BajaNomad

lote for sale en el centenario b.c.sur close to la paz

luisv_2 - 3-10-2009 at 07:42 PM

lot for sale en area el centenario....15 away from la paz....services in ti...water...tel....electric....22,000 usd....18 mts by 20 mts.....o better deal.....inf luisv_2@hotmail.com or cel 612 15 657 39 with luis valdez

fixtrauma - 3-10-2009 at 07:56 PM

Located up on the hill with a view or is it located on the flat?

its flat!!!

luisv_2 - 3-10-2009 at 08:05 PM

the lot is flat...not on the hill...have some friends that they parents has lot for sale...but they are expensive...and it on hill view....our lot is clean...has no house on it and have 3 big tamarindow threes...nice shades...and ready to build a house ther...its quiet and...really peacefull....also if you know every body want to rent for 300 montly...we can go for it...and we give the chance to do any thing on the property!!!

let me know!!!

luis valdez.:yes:

fixtrauma - 3-10-2009 at 08:12 PM

Thank you Luis.

BajaNuts - 3-10-2009 at 09:16 PM

Please say calle y calle location

luisv_2 - 3-12-2009 at 08:34 PM

yes...absolubly...is on lazaCard##as st and ruis cortines almos on the corner....it s all clean no house or buiding in it!!!!:)

longlegsinlapaz - 3-13-2009 at 08:17 AM

Luis, since there are very few street signs in Centenario, how about some landmarks? What's on the hwy where you turn? How many blocks off the hwy?...or GoogleEarth coordinates, por favor. Would a copy of the Environmental Impact Study granting permission for the lot to have been cleared be included in the sale?

luisv_2 - 3-14-2009 at 01:22 AM

well, impact study i havent did ti....no...because is aa property for to live..if you want to like a gas station...then we need to do that impac study or for something quimical industry....is one blok away from the hwy...end almos on the corner...lazaro Card##as st and ruis cortines str..and about the permision let me know what type of busisnes you want to do...and i let you know!!!

best regards....!!

luis valdez.

longlegsinlapaz - 3-14-2009 at 08:16 AM

Luis, unless there is some special exclusion that I'm not familiar with, ALL unimproved land legally requires an Environmental Impact Study to get approval from SEMERNAT to clear/clean. I haven't researched commercial, but I do know it is a legal requirement for residential construction. Even if you just want to clear the land & not build a casa, the law requires Environmental Impact Study & without the final letter of authorization telling the property owner what specific plants can be removed, what must stay & what can be relocated on the property, PROFEPA has the power to issue a legal order to cease all work on the property, and fines of up to $10,000 equivalent USD are imposed.

PROFEPA has issued many stop work orders & imposed $10,000 equiv. USD fines on properties here in Centenario; as well as throughout the entire length of Baja; where the contractor knowingly lied to the property owner & told them they had obtained the EIS, or lied by telling them it's not required.

These are Federal requirements, not local laws & several people here on the Baja Nomad site have had to deal with this problem & it's a long, stressful & expensive situation dealing with PROFEPA to make things right. PROFEPA is very aggressive in enforcement!

The EIS requirement law has been in place for many years, however, PROFEPA has only begun actively enforcing it in the past few years. Please check with SEMERNAT for current regulations before you try to sell this property because the property owner, not the builder, architect or contractor is held legally responsible.

It's expensive getting the EIS done, but it's even more expensive NOT getting it done!

Edit: Corrected my accidentally using PROFECO rather than PROFEPA which it should have been...I know the difference, the names are too close!:no::(

[Edited on 3-23-2009 by longlegsinlapaz]

oldlady - 3-15-2009 at 07:49 AM

She's right. You can ask the oldlady who's been there. Ignorance is not always bliss.

what are you tlking about!!!?

luisv_2 - 3-15-2009 at 11:20 AM

hello miss....!!

the property is belong to my family for 25 years...that property has the (escrituras) the power on name of my sister...we have not to fix any other paper work...every thing is right....that town just to be a ejido...but not any more....

by the way the property is clean...and if we want to build any thing on the lote...we just need to pay for the permision for construction...and thats it!!!

you probably are confuse....or if you want to build any commercial shop like gas station or something similar...then we need the impact study....thats diferent!!!

well i hope my spanglis help some how....

wish you the best!!!

best regards...

luis valdez.

longlegsinlapaz - 3-15-2009 at 01:24 PM

Moved from http://forums.bajanomad.com/post.php?action=reply&fid=7&... for continuity
Quote:
Originally posted by luisv_2
hello miss....!!

the property is belong to my family for 25 years...that property has the (escrituras) the power on name of my sister...we have not to fix any other paper work...every thing is right....that town just to be a ejido...but not any more....

by the way the property is clean...and if we want to build any thing on the lote...we just need to pay for the permision for construction...and thats it!!!

you probably are confuse....or if you want to build any commercial shop like gas station or something similar...then we need the impact study....thats diferent!!!

well i hope my spanglis help some how....

wish you the best!!!

best regards...

luis valdez.
I'm not questioning legal ownership of the land. My only concern is in regards to current Federal laws regarding Environmental Impact Study requirements.

Luis, with all due respect, I'm NOT confused. I've built 3 casas here within a mile of each other over the past 10 years. SEMERNAT requires an Environmental Impact Study on all unimproved land prior to construction. As I said, I've never researched commercial construction requirements...which I can understand would/should be different. My experience & knowledge is only in residential construction, and it's all in the Centenario area.

Please note the other post above which confirms that what I've said is true.

What???:O You think we're making this up?:no::no: People here in Centenario HAVE had PROFEPA issue a STOP WORK order on their construction & HAVE issued fines of $10,000 equivilent USD...it happened to someone who has posted on this thread.

My intent is not to argue with you, I just feel it's only fair that any potential buyer to be aware of current Federal laws. I feel it's important that you as the seller offer current and accurate information to anyone interested in this property.

Unless there is an exclusion for property under a certain amount of square meters (my smallest property was 800 sq meters)...or possibly the property was cleared prior to enactment of the Environmental Impact Study laws...the information I've provided to you is factual & current, based on my own personal experience, and the personal experience of other posters here.

If you don't believe me, please check with SEMERNAT & post your findings here. If you obtain conflicting information to what I've posted, please post specific details of any exceptions to the law as we've experienced it.

Edit: Corrected PROFECO to PROFEPA, which is the agency I should have used originally!:no::(

[Edited on 3-23-2009 by longlegsinlapaz]

ligui - 3-15-2009 at 01:38 PM

No big deal , if you buy the land pay and have a study done.After that you can build.

ok

luisv_2 - 3-15-2009 at 02:14 PM

you rigth...that happend in lomas del centenario...thats other neigthberghood....not even close from our property....!!!

longlegsinlapaz - 3-15-2009 at 02:27 PM

Luis, it's Federal law, not local city or even state; not restricted to Lomas del Centenario. My property is not in Lomas del Centenario. It applied to my beachfront property between Comitan & Centenario as well. Check with SEMERNAT.

shari - 3-15-2009 at 02:32 PM

legs....do you by any chance have a government link to provide here about "checking with semernat"? maybe that would help if luis could find the internet info...

luis...check your U2

ok

luisv_2 - 3-15-2009 at 02:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by longlegsinlapaz
Luis, it's Federal law, not local city or even state; not restricted to Lomas del Centenario. My property is not in Lomas del Centenario. It applied to my beachfront property between Comitan & Centenario as well. Check with SEMERNAT.


yes sr....i do believe you....and i m not argument about it...its diferent ...you are close to the beach...i m no close to....i know that for sure... i dont have to do that study...and honestly ...not trying to screw some one!!!
if you want to talk to me...i can explend you better by cel....6121565739....thank you any way for your advise...!!!

:yes:

luis valdez.

longlegsinlapaz - 3-15-2009 at 03:14 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by shari
legs....do you by any chance have a government link to provide here about "checking with semernat"? maybe that would help if luis could find the internet info...

luis...check your U2
No Shari, I don't...I'm not fluent enough in Espanol to research that type of information online. I believe Luis is fluent in Espanol, maybe he has the ability to find it online. Any other volunteers??

All my knowledge is based on personal experience in dealing directly with SEMERNAT & the personal experiences with friends & acquaintances dealing with SEMARNAT & PROFEPA.

Anyone can believe what they choose to believe...their beliefs do not change the reality of my multiple factual experiences. I'm soooo done posting to this thread!

Edit: PROFEPA not PROFECO....sorry!:no:

[Edited on 3-23-2009 by longlegsinlapaz]

luisv_2 - 3-15-2009 at 03:34 PM

i just call a frined of mine...he is a lawyer...he say any lot on beaches...or for use commercial...has to do that study,if you are close to the bech fro 100 mts...and also you have to pay a fideocomiso for to be 50 mts o less from ocean....and regular lots you are not force to do that...at lss if you are going to build anything that could damege the soil...water...or plants....so what happend on your case..no body explain you before you bouth that property and thats why you pay the fine....any question i ll give you my friend fhone number...i friend of my wife works on semarnap...

hope this inf help any body for future....!!!

norte - 3-15-2009 at 04:38 PM

Give it up Legs. It might be that your experience is in the minority.

BajaNuts - 3-15-2009 at 10:18 PM

thanks for the important info about SEMERNAT, it is important to know.

I did not see the references to local land marks for the calle as was asked for.

gracias.

[Edited on 3-16-2009 by BajaNuts]

shari - 3-16-2009 at 07:52 AM

this issue is important and would be great to clear up all the misconceptions and find out exactly what the rules are....and for where. I have asked different people in different positions and they all say something different...dont need the study if it is on municiple property is one thing I wonder if it's true...only on undeveloped ejido land???

Diver - 3-16-2009 at 07:56 AM

http://www.mexicanlaws.com/SEMARNAT/SEMARNAT_GUIDES.htm

Here is the link to the SEMARNAT guides and info; in spanish.

there you go....you"r the man!!!

luisv_2 - 3-16-2009 at 10:13 AM

you know what...i been trying just to help my sister to sell that property...are mom is sick...no that bad...but...cases like that, could scare a probably buyer...and i do undersstand..there are people who scruw some how other people...but...i tell you some thing...mexican wont scruw to other mexican...specialy if knows friends, and laws more or less de mexico.

i have alot of support on friends of all type!!!

i dont like people whos been scruwing people...!!!

p.d. la caca flota sin importar tenga peso o no...it minds no matter how many people this bad guys scruw up, some day they will scruw their self!!!

gracias por el consejo amigo!!!

all my respect for every body...and thanks for the advises on this case!!!gracias!!!
:yes:

LOSARIPES - 3-21-2009 at 05:46 AM

You are right Larry. At. 28 Section VII covers anything you do on undeveloped land. "Change of use of soil" covers everything.
Art. 7 also defines under who's competence law enforcement falls and establishes the state/municipality involvement on its enforcement.

Technically, SEMARNAT should be out of the picture for us all building in town as long as we are not ON the beach. Unfortunately, SEMARNAT likes to stick their nose wherever they smell dinero, (dollars).

As of late, SEMARNAT as corrupt as they can be, has been involved in way too many projects that fall directly under municipio jurisdiction even after construction permission has been issued. They will look and find an excuse to get in. (like the removal of a cactus, septic tanks, etc)..... o what is even worse, your own contractor or builder will invite them in... why? Mexicans don't do that and it is not that the law is being avoided here. It is just that they are not in the picture. Not in the Casa on a Lote Urbano picture.... unless of course, as I said above, you are building a casa on a river/creek; beach; estuary; etc.
Generally, immigrants (dollars) have been targeted and abused by semarnat and because it is a federal agency, "no one"can stop them once they've come.

Would I get semarnat involved on a project on a lot as LUIS describes? Nope. No way. That would be an invitation to come and rob me. Not if I have all my papers done correctly with "Obras Publicas" and "Catastro"

by the way... Obras publicas requires a "Change of soil use" when and if the construction is for commercial use. About $400.00 pesos.

If your builder indicates he will involve semarnat, I'd be suspicious. Ask him why.
I have been looking for a "Builder's Manual" if it exists where it woud define construction in Baja step by step... that would be of value for many people.... maybe we should try and put one together.... but, heck.... I am not a builder

[Edited on 3-21-2009 by LOSARIPES]

[Edited on 3-21-2009 by LOSARIPES]

[Edited on 3-21-2009 by LOSARIPES]

DENNIS - 3-21-2009 at 10:05 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by luisv_2
you know what...i been trying just to help my sister to sell that property...are mom is sick...no that bad...but...cases like that, could scare a probably buyer...and i do undersstand..there are people who scruw some how other people...but...i tell you some thing...mexican wont scruw to other mexican...specialy if knows friends, and laws more or less de mexico.

i have alot of support on friends of all type!!!

i dont like people whos been scruwing people...!!!

p.d. la caca flota sin importar tenga peso o no...it minds no matter how many people this bad guys scruw up, some day they will scruw their self!!!

gracias por el consejo amigo!!!

all my respect for every body...and thanks for the advises on this case!!!gracias!!!
:yes:



Luis.....Hi. It's me, Dennis. Excuse me for interupting your nonsense but, I still think you're a big fat fraud.

longlegsinlapaz - 3-21-2009 at 10:16 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lencho
Quote:
Originally posted by LOSARIPES
Technically, SEMARNAT should be out of the picture for us all building in town as long as we are not ON the beach.

Interesting. Longlegs, in the cases you mention where SEMARNAT was involved, was that within La Paz city limits away from the federal zone? BTW, are you in city limits in your current place?

For that matter, if one is outside city limits, who issues building permits?

--Larry

Lencho, interesting question....one would think that the city limits of La Paz would end somewhere before you get to what is knowned & signed as Chametula. I know that Chametula & El Centenario are under the jurisdiction of La Paz, but I personally don't consider my property to be within the La Paz city limits.

The only people I know who've done construction within what would; by my definition; fall inside La Paz city limits have been renovations on older construction on previously developed land where no EIS is required.

PROFEPA, who is the violations enforcement arm to SEMERNAT has stopped work & issued fines on people I personally know here in the Lomas Centenario area. There are posts here on Nomad from people as far north as Mulege & Punta Chivato who have had visits from PROFEPA & issued citations & imposed fines; these posts were 2-3 years ago, so it's not like it's a recent change in the EIS laws.

Building permits are issued by Catastro on Colosio near Soriana/City Club. SEMERNAT & PROFEPA are both in downtown La Paz as well (I can drive to each, but can't tell you street names).:rolleyes:

I never noticed it in the other areas I've built (outside of Lomas, but within a 1-mile radius), but I know that PROFEPA cruises this area several times a week looking for violations...newly cleaned lots & fresh construction starts. A copy of my EIS approval letter to clear my land was posted during clearing & initial construction, so they never stopped here to "chat". They have however stopped to ask me if I know the name of the owner of freshly cleared properties in the immediate area.

IMHO, the fees charged...even more so, the fines imposed...are geared towards non-Mexicans. There is no way that the majority of Mexican population could afford the cost to get the EIS performed, let alone come up with a $100,000 peso fine!:no::no:

Edit: corrected to PROFEPA instead of accidental PROFECO usage :no:

[Edited on 3-23-2009 by longlegsinlapaz]

rogerj1 - 3-22-2009 at 12:27 AM

If I EVER do a real estate deal in Mexico, I'm posting all the details here. Lot's of expertise on this board.

LOSARIPES - 3-22-2009 at 04:09 AM

Building permits are issued by the municipio.
I think it is important to select an engineer/architect who is:
1.- Registered locally with Obras Publicas and authorized to sign as a DRO (Responsible work director).
- If he/she can't sign as a DRO, he must then find someone who can, and
pay money and then of course, charge you for that plus his cut.

2.- Connected with the local group. Lack of connections as with everything,
can make things more difficult, take more time and cost more money

3.- By all means, look for and find your own material supplier. Compare and
haggle. Do not let the builder get involved on that. There is too much
money to be made for him/her there. (to be lost for you)
- Easy...... 30% savings on material if you do your own buying. That
includes plumbing, electrical, even furniture.

4.- Obtain your building permit from Obras Publicas and proceed. Do not
"invite" federal agencies in as CONAGUA; SEMART; PROFECO; etc. unless
you are sure you have to.

If your lot pays "Impuesto predial" to the municipio, you ARE under municipal jurisdiction whether you like it or not. Ejidos do not pay predial.

Now... if you really want to save lots of pesos and don't mind getting involved up to your neck in the construction process, go out and get quotes from the "Albaniles" (Construction workers) for specific jobs and select the best deal. Supervise the jobs as you go along. You will save a bundle and learn Spanish in the process. Could be fun, could be difficult but very rewarding in the end.

In this business as in any other I would, say, If you place yourself in a position where someone can abuse you, someone will.

comitan - 3-22-2009 at 08:13 AM

LOSARIPES

I would say you hit the nail on the head, this man knows what he is talking about I say this with 15 years of experience dealing with contractors, Architects and albaniles., Also reminds me of getting my first building permit, and the Mexicans getting theirs, with a sheet of paper with a drawing on it.

[Edited on 3-22-2009 by comitan]

shari - 3-22-2009 at 08:21 AM

losaripes is soooo right on all these matters....another little tip is that if you have some albaniles that you like but you find a lower quote...just tell them about the lower quote and more times than not...they will agree to do the job for the lower price in order to get the job.