BajaNomad

Big blank spaces on the AAA map -- are these (natural) wilderness areas?

RICHARDH - 1-4-2007 at 06:20 PM

I have now done most of my studying of conventional travel guides for Baja, and I'm ready to think more specifically about natural wilderness areas -- especially between Guerrero Negro and C. Constitution (and over to the Sea of Cortez).

Here are a few "big blank spaces" on the AAA map of Baja, and I'm wondering to just what extent these areas are natural wilderness areas. I don't presently have access to a Baja California Almanac, which I understand has considerably more detail. So I suppose some of these "big blank spaces" perhaps may actually be laced with primitive roads and jeep trails. And by the time I get a good look at an Almanac, it may be too late to do good research on this question -- I may be on the way to (or in) Baja.

So I'd like to get some comments on these possibilities. Note that "wilderness" tends to mean a lot of different things to different people. When I say "wilderness", I'm thinking maybe no one has ever been there before and certainly I'm not thinking of areas laced with jeep trails. However, I will be interested in primitive roads for initial access purposes.

Here are some of the areas (from north to south):

1) the big gap between Hwy 3 and Hwy 5 and south of Laguna Salada

2) the huge, roughly quadrangular area bounded by SPM Park, San Quintin, El Rosario, Catavinia, El Marmol, and the Sea of Cortez, but excluding the San Filipe Desert

3) the seemingly non-roaded triangular area with Mision San Borja, Villa Jesus Maria, and Punta San Francisquito as its vertices

4) the area east of the line between San Francisco de la Sierra and Mision Gertrudis

5) the "blank space" in the Vizcaino Desert between the Vizcaino-Bahia Tortugas road and the Punta Abreojos-Mex 1 road

6) the seemingly unroaded area between San Ignacio and Mision Guadalupe (ruins) and further to the southwest

7) the seemingly unroaded area between Mulege and La Purisma.

8) the "small", seemingly roadless area west of the line between the Comondus and San Javier

9) the area west of the agricultural region around C. Constitution and over to the Sea of Cortez

There are numerous smaller areas I've left out, but they could conceivably be quite good candidates for wilderness as well.

For example, the area of the Sierra de la Laguna looks fairly small on the map, but I've seen some scenic photos of vast, rugged mountains in that area.

I imagine that the most appropriate access to remote wilderness areas may be by burro to at least carry provisions for several days and perhaps weeks, but I'm thinking that my budget may only allow backpacking, which seems likely to limit my range and depth of penetration into wilderness.

So what are the possibilities, and what might I expect to find?

woody with a view - 1-4-2007 at 06:30 PM

rocks, lizards and dirt

Crusoe - 1-4-2007 at 06:43 PM

And even somemore rocks,lizzards and dirt plus alot of cactus and ants!:)

David K - 1-4-2007 at 07:09 PM

Richard.... I am BBQing some elk for dinner right now, but I will get back to you a bit later with details on those areas!!! STAY TUNED!!!:cool:

David K - 1-4-2007 at 07:18 PM

Okay, Area 1: See all posts with the subject 'Pole Line Road' (mostly made by Ken Cooke and Neal Johns)...

The WWII era telephone line service road (cobblestone) built by the U.S. between Ensenada and San Felipe goes through this area and makes a great Jeep trip (or Toyota)... This was to communicate with our radar station there... in case the Japanese or Germans invaded us via the Gulf!

[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

nomad 017.jpg - 47kB

David K - 1-4-2007 at 07:19 PM

Area # 2: http://vivabaja.com/1105/page3.html




[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

David K - 1-4-2007 at 07:21 PM

Area #3: http://vivabaja.com/703/page4.html

San Regis access road was gated, so couldn't get close to it!

Santa Ana, San Ignacito and San Regis were vistas for Mision San Borja... mission visiting stations in this region.




San Gregorio was also one, southeast from San Borja: http://www.davidksbaja.com/401/page5.html

[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

Bajagypsy - 1-4-2007 at 07:42 PM

I'm a bit of a Google Earth freak for things just like this, any luck picking off faint trails in these areas this way?

David K - 1-4-2007 at 10:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bajagypsy
I'm a bit of a Google Earth freak for things just like this, any luck picking off faint trails in these areas this way?


YES! If you are lucky enough to need a view of an area with the high resolution photos! Use my list to get close to the area you want to check out: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=10620

David K - 1-4-2007 at 10:41 PM

Area 4 is pretty sparse... along the coast is Trinidad... The El Camino Real had more than one route through this hostile area depending on the time of year or which visita or rancheria the padres had to visit between San Ignacio and Santa Gertrudis.

Photo of El Camino Real in this region by Harry Crosby...


[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

David K - 1-4-2007 at 10:44 PM

Area 5 contains the mysterious looking Santa Clara Mountains and is home to one of Baja's lost mission legands... See http://vivabaja.com/1757

David K - 1-4-2007 at 10:49 PM

Okay Richard, I gave you my input on the areas I have some info on and I hope the other Nomads can provide more for you...

The main answer to your question is there are blank areas on the AAA map because AAA hasn't mapped those areas or they removed the roads once shown because they don't want to have unexperienced members drive into some areas, have vehicle or driving issues, and then blame the AAA for showing 'bad' roads on their maps! Yes, this is a reason you see less roads than the older AAA maps once included.

The Baja California Almanac shows a whole lot more!

Here's just one area off the older Baja Almanac Norte to give you a hint to the detail, near Santo Tomas (ignore my notes on it)...



[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

Santo Tomas Map-R.JPG - 46kB

TMW - 1-5-2007 at 07:28 AM

Richard print out a copy of the SCORE Baja 1000 race map and course notes from the last couple of years and follow it around to get a good look and feel of the country side. A Baja Almanac would help too.

[Edited on 1-5-2007 by TW]

wilderone - 1-5-2007 at 10:29 AM

"So what are the possibilities, and what might I expect to find?"
The possibilities to backpack for a few days into wilderness is endless. However, as with any other wilderness area anywhere in the world, you will first access your departure point by road. I predict that after a month of traveling excessively potholed, deep sand, washboard roads, you will hope for a good dirt road to get you into the wilderness. Most places in the Baja CA desert containing some water source (spring, tinaja, river, lake), which would make the area more hospitable for resident or wilderness seeker alike, has been discovered centuries ago and you will find some evidence of habitation - abandoned rancho, hunting camp, old mining effort, etc. If you venture into a wilderness area that has no water, and you must carry your own water, that will limit your range in the wilderness. You can take a dirt road several miles off Mex. 1 and be the only person there for days - an area that hasn't changed for 1,000 years. So really not necessary to go where nobody else has stepped foot - the same cactus, rocks, lizards will be found right next to the road too.

David K - 1-5-2007 at 10:46 AM

Excellent advice Wilderone!

Baja California Almanac

David K - 1-5-2007 at 10:50 AM

I scanned three of the maps from the now out of print last edition of the Almanac, then cropped and reduced the size to meet Nomad limits... As the details get washed away when you reduce an image too much, I am not sure how much you will gain from these... But, it is probably enough to get you to try very hard to get your own copy!

Here is your area #1 (south of Laguna Salada... part of the Pole Line Road shown as a dashed single line in the upper left quadrant)

[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

Almanac 1-07r.JPG - 44kB

Area 3 (Mision San Borja/ Villa Jesus Maria)

David K - 1-5-2007 at 10:53 AM



Almanac 2-07r.JPG - 50kB

Area 4 (south of Santa Gertrudis)

David K - 1-5-2007 at 10:57 AM

part of two pages here, with the binding gap...

Almanac 3-07r.JPG - 43kB

David K - 1-5-2007 at 11:28 AM

Here's a close up of the area from San Borja and south...

Circled are San Borja and the visitas of San Ignacito, Santa Ana, San Gregorio, and San Regino (San Regis)... Also the El Camino Real is shown (E.C.R.) as a dashed line and I pointed out the onyx mine of El Marmolito... whose ore was shipped out from Miller's Landing, to the west.

The road between San Borja and Santa Ana was pretty bad and overgrown from lack of use when I went there and the road to San Regino had a locked gate just east of El Cardonal, so I couldn't get up to see the mission visita ruins and graveyard there.

[Edited on 1-7-2007 by David K]

scan-r.JPG - 43kB

Santa Ana

David K - 1-5-2007 at 12:48 PM

Graves along the road at the abandoned rancho and former San Borja mission visita of Santa Ana... Large tombs photo taken by 'BajaTaco' (Chris)

Looking the other direction towards the palms, over a simpler grave next to the big ones, is this photo I took in '03:


[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

PadresAtRest.jpg - 48kB

San Ignacito

David K - 1-5-2007 at 12:52 PM

Not sure if these ruins at San Ignacito (just west of the rancho) are the original San Borja visita ruins... from July '03:

San Gregorio

David K - 1-5-2007 at 12:56 PM

Located a quarter mile hike from the end of the Jeep road from San Borja, this old rancho is on the Gulfo Camino Real...



note the big cut stone blocks the adobe is built upon...

David K - 1-5-2007 at 01:00 PM

You will note two trails going east from San Gregorio... One goes northeast to the gold & silver San Juan Mines... whose ore was cabled and railroaded to Las Flores (south of L.A. Bay) for processing. The other is the Gulfo Camino Real to El Aguaje and on to Mision Santa Gertrudis... See the photos from Neal Johns when he and friends explored those two trails: http://vivabaja.com/neal

There is plenty of exploring to do in Baja... in those blank areas of the AAA map!!!

[Edited on 1-5-2007 by David K]

RICHARDH - 1-6-2007 at 04:50 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by wilderone
... - an area that hasn't changed for 1,000 years.


Sounds fabulous!!!

RICHARDH - 1-6-2007 at 05:00 PM

David, thanks for the many posts. They look fabulous. Of course, it will take me a little time to examine and digest all of that. Many thanks!

David K - 1-6-2007 at 06:16 PM

Richard, you are now ready to begin a whole new experience... exploring Baja California!

Be warned, once you catch 'Baja fever' you will forever want to keep going back!

RICHARDH - 1-7-2007 at 02:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Crusoe
And even somemore rocks,lizzards and dirt plus alot of cactus and ants!:)


Excellent!

Since there are lizards (and ants), I guess there must also be snakes, other insects, and birds of prey, and probably rodents and perhaps other small mammals.

I can't wait to see things first hand.

David K - 1-7-2007 at 08:54 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by RICHARDH
Quote:
Originally posted by Crusoe
And even somemore rocks,lizzards and dirt plus alot of cactus and ants!:)


Excellent!

Since there are lizards (and ants), I guess there must also be snakes, other insects, and birds of prey, and probably rodents and perhaps other small mammals.

I can't wait to see things first hand.


Photo I took of a coachwhip snake, San Gregorio...



My daughter with a red diamondback rattlesnake, south of L.A. Bay...

mtgoat666 - 1-7-2007 at 09:13 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by RICHARDH
Quote:
Originally posted by Crusoe
And even somemore rocks,lizzards and dirt plus alot of cactus and ants!:)


Excellent!

Since there are lizards (and ants), I guess there must also be snakes, other insects, and birds of prey, and probably rodents and perhaps other small mammals.

I can't wait to see things first hand.


Even in the harshest desert it seems you will find a few scrawny cows. I think Mexicans raise a type of cow that is capable of eating only sand, rocks and cactus spines.

Baja unknown areas

BAJACAT - 1-7-2007 at 09:14 AM

Wow if information is what you crave thit's the place to get it,somany people with so much experience on the subjet,like David K,Neal Johns,Sharksbaja, just to mention some of them.Im fairly new on this socall Bajafever,but yes I was also infected on my firts trip to this incredible and magical place,filling a little embarrased for being raise in Baja california norte and just started visiting Baja for the last three years. and learning all the things I was missing,but it's to never to late to start,and with help from this Bajafriends,it shuoldn't be no problem,I still remember my firts trip when I was asking the forum for information and the firts person that came out was somebody with the name of David Kier.offering all kinds of information on Baja. So Richard if you have questions you are in the right place,here I send you a small contribution on my part is a photo fron the road from Santa Ana to San Borja.

[Edited on 1-7-2007 by BAJACAT]

red san borja.JPG - 41kB

David K - 1-9-2007 at 10:59 PM

Pole line road as shown on Howard Gulick's 1962 map... Lower California Guidebook.

nomad 021.jpg - 35kB

David K - 1-9-2007 at 11:01 PM

Photo of the World War II built Pole Line Road from Ken Cooke...

[Edited on 1-10-2007 by David K]

DSCN4014.jpg - 49kB

David K - 1-9-2007 at 11:05 PM

Here's another... note cobblestone pavement

[Edited on 1-10-2007 by David K]

{Q-E}Pole Line Road 2004 020.jpg - 47kB

David K - 1-9-2007 at 11:06 PM

Here's one of the poles... from 1943!

{Q-E}Pole Line Road 2004 027.jpg - 43kB