BajaNomad - Why are Mexicans so happy?

Why are Mexicans so happy?

Lee - 11-10-2006 at 09:48 AM

http://thehappinessshow.com/HappiestCountries.htm

According to this survey, Mexico ranks #2 in two categories around happiness. Under the second category of ''Subjective Happiness," the US came in 15th.

I can't vouched for the validity of the survey but believe the numbers might be close.

Think it was Skeet who said recently that the N.Americanos and Candians around La Paz/Loreto, appeared more unhappy than the Mexicans down there.

That's been my impression. I always think that the N.Amer/Candians are stressed and the Mex deal with their stress in a different way. There's definitely a cultural thing going on.

Reminds me of a story I heard awhile back:

A Mex woman from a small village somewhere heads up to L.A., goes to school, becomes a lawyer, makes alot of money, and goes back home to visit. She does back and forth and does this for awhile and eventually someone close to her notices she's spending more and more time at home and they ask her about it.

"Carmelita? You go up North, make alot of money, have a nice job, but you come back here alot. Why is that?

"Well, up North, they have alot of money, but no time. Down here, we have alot of time but no money. I like it here better.""

Forgive the telling of this story if I've skewered it. I like this story. I know it's not that simple, but it makes a statement.

Any happier campers here who are (more?) happy down South?

:cool:

cultural differences

Bob and jane - 11-10-2006 at 12:12 PM

I'm going to make some over-generalizations on why Mexicans tend to be happier than people from the US. We have some big cultural differences, which I think everyone has noticed.
The Mexicans, as a society, tend to believe in fate. As Doris Day used to sing, "Que sera, sera. Whatever will be, will be. The future's not ours to see. Que sera, sera." If you are not in control of your future, why worry about it? They don't worry about things over which they believe they have no control. In the US, we believe that our future is in our hands. What we get in life is in direct proportion to what we put into it.
A corollary to that is the belief in the US in the importance of hard work. We get that from our Puritanical ancestors. Hard work is a virtue, sloth is a sin. We had a friend here in Mexico whose business was shut down for months while the city beautified his street. "Omigosh," we said, "that must have been awful." "Well," he replied, "I didn't have to work." In the US a businessman would be in a rage. Here, they tend to shrug their shoulders. What can I do?
A corollary to THAT is that Mexicans take siestas. People from the US think sleep is for sissies.
Most people in Mexico don't strive to keep up with the Joneses. Food on the table, a cerveza now and then, family and good friends. All is well. People from the US believe that more is better. If the economy isn't growing, if the hometown isn't growing, if the businesses aren't growing--something is wrong! My nephew asked me once what the secret to early retirement was. I said two words: want less. (Maybe I'm part way to being Mexican. I hope so.) In the US we are always looking over our shoulders to see if someone is catching up, if someone might be doing better.
Of course, there is a downside to happiness and contentment--at least in the view of most people from the US. A country with a happy and content population will probably never be a super power or have the respect of the "industrialized nations" of the world. Those happy, contented populations might even be at risk of intrusion from the more driven, less happy people in other countries.
So, happiness and contentment? Or superpower status and a luxurious (comparitively) lifestyle?
Maybe we can't have it both ways.

movinguy - 11-10-2006 at 12:22 PM

You are right about fate. When it comes to things like environmental issues, overfishing, etc. it is hard to make headway sometimes because many believe that if they take care of themselves and their families, God will take care of everything else. And if you're poor, that's a reasonable outlook on life.

Summanus - 11-10-2006 at 12:53 PM

In our experiences, we have met plenty of stressed-out Americans and plenty of stressed-out Mexicans... but far more laid-back happy ones...because we seek those people out. Who wastes time with grumps wherever you are? So it goes around the world. We can only assume that horses of a feather don't necessarily flock together.

I would think that all nations have some contentment and happiness...even Nigeria! Very odd to us that this poll selected that tumultuous nation to be thee most happy place on earth....hmm, strange choice indeed. Having traveled to many African nations, I doubt we would venture there without an armed bodygaurd! If being 'happy' means a male's feelings only, then I guess it qualifies...women there are pretty much slaves.

We have found that happy people are just 'themselves' the world over...one nation is not necessarily more 'happy' than another...unique individuals yes, nations no. From Siberia to Tierra del Fuego locals will normally present themselves to foreigners in a far different way than to their lifelong neighbors. It is up to you to find the 'happy' ones. A brother lived a few years in Moscow, Russia after it opened up to Westeners. He found it to be one of the friendliest places on earth...for him...because he sought out 'happy' people, then married one.

Baja is certainly one of the great 'happy' places we have been..but I hope we brought some of that happiness with us.

YOU are the mirror of your friends...wherever you travel.

Iflyfish - 11-10-2006 at 01:00 PM

Lee said, "Think it was Skeet who said recently that the N.Americanos and Candians around La Paz/Loreto, appeared more unhappy than the Mexicans down there.

That's been my impression. I always think that the N.Amer/Candians are stressed and the Mex deal with their stress in a different way. There's definitely a cultural thing going on."

I have traveled in Mexico over the past forty years. I have been to most of the states in Mexico. This does not make me an expert on Mexico and it is with humility that I make the following observations. One must always be careful when making cultural generalizations. There are always exceptions to the rule and exceptions that define the rules.

A Mexican friend said this to me, Ustedos Del Norte es por mi denero, Mexico es por mi corizone. Please forgive my spelling and grammar. You get the point.

When Anthropologists go to "primitive" cultures and ask people, "who are you?" They reply "we are the human beings". When asked who the people that are living over the hill are, they say, "these are not humans". It seems all cultures are ethnocentric. I am not an expert on any culture, even my own. My eyes are glazed with ethnocentricity. I cannot see the bone in my own nose.

When inquiring further with the question "who are you?" most people in most cultures tell you of their kinship bonds. "I am .........son of ......., daughter of.......

In the USofA when asked, "who are you?" people report the work they do i.e. I am a student, teacher, lawyer, plumber etc.

Mexico is about FAMILY. Most people are still very much part of their extended family network and their identity is there. They know who they are, where they are, and how they fit. They know the roles they play and there is a deep security and satisfaction with that. People in Mexico, and I know there are exceptions, work to live, not live to work. Families provide a safety net that most of us in the USofA do not have. We must take care of ourselves. We are tribes of one.

In the USofA it generally takes two working parents to support a family. Thank you Viet Nam, union busting etc. This takes parents away from their children.

Now that the USofA is primarily urban, the ties to the family farm of generations ago are broken, as Agribusiness has taken over. There is no there to go back to. Suburban life in the USofA is alienated with neighbors not knowing who lives next door. Many different cultures live in the same neighborhood. Often my neighbor, who is from East India, has lights hanging from his eaves, flower petals on his stoop, and I have no idea why. We do not share the same experience of being in the world. I like them very much, I ask about what he is celebrating, but I can only intellectually grasp the concept, never the experience. I can never get in my gut the feeling he is having as they build the flower petal mandala on his stoop. As an outsider, I am disconnected from his experience. I will never know the joy of Rama or whomever it is that is making their appearance at his door.

In my lifetime in the USofA we have seen the death of Halloween. Parents here increasingly feel a need to protect their children from "strangers.” Contrast this with the wonderful experiences recently posted on this list by Eli and others as they visit with their departed family.

Mexicans share a rich context of social activity that binds them together in shared celebration. Saints days, fiestas, holidays dominate the life and time of Mexicans. I know there are exceptions. However, this is the rule. Mexicans are pre occupied with the NOW and the next family function, not with the next paycheck and quarterly report, car payment etc. Since people of the USofA identify with their work, they are focused on production and competition. People in the USofA make major life decisions based upon whether or not they will have health insurance. Health Care is a right in Mexico. Tortillas and beans are subsidized so even the most poor can survive.

Mexicans and I know there are exceptions, leave each other alone. Ne Modo? There is a freedom in Mexico that we all experience when we are there. Mexicans in the main will not hassle you unless you are seriously out of bounds. Live and let live is the ethos. Ever met a "politically correct Mexican?" We both love and are exasperated with the laze faire attitudes of Mexicans, Ne Modo! Buildings are attached to the electric grid and the ground wire isn't connected. Ne Modo!, An act of God.

I once watched an auto accident on the Reforma in Mexico City. I was watching from my hotel window, thinking about the Indi 500 when two cars crashed into each other. There was significant damage to both cars. The drivers got out, walked around their cars, both shrugged, put their palms up in the air, got back into their cars, and drove away.

I recently read a post on this list from someone living in a remote area that was flooded. This poster, I am sorry that I forget their name, reflected upon how everyone pitched in and helped each other. They also reflected upon how in the USofA people look to the government to solve problems. This is a fundamental difference. I believe that most people in the USofA are kind, generous and want to be helpful. The point is not that people in the USofA are unkind or lack generosity or compassion. I see examples of it all the time. When human beings are massed together in urban environments, the connections between them are simply not as intimate as in rural areas where every one knows each other and thereby has some responsibility for the "other.” This used to be less the case when immigrants to the USofA settled in distinct communities where cultural and ethnic identity was maintained.

I think that it is also significant that Mexico is a conquered nation. Mexican history is one of subjugation since the time of the Aztecs. For many Mexicans things have not changed much since those times. Never had much and don't expect much. Don't stand out too much or either something will be expected from you or you will make a mistake and suffer the dire consequences. In that situation, it is not wise to intervene or take charge of or to rock the boat. Ne Modo!, An act of God!

I have rambled on.

I love Mexico and some of the best, magical, transcendent experiences in my life have happened there. I also love the USofA. I really like putting a glass under the faucet and drinking the water without worrying about some nasty bug. I often think I am living in Rome, like and emperor, where all of the consumer goods in the world are available for me. I also am faced with choices, choices, choices, always choices. Of the fifteen olive oils on the shelf, which one do I choose? In a typical Mexican Tiende I am lucky to find one and happy to find it.

I too am interested in others reflections on this topic. Thanks for posting.

Iflyfish

FARASHA - 11-10-2006 at 01:09 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Summanus
YOU are the mirror of your friends...wherever you travel.

Very true, I think we are happy if we look for it. Depends on what we focus, that is what we see. And how we judge it.
It was Aristoteles who sayed " not the event as such is what makes us feel a certain way, it's how we judge it"
Also called RE-FRAMING in the therapeutic jargon.

Mexicans and the Queen

Skipjack Joe - 11-10-2006 at 01:18 PM

Mexicans express happiness differently than we do. They are far more emotional than most of us. We are a more anal society.

Mexicans party more and longer than we do. Their fiestas often go through the night. On the other hand at funerals they tend to go to pieces. The women sometimes need to be carried off.

We tend to hold things in. Anyone see the new film 'The Queen'? It's about queen Elizabeth. In it she befriends this huge stag elk. She looks forward to it on her morning walks. One day she hears that the grand animal has been shot. She asks to see it and comes into a room where the beast is hanging from the ceiling without a head. The head is nearby and the eyes still shine as they did on her walks. Internally, the queen is devastated by the sight. Her face, however, show no emotion. She turns to the man: "Congragulations! Great shot Sir <whatever>".

We're not like that totally. But there is a lot of that in us.

Marie-Rose - 11-10-2006 at 01:42 PM

I, personally, find it much easier to be happy when down south. I'm not sure if it is because I do not have to go to work ( I enjoy my job) or because my comitments are less. Having said that, even though during my last visit, I was in the middle of a constrution zone, waiting daily for workers who did not show up, preparing for a potential hurricane, standed in town due to flooding,... I sang more, (could it be the tequila:lol

slept better, and even found myself dancing ... by myself!!!

jorgie - 11-10-2006 at 02:28 PM

A very, very good thread......Carmelita got it right

vgabndo - 11-10-2006 at 02:41 PM

As for me. Happier in Mexico. Sure, part of it is being away from work (which I don't enjoy). The balance though is being 65 miles from the nearest telephone. Not having a TV to drag me like a pitiful addict to its screen. Being the department of "water and power" as my wife says, keeps me occupied with my basic needs. Looking forward to the dying of the wind so I can fish and refill my fridge. Continuing to learn my second language and cultivating my friendships with my hosts. Making sure my boat will get us home safely from the sea. Living SO much closer to the earth.

We are invariably depressed by crossing the border northbound. Usually first by being treated like criminals by the public servants in the kiosk, then by have to drive for hour and hours and hours to get through one continuous city of people who suddenly appear to us to be incredibly spoiled. Where conspicuous consumption is a way of life.
Where most people couldn't grow a tomato if their lives depended on it.

I'm conflicted. I'd love to see my Mexican friends have more, and I'd really love to see my paisanos learn to need less.

Mi dos centavos

Marie-Rose - 11-10-2006 at 03:12 PM

SO right on vgabndo!!!!

Skipjack Joe - 11-10-2006 at 03:19 PM

Invariably someone will come along and find this thread to be 'unamerican'. And I partly agree with them.

No, not that these observations are unamerican. But it seems that all of this praise isn't entirely fair. Fatalism isn't the great philosophical virtue it's made out to be. It's the result of living in a third world country where your options are limited. If an American moves to Mexico he starts to develop their values. And when a Mexican moves to the US he too becomes a workaholic. It's the environment, not the people.

And then there's the proverbial 'manana' answer when it's time to deliver. I guess you can look at it as a cup being half full. An attitude of not taking anything too seriously. But I really see it more negatively. Laziness comes to mind. Lack of commitment. Even deceit.

I'm not saying that Mexicans don't have great qualities. But I would prefer a little more balance.

jerry - 11-10-2006 at 03:31 PM

what does anyone really need FOOD, CLOTHING, AND SHELTER everything else is just wants, people give those wanted expectations the power to make then unhappy. expecting less, less let downs
i was in RUSSIA interior when it was still communist for 3 weeks seting up equipment the first U.S. person in a city of 80,000 ppl
the people were happy, content,poor, but they didnt know they were poor so it didnt bother them i believe that the more the us intagrates with other countrys the less happy they will become i can allreaddy see the younge doing the keep up with the jones thing

SoCalAl - 11-10-2006 at 04:41 PM

Nice topic,
The truth is anything that is beyond your survival means is vanity and thus comes the stress to keep up with the Jones's.. In Mexico and I say it cause I am Mexican, when your family does what they are supposed to. They simply hand down land from one generation to the next. You get married build a simple home on it and work to eat. You know just the basics. In America you never really own your home and we are never just satisfied witht he basics.
When you visit family in other cities or states you stay at their home and the visiter is always treated special. In America we go to a hotel.
In Mexico you buy just enough clothing to get you through, in America we have closets full and most of the stuff is on credit. Come on our woman pay $50 for panties and men pay $100 for ties.
In Mexico people eat at home most of the time. In America we either go out to a restaurant or buy the best food trying to live longer. Come on if you look at Mexicans vs Americans they die at about the same age and many Mexicans outlive Americans. Stress Kills..
So I can go on and on but the bottom line is anything more that he basics for survival is vanity and having to much stuff or wanting the best of everything is like the Bible says affliction to the spirit.

The whole point that many Americans are attracked to Baja and Mexico in general is the serenity of a lifestyle that is pretty much stress free. Cheaper cost of living and the likes. I don't see to many of the american public rushing to live in Mexico city or Guadaljara it is always the areas where the Mexican people still practice the traditions I described above. But go to a large city and they are just as stressed out as people in America if not worse.
Just my opinion
SoCalAl
Alex

SiReNiTa - 11-10-2006 at 05:31 PM

some of you ask why more happier here in beautiful baja...while others like myself ask....why the hell not?´myself...i love it when i go up north but i doubt i could stand being up there full time...it´s just that most people up there are more up tight about things while here as some of you said it´s more of a fate thing...what´s gonna happen is gonna happen and we can choose how but not when and where or what...so i guess it´s all about letting yourself loose and enjoying the world and life because we all know it´s too short to waste

DENNIS - 11-10-2006 at 05:39 PM

What a bunch of nonsense.

The question should be, Why are Americans so miserable ?

jerry - 11-10-2006 at 06:31 PM

because there not mexicans living in mexico

that was easy :lol:

Skeet/Loreto - 11-10-2006 at 06:44 PM

Thanks to all of you who have given words from your Hearts.

There are places in America that still show the Happiness on a Daily Basis,

One of those is Utah. When you step off the Plane in Salt Lake City you will notice the Difference in 5 minutes.
M<y opinion is that it is the Culture of Family Values.

In my many years I have seen Children come out of Cardboard Shacks with a Smile on their Face, a longing for the Day, going to School!!!

The Time I brought Veggie Seeds to Chico at San Nicolas, telling him that he could start a Garden and have more Food.--He looks at me and says" If I am hungry i just go to the Beach and catch Fish"

There are many reasons for much of the Unhappiness I noticed about the Americans/Canadians-- The most outstanding seems to be "Fear".

I consider myself very Lucky in Life, as I do not know "Fear". I Trust in "Faith, Hope, and Charity and my Belief in God.

God Bless All of You!

Skeet/Loreto

DENNIS - 11-10-2006 at 06:44 PM

Oh yeah... Thats good. Americans arn't happy because they arn't Mexicans.

Jesus Christo Jerry, have some pride if you think you deserve it and quit embarrasing yourself.
After all, tomorrow is veterans day.

jerry - 11-10-2006 at 07:05 PM

hea thats tomorrow dont be trying to stressing me out today
monyona never comes
all that aside i do honer our vets there the only reason we have the freedom to live a life and injoy mexico

jerry - 11-10-2006 at 07:07 PM

ps im not embaressed at all i speak my mind and seldon stttttttuuuuuttttttttttteeeerrrr
ill thank the vets for that too

DENNIS - 11-10-2006 at 07:34 PM

OK Jerry----

Just dont blame the Vets for your inability to spell every word wrong. I know you will achieve this end, with practice. :yes:

[Edited on 11-11-2006 by DENNIS]

Baja Bernie - 11-10-2006 at 08:41 PM

You know what? You folks have me very confused.
When I wrote this in 2001 I thought I had this thing nailed.

"Expose yourself to a culture that will teach you how to relax and enjoy yourself and those around you. Learn that time is only your friend if its passing adds to your enjoyment of life. Kick back and relax. About thirty minutes into Baja you will notice that the grime of modern life is slowly lifting from your soul...You will begin to smile so talk to these happy people and learn what a gift a true Mexican smile can be."

Simple, Sure but how many Americans/ Canadians really do this? Most of the folks that head to Mexico find a place they love, normally as close to the ocean as possible, build a house, change the area to meet their 'wants' and in the process surround it with walls--to keep the Mexicans out??? (Remember JR ranting about this--that is why he and I were friends)

I kind of think that wishing Mexicans more is saying that they should enjoy life less.

As far as most Americans go it is not what they need so much as what they 'think' they 'want.'

Just look at what most of the people heading into Baja bring with them because they 'need' it.

I used to love to see an old VW bus with a couple of surfboards hanging on it. You know with those silly cafe curtains and that sweet aroma drifting out the window. All those guys needed was some wax, a board and some .............. Now take a look at the Lincoln Navigator pulling a custom trailer with two wave riders, a couple of motorcycles and a quad or three. Not to mention the three or four huge ice chests full of Budweiser and other goodies.

You tell me that they need all of that junk. Na! the old bus filled the real needs.

Like Lee said-- "I know it is not that simple."

And while there are a lot of Americans heading for Baja I sure don't count 10 million of them--and very few of them have to work to fulfill their 'wants.' and the 10 million Mexicans in America are not there to fill their 'needs' but rather their 'wants.'

Simple, not by a mile.

Talk to some of the YoYo's from Mexico City and you will find most Califorian's are really laid back in conparison.

[Edited on 11-11-2006 by Baja Bernie]

Dennis

Baja Bernie - 11-10-2006 at 10:34 PM

I love you too.

I have always called them my Bano books!

[Edited on 11-11-2006 by Baja Bernie]

Let's be fair

Dave - 11-10-2006 at 11:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Baja Bernie
Most of the folks that head to Mexico find a place they love, normally as close to the ocean as possible, build a house, change the area to meet their 'wants' and in the process surround it with walls--to keep the Mexicans out??? (Remember JR ranting about this--that is why he and I were friends)

Not to keep Mexicans out but to keep trespassers and thieves out. Remember, long before gringos got here Mexicans built walls for the same reason.

David K - 11-11-2006 at 12:16 AM

Thanks Dave for being so bold to state the obvious... Walls are to keep people in or out...

I remember as a kid in the 60's seeing walled communities in Tijuana and other places with broken glass cemented in the top... to keep people from going over the walls.... these were not gringo communites either.

Bad people are everywhere and bad to each other as well to foreigners!

jerry - 11-11-2006 at 12:53 AM

Dennis

OK Jerry----

Just dont blame the Vets for your inability to spell every word wrong. I know you will achieve this end, with practice.

i dont recall me blaming anyone for anything
perhaps you should look into your own words??

Skeet/Loreto - 11-11-2006 at 09:32 AM

Might it be that the inability to understand the Mexican People, is brought on by the inability of the Americans/Canadians to make Rational Judgements about other People??

The Loss of Character, Respect, Love, Kindness, that was at onetime the Foundation of Life in the States has been replaced with "Fear, Cheating, Lying, DOPE, Hate, Anger. Is it no wonder that a Portion of those New People going to Baja, maybe in an Attempt to regain their Respect, but just do not have the basic Qualities of Life to understand another Culture???

Anon The Preacher

Summanus - 11-11-2006 at 10:16 AM

Well, I am not sure that I agree with the proposition of a whole nation being happy. But it has been my observation that certain people behave pretty much the same. A generalization might be that their activities determine thier happiness. A city slicker is a city slicker in Hong Kong or New York. A country hick is a hick whether he is from the salad bowl of California or stalking his corn in Peru. The hicks always seemed much 'happier'.

So, if you find yourself taking a water taxi in Hong Kong or walking up to Machu Picchu, the odds are you are more likely to find a hick as a friend than a city slicker.

I like country Baja more than city Baja. But then, even with the tie, I was always a hick.

[Edited on 11-11-2006 by Summanus]

Lee - 11-11-2006 at 01:41 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Summanus
I like country Baja more than city Baja. But then, even with the tie, I was always a hick.
[Edited on 11-11-2006 by Summanus]

Me too, in a way. Proud to be a hick too even though I don't look like a hick. Doesn't get more hick than Arkansas (Ozarks, that is) (5 years on a farm as a child -- in the middle of nowhere) with a slew of cousins in 'Bama. Definitely doesn't get more hick than that.

Yeah, I can dig the Baja hicks too but only had to choose. Even in Cabo, there's something about the urban people there, who live locally, that every now and then, I'll look at someone hawking their wears on the street, or standing in a doorway, and he'll have a slight smile, and I'll give a small nod, and the communication passes between us.

:cool:

longlegsinlapaz - 11-11-2006 at 03:28 PM

Back to Lee's original question....IMHO, Mexicans are happier because they aren't materialistic like people from the USA & Canada. At times, it seems as though many of them have so little that they are truly & genuinely happy for whatever extra or small (to us) thing that they can get. They see joy in the little things; they sincerely have a totally different set of priorities than we do! For the most part, they care about today & don't worry about what tomorrow may bring. It's a totally different culture & I believe that cultural difference is part of our initial attraction to the Baja, however, it's damn hard to come down here & not attempt to impose our values on them....even if "for their own good" or "to their betterment"....better obviously in our eyes, but rarely in theirs, because our values, priorities & cultural differences are just as great an inherent part of us as theirs are to them. I've lived here full-time for 7 years, and there are some things that still frustrate me....45-60 minutes to cash a check in the bank versus 2-3 minutes at a drive-thru in the states; expecting the majority of cars to actually STOP at a stop sign or red light; a totally different attitude as to what constitutes what we view as good "customer service". It's been hard for me; I came from a fast-paced, highly stressful position in a company with an employee headcount equivalent to the population of La Paz; to meld into the "what's the rush, you'll get it when you get it" mentality that is prevalent here. That admitted, we ARE playing on a Mexicano field, so we need to play by their rules. They are a happy people....let's take a page from their book!! Slowing down & taking time to smell the cactus flowers is something we can all probably benefit from...learn to start appreciating some of the obscure little things that we were too driven to even notice in the culture we come from. Ever think WHY someone came up with the phrase "less is more"! Hmmmmmm....I wonder the nationality of that someone!

Stickers - 11-11-2006 at 06:07 PM

Quote:

Ever think WHY someone came up with the phrase "less is more"! Hmmmmmm....I wonder the nationality of that someone!

Longlegs, although I know you were speaking rhetorically the nationality of the person famous for "less is more" was German. He was referring to complexity of structures in architecture. He and his fellow modernists felt that the more that a building was simplified the more the architect had accomplished.
I think that the expression fits many other aspects of life, especially writing as in me going on in this post to total boredom.

BTW his name was Mies van der Rhoe or as we young architecture students called him "Mies God"

Although Mies was mainly referring to aesthetics the same applies to technical matters.

"System reliability is inversely proportional to parts count."

Lee - 11-11-2006 at 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by longlegsinlapaz
They see joy in the little things; they sincerely have a totally different set of priorities than we do! For the most part, they care about today & don't worry about what tomorrow may bring. It's a totally different culture & I believe that cultural difference is part of our initial attraction to the Baja,

There is an attraction, for me, of family, in Baja. White or brown skin, family is the glue that keeps the culture tied. We use to have that more up North.

I also feel a kinship with both white and brown skinned people that transcends what I have up North. People up here really are busy with stuff.

Then there's the lack of importance around time.

If I had a gripe, and they're too few to mention, Capt. Mike hit it on the head with the fatalistic attitude that some people in Baja have. But it's prevalent on the Mainland too.

Why anyone would pass (in vehicles) going over a hill, around a blind curve, taking very careless chances, is beyond me. I hope to catch somebody one day. They'lll remember that day when I'm done.

:cool:

longlegsinlapaz - 11-11-2006 at 09:16 PM

Stickers.....I actually KNEW that was an architectural term, and I agree that it does apply to many other aspects of life....but I DIDN'T KNOW the originator was German! Thanks for learning me sumpin new! :yes:

Paula - 11-11-2006 at 10:46 PM

You got me! My aunt and uncle lived in a van der Rohe building in Chicago. It was beautiful, but to my knowledge Jerry Brown initiated the phrase. Guess he just borrowed it.

i notice that in Loreto many people find their joy in the sea, the mountains and the critters who live here, and in their families and friends rather than in their achievements and posessions. They know that these are the best of belongings. It amazes me how much a school of dolphin cna delight a pangero who sees one almost every day. Less is definitely much more.

abreojos - 11-12-2006 at 04:23 AM

This topic did not take off on "What affect will the Democratic Victory have on Baja" thread where I posted the link to the study, but it certainly has produced one of the best threads on it's own here.
After living down here for many years and being married to a Mexican, I must say all it takes is seeing a really green gringo coming down here for me to appreciate the simple life no matter how illogical it is. I have always believed in taking the best of what all cultures offer and making that mine. A philosophy that has made the US great! All great philosophers and psychologist state that happiness does not come externally, it comes from within.
I don't always agree with the methods of Mexican madness, but I can appreciate the fact they will probably live longer than I will because of it and most of them really are happy. Sometimes we just plain out smart ourselves!

Summanus - 11-12-2006 at 06:40 AM

While certain places in Baja are tops in our book...another 'who is the happiest' poll puts the people of the mountain nation of Bhutan in Asia as the most happy and contented people on the globe.

Now what makes those guys so happy?

Hmmm...Maybe they don't wonder about Who is happier than Who?

FARASHA - 11-12-2006 at 06:47 AM

Maybe they just enjoy what they HAVE, instead of fretting over what they can NOT have.!!

Summanus - 11-12-2006 at 07:02 AM

We are on the same wave length, FARASHA.

And sometimes 'less' is indeed 'more' as per this quote by Oscar Wilde:

"Simple pleasures....are the last refuge of the complex."

Maybe finding these 'simple pleasures ' is what attracts the harried and busy to Baja....to unwind, kick back, and smell the tacos.

Osprey - 11-12-2006 at 07:08 AM

I don't really know why Mexicans might be happier than Americans and I don't really care. I've lived here for 12 years now among those happy Mexicans and I am not a part of their culture -- I have my own culture. I am an observer and I think the core cause for any differences in rural people is that DiTech.com has not yet come to Mexico. None of my Mexican neighbors has a mortgage, almost all Americans can boast a mortgage (even small town folks). Mexicans have to get a lot, buy, beg borrow or steal the building materials and little by little store them and protect them until they can round up people to build the little house. When it is finished there might be several wage earners living under the roof and each can add a little money which will go toward paying for the $5 water bill, the $25 power bill, the $10 propane bill. My wife and I paid cash for our house so are monthly bills are only slightly more than our neighbors -- we pay that from our SS income. I don't think we would smile as much, sleep as well if we knew we had a $1,500 dollar a month mortgage to meet each month forever.

FARASHA - 11-12-2006 at 07:18 AM

I have to say that I find GREEDINESS repulsive in people and this constant unpleased attitude that comes with it.
This repeatedly groaning and moaning what does NOT work out well.
I couldn't go over it with a friend - we split up over this, because I didn't want to live at the same place. It was disturbing my inner Balance and HARMONY.

Of course Sh**t happens and that can influence our mood, emotions for some period of time. No problem with this.

BUT out of that - you feel better when making the decision to look at the bright side of Life. And what does work out well.
That is MHO :yes:

Skeet/Loreto - 11-12-2006 at 08:42 AM

Osprey; Words well spoken, However I think deep down you do "Care".

In all of my years in Baja- Loreto- I found the inteaction with the Mexicanos a Soul-satisfing- time of my Life.
From the 60's on , I began to see a change in the People in the States, so looking for a Happier Life, I was led to Baja where I saw many, many People with very few "Material Goods" that were much Happier with their way of Life, than the Hippies, Baby Boomers etc.

I did observe the Changes brought about by Telephone, TV, Tourist, opening of the Road etc. On my Visit last week, I noticed a sutle change in the Attitude of the Mexicanos, that being that there is a resentment starting to emerge aganist the Americans/Canadians coming into the Area, buying Property,living behind walls, never interacting with the People, just expecting the Mexicano to be Grateful that they have arrived!!

I think it is good advice for each new visitor to read a book written many years ago titled ""The Ugly American".

Anon the Preacher

Iflyfish - 11-13-2006 at 10:40 PM

Ditto Skeet
Distant Neighbor by Octavio Paz is also a good one.
Iflyfish

fdt - 11-14-2006 at 12:12 AM

Alan Riding / Distant neighbors
saludos

bajarich - 11-14-2006 at 10:08 AM

I have a friend Filipe whom I met on the beach at Agua Verde. He lives in Ciudad Constiution and sells draperies and used air conditioners. Whenever he wants he goes fishing, or snorkeling for Cholate clams. He told me about his brother who makes $20/hr building mobile homes up in California and how his brother works all the time and hardly ever gets to go fishing. Filipe said he prefers to stay in Mexico where he can fish when he wants, to making a lot more money in the in the States.

In other words, money is not what is important to him. I feel much the same way, it's about being happy with what you have and doing what you like to do.