BajaNomad - Best boat yard in Ensenada?

Best boat yard in Ensenada?

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 03:27 PM

I'm looking at a boat in SQ. It's a nice boat but needs new power.
It's set up for an out board. But I saw another like it with an inboard/outboard.
So I'm thinking of repowering it with and inboard/jackshaft combo to move the engind forward and keep the deck flat back at the transom.
The I/O version I saw has the engins all the way back and has a step-up platform at the transom to cover the engine.
Not bad and I plan to fish the boat this summer to try it.
So what boat yard in Ensenada is capable of installing a jackshaft type drive?
The boat is an Amato 28 Pilothouse. I saw it on the water last weekend when I was out fishing on a Parker 23.
The boat was built by Amato in Ensenada but I not sure he's still in business.

Hook - 7-10-2009 at 04:08 PM

What is the beam and the weight of that hull w/o engine of any kind?

Yeah, the Amato site seems to be kaput.

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 04:14 PM

Not sure on beam and weight.
It's wide and it's heavy.
It can be trailered. Jaime, the captain with the inboard version hauls his out everyday. And they were towed from Ensenada with a standard pickup.
I do know that it needs about 300 hp to run right. The outboard version had a 225 Yamaha 4stroke and the boat killed that in 1 or 2 seasons.
The inboard version has a 350 ci chevy in it. That's probably what I will use.

Dave - 7-10-2009 at 04:24 PM

IMO, the best yard is Baja Naval. But pricey.

I have a friend here in Primo Tapia that's a topflight marine mechanic. He'll do you a proper job. Also know a first-class glass man.

tripledigitken - 7-10-2009 at 04:29 PM

That sounds like a project requiring some good engineering. Try to get as much help from the designer of the hull if you can. I wouldn't leave it in the hands of the shipyard to do it turnkey. You may end up spending big dollars with a less than stellar result.

an interesting thread on the subject.............http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/61488-pro-con-jackshaft.html

[Edited on 7-10-2009 by tripledigitken]

Hook - 7-10-2009 at 04:49 PM

If you go with the jackshaft setup, where will the fuel tank go? You cant move a V-8 too far up before it's wanting to be where the fuel tank is. I think that's why its only in I/O or O/B. You might have to go with some type of saddle tanks and there goes any fish holds and below deck storage.

How about a small Yanmar 4 cylinder with an I/O? You wont be keeping this in the water, will you? The thing will probably get 4nm/g with a duoprop. 235 hp but with the torque to take on that weight. That Yammy was probably overpropped for that weight IF it was actually the weight that killed it.

[Edited on 7-10-2009 by Hook]

[Edited on 7-10-2009 by Hook]

MikeLikeBaja - 7-10-2009 at 04:58 PM

I was at Amato's boat yard 3 weeks ago. They said they are slow but still going. You need to make a right "coming from Ensenada" at the Baja Conuntry Club signal. Follow the road a ways and you will see the boat yard off the road to your right.

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 04:59 PM

Those are all good questions. I'm not a boat engineer so I can only guess.
I hope I can find someone with experience who can help me.
I know that I don't like fishing over an outboard. So I'm wondering if I can do this.
There is a boat called an Albemerle. Some models have the jackshaft setup. But they are very expensive.
That's where I got the idea.

Hook - 7-10-2009 at 05:29 PM

Fishing over an outboard aint so bad. You just gotta have someone at the helm to keep the fish away from the prop. I've had to do it many times when I was the only one on my old Mako 220............and I had twin o/bs.

I also once saw a guy who had mounted a u-shaped piece of metal (like the kind that holds a boat hook along the inside of a boat) to the top of his o/b cowling. He would use a broomstick with a Y on one end to catch the line coming off the pole and fend it out away from the outboard. The U on the o/b cowling kept the broomstick in place and he just pushed it outward when the fish wanted to take it toward the engine. But moving the boat works better.

Hey, so you lose an occasional fish. There are plenty more out there.

You, above all, should know that, Fishbuck. :lol:

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 05:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by MikeLikeBaja
I was at Amato's boat yard 3 weeks ago. They said they are slow but still going. You need to make a right "coming from Ensenada" at the Baja Conuntry Club signal. Follow the road a ways and you will see the boat yard off the road to your right.

Ya, I've been out there and his place is really "out there" That's where I first saw his 28 Amato. He had one in there for some rework.
I'll ask Amato 1st about the jackshaft idea.

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 05:48 PM

The Albemerle:

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 05:55 PM

The drive shaft:

fishbuck - 7-10-2009 at 06:04 PM

Albe 26 with T-top and canvas:

fishbuck - 7-11-2009 at 01:39 AM

The answer to this question is easy.
I'll just take the pictures to Amato and ask him to copy it. The engineering has already been done.
I can probably order the same parts.

[Edited on 7-11-2009 by fishbuck]

Diver - 7-11-2009 at 06:12 AM

1. Putting on inboard into that boat will change the weight distribution.
Most likely, the boat will end up a bit bow heavy - rougher in the waves ...

2. How will you modify your trailer to hold the shaft ?

3. You need a 1 ton with duelly's to tow a 28" boat !! Even then ..... in Baja ??

Russ - 7-11-2009 at 07:02 AM

I don't now what your budget is or if you already have committed to a hull but there are some really good deals to be had in SD right now. You may find some thing you like up there. Seems to me a retro-fit is just asking for trouble. You all know a lot more about these things than I but seems any imperfection/vibration would spell disaster. Good luck with what ever you decide!
http://www.albinmarine.com/ExpressTrawler/26CC%20folder/26CC...

[Edited on 7-11-2009 by Russ]

my 2 cents

desertcpl - 7-11-2009 at 08:44 AM

I think you need to stick with the OB,, 4 stroke,, get a pair,,

the boat was designed for OBs,, your just asking for problems

Pescador - 7-11-2009 at 09:04 AM

Fishbuck, I think there is some really good info here on the conversion. I personally would not even consider doing that. The biggest problem with any type of Inboard/outboard operation is that they do not function well in the high salinity of the Sea of Cortez. They do a little better on the Ensenada side because the salinity is much less there and I find a lot of applications in Alaska and British Columbia that work well but everytime I see one of these on the Sea of Cortez, they go quickly.
If the boat was designed for outboard operation, you are much better off staying with that original configuration. The new 4 strokes are putting out a lot of power and work like a dream, they are just a little expensive.

fishbuck - 7-11-2009 at 12:42 PM

I love that Albin 26! Really similar t the Albe 26.
I haven't boat the boat yet. But I think I can by it without motor for 10 grand.
My first thought is to go with a new outboard. A 300hp Suzuki. It's a 4 stroke V6. They cost around $17-18000. The current owner suggests a 350hp Yamaha. A V8. About $21-22000
That's alot of money.
Jamie just replaced the inboard in his 28 Amato for $1000. He bought a used runabout and took the motor out and it dropped right in. The old motor was a 305 chevy and it was underpowered.
So a used motor and outdrive and make my own jackshaft. Maybe $5000. I'll let Amato do it.
I didn't know about the increased salinity of the SOC.
The primary mission for this boat will be to charge offshore from SQ for summer tuna. Three of the San Diego 1.5 day boats limited on Alvacora yesterday. So I think a minimum 25 mile run offshore to the blue water.
But at other times of the year I will tow it or another boat to BOLA, Mulege, etc. So that is a factor. I might even aircondition the pilothouse for those 100 plus days on the Cortez. Haven't figured that out yet.
Not a problem in SQ. It was cold out there last weekend.
Did see a nice grey whale in Bahia San Quintin.
But no fish! Should have gone to BOLA!

Crusoe - 7-11-2009 at 12:48 PM

Also Fishbuck..... There is an old nautical wise mans " trueism".... FREE,IS NOT CHEAP ENOUGH!!! ++C++

fishbuck - 7-11-2009 at 01:00 PM

The transom has a pedistal type engine mount that is simply bolted on.
I think Amato designs his boats for any different engine config because I've seen inboards and outboards for both of his hulls the 26 super and 28 pilot.
Plus many different deck configs.
That's what I liked about his shop. He will do any custom work per customer request.
A brand new 28 is about 13000. The 26 was about 8000.
The price is right.

Bob and Susan - 7-11-2009 at 01:39 PM

IMHO :biggrin:

its way to big to be haulin from place to place

that big thing will limit your fishing area

the truck will HAVE to be at least a one ton with a diesel to haul down hwy 1

the trailer tires will be your BIGGEST problem when traveling
the tires only hold so much weight

i've noticed the biggest thing down here
that launches and retrives well
is no bigger than a 24 footer

and that's HARD to trailer

you'd be way better off getting a boat that runs
and then fixing it if it breaks

remember the inboard engines are NOT car engines
they are different and use different parts

it would be like reinventing the wheel
repowering an outboard with an inboard

fishbuck - 7-11-2009 at 03:11 PM

That's the catch 22 for trying to find a boat that can fish both sides of the penisula.
I fished a 23 Parker out of SQ last weekend. 2 pax and captain.
Honestly I thought it was inadequte.
It had a new 225 Honda. Plenty of power. But the hull was too small for the ocean. And we only went as far as San Martin.
It was a rough, cold, windy day.
One of the boats ran outside 30 miles for 2 bluefin tuna.
No way would I have run out there in that Parker for 2 bluefin.
Maybe for limits of tuna but I would rather have been on a 28 Amato.
Or the Albemerle 26 or Albin 26.
A cheap Albemerle is $30000. A new one is over $100000.

mtgoat666 - 7-11-2009 at 03:18 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fishbuck
That's the catch 22 for trying to find a boat that can fish both sides of the penisula.
I fished a 23 Parker out of SQ last weekend. 2 pax and captain.
Honestly I thought it was inadequte.
It had a new 225 Honda. Plenty of power. But the hull was too small for the ocean. And we only went as far as San Martin.
It was a rough, cold, windy day.
One of the boats ran outside 30 miles for 2 bluefin tuna.
No way would I have run out there in that Parker for 2 bluefin.
Maybe for limits of tuna but I would rather have been on a 28 Amato.
Or the Albemerle 26 or Albin 26.
A cheap Albemerle is $30000. A new one is over $100000.

For occassional weekends of fishing, 'tis cheaper to charter. owning a big boat is same a standing in your shower while tearing up $100 bills.

Bob and Susan - 7-11-2009 at 03:25 PM

you play you pay....

Crusoe - 7-12-2009 at 02:07 PM

And there is this one.....Do you know what BOAT stands for?..... BREAK-OUT- ANOTHER-THOUSAND!!! ++C++

dishinit - 7-12-2009 at 10:33 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fishbuck
The transom has a pedistal type engine mount that is simply bolted on.
I think Amato designs his boats for any different engine config because I've seen inboards and outboards for both of his hulls the 26 super and 28 pilot.
Plus many different deck configs.
That's what I liked about his shop. He will do any custom work per customer request.
A brand new 28 is about 13000. The 26 was about 8000.
The price is right.

fishbuck,
What is the Amato 26/28 constructed of? It looks to be possibly of aluminum??
If I were you I would seriously consider staying with a flat c-ckpit floor....no rear step-up to trip over in rough seas and excitement of fishing, unless the engine covers are seat high. But that makes it more difficult to fish the rear of the c-ckpit/transom area.
If new, is $13,000.00 for the 28 (I assume hull only or is that with Pilot House?), am curious as to used price with motors.
Have you actually fished one? Whats it's sea keeping abilities like?
How difficult is it to handle when docking in strong currents/winds?
Outboards are not that difficult to fish around, especially with another person manning the helm.
By the way, a lot of transom brackets are bolted on...don't quite understand the pedestal reference...unless you mean jack plates to raise engine height.
As another poster mentioned get a boat that "you" can handle...especially when it comes to launching & trailering.
In boats, bigger is not necessarily better, just more expensive.
Good Luck.

tripledigitken - 7-13-2009 at 08:32 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by dishinit

Quote:

$13,000 will not include a Turn Key Boat with a new Honda 225, as the MSRP is over $20,000 for the outboard alone!

Fishbuck, we fish a 21 CC, with curtains when it rough, out of San Diego and routinely go out 50 miles. The key is having a deep V hull with at least 21 degrees of deadrise. Stabilizers are a must as well.

Ken

Alan - 7-13-2009 at 09:30 AM

Every boat is a compromise. It is simply a matter of what will meet YOUR needs for the majority of YOUR scenarios of how you plan to use it. I fish with friends that have 18' skiffs to 40' battlewagons. Each has scenarios they are best suited for. My scenarios called for a 23' walkaround with OB.

Look at the areas you have described. SQ, BoLA, Mulege. The 22' - 26' panga with OB is the boat of choice. There is a reason for that - they work! You haven't mentioned a budget but new I would think you would be looking around $25-30,000. You would dump that into trying to re-build and re-engineer a boat that still probably won't do what you want. I'm sure you could find a used gringo owned panga pretty reasonable right now. I only suggest a gringo-owned boat because mexicans actually use their boats nearly daily so they would more likely have more hours.

Length isn't as much an issue for towing. Weight would be more of a concern for me. Hard to fish around an outboard? I/O's put the engine in the c-ckpit with you! I usually use a 6 1/2 - 7' rod and an OB is not a problem. Plus you can lift the OB completely out of the water to unfoul a prop whereas I usually end up in the water clearing an I/O.

fishbuck - 7-13-2009 at 12:45 PM

This really good because alot of you guys know about boats.
I'm operating on the premise that I really don't like fishing from pangas.
I like the 26 foot supers but really dislike the standard 22 foot panga.
As I said earlier I was at Amatos shop to look at his 26 super. He had one there at the time that he was in stalling a full witdth pilot house. I was discussing a more narrow pilot house with full walk-around when I saw the 28 pilothouse.
So now I know where there are two of them. 1 for sale.
I did fish one of his 26 supers at San Quintin and it was very capable. I think it had a 175 twostroke and that wasn't real nice. Lot of power though.
I looked at that boat last weekend and it had been upgraded to a 4 stroke.
My dreamboat is that 26 Albemerle for sure.
I know it can be done going out in the Pacific on a 21 foot boat.
I did it once. I went almost to San Clemente Island. It was fine going out in the morning and really sucked coming home in the afternoon when it got rough and windy. I only did it one time.
I also use a Bayliner 28 Explorer. A real piece of c***.
But with the pilot house and long hull I could maintain cruise speed in very rough conditions.
I will try and fish the 28 Amato soon and then I'll know a little more.
I did see it last weekend. It was a bit slow compared to the 23 Parker. But when you got to the spot it was a superior fishing platform. Very stable.

tripledigitken - 7-13-2009 at 01:43 PM

Fishbuck,

The Nomad fisherman who undoubtedly puts more hours on a boat in baja on a monthly basis, both on the Pacific Side and Loreto is Bill Erhardt. His boat of choice is a 21' Bluewater with a 175hp Suzuki.

Pick his brain! He is a very knowledgeable guy and helped in my decision of what boat to consider for Baja. Ask him how many use a Pilothouse on the Sea of Cortez.

Ken

dishinit - 7-13-2009 at 02:35 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by fishbuck
This really good because alot of you guys know about boats.
I'm operating on the premise that I really don't like fishing from pangas.
I like the 26 foot supers but really dislike the standard 22 foot panga.
As I said earlier I was at Amatos shop to look at his 26 super. He had one there at the time that he was in stalling a full witdth pilot house. I was discussing a more narrow pilot house with full walk-around when I saw the 28 pilothouse.
So now I know where there are two of them. 1 for sale.
I did fish one of his 26 supers at San Quintin and it was very capable. I think it had a 175 twostroke and that wasn't real nice. Lot of power though.
I looked at that boat last weekend and it had been upgraded to a 4 stroke.
My dreamboat is that 26 Albemerle for sure.
I know it can be done going out in the Pacific on a 21 foot boat.
I did it once. I went almost to San Clemente Island. It was fine going out in the morning and really sucked coming home in the afternoon when it got rough and windy. I only did it one time.
I also use a Bayliner 28 Explorer. A real piece of c***.
But with the pilot house and long hull I could maintain cruise speed in very rough conditions.
I will try and fish the 28 Amato soon and then I'll know a little more.
I did see it last weekend. It was a bit slow compared to the 23 Parker. But when you got to the spot it was a superior fishing platform. Very stable.

fishbuck, I found Amato's web page:
http://www.geocities.com/amatoboats/amatopicsn.html

And see they are fiberglassed boats.

I also found some specific info on bloodydecks.com that might be of interest to you, especially if you are considering used (follow the links);
http://www.bloodydecks.com/forums/boating-discussion/111016-...

Another informative read:
nealmatthews.com/Documents/Panga%20Dreams.doc

As to rough stuff.......this is not a Deep Vee bottom boat from what I can tell...so your fishing trip will prove to be very telling, probably great at rest, fast on a calm day, but beats you up in a 3' or more sea.

For a good read on deadrise (shape of hull):
http://www.thehulltruth.com/boating-forum/12657-word-about-d...
Hope this helps

fishbuck - 7-13-2009 at 03:31 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
Fishbuck,

The Nomad fisherman who undoubtedly puts more hours on a boat in baja on a monthly basis, both on the Pacific Side and Loreto is Bill Erhardt. His boat of choice is a 21' Bluewater with a 175hp Suzuki.

Pick his brain! He is a very knowledgeable guy and helped in my decision of what boat to consider for Baja. Ask him how many use a Pilothouse on the Sea of Cortez.

Ken

Ya, no doubt Bill is the guy to ask. Like I said I was thinking of ways to aircondition the pilothouse.
But I am also looking at the center console with t-top and canvas as having the most versatility. You can make sort of a pilot house with the canvas and take it of for SOC fishing.

tripledigitken - 7-13-2009 at 03:59 PM

Fishbuck,

As I mentioned in an earlier post we use curtains on my CC also. You can also get winglets (which I have) that go between the gunwales and the CC which shield almost all of the spray coming over the beam in a cross wind as well. It ends up being a very dry ride in windy conditions.

Don't get me wrong, if I was to choose a boat only for use at San Quintin and north to San Diego it would be a pilothouse, express or similar design because of the conditions here.

Ken

fishbuck - 7-13-2009 at 05:12 PM

My first boat. Not mine exactly but the first boat I piloted in the ocean myself.
I was intending to take it to Catalina. But I never trusted the engine enough. I cruised it from Los Alomitos as for as Laguna Beach and out in the ocean about 10 miles.
I was very cozy in the pilot house even late in the day and going uphill.
But not a very good boat in general.

[Edited on 7-14-2009 by fishbuck]