BajaNomad - Baja Crime Taking a Toll

Baja Crime Taking a Toll

Slowmad - 11-26-2007 at 01:15 PM

From Gene Kira's www.mexfish.com report:

MEXICO: Mike Steele, reporting as acting president of the 50-member San Diego Fishing Club, Home of the Outcasts, said club members would suspend their overland trips to fish northern Baja California locations due to concerns about personal security. "None of our club members will be traveling in the near future to Ensenada, Castro's, Camalu, San Quintin, or Bahia de los Angeles until Mexico can assure they have their security under control," Steele said. "We have already canceled several trips and have postponed any future trips indefinitely until we can be assured of safe travel."

MEXICO: Other Baja anglers reported decisions to stop driving in Mexico due to crime and safety concerns. One said, "No more driving the Baja peninsula anymore. Very sad. Baja will have to wait until the Mexican government cleans up the crime problems."

[Edited on 11-26-2007 by Slowmad]

DENNIS - 11-26-2007 at 01:25 PM

If reactions such as this get no response, nothing will. It has to take on the snowball effect.

Hook - 11-26-2007 at 03:15 PM

This is good news. Now the operators of resorts in these areas will feel the pinch and will begin talking to their representatives; both governmental and business.

What effect it will have remains to be seen. But it's a good start.

I am wondering if anyone has been going to some of the benchmarks of tourism in northern Baja; specifically La Fonda, Puerto Nuevo, etc. Anyone notice a downturn in activity on the weekends over the last couple months?

Al G - 11-26-2007 at 03:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Hook
This is good news. Now the operators of resorts in these areas will feel the pinch and will begin talking to their representatives; both governmental and business.

What effect it will have remains to be seen. But it's a good start.

I am wondering if anyone has been going to some of the benchmarks of tourism in northern Baja; specifically La Fonda, Puerto Nuevo, etc. Anyone notice a downturn in activity on the weekends over the last couple months?

Well if it has not yet...it won't be long now. This is RV.net forum and they are paying attention...it won't stop veterans Baja People, but first timers can get in trouble and not know it. Most will think hard about the worth of Baja at this time. All first timers should wait until some REAL protection is put into place by the Mexican Gov.
Now I say "Just don't stop in Baja Norte" for the seasoned Baja person...and "Just don't Go to Baja" to the New travelers...

losfrailes - 11-26-2007 at 03:42 PM

if the traffic at San Ysidro Sunday night is any indication, nothing is going to change.

4 hours to get across.

This refusal to come to baja should be brought to the immediate attention of someone in Mexico with some authority. I doubt that the operators of any kind of business in the areas mentioned would notice the loss of business, at least not fast enough.

Al G - 11-26-2007 at 03:55 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by losfrailes
if the traffic at San Ysidro Sunday night is any indication, nothing is going to change.

4 hours to get across.

This refusal to come to baja should be brought to the immediate attention of someone in Mexico with some authority. I doubt that the operators of any kind of business in the areas mentioned would notice the loss of business, at least not fast enough.

Yes...you may be right...for now. This is the most media exposure and board and clubs notice in a very long time(don't know how long)
Plus border delay on a major holiday weekend...just does not say much.

Bajajack - 11-26-2007 at 03:55 PM

Quote:

I dont know about the rest of the country but I was in Algodones a few days ago and a friend of mine told me everyone is singing the blues.

This is normally the busiest part of the year and it was slower than I have ever seen it.

Twice as many hustlers practically draggin em to the Pharmacias and Dentistas, just not enough to go around.

Another really strange thing was the presence of the Tourist Police, all over the place, normally only a scattered few.

[Edited on 11-26-2007 by Bajajack]

Hook - 11-26-2007 at 04:21 PM

So, do the Tourist Police prey on the perps who prey on the tourists? Or do they prey on the Tourists?

Bajajack - 11-26-2007 at 04:34 PM

They operate under a different set of rules and since their on foot I dont think they have the opportunities as the other agencies.

Al G - 11-26-2007 at 04:40 PM

Are these private or hotel cops?

DENNIS - 11-26-2007 at 04:58 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by losfrailes
if the traffic at San Ysidro Sunday night is any indication, nothing is going to change.

4 hours to get across.

That's going north....A good sign. Get out of Mexico before it all comes to an end.

Minnow - 11-26-2007 at 05:02 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Al G

Yes...you may be right...for now. This is the most media exposure and board and clubs notice in a very long time(don't know how long)
Plus border delay on a major holiday weekend...just does not say much.

Define "very long time". You mean since you started going to baja a couple of years ago, or when you started posting on this board, a couple of years ago. :lol:

You newbies kill me.

bajalou - 11-26-2007 at 05:04 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Al G
Are these private or hotel cops?

They are special Mexicali Police. (not private)

Bajajack - 11-26-2007 at 05:26 PM

Tourist Police operate in all the border towns and are under the direction of the Mexican Tourism Dept.

Their sole purpose is to give directions and mediate any problems or disputes a Tourist may have.

You cant miss em, Black Berets, Black Uniforms and Combat Boots, except for one I saw last week, he was wearing white tennis shoes.

DENNIS - 11-26-2007 at 05:34 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajajack
Tourist Police operate in all the border towns and are under the direction of the Mexican Tourism Dept.

Their sole purpose is to give directions and mediate any problems or disputes a Tourist may have.

You cant miss em, Black Berets, Black Uniforms and Combat Boots, except for one I saw last week, he was wearing white tennis shoes.

Sounds like policia trainees to me. Do they have weapons? I don't mean a hairbrush in a holster such as I have seen. Do they have guns to use in wasteing away an armed robber?

Bajajack - 11-26-2007 at 06:23 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Sounds like policia trainees to me. Do they have weapons? I don't mean a hairbrush in a holster such as I have seen. Do they have guns to use in wasteing away an armed robber?

Yes they have the standard joe cool, deputy dog issue, sam browne belts. Like most mex cop's their sidearms are'nt standardized, I've seen 9mm Hi caps, Sig's and Glock's and some old & new 45 ACP with lot's of extra pouches along with their favorite Polygraph tool, the large Pepper Spray cannister.

gnukid - 11-26-2007 at 10:39 PM

Policia Turistica are good guys who fight against corruption of state policia y ministerial. Normally in BCS they wear white and are on the waterfront.

All cops have to buy their weapons and bullets and holsters. It would be be nice to give a holster and any support possible to policia turisticas, they are your friends and you need to keep their phone numbers/names handy for when you get hassled by the other corruptadas policia guys.

The only one so far I've seen pull a gun on robbers and chase them was the Policia Turista. They really are good people in La Paz. Supportar la Turista Policia, hooray.

bajaguy - 11-27-2007 at 07:50 AM

by gnukid:

"All cops have to buy their weapons and bullets and holsters"

Really???...In LaPaz or all of Baja???.....interesting.

DENNIS - 11-27-2007 at 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy
by gnukid:

"All cops have to buy their weapons and bullets and holsters"

Really???...In LaPaz or all of Baja???.....interesting.

It must be that way in Ensenada as well. Around the police station you can see any number of different uniforms as though each shopped from a catalog. Lots of different SWAT looking stuff.

Barry A. - 11-27-2007 at 11:31 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Al G

Quote:

As a 55 year vet of going to Baja, I can tell you Al that it DOES EFFECT ME, and I will not be going to Baja until I see some positive action taken to curtail this crazy crime spree.

barry

Mexitron - 11-27-2007 at 12:01 PM

I would have thought that Donald Trump would have been concerned about this...talk about hitting 'em in the money belt, this stuffs happening on the toll road in front of his new developments.

Hook - 11-27-2007 at 12:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Mexitron
I would have thought that Donald Trump would have been concerned about this...talk about hitting 'em in the money belt, this stuffs happening on the toll road in front of his new developments.

Many have said that all he did was sell his name for the projects and really has no financial interest. Quien sabe?

Hey, did you see my reply about Minch in that other post?

Mexitron - 11-27-2007 at 02:45 PM

Hook--oh yah! Which thread was that on? I must have been offline for awhile and missed the response...sorry...

Woooosh - 11-30-2007 at 12:19 PM

If the crime in northern Baja isn't slowing the economy down enough- the local real estate professionals are helping drive away business...

Baja Fair Trade Group Expelled from AMPI
Board not re-elected
BY NANCY CONROY

The members of the Baja Fair Trade real estate group have been expelled from the local real estate organization in Rosarito (AMPI) for advocating Baja real estate reform. The group recently announced that they would promote the concepts of Full Disclosure, Escrow, and Title Insurance in order to protect buyers in the Baja marketplace. The announcement was severely criticized by a local group of real estate agents. These individuals accused the group of slander and bad attitudes, and orchestrated their summary expulsion from AMPI. Brian Flock, an expelled Baja Fair Trade member, said “Disclosure clearly hit a nerve within the old guard leadership of the Rosarito associations. I suppose that disclosure was too much of a threat to the bread-and-butter of their businesses.” A week after the affair, AMPI elected a different board of directors.

Baja Fair Trade had presented a proposal to improve consumer protection in the Baja real estate market. Their proposal included a disclosure form that would require all members to disclose known defects in a property to potential buyers. For example, Baja Fair Trade would require members to disclose sewage issues or title litigation. Additionally, Baja Fair Trade argued that agents should advise clients to use Escrow, obtain Title Insurance, legal guidance, a home inspection, and use a professional closing method. Although these measures reflect the ordinary expectations of any buyer, the proposals were treated as heretical by some members of the Rosarito real estate groups.

The brouhaha began when an AMPI member, Ronald Hoff, circulated an email alleging that the group members were “Ugly Americans”, and arguing that “for you to come here and promote yourselves as “experts” who are going to “clean things up” is both laughable and embarrassing”. Hoff asked “who appointed you sheriff?”, and accused the group of associating with the Gringo Gazette.

Then, Willie Bautista, the president of another local real estate organization (APIR), sent a letter to Baja Fair Trade rebuking them for their “bad attitude”. Bautista wrote “You have the attitude that we should change our ways to make our methods of doing business just like in the States. You assert that the Baja Fair Trade group will clean things up and make it safe for the buyer to purchase in Mexico…It is your underlying attitude that needs adjustment. You are new here. You are foreigners. You do not understand the “Mexican way of doing real estate”” Bautista demanded that Baja Fair Trade apologize for their actions, adding that if they did not “we refuse to forgive and forget”.

Baja Fair Trade member Victor Loza, who is one of three Mexican members of the group, wrote that “the message sent is an unfortunate use of a leadership position to multiply the idea that Americans must be silent when in our country”, adding that as a Mexican professional he disagreed with this “bully attitude”. He warned that sending the wrong message would hurt business, saying “imagine how clients will view our association” after they heard about the affair.

In a written statement signed by AMPI leader Gustavo Torres, Loza was prohibited from becoming an AMPI member and told that “this information is to be shared with other local associations”. Members Brian and Ivonne Flock were ordered to immediately apologize, and notified that if they did not, they would be summarily dismissed from AMPI. The Flocks did not apologize, and Torres attempted to physically prevent Flock from leaving the premises with a written copy of the dismissal letter. Flock said “The so-called justice process by the leaders has proven to be a sham.” Baja Fair Trade has posted the letters, emails, and expulsion documents on their website at www.bajafairtrade.com.

This incident is expected to seriously hurt the reputations of both AMPI and APIR. However, a week after the incident, AMPI elected a new board of directors. The new officials have solid real estate credentials and may be able to restore AMPI’s credibility after this affair.

Woooosh - 11-30-2007 at 12:22 PM

I guess Mr. Torres has stopped looking for his kidnapped assistant. Maybe he should just go golfing with OJ.

Hugo Torres Proposes:
Agreement between Tijuana, Playas de Rosarito and Ensenada to Protect Tourism

Rosarito’s mayor-elect Hugo Torres Chabert proposed the need for a collaborative agreement that would serve to unify the efforts of Tijuana, Rosarito and Ensenada for the purpose of securing a safe Tourist Corridor for visitors. Tourism is the essential element of the region and a priority for the new administration of the “Quinto Municipio” (Rosarito was the 5th to be granted municipal city status).
That is what the Mayor-Elect expressed on October 6th at a meeting of the Grupo Político Ciudadanos de Ensenada A.C., a political action group. He stressed the need for the coastal government administrations to work together and support each other. He deems it necessary due to the security risks taking place in the State.
“The industry of tourism is of utmost importance, and we must take good care of it. When the new city administration begins, a priority will be to protect it by decree. We’re in an era of conflict and need to act swiftly. I’ve had talks with the mayors-elect of Tijuana and Ensenada and the challenge is before each of our mayoral responsibilities. We all agree to begin the collaborative process,” Hugo Torres explained.
There is a proposal in the works to create a Policía Metropolitana (Metropolitan Police) force to avoid situations such as recently occurred when police gave up a chase of a semi that crossed the city border to Ensenada and had to give up the pursuit. In a similar situation, Hugo Torres explained, any illegal act that may affect tourism from one municipality to the other has repercussions on the entire industry.
Hugo Torres explained that to reactivate the tourism industry also implies the open flow of tourism traffic along the coastal highways with efficient checkpoints and of streamlining the procedures for buses with tourism from the United States. At the same time is it important to improve our infrastructure for making our cities more attractive for to visitors and for our residents.
“We need to collaborate efforts to improve public safety and attract tourism. Our cities are basically co-dependent toward this goal, though we are autonomous in each of regions. What happens in any part of our State has repercussions on our entire economy,” he pointed out.
Regarding the clean-up of our police departments and anti-corruption efforts, he said that each city must act on their own. There are efforts taking place at the State level for bringing justice to corrupt officials.
Other topics that were discussed during the question and answer session: the need to rekindle the fishing industry, to protect species such as lobster as a prime industry for the corridor and of international fame, to start thinking of strategies for the water needs of the near future.

Al G - 11-30-2007 at 01:18 PM

I realize Torres is a very common name in Mexico...I hope they are not related

Minnow - 11-30-2007 at 01:54 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by soulpatch

Quote:

Originally posted by Minnow

Quote:

Define "very long time". You mean since you started going to baja a couple of years ago, or when you started posting on this board, a couple of years ago. :lol:

You newbies kill me.

I've been going for just a few years now. I think I started back in '91.
I've altered my northern baja driving habits for now.
Stupid newbies......I guess I'm an idiot.
How big is a minnow's brain anyway?

They must not test you FF's on reading. Otherwise you would have been able to figure out who that post was directed at. :lol:

Tell me, Soul, is this the most exposure, as to the crime issue, you have seen in your 16 years going to baja. Because I recall this sort of thing popping up every few years, then it dies down, then it comes back. It is kind of like the tide.

I would guess my brain is about the same size as most peoples, I can just put more in it. That goes double for you Soul. :lol:

bearbait1 - 11-30-2007 at 02:18 PM

Size doesn't matter, it is quality that's important, and I'm sticking to it.

Minnow - 11-30-2007 at 05:53 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by soulpatch

Any idiot could see who you directed that at you subtle dog! This one did. :lol:

It's just fun to grind on your elitist BS once in awhile.

[Edited on 12-1-2007 by soulpatch]

For the record, I am an anti-elitist. :?:

vandenberg - 11-30-2007 at 09:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by soulpatch
See? No worries then.
I am patently full of chit. :cool:

You in need of a good shyster. Lots of people on this board infringing on your patent :biggrin: