BajaNomad

Buena Vista Home Invastion

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LaRibereña - 7-16-2010 at 08:52 AM

Just received the below by email. Anyone have any further information?

READ BELOW....
--- I just got off the phone with Woody and Donna Sale. It was an absolute home invasion at 1am.....the were both tied up...with wire and duck tape by two men with two kids who just walked into their yard when woody went out to find out what was going on. They had screw drivers that they poked them both with repeatedly, also held a flare gun to both of their heads till they told them where the $$$ was. All of her jewelry was taken,even the ring ripped off her finger and her knuckle dislocated in the process. They both believe the home invaders knew who they were and what they were after. They took many other things in the house while Woods and Donna were tied up. They put duct tape over her mouth and almost over her nose where she could not breath....They also threatened to come back and kill them if they went to the police. VERY VERY SCARY.....

Woooosh - 7-16-2010 at 09:55 AM

YIKES!

DianaT - 7-16-2010 at 09:58 AM

That is AWFUL----hope they are doing OK.

Thanks for sharing it.

KASHEYDOG - 7-16-2010 at 10:18 AM

Where did this happen, in Baja or NOB??????????:?:

oldjack - 7-16-2010 at 10:50 AM

Buena Vista (if it is the BCS one) is close to my paradise of Los Barriles.... I would like to hear from someone who is close by and can report the facts/results

KASHEYDOG - 7-16-2010 at 11:06 AM

Is this Woody with a view, aka Woody in OB???

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 11:07 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by KASHEYDOG
Is this Woody with a view, aka Woody in OB???


No.

DavidE - 7-16-2010 at 11:37 AM

Screwdrivers versus two squirt bottles (wielded by two people) loaded with essence of Habanero, I wonder who would have won? At 1:00AM when I take a look-see my quarter-full (all the way full is too heavy) bottle is in my right hand.

This reply is no joke. The reach of squirt from a "high quality" chemical squirt bottle is formidable, especially when you can get off three or four squirts. Contact with the eyes disables INSTANTLY. Want revenge...when they go down give 'em a squirt in the mouth or up the old tooter.

Another thing that works is motion detection lighting. Crooks, like rats, do not like to be spotlighted.

Bill Collector - 7-16-2010 at 12:00 PM

This is true, they also have 4 LARGE DOGS. They have motion detectors. No time for jokes, this is very serious, we are all shaken..
Buena Vista, BCS

nbacc - 7-16-2010 at 12:10 PM

Were they tipped off by the dogs that someone was around? Whooo I don't like to hear those things. Nancy

Bill Collector - 7-16-2010 at 12:11 PM

Yes, the dogs did alert them to someone outside.

Close?

Bajahowodd - 7-16-2010 at 12:20 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by oldjack
Buena Vista (if it is the BCS one) is close to my paradise of Los Barriles.... I would like to hear from someone who is close by and can report the facts/results


They are basically next to each other.

Let's hope the police apprehend the thugs.

Let's also hope that this is a truly random incident, or that there was actually a specific reason for the crime against these people.

Scary to think that the area might fall prey to some brazen criminals.

Always liked how laid- back the area is, while still having decent amenities.

Russ - 7-16-2010 at 12:24 PM

This IS really bad news! First report seems to me like a gang type invasion. Bring young ones to learn the trade I would think there is a very serious problem. Hope the local law takes a strong stand on this. I'm glad no one was seriously injured.

bajaguy - 7-16-2010 at 12:27 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DavidE
Screwdrivers versus two squirt bottles (wielded by two people) loaded with essence of Habanero, I wonder who would have won? At 1:00AM when I take a look-see my quarter-full (all the way full is too heavy) bottle is in my right hand.

This reply is no joke. The reach of squirt from a "high quality" chemical squirt bottle is formidable, especially when you can get off three or four squirts. Contact with the eyes disables INSTANTLY. Want revenge...when they go down give 'em a squirt in the mouth or up the old tooter.

Another thing that works is motion detection lighting. Crooks, like rats, do not like to be spotlighted.






Ah.......wouldn't even need to leave the house if you had a laser pointer. Just aim through the window. Something magical happens to people when a red or green laser dot appears on their chest.......and if that doesn't work, just move it up a little................

Another word of advice....if you hear or see something outside.........STAY inside, turn on all the outside lights, leave the inside dark.

Woooosh - 7-16-2010 at 12:38 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
Quote:
Originally posted by DavidE
Screwdrivers versus two squirt bottles (wielded by two people) loaded with essence of Habanero, I wonder who would have won? At 1:00AM when I take a look-see my quarter-full (all the way full is too heavy) bottle is in my right hand.

This reply is no joke. The reach of squirt from a "high quality" chemical squirt bottle is formidable, especially when you can get off three or four squirts. Contact with the eyes disables INSTANTLY. Want revenge...when they go down give 'em a squirt in the mouth or up the old tooter.

Another thing that works is motion detection lighting. Crooks, like rats, do not like to be spotlighted.






Ah.......wouldn't even need to leave the house if you had a laser pointer. Just aim through the window. Something magical happens to people when a red or green laser dot appears on their chest.......and if that doesn't work, just move it up a little................

Another word of advice....if you hear or see something outside.........STAY inside, turn on all the outside lights, leave the inside dark.

the laser pointer idea is interesting... I have an hand-held infrared thermometer that looks like a small pistol and send a red laser dot a long distance. Of course if the bad guys are armed and you put a red dot on their chest, they will shoot back immediately. no?

bajaguy - 7-16-2010 at 12:48 PM

Woosh........I would use a green laser......and if that is the case, I would use it to see what color their eyes are.

In my experience with criminals, as soon as a laser dot is on their bodies, they either run or stop with hands up.

You should pick one up. They are really cheap and do some experimenting with it

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 12:51 PM

I would build my house like a prison. No one would enter without my knowledge. If they found a way, they would wish they hadn't.

[Edited on 7-16-2010 by DENNIS]

fishabductor - 7-16-2010 at 01:22 PM

This is close to home and spooky. This is my biggest fear. This is also the reason I don't go outside at night when the dogs bark without being armed with several weapons. I will no longer go out. I will sit in a dark window with my 22cal air rifle and aim for the teeth!! and/or the balls!!!

I used to go out with a powerful flashlight, a large knife tucked in my belt, a can of bear mace in the pocket and a hickory ax handle I my hand.


My wife is inside with a 12ga flare gun.

Tip about flare guns....take apart the shell and polverize the material inside...this way the flare gun will throw out a cloud of extremely hot flame that will roast the SOB head to toe!!!
Screw

[Edited on 7-16-2010 by fishabductor]

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 01:32 PM

There was a mention by chnlisle that I was posting on another site about recent Beachcamp crime. It was a response to another post telling our community that house robberys were happening frequently in a specific area.
My response:


I have to assume Fisher Camp has no security and it should be obvious to
everyone awaiting their turn to be robbed that it's time to spend some money and
hire a guard.
What other Campos are on the waiting list? It's only a matter of time before
the scum will be along to have their way with you.
Word travels fast in the underworld and when the chances of getting caught are
zero, it's an open invitation to redistribute your wealth.

No one else will come along to reinstill that secure feeling. The community has
to do that itself.

bajaguy - 7-16-2010 at 01:35 PM

Dennis......sounds like the incidents at Fischer Camp are burglaries as opposed to robberies?????

fishabductor - 7-16-2010 at 01:42 PM

Anyone know if this house sat alone or was it in the center of BV.

Did the people have a history of paying cash for things? I make it clear to all that I no longer keep cash at home... payments are made by check only.

This all comes after having out home burgalized last year.

dtbushpilot - 7-16-2010 at 02:14 PM

Wow, this is scary. Does anyone know where exactly they live? I'm here at our place in Buena Vista now and there are a lot of people camping on the beach. Yesterday morning I rode my quad into town and there were some young punks camped in front of MarySol condos. As I rode by (slowly, nowhere near their camp) one of them gave me a menacing look and gave me the finger. It wasn't the typical "parting gesture" that bothered me but the way he stared me down. When I came back by an hour later it was the same thing. It was unsettling to say the least. Nothing like that has ever happened to me here......dt

mtgoat666 - 7-16-2010 at 02:42 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
This is close to home and spooky. This is my biggest fear. This is also the reason I don't go outside at night when the dogs bark without being armed with several weapons. I will no longer go out. I will sit in a dark window with my 22cal air rifle and aim for the teeth!! and/or the balls!!!

I used to go out with a powerful flashlight, a large knife tucked in my belt, a can of bear mace in the pocket and a hickory ax handle I my hand.


My wife is inside with a 12ga flare gun.

Tip about flare guns....take apart the shell and polverize the material inside...this way the flare gun will throw out a cloud of extremely hot flame that will roast the SOB head to toe!!!
Screw

[Edited on 7-16-2010 by fishabductor]


your precautions sound extreme. perhaps time to move to someplace you feel more safe ?

wow Dave - that sucks!

capt. mike - 7-16-2010 at 03:01 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dtbushpilot
Wow, this is scary. Does anyone know where exactly they live? I'm here at our place in Buena Vista now and there are a lot of people camping on the beach. Yesterday morning I rode my quad into town and there were some young punks camped in front of MarySol condos. As I rode by (slowly, nowhere near their camp) one of them gave me a menacing look and gave me the finger. It wasn't the typical "parting gesture" that bothered me but the way he stared me down. When I came back by an hour later it was the same thing. It was unsettling to say the least. Nothing like that has ever happened to me here......dt


are there "gangs" there like MS 13 etc?
i would think it's too expensive an area for gang bangers.
bad sign for sure.
i hate those effing punk a$$es with hats on 1/4 turn and pants on the ground.
bunch of losers.
round 'em up and put them in the hoosegow!!
there's a pretty crappy prison just south of Sta Rosalia with NO ac... they ought to end up there and get some luvin' up their wazzzups..:fire::mad:

Udo - 7-16-2010 at 03:35 PM

DT

That was a very good observation, and I would think that next time around you take some hidden photos of the thugs. Then take the photos and show them to the victims for ID.
If it's them, pass them on to the local cops.

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 03:46 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by bajaguy
Dennis......sounds like the incidents at Fischer Camp are burglaries as opposed to robberies?????



Shame on me for differentiating the two.

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 03:57 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by capt. mike
Quote:

are there "gangs" there like MS 13 etc?
Quote:



What there are is sleazy people who know they probably won't be caught. This is because of the pitiful law enforcement that Mexico extends to their less than influential citizens.
Law enforcement is only for the rich. It doesn't serve the less than important citizen well. That's why they don't report infractions.

Gawwwdammmm....I can't get this post out of the box. I tried, but.....

[Edited on 7-16-2010 by DENNIS]

Bajahowodd - 7-16-2010 at 04:07 PM

Gee. And one of the things i liked most about you was your ability to think outside the box.:lol::lol::lol::lol::lol::lol: Que paso?

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 04:18 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Que paso?



I donnow. I lost it.

Bill Collector - 7-16-2010 at 06:20 PM

dtbushpilot,
I think they live just south of you, toward Vista del Mar.
They are up on the bluff about in front of the Buena Vista
Police station..

fishabductor - 7-16-2010 at 06:37 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by mtgoat666
Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
This is close to home and spooky. This is my biggest fear. This is also the reason I don't go outside at night when the dogs bark without being armed with several weapons. I will no longer go out. I will sit in a dark window with my 22cal air rifle and aim for the teeth!! and/or the balls!!!

I used to go out with a powerful flashlight, a large knife tucked in my belt, a can of bear mace in the pocket and a hickory ax handle I my hand.


My wife is inside with a 12ga flare gun.

Tip about flare guns....take apart the shell and polverize the material inside...this way the flare gun will throw out a cloud of extremely hot flame that will roast the SOB head to toe!!!
Screw

[Edited on 7-16-2010 by fishabductor]


your precautions sound extreme. perhaps time to move to someplace you feel more safe ?


With a 5mo old son and a 30y/o local wife in the house, my precautions are exactly that. the problem is not locals the problem is people from the interior who came to work and they no longer have jobs. There are a lot of tweakers(crystal) here these days.

When we lived in the states, instead the weapons above it was 45's and 12ga's. Meth is a big problem there as well.

You should go to any ranch around here. If someone went to a local ranch at 1am in the morning they'd be looking down the barrels of a a couple shotguns.

We live in the boonies, and have to rely on ourselves. There are no telephones, no electricity, no water...etc. we are totally out on our own out here.

If you have been robbed in the last year and suffered a loss of $40k you'd understand.

My theory is hope for the best, but plan for the worst.

P.S. : given that every visit to the States the news in seattle is about murders and violence. I feel much safer in baja. However in the states a 45cal, sure eases the mind.

By the way I am a liberal, perhaps a little red around the neck from my 10yrs in Montana, but a liberal nonetheless.

However, I will protect my family tooth and nail.



[Edited on 7-17-2010 by fishabductor]

fishabductor - 7-16-2010 at 07:12 PM

We should all help out by trying to put some pressure on Bueva Vista, and Barriles resorts. tell them you don't feel safe in the area with the news of the invasion. when we got robbed, not a damn thing happened...nobody cared.. This is a lot bigger deal than a mordita in CCD for us southerners

DENNIS - 7-16-2010 at 07:28 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor


By the way I am a liberal,




shhhhhh.....don't say that in public.

fishabductor - 7-16-2010 at 07:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor


By the way I am a liberal,




shhhhhh.....don't say that in public.


Can't help the way I was raised! however, I did tarnish it, by living in MT for 10 years. Lots of whiskey nights and shooting guns howling at the moon at my buddies dads 10,000 acres of ranch bordering forest lands, with the gallatin river running through it. All the space in the world to get loco and not get arrested.

woody with a view - 7-16-2010 at 10:43 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
Quote:
Originally posted by KASHEYDOG
Is this Woody with a view, aka Woody in OB???


No.


correct. not us!

woody with a view - 7-16-2010 at 10:47 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by dtbushpilot
Wow, this is scary. Does anyone know where exactly they live? I'm here at our place in Buena Vista now and there are a lot of people camping on the beach. Yesterday morning I rode my quad into town and there were some young punks camped in front of MarySol condos. As I rode by (slowly, nowhere near their camp) one of them gave me a menacing look and gave me the finger. It wasn't the typical "parting gesture" that bothered me but the way he stared me down. When I came back by an hour later it was the same thing. It was unsettling to say the least. Nothing like that has ever happened to me here......dt


hey D

have us down for a stay and i promise to make that punk kiss your toes before we leave.

it's all about changing their perceptions, and i mean their perception of reality..... it's quite simple, really!:light:

Osprey - 7-17-2010 at 05:31 AM

Last June, this municipio (from El Cardonal to Frailes) acquired its own Municipio Publico with an office here in La Ribera, with two armed and trained special police who patrol that area, look for trouble, help those who might be the victims of crime to recover their goods and make necessary reports to hold up in court, put the guys away and keep them there. I reported all the names and numbers more than once on the Baja Pony Express around the first of July last year. Anyone interested can get the more recent names/cell #s, etc. from any police station in the municipio. When something bad goes down, everybody is up in arms saying "Why can't something be done?" A few are circumspect enough to find out how the system works, keep the readily available info handy in the house in case they need more help than traffic police are paid to provide.

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-17-2010 at 05:42 AM

DT get all your male friends and neighbors in their 4x4 vehicles and just drive up where they are camping and park right in front of them. Everyone just stay in your vehile looking at them. If they don't flee after you guys just stare at them for a long time I'll buy you and your wife the most expensive dinner at Mama Espinoza's if and when meet.

David

lachicana - 7-17-2010 at 08:29 AM

I use to live in Buena Vista 6 years ago. I DONT REMEMBER THESE PEOPLE. WHERE DO THE LIVE EXACTLY?

fishabductor - 7-17-2010 at 08:31 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
DT get all your male friends and neighbors in their 4x4 vehicles and just drive up where they are camping and park right in front of them. Everyone just stay in your vehile looking at them. If they don't flee after you guys just stare at them for a long time I'll buy you and your wife the most expensive dinner at Mama Espinoza's if and when meet.

David


what's next they come back with all the male friends they know?

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-17-2010 at 10:32 AM

Then it will be time for action as done by that fictional character "The Preacher" portrayed by Clint Eastwood in Pale Rider and what Buford Pusser the McNairy County Sheriff did to clean up his county.


chnlisle - 7-17-2010 at 10:54 AM

DT, you should do exactly as Woody and ELINVESTIG8R say. Stare those punks down. And then when they totally trash your place when you are not there, please post it here so Woody and ELINVESTIG8TR can post their heartfelt sympathies for your "bad luck" and then give you 4 or 5 more posts of advice on how to deal with them.

There is nothing like getting advice on Mexico and Mexicans from people with no clue.

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-17-2010 at 10:59 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by chnlisle
DT, you should do exactly as Woody and ELINVESTIG8R say. Stare those punks down. And then when they totally trash your place when you are not there, please post it here so Woody and ELINVESTIG8TR can post their heartfelt sympathies for your "bad luck" and then give you 4 or 5 more posts of advice on how to deal with them.

There is nothing like getting advice on Mexico and Mexicans from people with no clue.



Quote:
Originally posted by chnlisle
There is nothing like getting advice on Mexico and Mexicans from people with no clue.


Au contrair, mon ami, we then escalate to this. You can pick them up down there easy!:lol:




Edit: To include some written content!

[Edited on 7-17-2010 by ELINVESTIG8R]

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-17-2010 at 11:01 AM

I should have put the laughing bobble head on my first post to DT to signify somehow that I was kidding. I would do it but would not ask someone else to do it.

fishabductor - 7-17-2010 at 11:42 AM

anyone hear anymore details about this incident? You can u2u if you like.

dtbushpilot - 7-17-2010 at 12:36 PM

Talked to a neighbor who pointed out the house to me, about 100 yards South of us. The only thing he added to the original post was that the perps told Woody that they were camping on the beach and the children were cold and could they borrow some blankets. When he came back with the blankets he was attacked. Don't know if it's accurate, just passing on what I was told.

I doubt that the punk I had the encounter with was involved but you never know......

Woddy and Donna, we hope that you are ok and you are in our prayers. If there is anything we can do to help please let us know....dt&jt

[Edited on 7-17-2010 by dtbushpilot]

noproblemo2 - 7-17-2010 at 12:38 PM

Still better to be safe than sorry after this incident tho..

dtbushpilot - 7-17-2010 at 12:42 PM

I find it hard to imagine encountering a family asking for help in the night and turning them away. I honestly don't know if I could do that.....dt

wessongroup - 7-17-2010 at 01:01 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DavidE
Screwdrivers versus two squirt bottles (wielded by two people) loaded with essence of Habanero, I wonder who would have won? At 1:00AM when I take a look-see my quarter-full (all the way full is too heavy) bottle is in my right hand.

This reply is no joke. The reach of squirt from a "high quality" chemical squirt bottle is formidable, especially when you can get off three or four squirts. Contact with the eyes disables INSTANTLY. Want revenge...when they go down give 'em a squirt in the mouth or up the old tooter.

Another thing that works is motion detection lighting. Crooks, like rats, do not like to be spotlighted.


Must agree, and will bs following your advice and made up some "welcome spray"... plus have a "24" cattle prod" that I keep right next to the front door.. guns.. I'm SOL... but, if with a knife and/or a some kind of pig sticker.. think I have a fighting chance.. plus have installed "security system" which by pressing one button, I can get either: hospital, fire or the police.. and have the added benifit of a Courtyard wall about 15' tall with broken bottles embedded in concrete.. surrounds two sides of the lot, off the back, 20' vertical drop, with walkway over the wall, the last access side of the lot, 15' drop to the road, with walkway over the wall.. pretty secure.. but, if one wants to get in.. know there are ways...

Hope I never am placed into the situation to implement .. as I'm slower than grass growing ... anymore.. 40 or more years ago..
might have been a bit different story .. but, now days must rely on others for help.. just the way it is... plus doing some serious planning too..

Thanks for the idea, had forgotten it .. used it with ammonia when a paper boy years ago with "dogs" that liked to try and eat my legs... go them once ... they quit attacking me.. there owner was going to sue me, for hurting his dogs.. this was around 1955..

:):)

[Edited on 7-17-2010 by wessongroup]

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-17-2010 at 01:32 PM

About a year ago I was awakened at 2:00 AM to my doorbell ringing. I looked down from a second story window and could not see anyone as my front door was blocked by part of my roof. I told whoever rang my doorbell to step into the light so I could see them. The man did step into the light and asked if he could use my telephone saying, "We" are broken down." I could see a car on the street in front of my home. I told him no and to give me a number of who he was trying to reach and I would call them for him on my cell phone. The man gave me the number which I called and the number was disconnected. I asked if he had another number and he said no. I said that is all I can do for you as I racked a OO Buck round into the chamber of my 12 GA. Shotgun. The man walked back to his car and a few minutes later drove off. I could see other people in the car when he got in. I think he was up to no good. My goodness the sound of a shotgun shell being racked into the chamber has a nice psychological effect on people.:lol:

longlegsinlapaz - 7-17-2010 at 02:48 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Collector
This is true, they also have 4 LARGE DOGS. They have motion detectors. No time for jokes, this is very serious, we are all shaken..
Buena Vista, BCS
As Bill Collector said, this is a serious subject & not an appropriate time nor topic for jokes.

I sympathize with the victims of this attack & am sincerely glad that they weren't injured any worse than they were. They both have to be extremely traumatized.

dtbushpilot, it is a tough decision to make in turning someone away during the night. Within the past year, my dogs went ballistic between 10-11 PM & I finally heard someone yelling intermittently out front. I turned the front porch light on & there was a woman standing in front of my car gates. I walked out to my man-gate to see what she wanted. In a nutshell, she was asking me to sleep in my casa for the night. She said she was from somewhere on mainland & was taking a bus back to mainland the next morning. I realized she was pregnant & while my head felt guilty, my gut was screaming NO!! She was at my gate for 10-15 minutes total & frequently looked down past my car gates & beyond my perimeter wall as though there was someone else with her outside of my line of sight. I has such a hard time understanding her & getting her to understand my Spanish, I finally ran back into my casa & got my cell phone & called a friend who speak fluent Espanol....despite the hour. I'd actually understood more of what the gal said in person than my friend could over the phone....she couldn't understand the majority of what the gal said; the final analysis was that she was not speaking a local dialect of Espanol, nor was she answering direct questions with direct answers.

Bottom line is I told her I was sorry, but no she couldn't sleep in my home & that I was sorry that I couldn't help her. I sensed she wasn't alone & I wasn't opening my gate to let her in nor for me to go out. There was simply too much that didn't make sense....she said she's been working in La Paz....I'm 10 miles outside of La Paz, approx 1/4 mile off the highway. There are no street lights, it's damn dark up here!! I had no visible lights showing from the front of my home when she came. If she walked up the hill, she had to have passed by several locals homes, I pointed out a couple Mexican households in line of sight & told her they'd speak Espanol there. She begged me to let her sleep in my casa & kept glancing back down towards the road. I couldn't hear anyone but all my internal warning systems were blaring!!

It's so dark up here that I couldn't see what direction she went or if indeed she did leave my property; my dogs continued to run between the front door & out in my back road-side yard barking non-stop for at least 10 minutes after I came back into my casa. Their reaction told me they could still hear something (conversation?/movement?) out there that I couldn't & I was damned if I was going outside my gates to check!!

Needless to say, I immediately closed & latched every window & door in my place & they stayed that way the entire night!

Yes, I felt guilty for turning a pregnant girl away, but my gut was speaking louder than my guilt.:( Given all the circumstances, I still feel I made the wisest decision that night.

BajaBlanca - 7-17-2010 at 09:29 PM

one of my greatest fears as well. a horrible story. an eye opener for me, as I would never have thought to turn someone asking for help away ... ever ...
The truth of the matter is that la bocana is so small that this wd probably never ever happen but i am thankful that I am more aware now.

eetdrt88 - 7-17-2010 at 11:03 PM

i dont know if u are kidding,but this post made me laff super hard:lol::coolup:
Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
This is close to home and spooky. This is my biggest fear. This is also the reason I don't go outside at night when the dogs bark without being armed with several weapons. I will no longer go out. I will sit in a dark window with my 22cal air rifle and aim for the teeth!! and/or the balls!!!

I used to go out with a powerful flashlight, a large knife tucked in my belt, a can of bear mace in the pocket and a hickory ax handle I my hand.


My wife is inside with a 12ga flare gun.

Tip about flare guns....take apart the shell and polverize the material inside...this way the flare gun will throw out a cloud of extremely hot flame that will roast the SOB head to toe!!!
Screw

[Edited on 7-16-2010 by fishabductor]

lachicana - 7-17-2010 at 11:20 PM

It is true what happened in Buena Vista! I verified it with Edrufo and Fiol who live in the heart of this community. Their opinion is these people were not from this area and were probably in another county within an hour after the crime

What a shame that these thugs can get away WITH WHAT THEY DID with only one highway going through this small pueblo!!!

woody with a view - 7-18-2010 at 05:55 AM

Quote:

My goodness the sound of a shotgun shell being racked into the chamber has a nice psychological effect on people.:lol:


what he said!

fishabductor - 7-18-2010 at 07:31 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by woody with a view
Quote:

My goodness the sound of a shotgun shell being racked into the chamber has a nice psychological effect on people.:lol:


what he said!


Maybe we came record that sound in the states and replay it in baja when the time comes:light:

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-18-2010 at 07:41 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
Quote:
Originally posted by woody with a view
Quote:

My goodness the sound of a shotgun shell being racked into the chamber has a nice psychological effect on people.:lol:


what he said!


Maybe we came record that sound in the states and replay it in baja when the time comes:light:


Great idea, Let me see if I can record that sound of a 12 GA. 00 Buck round being chambered into my shotgun and post it on here so you can record it and play it loud so they can hear it on the outside. I am technically challenged but will try.

wilderone - 7-18-2010 at 07:47 AM

You don't have to answer the door. If you're the "chosen one" to be asked for help - when there's someone next door or down the street or someone more capable - church, police, hotel - why must you respond? The doorbell rings in the middle of the night? Not my problem. Kids are cold? It's not freezing. Pregnant woman wants to sleep in your house? Who does this? How 'bout the house next door? A Mexican's house? Why your house? Why aren't Mexican's asking Mexicans for help in their own country in their own language? You let strangers in your house in the middle of the night? why do you have 4 dogs? for so-called security? Locks on the doors, shutters on the windows, alarm system - for security? And then you let them in the front door.

DianaT - 7-18-2010 at 07:55 AM

Does anyone know how the victims are doing after this terrible experience?

Longlegsinlapaz,

I understand what you are saying about turning a pregnant woman away, but I sure think your instincts were correct and glad you followed your instincts. :yes::yes:

fishabductor - 7-18-2010 at 08:07 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by DianaT
Does anyone know how the victims are doing after this terrible experience?


I have been wondering the same thing...With the threat on their lives there is a good chance they are now in the states.

Bill Collector - 7-18-2010 at 09:40 AM

This wasn’t a random robbery. Woody and Donna new one of the guys, the guy had done work at their house in the past. The guy wanted them to know he had been there in the house in the past.. This wasn’t someone on the beach, this wasn't someone just going through town, this was a local.
Woody and Donna are doing OK, both are very upset but doing fine. They have all their friends here to help in anything they might need.

toneart - 7-18-2010 at 10:37 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Collector
This wasn’t a random robbery. Woody and Donna new one of the guys, the guy had done work at their house in the past. The guy wanted them to know he had been there in the house in the past.. This wasn’t someone on the beach, this wasn't someone just going through town, this was a local.
Woody and Donna are doing OK, both are very upset but doing fine. They have all their friends here to help in anything they might need.


Why did... "The guy wanted them to know he had been there in the house in the past.."?

Bill Collector - 7-18-2010 at 10:45 AM

Not sure why the guy wanted them to know that. He mentioned he had been there before doing work. YES, they both remembered him

lachicana - 7-18-2010 at 10:47 AM

did they go to the Policia Minestario? Policia Ministerio in Santiago is probably where they need to go to report this. Especially if he is a local.

toneart - 7-18-2010 at 10:53 AM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Collector
Not sure why the guy wanted them to know that. He mentioned he had been there before doing work. YES, they both remembered him


That seems dumb! Didn't he wear a mask? It seems like he was making no attempt to cover up his crime. Maybe he is gone from the area by now. (?)

longlegsinlapaz - 7-18-2010 at 11:02 AM

Sounding more & more like drugs or alcohol involved & the invasion/robbery was to get cash for more! IMO, only false bravado of being high or sheer macho stupidity wanting to make sure victims knew who their assailant was makes any sense! I hope they've reported this to the police & if local police don't take it seriously, maybe the La Paz police would. I'd also inform the Dept of Tourism & the US Consulate just to get a little more pressure applied to the local police.

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-18-2010 at 12:21 PM

I have a good sound of a 12 GA. 00 Buck round being chambered into a shotgun. As soon as I can figure out how to post it here I will.

Has any tryed this?

lookingandbuying - 7-18-2010 at 03:41 PM

This past weekend I was in TJ and met a gentleman with the State Secretary of Tourism. His name was Arturo Martinez Esquer and he said he covers all of Baja.

Arturo seemed to be a very serious person and was highly motivated to help any American visiting Mexico. They have set-up the 078 number from cell phones that are staffed with people that speak both English and Spanish. We actually tested the 078 process by calling when he was in our presence and it at least seemed that they could be of help to you while visiting Mexico. They know they have a long way to go in correcting the problems within their country and they claim to want to do so, one by one.

I don't know if this current situation being discussed on the board is up the alley of the State Secretariat of Tourism, but if it happened to me, I would at least give them a try. The LAST thing they want is negative things happening while people are visiting Mexico. The other ways to reach Arturo are as follows:

Phone- from U.S. 011 52 (664) 973-0424

E-mail- amartineze@baja.gob.mx

Maybe many think I am naive in trying to fix problems with this approach, but, I figure why not at least attempt to use the resources they have available.

Am so sorry for what happened to this family.

DENNIS - 7-18-2010 at 03:52 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lookingandbuying
This past weekend I was in TJ and met a gentleman with the State Secretary of Tourism. His name was Arturo Martinez Esquer and he said he covers all of Baja.



It might be a good idea to post this on the Ciudad Constitición thread as well.

http://forums.bajanomad.com/viewthread.php?tid=46302&pag...



[Edited on 7-18-2010 by DENNIS]

mtgoat666 - 7-18-2010 at 03:55 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by toneart
Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Collector
Not sure why the guy wanted them to know that. He mentioned he had been there before doing work. YES, they both remembered him


That seems dumb! Didn't he wear a mask? It seems like he was making no attempt to cover up his crime. Maybe he is gone from the area by now. (?)


why do you think tweakers are smart?
tweakers are often really stupid criminals

chnlisle - 7-18-2010 at 04:33 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by lookingandbuying
This past weekend I was in TJ and met a gentleman with the State Secretary of Tourism. His name was Arturo Martinez Esquer and he said he covers all of Baja.

Arturo seemed to be a very serious person and was highly motivated to help any American visiting Mexico.


It does seem kind of weird that the Tourism Ministry is working so hard to recover American tourism in Mexico, while at the same time the government of Mexico is openly calling for Mexicans to boycott Arizona. You get the feeling the bureaucrats in Mexico are all not on the same page.

MsTerieus - 7-18-2010 at 05:02 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
Quote:
Originally posted by woody with a view
Quote:

My goodness the sound of a shotgun shell being racked into the chamber has a nice psychological effect on people.:lol:


what he said!


Maybe we came record that sound in the states and replay it in baja when the time comes:light:


My thought, exactly!

MsTerieus - 7-18-2010 at 05:06 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
I have a good sound of a 12 GA. 00 Buck round being chambered into a shotgun. As soon as I can figure out how to post it here I will.


Oh good! Thanks!

Osprey - 7-18-2010 at 05:45 PM

Looks like two or three threads about crime are still going. Just so there's no misunderstanding about the type of crimes: burglary is forced entry into your home when you're gone. Robbery is violence or the threat of violence. Home invasion is strangers invading your home. Theft is the taking of property with no sign of forced entry. Lose a tool to a friend or employee, that's wrongful conversion.

BillP - 7-18-2010 at 08:34 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
About a year ago I was awakened at 2:00 AM to my doorbell ringing. I looked down from a second story window and could not see anyone as my front door was blocked by part of my roof. I told whoever rang my doorbell to step into the light so I could see them. The man did step into the light and asked if he could use my telephone saying, "We" are broken down." I could see a car on the street in front of my home. I told him no and to give me a number of who he was trying to reach and I would call them for him on my cell phone. The man gave me the number which I called and the number was disconnected. I asked if he had another number and he said no. I said that is all I can do for you as I racked a OO Buck round into the chamber of my 12 GA. Shotgun. The man walked back to his car and a few minutes later drove off. I could see other people in the car when he got in. I think he was up to no good. My goodness the sound of a shotgun shell being racked into the chamber has a nice psychological effect on people.:lol:


To those that suggest rackin' a round in a shotgun as a deterrent: yes, it will work for kids stealing gas out of your car or such, but is a grave tactical error with serious bad guys. Defensive shotguns are like any other gun and should have one in the chamber with the safety on. You may not have time to rack a round and by racking a round, you've given away your position and told the bad guys where to direct fire. It's the same reason I won't have night sights on a gun: if I can see 'em, so can the bad guyz.

JMO, your mileage may vary

wessongroup - 7-18-2010 at 08:55 PM

"Lose a tool to a friend or employee, that's wrongful conversion."

And all these years.. I just thought my realitives and friends(s) were just worthless when it came to them "borrowing" tools from my garage... :lol::lol:

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-19-2010 at 11:56 AM

Peace Love and Fish Tacos ya'll!

motoged - 7-19-2010 at 12:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by soulpatch
.... I met a very interesting fellow. Across his chest and stomach in large print was tattooed the following phrase:
Will kill for family



Hmmmmm,
I wonder how long he had been out of jail:?:

Great Family Values.... a Sarah Palin kind of guy:light:

DENNIS - 7-19-2010 at 12:07 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by soulpatch
Will kill for family



Sounds like gang stuff....perhaps La Familia.
Nice sentiment though.

Bajahowodd - 7-19-2010 at 12:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by wilderone
You don't have to answer the door. If you're the "chosen one" to be asked for help - when there's someone next door or down the street or someone more capable - church, police, hotel - why must you respond? The doorbell rings in the middle of the night? Not my problem. Kids are cold? It's not freezing. Pregnant woman wants to sleep in your house? Who does this? How 'bout the house next door? A Mexican's house? Why your house? Why aren't Mexican's asking Mexicans for help in their own country in their own language? You let strangers in your house in the middle of the night? why do you have 4 dogs? for so-called security? Locks on the doors, shutters on the windows, alarm system - for security? And then you let them in the front door.


There are certainly some parallels between this and some threads that have been posted describing folks encountering stranded motorists along lonely stretches of Mex 1. Many of the same common sense rules would apply. And, in the end, as was mentioned earlier, after running through all the common sense stuff, it's your gut that will make the decision.

All that said, from what I've seen developing in the original case, it would appear that at the very least, this incident does not appear to be part of some local crime spree.

fishabductor - 7-19-2010 at 12:53 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bajahowodd

All that said, from what I've seen developing in the original case, it would appear that at the very least, this incident does not appear to be part of some local crime spree.


We'll just have to wait and see what developes...too early to speculate on a local crime spree, it could be the first of many. it could be an isolated instance.

Who else did this guy work for? When did he work at the house? Why did he all of a sudden job this couple in an invasion? that is risky. Where these people rich or appear rich? Seems wierd to invade a house with occupants when there were surely lots of vacant houses around.

Did the couple just use the cash machine that day, and maybe followed home? Did they keep lots of cash at home or maybe possibly flash the wrong person a bankroll?

MsTerieus - 7-19-2010 at 12:56 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Osprey
Looks like two or three threads about crime are still going. Just so there's no misunderstanding about the type of crimes: burglary is forced entry into your home when you're gone. Robbery is violence or the threat of violence. Home invasion is strangers invading your home. Theft is the taking of property with no sign of forced entry. Lose a tool to a friend or employee, that's wrongful conversion.


Your definitions are not quite accurate, Os.

Robbery is the taking of property of value, from the person of the victim or from his immediate presence, by means of force or threat of force.

Burglary, at common law, was the night-time breaking and entry of the dwelling of another with the intent to commit a felony inside. All or most states' statutes have broadened that definition such that the time of entry is irrelevant, no breaking is required, any structure -- not just a dwelling -- may be the target, and the intent need not be to commit a felony -- any crime will do. Note: burglary need not occur "when you are gone"; it can occur any time, e.g., while you are asleep.

Theft (or larceny) is the taking of property without the owner's consent. It can occur with or without forced entry (or any entry, for that matter), and it is often, if not usually, one of the elements of robbery and of burglary.

"Home invasion," as far as I know, is not a defined crime. I would think that any entry by an unwanted person or other entity might qualify as a "home invasion." E.g., an indoor ant infestation would qualify, I'd think, as a "home invasion."

Bajahowodd - 7-19-2010 at 12:57 PM

Good points. I wasn't intending to shut the door on this. But it does seem to me that the farther away in time from this incident, with no others in the area reported, the better for everyone.

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-19-2010 at 01:04 PM

If you shoplift in California they call it a Commercial Burglary which is a Felony vs. Misdemeanor shoplift case,

MsTerieus - 7-19-2010 at 01:39 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
If you shoplift in California they call it a Commercial Burglary which is a Felony vs. Misdemeanor shoplift case,


I imagine they'd have to prove MORE than a simple shoplifting; wouldn't they have to prove an intent to shoplift at the time of entry?

MsTerieus - 7-19-2010 at 01:42 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by ELINVESTIG8R
If you shoplift in California they call it a Commercial Burglary which is a Felony vs. Misdemeanor shoplift case,


El -- that's what "they" (the DAs, I assume) "call it" when trying to force a plea bargain, but I wonder how many times shoplifters have actually been convicted of this offense (as opposed to the lesser included one)....

ELINVESTIG8R - 7-19-2010 at 01:47 PM

It all depends on how bad they want you. Some will plea bargin a person and some will not. If you are a three striker forgetaboutit.

Bill Collector - 7-19-2010 at 01:47 PM

Just had a long talk with Woody, he said that when the two guys came up their drive way, they had a small baby with them, said they were looking for blankets for the baby. The one told Woody he had been there before working at his house, Woody didn’t remember him. When Woody’s back was turned that is when they grabbed him, took him in the house and used the electrical cords to tie both him and his wife up. Woody said these guys were pros, not drunk nor on drunks. They knew what they wanted and went about it very professional. They had a box cutter and cut Donna’s purse looking for any secret compartments.
Woody said the same night that someone over in La Capilla (that is where we live) got robbed at gun point, and was told if they talk they’ll come back and kill them, same as what they told Woody and Donna..
Guess it’s safe to say NO one will be answering doors or letting anyone on to their property in our area.
Last night three panga’s were stolen in our area…

[Edited on 7-19-2010 by Bill Collector]

fishabductor - 7-19-2010 at 02:19 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Collector
Just had a long talk with Woody, he said that when the two guys came up their drive way, they had a small baby with them, said they were looking for blankets for the baby. The one told Woody he had been there before working at his house, Woody didn’t remember him. When Woody’s back was turned that is when they grabbed him, took him in the house and used the electrical cords to tie both him and his wife up. Woody said these guys were pros, not drunk nor on drunks. They knew what they wanted and went about it very professional. They had a box cutter and cut Donna’s purse looking for any secret compartments.
Woody said the same night that someone over in La Capilla (that is where we live) got robbed at gun point, and was told if they talk they’ll come back and kill them, same as what they told Woody and Donna..
Guess it’s safe to say NO one will be answering doors or letting anyone on to their property in our area.
Last night three panga’s were stolen in our area…

[Edited on 7-19-2010 by Bill Collector]


Double Yikes!! Don't go to the door at night.

Make them try and come in, then you may have an element of surprise which is big when your swinging a axe handle.

I started installing my storm shutters this week so now there is only one way in!!

DENNIS - 7-19-2010 at 02:22 PM

I'm headin' to Home Depot to buy a couple of security doors that would require either a key or a cutting torch.

jureal - 7-19-2010 at 02:38 PM

This is all a shame. A shame that you have to go to such extremes to protect yourself, family and property. Makes one think twice about moving south now.:no:

fishabductor - 7-19-2010 at 02:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
I'm headin' to Home Depot to buy a couple of security doors that would require either a key or a cutting torch.


like I said in this or another post..... barred windows and steel doors and going to happen when I build our new home.

DENNIS - 7-19-2010 at 02:45 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by jureal
This is all a shame. A shame that you have to go to such extremes to protect yourself, family and property. Makes one think twice about moving south now.:no:



It wouldn't be such a rush for hardware if we were allowed firearms. These guys are so brazen because they know we don't have them.

toneart - 7-19-2010 at 03:43 PM

My heart goes out to the victims on the East Cape. It didn't use to be that way and I hope life returns to normal there.

I have to say...The Orchard, along the Mulege River in Mulege, is a very safe place. We do have security. In fact, we don't hear of any crime whatsoever along the south side of the river. I don't even lock my door at night. If any resident who lives in Mulege, and especially along the river, can refute this let's hear it. I want to hear it because I think we all need to be aware, if there is any danger.

There were some break-ins in houses directly on the river about three years ago, but we all know who the perps were. They were identified and run out of town. We party with the construction workers. I play Mariachi trumpet and congas with some of them who play guitar and sing. There is even one of these events on UTube. Everybody knows each other.

In spite of what Mano Negra says on the Turtle String, I am not aware of any drug related crime, or much crime at all, in all of Mulege. A couple of years ago some kids were breaking into some houses in The Oasis, but they were caught.

I have heard that some local kids are on Meth, but can't confirm that. You don't hear of any meth related crime around town.

Mulege is pretty mellow. Women can walk alone and not be bothered. The locals are a tight knit,conservative community, and are mostly related. They are Catholic and between the church and the extended family, everybody knows everybody else's personal business. The kids can't get away with much and are kept in line.

Most gringos are older and with gray hair. They may be prey in other areas, but not in Mulege. I attend the boxing matches when held in Mulege, next to the plaza. The last one I attended featured a boxer from Tijuana. He was fairly highly ranked and he won. There were some pretty scary looking groups (gangs?) standing around in the plaza afterward. Many were from TJ. I walked right through them, but I walked as though I had a purpose and a destination...didn't make much eye contact. Nobody said anything to me and nobody followed me to my vehicle. There was a good police presence.

Speaking of Police: There appears to be a hands off policy with gringos, unless one is really drunk, obnoxious and causing trouble. There is NO mordida, no traffic stops or harassment, and no parking tickets, unless you are really obstructing traffic. Then they try to find you and ask you to move it. Usually they look in Scotty's first. The police are talkative, helpful and treat us like locals. I am sure this manner is ordered from the top. They even patrol the neighborhoods, including The Orchard.

Our big threat seems to be Mother Nature. She has sent us three Hurricane driven floods in four years. It's always something, isn't it? We deal with it and continue onward.

Let's see if we haven't broken that weather pattern this year. We should know in about a month. Hopefully we will enter another cycle without devastating flooding that will last for years. This has been very hard on the town's locals too. They could really use a break!

Mulege is not a big development. It is a beautiful place that is a wonderful place to live. Great fishing and world class restaurants, too! Sign me up as a representative with the Chamber of Commerce. :bounce::cool:

BajaGringo - 7-19-2010 at 04:40 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
Quote:
Originally posted by jureal
This is all a shame. A shame that you have to go to such extremes to protect yourself, family and property. Makes one think twice about moving south now.:no:



It wouldn't be such a rush for hardware if we were allowed firearms. These guys are so brazen because they know we don't have them.


I personally know of many down here - gringos and locals - who keep a loaded gun on their nightstand. If these guys keep this up their luck will eventually run out. At night I would never walk outside when somebody comes a calling if I didn't know 100% for sure who it was, north or south of the border....

Bajahowodd - 7-19-2010 at 04:46 PM

Actually, the Buena Vista/ Los Barriles is not all that different from Mulege, in that is is a relatively small town that has a sizable Gringo population, seasonally or otherwise. I'm thinking that a major difference between the two communities may be that SJD is fairly close to Los Barriles. While Mulege is some distance from an international airport, it may suffer from it's isolation, Which is also one of its charms. Not to mention that service at Loreto is sparse, while virtually dozens of planes arrive and depart SJD daily.

chnlisle - 7-19-2010 at 07:59 PM

There was a passing mention of the crime problem in Los Barilles in the local newspaper today.

http://www.tribunadeloscabos.com.mx/newpage/index.cfm?op=por...

Tribuna De Los cabos

"le manifestaron a la legisadora su malestar por la inseguridad que impera en ese centro turistico, donde se han dado ya asaltos en la via publica y en casas habitacion, lo que causa alarma en los habitantes porque puede propiciar una disminucion considerable en el numero de visitantes..."

they told the legislator of their unhappiness with the prevailing insecurity in this tourist center, where there have been attacks in public and in homes, causing alarm among the inhabitants because this can lead to a considerable drop in tourism...

wessongroup - 7-19-2010 at 08:23 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by fishabductor
Quote:
Originally posted by DENNIS
I'm headin' to Home Depot to buy a couple of security doors that would require either a key or a cutting torch.


like I said in this or another post..... barred windows and steel doors and going to happen when I build our new home.


Had them on the first house we rented .... and like them very much.. know all about the fired hazard... but, when I was staying by myself and the wife was up north with the dogs.. felt very secure in my little place with the all locked up...

Yeah, if one wants in.. throw a logging chain on it and lock on to a hitch and off they come.. but, that would be a bit "visual" and "noisy" so... would not worry about it too much..

Don't have them on the new place.. it has a "security system" electronic which is linked to a private company that takes care of all responses to the appropriate agency's.. if there is any loss of signal for more than x.. it starts the drill.. plus the owner put up a Klaxon which will wake the dead...

I don't go out side the walls at night without the dogs... and carrying some typed of protection, if I can remember to take one.. Bajaguy gave me a good recommendation for one.. and I continue to forget it.. and it is right on my night stand.. along with a cattle prod... too..

I'm not paranoid, rather just like to be prepared... which includes a 6 months supply of food and 20 gallons of water at all times.. an emergency kit which can be put into the Bronco which has shelter (a 6 man Himalayan Hotel tent) plus a lot of other things which should help us get by, in the event of some really major stuff happening ... with only one thing lacking... a weapon with real stopping ability ... have them on NOB.. but, will play it the way they want it.... while down here..

Think Dr Glock is pretty good one.. Its' a keeper in my book:):)

Dave - 7-19-2010 at 08:51 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by wessongroup

Don't have them on the new place.. it has a "security system" electronic which is linked to a private company that takes care of all responses to the appropriate agency's.. if there is any loss of signal for more than x.. it starts the drill..


Don't want to cause any alarm but have you ever tested that theory?

I had a neighbor who had a fancy system. One evening while he was gone the thing went off. No one came...ever. He finally came home later that night and turned the damn thing off.

dtbushpilot - 7-19-2010 at 09:00 PM

Quote:
Originally posted by Bill Collector
Just had a long talk with Woody, he said that when the two guys came up their drive way, they had a small baby with them, said they were looking for blankets for the baby. The one told Woody he had been there before working at his house, Woody didn’t remember him. When Woody’s back was turned that is when they grabbed him, took him in the house and used the electrical cords to tie both him and his wife up. Woody said these guys were pros, not drunk nor on drunks. They knew what they wanted and went about it very professional. They had a box cutter and cut Donna’s purse looking for any secret compartments.
Woody said the same night that someone over in La Capilla (that is where we live) got robbed at gun point, and was told if they talk they’ll come back and kill them, same as what they told Woody and Donna..
Guess it’s safe to say NO one will be answering doors or letting anyone on to their property in our area.
Last night three panga’s were stolen in our area…

[Edited on 7-19-2010 by Bill Collector]


Wow, more bad news. Where were the pangas stolen from?....dt

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