISHING

Oficina de Pesca, 2550 Fifth Ave., Ste. 101, San Diego, CA 92103.

Telephone 619-233-6956; Fax 619-233-0344



Any non-resident alien 16 years or older must possess a valid Mexican Sport fishing License before fishing in Mexican waters. This license covers all types of fishing and
"is valid anywhere in Mexico."
Everyone aboard private boats in Mexican waters must have a fishing license if there is fishing gear of any kind, or fish, or fish parts on board. Licenses for people fishing on commercial sport fishing boats are normally provided by the boat operators. A fishing license is also required for underwater fishing. Fishing licenses are issued for periods of one week, one month, and one year, effective at 12:01 am on the starting date specified on the license application. The prices for Mexican fishing licenses are as follows:


but the local Loreto PESCA office requires licenses even for children under 16 years of age if they will be fishing. They however do not require one of a passenger on the boat is not fishing! Local interpretation TODAY that may change tomorrow, no foolin'

And now that you know that the law is in the eye of the beholder

flyfishinPam - 5-4-2005 at 11:32 PM

you know that it also changes at whim. what the CSL office requires differs from what the Loreto office requires and we as operators are at the whim of whatever the hell it is they require of us. In the case that started all this, I would have done the exact same thind as Lori did, send client to the PESCA office and let PESCA office make the call. She cannot set policy only PESCA can do that and she must follow her local office's rules period.

Reeljob - 5-5-2005 at 07:09 AM

...... and I haven't ever saw a representative from the local "Pesca office" checking for licenses that they issue. In Cabo it has almost always been the Port Captain backed up by the Navy, or vice versa. On the ocean (back and forth from US to Cabo), it has always been the Navy, except for some brave Army guys out of La Salina a few years back.

Bruce R Leech - 5-5-2005 at 07:19 AM

the PESCA office dose send people to check in this aria.

And now that you know that the law is in the eye of the beholder

jrbaja - 5-5-2005 at 07:37 AM

Sheesh, I was just trying to help Pam. Didn't mean to ruffle you or your cohorts feathers. I would say that this is a crock and that you two obviously know more than the Mexican Fishing Dept.:lol::lol::lol:

So then, when I or someone is out fishing and get asked for the Mexican Fishing License, I show it to them and they say it isn't any good here, what happens then.:lol:

CaboMagic - 5-5-2005 at 08:19 AM

Good day greetings all ...
JR - I do think you enjoy stirring up a good pot-o-stuff .. not that I dont enjoy the banter you create once in a while - its an interesting break from the realities of my day ... and not that I dont think what you do isnt more often than not incredibly good hearted and deep rooted in the goodness done ...
Pam - I have always admired you and sent you private emails to that effect - Now the Nomad World knows too .. & heres why: Being a business owner/operator and a female and an american too requires nearly unimaginable tenacity, intelligence, diligence (both due and absolutely necessary and continuous followup) and larger than life patience. Keeping the business operating has its own set of 'issues' .. Keeping crews working has several perspectives to consider: Getting them work, and alos getting the TO work .. people whose soul history of tradition comes from generations and who are sometimes fine with a fish and a beer every once in a while .. vs the idea of getting up every day and working ... Now of course not every one falls within either category as that is the beauty of human-being-ness. Point being there are challenges beyond the obvious that we deal with regularly, and, for myself, until we began operating a business in Cabo in 1994 I did not consider, nor care about, any of 'these' issues.
I am going to try and address as many spoken as well as insinuated issues as I can.
As to who checks the licneses Durango: Every day we encounter something 'new'. At 6am, the Port Captain 'usually' has a manned aboat at the marina departure and every boat must hand in to that person a document (we call this a dispatch) and on this document is the name of every person aboard, including crew. Sometimes the PC Office shares this boat with someone from the PESCA office and one or both of them can, at their discretion, ask for Angler Licenses and/or any other document for that matter. Any boat not having any document asked for can be sent back to get it, or them. There are days this boat is not where it is supposed to be, and, sometimes it arrives later .. go figure ... There are also times when the Navy sets up 'shop' and randomly, or perhaps deliberately, selects boats to check. I am not privvy to know who gives them directives as to who or when to check boats - here again all I hear is WHEN it is happeneing in the marina, as news travels fast - However, because we at CABO MAGIC follos ALL the rules we are give to follow, we dont flinch or worry about these events - we do however, feel badly for guests and visitors, who are a oftentime understandably unnerved about a 'teenager with an AK47' standing in front of them while another teenager reviews paperwork. Sort of like that first experience at a Military Checkpoint - its certainly not something one would experience in the USA (I know there are even going to be arguments made here for cases where folks get pulled over by a control freak patrol officer in the boonies of some town who causes some heart palpitations) but it is something one eventually gets used to, especially those who travel the Baja Pensinsula with any regularity.
And now on to The Dept of Fisheries document - "Fishing licenses are issued for periods of one week, one month, and one year, effective at 12:01 am on the starting date specified on the license application." So how come we all get to sell DAILY licenses?
Peace y'all. Gotta get to work.
And, on behalf of our staff and all crews, we look forward to having you in our beautiful paradise of Cabo San Lucas, Baja California Sur, Mexico where the sunshine, crystallline waters, and tropical beauty awaits you!

Cordially, Lori Garcia

Tommy & Lori Garcia's
CABO MAGIC Sportfishing Keeping it reel ?

Reeljob - 5-5-2005 at 08:30 AM

I think that's what I said!

CaboMagic - 5-5-2005 at 08:36 AM

PS - Pam - we are required to have a valid license on board for every person - including the grandma whose only purpose is to take a photo of the 8 year old reeling in a fish .. And we have lots of youngsters below the age of 16 who are incredible anglers! The way I understand it, if a boat has any fishing equipment on board (and the only ones I know of that dont are the booze cruisers) then a license is required for each and every passenger since each has the ability to reel in a fish. I say for the $11 or so it costs per person it just in not worth the potential repercussion/s for not having it .. The youngest angler we had, and we have the photos too on our website, was 8 year old Fabian Sanz - who visited us this past November with his father Cesar who believes strongly in the Father and Son bond. Look at page (5) of our Client Photos to see young Fabian in action.
Yes indeed Pam, I gulp every time we have to hand over those large sums of dinero - but sometimes (and happily) we do need them for the coming weeks period - and also keep extra on hand (as we are permitted to do, for those guests that decide "Today at 6pm" they would like to fish "Tomorrow"
OK - bye for now! LG

bajaloco - 5-5-2005 at 08:42 AM

Maybe this will clarify the debate on fishing licenses. Today there is an article in Western Outdoor News, it's about permits, licenses, and tourist cards. It states that according to the Mexican Dept. of Fisheries, the license to fish in Mexican waters does not apply on commercial boats. The laws applicable to commercial vessels is different than on private sportsfishing boats. These rules also apply to boats leaving from U.S. waters. Your sportsfishing license is basically null and void after you step on a charter boat.

Everyone on board where there is fishing equipment, must have a license.

No boat permits required on kayaks or small boats UNLESS there is fishing equipment on board. Then you must have a fishing license and boat permit.

All this info is in the latest Western Outdoor News in the Baja sportsman guide page 14.

If you want to have fun it's gonna cost you, just like everywhere else...hope this helps...Gary

[Edited on 5-5-2005 by bajaloco]

Bruce R Leech - 5-5-2005 at 09:08 AM

while I enjoy and respect Western Outdoor News I will do what the Mexican Dept. of fisheries says. they are the ones you deal with down here.

Curioser and curioser

jrbaja - 5-5-2005 at 09:34 AM

So, Pam. If I come by and want to go fishing, do I have to buy a special license besides my Mexican fishing license to go on one of your boats?
Lori ? I guess that's what you have been saying?:?::?::?:

Must be Mexico or something!!:lol:

Bruce R Leech - 5-5-2005 at 09:40 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by jrbaja
So, Pam. If I come by and want to go fishing, do I have to buy a special license besides my Mexican fishing license to go on one of your boats?
Lori ? I guess that's what you have been saying?:?::?::?:

Must be Mexico or something!!:lol:


I dont think so Jr..

turtleandtoad - 5-5-2005 at 10:03 AM

Just a quick clarification on what BajaLoco posted.

A Commercial vessel is defined as any vessel that catches fish to sell on the open market.

A charter vessel is NOT a commercial vessel, therefore your fishing license IS valid (not withstanding the opinoin of the local athorities that particular day, of course) on a charter vessel.

Osprey - 5-5-2005 at 10:14 AM

Before this thread runs out I'd like to make it clear that fishing licenses serve more than one purpose. They are a source of revenue that may or may not sustain the fisheries. In many places they are employed to set restrictions, lay out the rules of the road for the holder -- areas, times, methods, equipment, limits, sizes, specie, etc. In the almost 40 years I've been fishing the Sea of Cortez I've been asked to show my license many times but I have never seen the inspectors check my equipment or my catch. Now I INSIST they check my catch -- I want to remind them what the license SHOULD BE FOR.

Santiago - 5-5-2005 at 12:31 PM

Before this thread started I was sure I understood the who/what/where of licences - now I know nothin'.

LaTijereta - 5-5-2005 at 01:09 PM

In Loreto you will need to have a "day" wristband to be on the waters around the Loreto National Park. This has to be purchased here in Loreto from the office, or from a local charter operator as part of your package.
Only exemptions are for "local" residents or (ie FM-3 w/ local address).
We were checked on the water yesterday, as the park rangers went from boat to boat to see erveryone's papers.;)
This is in addition to your current fishing licenses talked about in the above thread.

The wristband

flyfishinPam - 5-7-2005 at 09:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by LaTijereta
In Loreto you will need to have a "day" wristband to be on the waters around the Loreto National Park. This has to be purchased here in Loreto from the office, or from a local charter operator as part of your package.
Only exemptions are for "local" residents or (ie FM-3 w/ local address).
We were checked on the water yesterday, as the park rangers went from boat to boat to see erveryone's papers.;)
This is in addition to your current fishing licenses talked about in the above thread.


Tijereta you were checked for the wristband because you were fishing inside the confines of the park. So far the park says that if you fish OUTSIDE the park then you do not need to buy one. Catch anything out there yesterday?

Then call the Loreto PESCA office yourself

flyfishinPam - 5-7-2005 at 09:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by jrbaja
Sheesh, I was just trying to help Pam. Didn't mean to ruffle you or your cohorts feathers. I would say that this is a crock and that you two obviously know more than the Mexican Fishing Dept.:lol::lol::lol:

So then, when I or someone is out fishing and get asked for the Mexican Fishing License, I show it to them and they say it isn't any good here, what happens then.:lol:


I wasn't tyring to be mean nor were my feather ruffled. You, above all others, should know that selective enforcement is the norm not the ordinary down here.

Loreto Pesca office, speak with Rosalia the secretary
011-52-613-135-1288
I trust that you speak Spanish. I can't guarantee what they'll say as they seem to change policy day to day.

Wow Lori, what words-

flyfishinPam - 5-7-2005 at 09:18 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by CaboMagic
Good day greetings all ...
JR - I do think you enjoy stirring up a good pot-o-stuff .. not that I dont enjoy the banter you create once in a while - its an interesting break from the realities of my day ... and not that I dont think what you do isnt more often than not incredibly good hearted and deep rooted in the goodness done ...
Pam - I have always admired you and sent you private emails to that effect - Now the Nomad World knows too .. & heres why: Being a business owner/operator and a female and an american too requires nearly unimaginable tenacity, intelligence, diligence (both due and absolutely necessary and continuous followup) and larger than life patience. Keeping the business operating has its own set of 'issues' .. Keeping crews working has several perspectives to consider: Getting them work, and alos getting the TO work .. people whose soul history of tradition comes from generations and who are sometimes fine with a fish and a beer every once in a while .. vs the idea of getting up every day and working ... Now of course not every one falls within either category as that is the beauty of human-being-ness. Point being there are challenges beyond the obvious that we deal with regularly, and, for myself, until we began operating a business in Cabo in 1994 I did not consider, nor care about, any of 'these' issues.
I am going to try and address as many spoken as well as insinuated issues as I can.
As to who checks the licneses Durango: Every day we encounter something 'new'. At 6am, the Port Captain 'usually' has a manned aboat at the marina departure and every boat must hand in to that person a document (we call this a dispatch) and on this document is the name of every person aboard, including crew. Sometimes the PC Office shares this boat with someone from the PESCA office and one or both of them can, at their discretion, ask for Angler Licenses and/or any other document for that matter. Any boat not having any document asked for can be sent back to get it, or them. There are days this boat is not where it is supposed to be, and, sometimes it arrives later .. go figure ... There are also times when the Navy sets up 'shop' and randomly, or perhaps deliberately, selects boats to check. I am not privvy to know who gives them directives as to who or when to check boats - here again all I hear is WHEN it is happeneing in the marina, as news travels fast - However, because we at CABO MAGIC follos ALL the rules we are give to follow, we dont flinch or worry about these events - we do however, feel badly for guests and visitors, who are a oftentime understandably unnerved about a 'teenager with an AK47' standing in front of them while another teenager reviews paperwork. Sort of like that first experience at a Military Checkpoint - its certainly not something one would experience in the USA (I know there are even going to be arguments made here for cases where folks get pulled over by a control freak patrol officer in the boonies of some town who causes some heart palpitations) but it is something one eventually gets used to, especially those who travel the Baja Pensinsula with any regularity.
And now on to The Dept of Fisheries document - "Fishing licenses are issued for periods of one week, one month, and one year, effective at 12:01 am on the starting date specified on the license application." So how come we all get to sell DAILY licenses?
Peace y'all. Gotta get to work.
And, on behalf of our staff and all crews, we look forward to having you in our beautiful paradise of Cabo San Lucas, Baja California Sur, Mexico where the sunshine, crystallline waters, and tropical beauty awaits you!

Cordially, Lori Garcia

Tommy & Lori Garcia's
CABO MAGIC Sportfishing Keeping it reel ?


This is a WOMAN in business in Mexico for sure. You're preaching to the choir on all this. I too don't worry when "they're out checking boats" because we have nothing to be worried about. All ducks the are in order.

pascuale - 5-7-2005 at 09:54 AM

Lori said that she told me I could check with the Pesca office and let them decide only after numerous emails from her saying that I must buy a license to fish on her boats and using her favorite line ....."we do not make the rules, we only follow them", without giving a good explanation. When i persisted and posted something on the board to gain information, she said I could come down and ask the Pesca office. It's not the $11 dollars its the principle that im not gonna be screwed over like the thousands of other gringos in the past. I understand its mexico and anything goes, but Im gonna spend my money on a company that knows their chit, not one that does not have any idea about how fishing licenses work telling me "Ethan, if you have a California fishing license and you went to morro bay to fish, you would have to get a stamp there too". Im not some idiot and I know you only need a stamp for lobster and shellfish in California. Instead of finding out exactly why the pesca office does not honor a year long mexican fishing license bought in Loreto, she said that i could come and check it out myself. Great business ethic. I know Lori is probably peeed off that I posted something, but havent we all learned alot from this? And will things not change? Maybe, Maybe not
Best of luck to Pam because I enjoyed my time fishing on her pangas in Loreto, and best of Luck to Cabo Magic.
Cheers,
Ethan

CaboMagic - 6-6-2005 at 03:15 PM

Latest in the ongoing Fishing/Angler License saga out of Cabo San Lucas: As every boat departs the marina all papers are checked - including boat license, dispatch, and angler licenses. Daily licenses get an "X" scrawled on them by whomever is checking them .. so far nothing done to weekly or annual licenses.


Lori

On the issue of licensing for commercial vessels....

Hook - 7-12-2005 at 09:23 AM

.......enforcement officials in much of Mexico are treating the "long-range" sportfishing industry departing from US as commercial vessels, even though they do not sell their catch commercially.

All of the long-range operators will tell you that your personal Mexican fishing license is NOT valid in Mexican waters on their boats.

So the definition of a commercial fishing vessel as one that sells it's catch is being "interpreted" in yet another fashion by various Mexican officials.

Can any of you really blame Pam or Lori for simply stating that they will comply with the wishes (whims) of the local enforcement office? They have much to lose, while you only have a day or two of fishing inconvenienced. If I were in their situation, I'd send persons questioning the policies right to the source of the problem....the PESCA officials. Don't ask them to explain why Cabo officials have decided a federal license valid in all waters of Mexico have decided it's not good enough for them! They are not lawyers; they are women trying to conduct business in a country that has taken the concept of "good 'ol boys network" to amazing extremes, even by American standards. HOW EXASPERATING (AND TYPICALLY MEXICO) FOR THE PESCA OFFICIALS TO BE OUT OF THE LOOP IN TERMS OF COLLECTION AND ENFORCEMENT.

This is yet another example of how the poor organization of government continues to cost Mexico bigtime. Just this week, figures for tourism in Mexico in 2004 were released......and they showed a modest increase of about 3%. But compared to much of the rest of Latin American and other areas of the globe, it was considered a poor showing, especially when you consider the proximity to the US. The article I read pointed to the "unofficial" costs of doing business in Mexico making it much more expensive than it need be. Without the increases, Mexico should have experienced an increase of two or three times what it experienced.

IMO, that port captain's job in Cabo is about as crooked as a drug cartel's chief. What's next, a fee per fish returned to the harbor!:fire: