BajaNomad

Cheerful subject matter

Sharksbaja - 1-20-2006 at 01:05 PM

does not always flow freely from this darn ol' keyboard.

Why?

Baja has sooooooo many "positive" features that appeal to me. This may account for the way I/we react with responsive post(s). Not always a positive response.
Kind of a protectiveness I/we possess in order to slow down(wishful thinking) the inevitable change that the penninsula is experiencing.
It may be possible to thwart the avalanche of land-grabbing incomers by discouraging folks from persuing a comfy life in Bajas' not so crowded places. But not everywhere.

What does that mean?
It might very well just be selfishness. Keeping the place(s) dear to your heart quiet, special and reserved just for you and the occasional accidental discoverer.
Is this how JR felt or was it much deeper?
Do you fear the inevitable shoulder-to-shoulder beaches replete with all the amentities? I think that this underscores how many of us feel. That can be troublesome when sharing these secret (special) gems with others of same mindset.

Like decades ago, only 15 mins from Torrance, Ca one could catch 25 lb lobsters and mucho abalone.
When I reminesce I get angry at what was lost never to return. Then I can't help but to envision a Baja without the splendor that she holds. That scares the hell out of me. Why shouldn't it, I spent decades not only enjoying So. Cals. awesome watersports but also defending the very rocks I used to fish from.
It wasn't without cheers or tears. The wheels of progress can be slowed but not stopped completely. I will never be convinced that all the condos were built with the peoples best interest in mind. Instead, it opens up pathways for the opportunists to get their share whether it's an abalone or a new condo.

Now ain't that cheerful??:lol


next:

How to be happy and still complain.....

Osprey - 1-20-2006 at 03:11 PM

Sharks,

You nailed it. We are selfish. Around these parts everybody wants to live near or right on the beach and be left alone. Well, there's not enough beach. The Mexicans around here don't feel that way. At Easter week they like to be chock a block on the beach near the shade -- perhaps 300 to 400 people all huddled together near the music, the shade, the potties. Very few move off to fend for themselves but they have hundreds of miles of pure white sand to camp on. My answer, to escape the "oh no's" is to just live in the moment.

Why is living in the moment...

eetdrt88 - 1-20-2006 at 06:47 PM

so much easier in Baja?:O:O

Maybe because so many of the moments...

eetdrt88 - 1-20-2006 at 06:55 PM

in Baja are spent in places like this;D

Bruce R Leech - 1-20-2006 at 07:31 PM

well
said
Sharksbaja
I
could
not
agree
more

Progress?

thebajarunner - 1-20-2006 at 08:53 PM

Well, as a California real estate developer (and a long, long, long time Baja traveler) I can only say..... SIGH!!!!!

We used to have NIMBY's (not in my back yard)

Now we have BANANA's (build absolutely nothing, absolutely nowhere, anytime)

The definition of a 'no-growther' or a 'preservationist' is one who has already gotten his place in the sun and wants no one else to cast a shadow.

When folks come to protest one of my projects I ask two questions:

Do you live in a house?
Did you drive a car to get to this meeting?

Case closed.
Sad to say, that's the way it is folks....

If you got it, you want to keep it, and you don't want to share it, and you don't think anyone else deserves it.

YIKES!!! mucha filosofia for a Friday evening...

Mi casa es sus casa?

Sharksbaja - 1-20-2006 at 09:45 PM

NO way Jose'! I mean EET!

You see this gorgeous beachfront spot completely ignored and undeveloped. How would you like to envision the place?

A) With my big beautiful house on the beach alone
B) An all-inclusive private beachside community
D) Condos, golf courses and friends everywhere
C) The way it stands now.

Choose wisely! You only get one chance:lol: literally!

[Edited on 1-21-2006 by Sharksbaja]

heres a shot...

eetdrt88 - 1-21-2006 at 02:19 PM

of the community I recently bacame a part of at Km34,my place is just a trailer with an awning but the view is pretty nice and the neighbors seem pretty friendly...Nomads are always welcome to stop by for a cold one;D;D:spingrin:

Pompano - 1-21-2006 at 02:46 PM

That the stuff, eetdrt88...exactly more of what we need. Good old-fashioned Baja hospitality. Muchas gracias, y mi casu es su casa now more than ever.

The Sculpin - 1-21-2006 at 02:55 PM

"Like decades ago, only 15 mins from Torrance, Ca one could catch 25 lb lobsters and mucho abalone."

Hmmmmmm...so YOU'RE the one who was stealing my bugs and abs! And people wonder why us PV boys are so protective of our coves and reefs...it's those damn torrancers coming over to steal, steal, steal......

:biggrin:

Kind sir

Sharksbaja - 1-21-2006 at 07:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by eetdrt88
of the community I recently bacame a part of at Km34,my place is just a trailer with an awning but the view is pretty nice and the neighbors seem pretty friendly...Nomads are always welcome to stop by for a cold one;D;D:spingrin:


Eet ,I hope you didn't take my illustrative (derogatory) remark personally.
It was to show how, along with the picture of yours that I modified, the point of the original post. It is a matter of perspective for people to see. Myself, I have mixed feelings about over development(s) of pristine coastlines.

Certainly in reality...mi casa es sus casa. Corky

woody with a view - 1-21-2006 at 07:37 PM

nice thread, but watcha gonna do? tis the great debate! the genie will never go back into the bottle.

therefore, love it and leave it as you found it....:)

Sculpin

Sharksbaja - 1-21-2006 at 07:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by The Sculpin
"Like decades ago, only 15 mins from Torrance, Ca one could catch 25 lb lobsters and mucho abalone."

Hmmmmmm...so YOU'RE the one who was stealing my bugs and abs! And people wonder why us PV boys are so protective of our coves and reefs...it's those damn torrancers coming over to steal, steal, steal......

:biggrin:


Nope!

:lol: I grew up in Portuguese Bend and dove and fished the rocks for 25 yrs. Maybe we've already met!
P.V.

Many good times and memories there.

also some not so good times..

Rattlers

But I did live in Torrance for a few months.:lol:

The Sculpin - 1-21-2006 at 11:03 PM

Oh man....used to ride dirt bikes at peackock flats, and yes, I went to St. John Fishers for a short time..and the gun turrets...and the tree swing above PV Cove..HUGE brown and spider crabs.. and if the south swell was just right......well....you know...I grew up above Lunada, and that whole area was my playground....

sigh....:smug:

Schools

Sharksbaja - 1-21-2006 at 11:54 PM

Went to Lunada Bay Elementary, Margate & and then P.V. High for a year. Many friends from there. Never surfed the point there but my crazy friends did when the 12ft tubes would form. Surfed Haggartys' more than a few trimes. Yep giant spider crabs..yum. Many tales I have from there! :coolup:


Ever hear of "Hassle Hill", "Spencer" or the "Flats" towards San Pedro. My dirt bike stompin' grounds... oh yea and Ascot :lol::lol: We all grew up on bikes. Man do I love to ride!

Al G - 1-22-2006 at 12:34 PM

"Like decades ago, only 15 mins from Torrance, Ca one could catch 25 lb lobsters and mucho abalone. "
I like the way Pompanos open heart is. I have no hard feelings that the people that discovered Baja before me was able to experience and use up some of the bounty of early Baja. I do however feel sad your heart has a selfish side. I am sure if you look inside it is only toward the faceless and not toward the many people that would be your friend.
I hope this is not misunderstood as I too struggle and don't like some of the feelings I have. I try my best to show the good and keep the rest packed away.
Al G

Oso - 1-22-2006 at 01:27 PM

Have you ever been ANYWHERE that wasn't better before?

Um, well ok... Pittsburgh.:rolleyes:

More semantics

Sharksbaja - 1-22-2006 at 02:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Al G
"Like decades ago, only 15 mins from Torrance, Ca one could catch 25 lb lobsters and mucho abalone. "
I like the way Pompanos open heart is. I have no hard feelings that the people that discovered Baja before me was able to experience and use up some of the bounty of early Baja. I do however feel sad your heart has a selfish side. I am sure if you look inside it is only toward the faceless and not toward the many people that would be your friend.
I hope this is not misunderstood as I too struggle and don't like some of the feelings I have. I try my best to show the good and keep the rest packed away.
Al G



Sorry if I am not the "Pollanna" that you would like to hear. S

You obviously don't know me too well Al. But I understand what you are trying to say.
You say selfish, I say protective.

If you read the post carefully, it is a philosophical approach to understand mans' innate desire to protect something dear to them. In this case pristine coastlines. I suppose selfishness is part of human nature and is certainly subjective and can be construed that way. Funny thing is back in the 60s and 70s there wasn't a problem with "not enough beach or game" so being sellfish then was not even an issue..


Had played a part in denuding the BOC I would feel a sense of guilt and responsibility today.
I find comfort and solace in conscience stewardship of our seas and seashore. If that is selfish then..... I guess I wear the proverbial haurachi.

NO BULLDOZERS ON THE BEACH,PLEASE!

You are right

Al G - 1-22-2006 at 08:28 PM

Sharks, I don't know you well, but hope to someday. I sincerely apologize and regretted posting as soon as I did it. I was combining several past post (my memory may be faulty) of yours about people moving to Baja and sort of ran the "philosophical approach" together, with my perceived, desire of yours to soften your approach. The descriptive word "selfish" was to strong and was aimed more as a general statement about one's emotions rather then bare fact.
If all that your are saying is you are "protective" of Baja's resources then I stand at your side. I would go one step farther and partition the Mexican government to double the the beach easement and any development must provide pedestrian easement every 100 feet and vehicle (boat) public access every 1000 feet. If this is not done you will have SoCal in short order. I nominate you Sharks as our Baja representative to protect the beaches.
Baja's friend and yours I hope.
Al G

Al G - 1-22-2006 at 08:55 PM

Now that I am on a soap box let me say it is time to get the government to tax something (Condos?) to subsidize the gill netters and long liners. It's not to late! Who is working on this? Is this to idealistic? There are some great writers on this board so why don't one of you inscribe our feelings and let us sign it. The Baja network is large and I am sure it would make an impact.
Al G

Packoderm - 1-22-2006 at 10:01 PM

Somebody somewhere in Baja aught to have a backbone like they do in Bolinas. That town is just as cool as it was 15 years ago.

bajarich - 1-22-2006 at 10:01 PM

I wonder how long it will take the Mexican Government to catch on to the idea of property tax, based on the value of the property. It would be a real boon to the Mexican economy, and would help finance their school systems and provide a lot more economic development. They could learn a lot by studying the way it is done here in Utah.

reefrocket - 1-23-2006 at 12:03 AM

Sharksbaja and others,
I take it that some of you saw the artical in "Tthe Wall Streete Journal" labled "Builders Bet on Mexico" in the property report section! "Adios" Freindly easy going Loreto! "Adios" Jucalito and the beach! "Adios" Baja de Los Angels! "Adios" San Juanico (Pacific side)!
And I mean this like the Mexicans mean "Adios" -- good by for ever--
Hello to the NEW California where you can't get to the beaches to swim, camp, launch a small boat.
Ya just gotta LOVE progress, (computers that crash, get 'infected, invaded and You idenity stolen, cell phones and the people THEY own --ruining the movie you paid $12 to get into ---ruining the meal with friends in a restaurant and the ever present disrespect of IT being answered while you are talking to IT's servent that you drove 20 miles to see (and after getting an appiontment)
Progress that over values your farm land till you cant make enough of a living to pay the inflated property taxes--- wait till that one gets to the Mexican people and they can't keep thier on land or buy groceries because of all the inflated prices. After all someone has to pay for the infastructure ----and it sure isn't going to be the developer.
Baja has changed so much in the last 10 years I double I get my wish and die before it is all gone.:no::(:(

Sharksbaja - 1-23-2006 at 01:37 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Al G
Sharks, I don't know you well, but hope to someday. I sincerely apologize and regretted posting as soon as I did it. I was combining several past post (my memory may be faulty) of yours about people moving to Baja and sort of ran the "philosophical approach" together, with my perceived, desire of yours to soften your approach. The descriptive word "selfish" was to strong and was aimed more as a general statement about one's emotions rather then bare fact.
If all that your are saying is you are "protective" of Baja's resources then I stand at your side. I would go one step farther and partition the Mexican government to double the the beach easement and any development must provide pedestrian easement every 100 feet and vehicle (boat) public access every 1000 feet. If this is not done you will have SoCal in short order. I nominate you Sharks as our Baja representative to protect the beaches.
Baja's friend and yours I hope.
Al G


Thank you Al. I realize that some of my posts rub ones Achilles Heal occasionally. I really do feel a sense of responsibility towards stewarding the beaches we use and frequent. Just like picking up the trash we generate.
This is particularily true if you are abutting the beach. Aside from Mother Natures' wrath upon the shores, man is the one who can decide where the ocean stops and where terra firma begins. Of course the Fed Law draws the real line but the shoreline is the vanguard to the sea. Access to the seas becomes a battleground when livelyhoods are at stake. Mexicans livelyhoods in particular.

All too often areas will be fenced off forbidding traffic that may lead to a families fishing/launching area. We saw this in Ca. too but access to public domain laws insured continued public access regardless of the new Condo owners complaints.

---

"Now that I am on a soap box let me say it is time to get the government to tax something (Condos?) to subsidize the gill netters and long liners. It's not to late! Who is working on this? Is this to idealistic? There are some great writers on this board so why don't one of you inscribe our feelings and let us sign it. The Baja network is large and I am sure it would make an impact."
Al G


Al, that is a grand and noble idea to suggest something I've always promoted personally.Gill netting IMHO the Mexicans don't want it that way bad enough and the transition to modern gill nets and practices can only be as good as it's supporting foundation. There are some good caring orgs and schools exploring environmental issues just like in the U.S. Their data is good, the recommendations are sound but the Mexican gov will prioritize other lucrative enterprises like a new fishery(tuna ranching) rather than save existing ones and or change them to save them.. Mo money talks. Moreover, the core of such an idea needs to demonstrate viability to the average citizen. If somehow you could collectively interface with all the potentially impacted people and then present that viable convincing plan, well, then it could possibly work but it's not probable or even more likely, not currently contemplated.

Other shore abuse is obvious and misplaced golf courses, parking lots,personal marinas are among them.
Don't get me wrong. WE need marinas. We need recreation and we need a place to live. The beaches of Baja offer all these on a grand scale. WE are fortunate to be a part. I feel blessed.
We need to keep it functioning, thats' all.:yes:
THAT is a lot of work!
I hope to meet you also amigo.
---
Rich.... what do u mean? Like taxes based on current sales prices? There is a property tax. You mean based on market value?

I can't imagine what the Mexican politicos would do with all that new easy money!:lol::lol:

Skeet/Loreto - 1-23-2006 at 08:02 AM

Very good thread!
I am sorry to say that the areas attracting the People from the States will contuine to be more and more like So. Cal.

However there is Hope if you can get out of the Rut!!
There are somanyPalces, beaches mountains to go to in Baja that you can spend years away from the Hordes.
You must change your habits of thinking you need all those Goddies, all that comfort, all those electronics, !!

It will take Hundreds of years to find enough people to fill the Area South of Loreto to La Paz. So go now and enjoy it, you cannot change the hearts or Minds that want all the goodies and a Condo, Let them have it.

You will never be able to change it unless you stop "People"!

Spend your short time on this Erth in Happiness, not in trying to change anothers mind to your Liking~!!.

Skeet/Loreto

Adventure!!!!!

Sharks,no problema mi amigo...

eetdrt88 - 1-23-2006 at 12:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Sharksbaja
Quote:
Originally posted by eetdrt88
of the community I recently bacame a part of at Km34,my place is just a trailer with an awning but the view is pretty nice and the neighbors seem pretty friendly...Nomads are always welcome to stop by for a cold one;D;D:spingrin:


Eet ,I hope you didn't take my illustrative (derogatory) remark personally.
It was to show how, along with the picture of yours that I modified, the point of the original post. It is a matter of perspective for people to see. Myself, I have mixed feelings about over development(s) of pristine coastlines.

Certainly in reality...mi casa es sus casa. Corky
from what I see you and I actually are very likeminded when it comes to progress of this kind...but like someone mentioned before the best way to deal with it is that I can see is to savor each moment that we are there and try and protect the raw nature that keeps us coming back there;)