BajaNomad

Frank Sinatra/Juan Rodriguez Cabrillo/San Juanico

Juan del Rio - 12-15-2005 at 11:27 PM

Frank Sinatra and Mexico have always been one in the same to me. In the 50's, early 60's...Frank was, "South of the Border", in more ways than one could count. I don't care that I'm showing my age... he sang about Mexico in my early years of music development (way before ipods/mp3's/CD's cassettes...we're talkin' four/eight track here!) and I have passed that love of Frank?s music to my three boys...who, believe it or not, like listening to Frank at the dinner table...on occasion, with my young bride and a good tri-tip from the Bar-b-Que/Baja Style!

So what does this have to do with Juan Rodriguez Cabrillo?


Over dinner and through a discussion with my family about my fourth grader's current homework assignment on the California Missions, I realized that Cabrillo, on his way North...up Mexico's mainland, then up the Baja coast, to "Alta" California, Cabrillo most likely had to stop along the way in various, "Baja, Port-of-Calls", before he discovered San Diego, San Pedro, Ventura, Santa Barbara, etc. It was in discussion with my ten year old, that Cabrillo, most likely put anchor near our second home in San Juanico... as it is has a perfect bay with fresh water that could be found nearby in those days (I think). Although I have no way to back this up, just living in the area since 1997, one would realize that this could have been the case.

Anyway, back to Frank and Baja: His song, "That's Life", has always been a favorite of mine. Whenever I'm in one of those "Baja situations", this song has just stuck in my mind.

Nothing more or less...just a simple family observation and a love for Frank's music and a passion for more knowledge for very early Baja History that wasn't recorded.

Any info on Cabrillo and his travels up the Baja Peninsula that you could share would be great!

Question is: Did Cabrillo stay in San Juanico or anywhere else in Baja before history recorded that he discovered San Diego Bay and/or points North of the border?

I?d love to continue the dinner discussion with my son on this if you have any historical input!

[Edited on 12-16-2005 by Juan del Rio]

[Edited on 12-16-2005 by Juan del Rio]

[Edited on 12-16-2005 by Juan del Rio]

David K - 12-15-2005 at 11:30 PM

Why ask this in the classified ads forum Juan?

I will see what I can dig up on Cabrillo... a Portugese sailing for Spain.

Cabrillo in San Juanico

Juan del Rio - 12-15-2005 at 11:40 PM

David, I'm trolling the classifies for some "Baja Love"!

David K - 12-15-2005 at 11:55 PM

Let's see if this can be read?

David K - 12-15-2005 at 11:59 PM

On this map of Cabrillo's voyage, #5 is Puerto San Juanico (the present name which was named PTO. LA MAGDALENA on the map)...

Both these pages are from Pablo Martinez' A History of Lower California, c1960

David K - 12-16-2005 at 12:18 AM

Here's a zoom in on the Baja peninsula part... Looks to me like Cabrillo made some notes on San Juanico, if not landed there!

Great stuff, David-----thank you----

Barry A. - 12-16-2005 at 10:48 AM

Juan del Rio - 12-16-2005 at 12:43 PM

David, thanks! This will help with our dinner discussions this coming weekend. What a great wealth of history knowledge you have on the Peninsula!

David K - 12-16-2005 at 06:28 PM

I love the place and may have been there in a previous life (building the El Camino Real perhaps?):tumble::biggrin:

Not that I have a ton of history knowledge, but I do have a bunch of great books and know where to find information... When you said you were seeking some Cabrillo details I walked to my book case and grabbed that book first... I haven't 'read' it, but thumming through is where I remembered seeing that map.

Big thanks to Baja Bernie for it, as well!

[Edited on 12-17-2005 by David K]

Marinero - 12-16-2005 at 11:59 PM

Awesome stuff, David. Where in the heck do you find it?

David---

Barry A. - 12-17-2005 at 11:29 AM

-----Pablo Martinez's "A HISTORY OF LOWER CALIFORNIA" is worth reading, tho he is a little "flowery" in some of his descriptions. I also have that book, bought from a used book store in little Burney, CA for $30 back in 1996.

I believe that some of his stuff has been challenged as to total accuracy, but still, it is deffinitely worth reading, and flows pretty well.

Cruising the Pacfic Coast Of Baja...

Juan del Rio - 12-26-2005 at 02:26 PM

There is another topic going on the board about San Juanico and early sailing vessels that could have stopped in the area. When my friend, Carlos Fiesta,who did his cicumnavigation of the Baja Peninsula http://www.bajaexpo.com/circumnavigation/adios.htm from San Pedro and up to the Colorado River a couple of years ago in a nineteen foot panga, said San Juanico was one of the best bays he found. So you gotta figure there have been a lot of early sailors before him who must have said the same thing. Any more input from the board would be great!

[Edited on 12-26-2005 by Juan del Rio]

Martinez, History of Lower California

John M - 12-26-2005 at 02:37 PM

History book here:

http://dogbert.abebooks.com/abe/BookDetails?bi=614400677

bugdude - 12-26-2005 at 03:06 PM

Along this line of historical exploration, a book I read earlier this year "The Outer Coast" by Richard Batman is an historical account about the early history of California and the Pacific coast from the arrival of the Spanish missionaries to the cattle hide trade in the early 1840s. There are several references to Baja California and points of landing.

The text gets a bit 'tedious' at times; you really have to have a genuine interest in the subject matter to get through it.



[Edited on 11/12/2005 by bugdude]

Dave - 12-26-2005 at 03:08 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Juan del Rio
Carlos Fiesta said San Juanico was one of the best bays he found. So you gotta figure there have been a lot of early sailors before him who must have said the same thing. Any more input from the board would be great!


Better than Santa Maria? I think not.

David K - 12-26-2005 at 03:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave
Quote:
Originally posted by Juan del Rio
Carlos Fiesta said San Juanico was one of the best bays he found. So you gotta figure there have been a lot of early sailors before him who must have said the same thing. Any more input from the board would be great!


Better than Santa Maria? I think not.


Dave, for Carlos Fiesta to make such a claim, San Juanico must have plenty of beer, women and margaritas!!!:lol:

Santa Maria Bay

Juan del Rio - 12-26-2005 at 03:39 PM

Dave, you're right...Santa Maria Bay is a great bay! For Carlos, San Juanico was one the best places for him to land on the Pacific Coast side going down.

...and David K: you're right as well, whenever Carlos is in town, he always finds the cold beers, the perfect Margarita and usually can track down the ladies for a dance as well. You just have to appreciate that guy for who he is!

Shhhhhhhhhhhh!

Dave - 12-26-2005 at 05:12 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Juan del Rio
Dave, you're right...Santa Maria Bay is a great bay!

Just who is Carlos Fiesta?

David K - 12-26-2005 at 06:28 PM

A great friend of Baja! His web site is excellent for obtaining information on many detinations in Baja... http://www.bajaexpo.com

Here is Carlos at my first Viva Baja event, 5 years ago, shown with Kacey Smith, author of the Baja GPS Guide...

Dave - 12-27-2005 at 03:25 AM

Hey Juan! I started looking at that picture and while it's beautiful, it ain't Bahia Santa Maria. Least the one I'm familiar with. SM bay is just North of Mag. About 65 miles South of Juanico.

bajalera - 12-27-2005 at 12:15 PM

Don Pablo's Baja California history, published in Spanish in 1956 and English in 1960, has been criticized by researchers because it lacks a bibliography and has scarcely any reference citations.

An edition published in 2003--Historia de Baja California: Edicion critica y anotada--is considerably larger [717 pages], sources have been cited, and in addition to a Bibliography it even has an Index. The scope of the book has been extended, mostly by adding a lot of research having to do with Alta California.

The original name has been retained, and Martinez is still credited as the author. That's a bit misleading--the text has been totally rewritten, and this is a completely different book from the one he wrote.

oladulce - 12-27-2005 at 03:03 PM

Juan's photo is of Bahia Santa Maria, but it's the one by the Twin Dolphin hotel between Cabo and San Jose. A beautiful little cove but not the Bahia Santa Maria near Punta Hughes at Mag Bay that Dave was talking about.

David K - 12-27-2005 at 05:22 PM

Then there is the Bahia Santa Maria, twenty miles south of San Felipe! Just a shallow scallop of a bay that empties at low tide, named by Aniceto Maduena when he began a campo there about 1970... More details at www.viabaja.com (not my vivabaja.com)... We called it 'The Lagoon' before then.

Tomas Tierra - 12-29-2005 at 10:10 AM

Bahia Santa Maria (near Mag bay)...


The only place I know of where the langosta california(red one),langosta carribeana(purple one), and the langosta hawaiiana(brown one), all live in the same hole!!

I thought the brown one tasted best!