BajaNomad

Border Crossing - Passports no longer needed

The Gull - 10-5-2008 at 05:17 PM

OK,

All of us have been reading about the tight screening at the border crossing back to the US at SY and Otay.

I am reporting that today, at each of the crossings, two cars crossed with some friends who visited me this weekend. In both cars, multiple occupants did not have US passports in their possession and they are US citizens. All they showed only a driver's license from California. One showed a Florida ID that wasn't a driver's license. In total, only one car had one person who had a passport in their possession.

Each of the four cars' occupants chatted up the CBP agent and all were allowed to enter the US without a secondary trip.

From this experience, tell every US citizen you know that they can come to Baja without a US passport as apparently the policies that have been published for the entire 2008 year are just bull.

By the way, with the state of the economy in Baja, we were able to go to numerous shopping places and restaurants where we got great service and attention. Also, the number of competitors for tourist visitor dollars is dropping fast as the businesses are failing or are just failing to open their doors.

Anyone out there have an opinion, viewpoint or story?

Cajones - 10-5-2008 at 05:20 PM

The requirement to show a passport when entering the US from Mexico was deferred again until 6/1/2009.

CaboRon - 10-5-2008 at 06:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Cajones
The requirement to show a passport when entering the US from Mexico was deferred again until 6/1/2009.


Only ground travel was deferred ...

You still need a passport to fly in/out .

And although technically you don't need the passport for travel by sea the cruise lines have been requireing passports for some time now.

CaboRon

Timo1 - 10-5-2008 at 08:35 PM

Don't even go therewith USBP and me

David K - 10-5-2008 at 08:46 PM

I posted this on 12/12/07:

(in a nutshell, no passport required, yet...)

==============================================

U.S. Department of Homeland Security

Press Release

December 3, 2007
Contact: DHS Press Office, (202) 282-8010
DOS Press Office, (202) 647-2492

TRAVELERS REMINDED OF NEW DOCUMENT REQUIREMENTS BEGINNING JANUARY 31, 2008
Documents Proving Citizenship and Identity Will be Required When Entering The United States Through Land and Sea Ports of Entry

WASHINGTON – The U.S. Department of Homeland Security (DHS) and the U.S. Department of State (DOS) remind the traveling public that as of Jan. 31, 2008, all adult travelers will be required to present proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate, and proof of identity, such as a driver’s license, when entering the United States through land and sea ports of entry. DHS will be issuing a notice in the Federal Register formally announcing the change.

This change is a necessary step to prepare travelers and ease the transition to the future requirements of the Western Hemisphere Travel Initiative (WHTI). WHTI proposes to establish documentation requirements for travelers entering the United States who were previously exempt, including citizens of the U.S., Canada, and Bermuda. As recommended by the 9/11 Commission, Congress enacted WHTI in the Intelligence Reform and Terrorism Prevention Act of 2004. WHTI will result in both enhanced security and increased facilitation across the border once implemented. During this transition, DHS and the Department of State are working diligently to minimize the impact on legitimate trade and travel.

Currently, U.S. Customs and Border Protection (CBP) officers may accept oral declarations of citizenship from U.S. and Canadian citizens seeking entry into the United States through a land or sea border. However, as of January 31, 2008:
§ Oral declarations of citizenship alone will no longer be accepted
§ U.S. and Canadian citizens ages 19 and older will need to present a government-issued photo ID, such as a driver’s license, along with proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate or naturalization certificate
§ Children ages 18 and under will only be required to present proof of citizenship, such as a birth certificate
§ Passports and trusted traveler program cards - NEXUS, SENTRI and FAST - will continue to be accepted for cross-border travel
All existing nonimmigrant visa and passport requirements will remain in effect and will not be altered by this change.

DOS reminds the public that the current turnaround time for a passport is four to six weeks, so Americans planning international travel may wish to apply now. For information on obtaining a U.S. Passport visit www.travel.state.gov or call 1-877-487-2778. Specific documentation requirements for land, sea and air travel may be found at www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/travel/vacation/ready_set_go/. To learn more about NEXUS, SENTRI and FAST, visit www.cbp.gov/xp/cgov/travel/trusted_traveler/.

greybaby - 10-5-2008 at 09:12 PM

Went on a cruise in January and we couldn't print our boarding passes until we entered our passport numbers.

We'll be driving across this next week and though they may not be "required" why would anyone want to get that one cranky border patrol who would send you to secondary. Have your passport ready, hand it to them and it's usually "have a good day".

I crossed later today

The Gull - 10-5-2008 at 09:50 PM

I went across at Otay about 6 pm today and in the SENTRI lane I asked the agent why did my friends get through and he said it was at the discretion of the agents.

What horsech1t!!!!!!!

robrt8 - 10-5-2008 at 11:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by The Gull
I went across at Otay about 6 pm today and in the SENTRI lane I asked the agent why did my friends get through and he said it was at the discretion of the agents.


That's the same answer I've been given (5x last month) and I crossed 2x with a DL only. No secondary.

So what's the big deal?

Dave - 10-6-2008 at 09:15 AM

Just get the friggin passport. :rolleyes:

Whether or not it's a requirement now, eventually it will.

Woooosh - 10-6-2008 at 09:37 AM

I've crossed recently with only my CostCo card as ID (I forgot my wallet and passport... duh). Until the law requiring passports at land crossing kicks in the CBP officers continue to have complete discretion. So long as they are convinced you are a citizen (through questioning), you can be passed through without ANY identification (although not a good risk for anyone not blond haired and blue eyed). As a US citizen they are supposed to work with you, not against you.

Get The Passport

MrBillM - 10-6-2008 at 09:43 AM

I've found that the crossings have been smoother since they started asking for the passports. Fewer questions, less delay and on my way. Before they even get the question out, I'm handing them the two passports.

The Gull - 10-6-2008 at 09:46 AM

Dave,

The point is that all of the folks who visited me do own passports and had them safely at home in the US.

Additionally, DK republished the notice from DHS that clearly calls for something like a DL and second document, maybe a birth certificate.

No second document was requested of any of the crossers, so the rule must be simply the discretion of the officer. This has now been confirmed by other Nomads.

If the practice of the DHS officers is to be subjective, I trust that you wouldn't object to having that information available for other Nomads who may be worried about crossing with someone who just happens NOT to have their birth certificate or passport in their possession at that moment.

Certainly, the most secure way would be to apply for one of three DHS accepted documents, SENTRI pass, Passport or Passport card. There are valid arguments as to which of these is the most practical to an individual's needs. In the absence of any of these, American citizens are crossing everyday just like they have for all of the 20th and 21st century (so far).

Therefore, the DHS has done it again - given the American public, lip service national security.

That's my point

Dave - 10-6-2008 at 11:51 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by The Gull
If the practice of the DHS officers is to be subjective, I trust that you wouldn't object to having that information available for other Nomads who may be worried about crossing with someone who just happens NOT to have their birth certificate or passport in their possession at that moment.


It's always been subjective. Trust me...In twelve years of regular crossing I've been diddled with plenty. If they told me I needed an Albainian passport I'd get one. Just so there would be one thing less they could flock around with.

That we should tell our friends they really don't need a passport may be technically correct but perhaps disingenous. They'll get back in the States alright. But they might get a finger-wave bonus.

People, just get the friggin passport.

The Gull - 10-6-2008 at 06:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave
Trust me...In twelve years of regular crossing I've been diddled with plenty.


In my 40 years of crossing and 20 years of which has been semi-monthly, I have only been to secondary three times. Each time was valid and took a few minutes.

Perhaps there is a cause for your treatment?

Passport

Howard - 10-6-2008 at 07:38 PM

Like a rookie, of which I am not, on a flight to Seattle I left my passport at the Alaska Airline counter at LAX on 7/6/08. A couple of days later I realized what had happened and got nothing but double talk from Alaska Airlines who provided no assistance in helping get my passport back from the counter and the lost and found was also of no help. Anyway, I applied for a new passport and did not pay the rush fee and I received my new passport in only 9 or 10 days after giving all the paperwork, etc. at the large post office very close to LAX. The 9 or 10 days include the mailing time to my house. Very impressive turn around time.

Ken Cooke - 10-6-2008 at 09:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by MrBillM
I've found that the crossings have been smoother since they started asking for the passports.


My feeling has been the complete opposite. Stamps from Colombia, Peru, Panama, and El Salvador quickly make for a chilly reception upon returning to the USA.

greybaby - 10-6-2008 at 09:47 PM

Getting a passport for us was certainly easier than getting a Pet Passport (yes, I said Pet Passport) for my African Grey Parrot. So I agree - just get it. It's pretty painless and is good for 10 years.

The Gull - 10-6-2008 at 10:49 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Ken Cooke
Quote:
Originally posted by MrBillM
I've found that the crossings have been smoother since they started asking for the passports.


My feeling has been the complete opposite. Stamps from Colombia, Peru, Panama, and El Salvador quickly make for a chilly reception upon returning to the USA.


Once again, self-imposed persecution comes to light. I have those same stamps right along some from Chile, Ecuador, Brazil, Costa Rica, Guatemala, Nicaragua, PRC & Russia. Maybe the cause is more about the person and the 'tude, than the stamps.

Oso - 10-7-2008 at 07:50 AM

Thank god they do have some discretion. I had a senior moment a couple months ago and left my passport at home when I made a run down to the San Pedro Martir. I was really sweating it at the garita. I told the agent what happened and he asked where I was born, didn't seem quite satisfied and asked where I was raised. He was obviously listening carefully to my accent. He cautioned me not to forget next time and waved me on. As soon as I got home I applied for the new passport card. It cost me $20 and took less than 2 weeks to arrive. Last week I rode along with a Mexican neighbor to a skeet shooting event in Sonora. Coming back across, I handed the card to the agent (my neighbor's US born son was driving, handed her his birth certificate and DL and spoke to her in Spanish). I said nothing. She stepped back into the booth for a minute then handed us our papers and waved us on. I keep the card in my wallet all the time now so as long as I don't forget THAT, I have great peace of mind. It's definitely worth the twenty bucks.

BTW, the Border Patrol does not man the ports of entry. Those are Customs agents. They are both components of ICE, which is now a division of DHS.

2-tie-dye-4 - 10-7-2008 at 10:25 PM

I crossed at Tecate about 3 weeks ago. I showed an AZ driver's license and was asked if I had a birth cert. to go with it. I explained that I left my passport at home and didn't realize it until I was already in Mex. The agent gave me a warning and that was all. I then went to Algodones to get glasses, walked across, and I explained right away what my sitution was, I got a reprimand and was let through. In the past, my boyfriend and I have showed passports and it's taken longer because we have so many stamps. I think they check the computer more. Then we started showing only driver's license's and got through quickly and warned to get passports as of Jan 2008. As we all know, that wasn't necessary. Yes, get a passport and don't forget it on your dresser.

vgabndo - 10-8-2008 at 02:13 PM

I find it interesting how this relatively small group of foreign travelers is so conversant on the subject of travel documents. It is also curious that folks like tie-dye, and Ken suffer from having TOO MANY stamps on their passports, and we have someone stating that they are ready to be President of the USA who still has eight and a half years left on her very first passport. Is there anyone else who thinks that visiting other countries and learning about their cultures has broadened their world view? Has it changed you in any way? Is there a personal growth component to traveling abroad?

rts551 - 10-8-2008 at 07:47 PM

I am shocked as well DK Take your BS to off-topic

Ken Cooke - 10-8-2008 at 07:56 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by vgabndoIs there anyone else who thinks that visiting other countries and learning about their cultures has broadened their world view? Has it changed you in any way? Is there a personal growth component to traveling abroad?


Thanks for clarifying the topic, David. This comment went completely over my head. Personally, I hope our friend in AK stays put.

As for learning about cultures, to me, Baja has provided mainly a place for leisure and "Getting away from it all" from a short distance from the USA. I have seen Europe about 3 times, but Central and South America has a beauty and a soul that calls for repeated exploration. Something you don't find here in the US. Seeing exactly how others live, observing their family units, how people survive while doing without - their virtues, their vices - has shown me how solid and secure our way of life here in the United States is.

dao45 - 10-8-2008 at 09:36 PM

Can anyone tell me how to get into the off topic section?Someone did once but the pass word didnt work?

BajaWarrior - 10-8-2008 at 09:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dao45
Can anyone tell me how to get into the off topic section?Someone did once but the pass word didnt work?


over18 is the password

David K - 10-9-2008 at 08:52 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
I am shocked as well DK Take your BS to off-topic


Hmmm, if you look again you will see I was responding with some balance to what was posted BEFORE: "...and we have someone stating that they are ready to be President of the USA who still has eight and a half years left on her very first passport"

Doesn't that belong in off topic, too?

Fair is fair, right?:yes:;)

CaboRon - 10-9-2008 at 12:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Dave
Just get the friggin passport. :rolleyes:

Whether or not it's a requirement now, eventually it will.


I have failed to understand the thousands of words on the is forum about passports.

I have carried a US passport since I was eighteen years old.

Never considered it a problem .....

And if you enjoy traveling the world, as I do, it is unthinkable to not have one.

All I can deduce from this is the vast majority of the posters on this forum never go anywhere except La Baja.

So, get a passport already and quit crying like a bunch of babies.

CaboRon

mtgoat666 - 10-9-2008 at 12:35 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K

I think that is great to have seen the world as long as you recognize that America is the shining light of hope and freedom in the world and...



DK, your blatant nationalism is showing thru. Also, another thing showing is your lack of overseas experience, if you had such experience you would find that some countries in fact do some things better than USA. (oops, such blasphemy!)

Also, get out a bit, and you may learn that calling the USA "America" is sort of short sighted and self-centered (aren't us "Americans" by definition short sighted and self-centered?). Lot's of other "americans" out there in the lands of North, Central and South America.

I always like it when DK brings up politics, as he is invariably wrong and muddle headed,.. see you in OT, DK :lol:

CaboRon - 10-9-2008 at 12:41 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by mtgoat666
Quote:
Originally posted by David K

I think that is great to have seen the world as long as you recognize that America is the shining light of hope and freedom in the world and...



DK, your blatant nationalism is showing thru. Also, another thing showing is your lack of overseas experience, if you had such experience you would find that some countries in fact do some things better than USA. (oops, such blasphemy!)

Also, get out a bit, and you may learn that calling the USA "America" is sort of short sighted and self-centered (aren't us "Americans" by definition short sighted and self-centered?). Lot's of other "americans" out there in the lands of North, Central and South America.

I always like it when DK brings up politics, as he is invariably wrong and muddle headed,.. see you in OT, DK :lol:


I have also felt that DK's travel experience is extreemly limited.

And DK, you can stuff your myopic politics.

CaboRon

norte - 10-9-2008 at 01:07 PM

Don't you guys realize passports are a way of traking you. Listen to Davidk, he is obviously well educated in these matters.

Love it or leave it!!!!!

woody with a view - 10-9-2008 at 01:18 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by norte
Don't you guys realize passports are a way of traking you. Listen to Davidk, he is obviously well educated in these matters.

Love it or leave it!!!!!


not when i "where" my tin foil hat with the spinning blade on top!

Passports:

toneart - 10-9-2008 at 02:49 PM

What's the problem? If it is or will be required, you must have it or the ID card. Sure it is used to track you. That is the age we live in. Big Brother already knows your every move and it is cross referenced in so many ways that it renders a fear of tracking, when you cross the border, a moot point.

I don't like being tracked either, but to resist getting the passport greatly isolates you. In isolation you can live smugly, in your "better than.." attitude and write love letters to Pat Buchannan and Lou Dodds, but you would miss out on the rich cultures of the world. Of course, what you don't know, you don't know! Ignorance is bliss, lazy and a cop out. By the way, I have had a passport for 50 years. All the renewals have many stamps. The word "Passport" is just that...your pass into and out of ports.

It is true that your treatment is subject to the whim and mood of the individual ICE agent, but I have nothing to hide and if I get a rude one, which rarely happens, it is because they are having a bad day...not me. True, they can cause you to have a bad day, but that depends on your mouth. Keep it zipped and be respectful.

I have been sent to Secondary several times. I think all of them are because I tow a passenger trailer. Until I bought it a few years ago, I was never sent to Secondary. Even so, the agents in Secondary have always been friendly and the search takes less than five minutes.

Now if I wanted to get really paranoid, I would worry about Homeland Security snatching me and rendering me to an undisclosed location, never to be heard of again because of something I may have said in this forum. That is a possibility, projecting current trends by the Bush Administration, but we are not there yet. I am a good American and so far, my opinions are protected by the First Amendment.

In conclusion, a passport is a facilitator and an ID that confirms that I am a free person, sanctioned by the government of The United States, to travel wherever it is legal to do so, and be welcomed back home again. :)

woody with a view - 10-9-2008 at 02:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by toneart
What's the problem? If it is or will be required, you must have it or the ID card. Sure it is used to track you. That is the age we live in. Big Brother already knows your every move and it is cross referenced in so many ways that it renders a fear of tracking, when you cross the border, a moot point.

I don't like being tracked either, but to resist getting the passport greatly isolates you. In isolation you can live smugly, in your "better than.." attitude and write love letters to Pat Buchannan and Lou Dodds, but you would miss out on the rich cultures of the world. Of course, what you don't know, you don't know! Ignorance is bliss, lazy and a cop out. By the way, I have had a passport for 50 years. All the renewals have many stamps. The word "Passport" is just that...your pass into and out of ports.

It is true that your treatment is subject to the whim and mood of the individual ICE agent, but I have nothing to hide and if I get a rude one, which rarely happens, it is because they are having a bad day...not me. True, they can cause you to have a bad day, but that depends on your mouth. Keep it zipped and be respectful.

I have been sent to Secondary several times. I think all of them are because I tow a passenger trailer. Until I bought it a few years ago, I was never sent to Secondary. Even so, the agents in Secondary have always been friendly and the search takes less than five minutes.

Now if I wanted to get really paranoid, I would worry about Homeland Security snatching me and rendering me to an undisclosed location, never to be heard of again because of something I may have said in this forum. That is a possibility, projecting current trends by the Bush Administration, but we are not there yet. I am a good American and so far, my opinions are protected by the First Amendment.

In conclusion, a passport is a facilitator and an ID that confirms that I am a free person, sanctioned by the government of The United States, to travel wherever it is legal to do so, and be welcomed back home again. :)



POST OF THE DAY!!!!!!!!

norte - 10-9-2008 at 03:55 PM

Yes and just another freedom given up. Pretty soon we will be just like Mexico and fighting all the Narcos. Getting back to Baja, the reason we don't have to show passports right now is to allow all our dollars to flow south.

David K - 10-9-2008 at 05:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by mtgoat666
Quote:
Originally posted by David K

I think that is great to have seen the world as long as you recognize that America is the shining light of hope and freedom in the world and...



DK, your blatant nationalism is showing thru. Also, another thing showing is your lack of overseas experience, if you had such experience you would find that some countries in fact do some things better than USA. (oops, such blasphemy!)

Also, get out a bit, and you may learn that calling the USA "America" is sort of short sighted and self-centered (aren't us "Americans" by definition short sighted and self-centered?). Lot's of other "americans" out there in the lands of North, Central and South America.

I always like it when DK brings up politics, as he is invariably wrong and muddle headed,.. see you in OT, DK :lol:


LOL... America, America, I love America...

Let's see... countries/ territories of the world I have set foot upon, toured, lived in, etc. (besides the U.S. and Mexico): Fiji, New Zealand, Australia, Hong Kong, Japan, Egypt, Greece, Italy, Vatican City, Switzerland, Germany (West), Luxemburg, France, United Kingdom (England), Canada (BC)... In addition, I lived and went to school in Australia for 6 months... where I learned the importance of America to the free world and how fortunate I was to be born there.

I didn't say anything negative about other countries or that they do not do things as good as us... too much smoke in your eyes mt.goat?

Another time I bet you won't apologize for being wrong?

Edit typo for Switzerland

[Edited on 10-10-2008 by David K]

bajaguy - 10-9-2008 at 06:02 PM

Switzedland.........wonder if that's where the Swizzle Stick was invented????

robrt8 - 10-9-2008 at 06:06 PM

Of course get a passport, by all means.
But if it's forgotten, or someone somehow finds them self without SOB, let it be known that you will not be turned back if you have an ID or otherwise appear as an Anglo who can speak without an accent.
Dutch and Swedish people, pay attention!

Ken Cooke - 10-9-2008 at 06:47 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K[/Ken, when you quoted Perry... you left out some of his words?:


I've carried a passport since I was 15.

Amsterdam at 16 rocked!! :bounce:

As for the election, let the best man win! :light:

lizard lips - 2-20-2015 at 08:15 AM

Is it still ok to produce a drivers license and original birth certificate when crossing back to the US?

It's been so long since I didn't have a passport and friends are coming today without a PP.

Thanks

David K - 2-20-2015 at 09:04 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lizard lips  
Is it still ok to produce a drivers license and original birth certificate when crossing back to the US?

It's been so long since I didn't have a passport and friends are coming today without a PP.

Thanks


Wow, way to bring up a thread that is 7 years old Dan!!

Americans cannot be denied entry back into their own country... proving they're Americans is easiest done with a passport or passport card. It is up to the border officer to send you to secondary to better prove your citizenship if he is not convinced by your words or other IDs. I have family members who had no issues at all coming back to the U.S. without a passport or birth certificate the past few years. They apparently do a great job looking and sounding like American citizens?

but can you get an FMM without one?

akshadow - 2-20-2015 at 09:57 AM

If you are going past the immediate border area and you get FMM?


Quote: Originally posted by David K  
Quote: Originally posted by lizard lips  
Is it still ok to produce a drivers license and original birth certificate when crossing back to the US?

It's been so long since I didn't have a passport and friends are coming today without a PP.

Thanks


Wow, way to bring up a thread that is 7 years old Dan!!

Americans cannot be denied entry back into their own country... proving they're Americans is easiest done with a passport or passport card. It is up to the border officer to send you to secondary to better prove your citizenship if he is not convinced by your words or other IDs. I have family members who had no issues at all coming back to the U.S. without a passport or birth certificate the past few years. They apparently do a great job looking and sounding like American citizens?

JoeJustJoe - 2-20-2015 at 10:00 AM

Quote: Originally posted by lizard lips  
Is it still ok to produce a drivers license and original birth certificate when crossing back to the US?

It's been so long since I didn't have a passport and friends are coming today without a PP.

Thanks


Yes, you can still cross the border with a drivers license and birth certificate.

You are still supposed to have US Passport or US Passport Card, but I see people still cross with only their drivers license and birth certificate, and since I often walk over the border. I see the brief exchange at the border, and most of the time the customs guy working the line, says nothing about not having a passport, other times, but rarely, they will tell the person crossing back into the US about the passport requirement, before waving them through.

I have never seen anybody sent to secondary for not having a passport or pass card.

I have also taken extended family members over the border and back, with only a DL and BC, and they had no problems crossing back into the US.

David K - 2-20-2015 at 10:10 AM

Quote: Originally posted by akshadow  
If you are going past the immediate border area and you get FMM?


Well, now that is a southbound issue... and as far as I know and have seen personally at the INM office, a passport is required to get the tourist card (FMM) for stays over 3 days or any trip south of the border zone (Maneadero/ San Felipe). Tourist cards for up to 7 days are FREE, and longer (up to 180 days) are around US$25.

[Edited on 2-20-2015 by David K]

vgabndo - 2-20-2015 at 10:21 AM

That is just freaking stunning...just exactly what does an American citizen LOOK LIKE David? Statistically, compared to the rest of the world, that would be white, fat, speaking only one language, and carrying a gun...right? You never fail to amaze me dude! :lol:

Tomas Tierra - 2-20-2015 at 10:23 AM

When was the last time anyone was asked to produce an FMM? and where? GN ag. Inspection/spray job I'd assume..

I took a buddy last year.. I had an FMM left over from previous trip and didn't want to stop and get him one.. I took the dirt road go around at GN coming and going to avoid the inspection.. Kinda felt like I got away with one.. But can't remember ever being asked to produce my FMM.......

TT

lizard lips - 2-20-2015 at 12:55 PM

THANKS ALLLLLLLLL........