BajaNomad - Has Litter in Baja changed over the last 10 years? (from 2009)

Has Litter in Baja changed over the last 10 years? (from 2009)

tripledigitken - 6-23-2009 at 01:27 PM

[Edited on 3-18-2013 by tripledigitken]

tripledigitken - 6-23-2009 at 01:32 PM

We have noticed that it appears that litter has decreased along Mex 1. No question that the abandoned wrecks have been mostly cleaned up, recyling no doubt is the reason.

But plain litter seems less as each year goes by.

DENNIS - 6-23-2009 at 01:36 PM

Depends on where. Monday morning at the local beach still resembles a city dump and Gigante parking lots are still littered with loaded baby diapers. But, as anybody knows, you can't litter aluminum. Toss an empty beer can from your car and it's in the bag before the second bounce.
All in all, I think it's a cleaner place. I've often thought that it would always have been cleaner if there were more trash cans. I think today there are more.

comitan - 6-23-2009 at 01:39 PM

More than 10years ago the Mexican Government started a program called Solidarity. The program was to educate the Mexican people on cleaning up after themselves no Tira Basura. It wasn't expected to work overnight but you can definitely see the difference. In the La Paz area you see crews out working to cleanup along the highways and Beaches.....

tripledigitken - 6-23-2009 at 01:41 PM

Comitan,

I didn't know of that program that explains the improvement we have noticed.

Ken

BajaGringo - 6-23-2009 at 02:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
Comitan,

I didn't know of that program that explains the improvement we have noticed.

Ken

Government is taking a larger role in cleaning up the place through requirements in permits, licenses and concessions. We have been granted a broad spectrum concession for a 5000 hectare area which includes the San Martin Island. Part of our concession includes a role as caretakers for the island with the requirement to clean the island of decades of trash as well as habitat protection. It is a large task but definitely an effort worth making. Every day the guys load up bags and piles of trash that are transported to shore to be offloaded and taken to the dump. We have been at it for a few weeks now and probably have three or four months left to go.

You can see San Martin Island in the background right on the second photo.

[Edited on 6-23-2009 by BajaGringo]

BajaBruno - 6-23-2009 at 02:50 PM

Shoot, I thought you asked if the LITER has changed! It certainly has for a lot of gas station operators.

As for the LITTER, Comitan is probably not old enough

to remember US highways before Lady Bird Johnson started her beautification campaign. It was nothing to throw a soda can or candy wrapper out the window before she made us all ashamed of such behavior.

So, as Comitan describes, Mexico is going through the same enlightenment, though some areas of the country always take a bit longer than others. I know that in Mexico City you will get very nasty looks from fellow drivers if you so much as drop a gum wrapper out the window. Baja will come along--and is better already, IMHO, than several years ago.

longlegsinlapaz - 6-23-2009 at 03:22 PM

You'll have to trust me on this....but Comitan IS old enough to remember....I think he probably went to kindergarten with Lady Bird!

Forgive me Comitan, the devil made me say that! :saint:

That said, I'm even old enough to remember!

IMO, there is a big difference between educating people not to litter....and the government paying crews to clean up area by area, as people continue to drive by & toss stuff out the window....or to leave their garbage strewn all over the beach within sight of a trash can. :no:

It's a long education process, but it can happen over time!

bajamigo - 6-23-2009 at 03:30 PM

Unfortunately, it takes only a small percentage of the population to wreck the environment for everyone. We occasionally participate in local volunteer efforts to pick up garbage on the road to Cantú. There is one home on a low rise near the roadway whose occupants put bags of garbage on the edge of their property closest to the road.

I've formed the impression that this is a type of "airmailing" your trash to the dump: the wind and hungry animals rip open the bags, the trash flies out onto the road, passing traffic disseminates it further, then the "good people" remove it.

It just takes one...
:no:

oldlady - 6-23-2009 at 03:31 PM

I remember too and have always thought she made more of a positive impact than a lot of presidents.....We were up toward San Juan de la Costa yesterday, the water was pristine and the beach was a mess from the weekend, people had made an effort, the one trash can was overflowing.
I guess packing it home hasn't dawned yet, maybe someday.

24baja - 6-23-2009 at 03:46 PM

I think it has gotten cleaner in Baja. I know we continue to pick trash when we stop along the roadside and on the beach in front of the house.

Bajahowodd - 6-23-2009 at 04:39 PM

Two observations:

Historically, at least in my opinion, BCS has had less of a problem with litter.

It wasn't all that many years ago that beverage containers were all deposito. There was an incentive to return your bottles to get cash. When Mexico joined the rest of the world with throwaway stuff, it clearly increased the litter problem.

rpleger - 6-23-2009 at 04:57 PM

It´s a lot better than it was 10 years ago...a lot...

shari - 6-23-2009 at 05:04 PM

there is a HUGE difference and work is being done to clean it all up...old dump sites are being cleaned....highways and towns have more trash cans, there are more clean up programs...i see a really big effort going on...but need more education and fines for litterers to get people NOT to litter.

Pops - 6-23-2009 at 05:21 PM

And all this time I thought that the Tecate can was the state flower of Baja. :?:

Von - 6-23-2009 at 06:00 PM

I guess if your talking about old cars its decreased but small liter i thought it was about the same from my perspective i sure hope im wrong and its decreased......

Paulina - 6-23-2009 at 08:48 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Pops
And all this time I thought that the Tecate can was the state flower of Baja. :?:

Pops,

You are right, it is. They grow all along the highway all the way to the tip.

Fred Hoctor once told me that little tid bit too.

I believe it.

P<*)))>{

BajaBruno - 6-23-2009 at 09:13 PM

As Ken & Von note, the abandoned and wrecked cars were greatly reduced during the steel shortage a couple of years ago. On my last trip north from La Paz, it seemed that every third semi was carying a load of smashed cars. Alas, that fluke of global inequity has gone away and junk cars are worth...well, junk. It was a nice run while it lasted.

Gringo: good for you and all the good work you participate in.

Legs: you may remember that you introduced me to Wiley when we all happened to be in the produce section of CCC at the same time...

Pops: don't forget white rocks----the highway flares of Baja.

Woooosh - 6-23-2009 at 10:46 PM

I pick up the night-party beach trash on sat and sun mornings (so the families that come to enjoy a clean beach won't see it). It has gotten much better the past few years. a lot better. I don't know if it's much less small "litter" like food wrappers- but certainly there is less dumping of furniture, large junk pieces and dead animals on the beach.

[Edited on 6-24-2009 by Woooosh]

mooose29 - 6-23-2009 at 11:03 PM

I also think the litter has gotten a lot better over the years and I am always amazed when I see a clean up crew along hwy 1 miles from any town. However I wish there is something that could be done about the grafitti on all of the rocks before and around Catavina. It breaks my heart everytime we drive by to see it. I always envision a crew with giant sand blasters going through there and blasting all of the paint off of the rocks.

Bajaboy - 6-23-2009 at 11:23 PM

I think of how Santa Rosalia has changed for the better over the years...yes, I think things are getting better but there is plenty of room for improvement....

woody with a view - 6-24-2009 at 06:04 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by mooose29
I also think the litter has gotten a lot better over the years and I am always amazed when I see a clean up crew along hwy 1 miles from any town. However I wish there is something that could be done about the grafitti on all of the rocks before and around Catavina. It breaks my heart everytime we drive by to see it. I always envision a crew with giant sand blasters going through there and blasting all of the paint off of the rocks.

that'll just encourage "them" to start over again, what with a blank canvas and all! i don't think there is a clean wall in all of mexico....

Skeet/Loreto - 6-24-2009 at 06:06 AM

Shortly after the Road opened there was observed large piles of Beer cans along the road. Then it became a source of money for some and they dissappeared. Then a few busses wrecked and rusted out finally leaving.'

It has improved 500% since the day of opening.

In Loreto Senora Gloria Davis made arrangements for barrells and the hauling of trash from the City. Also the stray Dogs were taken care of.

Yes things have really improved.

Skeet/Loreto

mulegemichael - 6-24-2009 at 07:15 AM

about 12-15 years ago i was touring the east cape with the then minister of tourism..he asked me how i thought baja might increase tourism as i had a successful tourist business...i said clean up the highway and put out garbage cans..he dismissed it, saying it would be too expensive...i came back six months later and met with him again...he said, "guess what, mike, i have this great idea..we'll install garbage cans along the highway and start recycling"...whatever....it HAS worked to a degree...now if they would just empty the garbage cans...

Martyman - 6-24-2009 at 08:23 AM

When I was a kid, my dad, who knew no spanish at all, kept wondering out loud "I wonder why you can't change your flat tire?" The signs read-No Tire Basura

BAJACAT - 6-24-2009 at 09:27 PM

On my hiking trips i pick up botles or cans from other people that litter.
Then I get to recycle them .. :light:

bajamigo - 6-24-2009 at 09:47 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by woody in ob

Quote:

that'll just encourage "them" to start over again, what with a blank canvas and all! i don't think there is a clean wall in all of mexico....

Interstingly, when the Baja Country Club erected large white stucco walls at its entrance on the carretera, it was instantly attacked by taggers. The Club painted over it, but the cycle repeated itself at least four times that I'm aware of. I guess that was enough, because the walls have been in pristine condition for over a year-and-half now.

BajaBruno - 6-24-2009 at 10:33 PM

bajamigo, you have just done a good job of summarizing what several criminal justice researchers have spent considerable taxpayer money to prove.

Martyman, on my first trip to Baja in 1985, having flunked Spanish in school, I needed ice. I sometimes saw a polar bear sign with hielo written below it and I would stop and ask for HEE-lee-o. They unfortunate shopkeeper would ask if I wanted YEA-lo. No, dammit, I want HEE-lee-o!

I drank a lot of warm beer that trip.

805gregg - 6-25-2009 at 07:39 AM

I did notice less trash along the roadside and even trash cans, so some are trying. Then we pulled into Coyote at the south end of the beach, we watched a Mex family pull in next to the only palm left. The father got out and with his little sons help, proceeded to dump their trash, (including pampers) next to the palm, thus insuring the next generations disreguard for their environment. All the while two guys sat in the back of their pickup on the other side of the palm, drank beer and threw the emptys on the sand. It's getting better but there is a ways to go.

DENNIS - 6-25-2009 at 07:50 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaBruno
bajamigo, you have just done a good job of summarizing what several criminal justice researchers have spent considerable taxpayer money to prove.

That's right. The longer a tag stays on a wall, the more wet the taggers pants get. That's why they do it. To see themselves in print. [in many cases, just like here ]
The sooner the tag is removed, the less the gratification for the P-nche tagger.

Bob H - 3-18-2013 at 09:22 AM

Bringing this thread back after four years... 2009 thread.
----------------
I think Baja has done a great job cleaning up from what I remember back in the mid 80's (my first visit to Baja).

Lot's of changes over the years regarding cleanup. Especially large clumps of debris.

rts551 - 3-18-2013 at 09:47 AM

1. I have noticed that most communities have organized clean-up crews.
2. It doesn't hurt that the scrap metal market got better allowing the clean-up of junk cars,
3. more organized land fills providing places to put garbage

the down side - those darn plastic bags. We generally refuse them if possible.