BajaNomad

Mexicans charge US violated sovereignty

fulano - 6-25-2008 at 12:00 AM

This is an interesting view of the Mexican perspective on the US. The story goes like this:

On June 6, Juan Enrique Martínez, his wife Maria and their son Jonathan Martínez went up to the border crossing at Calexico to send Jonathan to stay with relatives in Texas. Now, the point where one goes into the customs and immigration is a little inside the US. While Juan was standing there saying goodbye to Jonathan, Immigration and Customs Enforcement (ICE) recognized Juan as a guy having outstanding arrest warrants in the US. So, they grabbed him and arrested him.

The Mexicans went berserk. They called the Mexican consul in Calexico and they called the Mexican National Human Rights Commission, which immediately demanded an explanation from the US of its "aggression, threats and invasion of Mexican territory". The Mexicans claim that four members of ICE went into Mexican territory, beat the crap out of Juan and dragged him into the United States.

Juan is now a guest at the El Centro jail in Imperial County.

http://www.afntijuana.info/2008/junio/24junio/soberania.html

BajaGringo - 6-25-2008 at 02:15 AM

The article says that they saw him in the border crossing area and chased him into Mexico, where they were able to get catch him and then dragged him back across the border into US territory.

If that is true, the border agents are in the wrong.

Imagine if you were being chased by Tijuana cops and they followed you across the border into San Ysidro and then dragged you back into Mexico. That wouldn't be right either and I am sure people would scream about that as well...

fishbuck - 6-25-2008 at 04:16 AM

This guy Juan Enrique. This is 1 brave dude! But also not to smart.

They recognize this guy? What the hell did he do? Border agents chase this guy down and catch him? Are you kidding me. And into Mexico!

Holy @#$%!!!!!

This guy is like a drug dealer or hitman or something! The Mexicans probably tipped the US off so they would catch this guy and get him out of Mexico!

So ofcourse they(government) need to protest. People, Mexican people saw the whole thing!

Border agents just happened to recognize the guy and chase him down?

Ya right!
:lol:

[Edited on 6-25-2008 by fishbuck]

DianaT - 6-25-2008 at 08:17 AM

It will be interesting to see more written about this. I have not seen it in the Imperial Valley Press, but I don't read it everyday anymore.

With their training, it is difficult to imagine them violating Mexican territory, and I hope they did not do so.

But if he did go to the building, he was in US territory---will be interesting to read more accounts. Sounds a little like the accident with five different stories.

Diane

Serious Border Violations !

MrBillM - 6-25-2008 at 08:34 AM

This is the kind of thing that could lead to WWIII. Before you know it, Mexico will mobilize their formidable military resources and launch a pre-emptive invasion across the border with the distinct possibility that the U.S. will fall to their superior might.

Be prepared.

Or, maybe not. Most likely they'll strike back at the Government by nit-picking the Gringos who have Zero control over the problem.

fulano - 6-25-2008 at 12:26 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
If that is true, the border agents are in the wrong.

Imagine if you were being chased by Tijuana cops and they followed you across the border into San Ysidro and then dragged you back into Mexico. That wouldn't be right either and I am sure people would scream about that as well...


You should spend a little time researching the concept of "hot pursuit" before you decide what is right or wrong. The border has been crossed by both sides since Poncho Villa raided New Mexico in 1916 and the US Army pursued him into Mexico.

Nothing will come of this and I'll bet you the Mexican government will not even file a formal protest. It would seem a little silly, since even Calderon admits there are at least 6 million Mexicans illegally in the US.

Hot Tamale Pursuit

MrBillM - 6-25-2008 at 12:48 PM

Well, at least these guys had better luck than those that were pursuing Pancho Villa.

BajaGringo - 6-25-2008 at 02:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
You should spend a little time researching the concept of "hot pursuit" before you decide what is right or wrong. The border has been crossed by both sides since Poncho Villa raided New Mexico in 1916 and the US Army pursued him into Mexico.


Well, I guess that I could make a lot of challenges to some of the arguments made here in different threads if we are allowed to use almost one hundred year old history. Based on that analysis, we had basically open borders back then and using that comparison I guess you have no issue with any of the undocumented currently living in the US, if that were the case. if it was okay a hundred years ago, it must be okay now too, based on your logic.

So you are insinuating that "hot pursuit" justifies crossing international borders to arrest someone? I am sure the US would have "no problem" with Tijuana police blasting through the border gates chasing a US citizen who had just committed some crime while in Mexico.

Nice try but it doesn't work that way. Both examples are wrong and I can find no moral justification in either.

The Gull - 6-25-2008 at 03:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by MrBillM
This is the kind of thing that could lead to WWIII. Before you know it, Mexico will mobilize their formidable military resources and launch a pre-emptive invasion across the border with the distinct possibility that the U.S. will fall to their superior might.

Be prepared.

Or, maybe not. Most likely they'll strike back at the Government by nit-picking the Gringos who have Zero control over the problem.


Put more Home Depots along the border - that will stop them from invading. They will all assemble in the parking lots.

fulano - 6-25-2008 at 04:29 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
Based on that analysis, we had basically open borders back then and using that comparison I guess you have no issue with any of the undocumented currently living in the US, if that were the case. if it was okay a hundred years ago, it must be okay now too, based on your logic.


Say, Ron. What was your IQ before you started drinking?
Quote:
Straw man
Definition: One way of making our own arguments stronger is to anticipate and respond in advance to the arguments that an opponent might make. In the straw man fallacy, the arguer sets up a wimpy version of the opponent's position and tries to score points by knocking it down. But just as being able to knock down a straw man, or a scarecrow, isn't very impressive, defeating a watered-down version of your opponents' argument isn't very impressive either.

BajaGringo - 6-25-2008 at 08:52 PM

I am still waiting for your "facts" fulano.

And speaking of IQ, since you seem so proud of yours, when are you going to "come out" and tell the Nomads here who you really are???

That would make an interesting thread...

fulano - 6-25-2008 at 11:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
when are you going to "come out" and tell the Nomads here who you really are???


OK, OK. I am the lady that was in the line ahead of you at the CFE office. Are you going to export me now?

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=639474

Hey zeus, what a putz. Trying to be more Mexican than the Mexicans.

[Edited on 6-26-2008 by fulano]

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 12:01 AM

Oops. Sorry about the oversized picture making the page too wide. I don't know now to fix it.

BajaGringo - 6-26-2008 at 01:12 AM

Nice try and I stand behind that post. I do wish those kind of gringos would go home. They don't seem to like it here in Mexico, complain about everything and for the life of me I can't understand what they are even doing here. They embarrass themselves. Something you manage to do as well.

So back to the question which you are desperately trying to avoid...

Come out of the closet fulano. Or should I say "fulana"? The class would love to know who you really are.

I don't hide like you do.

Of course I know that it will be a bit embarrassing when everybody finds out as some will surely go back and look at some of your posts and then you will have some explaining to do, won't you???

Oh, this is going to fun...

:)

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-26-2008 at 04:01 AM

Fulano why are you posting stuff in here that BajaGringo has posted elsewhere. Who cares what he posted elsewhere. My respect goes to him for putting himself on the web as a real person. He has a web page where you can see his face and he has posted his name. You on the other hand snipe with anonymity and do not show us who you are. Come out of the darkness into the light so we can see you. BajaGringo has guts. You do not. No seas cobarde o chismosa. It is your kind of conduct that should be banned by BajaNomad and the moderators. You are the true troublemaker.

And just for the record Fulano regarding BajaGringo's post you brought in from another website. I would have told her to quiet her Gringa mouth and remember where she is.

[Edited on 6-26-2008 by ELINVESTI8]

Mexican Army Invades Phoenix!

Woooosh - 6-26-2008 at 09:22 AM

Text
Police reports show that three men arrested in a Phoenix home invasion and homicide Monday may have been active members of the Mexican Army.

While on the J.D. Hayworth show, Phoenix Law Enforcement Association President Mark Spencer said that the men involved were hired by drug cartels to perform home invasions and assassinations.

The Monday morning incident at 8329 W. Cypress St. resulted in the death of the homeowner. Between 50 and 100 rounds were fired at the house.

Spencer said a police officer told him that one of the men captured said they were completely prepared to ambush Phoenix police, but ran out of ammunition.

He added that all were all dressed in military tactical gear and were armed with AR-15 assault rifles. Three other men involved in the invasion escaped.

Click Here to listen to Mark Spencer's entire interview on the J.D. Hayworth show.

However, Phoenix Police have not confirmed the men were Mexican Army members.

Sgt. Joel Tranter said one suspect revealed that he had "prior military training," but "no credible evidence" that any of them were active in the military.

[Edited on 6-26-2008 by Woooosh]

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 09:56 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
Come out of the closet fulano. Or should I say "fulana"? The class would love to know who you really are.


OK, OK. I'm Brian Flock.
Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
I don't hide like you do.


And I don't talk out of both sides of my mouth, like you do. After all this time, you have STILL refused to answer my question as to why you are opposed to the Baja Fair Trade proposals.

http://www.bajafairtrade.info/A_Rosarito_Scandal/page_196450...

What have you got against trying to make sure that gringos don't get skinned and flicked by the people who sign your paychecks?

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 10:17 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Fulano why are you posting stuff in here that BajaGringo has posted elsewhere. Who cares what he posted elsewhere.


I care.
Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8And just for the record Fulano regarding BajaGringo's post you brought in from another website. I would have told her to quiet her Gringa mouth and remember where she is.


I probably would have too. But, David, I would then not go to a public internet forum for Mexicans and posted my experience and ask all the Mexican's there if they know any other Americans in Mexico that they want to kick out...and to not be shy about speaking up about it.
Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
My respect goes to him for putting himself on the web as a real person.


But he is not doing that. Most of what he puts on there is pure BS. That story about him befriending an old man on the beach who abandoned his family after getting laid-off from his job. About hooking him up with a lady named Gaby and them getting married...it is all pure BS roughly laid-out along the lines of his own life. He has adult children by a former marriage, even though he says on his website that he was a "lifelong" bachelor until he met his current wife at a cooking class.

El cobarde y chismosa es BajaGringo. El esta haciendo pendejo aqui y engañando la gente estúpida.

BajaGringo - 6-26-2008 at 10:20 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulanoOK, OK. I'm Brian Flock


So, I am accused of selling real estate (which I don't) and it turns out that the one who really sells real estate here is you.

Interesting...
Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
And I don't talk out of both sides of my mouth, like you do. After all this time, you have STILL refused to answer my question as to why you are opposed to the Baja Fair Trade proposals.


No Brian, I am not against any of the things that your little band proposes. There were many before you working hard to bring these real estate standards to the market. People like Hector Bustamante and his father Luis. I have come to know them very well and they are great examples that you could learn from.

My advice would be that you should take their lead and just work under those principles instead of using them as a "gimmick" in a desperate attempt to attract buyers in a down market, stepping on everyone else along the way, including Hector and his father Luis. I have a lot of respect for people who seek to bring positive change in ethical ways. If you could learn to take a similar approach I would become your biggest supporter.

I said it to you before, and I will say it again. Stop by my house and we'll have a drink and talk. No audience, just you and me.

The door is open...

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 10:24 AM

Hey zeus, Ron. You are such a Pilgrim.

BajaGringo - 6-26-2008 at 10:29 AM

I am flattered that you read my articles Brian and if you go back and read the first one, the quote was "long single bachelor". I had been divorced for 10+ years. Never said "life long". Some would consider being single for over ten years a long time. Maybe you don't. That's okay, it's my life.

The character from my latest article is real but he kindly asked that I not name him in the story, which is why I used only the term "friend" to refer to him throughout the article.

Brian, I put my life out there, good, bad and for all to see. I don't hide. No sense to at this point in the game.

Again, I am flattered that you so closely follow my articles and again, the invitation to come by and talk face to face is open. tell me what you like to drink so I can have it on hand...

[Edited on 6-26-2008 by BajaGringo]

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 10:39 AM

Ron, I'm not Brian. I was being sarcastic.

...and I read your business plan. You are peeing up a rope.

BajaGringo - 6-26-2008 at 10:42 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
Ron, I'm not Brian. I was being sarcastic.


Too late Nancy, you and Brian are both out...

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-26-2008 at 10:44 AM

Fulano hazme el gran favor de arreglar esa copia de la otra página que metiste arriba del BajaGringo. Bórralo o arréglalo. Ya ni se puede leer uno a gusto las pendejadas que están escritos. Y la mera verdad si no te afecta lo que el escribe porque te importa tanto. Yo tampoco lo conozco pero el si tiene su nombre y pagina en el Internet para que todos lo podemos ver. Estas diciendo que no es el que esta puesto en ese ¿página? Ustedes tienen diferencias de opinión pero merece una lucha libre ¿aquí? Que no te botaron de aquí antes por hace lo mismo que estas haciendo ¿ahora? Bueno si no te bota el dueño de aquí vamos a ver que pasa entre tu y el. Para que sepas yo de ves en cuando me gusta hacerme el pendejo para dar a la gente bastante cuerda para que ellos mismos se puedan colgar.

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 11:46 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
Fulano hazme el gran favor de arreglar esa copia de la otra página que metiste arriba del BajaGringo. Bórralo o arréglalo.


OK David. I fixed the post by deleting the oversized picture that was causing the problem and replaced it with a link to BajaGringo's original post. Here it is again:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=639474

Now you can follow the thread where the majority of the posters are Mexican and disagree with BajaGringo and have a very favorable view of Americans. They do seem to have a big problem with pochos, though. I've said it before here, BajaGringo talks out of both sides of his mouth. He wants to be your best buddy here on this forum and them bad-mouths gringos on other forums.

And no, I have not posted here under any other name and have never been booted off this forum.

ELINVESTIG8R - 6-26-2008 at 12:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
OK David. I fixed the post by deleting the oversized picture that was causing the problem and replaced it with a link to BajaGringo's original post. Here it is again:

http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=639474

Now you can follow the thread where the majority of the posters are Mexican and disagree with BajaGringo and have a very favorable view of Americans. They do seem to have a big problem with pochos, though. I've said it before here, BajaGringo talks out of both sides of his mouth. He wants to be your best buddy here on this forum and them bad-mouths gringos on other forums.

And no, I have not posted here under any other name and have never been booted off this forum.


Thank you Fulano for fixing it and for the information.

BajaGringo - 6-26-2008 at 04:56 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulanoI've said it before here, BajaGringo talks out of both sides of his mouth. He wants to be your best buddy here on this forum and them bad-mouths gringos on other forums.


Sorry Nancy, but I only "bad mouth" Gringos who come to Mexico and act like complete marooons. If there is something there that you identify with, I can imagine how much that hurts, but you are the one who gets to look in the mirror everyday.

You sound more and more like a woman scorned. I know your story and why you are bitter.

Sorry things haven't worked out for you...

fulano - 6-26-2008 at 06:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
You sound more and more like a woman scorned. I know your story and why you are bitter.

Sorry things haven't worked out for you...


Oh Ron! If only you had married me, instead of the little Mexican tart. I will never forgive you.

...Nancy

Woooosh - 6-26-2008 at 07:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by BajaGringo
Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
Nice try but it doesn't work that way. Both examples are wrong and I can find no moral justification in either.


I always agree that "two wrongs don't make a right". I sometimes have a problem with "the enemy of my enemy is my friend" though.

Woooosh - 6-26-2008 at 07:12 PM

Quote:
Quote:

Put more Home Depots along the border - that will stop them from invading. They will all assemble in the parking lots.


How about getting some Mexicans to hang out around the Home Depots in MEXICO once in a while. Geeeesh. Everyone in Rosarito is complaining there's no unskilled construction work to be had right now but I've never seen a person sitting outside Home Depot like stateside, offering to help gringos who could use it. lol

CaboRon - 7-3-2008 at 05:39 AM

Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Originally posted by Woooosh

Put more Home Depots along the border - that will stop them from invading. They will all assemble in the parking lots.


How about getting some Mexicans to hang out around the Home Depots in MEXICO once in a while. Geeeesh. Everyone in Rosarito is complaining there's no unskilled construction work to be had right now but I've never seen a person sitting outside Home Depot like stateside, offering to help gringos who could use it. lol


Very funny, I haven't found ANY skilled construction workers yet.... the best contractors are bringing skilled construction people over from the mainland....

CaboRon