BajaNomad - 2 California cops arrested in Tijuana- Stand Accused of Weapons Charges

2 California cops arrested in Tijuana- Stand Accused of Weapons Charges

Woooosh - 8-7-2008 at 09:50 AM

The only reason these guys were caught is because they got the random "revision" red light entering Mexico. Tough luck. If Mexico would inspect every car entering (as we do) gun smugglers would have to use the more risky drug/human smuggling routes and not just drive them into Mexico.

"Two Northern California police officers could face up to 20 years in a Mexican prison after being caught in Tijuana with firearms and about 6,000 rounds of ammunition, authorities said.

The officers, identified as Hermonegenes Llanos and Jorge Luis Matos, were ar- rested Friday afternoon by Mexican authorities. Both are from the Monterey area.

Llanos is a patrol officer and eight-year veteran of the Soledad Police Department in Monterey County. Police Chief Richard Cox conBrmed the arrest yesterday and said an internal affairs probe is under way.

Matos was identified as a civilian police sergeant at the Presidio of Monterey, an Army installation.

A U.S. consular official in Tijuana, speaking on condition of anonymity because of the sen- sitivity of the case, said the officers could face a variety of charges, most of them involving the possession of weapons and equipment restricted under Mexican law to military use.

The official said the charges carry penalties ranging from three to 20 years in prison.

Lauren Mack, a spokeswoman for U.S. Immigrations and Customs Enforcement, said Llanos and Matos were in custody at the La Mesa Penitentiary in Tijuana. However, the consular oflicial said a Mexican federal judge ordered Llanos released on bail yesterday.

The two officers had just crossed the border at the San Ysidro port of entry when their SUV was pulled over by Mexican customs officers for a random inspection, Mack said.

The oflicers found two handguns and "well over 5,000 rounds of ammo" in the vehicle, one official said. A later estimate put the ammunition at 6,000 rounds, Mack said.

Grey Gross: (619) 293-1889; greg.gross@uniontrib.com"

DianaT - 8-7-2008 at 09:59 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
The only reason these guys were caught is because they got the random "revision" red light entering Mexico. Tough luck. If Mexico would inspect every car entering (as we do) gun smugglers would have to use the more risky drug/human smuggling routes and not just drive them into Mexico.

------------
From the article

The oflicers found two handguns and "well over 5,000 rounds of ammo" in the vehicle, one official said. A later estimate put the ammunition at 6,000 rounds, Mack said.

Yes, lots of ammo, but IMHO, two handguns does not make them smugglers, it just makes them really stupid.

Diane

bajalou - 8-7-2008 at 10:02 AM

Quote:

US does NOT inspect every car entering the US - only ones the agent thinks needs inspecting. If the agent doesn't like the way you look, you will get inspected.

Woooosh - 8-7-2008 at 10:09 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajalou

Quote:

US does NOT inspect every car entering the US - only ones the agent thinks needs inspecting. If the agent doesn't like the way you look, you will get inspected.

So you are saying that visual inspection and ID check are not inspections?

ELINVESTIG8R - 8-7-2008 at 10:10 AM

AGENCIA FRONTERIZA DE NOTICIAS DE TIJUANA

TIJUANA BC 6 de agosto de 2008 (AFN).-Dos agentes pertenecientes a un grupo élite de la corporación policíaca de San Diego, los cuales fueron detenidos en la Garita de San Ysidro el pasado viernes, fueron liberados este miércoles mediante el pago de una fianza. Esto, de acuerdo a fuentes extraoficiales, que señalaron a Agencia Fronteriza de Noticias, que los policías estadounidenses, Jorge Matos y Hermógenes Brown Llanes J. viajaban hacia Tijuana para asistir a una fiesta familiar; sin embargo al ser inspeccionados en la línea, les fueron encontrados cartuchos y armas de fuego en el
interior de su vehículo.

A decir de los oficiales de la Unión Americana, el armamento era de un amigo que realizaba prácticas de tiro, y que olvidó el equipo en su auto sin que ellos se percatarán de este hecho. Por este motivo, fueron capturados, bajo cargos por el delito de portación de armas de fuego, y puestos a disposición de las autoridades mexicanas, las cuales finalmente les otorgaron su libertad, tras la asignación de una fianza, cuyo monto no fue revelado.

Loose translation:

Tijuana BC August 6, 2008 (AFN) .- Two agents belonging to an elite group of the San Diego police, who were arrested in San Ysidro last Friday, were released on Wednesday after making bail. This, according to unofficial sources, who told Agencia Fronteriza de Noticias News Agency that U.S. police, Jorge Matos and Hermógenes Llanes J. Brown traveled to Tijuana to attend a family party. When they were inspected they found cartridges and firearms in the vehicle. It was revealed that a friend of the two officers owned the items found in the vehicle which the friend used for target shooting and just forgot the items were in his car. The two officers were not aware the items were in the vehicle. They were arrested and charged with carrying firearms by Mexican authorities. They were later given their freedom after posting bond.

Woooosh - 8-7-2008 at 10:10 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by jdtrotter

Quote:

Yes, lots of ammo, but IMHO, two handguns does not make them smugglers, it just makes them really stupid.

Diane

Another article said they had "training materials" with them. Maybe they were just coing down to Mexico to make a hit. 6,000 casings at a crime scene seeems about right these days.

fdt - 8-7-2008 at 10:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajalou
If the agent doesn't like the way you look, you will get inspected.

I knew a border inspector that would have beautiful girls get out of the car and have them open the trunk and hood, specialy the ones with short skirts :yes:

There isnt a cop in

Bajajack - 8-7-2008 at 11:45 AM

California that doesn't know what the firearms laws are in mexico.

These guys were bringing in 6000 rounds of ammo for who knows what or who, it was not an honest mistake as they claim the ammo belonged to a friend, BS.

They were counting on not being inspected and just got caught!

CaboRon - 8-7-2008 at 11:56 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajajack
California that doesn't know what the firearms laws are in mexico.

These guys were bringing in 6000 rounds of ammo for who knows what or who, it was not an honest mistake as they claim the ammo belonged to a friend, BS.

They were counting on not being inspected and just got caught!

You got that right ....

This was smuggling in ammo for the cartels ....

Unless they were really, really bad shots....

They should rot in a Mexican prison.....

CaboRon

ELINVESTIG8R - 8-7-2008 at 12:02 PM

You can be assured of two things.

1. These two officers will be undergoing intensive investigations both local and federal and will be subjected to a detailed polygraph examination.

2. If they are found to be involved in criminal activity they will be tried in a court of law and if convicted they will go to prison.

LMFAO

Bajajack - 8-7-2008 at 12:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by ELINVESTI8
You can be assured of two things.

1. These two officers will be undergoing intensive investigations both local and federal and will be subjected to a detailed polygraph examination.

2. If they are found to be involved in criminal activity they will be tried in a court of law and if convicted they will go to prison.

That's a joke, right???

ELINVESTIG8R - 8-7-2008 at 12:39 PM

Just wait and see!

Von - 8-7-2008 at 02:05 PM

QUE GUEYS!!!!! I know police officers have common sense, you got to be kidding right?

aha baja - 8-7-2008 at 02:19 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajajack

Quote:

Which country.... Given bail I think it would be a good idea to go back home and STAY

ELINVESTIG8R - 8-7-2008 at 02:21 PM

These two officers are in so much trouble here in the US. It will not be swept under the carpet.

Yes, I have already written

Bajajack - 8-7-2008 at 02:49 PM

the headline for them. After a thorough investigation it has been decided that the Orficers involved made an honest mistake and all is forgiven!

vacaenbaja - 8-7-2008 at 04:00 PM

Does anyone know the going rate for a properly obtained 45 automatic? My frined and I were talking to a police officer
in one of the smaller towns in baja. We were asking him about his duties and the types of crimes he sees. The talk then went on to the subject of how much various weapons cost. I do not know how true this statement is but he said that to properly obtain a pistol would cost a few thousand
dollars. My friend who has been through a few riots always
has a few thousand rounds in the trunk. Even his peers think that's overkill so to speak.
If the pricing is true one could make it quite a profitable weekend on just two little guns and enough ammo for a
small south of the boarder shootout. Smuggling? You bet.

DENNIS - 8-7-2008 at 04:05 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by vacaenbaja
If the pricing is true one could make it quite a profitable weekend on just two little guns and enough ammo for a
small south of the boarder shootout. Smuggling? You bet.

I like to pretend that all cops are honest and wouldn't do anything like that.

CaboRon - 8-7-2008 at 05:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

I like to pretend that all cops are honest and wouldn't do anything like that.

Mexico has a very f***ed up

Bajajack - 8-7-2008 at 06:01 PM

system regarding arms and ammo. There are no regular stores where they are available except through government channels.

If obtained legally a pistol can run 2-3 thousand and ammo if obtained through legal channels is a real PITA to get.

That's why everyone including the cops buy theirs on the street.

At the lastest count in 2007 there was something like 3500 private legally registered firearms in all of mexico.

DENNIS - 8-7-2008 at 06:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajajack
At the lastest count in 2007 there was something like 3500 private legally registered firearms in all of mexico.

This has been done here before and the ideas presented in the past tell of ease of ownership for Mexicans and I can remember long back, a sporting goods store on Ruiz, across from Hussongs that had a selection of high power rifles on display for sale.

Where are you getting your figures, Jack?

Bajajack - 8-7-2008 at 08:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajajack
At the lastest count in 2007 there was something like 3500 private legally registered firearms in all of mexico.

Ministry of Defense, look it up!

And yes you can get the permit easily if you want to pay the price and go through Sedena, the very reason very few mexicans have legal firearms.

No firearm is legal in mexico unless it's cleared through Sedena, look it up!

vacaenbaja - 8-7-2008 at 08:53 PM

Boy I do not know of a single time that a police officer had let someone go because the contraband found in the car was "someone elses not mine." I borrowed the car "etc.
It never goes that way without getting charged with possesion. Those guys got off real easy and someone ( boarder liason et al) must have pulled some big strings.

Taco de Baja - 8-8-2008 at 07:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by vacaenbaja
Boy I do not know of a single time that a police officer had let someone go because the contraband found in the car was "someone elses not mine." I borrowed the car "etc.
It never goes that way without getting charged with possesion. Those guys got off real easy and someone ( boarder liason et al) must have pulled some big strings.

The cops let my stepdaughter off once, she and her boyfriend at the time were smoking pot in a parking lot, around midnight, the cops pulled in to see what they were doing. Smelled the pot, found the pipe, found a bag of weed....She though she was going to jail. She was polite, and admitted it was hers. The cops told them to be careful being out so late at night and let them go! She, of course did not tell us about this for several years after it happened. The cops did not even take the pipe or the weed.

Woooosh - 8-8-2008 at 08:21 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Taco de Baja

Quote:

That's a great story. I guess it didn't happen in Rosarito Beach where the police just resell the pot they take from the kids ten minutes later. I had a neighbor move back to the states after a policeman offerred to sell her pot.

Mexico no longer charges people for posessing a personal amount of pot. If it's under 28 grams and in one bag- and it's yours, you are OK. If if you have 28 grams in one bag and 27 little empty bags in your other pocket you will go to jail for distribution. The purpose of the law change was to free the police to go after more serious crime and drug distributors.

[Edited on 8-8-2008 by Woooosh]

DENNIS - 8-8-2008 at 09:01 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
The purpose of the law change was to free the police to go after more serious crime and drug distributors.

Of course it is.
I used to think that, when the underpaid police were screaming for a raise, the city would just put up more stop signs.

Jeezo...My spelling has gone to hell.

[Edited on 8-8-2008 by DENNIS]

Woooosh - 8-8-2008 at 11:05 AM

I'm sure someone here will find it. The link was posted in December after the last elections. The prosecutors won't pursue criminal charges for personal amounts of pot- I guess it doesn't mean the police won't try scare tactics to shake you down for cash. It is Mexico after all.

Remember the law in Mexico

Bajajack - 8-8-2008 at 11:22 AM

is whatever they say it is at that particular time and place and laws for mexicans vs gringos are not created equal.

The Prosecuters may not Prosecute but does anyone really want to test the system to find out???

DENNIS - 8-8-2008 at 11:42 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Woooosh
I'm sure someone here will find it. The link was posted in December after the last elections. The prosecutors won't pursue criminal charges for personal amounts of pot- I guess it doesn't mean the police won't try scare tactics to shake you down for cash. It is Mexico after all.

Exactly. I remember this as one of Vicente Fox's initiatives.

The mexican congress

Bajajack - 8-8-2008 at 01:32 PM

or whatever it is did indeed pass the law decriminalizing small amounts of all illegal drugs.

This was done at the urging of Fox himself.

When word got out the US put the pressure on Fox and he vetoed the whole thing.

CaboRon - 8-8-2008 at 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajajack
or whatever it is did indeed pass the law decriminalizing small amounts of all illegal drugs.

This was done at the urging of Fox himself.

When word got out the US put the pressure on Fox and he vetoed the whole thing.

And that's a fact, Jack..

Yessir, I was

Bajajack - 8-8-2008 at 06:01 PM

jumpin for joy when they passed that law, then Fox, the friggin traitor he was vetoed it. Just when everybody thought they were gonna be safe he knocks the wind right outta the sails.

You cant trust no Politicos! :lol:

Bajafun777 - 8-8-2008 at 11:59 PM

Well, I know 6,000 rounds sounds like a lot of ammo but I know a number of officers that try to buy this and more. Now, you may ask why and the reason is simple--- ammo was real hard to find even for agencies due to the war in Iraq especially 9's, 40 cal and 45 cal. Cops also do dumb things that make you just shake your head sometimes when it comes to how many guns they have to own and ammo they have to have.
I had a friend once that did something just about like this but not so much ammo but it was a case of 45 cal. Now, the worse thing was I did not know he had it and he had intended to take it out but pulled a double and rushing around like a chicken with his head cut off forgot, yes forgot, to take it out of the vehicle where he had it in the spare tire covered area. I found out when we were already in Mexico and he was looking for his fins for the ocean. Needless to say it was nerve racking until we got back into U.S.A. So, can dumb things happen to cops, yes and it doesn't mean they are dirty right off. By the way I always searched my buddy's vehicle after that when going into Mexico and he got peeed every time but I did not care, my memory was long and hard on this. I also check and double check my own vehicle to make sure not one single shell casing or a round is inside. My fear of this is a long hard sweat that makes me never want to be in that situation again. I know a number will say bull$_ _t. Never say never and tired people in a hurry do dumb things sometimes that have very serious consequences. Such is life "Believe It or Not!!!" Later------ bajafun777

CaboRon - 8-9-2008 at 06:18 AM

Why didn't you discard that case of ammo into the ocean ?

You carried it back to the US? Risking imprisonment in a Mexican jail ?

CaboRon

Woooosh - 8-10-2008 at 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by lencho

Quote:

Originally posted by CaboRon
And that's a fact, Jack..

OK, Whoosh, you started this. Will you please support your allegation that drug laws have somehow changed in the last couple of years? I'm not challenging you-- nor supporting you (I have no information either way)-- but I for one would appreciate some third-party verification as to what you've stated here. Seems important.

Thanks-- Larry

I guess I was too busy celebrating that the law was passed to hear that Fox had vetoed it. I do suppose the passage of the law got more attention than the subsequent veto. My bad. I just got back from Amsterdam where soft drugs (hash and pot) are openly tolerated but harsh penalties are imposed for other drugs. It works for them- but they are a civilized nation.

Woooosh - 8-10-2008 at 09:10 AM

http://www.coffeeshopsiberie.nl/eng/

I think people will be surprised when they visit the website and look at the pics. People drink coffee, play cards and chess, read books, check their e-mails on the free PC and generally just socialize. The most fun is sittng at the bar and watching Americans come in and squirm sheepishly when figuring out what to buy.

I've been going to this Coffeeshop for over twenty years. Amsterdam has over 250 coffeeshops- all with different themes (some are artsy, some are punk, some are hard rock). You see people from 18 to 80, there's no social stigma- and some people actually just have coffee.

I have a photo of the hash/weed menu- but can't seem to shrink it enough to upload it. This is how a civilized country deals with recreational drug use...

Coffeeshop House Rules (Very interesting is that the new Dutch law prohibits indoor tobacco smoke- not pot smoke. Most Europeans mix their pot with tobacco, and don't smoke it pure. This is causing the coffeeshops to install ventilated smoking rooms for tobacco while people hitting the bong or smoking hashish can sit at the bar. Way crazy)

"THE HOUSE RULES are written to provide everyone with a clear understanding of and to prevent misunderstandings that may occur by explaining you the conduct of business within the boundaries of the Dutch law. Rules are being maintained carefully and strictly to ensure each guest a pleasant stay.

Entrance exclusively for persons of 18 years and older, even not for minors accompanied by an adult.

ID is obligatory for everyone; and should be showed upon our request (as of 01.01.2005 is each citizen of 14 years and older obliged by law to carry a valid ID at all times).

Only the following ID is accepted: passport, identity card & driver's license. So: not expired, no copies, no elderly cards, no student cards. When we encounter a fake ID, police is informed immediately; you will not be welcome in our coffeeshop ever again. We like to get a clear view at your face when you show us your ID (please take off your helmet, cap, sun glasses, etc).

Possession, use and dealing hard drugs and alcohol is strictly prohibited: we will call the police immediately when we identify or suspect such activities, you are not welcome ever again.

The law allows us buy 5 grams per person per day maximum. You are not allowed to carry more than 5 grams whilst in our coffee shop.

We do not tolerate selling, not in the coffee shop and not in the neighbourhood of the coffee shop. We will take the same action as mentioned in 6.

The Dutch law on tobacco prohibits smoking tobacco in the coffeeshop. Therefore we cannot allow anyone to smoke tobacco products inside.

Selling our products to minors will never be tolerated.

Possession of weapons, whatever kind, is prohibited.

Aggression will never be tolerated.

Discrimination will never be tolerated.

We have the right to refuse customers entrance to the building, terrace and parcel at any point.

Consumptions have to be paid for immediately; a consumption is compulsory; you are not allowed to bring your own.

It is forbidden to use your mobile phone.

Dogs are not allowed inside.

Those who do not park their vehicle in a proper manner will not be served.

We are frequently (24/7) checking up on disturbance and hindrance in the shop and neighbourhood, such as making noise and leaving trash. At identification we will report the crime to the police."

Taco de Baja - 8-10-2008 at 09:15 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by CaboRon
Why didn't you discard that case of ammo into the ocean ?

You carried it back to the US? Risking imprisonment in a Mexican jail ?

CaboRon

Cost for a box of ammo: $25
Cost for a case of ammo: $240
Cost of a week long camping trip to Baja for 2: $400
Cost of the Federalies finding said ammo, that you could have simply buried in the desert: Priceless

loki - 8-10-2008 at 11:20 AM

Its possible these two fellows are telling the truth.Most cops that I know will plink a lot of ammo at the range and having that much of it is not a crime in the USA .I have at least that much in my home in San Diego right now. They also did not have a lot of weapons on their person so it could be an honest mistake.
I also know people that take down protective vests ,radios and the like to give to the smaller police forces in Baja as they can not afford them in their small budgets.

MEXICO UNDER SIEGE: U.S. guns arm Mexican drug cartels

Lee - 8-10-2008 at 11:23 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by vacaenbaja
If the pricing is true one could make it quite a profitable weekend on just two little guns and enough ammo for a small south of the boarder shootout. Smuggling? You bet.

http://www.latimes.com/news/nationworld/nation/la-na-guns10-...

SIERRA VISTA, ARIZ. -- High-powered automatic weapons and ammunition are flowing virtually unchecked from border states into Mexico, fueling a war among drug traffickers, the army and police that has left thousands dead, according to U.S. and Mexican officials.

The munitions are hidden under trucks and stashed in the trunks of cars, or concealed under the clothing of people who brazenly walk across the international bridges. They are showing up in seizures and in the aftermath of shootouts between the cartels and police in Mexico.

More than 90% of guns seized at the border or after raids and shootings in Mexico have been traced to the United States, according to the U.S. Bureau of Alcohol, Tobacco, Firearms and Explosives. Last year, 2,455 weapons traces requested by Mexico showed that guns had been purchased in the United States, according to the ATF. Texas, Arizona and California accounted for 1,805 of those traced weapons.

loki - 8-10-2008 at 11:28 AM

I guess none would make there way up from the drug terrorists partners in Columbia where gun registration is the norm. :lol:

k-rico - 8-10-2008 at 11:29 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by loki
Its possible these two fellows are telling the truth.Most cops that I know will plink a lot of ammo at the range and having that much of it is not a crime in the USA .I have at least that much in my home in San Diego right now.

You have at least 6000 rounds of ammo in your house? What for?

loki - 8-10-2008 at 11:37 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico

Quote:

You have at least 6000 rounds of ammo in your house? What for?

Its closer to 8000 rounds .
I am ex law enforcement and still teach gun courses. I also reload my own and for friends.

k-rico - 8-10-2008 at 11:43 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by loki

Quote:

Originally posted by k-rico

Quote:

You have at least 6000 rounds of ammo in your house? What for?

Its closer to 8000 rounds .
I am ex law enforcement and still teach gun courses. I also reload my own and for friends.

Oh I see. Do you give this ammo away or sell it?

loki - 8-10-2008 at 11:50 AM

I reload the brass from my friends and return it to them as that is where you are going with this. I am well versed in the laws as it pertains to this . I also shoot over a thousand rounds a week myself as I compete in competition and try to remain sharp.
Some people golf, I shoot firearms.

Sharksbaja - 8-10-2008 at 01:16 PM

I'll be more careful.........fergit I said anythang :saint:

btw, yer in good company here at BN

Legalize soft drugs. It would save money and lives.

loki - 8-10-2008 at 01:39 PM

Your right. More time is wasted on soft drugs and the manpower is needed elsewhere. You still need to intercept the major exporters of these same soft drugs.