BajaNomad

Time to Leave---as others have done

fulano - 7-16-2008 at 12:26 PM

There is always that standard Mexican equivalent to "the system is down".

Ya se murió el burro!

CaboRon - 7-16-2008 at 12:49 PM

jdtrotter,

Didn't you open this thread?

You think it is fun to pay for work slowdowns?

You should maybe pull your head out of the sand ...

And there is nothing fun when you see a deck collapse or a fire started because of the local building customs...

CaboRon

fulano - 7-16-2008 at 12:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jdtrotter
Fulano,

Your comments are always either negative or demeaning---

evidently your experiences have truly made you a bitter person, and for that I feel for you.


You know Diane, for all your comments about how you love Mexico and how you spend so much time there, it truly amazes me how little you understand of the Mexican soul. It is almost like you have some kind of comic-book understanding of Mexico, or have somehow convinced yourself that you understand what apparently is unfathomable to you.

The statement "Ya se murió el burro!" is a very common expression throughout all of Mexico and Latin America. It is not the least bit insulting and considered humorous. It is no worse than an English equivalent, like saying "the dog ate my homework".

Maybe you should hang out with some Mexican's someday, because I just have to tell you that whatever disaffected and dysfunctional ex-pat's you hang with are not doing you any good.

DianaT - 7-16-2008 at 01:02 PM

Fulano, maybe I don't fully understand all of the nuances of this culture, but enough is enough. You are so constantly posting only the negative things you can find----.

Going to delete what I can of this thread. It was meant to be a postive more fun thread, but guess that won't happen.


Sorry to all----back to my comic books --- you obviously know who I am.

Diane

[Edited on 7-16-2008 by jdtrotter]

[Edited on 7-16-2008 by jdtrotter]

Cypress - 7-16-2008 at 01:05 PM

When you hire someone to work for you, you really need to know them.:) Know Them?:?: How many people do you really know?:)

CaboRon - 7-16-2008 at 01:09 PM

You know that "it is what it is" crap is what has held Mexico back .... it is third world thinking .... it is the give up rationalization of a repressed people who don't believe there is are any choices ....( choices only come to those who show initiative) ....

The Mexican people have been told 1848 that the US is responsible for all of their woes ... that thinking only holds the country firmly in the ruling class/third world game. And it is a lie that has been told by the people who have been sucking this country dry for as long as any can remember.

CaboRon

shari - 7-16-2008 at 01:09 PM

I heard a new one this morning when I asked why our workers werent' at work yesterday.....TOOTHACHE!!! 2 DAYS OFF!!
Actually I'm proud of and commed the trotters on how they have adjusted to this village culture and accepted it without getting angry...and I've NEVER seen them with any ex-pats...except once an old friend of theirs visited for a couple days. I see them once in awhile when they graciously give us left over tile or something and they always have a nice cold Bohemia for me and tell me about their mexico new friends they have made.

CaboRon - 7-16-2008 at 01:10 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jdtrotter
Fulano, maybe I don't fully understand all of the nuances of this culture, but enough is enough. You are so constantly posting only the negative things you can find----.

Going to delete what I can of this thread. It was meant to be a postive more fun thread, but guess that won't happen.


Sorry to all----back to my comic books --- you obviously know who I am.

Diane

[Edited on 7-16-2008 by jdtrotter]

[Edited on 7-16-2008 by jdtrotter]


BYE

gnukid - 7-16-2008 at 01:17 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
Quote:
Originally posted by jdtrotter
Fulano,

Your comments are always either negative or demeaning---

evidently your experiences have truly made you a bitter person, and for that I feel for you.


You know Diane, for all your comments about how you love Mexico and how you spend so much time there, it truly amazes me how little you understand of the Mexican soul. It is almost like you have some kind of comic-book understanding of Mexico, or have somehow convinced yourself that you understand what apparently is unfathomable to you.

The statement "Ya se murió el burro!" is a very common expression throughout all of Mexico and Latin America. It is not the least bit insulting and considered humorous. It is no worse than an English equivalent, like saying "the dog ate my homework".

Maybe you should hang out with some Mexican's someday, because I just have to tell you that whatever disaffected and dysfunctional ex-pat's you hang with are not doing you any good.



Diane,

Please consider that point again. Fulano's comments have been accurate. No one has been able to point to false statements. Not once so far. He/she is pursuing a better world through understanding of truth, while so many here would prefer to distract from truth about Baja California's culture and society.

Similarly denial or attacking the truth is not helpful to the discussion. A critical perspective, with patience, reserve and respect for each other would be helpful here.

As a group we need to ask ourselves are we working toward a better Baja California or are we reinforcing falsehoods? As gringos who fund much of the development is our lack of real cultural understanding perpetuating misunderstanding and separatism? We need to ask among ourselves if our compatriots actions may be detrimental to our longterm survival here.

I, too, ask you to consider your role.

DianaT - 7-16-2008 at 01:19 PM

Thank CaboRon

I haven't left quite yet---and may not---as you say, lots of choices around.

comitan - 7-16-2008 at 01:29 PM

Diane I for one enjoy your posts and your pictures and your closeness to the Mexican people don't let anybody hinder your enthusiasm or your posts.

wiley

Cypress - 7-16-2008 at 01:30 PM

shari, A serious toothache will make a grown man cry. :bounce: You've just got to buck-up, put your shoes on and go from can to can't. ;D "All you need is power and more power!" My foreman told me this when I hired into a shipyard labor crew.:spingrin:

DianaT - 7-16-2008 at 01:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by grover


This thread could have forevermore been "Donkey Orphanage Converted Into Cemetery."


Dang---wish I could go back and do that. :lol:

Wiley, I have already rethought my decision---because of the number of people who do really like Baja and have fun with all of it.

Just blowing off steam at the we don't like Mexico or Mexican Culture groups.

Diane

rts551 - 7-16-2008 at 02:27 PM

Where is it that some people have a lock on the "truth"?

Maybe the real truth lies with the culture as it is.

jls - 7-16-2008 at 02:37 PM

When reading some of the comments and opinions on the site, I often think how I would feel if a group of people from another country moved into my area and started acting like they know more about my government, my culture and my needs than I do. Doesn't influence come from trust and support rather than criticism, negativity, and cultural elitism? Until we can vote, run for office, speak the language, and foster a legal movement, we are guests in a country and should behave as guests.
Just speaking for myself and how I feel about living in a foreign country.

EVERYPLACE has it's problems. Now, is the glass half full or half empty?

Lee - 7-16-2008 at 02:42 PM

There is nothing wrong with thinking (Diane) Baja is a land with problems but it's glorious and beautiful -- or, fulano's need to update everyone on the danger lurking in the shadows.

For those (Diane) who do not see the danger, or the ugliness, no problem. Doesn't mean a thing. It means that that is her experience of Baja and where she is and isn't that great?

It isn't like fulano is making up stuff printed to sell papers. AND it's his perspective of things -- and there even seems to be a balance -- from my perspective.

What comes across from both Diane and fulano is they LOVE Baja and Mexico and the Mexicans.

And as much as I'm one of those people who love the people and the land, if I ever get a chance to catch someone passing on a hill causing me to make an emergency brake, I'll teach them that stupidy know's no border's. Add to that those I catch throwing garbage out their car window's with me driving behind them.

I am ZorroLee -- Protector of Mexican women and Tortugas (and anyone else in need of protection).

gnukid - 7-16-2008 at 02:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jls
When reading some of the comments and opinions on the site, I often think how I would feel if a group of people from another country moved into my area and started acting like they know more about my government, my culture and my needs than I do. Doesn't influence come from trust and support rather than criticism, negativity, and cultural elitism? Until we can vote, run for office, speak the language, and foster a legal movement, we are guests in a country and should behave as guests.
Just speaking for myself and how I feel about living in a foreign country.


I often am struck by the number of people in Baja who have no respect for the law, who believe that laws shouldn't be enforced. Even more shocking, are people who move to Baja California but feel they should not be involved in their community, they should not learn laws, participate in support of their neighbors and community and just stay out of things.

There is a general rule---where ever you live you have a responsibility to participate in your community and do your part to the extent that you can.

Why some people feel they can move to Baja California and benefit from all it has to offer but ignore language, laws and culture, community is beyond me.

Those gringos who come here and do not do what they can to be a integral citizen to the degree that law allows and requires are a serious threat to our wellbeing.

For example, say we continue down this road for eons to come... will Baja California be a place where the majority (gringo expats) believes they are not part of the community with no responsibility to learn about the social issues, speak the language, enforce laws and participate to the degree they are capable?

That mindset repeated here far too often is the straw that is breaking the back of the burro in Baja California.

Those who attempt to justify disconnected existence in quiet silence in the face of social issues that demand their attention are the reason so many Mexicans are outraged.

Quit the rationalizations, get off your butts, go meet your delgado, go meet every policeman and government official and talk, listen and move the agenda forward to the extent that is reasonable and necessary.

Imagine a Baja of the future with gringos far and wide--doors shut, unable to translate news and info, unwilling to discuss issues with neighbors in depth and with a degree of understanding and resourcefulness.

C'mon Nomads get off your butts and get out there and be Nomads!

I'm serious!

Lee - 7-16-2008 at 03:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by gnukid
Quit the rationalizations, get off your butts, go meet your delgado, go meet every policeman and government official and talk, listen and move the agenda forward to the extent that is reasonable and necessary.


God I'm getting the chills.

Listen to gnukid, folks. Kid has a finger on the pulse of reality.

OK. Let's all sing.

''THIS LAND IS YOUR LAND
words and music by Woody Guthrie

Chorus:
This land is your land, this land is my land
From California, to the New York Island
From the redwood forest, to the gulf stream waters
This land was made for you and me

As I was walking a ribbon of highway
I saw above me an endless skyway
I saw below me a golden valley
This land was made for you and me

Chorus

I've roamed and rambled and I've followed my footsteps
To the sparkling sands of her diamond deserts
And all around me a voice was sounding
This land was made for you and me

Chorus

The sun comes shining as I was strolling
The wheat fields waving and the dust clouds rolling
The fog was lifting a voice come chanting
This land was made for you and me

Chorus

As I was walkin' - I saw a sign there
And that sign said - no tress passin'
But on the other side .... it didn't say nothin!
Now that side was made for you and me!''

Cypress - 7-16-2008 at 03:11 PM

All you need is power and more power.:)

CaboRon - 7-16-2008 at 03:59 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Where is it that some people have a lock on the "truth"?

Maybe the real truth lies with the culture as it is.


Maybe it doesn't ...............

CaboRon

Skipjack Joe - 7-16-2008 at 04:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by gnukid
Even more shocking, are people who move to Baja California but feel they should not be involved in their community, they should not learn laws, participate in support of their neighbors and community and just stay out of things.


Don't be so shocked.

Have you ever been to LA or SF's Chinatown or Japantown? Hollywood is now 'Little Armenia'. There are interesting scenes in 'The Godfather' that show the Italian communities on our eastern seaboard.

I lived in an Italian community in Melbourne, Australia for 4 years. Nobody spoke English (some claim the aussies don't either hah). They grew their own tomatoes in their yards and made sauce for pasta which was consumed every day. Lp's of Mario Lanza could be heard throughout the neighborhood. Card games were played with 'Bostoni' cards. Vino with every meal. Espresso was the only coffee consumed (aussie coffee was considered swill). Boccia ball on weekends to the sound of 'Tarantella'.

Usually it takes one generation before any attempt at assimilation takes place.

Pescador - 7-16-2008 at 04:09 PM

Oh, for crying out loud, Now we have Gnukid teaching us how to be social citizens, Fulano screaming at everybody who does not agree with his choice of postings or his translations of the Spanish Language (of which he is so proud), and now Lee is wanting us to sit around the campfire and sing Kumbaya. This is a group discussion board with lots of different viewpoints and philosophies and just because someone does not have the same viewpoint as you, you probably won't change them by getting acerbic and acidic.

AH, I LOVE BAJA NOMAD TOGETHERNESS!

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-16-2008 at 04:16 PM

mtgoat666 - 7-16-2008 at 04:18 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
Quote:
Originally posted by gnukid
Even more shocking, are people who move to Baja California but feel they should not be involved in their community, they should not learn laws, participate in support of their neighbors and community and just stay out of things.


Don't be so shocked.

Have you ever been to LA or SF's Chinatown or Japantown? Hollywood is now 'Little Armenia'. There are interesting scenes in 'The Godfather' that show the Italian communities on our eastern seaboard.

I lived in an Italian community in Melbourne, Australia for 4 years. Nobody spoke English (some claim the aussies don't either hah). They grew their own tomatoes in their yards and made sauce for pasta which was consumed every day. Lp's of Mario Lanza could be heard throughout the neighborhood. Card games were played with 'Bostoni' cards. Vino with every meal. Espresso was the only coffee consumed (aussie coffee was considered swill). Boccia ball on weekends to the sound of 'Tarantella'.

Usually it takes one generation before any attempt at assimilation takes place.


Everybody should do as I say and not as I do :lol:

There are like a billion people in Baja (well, a billion plus/minus a little), and about 50 people that pontificate here, insistently telling each other how to live and be a good gringo,... and it they aren't telling you how to live, then they are yammering about their quads, their dumb fishing stories, or talking about off road mayhem. Anybody who takes any of it seriously is a fool. If it wears you out, then quit reading it for a month or two. Given a choice between listening to foolish anus and watching videos on youtube, it really is much more fun watching videas over at youtube, and probably more educational over at youtube.
Rock on!
Peace out!

comitan - 7-16-2008 at 04:34 PM

Pescador

Very well said!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!:yes::yes::yes:

Pacifico - 7-16-2008 at 04:42 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by gnukid

I often am struck by the number of people in Baja who have no respect for the law, who believe that laws shouldn't be enforced. Even more shocking, are people who move to Baja California but feel they should not be involved in their community, they should not learn laws, participate in support of their neighbors and community and just stay out of things.

There is a general rule---where ever you live you have a responsibility to participate in your community and do your part to the extent that you can.

Why some people feel they can move to Baja California and benefit from all it has to offer but ignore language, laws and culture, community is beyond me.

Those gringos who come here and do not do what they can to be a integral citizen to the degree that law allows and requires are a serious threat to our wellbeing.



I feel the same way about many of the Mexican immigrants (both legal and illegal) up here in the U.S.! I guess it is universal.....I fully agree with you gnukid, people must attempt to assimilate and become part of their community.

fulano - 7-16-2008 at 05:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Where is it that some people have a lock on the "truth"?

Maybe the real truth lies with the culture as it is.


"Y es que en el mundo traidor
nada hay verdad ni mentira:
todo es según el color
del cristal con que se mira."

~ Ramon De Campoamor


In this treacherous world, there is neither truth nor lies:
everything is colored according to the glass through which we look.

~ Ramon De Campoamor

CaboRon - 7-16-2008 at 05:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTI8

rts551 - 7-16-2008 at 05:08 PM

OK My Point. No one person has all the answers
Quote:
Originally posted by CaboRon
Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Where is it that some people have a lock on the "truth"?

Maybe the real truth lies with the culture as it is.


Maybe it doesn't ...............

CaboRon

rts551 - 7-16-2008 at 05:15 PM

Quote:
You are right. I am taking a break from the boob tube computer for a month. Is it OK if I ride my quad while I am at it.. See you guys in a month with some pics!!!!!




Everybody should do as I say and not as I do :lol:

There are like a billion people in Baja (well, a billion plus/minus a little), and about 50 people that pontificate here, insistently telling each other how to live and be a good gringo,... and it they aren't telling you how to live, then they are yammering about their quads, their dumb fishing stories, or talking about off road mayhem. Anybody who takes any of it seriously is a fool. If it wears you out, then quit reading it for a month or two. Given a choice between listening to foolish anus and watching videos on youtube, it really is much more fun watching videas over at youtube, and probably more educational over at youtube.
Rock on!
Peace out!

redmesa - 7-16-2008 at 05:23 PM

Fulano , that quote has earned you some respect.

Bruce R Leech - 7-16-2008 at 07:30 PM

jdtrotter if you cant stand the heat don't turn on the gas.

goodbye been nice knowing you

palmeto99 - 7-16-2008 at 07:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bruce R Leech
jdtrotter if you cant stand the heat don't turn on the gas.

goodbye been nice knowing you



Ya, do not go away mad.
just do not bring pasta to a gunfight:lol:lol::lol::lol:

Bruce R Leech - 7-16-2008 at 07:42 PM

good one palmeto99 :light:

palmeto99 - 7-16-2008 at 07:44 PM

I try Bruce, I try.:lol::lol:

comitan - 7-16-2008 at 07:47 PM

One word SICK

CaboRon - 7-16-2008 at 08:03 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by comitan
One word SICK


She'll be back after a while ...

This forum is an addictive exercise ...

And an addict ALWAYS goes back ...

CaboRon

Go ahead and hang it up for a month, any of you, bet you can't do it. :lol::lol::lol:

Sharksbaja - 7-17-2008 at 12:13 AM

I'm hoping for a friggin' week Ron!:P

Sharksbaja - 7-17-2008 at 12:14 AM

But not limited to Diane.;)

CaboRon - 7-17-2008 at 06:59 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Sharksbaja
I'm hoping for a friggin' week Ron!:P


:lol::lol::lol::lol:

I haven't made it a week yet, but I am working on it.

Looks like Dennis was succesful, haven't heard from him for ten days ... Must be part of the purification :saint: before assuming the mantle of moderator .

CaboRon

Capt. George - 7-17-2008 at 03:24 PM

Great Whistler!!!

We will be home on August 3rd, stay into November. We gonna see you?

Our love to Gloria and the girls!!!

rts551 - 7-17-2008 at 07:06 PM

Whistler


They are having the time of their lives. You are the best

Udo - 7-17-2008 at 07:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Where is it that some people have a lock on the "truth"?

Maybe the real truth lies with the culture as it is.


"Y es que en el mundo traidor
nada hay verdad ni mentira:
todo es según el color
del cristal con que se mira."

~ Ramon De Campoamor


In this treacherous world, there is neither truth nor lies:
everything is colored according to the glass through which we look.

~ Ramon De Campoamor


Fulano...
I'll buy lunch and the Pacificos (or mojitos).
Tell me when & where!

palmeto99 - 7-17-2008 at 07:42 PM

Are you throwindown to him?

fulano - 7-17-2008 at 07:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by udowinkler
Fulano...
I'll buy lunch and the Pacificos (or mojitos).
Tell me when & where!


I may be up in Running Springs some time in August. Before I go, I'll U2U you to see if see we can hook-up. I'll be driving right up Live Oak to mi cunada's.

Udo - 7-17-2008 at 08:01 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fulano
Quote:
Originally posted by udowinkler
Fulano...
I'll buy lunch and the Pacificos (or mojitos).
Tell me when & where!


I may be up in Running Springs some time in August. Before I go, I'll U2U you to see if see we can hook-up. I'll be driving right up Live Oak to mi cunada's.

Fulano, I'll be honored if you do that...we'll have a lot in common, bro!
Weekday or weekend, you name the day and I'll make room for us.