BajaNomad - Santa Maria - Powered by XMB

Santa Maria

Steve&Debby - 1-23-2009 at 09:59 PM

I was reading David K and Ken's trip reports on Santa Maria. I am very interested in doing that trip,but I have some questions for both of them.
The ranch stopped putting the road in about a mile past the mission,if I read Davids report correctly.Looking at the map David has on his report it looks as though it is only a couple of miles to highway 5.It also looks like there is an arroyo or road that goes on to highway 5.
Question is why not continue on down the arroyo to highway 5 ?

With a properly equipped vehicle and carefull driveing.picking your way around the vegetation as to not destroy the land I bet it could be done.

Ken your Rubicon could probably do it. :yes:

I have a friend with a 1958 Chevy pickup and I have a pretty radical CJ 7 we go through the Rubicon and Four Dice trails regularly.

How about it Ken? :yes:

and any one else with a properly equipped vehicle

When would be the best time of year to make this run?

Go down highway 1 to Santa Inez then across to Santa Maria then make our way across to highway 5 and to Gonzaga then to San Flippy then head home. Of course alot of beer and fish tacos in between :tumble:

I love it! Mision Santa Maria to Gonzaga Bay!

David K - 1-24-2009 at 01:28 AM

To drive across Baja there has been a dream for years!

The short answer is that it is a steep sided canyon with waterfall drops and giant boulders... it is almost impossible to go down the canyon on foot!

The Jesuits who founded the mission at Santa Maria in 1767 had gone up the canyon, they named 'El Cajon', as it was like a box canyon... the trail they used was likely first built by the native Indians. It is visible today and used by hikers. Pack animals had a terrible time... constantly falling. The Jesuits were removed from the New World before they had a chance to build a better road.

The Franciscans in 1769 built a new section of El Camino Real north of, and out of the canyon just to get pack animals through. Graham Mackintosh tried to get his burro 'Mision' out to Gonzaga on it, but it was too trecherous and Mision fell... Graham abandoned the burro attempt.

It was the hope of the owner of Rancho Santa Ynez (Josefina Zuñiga) to have a road between her ranch and her Punta Final property... Fred Hampe built it in the 1960's to the edge of the canyon, 2 miles east of the mission. There was no where to go from there without major construction. At the end of the road building attempt are petroglyphs on some rocks and the Indian trail goes from there down into the deep canyon. The Camino Real climbs up the hillside from the road about 1/2 mile from the end, heading north to the top of the canyon rim then east to the desert floor. Only the best trials style dirt bike rider sould consider riding on it and then only knowing damage and injury will occur. It was rumored Malcolm Smith rode it... I do know Kevin Ward ('Slider') has... once!

When the Transpeninsular Highway was built near Rancho Santa Ynez, Josefina had lobbied for a cross connector highway to do what her partner Fred wasn't able... Apparently the Mexican highway engineers took a look at the terrain between Santa Ynez and Gonzaga Bay and promptly decided on going across further south from Laguna Chapala, where a poor Jeep trail was built by Arturo Grosso in the mid 1950's... to Gonzaga and all the way north to San Felipe.

Use Google Earth to see the canyon in 3-D... and you will see that any vehicle would not get through, unless it could fly.

Here are some photos... in the next post...

David K - 1-24-2009 at 01:55 AM

The arroyo about 3/4 mile from the mission, looking down from where the road is... that nice sand doesn't last...

The road drops down into the sand, steeply 1.0 miles from the mission. Here is a photo of me climbing back up this steep drop:

If you pass the road (1.3 miles from the mission) that heads up to the bulldozed grade/ canyon edge... it looks like this:

In the arroyo, 1.6 miles eastward from the mission... this is as far as a 4WD can go. Get out and walk past the boulders and you will come to a steep 'waterfall' drop off into the lower Santa Maria Canyon:

At the end of the bulldozed grade/ end of Fred Hampe's road at the edge of the canyon are some petroglyps:

I took this from Doug Bowles plane... it shows the bulldozed grade climbing to the top edge of the canyon and then the Indian trail dropping down from there to the canyon bottom. Just to the right is where the arroyo makes the big drop into the lower canyon...

Here is a photo of the Camino Real, just above the road... looking down to the arroyo...

MSM07 161r.JPG - 42kB

The Gonzaga Bay side

David K - 1-24-2009 at 02:15 AM

It was here in 1999, that we could not get any further up the canyon on our quads, as brush and boulders block the way. I am pointing to Baja Mur where the mission is!

In about 1/2 mile was surface water and pools deep enough for a swim!

Aerial photo showing the mouth of the canyon and the arroyo all the way to Punta Final (Gonzaga Bay)... the bottom left of the photo is where the above photo was taken. The Camino Real leaves the arroyo and climbs up the north side hills, left side of photo, before the canyon begins.

Here is where we took a swim, a half mile up the canyon... the Camino Real is along those hills and ridges, above the canyon.

EL CAMINO REAL

In Nov. 2003, my son and I hiked towards the mission... Soon after climbing out of the Arroyo Santa Maria is this sign!

Here is the Camino Real (all rocks) climbing up... see Arroyo Santa Maria in the background:

You can barely make out the Camino Real on the left side of that slope... In the background is the deep Santa Maria Canyon...

My son pointing the way to the mission! All rocks... we ran short of daylight and turned back after so we wouldn't be hiking at night... We got 2/3 to 3/4 of the way to the mission.

Baja Nomad 'Don Jorge' did the hike a week or so after we did, and made it to the mission and returned via the canyon... which required some deep water fording.

David K - 1-24-2009 at 02:19 AM

To get to the Camino Real from Gonzaga Bay:

GPS Directions (map datum NAD27 Mexico)

Take Hwy. 5 south 7.4 miles from Rancho Grande, turn west: 29°41.094'/ 114°24.566'

3.2 miles west of Hwy. 5, go straight where most traffic curves left for Las Palmitas: 29°41.278'/ 114°27.639'

0.8 miles from above, park at huge boulder: 29°41.68'/ 114°28.20' (marked as 'End of Road' on Google Earth image in next reply)

Hike to north bank of Arroyo Santa Maria to: 29°41.733'/ 114°28.175' elev. 609' (ECR-1)

Go northwest and climb out of valley, note ocotillos. (Marked as 'El Camino Real' in Google Earth image in next reply)

Along left side of side valley: 29°42.374'/ 114°28.566' elev. 741' (ECR-2)

On first padre built switchback up: 29°42.669'/ 114°28.937' elev. 906' (ECR-3)

On a ridge, trail continues northwest: 29°42.671'/ 114°29.425' elev. 1308' (ECR-4)

On the Camino Real: 29°42.748'/ 114°29.482' elev. 1391' (ECR-5)

Crossing ridges and little mesas: 29°43.008'/ 114°29.967' elev. 1477' (ECR-6)

Drop along side of ridge, trail narrow: 29°43.074'/ 114°30.128' elev.1610' (ECR-7)

End of today's hike just beyond this last clear sign of the old trail: 29°43.141'/ 114°30.189' elev. 1702' (ECR-8)

Junction of ECR & bulldozed road: 29°43.126'/ 114°31.753' elev.1413'
(End of bulldozed road, on canyon ridge: 29°43.033'/ 114°31.556' elev. 1,615' )

Mision Santa Maria: 29°43.891'/ 114°32.794' elev.1628'

[Edited on 1-24-2009 by David K]

Google Earth lets you see how rugged the terrain is!

David K - 1-24-2009 at 08:56 AM

From the Gonzaga Bay side, looking west at the canyon...

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

About where the water pools begin if hiking up the arroyo, from Gonzaga.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

About halfway up the canyon to the mission valley. The Camino Real is on the ridge tops to the right of the canyon.

--------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Near the end of the canyon where the mission valley begins, the end of the bulldozed road is marked. The Indian trail is seen dropping down into the canyon.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Looking east, towards Gonzaga, down the canyon...

-----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Mision Santa Maria... and just over a mile in the distance is the 'Widowmaker' grade heading towards Rancho Santa Ynez.

----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

Here is looking towards the mission (4 1/2 miles) from the highpoint (peninsular divide) on the road from Santa Ynez (10 miles away). Punta Final is in the distance and can be seen from the peninsular divide, on the road.

The three closest yellow markers are 1) The Widowmaker grade, 2) The mission, and 3) the end of road construction, 2 miles past the mission.

[Edited on 1-24-2009 by David K]

Steve&Debby - 1-24-2009 at 11:49 AM

David,
My son turns 21 this year and I was trying to think of something to do for his birthday that he would remember all his life. The Santa Maria trip sounds like a trip that he would like.In looking at all the pictures you have posted and the information you have given it looks to be quite a challenge. But some more questions;

1 The Camino Real is this an old road and does it go from Gonzaga to Santa Maria?
2 The Jeep trail built in the mid 1950's.Does it continue from Santa Maria to Gonzaga?
3 What about going around the waterfall and working your way down the arroyo ?
4 Where is Laguna Chapala ? Is it where the jeep trail starts?

Thanks for all the information.

David K - 1-24-2009 at 12:26 PM

Steve or Debbie?,

please re-read what I posted above... as all the answers are there.

I show where the Camino Real climbs up the hill from Arroyo Santa Maria (on the Gonzaga Bay side of the mountain)...

I show photos of the 'trail' and it is all rocks, this is the mission train, not the Jeep road of the 50's...

I told you that Nomad 'Don Jorge' came down via the waterfall canyon route and had to get into the water....

Laguna Chapala is on Hwy. 1 and is where the 1950's Jeep trail was built north to Gonzaga and San Felipe... the part north from Gonzaga was improved about 1960-63, and again with a new graded road in 1986, from Chapala.

A trip to Mision Santa Maria from Santa Ynez is a GREAT adventure... See http://vivabaja.com/msm (our 2007 trip and bighorn encounter). The map on the last page shows the canyon and the Camino Real location as well as the 'Jeep' roads on both ends of the canyon.

I am happy to help!

Checking in...

Ken Cooke - 1-24-2009 at 05:19 PM

If you have a well set-up CJ-7, the end of our route will be beyond the traditional "end of the road" to the granite pools. You honestly cannot travel past this point without causing serious damage to your vehicle as the canyon closes up, and the technical level increases dramatically.

At this point (traveling East), you will have to simply hike the remainder of the route as David mentions until you descend in elevation towards Gonzaga Bay.

In November '09, Baja Grande will continue east as far as our vehicles can travel without damage to the vehicles or the terrain. Tomer has run the Rubicon, I have run every trail in Big Bear, along with the Hardcore trails in Tecate which are much more challenging than the drive in to Mission Santa Maria. David K's pickup can easily make it in and out of Mision Santa Maria, as will an open differentialed Cherokee on 31s. It is not hardcore in any way. The only challenges relate to getting stuck in the swamp on your way into the Mission, or traveling out of the mission as I did this past November.

Do your best to join our group. We plan to be roughly 15 vehicles strong in November '09. Northern California Toyota Club "Getting Off" plans to make this their Thanksgiving week trek as to honor their member Andrew Simpkins who encouraged me to continue this 4WD run. Andrew was an avid Jeeper that led runs for the Easter Jeep Safari in Moab, Utah, and was a great friend of mine. He dreamt of visiting the "Mission Impossible" trail in to Mission Santa Maria from Rancho Santa Ines, but 5 months before purchasing his '07 JK Rubicon and joining Baja Grande, he succumbed to Leukemia.

Me and Andrew in 2000 on the Observatory Road, Parque San Pedro Martir, Baja, Mex. (taken from David K's site):

Traveling La Tasajera road, San Pedro Martir, Baja, Mex.

April 2007 -- San Felipe. Andrew's last visit to Baja.

2009 Baja Grande will include a short HARDCORE challenge

Ken Cooke - 1-24-2009 at 05:34 PM

Recent photo of me and Jose (BajaCat):

Tomer Avital (Hardcore Jeep Addict) w/gf Iris:

The road past the Mission Sta Maria stops at a row of boulders. Tomer had little difficulty traveling past these boulders and down into the dry streambed.

The trail actually opens up just past this row of boulders, but returning to the main road presents a problem for vehicles that do not have clearance and locked differentials fore and aft:

We plan to run past the granite pools until the trail begins to close up in the canyon traveling East. There, we will swim in the granite pools and hike a little. Exiting will be difficult, but not impossble as shown here:

Traveling West towards the Mission. Obstacles like these make you glad your vehicle has a short wheelbase and/or locking differentials:

Ken Cooke - 1-24-2009 at 05:49 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve&ebby
With a properly equipped vehicle and carefull driveing.picking your way around the vegetation as to not destroy the land I bet it could be done.

Ken your Rubicon could probably do it. :yes:

I have a friend with a 1958 Chevy pickup and I have a pretty radical CJ 7 we go through the Rubicon and Four Dice trails regularly.

How about it Ken? :yes:

and any one else with a properly equipped vehicle

When would be the best time of year to make this run?

No damage will be done to the land. Rocks may get slid around on top of each other, but we will keep overall impact to an absolute minimum (Tread Lightly).

:!:

My Rubicon won't have many difficulties. I only run 33" tires. I have Warn skidplates under the Rubicon, Fabtech rocker guards, and FourXDoctor Differential guards, keeping the Rubicon in tip top shape for a daytime run past the Mission.

Ralph Shoemaker is our resource in case vehicles break on the trail.

He lives in Rancho Santa Ines part time. His wife told us that in April each year, "The Snakes Come Out." This is a great time when not to be in the region. This is also when the temperatures skyrocket. Best to run these trails from October through March, no later.

There will be Toyota's joining Baja Grande in November '09. We estimate this will be a good year for Baja Grande despite the economic slump we're in (recovery in '10?).

Gettin' Off 4WD Club of San Jose, CA:

Let me know how this sounds, Steve & Debbie. :bounce:

Steve&Debby - 1-24-2009 at 09:36 PM

Hi Ken,
The trip sounds great to me.Do you have exact dates lined out for the trip? Also a route we would be takeing? It sounds like you are game for trying to make it to highway 5. My CJ7 is set up as follows; tuned port injection 350 chevrolet engine,TH700r automatic transmission,fullwidth dana60 front and rear,welded rear end,detroit locker front,5:38 gears,spring over,high steering,38x15.50Rx15 TSL Interco tires, onboard air system,on board welder,warn 9000lb winch 25 gallon gas tank,2 5 gallon gas cans.

Running through the big rocks we always have a spotter to guide you over or around the boulders. From looking at the pictures it does not look that bad,especially since I know that a stock toyota and a stock range rover made it in and out. You say the canyon gets very narrow and steep,could we work our way around the canyon? Then go down in the arroyo toward highway 5.

Sorry to hear about your friend,Sounds like he was a great guy.

Ken Cooke - 1-24-2009 at 10:14 PM

Steve,

You can't get to Hwy 5. Its not doable. We won't even try it.

Our plan is to camp near the Mission, and play on the rocks while we are there.

This is a camping trip where we camp in San Felipe, Gonzaga, LA Bay, and at the Mission during Thanksgiving week '09. You might be more interested in driving to the Mission and playing on the trail and beyond the Mission itself. But, having a group on hand is always better if a vehicle breaks down. Your Jeep sounds very capable, though.

This trip will tentatively happen Nov. 21-28th, 2009.

David K - 1-25-2009 at 09:22 AM

"You say the canyon gets very narrow and steep,could we work our way around the canyon? Then go down in the arroyo toward highway 5."

Didn't I already cover this?

Steve or Debbie, we are hardcore off road travelers and we really want to get across the peninsula in this area... there is just no path available other than by foot ... as I showed you, above.

Roy and his LR-3 did get through La Turquesa Canyon and went from Mex. 5 to Mex. 1 with the help of TW... this is halfway to Chapala, from Santa Ynez/ Cataviña.

David K - 1-25-2009 at 10:00 AM

The Squarecircle's (Roy's) Land Rover isn't exactly stock... He has done a lot with it and uses the biggest tires that will fit.

Anyway, after Baja Angel and I checked out the La Turquesa Grade (from the Highway One side) and reported here on Nomad (Feb. 2007) see http://vivabaja.com/20t , Roy made several research trips... Ken Cooke also tried to get his Jeep friends through... too tough.

Roy did make it, with help from TW... the hard way, going uphill from Hwy. 5 to Hwy. 1. Here are some photos of that historic event.

Getting across the desert floor from the turquoise mine to the bottom of the grade was a big task... then the steep, abandoned grade up was next!

The Top!

Out to Highway 1...

[Edited on 1-25-2009 by David K]

TMW - 1-25-2009 at 12:38 PM

In David's photos as you look up the hill the MC trail is on the left and had good traction but the right side was a lot of loose rock. That had us worried that the sqcircle might slide off onto and down it with bad consequences. But with great driving skills he got up to the cheers of all these 60+ year old kids.

Steve&Debby - 1-26-2009 at 09:52 PM

So ,your saying theres a chance "A"

David K - 1-27-2009 at 10:50 AM

Here's where the La Turquesa Canyon shortcut is... the route that Roy in his LR-3 got through.

[Edited on 1-27-2009 by David K]

TMW - 1-27-2009 at 08:05 PM

If your going to try this route I suggest a short wheel base vehicle like a Jeep or Xterra or 4runner, the smaller the better. ATV no problem, especially if 4x4. There are two places where you will be working around large rocks in a sand wash setting. I also highly recommend a locking rear axle and 4 wheel drive. Someone said that a full size truck had gone thru before. Either he found a different route or the rains have changed the course since then. The day before the run we walked all the way from the mine to the hill out of the wash (about 3 miles) with a master trail finder (Richard, friend of Sqcircle). We marked and took the best trail we could find. Roy's Land Rover has several 4x4 controls but did not have a true locking rear axle. It had an auto type mode that would brake the spinning wheel, great for snow and ice but not for rocks and sand.

David K - 1-28-2009 at 11:28 AM

TW, how did you mak the route between the mine and the bottom of the grade? Did you need to wiggle around many plants, or just boulders. If someone drove down the grade to the desert floor, is the route to the mine an obvious choise... straight ahead or follow the wash?

TMW - 1-28-2009 at 02:36 PM

The motorcycle trail is pretty easy to follow and that is what we did except for a few places. We had to move a lot of rocks, one was about 2.5 to 3ft in diameter and some fallen cactus etc. The two big problems were we had to make like an S turn around a hugh rock, think VW size or bigger. In one case we ran up the side of the wash several times to make a path but Roy had to be careful not to roll the vehicle and again traction was an issue as sometimes he would get one or two wheels airborne. It took us 8 hours to go 3 miles. The two bad spots took half that time. We did stop a couple of times to rest and have lunch. Everytime we stopped moving the little bugs were all over our face. The sweat I guess. We did it the first of May and I think cooler weather would have been better.

Steve&Debby - 1-28-2009 at 08:40 PM

TW,
If the rocks are only 2 to 3 feet in diameter that is no problem at all with a rig that is set up for rock crawling. There are places in the Rubicon that the rocks are 4 to 5 feet in diameter and some even bigger.Its all about tire placement as far as getting over them.

I agree with you that if you don't have both axles looked up you are not going to get as far.My Jeep has a welded rear end and a detroit locker in the front end.

I would love to go on these runs that you and Davd K talk about. My son and I are going to try and make the run in november,I hope you and David K can make the run also so you can see how my set up works. :yes:

[Edited on 1-29-2009 by Steve&

ebby]

Diver - 1-28-2009 at 09:18 PM

You need to post a picture of your rock crawler, Steve.
Steve's rig is nothing like a semi-stock CJ, FJ or Tacoma; it's a serious rock crawlin' machine !!

TMW - 1-29-2009 at 08:36 AM

Steve it sounds like you've got the perfect rig for that trail. I would like to spend some more time looking for a better trail in the wash but not when the bugs are out, they were a real pain in the you know where. I think November should be a good time.

David K - 1-29-2009 at 12:09 PM

Steve... I am all for you trying to drive from Mision Santa Maria to Gonzaga... don't get my above posts wrong... I just wanted you to have as much data as possible to see if going up the sides of mountains is something your Jeep could do!

The Google Earth satellite images are the best way to see what you are up against... You would be the first...

From the photos Ken posted of that Jeep on the rocks in the palms, it is possible they didn't see where the bulldozed road turned left, out of the sand arroyo (1.3 miles from the mission) to climb towards the hill (and El Camino Real route) and past it to the bulldozed grade... ended at the canyon rim where the petroglyphs are.

The road out of the sand arroyo was hidden by a young palm last time I was there...

Ken Cooke - 1-29-2009 at 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David KFrom the photos Ken posted of that Jeep on the rocks in the palms, it is possible they didn't see where the bulldozed road turned left, out of the sand arroyo (1.3 miles from the mission) to climb towards the hill (and El Camino Real route) and past it to the bulldozed grade... ended at the canyon rim where the petroglyphs are.

We saw it both the 3 times I've been down this road. I have never driven up the road, and those driving up it, didn't know where it led. I am sure it is impassable. Plus, respecting Baja - I know (from knowledge) that it is better to drive out than hitchhike out.

David K - 1-30-2009 at 09:40 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by Ken Cooke

Quote:

Ken, it climbs out of the sand, parallels the arroyo a bit, then turns towards the small side canyon, passes the point the Camino Real switchbacks up the side of the mountain, then the erosion of the roadbed (leaving only big rocks) stopped our Toyotas... we continued on the bulldozed road bed about 1/4 mile more to the end... on the ridge overlooking the deep canyon to Gonzaga. Petroglyps are on some rocks... and the Indian trail drops down into the canyon from there'

Steve or any rock crawler could drive to the end of the bulldozed grade... otherwise, the short uphill walk is worth it to see the petros, trail and canyon view!

See my satellite image above with the yellow pin labeled 'End of Road Const.' for this point... You can see the bulldozed road climbing up from the mission...

[Edited on 1-30-2009 by David K]

Ken Cooke - 1-30-2009 at 02:37 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Originally posted by Ken Cooke

Quote:

I saw the Google earth pics. Do you think with a properly set up rig, it could be negotiated all the way to Gonzaga? Let me know what you think.

Ken

David K - 1-30-2009 at 05:46 PM

I don't think so... we are talking total cross country.... and not flat, mountain sides, ravines, boulders, shrubs, boojums. I am all for trying... in a tank maybe!

Steve seems unconcerned with the photos and images I posted, because he keeps asking about driving to Gonzaga from Santa maria...

I am curious as to what Fred Hampe was thinking for a route for the road he was building? Follow the ridge line, like the Camino Real down to the desert north of Arroyo Santa Maria??

Neal Johns - 2-2-2009 at 09:31 PM

Been there several times, concur with DK and Don Jorge, no way.

Steve&Debby - 2-2-2009 at 10:19 PM

Don,
Great pictures, is this what is at the end of the bulldozed road? That picture gives me a better idea of what the terrain is like.The pictures that David and Ken posted did not look very tough. The google earth pictures that David posted are hard to get an idea of what the terrain is like.If you go to google earth and put in Rubicon Springs Ca. it is hard to get an idea of how rough the terrain is there.I have been through the rubicon many times, there are very tough spots and there are easy spots it all depends on what route you choose to take.

Thank you all for your input on this.My son and I are going to try and make the run in November and take a look at this place. Any other pictures or stories about this run or other runs would be great.

I always love a challenge

Also my wife and I will be going to San Felipe in December to look for a lot on the beach. We would like something between San Felipe and Gonzaga Bay. If any one has any leads please U2U me.

Thanks again, Steve

David K - 2-3-2009 at 09:17 AM

Steve, my wife ('Baja Angel') is from the Tahoe area... years ago... owned CJ-5s, and did the Rubicon run often... When I took her to Mision Santa Maria, she said that was the first Baja road that was close to what the Rubicon is like... driving on boulders, and slow crawling Jeep action... or Toyota action, in my case!

[Edited on 2-3-2009 by David K]

MSM07 056r.JPG - 49kB

Sta Maria to Gonzaga via wheels

Baja Bucko - 2-3-2009 at 09:25 AM

I have a pic of my son holding his mule's reins and standing by his mule on a huge boulder as we pick our way over the cargo trail from Sta Maria to Gonzaga Bay. When the cowboy says time to get off and hike, he means it! These trails were never meant for wheels. He**, even the mules had a time of it but only one took a fall....

tripledigitken - 2-3-2009 at 11:23 AM

Nice photo! What a place. Thanks for posting.

Ken

David K - 2-3-2009 at 11:33 AM

Just to clarify... there are 3 routes west from the Gonzaga Bay region to the Santa Maria region:

1) The canyon (Arroyo Santa Maria)... by foot only as vehicles are blocked near the east opening of the canyon by rock and brush... soon becoming giant boulders and ponds (as Don Jorge shows)... the 'Indian Trail' climbs out of the canyon to the ridge where the bulldozed road ends.

2) The Camino Real (mission road)... by foot, mule/ burro, and most experienced m/c rider who knows damage and injury is likely (Malcolm Smith/ Kevin Ward)... It leaves Arroyo Santa Maria near the east opening of the canyon and climbs into the hills to the north of the canyon, along the canyon's north rim or near it... It drops out of the hills and rejoins the bulldozed road between the end of the road and the arroyo.

3) The Cargo Trail (aka 'Serra's Cargo Trail') which was the supply route primarily for developing Mision San Fernando Velicata... It started at Bahia San Luis Gonzaga where there was a warehouse (ruins remain)... traveled up or near Arroyos 'Alfredo' and 'Las Palmitas' (named in the Almanac) and meets the auto road from Santa Ynez just east of the peninsular divide.

Baja Bucko posted a photo and hid a geocache (geocaching.com) on the Cargo Trail back in '01 or ? when she and her son rode it.

Fun stuff!

Steve&Debby - 2-3-2009 at 10:00 PM

I can't wait to get down there and do some exploreing.

Don keep the pictures coming the terrain looks fantastic.

David your wife knows what I mean when I say the Rubicon is as tough as you want it to be.There are tough spots like the Little Sluice Box and then there is a bypass to go around the tough spots. On one trip through there was a Toyota Tacoma brand new that was goig through.We saw him at the begining and the end. By the way this Tacoma was Stock except for a little larger tires.At the end the tail gate was gone,both sides had rock bites from front to back and a broken axle. he was pulled most of the way through. What a waist a good vehicle.I guess some people have more money than brains.

I might be able to get away for a week during Easter would anyone be able to make this run to Santa Maria? Is it doable in a week?

David K - 2-3-2009 at 10:12 PM

Yes... You can drive to Santa Ynez in 6-7 hours from the border, easy...

Allow 2.5 to 3 hours for the 14.5 mile 'road' from Santa Ynez to Santa Maria.

Ideally, into the mission on the second day...

The third day exploring the mission valley, enjoyong the quiet, the 'Baja feeling', the vibes from the past...

The fourth day drive out... head to Baja Cactus in El Rosario (or Motel Turista if Cactus is full)...

Come home on the fifth day.

If you have 6 days, then a second day in the mission valley... specially if you want to hike the Camino Real or down into the canyon.

Steve&Debby - 2-4-2009 at 08:39 AM

David,

How about if we went in to San felipe and left our motorhome there.How much time should we allow to get from San Felipe to the mission?Also are there any places to get a room close to the mission entrance off the highway? Maybe Catavina I think there is two places.
Thanks,Steve

David K - 2-4-2009 at 10:20 AM

You would be on the wrong side of the peninsula if you based in San Felipe.

San Felipe to Gonzaga Bay is a 4+ hour drive... The only way to the mission is a 6 hour hike (one way) from the Gonzaga side.

Driving from Gonzaga south to Hwy. 1, then back north on Hwy. 1 to Santa Ynez would be about 2 hours.

If you want to drive to the mission in your Jeep (fun)... then drive your motorhome to Rancho Santa Ynez where they have a large field for RVs and a bathroom. They have a restaurant and taco stand... as well as rooms for the night (bunk beds, showers). Run by Oscar and Matilda. Hoefully none of that has changed with the new owner (Don Briggs) taking over from Fred Hampe and his partner?

Otherwise, there is the La Pinta Hotel and the less then best Motel Linda in Cataviña, a mile+ from the ranch.

Tijuana to Cataviña/ Santa Ynez is about 6-7 hours regular driving... add 1-2 more for motorhome/ towing.

[Edited on 2-5-2009 by David K]

Ken Cooke - 2-4-2009 at 08:26 PM

David,

This video shows the Baja Grande guys last weekend going wild in Johnson Valley. This place is nothing in comparison to what the drive up from Gonzaga to the Mission would look like. BTW - Do you see me wearing my "Got Baja" hat in the opening credits????
:light:

David K - 2-4-2009 at 08:28 PM

I just did Ken!

Steve&Debby - 2-4-2009 at 09:32 PM

Ken,
Great video,Johnson Valley is on my list of places to go.Have you ever run the Hammers?I have seen video of the Hammers they look like they would be very tough.Do you have any video of the Hammers?

David,thanks for the information.I thought it would be alot farhter to go to San Felipe then to the Mission.We will probably have to try the Mission run In December when we go down looking for some property.Unless I can make it in November when Ken's group goes through.

Ken Cooke - 2-4-2009 at 10:39 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve&ebby
Ken,
Great video,Johnson Valley is on my list of places to go.Have you ever run the Hammers?I have seen video of the Hammers they look like they would be very tough.Do you have any video of the Hammers?

Johnson Valley might be converted into a military bombing range, so you need to visit there quickly, as my Baja buddies are doing at the moment. :no:

I haven't run the Hammers, but there is video on YouTube. Bullfrog is fairly tough, but with the right spotting, almost anyone can make it through. The only thing comparable in Baja would be Jacume (or Smuggler's Cyn) just outside of Tecate. In the U.S., there is Jacumba which is the opposite side of the border from Jacume. Very fun place, IMO.

Steve&Debby - 2-5-2009 at 08:43 PM

Ken,
Do you have any video or pictures of the places out side Tecate?

Ken Cooke - 2-5-2009 at 09:13 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Steve&ebby
Ken,
Do you have any video or pictures of the places out side Tecate?

http://www.justruns.com/gallery2/v/Run+Photos/070508/

Steve and Ken...

David K - 2-13-2009 at 03:44 PM

... I was going through my photos and found this one that shows the last part of the bulldozed road, climbing up to end on the ridge by the petroglyphs.

This is taken from the El Camino Real which climbs up the steep slope, northwest from the road...

David K - 2-13-2009 at 03:48 PM

Here's looking the other direction, towards Arroyo Santa Maria about where tha Camino Real meets the bulldozed road... That's TheSquarecircle heading back towards the arroyo... This is about 1.5 miles from Mision Santa Maria...

[Edited on 2-13-2009 by David K]

Steve&Debby - 2-13-2009 at 08:08 PM

David,
Is this past the Mission or before it?

David K - 2-14-2009 at 08:23 PM

Steve... that is the bulldozed / end of the road, past the mission... about 2 miles.

The ECR takes off up the steep hill on your left at 1.5 miles... Rocks get so big, stock 4X4s need to park a bit past the ECR.

To get to the ECR and bulldozed grade:
Turn left out of the sandy arroyo (hidden by youing palm) at 1.3 mile from the mission. If you stay in the arroyo you will come to the dead end in the palms and rocks 1/4 mile ahead... Please review all the previous posts, photos, etc.

The misson is 14.3-14.5 miles from Rancho Santa Ynez. The road continues past the mission then drops down a very steep grade into the sandy arroyo at Mile 1.0. Nice camping if you turn left in the arroyo and go to the oasis pond.

Steve&Debby - 2-15-2009 at 12:18 PM

Thanks,David and Ken
I will probaly forget all the great information that you and Ken have given to me.I can't wait until I can get back down there.We are going to try and go down to the San Felipe area to look for a house or lot buy around Easter.

David K - 2-15-2009 at 12:54 PM

10-4... You can print out the pages on Nomad (click on 'Printable Version) and put them in a binder and take with you!

Also see my new post 'See El Camino Real: Mision Santa Maria to San Borja, from space' I jus added this morning for more views of the area east and south from Santa Maria...

As for your plane question I saw... there is an open airport (dirt strip) at El Vergel, (Km. 35) south of San Felipe... That one you may check in on as far as buying a home in the area.

Next airstrip is at Coloradito about 10 more miles south, but it may not be open... then Puertecitos (is open).

Between Puetecitos and Gonzaga are/ were strips at El Huerfanito and Punta Bufeo, but either of them may now be closed...

San Felipe is an International airport and you can check into Mexico there after leaving U.S. airspace. All other pilot questions, I refer you to the many Baja Nomad pilots (Skeet, Capt. Mike, Beercan, Fishbuck, steekers, etc.).

Joining the Baja Bush Pilots is recommended... You now must join them to see their forums... lots of info and airport photos... and get 'Airports of Mexico'. The book 'Fly Baja!' is great... color airport photos, easy to use size... but several years old, now... and many of the runways listed have been ditched by the army in the anti-drug program, since drug runners use remote strips.

Steve&Debby - 2-15-2009 at 02:20 PM

Thanks again David,you are a wealth af information on Baja.We have 4 lots up in snow country in Northern California,we are building a cabin on one of them and hope to sell the cabin and get some property in Baja.Then we will get serious about the plane.

aerials of Santa Maria

steekers - 3-22-2009 at 09:48 PM

I know David K has some aerial of Santa Maria and the canyons close by.

Any other Nomads have some good aerials?

As part of my Easter break, I am planning to fly into several airstrips in that area. While I am airborne, I will try and get some pics of the canyons.

David K - 3-23-2009 at 07:57 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by steekers
I know David K has some aerial of Santa Maria and the canyons close by.

Any other Nomads have some good aerials?

As part of my Easter break, I am planning to fly into several airstrips in that area. While I am airborne, I will try and get some pics of the canyons.

Just a mile inside the canyon on the Gonzaga Bay side... where pools of water begin to be seen:

At the east end of the canyon, looking out to Punta Final:

The end of the bulldozed road, 2 miles east of Mision Santa Maria:

Ken Cooke - 3-23-2009 at 06:09 PM

Thanks for the photos, David. They lend a great perspective of the terrain.

TMW - 3-23-2009 at 06:37 PM

Quote:

Make sure the airstrip is not cut. The Mexican government has been cutting a lot of the dirt strips to prevent drug runners from landing.

David K - 3-24-2009 at 07:27 AM

The old El Marmol airport has been ditched... however, on GoogleEarth... go north about 5 miles and see a runway at the end of a road... We drove out there and saw it... after visiting El Volcan http://vivabaja.com/marmol

See this new post of those airstrips: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=37821

[Edited on 3-24-2009 by David K]

David K - 8-15-2012 at 05:40 PM

Bumping this one to help someone find it who emailed me asking about the hike to Mision Santa Maria and the canyon pools.