BajaNomad - For Traveling Nomads

For Traveling Nomads

bajaguy - 5-14-2011 at 07:22 AM

If you are traveling to or from Baja through California, the below list of California State park closures may affect your camping or overnight stays. Parks will begin closing in September of 2011, with all 70 closings completed by July 2012.

Among the parks scheduled to close are the Governor’s and Leland Stanford mansions in Sacramento, the Antelope Valley Indian Museum, and the Del Norte Coast Redwoods State Park. The closings span the state, from the Morro Strand and Moss Landing state beaches to the Salton Sea State Recreation Area and Palomar Mountain State Park. They include popular recreation spots near cities, such as China Camp State Park north of San Francisco, and isolated nature spots including Plumas-Eureka and South Yuba River state parks.

List of California state parks to be closed:

Anderson Marsh State Historic Park
Annadel State Park
Antelope Valley Indian Museum
Austin Creek State Recreation Area
Bale Grist Mill State Historic Park
Benbow Lake State Recreation Area
Benicia Capitol State Historic Park
Benicia State Recreation Area
Bidwell Mansion State Historic Park
Bothe-Napa Valley State Park
Brannan Island State Recreation Area
California Mining & Mineral Museum
Candlestick Point State Recreation Area
Castle Crags State Park
Castle Rock State Park
China Camp State Park
Colusa-Sacramento River State Recreation Area
Del Norte Coast Redwoods State Park
Fort Humboldt State Historic Park
Fort Tejon State Historic Park
Garrapata State Park
George J. Hatfield State Recreation Area
Governor’s Mansion State Historic Park
Gray Whale Cove State Beach
Greenwood State Beach
Grizzly Creek Redwoods State Park
Hendy Woods State Park
Henry W. Coe State Park
Jack London State Historic Park
Jug Handle State Natural Reserve
Leland Stanford Mansion State Historic Park
Limekiln State Park
Los Encinos State Historic Park
Malakoff Diggins State Historic Park
Manchester State Park
McConnell State Recreation Area
McGrath State Beach
Mono Lake Tufa State Natural Reserve
Morro Strand State Beach
Moss Landing State Beach
Olompali State Historic Park
Palomar Mountain State Park
Petaluma Adobe State Historic Park
Picacho State Recreation Area
Pio Pico State Historic Park
Plumas-Eureka State Park
Point Cabrillo Light Station
Portola Redwoods State Park
Providence Mountains State Recreation Area
Railtown 1897 State Historic Park
Russian Gulch State Park
Saddleback Butte State Park
Salton Sea State Recreation Area
Samuel P. Taylor State Park
San Pasqual Battlefield State Historic Park
Santa Cruz Mission State Historic Park
Santa Susana Pass State Historic Park
Shasta State Historic Park
South Yuba River State Park
Standish-Hickey State Recreation Area
Sugarloaf Ridge State Park
Tomales Bay State Park
Tule Elk State Natural Reserve
Turlock Lake State Recreation Area
Twin Lakes State Beach
Weaverville Joss House State Historic Park
Westport-Union Landing State Beach
William B. Ide Adobe State Historic Park
Woodson Bridge State Recreation Area
Zmudowski State Beach

shari - 5-14-2011 at 07:23 AM

why are these parks closing?

bajaguy - 5-14-2011 at 07:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

"We regret closing any park,” California State Parks Director Ruth Coleman said in a prepared statement, “but with the proposed budget reductions over the next two years, we can no longer afford to operate all parks within the system.”

The cuts are the result of a bill California Governor Brown signed into law in March that trims $11 million from the parks budget in the fiscal year that begins July 1 and $22 million the next fiscal year. That trims the system’s 2012-2013 budget from the state general fund to $99 million.

“This is a 40 percent reduction to the general fund parks budget since 2007-2008,” said John Laird, California Secretary for Natural Resources.

David K - 5-14-2011 at 07:58 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

The parks close, the majority of people lose what they have been paying for... because the special interest groups insist on keeping their freebies, even though the rest of us are making less (so tax revenues are way down).

comitan - 5-14-2011 at 08:22 AM

It just tells my that someone is not doing their job, for what you have to pay to stay in a state park they should be self sustaining. :barf:

desertcpl - 5-14-2011 at 09:17 AM

I am not sure that I agree with some of your statements, but I do agree that alot of these parks and other subsidized attractions that we have become accustomed to enjoying, will for the foreseeable future be a thing of the past, I have always thought that most if not all should be self supporting

tiotomasbcs - 5-14-2011 at 11:35 AM

National Parks will all remain open? Sounds like I'll need bolt cutters to acces my fav county parks near Tioga, off 395. Too bad for us retired/retiring Baby Boomers! What happened to those Enron Executives, anyway??

Tio

bajario - 5-14-2011 at 12:01 PM

I know here in Cardiff and Carlsbad the beach campgrounds close about half the sites down for a good part of the winter to "do maintenance". These parks are very popular and seems like such a waste of revenue to shut half the campground down for an extended period to trim bushes.

mtgoat666 - 5-14-2011 at 12:12 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by David K

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

The parks close, the majority of people lose what they have been paying for... because the special interest groups insist on keeping their freebies,

you mean special interests like retired people?
this board is full of retired people, so the average reader probably uses relatively much more govt services than they pay via taxes!
:lol:

bajaguy - 5-14-2011 at 12:38 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

Just another scam by government........they want to close parks "for lack of funds"........people will scream.......then agree to a bond initiative or increased taxes to keep the parks open..........

comitan - 5-14-2011 at 01:17 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

This I agree !!!

Just another scam by government........they want to close parks "for lack of funds"........people will scream.......then agree to a bond initiative or increased taxes to keep the parks open..........

[Edited on 5-14-2011 by comitan]

Bajahowodd - 5-14-2011 at 04:03 PM

Sorry. But, when people want services, be they state parks, fire departments or police, someone has pay for it.

Jerry Brown, perhaps much to his current chagrin, campaigned on a platform of having the voters approve tax issues.

But, the fact is, the lion's share of revenues that will sunset, are just that, already in-place measures. So, they are not tax increases. They are continuation of the current status quo.

It kinda reminds me of what happened to Gray Davis. Not persoanlly a big fan of his, but, in retrospect, given that the major issue that ot him recalled was the DMV tax that was set to expire. (it was a "temporary" measure) Statisics bear out that an immense amount of the California budget deficit comes from the sunsetting of the DMV fees. Not unlike the fact that the Bush tax cuts represent the lion's share of the US deficit problem.

It would appear to me that way too many of the Republicans, in particular, are way too beholden to the corporate elite, such as the Koch Brothers, who are hellbent to destroy the American middle class.

You want to go camping at a California state park? Then just don't allow the current tax rates to sunset. Seems simple to me.

[Edited on 5-14-2011 by Bajahowodd]

DENNIS - 5-14-2011 at 04:10 PM

What total crap. They'll close the parks for reasons of fiscal poverty, but spend much more enforceing the closure.
Typical government nonesense.

Bajahowodd - 5-14-2011 at 04:16 PM

Doesn't have to happen if only the current tax rates continue!!

DENNIS - 5-14-2011 at 05:14 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Doesn't have to happen if only the current tax rates continue!!

It isn't taxing. It's spending and you know it.

Bajahowodd - 5-14-2011 at 05:21 PM

Sheesh! People expect and want services. How to get them if no one pays for them????

BajaGringo - 5-14-2011 at 05:35 PM

You really don't believe that there is enough excess fat in government that could be cut from needless / redundant services to cover the costs of keeping the parks open???

comitan - 5-14-2011 at 05:40 PM

You think your not paying enough when they charge as much as private RV parks. They have to be subsidized ? :fire:

wessongroup - 5-14-2011 at 05:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Originally posted by Bajahowodd
Doesn't have to happen if only the current tax rates continue!!

It isn't taxing. It's spending and you know it.

Ditto's...

wessongroup - 5-14-2011 at 05:46 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo
You really don't believe that there is enough excess fat in government that could be cut from needless / redundant services to cover the costs of keeping the parks open???

Ditto's....

desertcpl - 5-15-2011 at 02:40 PM

here in Yuma,, the state was going to shut down the Yuma Territorial prison and the Yuma Quartermaster Depot,,

Yuma stepped in and took it over, they did fund raisers and promoted other events to keep them open, also moved one of their offices like the Tourist center in the Quartermaster depot, I know Yuma didnt have any extra money like most Cities, I dont know really how they are doing, but they are still open and I havnt heard that are having a hard time making it

Jo Jo Jo

Bajahowodd - 5-15-2011 at 03:49 PM

Quote:

So, for just how many years, and by how many so-called do-gooder candidates have we heard about cutting waste and duplication will solve the budget problem?

I dunno, but be they Dems or the GOP, just seems to me that once they get intimate with the situation, they find little more than chump change as far as waste and duplication.

It's been going on for decades now. It that was the answer, one would think the problem would have been solved by now.

It makes for a great sound bite during an election campaign, but at the end of the day, it doesn't work.

As I mentioned earlier, people demand services. They just don't want to pay for them.

And something that most folks don't realize it thatcompared to say 1960, government is actually more efficiently funded as a percentage of revenue. There's this little issue about population growth outstripping the capacity of the infrastructure, for instance.

DENNIS - 5-15-2011 at 04:07 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by soulpatch
Actually they won't Dennis. Spoke recently to a regional State Parks director and he said they have had their budget cut about 27% and they will have about 5 guys to "monitor" the closed parks for the entire state. He says the facilities should be vandalized and ruined completely soon enough,

In that case, I suppose the parks will turn into dope farms soon enough.
There's no getting ahead of the negatives, is there.

BajaBlanca - 5-15-2011 at 05:29 PM

it is a bloody shame to close state parks ....

Bajaboy - 5-15-2011 at 05:48 PM

This could have been avoided if the populace would have voted for the meager $18 surcharge on vehicle registration via the State Parks and Wildlife Conservation Trust Fund Act of 2010. It currently costs about half that amount for a day parking pass. If that measure would have passed, the parks would have been okay and California residents (with a car) would have unlimited access.

But nope, no new taxes and now people are whining about the parks closing.

BajaBruno - 5-15-2011 at 11:30 PM

Irresponsible voters need to take a big chunk of the blame for the fiscal condition of California. For many years voters rubber-stamped general obligation bonds for innumerable feel-good projects of dubious need. As a result, the current Natural Resources Agency budget includes:

$976.6 million for debt service costs on various natural resources general obligation bonds.

$685.1 million for CAL FIRE to provide fire protection services in wildland areas of the state.

$119.0 million for Parks to operate the state park system.

That is only part of the Department of Parks and Recreation budget, which is actually $682 million this year – the rest comes from other tax sources.

Parks and Recreation is reported to suffer a $11 million budget reduction this year, which hardly justifies these drastic measures, but that tells only part of the story. Last year’s budget gave Parks $877 million – a big change from the current year; however, 2009-10 budget was only $406.6 million, so by that measure, spending this year has increased 40% over the last 2 years. The current budget does not explain that difference, but debt service may play a significant role.

mtgoat666 - 5-16-2011 at 05:34 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaBruno
Irresponsible voters need to take a big chunk of the blame for the fiscal condition of California.

tax revenues are down nationwide because GWB was not regulating wall street and banks,... and the economy melted down due to housing bust.
don't blame the voters. tax revenues rise and fall, and cost of govt stays same.

p.s. man of the closed parks are little used holes in the wall. not sure they are worth keeping open even if gwb had never wrecked our economy and govt were flush with money

oxxo - 5-16-2011 at 07:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
You think your not paying enough when they charge as much as private RV parks.

Then why the angst over closing State parks? If private RV parks can operate for the same overnight rate (and make a profit) then why keep State parks open? Just stay at a private RV park. It makes sense to me.

If what you say is true, then I support the State getting out of the RV campsite business.

[Edited on 5-16-2011 by oxxo]

BajaGringo - 5-16-2011 at 08:08 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by oxxo

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
You think your not paying enough when they charge as much as private RV parks.

Or maybe the state should consider leasing out the parks to private operators...

tripledigitken - 5-16-2011 at 08:34 AM

The Federal Government is doing that to some degree.

Zanterra is a private operation running the concessions at Yellowstone, Grand Canyon, Bryce, Zion, Mount Rushmore, and many more national and state parks.

Pompano - 5-16-2011 at 08:47 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by BajaGringo

Quote:

Originally posted by oxxo

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan
You think your not paying enough when they charge as much as private RV parks.

Or maybe the state should consider leasing out the parks to private operators...

Interesting points, indeed. Just 2 days ago, I checked California's State Park accommodations at Patcick's Point campground. The rate for a campsite with no hookups was $45.

Within 5 miles and with the same or beautiful views, there were 3 other private parks with full-hookups ranging from $27-$35. I decided to stay at Stone Lagoon. $27 full hookups with elk herd and lagoon view.

The rates at Cal. State Beach Campgrounds are higher than a lot of private parks nowadays.... when not so long ago, it was the opposite.

p.s. The state parks are still my favorite, though...for thier natural settings.

[Edited on 5-16-2011 by Pompano]

wilderone - 5-16-2011 at 11:10 AM

"...then why keep State parks open?"
Not all state parks have a campground component - most have historical significance - looks like a park, with a restroom and a parking lot, some with a souvenir shop and museum, etc. Forget the list of closed state park campgrounds and switch to BLM land, federal monuments and national parks. I went to Bandolier Natl. Monument last summer and it was staffed with 4 volunteers. Effective enough. They have those "camp host" staffers living at other federal park campgrounds - I don't think they get paid near what a state Park Ranger II (or whatever the position is) plus benefits, possibly overtime. I think each manager/supervisor of each state park should have a list of considerations provided to use to cut down their cost of operation by - say 30%, so everything can stay open. I wouldn't complain if one restroom of two was closed. I wouldn't complain if there were porta-potties provided and maintained a by local company instead of a restroom. $2.00 entrance fee instead of free -including entire classes of children - each person pays - no busloads for the cost of a $5 parking pass. The users should pay. Half the staff volunteers? No overtime. Early close time; lease 15'x15' of the parking lot to a concessionaire with a trailer; cut down on grass and landscape maintenance - have it done by contractor via low-bid process.
So they're going to close all these state parks, and lay off the employees? Who will get the jobs when the park re-opens? Same high-paid park rangers? Same problem - no solution. The Dept. of Parks and Recreation administrative staff should be shaved and analyzed as well. Could one $75,000 admin employee keep 3 parks open staffed with volunteers? Making broad-brush closures tells me the Dept. of Parks & Rec. didn't do much work to find ways to keep them open.

Conservation camp inmates

bajaguy - 5-16-2011 at 11:23 AM

or county jail low risk inmates.......Have em work off their sentence by doing maintenance and landscaping when not fighting fires or assisting with floods. Use volunteers and trade camping space for campground host duties......overseen by minimal staff of paid state employees.....use the local sheriff's office or police department to make drive throughs....develop an "adopt a park" program for local businesses or civic groups.

There are plenty of ways to keep the parks open, gotta think outside of the box........however, the elected officials and bureaucrats want to build and maintain empires........

comitan - 5-16-2011 at 12:30 PM

Such good ideas.

preston - 5-16-2011 at 01:53 PM

Three words:

CALIFORNIA GOVERNMENT PENSIONS

Google "California government pension problems".

The only solution is a massive sale of state assets or bankruptcy. I support both.

You cannot tax your way out of a spending problem ... just ask Greece.

preston - 5-16-2011 at 01:58 PM

Remember when lifeguarding was a summer job? I did it for 2 years for a cool $3 per hour when the going teen labor rate was about $2.25 per hour.

Here is what these "professionals" are now paid:

http://www.redstate.com/moe_lane/2011/05/11/california-lifeg...

How about lay off 1,000 of these guys (and gals) to fund the state parks? Ooops ... how many state park employees are paid a similar amount?

Lifeguarding is a $15 per hour job ... not a $50 per hour job ... WITH A PENSION PLAN!!!!!

J.P. - 5-16-2011 at 03:07 PM

Most California state camp grounds use host that are usually retired people that recive no salry and are required to work 20 hrs a week greeting people and getting them parked, In exchange for your parking and hook ups.I checked into it and at the time they wanted you to commit to a 6mos time I didnt want to stay for 6mos so i dropped it.

Jim/Liisa - 5-16-2011 at 03:22 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by comitan

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

[Edited on 5-14-2011 by comitan]

It's State parks there talking about. they always charged too much in the first place California State parks. California has to do something or it will surley go bankrupt. No I didn't vote for the guy, actualy didn't vote for any of them, none where worth a sh!t.

DENNIS - 5-16-2011 at 03:40 PM

What would Ansel Adams have to say in this thread? I'll bet it wouldn't be very nice.

To Some Degree

Bajahowodd - 5-16-2011 at 03:40 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by tripledigitken
The Federal Government is doing that to some degree.

Zanterra is a private operation running the concessions at Yellowstone, Grand Canyon, Bryce, Zion, Mount Rushmore, and many more national and state parks.

Zanterra is fundamentally the successor to the old Fred Harvey outfit.

In my opinion, the significant difference between the Zanaterra operation and what might be done, if anything, to privatize the California State Parks operation is that by and large, Zanterra/ Fred Harvey operated hotels, restaurants and stores. Big opportunity for profit. In major attractions.

Many of the California parks host only campgrounds. I just think that offering to privatize campsite operations does not have the potential to attract a corporate operator.

preston - 5-16-2011 at 04:21 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by J.P.
Most California state camp grounds use host that are usually retired people that recive no salry and are required to work 20 hrs a week greeting people and getting them parked, In exchange for your parking and hook ups.I checked into it and at the time they wanted you to commit to a 6mos time I didnt want to stay for 6mos so i dropped it.

If this is true, why are they out of money? If they have no costs, why does budget matter?

oxxo - 5-16-2011 at 05:12 PM

Let's make this a win/win proposition!

California should lease out their State parks individually to the highest bidder. Let private industry see if they can operate them at lower cost than the State. Consequence: the State would then earn revenue, private industry would make a profit, and the public would "theoretically" pay lower rates. What's not to like?

I am a former full time employee of the California Department of Parks and Recreation (not a Park Ranger). I worked there long enough, barely, to qualify for a pension - 10 years. My State pension is about $300 per month - like that's going to keep me in champagne and caviar!

preston - 5-17-2011 at 01:27 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by oxxo
I am a former full time employee of the California Department of Parks and Recreation (not a Park Ranger). I worked there long enough, barely, to qualify for a pension - 10 years. My State pension is about $300 per month - like that's going to keep me in champagne and caviar!

You should have applied for a prison job. Start at 18 (no college degree required), work till your 48 and then collect 90% of your last years salary (which you've "slammed" by taking a one-time payout for your unused sick time) ... should be $100K plus for the rest of your life. Sweeeeeet!

DENNIS - 5-17-2011 at 01:32 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by preston
You should have applied for a prison job. Start at 18 (no college degree required), work till your 48 and then collect 90% of your last years salary (which you've "slammed" by taking a one-time payout for your unused sick time) ... should be $100K plus for the rest of your life. Sweeeeeet!

Just another example of how unions are terrorizing America and couldn't care less. :fire:

Preston has an agenda

baja1943 - 5-17-2011 at 02:06 PM

Quote:

Originally posted by DENNIS

Quote:

Just another example of how unions are terrorizing America and couldn't care less. :fire:

Why don't you research the facts before going on a :fire:

CHEERS!

captkw - 5-17-2011 at 02:53 PM

when I was a kid they called it"the golden state" now it's the " red state'' as it's in the red, big time !!! can we saay MISSMANEGED

bajatravelergeorge - 5-17-2011 at 07:13 PM

I used to be proud to say that I am a 2nd generation Californian. Now I'm ashamed to admit I live in the state at all. I can't believe we went from the great Ronald Reagan to moonbeam Jerry Brown! And to top it off, you have a very liberal state assembly full of idiots that only got elected because they promise to take care of the leeches who don't contribute anything. Their way of living is figuring out how to receive the most benefits possible without having to work for any of it. Except maybe they have to stand in a line at the welfare office with the other maggots and fill out a couple of forms.

Its too late folks, the system can't be fixed. There are just too many voting leeches that want to suck us working folks dry. Business has figured this out and their fleeing the state in droves. Less jobs, less taxes, more leeches on the dole. Productive people don't want to be sucked dry so they leave as well. What happens when all that is left are the leeches? Can a leech leech off of a leech?

So where am I building my retirement home, BAJA!

And California can go to hell for all I care. And to hell with the unions too!

Bajajorge - 5-18-2011 at 09:04 AM

That's a long list. :wow:

You must have typed your little fingers to the bone.

mtgoat666 - 5-18-2011 at 09:16 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajatravelergeorge
I used to be proud to say that I am a 2nd generation Californian. Now I'm ashamed to admit I live in the state at all. I can't believe we went from the great Ronald Reagan to moonbeam Jerry Brown! And to top it off, you have a very liberal state assembly full of idiots that only got elected because they promise to take care of the leeches who don't contribute anything. Their way of living is figuring out how to receive the most benefits possible without having to work for any of it. Except maybe they have to stand in a line at the welfare office with the other maggots and fill out a couple of forms.

Its too late folks, the system can't be fixed. There are just too many voting leeches that want to suck us working folks dry. Business has figured this out and their fleeing the state in droves. Less jobs, less taxes, more leeches on the dole. Productive people don't want to be sucked dry so they leave as well. What happens when all that is left are the leeches? Can a leech leech off of a leech?

So where am I building my retirement home, BAJA!

And California can go to hell for all I care. And to hell with the unions too!

so you are leaving CA only because of the political/govt situation. tell us how the government in baja is so much better. what parts of baja's govt do you think are so much better to cause you to want to move there

mtgoat666 - 5-18-2011 at 09:28 AM

CA is still the greatest state in the union, and all of you that can't afford to live here are green with envy!
If you live here and are complaining, then pleased leave!

:lol:

grizzlyfsh95 - 5-19-2011 at 10:07 AM

Quote:

Originally posted by bajaguy

Quote:

Originally posted by shari
why are these parks closing?

Just another scam by government........they want to close parks "for lack of funds"........people will scream.......then agree to a bond initiative or increased taxes to keep the parks open..........

Exactly..."its for the children"

desertcpl - 5-20-2011 at 10:24 AM

California Urging Non-Profits to Run Parks

Posted: 20 May 2011 04:51 AM PDT

With budget cuts threatening to force the shutdown of 70 California state parks, the state Assembly on Thursday (May 19) unanimously approved legislation making it easier for nonprofit groups to take over operations at some parks. According to an Associated Press report, the bill, AB42, passed 67-0 Thursday with little discussion and was sent to the [...]

Bajahowodd - 5-20-2011 at 05:28 PM

There are non-profits and then there are non-profits. It's all about the charter. Unfortunately when most people read or hear about a non-profit, they immediately think of a charitable organization.

Unfortunately, in way too many cases, these so-called non-profits are polar opposites of charity. Creative accounting is just one of the many ways these organizations flourish.

That said, privatizing anything, in this era, means nothing less than Pavlov's bell.

There are too many to enumerate out there, that are "privatized" organizations, who are absolutely ripping off the tax payer for huge profit.

Just think of the situation in Iraq. The folks in chagre figure out that a war fought with conscripted soldiers would be open to widespread complaint when things were not going well. So, we did awat with the draft, that basically took out the component of middle and upper middle class families that would protest a lack of successs, and replaced many of those positions with " mercenaries" . No other way to put it.

There are more private contractors in Iraq today than US troups. Those contractors earn multiples of what a US soldier, marine or what have you is earning. And it is the US taxpayer that's footing this bill.

It is fundamentally welfare for the friends of the power elite. Jackpot for the connected.