BajaNomad

Well at Ojo Liebre

bajaamy - 1-20-2010 at 02:06 PM

Does anyone (hello, David!) know exactly where the well at Ojo Liebre was that Arthur North talks about in his Camp and Camino book (p 146)?

His party had gone southwest from Calmalli, stopped at this well, and then headed southeast toward San Angel. Unfortunately they missed this second water stop and almost died before reaching San Ignacio.

From the well at Ojo Liebre, they mucked around in the salt flats and noticed "Black Warrior" Lagoon (GN) in the distance. Can anyone pinpoint where the actual well was?

David K - 1-20-2010 at 04:20 PM

YES... a Nomad even went there recently and photographed it... I will try and dig it up... GPS, etc. (it is not easy to find today, but it is this spring that gave the lagoon its Spanish name)...

David K - 1-20-2010 at 05:11 PM

Okay Amy... I found the GPS for Ojo de Liebre. It is a spring not a well, by-the-way. This is thanks to Chris who found it last March. Howard Gulick went there 50 years ago and took a photo. Chris reports more vegetation today.

NAD27Mexico for Ojo de Liebre is 27°40.659', -113°49.849'

WGS84 in the degrees, minutes, seconds format: 27°40'40.4" -113°49'53.3" (Google Earth uses WGS84)

On the Baja Almanac, this is very near 'El Huizache', just east of Scammon's Lagoon (Laguna Ojo de Liebre).

I will dig up the old photo and the Google image of it.



[Edited on 4-4-2017 by David K]

from space and maps:

David K - 1-20-2010 at 06:06 PM





2003 map:



1975 map:



1962 map:



1941 map:



1907 (North) map:



1905 Nelson trip map (1919 pub.):




AAA 2003/2007 Map of area:





[Edited on 1-21-2010 by David K]

Ojo de Liebre on May 1, 1961

David K - 1-20-2010 at 06:13 PM

http://libraries.ucsd.edu/speccoll/baja/gulick/images/m91-46...


[Edited on 12-28-2012 by David K]

David K - 1-21-2010 at 09:58 AM

Camp and Camino in Lower California... both the original 1910 book and the 1977 reprint have the map. I have it scanned as well... Here is a post of that book and map: http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=35278

Let me know if you want close ups on that map posted here.

[Edited on 1-21-2010 by David K]

David K - 1-21-2010 at 02:43 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajaamy
Thanks, David. My book is the bright-yellow no-frills reprint (sans map!) I'd love some high-quality close-ups if you don't mind.


From north to south (drawn my Arthur North showing his travel route through Baja in 1905-06:











David K - 1-21-2010 at 02:49 PM

Some selected close ups:

Gonzaga Bay area:



Bahia Asuncion area:



San Pablo/ Ojo de Liebre/ San Ignacio area:



Mulege/Magdalena area:



Cape area:

fishbuck - 1-21-2010 at 07:04 PM

DavidK, I still not sure where it is. Could you please post another 20 or 30 maps for me?:bounce:

desertcpl - 1-21-2010 at 07:38 PM

DK

neat maps

could you give us a brief summary of his trip,, how long did it take him,, was they on horse back? etc

David K - 1-22-2010 at 10:43 AM

I highly recommend you read his book(s)... 'Mother of California' is the other one! Your library should be able to get a copy of Camp and Camino if they don't have one.

He and is party were on muleback (horses are no good on the El Camino Real in many places were there are drop offs)... and the trip was over several months in 1905-06. The book has many photos... I used some of them in my Baja Mission web page...

La Purisima in 1906:



[Edited on 1-22-2010 by David K]

David K - 4-4-2017 at 04:58 PM

How about in the past 7+ years: any new visits to Ojo de Liebre spring?

shari - 4-5-2017 at 07:36 AM

I would love to try to find it...David thanks for the maps...it was interesting that there was a trail from San Roque(near Asuncion) to the lagoon. So the NAD27 coordinates are what we would use on our GPS???

David K - 4-5-2017 at 07:59 AM

Quote: Originally posted by shari  
I would love to try to find it...David thanks for the maps...it was interesting that there was a trail from San Roque(near Asuncion) to the lagoon. So the NAD27 coordinates are what we would use on our GPS???


The datum is how the map is drawn. The Mexican topos were drawn to NAD27 Mexico. Google Earth, Geocaching, and standard factory settings on GPS units are all set to WGS84.

Unless you are using a large scale topo, just staying at WGS84 is fine. In fact, the two points are usually withing shouting distance of each other!

If you get a GPS number (waypoint) that is at NAD27, simple change your GPS to NAD27, enter the waypoint, then change it back to WGS84. Either way, if entered correctly, the GPS will take you to the point. What it is in longitude and latitude numbers will be slightly different, but probably only 100 meters or less apart on the ground.

My Viva Baja GPS list: http://www.vivabaja.com/GPS/ was made about 15 years ago, and per Neal Johns recommendation, I used NAD27 (because the Mexican topos / Baja Almanac were drawn at that datum). Google Earth being at WGS84 has become the prime Baja location map for many, so that is why I am posting all new GPS figures at that datum. Maybe, someday, I will convert my Viva Baja GPS list to WGS84?

PaulW - 4-5-2017 at 11:28 AM

David,
When one needs to convert a lot coords for a new datum see if this link makes it easier than using the GPS
http://tagis.dep.wv.gov/convert/
PW

BajaBlanca - 4-5-2017 at 11:43 AM

thanks for all those maps! I love each and every one of them! La Bocana doesn't appear anywhere LOL

What an amazing journey this must have been- golly gosh.

Again, thanks so much for taking the time to post the various maps.

great thread you started bajaamy.

David K - 5-14-2017 at 02:55 PM

La Bocana, as a village is newer than most of those maps. Ojo de Liebre is an important source of life in a vast desert with few sources of water.

An interesting note on La Bocana is that Antonio's (BajaCactus) father was the school principal there and where he met the future mother of BajaCactus.

[Edited on 5-14-2017 by David K]

mtgoat666 - 5-14-2017 at 04:44 PM

Speaking of wells, Any of you wandering nomads seen any chain pumps in your nomadic wandering? Curious to know if any still in use. I don't recall seeing any, but suspect there are many still about.
Also, for you engineers, what is Spanish word for "chain pump" used for wells?

gsbotanico - 5-15-2017 at 03:56 PM

Quote: Originally posted by mtgoat666  
Speaking of wells, Any of you wandering nomads seen any chain pumps in your nomadic wandering? Curious to know if any still in use. I don't recall seeing any, but suspect there are many still about.
Also, for you engineers, what is Spanish word for "chain pump" used for wells?

I've never heard a discussion in Spanish of a chain pump. I would guess it would be "bomba de cadena," a literal translation. Perhaps adding "...para agua de pozo" would clarify it. If there is a word, I would like to know what it is.

And thanks for the maps, David. I enjoyed looking at them all.

[Edited on 5-15-2017 by gsbotanico]

David K - 5-16-2017 at 03:42 AM

Quote: Originally posted by gsbotanico  


And thanks for the maps, David. I enjoyed looking at them all.


De nada... if you would like to see more, let me know what area of Baja or what year map is of interest to you. I have hundreds of scanned maps of Baja and they are all online for anyone to see. :light:

geoffff - 5-27-2017 at 04:20 PM

Quote: Originally posted by David K  
http://libraries.ucsd.edu/speccoll/baja/gulick/images/m91-46...


[Edited on 12-28-2012 by David K]


I just came across this photo in the early 1920's book, National Academy of Sciences: Lower California and Its Natural Resources. I'm guessing this is the same place.



Fig. 1.— Ojo de Liebre, or Jack Rabbit Springs, near head of Scammon Lagoon, on Vizcaino Desert. This spring is the only water within a day's journey in any direction and is marked by two stunted cottonwood trees which aw visible only a short distance owing to surrounding sand dunes.

-- Geoff

Udo - 5-27-2017 at 06:31 PM

WOW, David...you are one encyclopedia!

(It's an honor to be associated with you!)

[Edited on 5-28-2017 by Udo]

David K - 7-25-2017 at 03:04 PM

Naturally, the hope is Photobucket will keep all these maps viewable for a few more years.