BajaNomad

Sea wall at Gonzaga?

tattuna - 1-13-2010 at 10:29 PM

I've been hearing about a "sea wall" being built in Gonzaga. Is this true? Anyone have pics or know why it's being built?

fishbuck - 1-13-2010 at 10:38 PM

There is a reference to it on Bloodydecks. Being built by Rafael. Doesn't say why.

David K - 1-13-2010 at 11:01 PM

Just some development at the beach in front of Rancho Grande...

It will get worse when the pavement arrives in a couple more years!

Skipjack Joe - 1-13-2010 at 11:47 PM

They've got a model in there on what they plan to do.

Three hotels, a marina, golf course, etc. all waiting for the highway.

Personally I'm skeptical about these grandiose plans. Areas with more money have failed. It will follow the usual development stages in baja - bulldoze the vegetation, ravage the environment and then walk away. No harm, no foul.

BTW, the scuttlebutt is that the pavement is scheduled to reach in April.

redhilltown - 1-14-2010 at 12:29 AM

I personally hope it (the pavement) never makes it but April?? Hasn't it taken almost two years just to get from North of Puertecitos to Huerfanito? I hope Skipjack is right and they walk away from the road too.

capt. mike - 1-14-2010 at 09:21 AM

build it and they will come......

i for one would like to have a casita there one day. if i could drive as an option - all the better.

i don't think much will happen unless they get power - that is eons away.

wilderone - 1-14-2010 at 09:27 AM

"Three hotels, a marina, golf course, etc. all waiting for the highway."

ha ha ha :lol:

they could do that in Puertocitos now. Or 30 years ago. No - let's make it ten times as difficult to get there to ensure success of the project.

David K - 1-14-2010 at 09:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
build it and they will come......

i for one would like to have a casita there one day. if i could drive as an option - all the better.

i don't think much will happen unless they get power - that is eons away.


Don't be too sure... Power lines heading south from San Felipe may not be too far behind pavememnt, or Sr. Rodriguez (Los Pinos boss) will generate electricity for his expanded Rancho Grande, as he already does for the mini-market there.

The main issues preventing development are likely the REDUCED number of Norteamericanos going to Mexico or moving to Mexico because of the narco-terrorism and economic crash up here. There is no 'local population' to speak of at Gonzaga (like there is at L.A. Bay) to bring poer in for... yet.

Donjulio - 1-14-2010 at 09:29 AM

The difference between Gonzaga and San Felipe development wise is that San Felipe was bought up by a bunch of Americans and then developed. The Mexican powers that be saw what happened. Now some of the prime spots towards Gonzaga are owned by wealthy and powerful Mexican people and companies. That makes a big difference. Of course there are some locals that have been there forever that own too.

San Felipe for some has become their red-headed stepchild. Now they want to focus on development south. Only thing they forget is "Where the hell are they going to find the buyers"? That is going to be an issue for years to come.

David K - 1-14-2010 at 09:35 AM

Yup... I bet they seek out wealthy Europeans or Middle Easterners since we are a poor country now!???

Donjulio - 1-14-2010 at 09:56 AM

MAYBE 2040??? Took 17 years (since laws changed to allow ownership and Pat Butler started developing EL Dorado) to get San Felipe where it is today. And electric, water etc was already within a reachable distance. Airport was already here. Service infrastructure was set up. Now what do we have? Airport which still can't accept international flights. Hospital that closed. No really good restaurants or shopping. No real spas. 1 golf course. Unfinished marina. Not a decent hotel. A bunch of unfinished developments and condos and half the loca businesses have closed. However we do have 5 new OXXO's (which are going to cause more local businesses to close).

I was talking to one of the curio shop owners the other day. They have one of the largest stores in the area. She said they made about $2000 last year for the whole year. Ouch.

So reality - Gonzaga starts with basically nothing. Might not see it in my lifetime. Look at Penasco. The Mayan Palace was talking about building their airport in 99 when I was there. Look how long it took. And they already had service infrastructure too.

Will be interesting to watch. Unfortunately I will be watching from somewhere else.

[Edited on 1-14-2010 by Donjulio]

GrOUper-GAr - 1-16-2010 at 01:25 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by tattuna
I've been hearing about a "sea wall" being built in Gonzaga. Is this true? Anyone have pics or know why it's being built?


A coupLe friends & I caMped @ Gonzaga in OcT o9...
EroSion has occureD over the years that looks to bE compromising tHe seaward legs of the Large BeacH Palapas of RanCho Grande.
-Some LeGs are Airborne !!
with their BaLLs of cement exposed !!!
(haha, Not as exCiTinG a$ iT sOUndS peOpLes) !.
Good O bad?
After watching the work for a few dAys, we came t0 the coNclusion thAT the 'WaLL' loOks like a Temp fix for the beach er0sion to eXtend the liFe of the Palapas... w!LL The waLL stop anYTh!Ng seriou$?... water? ...nah.

...Its cut the distance of the southerN Palapas up to and around (yes, it dips closer to the water here) the forever empty rock house/restouRante @the end of the Runway. - a trench about 3 ft deep, 1 ft wide, built of rock/cobLestone and a little cement - then Mostly Burried in sand/dirt.
----
by FAr tHe most whaLeShaRks weVe eVer sEEn @ GonzagA.

-Gar

and a wOrd from CoCO...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=sasBtHUQqlg

Barry A. - 1-16-2010 at 04:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
build it and they will come......

i for one would like to have a casita there one day. if i could drive as an option - all the better.

i don't think much will happen unless they get power - that is eons away.


Don't be too sure... Power lines heading south from San Felipe may not be too far behind pavememnt, or Sr. Rodriguez (Los Pinos boss) will generate electricity for his expanded Rancho Grande, as he already does for the mini-market there.

The main issues preventing development are likely the REDUCED number of Norteamericanos going to Mexico or moving to Mexico because of the narco-terrorism and economic crash up here. There is no 'local population' to speak of at Gonzaga (like there is at L.A. Bay) to bring poer in for... yet.


David----------and water?????????? Where, oh where, are they going to find good water??? It will take time, for sure. :yawn:

Barry

David K - 1-16-2010 at 05:11 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
build it and they will come......

i for one would like to have a casita there one day. if i could drive as an option - all the better.

i don't think much will happen unless they get power - that is eons away.


Don't be too sure... Power lines heading south from San Felipe may not be too far behind pavememnt, or Sr. Rodriguez (Los Pinos boss) will generate electricity for his expanded Rancho Grande, as he already does for the mini-market there.

The main issues preventing development are likely the REDUCED number of Norteamericanos going to Mexico or moving to Mexico because of the narco-terrorism and economic crash up here. There is no 'local population' to speak of at Gonzaga (like there is at L.A. Bay) to bring poer in for... yet.


David----------and water?????????? Where, oh where, are they going to find good water??? It will take time, for sure. :yawn:

Barry


Yes, water is needed too... If they don't desalinate the sea water... then they could run a pipe to Arroyo Santa Maria and pull it out of the ground. That's how San Felipe does it... several wells about 12 miles south in the arroyo pulling out sierra water.

Here I am in Santa Maria Canyon, just west of Gonzaga Bay (Punta Final), far below the mission. (about where the last 'N' is in CANYON in my map below)



Below is Las Palmitas oasis, behind me... it is just south of Arroyo Santa Maria and west of Punta Final...







[Edited on 1-17-2010 by David K]

Barry A. - 1-16-2010 at 05:29 PM

Maybe------------but the "Sierra" behind Gonzaga is not nearly as productive (little rain) as the San Pedro Martir Plateau----------I am skeptical.

-----and "de-salinazation" takes LOTS of power------?!?!?!?!

I am not going to "hold my breath" on this one.

Barry

David K - 1-16-2010 at 05:31 PM

Naturally, I hope none of it happens... It is bound for failure without power, water, labor population, other businesses...

Barry A. - 1-16-2010 at 05:42 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Naturally, I hope none of it happens... It is bound for failure without power, water, labor population, other businesses...


------and that area is so fantastic that I think it qualifies for National Park status--------keep it just the way it is, and make the existing 3 facilities concessionairs, and grandfather the homes in as "in-holdings". Lordy, I hate to see that area ruined by over-development, and then subsequent decay. A Mexican decision for sure, tho. None of my business other than my emotional rantings.

Barry

norte - 1-16-2010 at 06:24 PM

Barry, Just stop. When was the last time you were south of the border? You are just like I am and stay North, so keep your comments relative to North of he border BS

rts551 - 1-16-2010 at 06:33 PM

David

Isn't that a very short term solution to increased population? Maybe we can run a line from the Colorado River as well. Face it. Water is very limited and some areas are going to be dry. Including much of Baja, thus keeping Norte Americanos(as well as other) away.
Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by David K
Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
build it and they will come......

i for one would like to have a casita there one day. if i could drive as an option - all the better.

i don't think much will happen unless they get power - that is eons away.


Don't be too sure... Power lines heading south from San Felipe may not be too far behind pavememnt, or Sr. Rodriguez (Los Pinos boss) will generate electricity for his expanded Rancho Grande, as he already does for the mini-market there.

The main issues preventing development are likely the REDUCED number of Norteamericanos going to Mexico or moving to Mexico because of the narco-terrorism and economic crash up here. There is no 'local population' to speak of at Gonzaga (like there is at L.A. Bay) to bring poer in for... yet.


David----------and water?????????? Where, oh where, are they going to find good water??? It will take time, for sure. :yawn:

Barry


Yes, water is needed too... If they don't desalinate the sea water... then they could run a pipe to Arroyo Santa Maria and pull it out of the ground. That's how San Felipe does it... several wells about 12 miles south in the arroyo pulling out sierra water.

Here I am in Santa Maria Canyon, just west of Gonzaga Bay (Punta Final), far below the mission. (about where the last 'N' is in CANYON in my map below)



Below is Las Palmitas oasis, behind me... it is just south of Arroyo Santa Maria and west of Punta Final...







[Edited on 1-17-2010 by David K]

Barry A. - 1-16-2010 at 07:13 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by norte
Barry, Just stop. When was the last time you were south of the border? You are just like I am and stay North, so keep your comments relative to North of he border BS


:lol::lol::lol::lol: Wow, like Gonzaga has "changed" in the last 4 years???? You DO have a point, but I still reserve the right to comment on the few things that I still have reasonably current knowledge of. Few, if any, are interested in my comments on the NOMADS board of things North of the border, I am thinking.

So, where does THAT leave me??????? :spingrin:

Barry

rts551 - 1-16-2010 at 07:46 PM

Barry. sorry but only with memories. as good as they are.

Barry A. - 1-16-2010 at 07:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Barry. sorry but only with memories. as good as they are.


Hmmmmmmm------perhaps your right. But those 60+ years of going to Baja are nice------to me at least. :lol:

Barry

Skipjack Joe - 1-16-2010 at 09:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.

------and that area is so fantastic that I think it qualifies for National Park status--------keep it just the way it is, and make the existing 3 facilities concessionairs, and grandfather the homes in as "in-holdings". Lordy, I hate to see that area ruined by over-development, and then subsequent decay. A Mexican decision for sure, tho. None of my business other than my emotional rantings.

Barry


I heartily agree with your "emotional rantings".

And as far as I'm concerned your opinion is just as valid as recent visitors. In fact, more so. Because having seen the past you are aware of the decline. Newbies draw their own baseline from which they start to measure change. And by the time they are aware of the situation they will be admonished by still newer newbies, as you were.

rts551 - 1-16-2010 at 10:22 PM

Memories are always nice.
Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.
Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Barry. sorry but only with memories. as good as they are.


Hmmmmmmm------perhaps your right. But those 60+ years of going to Baja are nice------to me at least. :lol:

Barry

rts551 - 1-16-2010 at 10:27 PM

Igor

Progress does not always mean decline. For Gonzaga Bay, progress so far has only meant a place for you and others to stay. For the future, .... we will see. It may mean not much changes at least in my life time. My first visit there was 1971 and I thought for sure the world would come to an end soon

Ralph
Quote:
Originally posted by Skipjack Joe
Quote:
Originally posted by Barry A.

------and that area is so fantastic that I think it qualifies for National Park status--------keep it just the way it is, and make the existing 3 facilities concessionairs, and grandfather the homes in as "in-holdings". Lordy, I hate to see that area ruined by over-development, and then subsequent decay. A Mexican decision for sure, tho. None of my business other than my emotional rantings.

Barry


I heartily agree with your "emotional rantings".

And as far as I'm concerned your opinion is just as valid as recent visitors. In fact, more so. Because having seen the past you are aware of the decline. Newbies draw their own baseline from which they start to measure change. And by the time they are aware of the situation they will be admonished by still newer newbies, as you were.

Skipjack Joe - 1-16-2010 at 11:09 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by rts551
Igor

Progress does not always mean decline. For Gonzaga Bay, progress so far has only meant a place for you and others to stay. For the future, .... we will see. It may mean not much changes at least in my life time. My first visit there was 1971 and I thought for sure the world would come to an end soon

Ralph


Didn't say the progress = decline. I wouldn't be alive today if my parents hadn't gotten their hands on penicillin in post war europe.

All of my trips to Gonzaga have been camping trips so I don't know how I benefitted from 'progress'.

I agree that development won't come to Gonzaga rapidly. I stated that in another thread.

I don't think 'the world is coming to an end'. I think that Gonzaga as we know it is starting to come to an end.

And those that follow won't be dismayed because they don't have a 'memory'.

Barry A. - 1-16-2010 at 11:11 PM

Thanks, Skipjack------I appreciate that.

Barry

Gonzaga sea wall

3464james - 1-17-2010 at 09:44 AM

As a Rancho Grande palapa leasee, I spent two weeks there in November. Sea wall was finnished, ran from the north side property boundary to the south side property boundary. In front of the rock "restaraunt" the sea wall has been back filled with sand. Sea wall extends the entire length of the palapas. I asked up at the store; "WHY." No answer, just a shrug. Additionally and the most upsetting part, was that they have levelled the area from the main road to the back of the papalpas, making a flat expanse of barren desert. The down side, which casued everyone to leave, was the wind blowing the sand into the palapas. Since I own two trailers I was informed, prior to our arrival, that they would be covered in sand. We had a friend have one of the local ladies clean the trailers, took her three days. Upon our arrival I was sceptical that any "cleaning" had occurred. Our friends told us that the trailers were 100% better then before, but that the wind just blew the sand everywhere, what with no vegetation to cover the ground.

There were no palapaites staying there, and normally there would be at least four to five palapaites present. The sand has driven every one away, just too miserable. Well the sand, the theft of our friends airplane, and the attempted theft of the other plane at Alfonsinas, accompanied by the car jacking.

On the plus side the new store at Rancho Grande is very nice and the food is outstanding at their new restaraunt. The diving was excellent, plenty of fish, and the whale sharks were in the bay, quite exciting. For unknown reasons they rethatched our palapa, it certainly needed it. As far as the water issue, there are three wells that have been sunk between the north side of the valley down to Punta Finale, this is where water is obtained for the locals. The water is a little salty but drinkable. No electricity but there are large stationary diesel engines to pump the water.

It was rather melancholy, with no one in the palapas and having trucks drive by the back side of the palapas in the late night and early morning hours.

I asked at the store about the future of the palapas and was assured that they would remain as they are.

We are seriously thinking about not renewing our lease this year and just selling out, because of all of the drama.

Pacifico - 1-17-2010 at 10:07 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by norte
Barry, Just stop. When was the last time you were south of the border? You are just like I am and stay North, so keep your comments relative to North of he border BS


Norte, you are always so kind to everyone! Who peeed in your Cheerios? If you "stay North" as you say you do, why don't you keep your comments relative to North of the border? Oh, that's what you want Barry to do....but not yourself.

Barry - For what it's worth, I really enjoy talking to guys like yourself that have been going to baja for as long as you have. I always enjoy hearing about how "it used to be" especially when it comes to the fishing and traveling baja before the highway. Keep the memories coming.........

Sidamone - 1-17-2010 at 11:35 PM

Has anyone photos of this?

gonzaga seawall

cj5orion - 2-19-2010 at 08:19 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Sidamone
Has anyone photos of this?

heres a couple...taken from palapa 6

[Edited on 2-19-2010 by cj5orion]

seawallfeb22010.jpg - 16kB