BajaNomad

This is how the Mexican surrender begins...

arrowhead - 1-24-2010 at 12:55 PM

Quote:

U.S. Ambassador in Mexico, Carlos Pascual, today welcomed the new Mexican government security strategy for Ciudad Juarez, in changing the command from the Army to the Federal Police.

'What the government has done now is taking an intelligent and proper step: to introduce the federal police, which has all the legal capacity, and put them in the lead in the fight against drug traffickers," Pascual said in an interview.

http://www.frontera.info/EdicionEnLinea/Notas/Nacional/24012...


In my opinion, this is a surrender to the narcos. The federal police will be bought off in a New York minute

Bajahowodd - 1-24-2010 at 01:09 PM

I can be fairly cynical. but this appears more like a move to appease international critics of human rights violations by the army. If our ambassador and the State Department appear to concur with this decision, it would mean that either they are tacitly encouraging such a surrender (as you put it), or they have been completely hoodwinked by Calderon and his people.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-24-2010 at 01:34 PM

I concur with Arrowhead. This is the beginning of the end. Jesus H-Christ what are they thinking in Mexico changing of the guard like that. If the USA and the International community is b-tching that there are human rights abuses we/they need to shut our collective mouths and let Mexico fight the F-ing war against the Narcos! If anything else, Mexico needs to saturate the violent areas of Mexico with thousands of troops and go door to door block by block building by building ranch by ranch and under every stone to eliminate these scumbag monsters. UFFF!

JESSE - 1-24-2010 at 02:36 PM

The army in Juarez was completely corrupt, or at least the general in charge and its top officers. They needed to be changed, but they wont admit there was corruption there. I wouldn't see this as a pullout, this is only happening in Juarez, not in other states.

Donjulio - 1-24-2010 at 02:53 PM

The US should be the last ones complaining about human rights abuses.

Pot Calling the Kettle

Bajahowodd - 1-24-2010 at 03:05 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Donjulio
The US should be the last ones complaining about human rights abuses.


Please note that I mentioned "international" complaints. There are plenty of folks around the world who complain about the US record on human rights.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-24-2010 at 03:25 PM

"F" the Terrorists and "F" the Narcos, waterboard the hell out of them. I somehow do not think that the Narcos are getting any torturous treatment. I bet they sing like canaries when brought in for interrogation. F-ing cowards. But, if Waterboarding is necessary then by all means be my guest force them to sing like canaries if needed! Stop the Namby-Pamby treatment!

monoloco - 1-24-2010 at 03:55 PM

I'm sure they have used the old soda water with chili powder up the nose treatment on more than a few narcos.

Bajahowodd - 1-24-2010 at 04:37 PM

David- I really can understand your frustration with the narco situation. However, there is a much bigger picture to consider. I really don't want to initiate a bunch of posts about the demand for drugs NOB, but what i'm sensing from your posts is that ANY end can be justified by the means. the major problem with an all-out assault on these rameras, is the idea of whether one can go home again.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-24-2010 at 05:40 PM

Howard the Mexican Government cannot afford to PUSSYFOOT around any longer. The more lax the government gets, the worse the problem becomes. Once and for all they need to go en mass and clean out the bad guys city to city town to town village to village rancho to rancho. That way the good people can return to a normal way of living. There needs to be MASSIVE VIOLENCE on the part of the Mexican Armed Forces toward the Narcos. They, the Army need to go in and start killing these scumbags. PERIOD! I say this regardless of the demand for drugs here in the USA. I for one do not use illegal drugs so if the supply is cut off I will not be affected. To hell with the bellyachers politically correct pinheads who say to treat these criminals with kid-gloves. Let them complain all they want. Just get the F-ing job done!

Was I too harsh in my assessment?

Ok, I know it's tar and feather time for me!

arrowhead - 1-24-2010 at 05:46 PM

David, the corruption runs too deep into the Mexican bureaucracy and the ties to the narco money are way too involved for your idea to work. It would be like trying to remove a cancerous tumor that entirely surrounds your brain.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-24-2010 at 05:57 PM

Arrowhead they can at least give my thoughts a run for the money (Pardon the pun) and see what happens. All it can do is succeed or fail. The government just needs to take that FIRST BOLD STEP and give it a chance!

Woooosh - 1-24-2010 at 05:58 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
Howard the Mexican Government cannot afford to PUSSYFOOT around any longer. The more lax the government gets, the worse the problem becomes. Once and for all they need to go en mass and clean out the bad guys city to city town to town village to village rancho to rancho. That way the good people can return to a normal way of living. There needs to be MASSIVE VIOLENCE on the part of the Mexican Armed Forces toward the Narcos. They, the Army need to go in and start killing these scumbags. PERIOD! I say this regardless of the demand for drugs here in the USA. I for one do not use illegal drugs so if the supply is cut off I will not be affected. To hell with the bellyachers politically correct pinheads who say to treat these criminals with kid-gloves. Let them complain all they want. Just get the F-ing job done!

Was I too harsh in my assessment?

Ok, I know it's tar and feather time for me!



The USA created the FBI in the 1930's as a direct result of all the bank robbers and gangsters- the narcos of their day. A totally new agency from scratch. Mexico would benefit in many ways from starting fresh too IMHO.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-24-2010 at 07:32 PM

Woooosh, Mexico needs several units of Delta Force type units so when they get intelligence as to the whereabouts of a Narco’s hideout they can go in full force and kill every single Narco present! It should be a "Top Secret" operation. Meanwhile the Narco’s numbers keep dwindling for some reason.

wessongroup - 1-25-2010 at 11:49 AM

ELINVESTIG8R, spoken like true Marine.. Huuurraaa!! :biggrin::biggrin:

Turn you lose... oh, man.. the fur would fly... :):)

[Edited on 1-25-2010 by wessongroup]

k-rico - 1-25-2010 at 12:32 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
Woooosh, Mexico needs several units of Delta Force type units so when they get intelligence as to the whereabouts of a Narco’s hideout they can go in full force and kill every single Narco present! It should be a "Top Secret" operation. Meanwhile the Narco’s numbers keep dwindling for some reason.


I would bet they're in Mexico working with the Calderon gov. I just finished reading "Killing Pablo" which is about the hunt for and killing of Pablo Escobar. A Delta Force contingent was instrumental in finding his hideout using state of the art satellite telephone signal locating devices.

[Edited on 1-25-2010 by k-rico]

wessongroup - 1-25-2010 at 12:35 PM

AAhhh, roger that

Survival Of the Fittest?

Bajahowodd - 1-25-2010 at 12:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
Meanwhile the Narco’s numbers keep dwindling for some reason.


Fewer narcos may actually mean less violence, even if, in the end, the actual amount of trafficking does not decline. Who knows, if maybe that might be the end game Calderon has in mind?

k-rico - 1-25-2010 at 12:55 PM

I'm currently thinking that the rise of La Familia Michoacana in Calderon's home state sparked his war on drugs. Unlike the older, traditional cartels, La Familia has strong quasi-religious and political aspects to it. Much more dangerous than common organized crime.

IF things ever get back to normal drug trafficking with a moderate amount of violence, politicians/police accepting the willing payment of "taxes" by the cartel leaders, and the cartels minding their own business, the war will stop. Perhaps the objective is to end the social aspirations of the cartels, not necessarily the drug flow.

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-25-2010 at 02:06 PM

I can only hope Mexico is allowing the US Government to help them with their war against the various drug cartels. I am sure President Calderon wants the drug cartel leaders caught or killed and I am sure he is using all available resources to capture or kill them. I wish Mexico would pass a death penalty so it can be used in certain instances. One of those instances should be when any government official from the top all the way down to the lowest municipal official is consorting with drug cartel people and results in the death of innocent officials or citizen. Another is when a drug cartel leader is convicted he/she needs to be subject to the death penalty for ordering murders of innocent officials and citizens. And still another reason to give the death penalty is for hired killers who carry out the orders of the drug cartels and to kill innocent officials and citizens. These are only a couple of examples where the death penalty needs to be carried out. My thought is the cartels should be shown no mercy and should be killed during arrest or immediately after conviction if not sooner. NO MORE PUSSYFOOTING AROUND!

Edit: To change a word here and there!

[Edited on 1-26-2010 by ELINVESTIG8R]

Bajahowodd - 1-25-2010 at 03:30 PM

David- I've said it before, but perhaps it bears repeating. Given the nature of these animals, it would seem that they would view their execution as some sort of martyrdom. Spending the rest of their lives in some nasty, dank Mexican prison, always worrying about what might happen if they dropped the soap in the shower just seems to me to be a harsher penalty.

wessongroup - 1-26-2010 at 06:15 AM

Just a question that has come to mind about the reporting here in Mexico and statements from many elected officials ... is it lost in translation or is the word "alleged" not used....

I find it refreshing when an individual is captured, who is responsible for death and destruction on a scale that would make Al Capone envious.. they don't claim a defense of "not guilty" or at least not in this last big bust in La Paz... I did not hear Teo saying "I didn't do it".. and from what Jesse is reporting.. elected officials just kind of disappear, no press releases about they're non involvement and the likes.. they just bail

I like the old school gangsters here ... live by the gun, die by the gun and if you get caught .... your caught game over

Hope I don't draw "smoke" from this one.. There's Marines out there on the perimeter :saint::saint:

[Edited on 1-26-2010 by wessongroup]

[Edited on 1-26-2010 by wessongroup]

ELINVESTIG8R - 1-26-2010 at 06:40 AM

The Mexican Government needs to have an "Official Lineup" complete with police agency or army backdrop boards and 8x10 glossy photographs of all corrupt officials they identify in their corruption probe so the entire world and see them. Not just the killers and drug dealers. Have they been doing that all along and I just missed it? Past and present scumbag officials need to suffer HUMILIATION GALORE before being imprisoned!

bajabass - 1-26-2010 at 01:33 PM

I used to love the posters at the border showing the pictures of the arreano-felix cartel members. The DEAD ones, and the ones still wanted. They should plaster that stuff all over Mexico, with substantial rewards, paid with cartel money!!!

noproblemo2 - 1-26-2010 at 01:50 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajabass
I used to love the posters at the border showing the pictures of the arreano-felix cartel members. The DEAD ones, and the ones still wanted. They should plaster that stuff all over Mexico, with substantial rewards, paid with cartel money!!!

Or maybe they could print up playing cards for Mexicos most wanted as the US did in Iraq......

bajabass - 1-26-2010 at 03:55 PM

I believe that makes to much of a game of it. These people need to be hunted down and exterminated like the vermin they are. Wanted posters everywhere! Large rewards for the people with enough guts to stand up and do something about the destuction to their country and families. Rat on the rats, and it pays. A few more serious arrests, and I think they will become a little less brazen in their activities. When they realize one phone call can be the end!!!:light:

The Gull - 1-27-2010 at 07:25 AM

Mexico should recruit all the world's mercenaries and set them up with places to live from the booty taken as they eliminate the drug lords. This way there could be a changing of the guard on the drug pushers side. It would be a healthy change to get some real professional killers involved in this war on drugs.

bajabass - 1-27-2010 at 07:41 AM

Even as a former U.S. Marine, midwest conservative Republican, gun owner, and N.R.A. member, I have never felt violence was the correct answer to the worlds problems. These murderous bastards need to die. Good idea Gull. There are already professional killers involved, but on the wrong side!!

k-rico - 1-27-2010 at 08:27 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajabass
There are already professional killers involved, but on the wrong side!!


I'd be real surprised if there haven't been some on the spot arrests, trials, sentencing, and executions by the authorities.

DENNIS - 1-27-2010 at 09:02 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajabass
There are already professional killers involved, but on the wrong side!!


Some started on the right side...the Zetas, US trained. I think they pretty much have their own cartel now.